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All Gens Ask a Simple Question, Get a Simple Answer Mark II (RoA edition)

Discussion in 'Ruins of Alph' started by Jellicent, Jun 25, 2012.

  1. hinode

    hinode

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    Out of curiosity, has anyone ever tested Sleep Talk in Colosseum/XD to see if it behaves the same way it does in the GBA games?
    Triangles and Khaytra like this.
  2. Xeze

    Xeze

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    So, now with Sun&Moon being the most recent games, will ORAS become part of RoA?
  3. Khaytra

    Khaytra

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    Yeah, it will. It's already got an icon in the ROA room on Showdown iirc. I guess once the Uncharted Territory subforum becomes more "standardised", the ORAS VR and the like will either move here or have to get redone here.
    Xeze likes this.
  4. Thunder Gemini

    Thunder Gemini

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    Where can I find a full list of smogon Gen 2 rules?

    And information on the game mechanics of Gen 2
  5. Ortheore

    Ortheore

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    Smogon does a pretty terrible job of making this ruleset accessible imo

    Tiers can be found here. Clauses etc. can be found here, but basically it's freeze/sleep/species clause and a complex ban of sleep+perish song+trapping moves.

    As for mechanics, I don't think there's a comprehensive resource available. Is this kinda general information, or are you looking for specific mechanics and glitches?
  6. Thunder Gemini

    Thunder Gemini

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    Mechanics such as how much percent crits do, which types are immune to which status effect, exact effects of each status effect etc

    Thanks for the tiers and clauses links.
  7. Duck Chris

    Duck Chris

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    When did Chandelure and Snow Warning get banned from BW UU? And is there a link where I can read about that decision?
  8. Jorgen

    Jorgen World's Strongest Fairy
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    Crits do roughly 2x damage (technically slightly less) in standard lv100 gsc. At level 5 iirc its more like 1.5x.

    Paralysis - speed cut to 1/4. 1/4 chance for fully. grounds immune to that afflicted by twave.

    Poison - 1/8 hp dealt at the end of each of the poisoned pokemons actions (NOT between rounds like in future gens). poison and steel types are immune except to that afflicted by twineedle.

    Toxic - starts at 1/16, damage increments by 1/16 after each turn of poison. reverts to normal poison after switching out. poison and steel immune. also note that poison (and other events that happen after actions but before the between round phase) gets cancelled after a poke faints, and psn damage is not applied (nor does toxic counter increment) during turns where you KO a poke (important for bp sweeps!)

    burn - attack cut in half. 1/8 damage at the end of each of the burned pokes actions. fire immune except to that afflicted by tri attack.

    sleep - 1-6 turns inactivity. chance to wake up & attack during the 2nd thru 7th action (inclusve) taken by the pokemon post-sleep

    freeze - 10% chance to thaw between rounds (when leftovers usually apply, so you can switch or be roared in and have a chance to thaw out without needing to attack, but if you are frozen before a round starts, you will not thaw during the round a la waking from sleep). Also being hit by a fire move or using flame wheel or sacred fire auto-thaws. ice immune except to that afflicted by tri attack.

    leech seed - 1/8 health sapped after each of the seeded poke's actions (a la poison, so you only get same-turn heal if you are faster). all health sapped goes toward healing your poke (not 50% like other drain moves). grass immune.

    confusion - 1-4 attacks where a poke can hit itself. snaps out of confusion during the 2nd-to-5th (inclusive) turn following affliction.

    attract - 50% chance of being unable to attack. lasts until one poke switches out. same gender and genderless immune.

    wrap - 2-5 turns where you cannot switch and receive 1/16 damage (equal to leftovers healng). released on 3rd thru 6th turn (inclusive) after wrap starts.

    sandstorm - 1/8 hp damage per turn for non rock steel or ground types. 25% heal from synthesis and the like.

    sun - 1.5x fire, 0.5x water, solarbeam 1 turn, thunder 50% accurate, 100% heal from synthesis and the like

    rain - 1.5x water, 0.5x fire, half damage solarbeam, 100% accurate thunder (ignores all accuracy checks, its basically swift), 25% heal from synthesis

    crits - if atk stage > def stage (ie, you are +1 and they are +0), nothing gets ignored, normal damage is just (almost) doubled

    if atk stage <= def stage, ignore everything (all stat changes get set to 0/0, reflect, light screen, burn ignored, but i dont think weather gets ignored)

    rollover - normally stats are capped at 999 but the capping code can fail to execute if an item that applies a stat multiplier boosts a stat beyond 1023 (ie thick club at +2 gets marowak to 1032, which rolls over to a whopping 8 attack, light ball and metal powder can do the same) OR if reflect or light screen is up and multiplies def/spdef beyond 1023 (ie reflect up with a +1 def skarmory brings its def down to laughable levels - important to keep in mind against last poke curselax!)

