Technically, Cloyster gets Rapid Spin as well, but I've never seen anyone run it, ever.Anyone had success in UU with this thing? Ice is a fucking useless defensive typing, but the only other ice type with Rapid Spin is Cryogonal (don't mention Delibird, that thing doesn't even count as a Pokemon :/.) I think it would be decent tbh (on paper at least.)
What do you mean? This thing walls most Physical Attackers on OU, why you trying to bring it down to UU? Rocky Helmet + Recover means you can wall all the big threats and just let them ill themselves. Garchomp is OHKO by Avalanche and can only 2HKO you. Roar lets you force out people that set up on you and toxic lets you further damage the ones that keep attacking you.Anyone had success in UU with this thing? Ice is a fucking useless defensive typing, but the only other ice type with Rapid Spin is Cryogonal (don't mention Delibird, that thing doesn't even count as a Pokemon :/.) I think it would be decent tbh (on paper at least.)
You half have me, half don't. He isn't terrible for not being able to survive a 3rd E-quake from a M-Garchomp. The fact that his defensive typing is so terrible and comparing him to such a beast as Chomp shows how truly impressive his stats are. TBH, I originally tried to max his SpDef with AV and go for an attacker set, but recover was too good to pass up. Now I run with full SpDef evs and full HP.The only ou threats it ''walls'' are dragonite are landorus-t. Everything else can ko it on the switch in or just muscle through it while laughing at its attacks. But really this is a spinner that is weak to stealth rock and vulnerable to spikes/toxic spikes, you arent staying healthy through the match to take on anything. This is just a reversed cryogonal but worse, since its weakness are mainly physical moves which ruins the entire point of having a huge physical bulk. I dont even know why people keep mentioning a phys def spread when it should always maximize its sp def instead.
He does with or without the evs, but he won't be predicting that switch everytime, nor would going for Fire Blast on something that is feared out by EQ or DC usually do too much. So we can figure ~37% damage prior, he fails to do 63% with a FB, unless invested quite a bit, wasting precious evs otherwise. Avalugg will come in, soak a hit, soak a FB and revenge kill with Avalanche everytime in that scenario. Thats a pretty decent poke to be keeping up with a mega.The opposing Infernape is paralyzed! It can't move!
Yeah of course everything is great when the RNG screws with your opponent, i fail to see how that replay proves anything. Avalugg did nothing except get lucky, your opponent was pretty bad by trying to setup on an obvious specs sylveon with a 75% health pinsir and seriously, luxray? Also Chev mega garchomp always runs sp attack evs and will cleanly 2hko any avalugg with fire blast.
The only ou threats it ''walls'' are dragonite are landorus-t. Everything else can ko it on the switch in or just muscle through it while laughing at its attacks. But really this is a spinner that is weak to stealth rock and vulnerable to spikes/toxic spikes, you arent staying healthy through the match to take on anything. This is just a reversed cryogonal but worse, since its weakness are mainly physical moves which ruins the entire point of having a huge physical bulk. I dont even know why people keep mentioning a phys def spread when it should always maximize its sp def instead.
Three things.Less hyperbole everyone please. Typing isn't always more important than stats or vice versa, its everything taken into account of course. Spiritomb used to have one of the best typings before this gen, having no weaknesses and three immunities. Why didn't people use it? Bad stats. Sableye has the same typing and similarly unimpressive stats. Why is he viable in OU? His ability, and support movepool. Kyurem-B has an outrageous stat total and one of the highest attack stats in the game and numerous high BP moves. Why isn't he Uber? His typing (also physical movepool).
Ice =/= unusable. KyuB and Avalugg are examples of stats so high they compensate somewhat for their typing. Avalugg's Defense is so good no unboosted super effective STAB can actually OHKO it, regardless of Sturdy.
252+ Atk Mega Heracross Focus Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 324-384 (82.2 - 97.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Anything that can take a STAB 150 BP move from a maxed 185 Attack stat and NEVER be 2HKOd normally has one disgusting Defense stat. In fact, this kind of underestimating is what leads many physical attackers to a surprise death.
