1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Celebi (Baton Pass)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by AccidentalGreed, Feb 12, 2013.

  1. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed "Smogon friends" is an oxymoron.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2009
    Messages:
    2,687
    Takin' over for Pocket.

    Status: Done

    GP Approvals (2/2): (melvni) (Jumpluff)

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    [​IMG]
    It's nice to see you again, my old friend.

    [SET]
    name: Baton Pass
    move 1: Baton Pass
    move 2: Calm Mind / Nasty Plot
    move 3: Giga Drain
    move 4: Substitute / Hidden Power Fire
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Calm / Timid
    evs: 252 HP / 224 SpD / 32 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Baton Pass isn't exactly the first thing that comes to mind when considering Celebi's large list of viable sets. Despite its rarity, however, using Baton Pass with a boosting move is an underrated and incredible strategy on something as versatile and bulky as Celebi. Not only does it boast multiple resistances to tank attacks while boosting, but it can also hit back hard should the situation call for it. While Mew might seem like a better candidate for such a set, Celebi's very presence intimidates and forces out a larger list of threats, and Mew's own set often leaves it too vulnerable due to a lack of attacking moves and a poor defensive typing. Outside of using Baton Pass, Celebi can also act as a bulky boosting tank, capable of boosting its Special Attack and hitting back hard with Giga Drain while avoiding dangerous attacks with Substitute or Baton Pass.</p>

    <p>To use this set effectively, Celebi should come in on a threat it can easily force out or set up on. Such targets include (but are not limited to) rain-reliant threats, bulky Water- and Ground-types, Breloom, and non-Taunt Gliscor. As the opponent switches in a response, Celebi should have acquired a boost or more. Baton Pass lets it escape from the clutches of Heatran, Scizor, Tyranitar, and many other counters, and pass its boosts to something more suited to facing these threats. Scizor in particular can be problematic due to its ability to use Pursuit or U-turn. Therefore, Celebi can either use Substitute to predict Pursuit and avoid U-turn or use Hidden Power Fire to take it, as well as other Steel-types, out instantly. As a bonus, if Celebi manages to keep its Substitute intact, the Baton Pass recipient can switch in safely while being even more of a threat with a form of protection.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>A specially defensive EV spread makes setting up boosts against special attackers much easier, and is especially preferred if using Calm Mind. Maximized investment in HP in particular is a requirement, allowing Celebi to tank hits better overall and, more importantly, create 101 HP Substitutes. Doing so prevents Seismic Toss and Night Shade users from breaking a Substitute in a single hit, making setting up in front of the likes of Blissey, Chansey, and Deoxys-D easier. Even so, to maintain offensive pressure and preserve Celebi's health and ability to continue using Substitute, it is recommended to hit them occasionally with boosted Giga Drains.</p>

    <p>If not using Calm Mind or if you would like Celebi to beat other threats, there are several other options to consider. Celebi's Speed can be increased to outrun several important targets; these include Modest Heatran, which requires 72 Speed EVs, and Timid Deoxys-D, which requires 176 Speed EVs with a Timid nature. Additionally, investing in Special Attack and using other coverage moves allows Celebi to beat some threats without having to rely on prediction with Baton Pass. For example, 248 HP / 148 SpD+ Scizor can be OHKOed by a +1 Hidden Power Fire with Stealth Rock damage, while the same can be said for specially defensive Heatran if Celebi uses a +2 Earth Power with 84 Special Attack EVs. Celebi is also able to use Swords Dance, though using either Nasty Plot or Calm Mind is generally better in the long run as they both benefit Celebi offensively. Magic Coat is another option that prevents phazers and Taunt users (especially the usually faster Deoxys-D) from ruining the chain. Recover can keep Celebi healthy in the long run, but sacrifices a good moveslot. Finally, a Tanga Berry allows Celebi to tank a U-turn and respond, though it can always bypass this with Substitute and will miss the recovery from Leftovers.</p>

