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BW Ubers Drown All

Discussion in 'RMT Archive' started by trickroom, May 30, 2011.

  1. trickroom

    trickroom
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    DROWN ALL

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    Introduction
    Burn All is an awesome team made by firecape. His team inspired me to create a counterpart to Burn All. Since Jibaku made Drown All a kick word in IRC for me a while ago, I am using that name as the RMT tittle! Obviously, Drown All contains Kyogre and previously Gyarados was the MVP of the team. Nevertheless, I reluctantly removed Gyarados from the team because Gyarados just isn't worth using in Ubers without proper support, Stealth Rock weakness, mediocre stats and lack of recovery hurts it severely. As an Uber QC team member, I made an Ubers team just to support Gastrodon for the sake of testing the usability of the slug in the tier. I don't want to post any Ladderboard achievement here because getting to 1st on the Ubers leaderboard isn't such a big deal. Gyarados more common than Steel Arceus in total usage ---> LOL This team did fairly well when I tested it against several experienced players but I won't name them just like in firecape's RMT :P

    I don't think I need much prove for this team's success but it's a team not similar to my past teams. Jibaku's rain team was superb but I tried not to copy his team :P Jibaku's team of RestTalk Kyogre, Choice Scarf Palkia, Ferrothorn, Dialga, Arceus-Ground and Giratina-O gotten incredibly popular, heck I met many people spamming that team on ladder ;_; Similar to Vulcan Fury this team attempts to display the utility of a few underrated Pokemon: Gastrodon and Lugia. Gastrodon is rather anti-metagame because it completely trolls Kyogre, the most common Pokemon in the tier with it's Water-type and Electric immunity, decent bulk and access to Recover. That's not all, Gastrodon also harasses Steel Arceus, Palkia, Giratina-O and Dialga. [ Note: I dropped Gastrodon for Lustrous Orb Palkia, another uncommon threat in Ubers. Unlike Gastrodon, Lustrous Orb Palkia can not only surprise but immediately take out the opponent expecting the Choice Scarf set. ] The Lugia in this team is rather unique. While the standard Great Wall Lugia fears Toxic from the likes of pink blobs to death, this one can use them as a ticket to get a free Substitute up. Instead of dying to Heatran, Substitute Lugia is safe from Heatran's Toxic. Even Taunt fails to stop Lugia from flying things around thanks to Dragon Tail.

    I don't know what will you call a team like this. It's generally defensive based team due to the bulkiness of all the team members. I like Wish support a lot but Blissey or Chansey cannot fit in. Unlike most generic stall teams, I abuse Dialga and Giratina-O to threaten stall teams with their mighty power and bulk. Contrary to popular believe, my team actually fairs well against the standard Classic Stall team. Choice Scarf users are generally free food for my team because this team utilizes amazing synergy between all of the team members. Hax can be a general nuisance, something like a critical hit from Groudon's Earthquake on my Kyogre can be a disaster.

    Arceus is released with no EV restrictions this generation. This team attempts to cover all of them as close as possible. This is probably the longest RMT I ever made because I followed Jibaku's Vulcan Fury RMT style! He gets all the credit for it because his RMT is just so cool and neat!

    PS: I might lie on the EV spreads..

    Here's the team...

    Team at a Glance
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    Kyogre @ Choice Scarf***firecape
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 64 HP / 252 SpA / 192 Spe
    Modest Nature (+SpA, -Atk)
    - Water Spout
    - Thunder
    - Surf
    - Ice Beam

    Kyogre is the base of this team, by summoning infinite heavy downpour. Unlike the standard Scarf Kyogre, I prefer power over the little extra Speed. While I lose the Speed tie and outspeeding Deoxys-formes, my Kyogre can OHKO even a +1 Mewtwo at full health. With Modest, Kyogre suddenly gets the ability to OHKO max HP Arceus, a very impressive feat. Water Spout drowns almost any Uber, including but not limited to Mewtwo, Darkrai and Arceus. This bloated whale holds the entire team together by acting as a revenge killer or cleaning up with fast and powerful strikes.

