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CAP 11 CAP 11 - Concept Submissions

Discussion in 'CAP Process Archive' started by Fuzznip, Jul 5, 2010.

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  1. Fuzznip

    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Mar 3, 2009
    Hello. Great submissions so far everyone. Here's my feedback!


    Res Ipsa Loquitur
    Too many concepts to respond too, heh. Don't worry though, I'll be back with more responses for the rest of the concepts tomorrow. If you want to discuss anything with me or if you just have some questions, don't hesitate to pm me on the forums or on IRC. My door's always open.

    That said, I'm liking some of these concepts so far. Good stuff!
  2. DetroitLolcat

    DetroitLolcat Maize and Blue Badge Set 2014-2017
    is a CAP Contributoris a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Apr 11, 2010
    Name: Do or Die
    General Description: A Pokemon that forces the opponent into a defensive position where they have to either attack or be defeated. Therefore, the opponent cannot set up or spread debuffs.
    Justification: The metagame (with the exception of Choice Users) is based about setting up offensive boosts (such as Dragon Dance) to sweep the opponent or defensive debuffs (such as Toxic) in order to stall out the opponent. This concept would allow us to learn about a metagame built around unboosted attacking, instead of one based around boosts and hazards.
    Questions To Be Answered:
    Is is possible to stop any and all set-up moves with only one Pokemon?
    Which Pokemon will become more viable now that setting up moves are discouraged?
    Will the metagame shift offensively or defensively now that set-up pokemon have been severely weakened?
    Will underused Pokemon that were outclassed by set-up Pokemon (such as Shaymin instead of Celebi) step into the limelight?
    How important is supporting sweepers and walls in the current metagame?
    Will stall teams become nonexistent due to the presence of this Pokemon?

    Explanation: Dragon Dance. Swords Dance. Agility. Baton Pass. Reflect. Light Screen. Spikes. Stealth Rock. Toxic Spikes. Toxic. Thunder Wave. Will-o-Wisp. Rapid Spin. Some of the most commonly used moves in the metagame. They are used to directly or indirectly aid in a sweep or in a stall. What if a Pokemon made these moves much less viable by FORCING the opponent to attack? This is the goal of Do or Die. Basically, it forces the opponent to use unboosted attacks in order to kill this Pokemon.
  3. Yllnath


    Dec 18, 2008
  4. Bippa201


    Feb 7, 2009
    Name: Double "Powder" Lead
    General Description: A Pokemon capable of using accurate status moves to early incapacitate opposing Pokemon.
    Justification: Depending on the shaky Hypnosis/Sleep Powder/Stun Spore to cause status is a bit unnerving, as a miss can cost you the game. But what if a Pokemon had more accurate status moves? The double powder strategy would not be much of a gamble.
    Questions To Be Answered:
    How much of a role does status play in Standard?
    Will there be a defensive or offensive shift in the metagame?
    Would stall become more abundant?

    Explanation: I dislike relying on Roserade to spread status around my opposition because its move are inaccurate. But what if a Pokemon could utilize Spore and Thunder Wave to mimic the double powder strategy? These moves are more accurate, and would make the Double Powder strategy more effective.
    I don't think it would need high stats anywhere, except speed. To perform well, it would need to be very fast.
  5. Drakhun


    Oct 24, 2007
    Name: Anti-Residual damage
    General Description: A pokemon that is spefically designed to combat residual damage effects (weather, entry hazards, status)
    Justification: Stealth Rock, Sand, and status are all major parts of the current metagame, and are not reliably answered in a concise manner. A pokemon dedicated to preventing residual damage could provide an interesting study into the importance or residual damage.
    Questions To Be Answered:
    Is a pokemon dedicated to the prevention of residual damage worth a team slot, or would it too often be setup bait?
    Would the prevention of residual damage help offense or stall more?
    What methods of combating residual damage are most effective?
    Would common and easy residual damage counter ability fundamentally change team design?