    <p>As this set is centered around Baton Pass and a special boosting move, teammates that benefit from Special Attack and/or Special Defense boosts are obviously mandatory. Note, however, that Celebi's multiple weaknesses mean that defensive synergy is also mandatory; recipients must be able to tank attacks such as Scizor's Pursuit and U-turn, Tyranitar's Crunch, and random Fire Blasts and Ice Beams. Using this Celebi with rain support gives it one less weakness to deal with, and there is a long list of powerful rain-based attackers to pass boosts to, although in this case, using Hidden Power Fire is ill-advised. Special attackers that have decent synergy with Celebi and benefit from the boosts include Thundurus-T, Choice Scarf Keldeo, Starmie, Latios, Latias, and Volcarona. Pairing Celebi with Magic Bounce Espeon is also a good strategy to avoid being phazed out, though keep in mind that this doubles up on Ghost-, Dark-, and Bug-type weaknesses. Finally, teammates that can deal with specific Steel-types, opposing Perish Song Celebi, Volcarona, and Tornadus are very helpful in letting Celebi set up. Heatran is a good answer to many of them, while a Scizor of your own can Pursuit-trap Celebi and Tornadus.</p>
  2. melvni

    melvni
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2010
    Messages:
    1,148
    GP check. Good job on writing this.
    Additions in Blue
    Subtractions in Red
    Comments in Purple

    Show Hide
    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Baton Pass isn't exactly the first thing that comes to mind when considering Celebi's large list of viable sets—most notably its defensive set (you could add "or even just its defensive ones" or something similar if that's what you meant). Despite its rarity, however, using Baton Pass with a boosting move is an underrated and incredible strategy on something on as versatile and bulky as Celebi. Not only does it boast multiple resistances to tank attacks while boosting, but it can also hit back hard should the situation call for attacking. While Mew may might seem like a better candidate for such a set, Celebi's very presence forces a larger amount of threats out, and Mew's own set often leaves it too vulnerable due to a lack of attacking moves and good a poor defensive typing. Outside of using Baton Pass, Celebi can also act as a bulky boosting tank by itself, capable of boosting its special attack to Special Attack a few levels and hitting back with Giga Drain while avoiding dangerous attacks with Substitute or Baton Pass.</p>

    <p>To use this set effectively, Celebi should come in on a threat it can easily force out or set up on. Such targets include (but are not limited to) rain-reliant threats, bulky Water- or and Ground-types, Breloom, and non-Taunt Gliscor. As the opponent switches in a response, Celebi should have acquired a boost or more. Baton Pass lets it escape from the clutches of Heatran, Scizor, Tyranitar, and many other counters, and pass the its boosts to something more suited to facing these threats. Scizor in particular can be problematic due to its ability to use Pursuit or U-turn. Therefore, Celebi can either use Substitute to predict Pursuit and avoid U-turn, (remove comma) or use Hidden Power Fire to take it and other Steel-types out, as well as other Steel-types, instantly. As a bonus, if Celebi manages to keep its Substitute intact, the Baton Pass recipient can switch in safely while becoming being even more of a threat behind a form of protection.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>A specially defensive EV spread makes setting up boosts much easier against special attackers, (remove comma) and is especially preferred if using Calm Mind. Maximized investment in HP in particular is a requirement, allowing Celebi to tank hits better overall and, more importantly, create 101 HP Substitutes. Doing so prevents Seismic Toss and Night Shade users from breaking a Substitute in a single hit, making setup easier in front of the likes of Blissey, Chansey, and Deoxys-D. To Even still, to maintain offensive pressure and preserve Celebi's own health from and ability to continue using Substitute, it is recommended to hit them occasionally with boosted Giga Drains.</p>

    <p>If not using Calm Mind isn't the case, (remove comma) or if you would like Celebi to beat other threats, there are several other options to consider. Celebi's speed Speed can be increased to outrun several important targets; this includes these include Modest Heatran, which requires 72 Spe Speed EVs, and Timid Deoxys-D, which requires 176 Spe Speed EVs with a Timid nature. Additionally, investing in Special Attack and using other coverage moves allows Celebi to beat some threats without having to rely on prediction with Baton Pass. For example, 248 HP / 148+ (148 what?) Scizor can be OHKOed by a +1 Hidden Power Fire with Stealth Rock damage, while the same can be said for specially defensive Heatran if Celebi uses a +2 Earth Power with 84 SpA Special Attack EVs. Celebi is also able to use Swords Dance, though using either Nasty Plot or Calm Mind is generally better in the long run as they both benefit Celebi offensively. Magic Coat is another option that prevents phazers and Taunt users (especially the usually faster Deoxys-D) from ruining the chain. Recover can keep Celebi healthy in the long run, but sacrifices a good moveslot. Finally, the Tanga Berry allows Celebi to tank a U-turn and respond in time, though Celebi it can always bypass this with Substitute, (remove comma) and it will miss the recovery from Leftovers.</p>

