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Volcarona

Volcarona is actually very effective in my opinion. I've paired it with LO Starmue to spin rocks, and since I run HP Ice it helps with Heatran and Jellicent. Still, Ive found it extremely effective even at times when rocks were down.
 
Why in the world would you ever hit a Blissey with a hidden power, when you have a more powerful STAB move. And thats what Blissey is for, to take special hits.

Oh yeah and in gen 2 it actually was made to do that. Just saying. :pimp:
 
I think kefka meant that as an example to show the ineffectiveness of neutral hidden powers.

and why in the world would you ever intentionally hit a Blissey with ANY special attack? (unless that move's name is psycho shock or psycho break)
 
Granstafer said:
and why in the world would you ever intentionally hit a Blissey with ANY special attack? (unless that move's name is psycho shock or psycho break)
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That's just theorying. Very few Special attackers can 2HKO Blissey, namely Kyogre and Reshiram.

And speaking of Ubers, which Kyogre and Reshiram are, how well does Volcarona fare there?
 
How would it even get 6+ boosts? Perhaps baton pass?

Yeah I have to agree its pretty useless normal damage at only 70 is aweful. But if stabed after a few boosts blissey can be 1HKOed. It can happen but pokemon are usually more notable for there 2HKOes like shaymin-s and rotom-W.
 
@platinumdude: that might be a question to take to the uber section, as I don't play much of ubers...
although, I would imagine Volcrona would get pounded by rayquaza or something...
again, I don't play ubners that much, so don't take my word for it.
 
Decently, actually. Base 100 speed is great when so many pokemon are at the 90 benchmark, and with boosted SpD it can take a lighter hit. Bug Buzz has good coverage on the Psychics, and with Ho-Oh, Rayquaza, and Reshiram taking SE damage from rock, HP Rock has more merit.
 
1. e4 d6 said:
How would it even get 6+ boosts? Perhaps baton pass?
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If Volcarona somehow manages to get at +6 with Quiver/Butterfly Dance, then it'll inflict a lot of damage. However, Heatran will get in its way unless Volcarona carries a move that inflicts neutral or super effective damage on it (mainly Hidden Power).
 
I don't think Jellicent should count as a counter on that list of resists because if anything, Volc sets up on him with Butterfly Dance (ChestoRest from what I hear is very promising).
 
Jellicent walls purely offensive Volcarona, who needs multiple QDs to break through it even with Lum Berry or Life Orb. It can also outstall Morning Sun Volcarona with Toxic, though ChestoRest variants can boost to +5/+6 and take it out in 2 hits eventually.

EDIT: I'm not sure about you guys, but I'm finding that even offensive Volcarona has more options, as far as item choice goes. It is so specially bulky that even Leftovers merits mention, but I've found Lum Berry extremely effective. I can't count the number of Thundurus that have tried to priority Thunder Wave, or Ferrothorn that get ballsy predicting my QD and Thunder Wave rather than switch. Then there are the random Toxics and such that Porygon-2 like to use...it really is a great item on the moth.
 
Kefka Palazzo™ said:
The problem is that neutral Hidden Powers are too weak.
For example, a +6 HP Dragon from Chandelure CANNOT 2HKO Blissey.(That's 1700 Sp.Attack!)
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It's probably easier to understand when saying that a resisted Bug Buzz has 67.5 BP, which is a measly 2.5 lower than a neutral hidden power.
 
If you can predict a switch in and phaze him out (with dragon tail, roar, etc) this thing is pretty much dead with stealth rock. Assuming it survives with 1 hp (IF you're not hit by dragon tail), ANY priority attack in the game will finish him off. A common scenario I see way too often is as follows: your opponent is using jaroda, and you try to send in ulgamoth to get rid of him. However, he predicts you and uses dragon tail as you switch in. With stealth rock up, all you have left is death fodder. So, the question is how do you get him in safely without being phazed away??
 
lmitchell0012 said:
If you can predict a switch in and phaze him out (with dragon tail, roar, etc) this thing is pretty much dead with stealth rock. Assuming it survives with 1 hp (IF you're not hit by dragon tail), ANY priority attack in the game will finish him off. A common scenario I see way too often is as follows: your opponent is using jaroda, and you try to send in ulgamoth to get rid of him. However, he predicts you and uses dragon tail as you switch in. With stealth rock up, all you have left is death fodder. So, the question is how do you get him in safely without being phazed away??
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Well, you might want spin support if you want to use Mothra >.>
 
@lmitchell0012: you switch him into a pokemon it can safely set up on who does not have a phazing move (or is unlikely to have one).
Incredibly simple.
Example: Ferrothorn.