    Thunder fries Manaphy, opposing Kyogre, some Lugia and can spread paralysis around. I can always Thunder predicted Palkia switch ins and cripple them with a possible paralysis and doing around 43% damage. Surf is mandatory and still does a respectable ~90% to Mewtwo. I was thinking about Hydro Pump but with my already horrible luck, I rather do less damage for 100% accuracy. Ice Beam allows me to pick of Dragons such as non Scarf Garchomp, Zekrom, unboosted Rayquaza, especially MixedQuaza, Shaymin-S and Groudon if the weather is not on my side. Defensive teams always face problems from the near unstoppable Mewtwo and Darkrai. Nevertheless, Kyogre drowns them both easily with a mighty tidal wave. I don't usually lead with Kyogre due to team preview. I will only lead with Kyogre when the opponent's lead is most likely to be Darkrai. If their lead is Groudon, I won't lead with Kyogre because the weather will then be sunny. Max Special Attack is straight foward, while the Speed EVs help to outrun everything up to Mewtwo. Some HP EVs are for additional bulk and that little buff helped me survived a +2 Arceus Extremespeed once.

    Kyogre is named after Firecape because firecape is phat, fast, helpful, persistent and strong :) I mean look at the Parasect formation on Jibaku's profile wall. Iconic is still a true boss, he's cooler than firecape imo but firecape is phat so I named Kyogre as firecape.

    I won't mention any Dream World threats here (unlike Burn All) Without Latias blocking the way to Kyogre's sweep, this true King of Ubers (Arceus suck imo) can smash almost everything in his path.

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    Giratina-O @ Griseous Orb***Jibaku
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 236 Atk / 236 SpA / 36 Spe
    Naughty Nature (+Atk, -SpD)
    - Draco Meteor
    - Dragon Tail
    - Shadow Sneak
    - Thunder

    Giratina-O is the best spinblocker in the game, out ranking even Ghost Arceus. Giratina-O's resistances are always overlooked. Resistances to Water, Electric, Fire, Grass and immunity to Fighting and Ground, makes it a fantastic pivot. Weakness to Dragon, Ghost and Dark are a bit depressing but Giratina-O's bulk is actually similar to Ghost Arceus assuming both are without HP or Defense EVs. Giratina-O checks Mewtwo, Victini, mono attacking Kyogre, Groudon, Ho-Oh, Ground Arceus, Excadrill and a lot of other threats, so it's kinda like Burn All's Heatran, phazing everything out repeatedly, and harassing stall. Unlike Roar, Giratina-O's Dragon Tail actually packs quite a punch, especially when combined with hazards. As an example, even Fireburn's divine Ghost Arceus was brought down with a simple Dragon Tail + Shadow sneak with a layer of Spikes and Stealth Rock out. Giratina-O's ability to wear down his counters with entry hazards, invulnerable to hazards himself and Dragon Tail is an amazing ability Ghost Arceus wishes it can do. The EVs are standard on Mixed Giratina-O but I like to Speed creep a bit to beat Groudon in a Dragon Tail war.

    Of course, we must no forget Giratina-O's main niche is to block any attempts of Rapid Spin. Forretress will struggle to do much damage although Giratina-O will loathe swallowing a Toxic. Draco Meteor is an extremely powerful move, and it gets STAB with a Griseous Orb boost. Draco Meteor's main move is to dish out heavy damage to the opponent before spamming Dragon Tail, and it's mainly to smack Groudon or Dialga. Dragon Tail was already mentioned earlier and it is Giratina-O's most used move. Shadow Sneak is rather weak but it can be useful for picking off weakened things such as Mewtwo and Ghost Arceus. It won't be too hard to put many threats into KO range when combined with entry hazards. Thunder is mainly a filler as Hidden Power Fire sucks in the rain, even when Groudon is so popular, I chose Thunder to spread paralysis around and threaten Lugia or Kyogre.

    Giratina-O is named after Jibaku, he is a very cool guy and his favorite Pokemon happens to be Giratina-O. Oh yeah, Jibaku first used (popularized?) Dragon Tail Giratina-O before it became the main move for the renegade. EDIT: Jibaku found my threat list back :D

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    Lugia @ Leftovers***Fireburn
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpD
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SpA)
    - Substitute / Reflect
    - Toxic
    - Roost
    - Dragon Tail

    This is a rare Lugia set not seen a lot in the tier. Sub + Toxic allows Lugia to stall out a variety of threats such as Arceus, Ho-Oh, Groudon and Rayquaza. Sometimes I miss Reflect for completely walling Ho-Oh and physical Arceus but Substitute prevents Lugia from being statused by the likes of Chansey, Ferrothorn or even Groudon. In addition, thanks to Lugia's bulk, Groudon's and even Rayquaza's Dragon Tail will never break Lugia's Subsitute. Lugia is the main buffer of the team and it annoys many offensive threats. This Lugia EV spread became the standard for the outdated Great Wall Lugia set. With an Impish nature, I can comfortably wall Groudon, Rayquaza, Garchomp and even Ho-Oh!