    <p>Since As this set is centered around the Baton Pass and a special boosting move, teammates that benefit from the special attack and/or special defense boost Special Attack and/or Special Defense boosts are obviously mandatory. Keep note Keep in mind / Note (your choice, or another expression you prefer), however, that Celebi's multiple weaknesses means mean that defensive synergy is also mandatory; recipients must be able to tank attacks such as Scizor's Pursuit and U-turn, Tyranitar's Crunch, and random Fire Blasts and Ice Beams. Using this Celebi with rain support gives it one less weakness to deal with, and a powerful long list of powerful rain-based attackers to pass boosts to. Obviously in this case, using Hidden Power Fire is ill-advised. Special attackers that have decent synergy with Celebi and benefit from the boosts include Thundurus-T, Choice Scarf Keldeo, Starmie, Latios, Latias, and Volcarona. Pairing Celebi with Magic Bounce Espeon is also a good strategy to avoid being phazed out, though keep in mind that this doubles up on Ghost Ghost-, Dark-, and Bug-type weaknesses. Finally, teammates that can deal with specific Steel-types, opposing Perish Song Celebi, Volcarona, and Tornadus are very helpful in letting Celebi set up. Heatran is a good answer to many of them, while a Scizor of your own can Pursuit-trap Celebi and Tornadus.</p>


    [gp]1/2[/gp]
  3. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed "Smogon friends" is an oxymoron.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2009
    Messages:
    2,687
    Thanks, melvni! This thing needs one more, and it's out of the bag.
  4. tehy

    tehy

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2010
    Messages:
    1,658
    3 Amchecks in one night? That has to be some kind of a record. (Although, seeing how late it is, it'll probably be an ironic record for mistakes missed.)
    Also, ignore the random underlines. They just showed up and refuse to leave. Add green cut red comments below

    Show Hide

    [SET]¶
    name: Baton Pass¶
    move 1: Baton Pass¶
    move 2: Calm Mind / Nasty Plot¶
    move 3: Giga Drain¶
    move 4: Substitute / Hidden Power Fire¶
    item: Leftovers¶
    nature: Calm / Timid¶
    evs: 252 HP / 224 SpD / 32 Spe¶

    [SET COMMENTS]¶

    <p>Baton Pass isn't exactly the first thing that comes to mind when considering Celebi's large list of viable sets. Despite its rarity, however, using Baton Pass with a boosting move is an underrated and incredible strategy on something as versatile and bulky as Celebi. Not only does it boast multiple resistances to tank attacks while boosting, but it can also hit back hard should the situation call for attackingit. While Mew might seem like a better candidate for such a set, Celebi's very presence forces out a larger list of threats out, and Mew's own set often leaves it too vulnerable, due to a lack of attacking moves and a poor defensive typing. Outside of using Baton Pass, Celebi can also act as a bulky boosting tank by itself, capable of boosting its Special Attack a few levels and hitting back with Giga Drain, while avoiding dangerous attacks with Substitute or Baton Pass.</p>¶

    <p>To use this set effectively, Celebi should come in on a threat it can easily force out or set up on. Such targets include (but are not limited to) rain-reliant threats, bulky Water- and Ground-types, Breloom, and non-Taunt Gliscor. As the opponent switches in a response, Celebi should have acquired a boost or more. Baton Pass lets it escape from the clutches of Heatran, Scizor, Tyranitar, and many other counters, and pass its boosts to something more suited to facing these threats. Scizor in particular can be problematic due to its ability to use Pursuit or U-turn. Therefore, Celebi can either use Substitute to predict Pursuit and avoid U-turn, or use Hidden Power Fire to take it, as well as other Steel-types, out instantly. As a bonus, if Celebi manages to keep its Substitute intact, the Baton Pass recipient can switch in safely, while being even more of a threat behindwith a form of protection.</p>
    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]¶

