Conkeldurr (Status Orb) (QC 3/3) (GP 2/2)

[SET]
name: Status Orb
move 1: Drain Punch
move 2: Mach Punch
move 3: Payback
move 4: Facade
item: Flame Orb / Toxic Orb
ability: Guts
nature: Adamant
evs: 224 HP / 252 Atk / 32 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Bulk Up and Choice Band Conkeldurr have to hope that the opponent will accidentally burn, poison, or paralyze them, all while still being susceptible to Spore from Breloom. However, Conkeldurr can guarantee a Guts boost and possess an immunity to sleep by equipping a Status Orb, easily allowing it to smash through the opposition after the first turn it is sent out. Conkeldurr can easily revenge kill a weakened threat with Mach Punch or come in on attacks like Tyranitar's Crunch in order to safely activate Flame Orb or Toxic Orb, then begin to hammer away. Drain Punch, while actually not the strongest attack Conkeldurr has on this set, is the only way to keep Conkeldurr alive for a long period of time while still hitting hard, as the residual damage from a burn or poison will quickly eat away at Conkeldurr's HP. Mach Punch can not only aid in allowing Conkeldurr to safely receive the boost from the Status Orb, but score hits on faster threats that would otherwise deal massive damage to Conkeldurr, such as Terrakion. Payback is the main way any Conkeldurr set will get around Ghost- and Psychic-types, such as Gengar, Latias, or Latios. Facade is the strongest attack on this set, and is able to surprise and deal massive damage to threats such as Gliscor and Reuniclus, who would otherwise completely wall this set.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>The given EV spread allows Conkeldurr to drop the residual damage of Burn from 51 HP per turn to 50 HP per turn, which will more than make up for the loss of 7 max HP in the long run, especially with the small boost in Special Defense the 36 SpD EV's give. The choice of Flame Orb or Toxic Orb ultimately depends on how you decide to use Conkeldurr. If Conkeldurr is being used as a mid-game sweeper and will be given the job of breaking the opponent's walls, Flame Orb is the best choice. If Conkeldurr is being used as a late-game cleaner or as a hit-and-run attacker of sorts, where Conkeldurr will not be on the battlefield for more than three turns in a row, Toxic Orb is the best choice.</p>

<p>Like the Bulk Up set, Status Orb Conkeldurr has a few other moves it can effectively use. Stone Edge can be used to nail Flying-types such as Dragonite or Salamence, as well as Volcarona, harder than any other move could. Hammer Arm and Superpower are far more powerful than Drain Punch or Mach Punch, but the loss of either desperately needed recovery or hard-hitting priority can spell doom for Conkeldurr in many situations, so the two are inferior options. Finally, Bulk Up can be used to send Conkeldurr's Attack stat to even higher levels, hitting an insane 936 Atk stat after only one Bulk Up, but the residual damage from the Status Orb makes it a lot harder for Conkeldurr to find an opportunity to set up the Bulk Ups safely. Furthermore, the only moveslot that can really be replaced with Bulk Up is Facade, but Facade just has so much raw power (as shown in the below calcs) that it is almost too good to ever pass up. For example, see what this move does to defensive Pokemon of the metagame:</p>

<ul class="damage calculation">
<li>Facade vs. 236/252+ Breloom: 69-81.25%</li>
<li>Facade vs. 252/184+ Gliscor: 48.6-57.3%</li>
<li>Facade vs. 252/128 Dragonite (Multiscale activated): 31.4-37%</li>
<li>Facade vs. same Dragonite (Multiscale down): 63-74%</li>
<li>Facade vs. 156/96 Gyarados (after Intimidate): 51.6-60.8%</li>
<li>Facade vs. 252/252 Volcarona: 73-86.1%</li>
<li>Facade vs. 252/252+ Slowbro: 45-53%</li>
</ul>

<p>Regarding teammates, Status Orb Conkeldurr does not require much support to be used effectively, but can still gain major benefits from it. Arguably the best partner to Conkeldurr is Trick Room Reuniclus (offensive or not), as Trick Room can turn Conkeldurr into an incredibly fast sweeper for 3 turns, where the opponent will majorly struggle to find anything that can even attempt to stop Conkeldurr without taking a major hit. If Conkeldurr is being used in Trick Room, a Brave nature with a 0 Speed IV can be used to make Conkeldurr even "faster" under Trick Room. Toxic Orb would also be the preferred item in that scenario, as Conkeldurr will only be under the effects of Trick Room for three turns and will most likely switch out afterwards. Pokemon that can supply entry hazards, such as Deoxys-D or Ferothorn, also make excellent partners to Conkeldurr, as they allow Conkeldurr to turn many 2HKOs into easy OHKOs, making it even harder to stop. Rapid Spin support from the likes of Forretress is also quite useful, as it allows Conkeldurr to avoid damage from Spikes, which are especially harmful to the Status Orb set. Even with the Guts boost, Conkeldurr still struggles to break physical walls such as Skarmory, Gliscor, and Slowbro, so special attackers like Rotom-W or Jolteon, who can easily muscle past the aforementioned counters, make excellent partners. Furthermore, Conkeldurr's less-than-stellar Special Defense stat leaves it at the mercy of Pokemon like specially-based Dragonite, Starmie, and Rotom-W, especially when Rain is in effect, so dedicated special walls like Chansey, Blissey, and Ferrothorn make great partners (although the first two must watch out for the occasional Psyshock from Starmie).</p>