    Explanation: There are many ways to combat residual damage. Weather can be used to cancel other weather, along with the abilities airlock and cloud nine. Spikes et-al can be spun away, or in the case of toxic spikes, absorbed by grounded poison types. Heal bell and aromatherapy work to take out status ailments. Less conventionally a wish pass helps patch up damage from constant switches, and even more rarely healing wish can wipe out all the damage on one of your pokemon. However, outside smeargle none of these features have ever been in one place, and without being designed around these things won't work as well. Anti-weather abilities are either on ubers or failures. Spinning can be blocked, unless we put scrappy with it, and cleric abilities are hard to find and often on pokemon with better things to do. Assembled properly in one place, anti-residual damage could be a valuable tool
  6. Vaz


    Dec 14, 2009
    This is my concept idea I have been working on. I hope it is valuable enough to be presented as a "good" concept idea.


    General Description:
    A Pokémon that is able to copy the features of an opponent in a way that uses what features it has has to defeat it.

    Many Pokémon featured in today's metagame are used to counter the opponent. This Pokémon though would provide a different method of defeating the opponent, that being by copying it. By performing this, we would be able to explore how effective a Pokémon can be by copying the features of the opponent.

    Questions To Be Answered:
    • How sufficient will a Pokémon act if it copies the opponent's features rather than using a tactic of its own?
    • Is copying what features the opponent has an adequate method of eliminating the opponent?
    • How will the metagame respond to this Pokémon in play?
    It would be an enjoyable sight to witness a fresh option to eliminate your opponent rather than entrusting on the commonly used tactic of switching to counter the opponent presented in battle. Due to the Pokémon’s concept, many viable options will perfectly fit what it should be, whether it is high base stats, unique (yet reasonable) move pool or an intriguing ability. A Pokémon capable of performing such an extraordinary concept would be appreciative.
  7. Deck Knight

    Deck Knight RIP DryPass Vaporeon
    is a Forum Moderatoris a CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
    CAP Head Mod

    May 27, 2005
    Since I'm up and have time, I'll plow through the rest right now so I can pay more attention to Beck this evening.


    I've run out of time for now. I'll catch up with the rest this evening.
  8. shrang

    shrang AAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!
    is a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Jul 24, 2009
    Okay, since no-one has actually posted this yet this round, I'm going to post this (I got infracted last time because someone already came up with it):

    • Name - QuickStaller
    • Description - A CAP with high Speed and decent defenses (Doesn't have to be an extremely bulky Pokemon, just so long as it isn't extremely frail), with a movepool and ability fit for stalling (Moves that can allow it to cripple attackers or bolster its own defenses)
    • Justification - QuickStall is usually a playstyle associated with Ubers, a prime example being stalling Mewtwo. However, the style doesn't get enough love in OU due to the lack of viable Pokemon to fit such a role, which is why stall in OU is more balanced. It could find a great new niche of a "Fast staller" in OU, as well as teaching us more about the QuickStall style.
    • Questions To Be Answered:
    - How can stall teams benefit from such a CAP (How can they stall more efficiently)??
    - How does the metagame adapt to this QuickStall??
    - What strategies are effective and ineffective against QuickStall??
    - How much team support will such a style and CAP require??

    • Explanation - A QuickStaller would be fun to use in OU. While Stall teams are seen as "boring" and "tedious", it is a very reliable style. One problem that Stall bumps into is the fact that its abusers are often bulky and slow, therefore susceptible to Taunt, Trick, and possibly status. A QuickStaller would hope to minimise this as much as possible, with the expense of some of its defenses. A good ability for this CAP would be stuff like Intimidate, Pressure or even Magic Guard, while it should have very high Speed (Base Speed should be over 110) with reasonable defenses (Around 80/90/90). Good movepool ideas can be stuff like Taunt, Agility, Toxic, Dual Screens, Substitute, etc.
  9. callforjudgement


    Jul 8, 2009
    Name: Stealth Rock punisher
    General Description: A Pokémon whose mere existence in the metagame makes people think really hard if they want to waste a moveslot on Stealth Rock.
    Stealth Rock is seen on pretty much every competitive team nowadays. Unlike some of the other submissions, which focus on generally reordering the metagame or on residual damage in general, this one move deserves to be looked at in more detail, to determine exactly what affect it is having in the metagame, by comparison to an engineered metagame in which it is somewhat less prevalent.
    Questions To Be Answered:

    • Many Pokémon are commonly understood to be NU/UU merely because of Stealth Rock's prevalence. Is the common wisdom right in this respect?
    • Stealth Rock favours both defensive and offensive teams, but for different reasons. Which would be hurt more by its removal?
    • Is Stealth Rock, as a move, powerful enough that people will use it anyway despite one CAP's best efforts to get rid of it?
    • Conversely, is Stealth Rock dangerous enough that people will dedicate an entire slot in their team to try to get rid of it?
    • Are there any other effects in the metagame that could take Stealth Rock's place? (Spikes and bad weather come to mind.)
    Explanation: This concept has a slight overlap with some of the others; one of the above submissions mentions suppressing residual damage in general, but I think it may be more interesting to look at a metagame missing just one move. Arguably, this isn't a bad thing, as it means people are interested in the same general idea. This is also a "special case", as it were, of reachzero's idea, in that trying to suppress the rocks would likely favour a lot of Pokémon commonly underused due to their typing (although it does other things too, and there are other ways to implement reachzero's idea).

    Arguably this would be less attractive for a spot on a team than a number of other CAPs; I can imagine such a single-minded Pokémon being relatively useless against a team that doesn't run, or use, SR. I don't have much of an idea of how it could be implemented beyond that, though; there are several strategies that could be used to implement the idea (an ability, an SR-hostile movepool (foresight-spinning, anyone?), a build designed to kill most SR-capable Pokémon before they can get set up, a "suicide antilead" for which IIRC there aren't many/any viable options in OU atm, and probably lots of other things I haven't thought of).
  10. noobiess

    is a Pre-Contributor

    Nov 28, 2009
    the summer love

    General Description:
    A pokémon that easily and permanently sets up sunshine, so other pokemon have a chance to shine in OU

    Teams based on sunshine are hardly seen in the current OU metagame. There are alot of reasons for that; you always lose one turn by using sunny day (since the only pokemon that can set it up by ability is an uber-pokemon); it only stays in effect for a few turns; there isn't so much variation in pokemon that could use the sunshine (either fire-pokémon or grass pokemon that have an ability that boosts their speed). By losing the first 2 reasons, a sunshine-based team could become a powerfull and common team in the OU metagame

    Questions To Be Answered:
    - Will this pokemon be able to make sunshine-based teams more common in the OU-metagame?
    - Will the sunshine be able to brighten up some UU pokemon and let them become more common in the OU metagame?
    - Will we be able to discover some new movepools for pokemon that will raise the popularity?
    - Will it make the move solorbeam alot more popular?
    - Will this pokémon make sandstorm-based team much less popular?

    Actually a sunshine-baseed team could be very strong if it would be easy to set up the sunshine. Fire pokémon are already very strong pokémon in the OU metagame. With sunshine the fire moves will be even more dangerous (because of the 50% more damage) and they won't be so vulnerable against watermoves. And with a sunshine-based team you always have some grasspokemon that could easely wall the water and ground moves. Grass pokemon are also very strong against the last weakness of fire pokémon: rock.
    Fire pokémon could also protect grass pokémon in the same way as above with ice,fire and bug attacks. This makes a team with fire and grass pokemon a strong combination.
    The grass pokémon also get alot of advantages because of the sunshine. Not only are there alot of grass-types pokémon that have abilities that strongly boost their speed (or other stat), it also gives the opportunity to use solarbeam directly without waiting one turn.
    This strong grass moves also make it much harder for sandstorm and rain based teams to set up sandstorm/rain. The fire moves also keep the hail-based away.

    Now you might think that sunshine-based team could be too strong and will wreck the viriaty of the OU-metagame, but that is wrong.
    Fire pokemon are very vulnerabel for stealth rock, and without a strong grass/fire types rapid spinner, you could imagen that a stops sunshine team of becomming too big.
    There also aren't so much strong OU grass-typed pokémon and grass is also concidered as one of the weakest types because of the amount of weaknesses.

    Now some people might know what happened with pyroak, but I want to approach it much diffrently. I want to focus on making it easy to set up the sunshine, either then make another pokemon that is strong in the sunshine. Just like a snover of hippopotas in the UU metagame. It personaly suggest either a pokemon with the ability drought or either a fast pokémon with the abilty that if you use sunny day, it stays every turn. I think this way is much more effective then pyroak and will clearly raise suneshine-based teams.

    ave a nice summer :)
  11. TFT


    Jun 22, 2010
    Hello, while my post count is very low, I am not new to Smogon, I've been lurking here for about a year, without an account, just reading. Now I have an account and I'd like to take a shot at CAP with an idea I've been sitting on for awhile.