    <p>A specially defensive EV spread makes setting up boosts much easier against special attackers much easier, and is especially preferred if using Calm Mind. Maximized investment in HP in particular is a requirement, allowing Celebi to tank hits better overall and, more importantly, create 101 HP Substitutes. Doing so prevents Seismic Toss and Night Shade users from breaking a Substitute in a single hit, making setting up easier in front of the likes of Blissey, Chansey, and Deoxys-D easier. Even stillo, to maintain offensive pressure and preserve Celebi's own health and ability to continue using Substitute, it is recommended to hit them occasionally with boosted Giga Drains.</p>¶

    <p>If not using Calm Mind or if you would like Celebi to beat other threats, there are several other options to consider. Celebi's Speed can be increased to outrun several important targets; these includes Modest Heatran, which requires 72 Speed EVs, and Timid Deoxys-D, which requires 176 Speed EVs with a Timid nature. Additionally, investing in Special Attack and using other coverage moves allows Celebi to beat some threats without having to rely on prediction with Baton Pass. For example, 248 HP / 148 SpD+ Scizor can be OHKOed by a +1 Hidden Power Fire with Stealth Rock damage, while the same can be said for specially defensive Heatran if Celebi uses a +2 Earth Power with 84 Special Attack EVs. Celebi is also able to use Swords Dance, though using either Nasty Plot or Calm Mind is generally better in the long run as they both benefit Celebi offensively. Magic Coat is another option that prevents phazers and Taunt users (especially the usually faster Deoxys-D) from ruining the chain. Recover can keep Celebi healthy in the long run, but sacrifices a good moveslot. Finally, thea Tanga Berry allows Celebi to tank a U-turn and respond, though it can always bypass this with Substitute and will miss the recovery from Leftovers.</p>¶

    <p>As this set is centered around Baton Pass and a special boosting move, teammates that benefit from Special Attack and/or Special Defense boosts are obviously mandatory. Note, however, that Celebi's multiple weaknesses mean that defensive synergy is also mandatory; recipients must be able to tank attacks such as Scizor's Pursuit and U-turn, Tyranitar's Crunch, and random Fire Blasts and Ice Beams. Using this Celebi with rain support gives it one less weakness to deal with, and a long list of powerful rain-based attackers to pass boosts to. Obviously, although in this case, using Hidden Power Fire is ill-advised. Special attackers that have decent synergy with Celebi and benefit from the boosts include Thundurus-T, Choice Scarf Keldeo, Starmie, Latios, Latias, and Volcarona. Pairing Celebi with Magic Bounce Espeon is also a good strategy to avoid being phazed out, though keep in mind that this doubles up on Ghost-, Dark-, and Bug-type weaknesses. Finally, teammates that can deal with specific Steel-types, opposing Perish Song Celebi, Volcarona, and Tornadus are very helpful in letting Celebi set up. Heatran is a good answer to many of them, while a Scizor of your own can Pursuit-trap Celebi and Tornadus.</p> ¶
    Comments: A form of protection? (When talking about subpassing). Maybe word better?
    The last part about setting up on Chans/Bliss/Deo-D. Does the part about occasionally using Giga Drain need to be said?

  5. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed "Smogon friends" is an oxymoron.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2009
    Messages:
    2,687
    Implemented the changes. I don't think there's anything wrong in particular with "form of protection."

    Anyhow, one more stamp and we're all done, Joe.
  6. jumpluff

    jumpluff princess
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Site Staff Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Smogon IRC SOp Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2008
    Messages:
    6,169
    Show Hide


    Very well-written. Barely any changes necessary, especially after melvni's check. Nice job!

    [gp]2/2~[/gp]
  7. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed "Smogon friends" is an oxymoron.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2009
    Messages:
    2,687
    Aaaand this is done! Thanks for the super-quick check, jump!
  8. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Messages:
    8,564
    you are champ, AG ;D
  9. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2009
    Messages:
    5,158
    Can I help you?

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)