    encore - 3-6 turns where you repeat the last move. paralysis or any other turn where a poke is disallowed a move doesnt resey the last move used ID. fails if last move used is sleep talk.

    mean look - ghosts are not immune sorry not sorry

    counter - fails on moves called by sleep talk, can bounce back all hidden powers (technically normal), even if they run off SpA, cant touch ghosts

    mirror coat - fails against all hidden powers, cant touch darks, also fails on moves used by sleep talk

    priority - all negative priority moves fail if they are not used after the opponent makes a move (so whirlwind fails if a slower counter/whirlwind/roar/vital throw is used). iirc there is no priority lower than -1 or higher than +4 (protect/detect are +2, switches +3, pursuit on the switch +4 technically)

    theres plenty more im prolly forgetting. i find upokecenter (google it, the site is kinda sketch but w/e) is the best source when it comes to specific mechanics info.

    also this: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/gsc-mechanics.3542417/
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2016
    Khaytra, Jimmy Turtwig and Crestfall like this.
  9. Thunder Gemini

    Thunder Gemini

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    Thanks, really helpful
  10. Oglemi

    Oglemi oh my gosh you found me
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    Duck Chris likes this.
  11. Triangles

    Triangles
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    Bumping for this post, if there's any justice in the world it'll work properly in Colo/XD and ADV can be made great again.

    #freerestalk
  12. Texas Cloverleaf

    Texas Cloverleaf meh
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    I took a video experimenting with this edit: which I will post after it finishes uploading to youtube

    [15:09] %Texas Cloverleaf: bkc
    [15:09] %Texas Cloverleaf: im going to test the think on poke xd
    [15:09] %BKC: supatives
    [15:09] %Texas Cloverleaf: what should i be looking for
    [15:09] %BKC: um
    [15:09] %BKC: sec
    [15:10] %BKC:http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/new-mechanic-sleep-talk-doesnt-burn-sleep-turns.3544205/
    [15:10] %Texas Cloverleaf: just rest and spam sleep talk
    [15:11] %BKC: i believe the order goes
    [15:11] %Texas Cloverleaf: see if it lasts more than two turns
    [15:11] %Texas Cloverleaf: ?
    [15:11] %BKC: sleep talk -> sleep -> wake up
    [15:11] %BKC: sleep -> sleep talk -> 1 turn left
    [15:11] %BKC: as in
    [15:11] %BKC: sleep talk -> sleep -> switch out -> wake up
    [15:11] %BKC: sleep -> sleep talk -> switch out -> 1 turn left
    [15:12] %BKC: if you sleep talk without sleeping before you switch out
    [15:12] %BKC: you still have 2 turns left
    [15:12] %BKC: as in
    [15:12] %BKC: talk -> talk -> switch = 2 turns left asleep
    [15:13] %BKC: talk -> switch = 2 turns also still left
    [15:20] %Texas Cloverleaf: [15:11] %BKC: sleep -> sleep talk -> switch out -> 1 turn left
    [15:20] %Texas Cloverleaf: this did not occur
    [15:20] %BKC: one sec gonna dc
    [15:20] %Texas Cloverleaf: wait not that one
    [15:21] %Texas Cloverleaf: [15:11] %BKC: sleep -> sleep talk -> 1 turn left
    [15:21] %Texas Cloverleaf: that one
    [15:24] %Texas Cloverleaf: [15:12] %BKC: talk -> talk -> switch = 2 turns left asleep
    [15:25] %Texas Cloverleaf: this did not occur
    [15:28] %Texas Cloverleaf: [15:13] %BKC: talk -> switch = 2 turns also still left
    [15:28] %Texas Cloverleaf: neither did this
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2016
    Khaytra, froggy25, Typhlito and 2 others like this.
  13. Merritt

    Merritt

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    What are the mechanics when battling from XD vs Emerald for example? Does it use the XD sleep mechanics or does it use the RSE ones?
  14. Texas Cloverleaf

    Texas Cloverleaf meh
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    Will test later tonight
  15. froggy25

    froggy25 Bye RNGmon
    is a Pokemon Researcher

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    Can anyone who can use Dolphin test the consecutive Protect / Detect success rates on each consecutive use ? Especially after the 4th consecutive use.