Definitely Facade over Stone Edge. Facade provides awesome neutral coverage that even nails Gliscor. It only misses out on Ghosts, which Payback comes in handy. You really don't need the coverage of Stone Edge with Facade under Conkeldurr's belt. Bulk Up is still useful to break certain physical walls like Skarmory or Hippowdon. Here's what I'm thinking:

Name: Status Orb
Move 1: Drain Punch
Move 2: Mach Punch
Move 3: Payback
Move 4: Facade / Bulk Up
Item: Toxic Orb/ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 HP/ 252 Atk/ 4 SpD

You could probably note that this Conkeldurr pairs well with OTR Reuniclus, since this Conkeldurr can wreak havoc under Trick Room.

Seems legit but needs some calcs!

^editing in those suggestions as we speak

EDIT: they're all in there now

if you decide to put facade over stone edge, mention spiritomb in teammates/counters? payback doesnt do to much to it as spiritomb is slower than conk, and its immune to its other moves.

havent played OU in a while, dont know if spiritomb still has a niche :(

Spiritomb is virtually non-existant in OU, but Sableye exists, which is a 2HKO by Payback.

Facade should definitely be slashed in the main set but i am not sure where...
Without SE, Conk will have troubles with fliers and without Payback with Psychics and Ghosts. But Facade is your best option against many pokes, such as Gliscor, Heracross, Toxicroak,Tentacruel,Landorus,Starmie on the switch, and Lati@s on the switch(you wouldn't stay in after the switch anyway).
Also Facade is the strongest move in the set, outdamaging even Drain Punch!

@Molk, sorry, but Pocket's right. You never see a Tomb in OU
@alexwolf, i was adding that in while you posted that

@Chillarmy, you know what, you have a point. added.

Pocket said:

Spiritomb is virtually non-existant in OU, but Sableye exists, which is a 2HKO by Payback.

Click to expand...

"If a Pokemon is not common, it should not be mentioned at all" -- I'm confused by this logic. Spiritomb is at least usable in OU (not to mention that it has its own OU analysis), so I don't see how a single sentence mentioning it being a solid check to this set would hurt. It's important to mention checks and counters to a Pokemon if they can be used against said Pokemon, even if they're not particularly common. It's really like saying Kyogre "only loses to Palkia, BU Dialga, Nattorei, (sometimes) Chansey, and Grass Arceus" because Shedinja isn't common in Ubers. Also, Spiritomb gives this set the business, even if Stone Edge is present, due to Pressure. I personally think that it's worth mentioning at some point in "Teammates and Counters" and eventually in AC, if this set gets approved.

Except it's not even a solid check. What's it going to do in response? Its normal response to physical threats is Will-O-Wi... oh wait.

Tomb is not only bad in OU, it's not even a good check, doubly so since it doesn't have recovery.

Yeah no objections here. Guts abuse Conkeldurr is the most common secondary set (definitely more common than subpunch and choice band) and its pretty good to boot.

QC APPROVED (1/3)

Tomb taken off Checks and Counters (sorry Molk and Chillarmy)
PK Gaming is awesome

@below:
| 102 | Spiritomb | 3875 | 0.824% | 2992 | 0.763% |

This.

Seven Deadly Sins said:

Except it's not even a solid check. What's it going to do in response? Its normal response to physical threats is Will-O-Wi... oh wait.

Click to expand...

Spiritomb -- being immune to 3/4 of this Conk's moveset -- can hammer away at Conkeldurr with Night Shade or Shadow Ball, both of which do 'enough' damage. Granted, Spiritomb sucks against Bulk Up variants, but with either status orb, Conkeldurr won't be able to tank Spiritomb's hits for long, let alone leave Spiritomb in a position where it can't Rest or Pain Split. Spiritomb is also the only Ghost-type that doesn't get maimed by a Guts Payback, which is worthy of at least a mention. Conkeldurr has immediate power now, as well as extra coverage with Facade, so the usual means of checking Conkeldurr will likely have changed. Quickly mentioning Spiritomb as a check gives anyone reading another good idea of what to look (out) for, when searching for what can put this particular set in its place -- not exactly the best of options, but it can work. Being a great option against Reuniclus and good spinblocker, as well as an 'ok' option against this set is enough to at least get a short sentence.