    Substitute helps a lot for preventing status being inflicted on Lugia. It turn the tables on the pink blobs, and Lugia can now abuse them because either Seismic Toss or Ice Beam will not break the Sub. Toxic is Lugia's main way of doing damage. Lugia is my only check to Calm Mind Grass Arceus if it's the last Pokemon. Roost is mandatory for a wall like Lugia and just gets better with Pressure. Dragon Tail is Lugia's new gift this generation, and it works incredibly well. Thanks to this move, I can stay in Lugia on Heatran or StallTwo. Staying on Heatran when not behind a Rhydon doll can be risky though because some of this Volcanoes love to carry Toxic. Lugia also provides useful Grass resistance to the team and can beat Grass Arceus and Shaymin-S for Kyogre.

    Lugia is named after Fireburn because he made the Lugia analysis, loves Lugia, is overall a friendly and experienced guy. Fireburn can absorb a lot of blows( including the Gyara discussion !_!) just like Lugia.

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    Dialga @ Leftovers***Colonel_M
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP / 96 SpA / 140 SpD / 20 Spe
    Modest Nature (+SpA, -Atk)
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Stealth Rock
    - Fire Blast
    - Roar

    Nothing can fully halt a Dialga rampage with the possible exception of Ground Arceus. Unlike Burn All, Dialga fits perfectly with the Drown All theme. While Kyogre drowns threats with torrential rain, Dialga drowns everything in a Time Zone. Setting Stealth Rock is almost important for any team. Dialga is very reliable and it can beat Groudon leads because Fire Blast is a 2HKO on most Groudon. EV spread seems confusing but it gives Dialga a bonus point in Special Attack while providing optimum bulk. Some Speed EVs were slapped in to beat Groudon in a speed creep contest.

    Draco Meteor annihilates anything not resistant to it bar extremely bulky farts such as Ho-Oh or Chansey. However, I picked Dragon Pulse for it's consistency and for defeating Bulk Up Dialga with Leech Seed support. Dragon Pulse still OHKOes Palkia after Stealth Rock anyway. Fire Blast roasts Forretress and Ferrothorn, both are possible annoyance to the team. Roar is used because I just love raping things with entry hazards, and since Dialga forces a lot of switches, Roar is an invaluable move. Breaking stall becomes a tad easier with Dialga around. Dialga can also easily phaze out Steel-, Electric- and Grass Arceus but is unable to kill them. Toxic on Dialga can work to stop Grass Arceus but I prefer Roar to phaze out Shaymin-S, Ho-Oh and Hone Claws Zekrom.

    Dialga is named after Colonel_M because Colonel_M is a Tyrant King and owns everything like Dialga.

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    Ferrothorn (M) @ Leftovers***reachzero
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD ( 0 Spe IVs)
    Sassy Nature (+SpD, -Spe)
    - Gyro Ball
    - Leech Seed
    - Spikes
    - Protect / Power Whip

    Similar to Burn All, Ferrothorn makes another appearance in Drown All. Unlike the one in Burn All, my Ferrothorn is all out Specially Defensive due to the amount of Special Attacks, Ferrothorn is likely to take such as Spacial Rend, Draco Meteor, Thunder, Surf, Fire Blast in rain, Focus Blast, Grass Knot, Seed Flare and the list goes on.. I just love to Spike stack and abuse them through phazing, a tactic favoured by top players such as Jibaku, Fireburn, reachzero and firecape. Since I am battling in Wifi Ubers, I have nothing to fear from Chandelure. I have another great Kyogre check so Gyro Ball is used to deal more damage, and prevent Shaymin-S from coming in for free. Gyro Ball is actually surprisingly powerful since it almost always hits for base 150 damage.