@ Mudkipmaster: I don't doubt the power of the moth. I doubt the LONGEVITY of the moth.
bottom line: I doubt the moth.
 
Granstafer said:
I would also like to point out Gyarados, who resists both HP ice AND HP fighting, and also has an offensive advantage on ulgamoth. the only solution would be to run HP electric.

in fact, that might be the best option, hitting everything on that list for at least neutral coverage.
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This. HP Electric is the best thing for coverage on Ulgamoth, hitting all the bulky Waters that give both its STABs trouble (Jellicent, Gyarados, Tentacruel, etc) and still hitting stuff like Heatran and other Fire-types neutrally. 'Lectric is the way to go.

Fluffy Otters said:
I don't think Jellicent should count as a counter on that list of resists because if anything, Volc sets up on him with Butterfly Dance (ChestoRest from what I hear is very promising).
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Some variants, no, but Jellicent that run either Toxic or Taunt (or both) give it trouble and can eventually beat it. Toxic wears Volcarona down before it can KO Jellicent, and Taunt keeps it from getting enough Dances to wear Recover Jellicent into KO range. HP Electric helps kill it faster, but... still.

Although if it lacks those, yeah, Volcarona can easily set up BDs on Jellicent's pathetic Boiling Water.
 
Granstafer said:
@lmitchell0012: you switch him into a pokemon it can safely set up on who does not have a phazing move (or is unlikely to have one).
Incredibly simple.
Example: Ferrothorn.

@ Mudkipmaster: I don't doubt the power of the moth. I doubt the LONGEVITY of the moth.
bottom line: I doubt the moth.
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So, there's one thing that doesn't get roar. Not a whole lot he can switch in on.

Actually, I just realized that foretress doesn't get roar either (but he does get rock slide...)
 
What ferrothorn uses rock slide? Anyway, here's more...
Shaymin
Celebi
Virizion (it does learn roar, but how often does one seea virizion with roar? although, it may carry HP rock...)
 
Once, a very long time ago, I brought in my heatran against this guy when he started butterfly dancing. He noticed that he wasn't carrying hp ground and thought I could simply outmuscle him and wear him down with toxic as my specially defensive heatran withstood all of its attacks.

I proceeded to lose the match to a +6/+6/+6 pokemon, who used its chesto berry and flattened the rest of my team.

Heatran isn't a counter. Gyarados can actually do something to Volcorona by taking it out with stone edge, or waterfall if it isn't being used on a sun team. Heatran cannot do this.

The poor physical defense is really made up for by running a bulky set. The fighting resistance in a metagame filled with fighting type moves is also nice. He can run bulky sets or purely offensive sets, utilizing an item other than life orb to obtain an easy boost.

I've watched matches where this guy was paired with either Blissey or Vaporeon and would switch in to cripple teams even with stealth rocks up. Simply walling it isn't enough to take it out. Stealth rocks alone don't stop it from being a threat. From personal experience, I can safely say that switching a tentacruel into volcorona is like switching a jellicient into blaziken. It's like asking to lose the match.
 
Heatran isn't a counter.
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Use HP Rock/AncientPower. Its not like heatran is having any 4mss(offensive, not sure about the defensive ones but you really should have better checks to him than just a defensive tran)

also defensive heatran can still beat it by using roar
 
Your right due to the special defense boost, its harder to counter then people think. It still has its problems though. I imagine if you really have problems with this thing, set up stealth rocks, then get an azumarill out and aqua jet in. Azumarill acutally has a decent niche now, with more fire types and sandstormers about. At 51% health it is fodder for a lot of priority hitters.
 
UnhandledException said:
Use HP Rock/AncientPower. Its not like heatran is having any 4mss(offensive, not sure about the defensive ones but you really should have better checks to him than just a defensive tran)

also defensive heatran can still beat it by using roar
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This. I myself have never used a defensive heatran, but it seems on most offensive variants there is really no dominant option for the fourth moveslot. Thus heatran with HP rock is a counter/check.
 
Although Heatran DOES stop the more offensive sets without HP Ground since it wont be able to heal.

Though the bulky sets CAN be tough to stop without a strong unresisted physical move.


Not a top tier pokemon, but definitely a threat.
 
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