EDIT: Right, so Lanturn should be removed from Starmie's list of checks and counters, because it's not relevant to the OU metagame. Golurk and Nidoqueen shouldn't be mentioned at all as Pokemon that can check Terrakion, because they're not commonly used. It's the OP's choice to include Pokemon such as Spiritomb in the analysis, but giving them the pass because they're not that common hurts a lot more than it helps. Mentioning generally crappy things such as Shedinja as a check to, say, CM Reuniclus is a terrible idea, and I would back down if it were the same case with Spiritomb, but it's not. Spiritomb has utility outside of preventing this set from getting out of control. I'm not proposing that Spiritomb be mentioned as a significant threat, but rather have it serve as something to base potential other checks and counters to this Conkeldurr on. I.E, mentioning something that can give this set problems (or does Conkeldurr have Magic Guard ?_?) will give those reading it an idea of how to check it though their own means. Moreover, it shows that Conkeldurr's usual checks and counters have changed at least a bit with the moveset change.

"Without Bulk Up or Leftovers, Conkeldurr won't be able to survive for as long as usual, making Pokemon that can tank a few boosted attacks and hit Conkeldurr back for a sizable amount of damage, such as Spiritomb or Poison Heal Gliscor, are good options to use against this set as well. For that reason... blah blah blah" -- not exactly that ideal sentence, but this is what I meant. The Pokemon that I'd mentioned serve two completely different purposes, and check this Conkeldurr using similarly played, but overall different methods. Generalizing checks to this set filters out a lot of theorymon ("But wait, Dragonite can't tank a Guts Facade if SR is up, let alone more than once. Skarmory can't tank Drain Punches forever, either. Oh no, this thing is uncheckable."), which ultimately makes the set much easier to understand. This Conkeldurr is much more vulnerable to being stalled out, and there are many Pokemon that can do such a feat. Listing them all is asinine, but mentioning the better examples of Pokemon that can do so saves a lot of effort for the people contributing to this set, and more importantly, those reading it in with the intent of bettering their team.

Spiritomb is just not relevant to the OU metagame. It's like stating Lanturn as a counter to Rotom-W. If this was UU, then mentioning Spiritomb as a counter would be important, as Spiritomb has significantly more usage and influence on the metagame. But since this is an OU analysis, we don't need to mention obscure counters that players would most likely never face.

Calcs would be appreciate to deepen this set's understanding.

Kira Light said:

Calcs would be appreciate to deepen this set's understanding.

Click to expand...

They're there, between why the set should be on-site and additional comments O.o

I've been using this Conkledurr on my Trick Room team, and let me tell you, Facade is absolute annihilation! Once you click Facade, you click the insta-kill button. I think it should be noted that if this set is run on a TR team, Toxic Orb should be the primary choice since he will be sweeping in the 3 turn limit of TR, meaning he will pretty much always receive less damage.

@your damage calcs: Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm quite sure that Payback's power isn't doubled anymore on the switch in 5th gen..

@Pillsbury, comment added
@Husky, you're certainly right, and that's what I was trying to show, that it hits really hard even though it is still only 50 BP.

While I don't doubt Gengar's chances of survival (60/60 defenses don't lie), the calc on Jellicent looks a little off. Can someone confirm the calc? I'm using this, so it would be appreciated if it was from another source.

What EVs for Jellicent are you using? I use this calculator.

the calculations are correct, if you go first its rather weak.
luckily jelly outspeeds you.

I know this probably detracts from the purpose of the set (ignores status by using your own status orb), but would Life Orb deserve some mention on this set? By taking stray status (paralysis is recommended to take as less damage as possible), Conkeldurr hits much harder in addition to the boost from Life Orb.

Using Life Orb on this set would probably mean renaming this set to "All-Out Attacker."

Using LO goes against the purpose entirely. BU, CB, etc. Conk relies on the opponent sending a stray status Conk's way. The point of this is that Conk will ALWAYS have Guts, and not have to rely on the opponent. I can't deny that LO Conk with Guts hits like a monster truck on roids, but its just not the purpose of Status Orb Conkeldurr.

This set is pretty solid. As a minor note, mention a Brave nature with 0 Speed IVs just so Bold variants of Slowbro will outspeed you, this allowing you to hit them much harder with Payback. Conkeldurr won't be outrunning much anyway, so this sacrifice of Speed won't really affect its effectiveness. Also, Stone Edge at least deserves a mention in AC, as being able to demolish Pokemon such as Dragonite and Volcarona is a good benefit.

I don't know if you want to be slower than Slowbro, since many of them seem to carry Psychic