    Leech Seed is Ferrothorn's only way of healing and with it, I can beat Dark and Steel Arceus with the entire team and Leech Seed support. Spikes is obviously useful because the team is focusing on Spikes abuse. Ferrothorn provides useful resistances to the team such as Dark-, Dragon- and Electric-types. It can also stop most Zekrom sets, excluding the Sub Hone Claws set. Ferrothorn also assists Lugia in absorbing hits from the likes of Garchomp, Groudon, some Rayquaza and Arceus. Lastly, Leech Seed + Protect is a cool combination to heal up and causes a lot of annoyance. Anyway, I am thinking of using Power Whip over Protect to combat Manaphy and Ground Arceus. I sometimes miss Protect's scouting ability though and free healing with Leech Seed. Power Whip hits Groudon harder too but makes it set up fodder for Rayquaza or Shaymin-S.

    Ferrothorn is named after reachzero because they are both tough and produces amazing results. I also saw reachzero frequently used Ferrothorn in his Ubers team...

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    Palkia @ Lustrous Orb***Bloo
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD /252 Spe
    Nature(s): Timid (+ Spe, -Atk)
    - Spacial Rend
    - Surf
    - Thunder
    - Fire Blast

    Unlike Gyarados, Palkia is a TRUE beast in Ubers. I am currently using it over Gastrodon since the slug sucks vs sun teams. Palkia also helps me check Manaphy, Lucario, Ho-Oh and Kyogre. Palkia lures in Ferrothorn and 2HKO it with Fire Blast easily. Oh yeah, Jibaku is using Scarf Palkia in his team, this one is a rare sight in the current metagame with lots of surprise value. User BLOO is awesome just like Palkia and he even said Palkia > Gastrodon all the way. What user Blue said makes a lot of sense though! It made me reconsider putting Palkia back over Gastrodon.

    I actually wanted to use Palkia over Gastrodon because Gastrodon just sucks against sun based teams. Palkia also helps me check Lucario, Manaphy and even Ho-OH in the rain of course! Lustrous Orb Palkia is now the superior choice over Gastrodon for the team. After some discussion with Bloo, I decided to use Palkia over Gastrodon. Palkia somewhat fixes that annoying Ferrothorn issue by luring it in and KO with Fire Blast, Thunder fries Manaphy for the 2HKO, Lucario is OHKOed by Fire Blast or Surf. It fixes all of the team's weaknesses really except now I lack an Electric-type immune but I guess that's unnecessary with Dialga, Giratina-O and Ferrothorn to absorb it. Lustrous Orb pushes Palkia's STAB moves to insane levels, allowing it to nearly OHKO min HP Arceus with Surf in the rain after just Stealth Rock damage. Thunder is usually just for raping Kyogre and Manaphy but it works. Should opposing Lugia or pink blobs try to wall Palkia, Ferrothorn can set up on them for free or my Dialga can phaze them out with relative ease. Giratina-O punishes Chansey to the extreme with entry hazards support while Kyogre scares off Lugia generally. Ferrothorn and Lugia can stomach almost any Dragon-type attacks for Palkia while absorbing Specs Water Spout is Palkia's main niche for this team.

    Although Palkia is a smaller fish compare to Gyarados, Palkia is just as awesome if not more. Palkia is named after Bloo because he is the one who made me try out Palkia over Gastrodon for another time. Palkia > Gastrodon at least for now.

    Show Hide

    Gyarados
    Moveset Name: Annoyer
    Move 1: Taunt
    Move 2: Waterfall
    Move 3: Dragon Tail
    Move 4: Toxic
    Item: Leftovers
    Ability: Intimidate
    Nature(s): Impish
    EVs: 248 HP/ 184 Def / 76 Spe

    Gyarados was an ex team member. Although I like Gyarados and I reached 1st on the ladder with my Ubers Gyarados team(getting to 1st on ladder means nothing in Ubers), Gyarados isn't owning in Ubers anytime soon. Lugia is much better in that team slot. I made the Gyarados team without referring to Jibaku's team :P so I am not putting Gyarados in the section below.

    Gastrodon (Gastrodon) (M) @ Leftovers***The Chaser
    Trait: Storm Drain
    EVs: 252 HP / 240 SpD / 16 Spe
    Calm Nature (+SpD, -Atk)
    - Earth Power
    - Scald
    - Recover
    - Toxic / Clear Smog

    As the final member, you know who this is! Gastrodon might look iffy and I even doubt it's effectiveness earlier. In this team Gastrodon plays an important niche other than stopping the infamous Kyogre. In addition to walling Kyogre, Gastrodon provides a valuable Electric resistance to the team. It also beats Deoxys-A lacking Grass Knot and the occasional Electric Arceus. This slug also happens to completely wall Qwilfish and Kabutops :D This team is made to test Gastrodon and it did fine.