    Name: It can do it all! ...Kinda!
    General Description: This Pokemon has the ability to do any role that the user wants, however it's only decent at these roles, and not excelling at any particular one.
    Justification: The Pokemon is fully customizable introducing more of an element of surprise, your opponent will have no idea what you are using it for.
    Questions To Be Answered:
    Can a Pokemon that's only decent at its role be successful through its element of surprise?
    Can a Pokemon like this gain an advantage through the opponent over predicting?
    Can it hang in there with other sweepers, leads, status users, etc. that do it better?
    If the opponent correctly predicts what this Pokemon is there for, can it still function effectively?
    Explanation: In theory this Pokemon can come in, the opponent, not knowing what its there for, and do its job to perfection while the opponent is trying to figure out what its doing. It forces over prediction commonly. A Pokemon like this would be able to throw your opponent off balance and mess with his strategy, preferably, he won't be able to recover until its too late, and your team is victorious.

    I would really love feedback from some of the CAP experts, thanks in advance. =)
  12. Little Battler

    Little Battler

    Dec 13, 2009
    Name: True Anti Lead
    General Description: A Pokemon capable of stopping common leads, including common anti leads, from doing their job, but not capable of doing whatever a common lead does.

    Justification: The lead is a very important position in competitive battling. A bad match up at turn one can be very dangerous, as that could mean the absence of entry hazards in the opposing side of the field, missing a few turns of rain, or failing to set up screens, which in turn makes lots of pokemon unusable in the OU (E.G. because of entry hazard). This pokemon shall be able to stop the opposing lead from doing whatever they are meant to do (entry hazards, screening, weather) and therefore allowing us to find out whether or not stopping leads from doing their role creates a big impact in the metagame.

    Questions To Be Answered:
    -How does the first few turns affect the flow of battle?
    -Which lesser used pokemon become more relevant with the lack of common leads?
    -Which strategies will be most effective with the lack of first turn set up?
    -How will the lack of common leads affect the metagame?

    The Lead is one of the most important role in a team. A common lead either taunts, sets up entry hazards, status, does other set up, blow up, or any combination of said things. This pokemon should be designed to disable any leads from doing their job, either by taunting them first, killing them on the first turn, or clearing whatever they set up. Resisting / immune to explosion is a nice bonus, as well as immune to status, although status can be fixed with a lum berry.
  13. Defyin


    Mar 17, 2010
    Name: The Ultimate Trapper

    General Description: Pursuit, Arena Trap, Magnet Pull, all forms of trapping the enemy, but there is no pokemon that really trap wells, we have Dugtrio, but his stats a terribly low and his movepool is limited. What if we could create a Pokemon that with means of ability, moves, stats could become a great trapper?

    Justification: A trapper Pokemon can easily change the tides of a battle to be positive to you. This pokemon can easily pick off weak enemies and they have no chance to switch out.

    Questions To Be Answered:
    Does this Pokemon need to be overcentralized on either Magnet Pull or Arena Trap?
    Would this Pokemon potentially become overused if it's stats are too good?
    What kind of counters could it have if it could trap and pick off anything that comes along atleast once?

    Explanation: Trappers are able to shake up the game enough to change the tides to you, say you have a Rotom-h out and your opponent switches in Tyranitar, the tides have suddenly turned to him, you must either face switching out and hoping you survive the pursuit, or stay in and try to dish out as much damage as you can before you die. A Pokemon like this could change how the metagame is played because you must always be prepared for if this thing comes along, and it would help give you the flow of the battle.
  14. toshimelonhead

    toshimelonhead Honey Badger don't care.
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Nov 24, 2009
    TFT your concept is basically what Krillowatt was.
  15. TFT


    Jun 22, 2010
    I was afraid someone would say that, I thought Krillowatt was meant to counter common threats, but not at once, mine is similar as in it can only do one thing at once, but it can do a wide array of things and uses surprise to do better.
  16. kd24

    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Dec 21, 2007
    Name - Slowing Down the Game

    Description - A Pokemon that punishes / revenges others who raise their Speed / faster teams

    Justification - The biggest threat in the metagame remains to be Pokemon who hit too fast and the game constantly revolves around Speed. Speed numbers/Choice Scarf/Dragon Dance/Agility, whatever the case may be, you can be sure teams will be using Speed to their advantage. A Pokemon that can make the opponent readjust and give more chances of strategic play rather than that of "who can bring in the right Pokemon first" would have a very postitive effect on the metagame. This Pokemon would ideally bring a rise back to slower Pokemon who simply aren't used because their Speed is too low to compete with those faster. This fills both the 1st and 2nd category for justification.