    I will be able to research various things on Colo / XD starting February, but until then I can't do anything on this computer
  16. Colossus

    Colossus

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    Hey all, it's been awhile. Not sure if there's a dedicated Gen 3 Frontier thread, but if there is, I will gladly take my questions there. Anyways, I'm building a Frontier team, and this is what I've got so far:

    Milotic
    Bold@Leftovers
    29/x/30/27-28/31/22-23
    252 HP/252 Def/4 Spd
    Surf/Ice Beam/Recover/Hypnosis or Toxic

    Salamence
    Rash@Leftovers
    (still haven't bred a good one yet)
    24 Atk/232 SpA/252 Spd
    Dragon Claw/Fire Blast/Rock Slide/Earthquake

    I was wondering if:
    1) the ev spreads for both Pokemon are appropriate
    2) what a good third team member would be (I don't have access to Metagross, unfortunately)
    3) if the missing Speed IVs on Milotic will hurt it's viability at all

    Thanks!
  17. Porii Sames

    Porii Sames

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    there was some discussion a while back on not being able to obtain certain mons in gen 1 with perfect IVs. the info on this still seems spotty, but i was wondering if a) we have data for mons that are caught via the missingno/mew glitch, b) if they are capable of obtaining perfect IVs, and c) if both a) and b) are true, could that be a justification for why they should be legal in ou? since atm it seems like a big gray area where nobody really wants to change what we have even though there could be issues with cartridge accuracy.
  18. Ortheore

    Ortheore

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    iirc you still need to generate a random encounter, so the RNG still follows that predictable pattern. Don't quote me on that though, I'm not the most knowledgable in that area.

    As for being a big grey area, just from looking at the thread we were able to work out possible DV combos for all encounter rates, it's just that no-one knows how fishing works (of all things), although I assume it's simply a matter of working out the encounter rate?

    As for the discussion surrounding it, I think that even if the mew glitch were able to produce flawless mons there would still be issues since the general rule is that you can't bring glitch-only pokemon to a battle (also no tradebacks from GSC)... which is what it would come to in the situation described since you're relying on a glitch to produce flawless mons. I was actually thinking about it the other day when I was thinking through what would be involved in an irl yellow tour. I remember when the thread went up a while back I argued against the changes, but tbh my position now is reversed in that I think they ought to be implemented... if we have the data to do so.
    Porii Sames likes this.
  19. Khaytra

    Khaytra

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    Can someone please explain the mechanic seen in this rby spl match? http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen1ou-234563
    So on turn 29, a paralysed Snorlax Hyper Beamed into an Eggy. On turn 30, the recharge turn, Eggy was about to successfully Sleep Powder the paralysed Snorlax. I'm assuming it's just part of the general "HB is a messy mechanic", but can someone spell out exactly how that works and in what situations?
  20. Jellicent

    Jellicent
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    Ruiner of Alph

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    Sleep moves will "Fail against a Pokemon already frozen, burned, paralyzed, or poisoned, unless the target has Hyper Beam (recharge) status active (bug)". They also "Apply Move Hit/Miss test unless the target has Hyper Beam (recharge) status active (bug)"

    http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/past-gens-research-thread.3506992/#post-5878612
    Khaytra likes this.
  21. Whydon

    Whydon

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    Can tournaments still be hosted in this forum? I know they were hosted in the past but I was just curious if they could still happen today.
  22. Jellicent

    Jellicent
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    Ruiner of Alph

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    Yeah, they still happen in a variety of forms here. Currently, there's a Ladder Tournament that you can still join. There's also a Tournament Calendar that you can check to see when other tours will be coming up, and mini-tours are started sporadically throughout the year.
    Typhlito, Whydon and Lutra like this.
  23. Golden Gyarados

    Golden Gyarados
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    Crystal_ specifically, but really anyone who might know: under what circumstances should Spore fail in Gen II? I just fought a wild Parasect in Crystal (in cartridge on an actual GBC). It used Spore against my (un-statused) Houndoom but "it didn't affect HOUNDOOM!" I thought Spore was 100% accuracy and there was no 255 miss in GSC. So now I'm fishing for it - putting my Pokemon into position for Spore, waking them up with Mint Berries if they do go to sleep, and just switching around if they don't - and Spore hasn't worked multiple times, versus multiple Pokemon. What's the logic here?
  24. Crystal_

    Crystal_
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    Stat lowering moves (Gen 1 & 2) and Poison/Sleep inducing moves (Gen 2 only) have an added 25% chance to miss when used by a non link battle enemy.
  25. Colossus

    Colossus

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    Does Soul Dew work in the 3rd Gen Battle Frontier?

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