    EV spread is simple, max out Special bulk because it's Gastrodon's job to defeat Kyogre, Scarf Dialga, Palkia and even Ghost Arceus! Mud Bomb seems cute but it is too unreliable. Mud Bomb just love to miss at the worst times so Earth Power seems better but I sometimes miss the ability to reduce the accuracy of the opponent. Earthquake strikes Steelceus and Mixed Dialga harder but I have those covered with Leech Seed + Burn damage from Scald. Storm Drain allows a Special Attack boost when hit by a Water-type attack so I can abuse this boost by spamming Earth Power or Scald. Scald is rather random but it can spread burns which is the main reason I am using it. Scald + Earth Power allows me to defeat Steel Arceus and possibly Calm Mind Ground Arceus. Toxic is to prevent Gastrodon from being utter set-up bait against things like Swords Dance Arceus and Rayquaza. I am also thinking of Clear Smog since it allows me to defeat the almost extinct Baton Passers without Taunt and beats up bulky boosters such as Ghost Arceus. I found Groudon switching in a lot on Gastrodon, probably to set up Stealth Rock but Toxic or Scald's moderate burn rate will likely cripple it. I am thinking about using Mud Slap too because Gastrodon is usually weak anyway and that 100% reducing accuracy is fun to abuse against bulky Pokemon like Bulk Up Dialga or Arceus.

    Gastrodon is named after The Chaser because they are both resilient and The Chaser is my bro. The Chaser is also a great player and we both use Trick Room teams in Ubers :) Sadly, I removed Gastrodon because it plain sucks compare to Palkia and is useless vs sun based teams. Oh yeah Gastrodon gives Ferrothorn a free switch in too. :(


    Please rate away! Credits go to Jibaku for discussing with me and finding the team's weakness to Calm Mind Focus Blast Ghost Arceus (fixed with Clear Smog Gastrodon but it's 2HKOed by a +1 Judgment ;_;) The idea is to never let Ghost Arceu setup or I will have to nearly sacrifice Dialga to phaze it out mid game or use Ferrothorn to annoy it. Toxic from Gastrodon owns Ghost Arceus, Lugia can survive one hit and Toxic it. If unboosted, Scarf Kyogre can OHKO Ghost Arceus. I haven't discover any major threats at the moment but that's why I am making it into an RMT!

    Team Building Process



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    I saw Jibaku's amazing rain team and used it as the base of this team. [ Note: Jibaku's Vulcan Fury RMT's Team Building Process words are in blue colour, mine are red!]

    I took out (stole? :P) Jibaku's gen 5 rain team and saw his synergy combinations of Calm Mind RestTalk Kyogre, Palkia, Ferrothorn, Dialga and Ground Arceus with Giratina-O as the spin blocker. I like his team and i even used his very own team against him ;_; to troll. I began to like utilizing bulky rain teams after using his.

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    I removed Arceus in the team since I don't like Arceus much. This became the main difference between both his team and the one I am going to build. For Arceus, I put in Lugia instead who checks arguably more things such as Dragon Dance Rayquaza, Scarf Kyogre, Palkia and Ho-Oh. I used this opportunity to abuse Sub Toxic Lugia since Ferrothorn and Chansey are rather common in the Ubers tier at the moment.

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    After the removal of Ground Arceus, I found out I lack a Ground-type. Since Ubers QC were having a discussion on Gastrodon's viability in Ubers, I decided to give Gastrodon a second chance. Gastrodon not only stops Kyogre but absorbs Electric-type attacks for free. It also beats Steel Arceus with a burn and Ferrothorn's Leech Seed, creating an effective combination. With Gastrodon owning Kyogre, I removed Palkia since it was primarily a Kyogre check. Thanks to Lugia, I can check Rayquaza without the help of Palkia. I need a Scarf user over someone since Palkia was removed. Thus, Kyogre was used as the Scarf user over Jibaku's original Mono-attacking set. Scarf Kyogre did very well and it can OHKO a +1 Mewtwo, something Palkia cannot achieve. Until now, this team did exceptionally well, and I am satisfied with it :D I am actually thinking about dropping Gastrodon back for Palkia, but that makes the team resemble Jibaku's team even more LOL. Mixed Palkia is an awesome fit over Gastrodon, and it isn't useless against sun teams either.