    Questions To Be Answered -

    ~ What are the biggest speed threats are and how we can force Speed down?
    ~ Should this Pokemon employ revenge killing with priority and what other attacks / abilities can it use to capitalize on teams that rely on quickness?
    ~ Should this Pokemon be offensively minded to kill the opponent's fast Pokemon or should it be defensively minded to support your own?

    Explanation - I think a lot of people are tired of metagames that are simply dominated by Speed. People always remininsce about old gens and how it requires more strategy and I think a Pokemon that invokes that strategy again would do wonders for the metagame. CAP has previously created Pokemon who could slow down DDers / Speed quite a bit with stuff like Scylant, Arghonaut, and Krilowatt but it never was the intended purpose and unfortunately, these Pokemon just couldn't help with this "problem" in the end. Again, my major thinking is a metagame based more on strategy than team building matchups / lucky when getting the right pokemon in is a better metagame.
  17. petrie911


    Aug 27, 2005
    A few of these concepts remind me strongly of things that have been used effectively in UU. This is a good thing for the concepts, mind you, as it indicates that they can work, and gives us an example of how it worked in the past.

    Sextus's Pivot sounds a lot like how Crobat worked before he got himself banned. He could come in on tons of things, kill offensive mons with Brave Bird, Taunt defensive/support mons, and could U-Turn out to keep momentum. Roost let him do this repeatedly even with SR weakness.

    Rising_Dusk's Winter Wonderland reminds me of another BL pokemon: Froslass. During her time in UU, Hail actually became somewhat common, despite Snover being the only one that could set it up. I think this shows that a new Snow Warning pokemon is not necessarily needed. Abomasnow isn't even all that bad; it's a good subseeder and can switch in on most bulky waters. In fact, we don't even really need Ice-type, as Snow Cloak, Ice Body, and Magic Guard can block hail damage, too.

    bugmaniacbob's Defensive Characteristic is basically Milotic++. Milotic's support movepool consists of Haze, Toxic, and Hypnosis, and only the first 2 actually see use. Otherwise, its purpose is to just sit there and wall things while hitting back with its fairly good SpA.

    TFT's concept (which might be better named as "Jack of all trades") is essentially what Clefable does in UU. It can do tons of stuff, but it's not always the best at it. Its unpredicatability makes it pretty dangerous, though, and it's also got a number of sets only it can run.

    Since these Pokemon all fulfill(ed) rather interesting niches that aren't really seen in OU, I would definitely like to see these concepts.
  18. TFT


    Jun 22, 2010
    Thanks Petrie, that makes me more confident about my idea, but what do you mean about the name?
  19. Fuzznip

    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Mar 3, 2009
    More to come later.
  20. Res Ipsa Loquitur

    Res Ipsa Loquitur

    Aug 19, 2009
    As I mentioned in my explanation, Fidgit is a fair comparison in some regards. But Fidgit is only good at getting Gravity going, while Pokemon like Starmie are only good at using it. I feel certain that a successful Gravity team would take advantage of some of these Pokemon, but they do not make the team.

    Successful field effect teams always have one or more Pokemon adept at both activating and using the condition. Rain teams have Jirachi to set up with Damp Rock and then hit hard with Serene Grace Thunder or boosted Water Pulse. Electrode does a similar trick on those Rain teams. Sun teams have any number of Chlorophyll sweepers with access to Solar Beam, Fire-type moves, and Sunny Day. Trick Room teams have Bronzong to set up Trick Room, then outspeed nearly everything and use powerful STAB Gyro Balls. Slowking, similarly, forces out special attackers, uses Trick Room on the switch, and becomes an instant threat with Nasty Plot and powerful Surfs. Gravity has nothing like these Pokemon.

    I believe that Gravity has a powerful and interesting effect. I believe that the metagame would benefit from its becoming more popular. I believe that a "Bronzong of Gravity" could make this happen. That is what I intend with my concept, and it should come out quite different from Fidgit.
  21. DougJustDoug

    DougJustDoug Knows the great enthusiasms
    is a member of the Site Staffis an Artistis a Programmeris a CAP Contributoris an Administratoris a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
    CAP Leader

    Jun 26, 2007
    Name: Perfect Mate

    General Description: Pick a good-but-not-great OU pokemon, and design the perfect teammate for it, similar to the way Celebi & Heatran, or Blissey & Skarmory complement each other so well on competitive teams.