NOW! The question of, is Avalugg a good fit for your team? Unlike many walls, that's a very conditional situation. I certainly at least can't think of an instance where somebody would say Avalugg is exactly what their team needs. Not like Skarmory for sure. If you want something physically sturdy with STAB Ice attacks that may be justification enough to use him on an OU team. And that's all that really needs to be said on the matter. Everyone knows how to handle Skarmory, but many people aren't aware of how best to handle an Avalugg necessarily. You think Terrakion would switch away from an Avalugg with super effective STAB Close Combat and Stone Edge?
252 Atk Choice Band Terrakion Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 270-320 (68.5 - 81.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 Atk Avalugg Earthquake vs. -2 0 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 360-424 (111.4 - 131.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Recover on the same turn and heal up to still a safe range. You survive the second and an Earthquake, or Avalanche, is now a very easy OHKO. Therein lies the danger of Avalugg.
There are safer choices for a physical wall, but Avalugg can function.
Three things.
First: 252+ Atk Choice Band Victini V-create vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 372-440 (94.4 - 111.6%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO Mmm, barring Sturdy, that's a better-than-not chance to OHKO. Nice cherry pick, bro. I'd look up more attacks that can do the same, but your claim was that no unboosted SE STAB attack could OHKO, which I already beat, so it's irrelevant.
Second: That trick with Terrakion only works when Terrakion gets consistently low damage rolls. If it rolls high you're risking getting 2HKO'd AFTER the Recover. Max roll 100 - 81.2 = 18.2 + 56.25 = 74.45. Still in range for a 2HKO. Maybe a little unlikely, but still possible.
Third: Why would you mention Kyurem-B when his not being Uber is literally the same problem Avalugg has, bad typing? That's just proving the point, not countering it.
Choice Band counts as a boost, or modifier if you will. Mega Heracross can't hold an item. I chose my words purposefully, not to exaggerate he's invincible, just that he has underestimated physical bulk. So replace my use of the word "unboosted" with "natural Attack stat" if you wish.
And I am never saying anything about Avalugg comes in on wrong attack, or else I am using fire blast and flash cannons as example. CC and the like of Flare Blitz and Stone Edge are the RIGHT attack that you should come in, because, to begin with, taking such things is something that a tank is supposed to do, one is not even a viable physical tank if it does not manage to take a couple of CC and EQ, and also outrage in the case of previous generations. There is a reason why CC is used as a benchmark to determine one's physical defensive capability.
You say that, but I have yet to see anyone take mine out with ease. All he needs is one turn. Switch in on physical, recover next turn as they rocky helmet themselves. After that you choose to avalanche, toxic, roar, curse, whatever you are running. I am speaking from experience, not theorycrafting. The only things that do kill him are some Megas and pokes that ALREADY set up on you.The only ou threats it ''walls'' are dragonite are landorus-t. Everything else can ko it on the switch in or just muscle through it while laughing at its attacks. But really this is a spinner that is weak to stealth rock and vulnerable to spikes/toxic spikes, you arent staying healthy through the match to take on anything. This is just a reversed cryogonal but worse, since its weakness are mainly physical moves which ruins the entire point of having a huge physical bulk. I dont even know why people keep mentioning a phys def spread when it should always maximize its sp def instead.
Since... when? That's the first time I've heard CC is used as a "benchmark." For that matter, taking a super effective hit isn't the benchmark we should be looking at; neutral hits are better benchmarks. Of course you're not going to have a good physical wall if they can't take something that will annihilate them because of typing. In that case we might as well put Forretress in UU because it can't take a Flare Blitz safely! It's biased against the Pokemon. If the Pokemon's good, they can take neutral hits with plenty to spare; SE hits should only be an afterthought since those the attacks you want to avoid.
In other news, 252+ Avalugg takes a maximum of 29% from Linoone's +4 Extremespeed. ...Don't ask why someone thought it was a good idea to run Linoone in OU.
Just pretend that against fire/rock/fighting/steel moves its physical bulk is 95/90 instead of 95/184, which is still pretty damn good.