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    Now, I have decided to reuse Palkia again but not Scarf Palkia though. Gastrodon's reign is over, it's time for Lustrous Orb Palkia to smash the Ubers metagame to shreds! User Bloo proved that through his awesome victory in a recent Ubers tournament too. He mentioned that non-choiced Palkia easily wins him the game most of the time. I like the way the team stands now and Gastrodon is forgotten in the same way Gyarados is. However, these fishes will never be useless in my opinion so I grouped them in a hide tag instead.

    Note (open)
    PS: I hope Jibaku doesn't mind me using his team as a base. He even made Drawn All as a kick word so Ima troll him with a Drown All RMT :) Unlike most of his RMTs and firecape's this one is rain based !_! After the Battle of the Week, many players used Jibaku's team, so I felt guilty for popularizing it earlier.


    Threat List :
    Jibaku Style Uber Threat list with generation 5 additions..I removed some useless Pokemon though. I still have some Gastrodon mentions in because I sometimes do use Gastrodon over Palkia for fun.
    Black indicates minor threat
    Blue indicates a somewhat mild threat
    Red indicates a high level threat

    [​IMG]Arceus : God of all Pokemon, I don't really like it but how do you counter all the variants?
    Show Hide

    Swords Dance Arceus:

    *Extremekiller Arceus: Lugia can Toxic it while easily surviving +2 ExtremeSpeed or even Shadow Claw. Dragon Tail stops Arceus from being greedy. Ferrothorn can Leech Seed and Gyro Ball it for decent damage, while resisting most attacks other than Earthquake. Even Overheat in the rain does not KO. If it somehow lacks Earthquake, Dialga can Roar it out easily. Giratina-O can survive most hits bar Shadow Force and phaze it out with Dragon Tail or just Draco Meteor.

    *Ground Dancer: Kyogre outspeeds and drowns it easily. Earthquake will not KO Kyogre when unboosted. Lugia is bulky enough to shave off a +2 Stone Edge and Toxic it or Dragon Tail. Giratina-O takes little damage from Stone Edge and can force it out with Dragon Tail. Ferrothorn can annoy with Leech Seed but I lack Power Whip to KO it ;_; Palkia can OHKO with Surf while surviving unboosted Earthquake easily.

    *Rockey sweeperKyogre outspeeds and OHKOes it. Drown All of them. Ferrothorn survives all and can reply with Leech Seed + Gyro Ball to 2HKO it. Gastrodon can Scald it to death in rain of course! Without Gastrodon, I have Palkia to OHKO it with Surf but +2 Stone Edge will likely OHKO Palkia.

    *Ghost Stallbreaker: People say it breaks stall but my team has Kyogre to rape it. +2 Extremespeed is rather weak from Ghost Arceus, and Kyogre can easily deal seriously damage with Surf or OHKO with Water Spout. Dialga and Ferrothorn can take at least one attack, Roar it out or Leech Seed accordingly. Lugia can survive +2 Shadow Claw and Toxic it, Substitute blocks any Shadow Force attempts or Ferrothorn can switch in on the executing turn. Giratina-O can pick off weakened ones with Shadow Sneak. Should it come in on Palkia, Palkia can 2HKO it with Surf while Shadow Claw is unable to 2HKO Palkia.

    *Dragon style Extremekiller: +2 Outrage hits like a truck so I am putting this in blue. Lugia can survive +2 Outrage and Dragon Tail it out. Ferrothorn can annoy it with Leech Seed and 2HKO with Gyro Ball and passive damage. Dialga beats it one-on-one and can roar out unboosted ones. Kyogre can Ice Beam it to death but will not OHKO it. If Arceus gets greedy or comes in on Palkia's Fire Blast, Thunder or Surf expecting a Scarf variant, Palkia can OHKO it with Spacial Rend.

    *Swiming Extremekiller: Giratina-O is likely the best counter to it unless it has Dragon Claw. Thunder or Dragon Tail are useful tools to mess up with SD Water Arceus. Kyogre can KO with Thunder while Lugia can phaze it out with Dragon Tail or Toxic it. Ferrothorn takes little damage from any attack and can Leech Seed to cause annoyance. Dialga beats it when Arceus lacks Recover. Gastrodon can come in on anything and Toxic it into the oblivion. Palkia can 2HKO with Thunder while surviving everything.