    This would allow us to explore in detail how synergy between two pokemon can be achieved, because currently there are only a few perfect teammates in OU. And depending on the base pokemon we choose to give a "perfect mate", we can open a new niche in the metagame based around the efficient pairing.
    The niche we create will be inherently tied to an existing pokemon in the metagame, which should provide a natural limitation to prevent this concept from being broken or "too different" from standard OU.

    Questions To Be Answered:
    • Is the base pokemon's usefulness (and usage) in the metagame increased as a result of having a "perfect mate"?
    • What strategies are more effective for the base pokemon, as a result of having a perfect teammate?
    • What are the most effective aspects of the new pokemon, for purposes of making a great teammate with the base pokemon?
    • Is the new pokemon viable in the metagame without the base pokemon as a teammate?

    This concept is very similar to the "Partner in Crime" concept proposed back in CAP 7. But, with all the changes in the CAP process, and stagnation in the metagame, I think this is a good time for the CAP community to focus on the competitive factors of synergy between pokemon.

    I envision we will pick a base pokemon during the Concept Assessment. We will make a case to the TL for a good-but-not-great OU pokemon and the characteristics of that pokemon's "perfect mate". The Topic Leader would then select their favorite. We could even rename the concept to "<Pokemon>'s Perfect Mate" from that point forward.

    It think we could have some fantastic discussions every step of the way, dissecting the base pokemon in exacting detail to figure out the best way to make an ideal teammate. If we choose the right base pokemon, we might even breathe some new life into a sentimental favorite, that isn't quite up to top-OU standards on its own.
  22. TPM


    Aug 27, 2008
    Name: The Knight Who Says Ni
    General Description: A Pokemon posessing great power that has one crippling, and potentially easy to exploit weakness (and I don'tjust mean type weakness).
    Justification: I believe it would be rather interesting to see a Pokemon so incredibly devastating, thatisat the sametime not very feared for the reason it can be crippled quite simply. Now people may say this already exists in the form of many of the 4x weak Pokemon, however Salamence's strength ISN'Tcounter-balanced by his weakness, Scizor/Magnezone aren't so much "threatening" as they are useful, and Heatran and Gyarados can be handled without abuse of their weakness.
    Questions To Be Answered:
    -Can we balance Hercules' muscle with Achilles' heal?
    -Can there exist a weakness so great that can render a would be tyrant to a merely okay Pokemon?
    -How far can we push the abilities of a Pokemon if we put a handicap on it?
    Explanation: Now the easiest thing wouldbe tojump to 4x weaknesses, but there are somany other things that can be done. Maybe instead of one 4x weakness, it has poor defensive typing in general. Maybe we make incredibly succeptible to paralysis, or incapableof breaking through acertain class of threats. Maybe its speed sits ata point where there a several Pokemon always able to switch-in, outspeed and KO. Now, I think the key to this would be porducing a PHENOMINAL pokemon made good because of a weaknes, instead of a good Pokemon made bad.
  23. Jibaku

    Jibaku Who let marco in here????
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Champion

    Dec 13, 2005
    Name: Offensive Trick Room user

    General Description: A Pokemon that can "selfishly" (ab)use Trick Room and excellent firepower to cause great deal of damage to the opponent.

    Justification: Okay this is rather hard to justify (and what's worse, there's already a Trick Room concept posted before this)... anyways, I'd like to ask - when was the last time you saw a Trick Room team? Or rather, how often? Almost none, right? What makes Trick Room such an unpopular move in singles, where Speed and relative frailty quite often dominates our metagame? Is it its duration? Is it the time it takes to set up (and then switch?)? Is it the lack of Pokemon that can take advantage of it? All of the above?

    Come to think of it, how many Pokemon can simulatenously learn Trick Room and have decent firepower? FIVE! Exeggutor, Gallade, Bronzong, Palkia, Dialga. Exeggutor has too many weaknesses and a horrid special defense, along with an unappealing coverage in the offensive department, and Gallade has low Defense and is vulnerable to priority attacks. Bronzong has decent firepower, great bulk mainly due to Gyro Ball and Explosion, but falls flat against stall, and the last two are Uber. That leaves us with a grand total of ONE Pokemon in OU that can fit this role - and it's not quite strong enough sometimes, especially against slower teams

    Also in case you aren't getting this, I don't mean stuff like Camerupt, Rampardos, or Rhyperior, all who have stats that are well suited under TR. This Pokemon HAS to learn Trick Room.

    Questions to be Answered:
    - If we make a Pokemon whose main purpose is to set up and destroy under Trick Room, how would the increased popularity of the move affect the metagame? How would teams change as a result? And I know this has been asked before, but "how would it affect stall teams?"

    Explanation: I guess a big issue with this concept is the relative tightness of it. We know that this Pokemon either has to have great power and/or coverage, low Speed, and decent bulk. We might even have to stick Persistent for its ability to ensure the success of the concept. THat said, we still do have quite a bit of freedom to mess around. Speaking of which, I envision this Pokemon to mainly be used as a Trick Room sweeper, but that doesn't mean it can't do other roles.

    PS: Cyclohm learns Trick Room, has middling Speed, and impressive firepower. But no one really uses it, because it has better things to do.
    PS2: Fidgit gets Persistent and Trick Room, but it has lol 105 base Speed and other, more consistent utility moves to use.
    PS3: I've said this before in the chat, I feel like mentioning it again. Can we not make cap11 weak to Ground pleeease?
  24. HouseFantastic


    Mar 30, 2009
    Name: Opposite-stat Wall and Counter.

    General Description: A wall that can block one type of assault and counter immediately using the other, "un-walled" stat.

    Pokemon that have a wide variety of things to do are extremely fun to use. I enjoy pokemon with lots of roles like Venusaur and Clefable, but not so much that their role is completely undiscernable until they use a few of their moves. I'd like to take out a bit of that unpredictability and replace it with a better opportunity to come in on attacks, which is something that pokemon like Venusaur and Clefable don't always have the luxury of doing. In conclusion, this pokemon would be fun to use like Clefable, and this would help the metagame out.

    Questions To Be Answered:
    • Does the current metagame have enough pokemon to really make people stop and think about what button they're clicking?
    • Is a pokemon that goes in for the kill and not much else boring, even though it has a wide variety of attacks in its arsenal?
    • Are easily predictable pokemon too prevalent in the metagame?
    • Are certain types more effective as special types in general, and others as physical? How can we transcend this distinction with this pokemon?

    I like the idea of having opposite stats, so that it would be analogous to or the antithesis of pokemon like Tyranitar, who attack physically and block specially. Imagine a physical wall with special attacks locked in a heated struggle, when Tyranitar comes in to block your special attack and set up its sandstorm, only to find out that you've got Aura Sphere in your arsenal, when he expected you to have something else, for an example. This could help create exciting and tense situations in the metagame, thereby improving its overall quality.

    I would suggest that this pokemon has a huge movepool in one stat, and maybe a few good moves in the other one. Because of this, a wide variety of types may be suggested for use, too, but hopefully the one that prevails will be unique. Perhaps it could even take advantage of Conversion, a very cool move given to only the porygon family. While porygon2 is pretty bulky, it is far from a wall.
  25. Res Ipsa Loquitur

    Res Ipsa Loquitur

    Aug 19, 2009
    This sounds a lot like Shedinja. Amazing in that it is borderline-unkillable, but with the flaw that it dies in one hit to any entry hazard or super effective move. I'm not sure how much better we could execute the concept.

    I find this concept very unclear. You say "like Clefable," which is basically the classic "jack of all trades, master of none" Pokemon. But then you talk about surprising Tyranitar with Aura Sphere. If you have so many strong special attacks that an amazing move like Aura Sphere isn't even expected, then you are master of a trade: special attacking!

    Maybe you could make the concept clearer by changing your questions section. Your questions all pertain to why we should pick this concept; if we are answering yes to these questions, then we would like to see this as a CAP. That is not what the questions section is supposed to do. The questions are supposed to be things we currently do not know about the metagame that would be answered if we made a successful CAP under this concept. Put another way, if your concept is "a Pokemon that knows Fire Blast," a good question would be "What Pokemon would become less effective with another Fire Blast user available?" rather than "Are there currently not enough Pokemon able to use Fire Blast?"
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