    *Steel Dancer: Kyogre outspeeds and KOes with Surf or Water Spout. Gastrodon survives +2 Earthquake and can Scald or Earth Power it. Ferrothorn walls it and can Leech Seed but cannot KO Steel Arceus. Lugia survives any attack and can Dragon Tail it out. Dialga can Fire Blast it or Roar it out. Palkia again can Fire Blast or Surf it for the 2HKO depending on the weather.

    Calm Mind Arceus:

    *Mono Steel: It can be taken down by Ferrothorn + Gastrodon while Lugia and Dialga can phaze it out if Arceus lacks Roar. Leech Seed + Scald's burn will make Steel Arceus's life hard. It can't really damage Dialga without boosts while Kyogre can OHKO unboosted ones with Water Spout. Palkia defeats it one-on-one.

    *Grass: I don't like these Arceus formes. Lugia is my best hope of killing it with Toxic. Dialga can Roar it out while Ferrothorn can set up on it but do to stop it.

    *Fighting: Lugia again, with Toxic and surviving Ice Beams easily. Kyogre can OHKO unboosted ones. Giratina-O can Dragon Tail it out but hates boosted Ice Beams. Gastrodon can Clear Smog or Toxic it.

    *Rock:Kyogre again is the best counter because it can OHKO Rock Arceus even after one Calm Mind. Gastrodon is next because it can burn it with Scald or spam Earth Power. Ferrothorn can still annoy it with Gyro Ball + Leech Seed and easily survives Fire Blast in the rain. Palkia has Surf to OHKO it in rain.

    *Ghost: Ghost Arceus is a bit trickier to deal with but Kyogre, Gastrodon and Ferrothorn can annoy it. Clear Smog will help me in this case. Ferrothorn can Leech Seed it while Gastrodon can Toxic too. Kyogre can kill those without boosts.

    *Electric: Owned by Gastrodon and Ferrothorn. Gastrodon walls it easily and Ice Beam is weak. Clear Smog away all the boosts or Toxic it. Ferrothorn can hit it with Leech Seed. Kyogre OHKOes those brave enough to switch in. Sadly, without Gastrodon, I lose a check to this thing. Palkia can still beat it one-on-one with Surf.

    *Dark: Stopped by Ferrothorn + Gastrodon or Dialga can keep phazing it or Dragon Pulse till Recover runs out. Kyogre can OHKO even Max HP Arceus without boosts. Ferrothorn will generally be a large annoyance to it while Gastrodon can Clear Smog away. Palkia's Surf will generally 2HKO it.

    *Poison: Gastrodon beats it with Earth Power and Scald's burn. Clear Smog to remove all the boosts. Ferrothorn and Dialga can annoy it with Leech Seed or Roar. Kyogre OHKOes it with Water Spout. Lugia can easily phaze it out. Palkia has STAB Surf to pummel it for the 2HKO in rain.

    *Ice: Kyogre can OHKO unboosted ones with Water Spout. Gastrodon can Clear Smog or Toxic it depending on which move I have. Ferrothorn can Leech Seed and Gyro Ball it to death easily. Dialga can phaze it out or Fire Blast. Palkia has Fire Blast to nail it or Surf in rain.

    *Water: Gastrodon walls it completely and has Toxic or Clear Smog to fight back. Ferrothorn Leech Seeds it to make it sad. Kyogre can KO with Thunder while Dialga and Lugia can phaze it out. Lugia can Toxic it too. Palkia's Thunder will kill poor Arceus.

    *Fire:Kyogre swallows it in a tidal wave and KOes even after one Calm Mind. Lugia beats it with Toxic in rain while Dialga can phaze it out easily. Gastrodon walls it and has Toxic or Clear Smog, Scald and Earth Power to strike back. Palkia has Surf to OHKO this Arceus even through Calm Mind.

    Defensive Arceus:

    *Standard Wallceus Owned by Kyogre. Dialga and Ferrothorn can set up easily on it although they won't enjoy a nasty burn. My Lugia has Toxic and poison ruins any Arceus variant minus Poison Arceus who is stopped by Kyogre and Gastrodon to an extend. Arceus doesn't enjoy burn either because it lacks leftovers while Lugia and Gastrodon don't mind it too much. Leech Seed is annoying for Arceus as well. Palkia 2HKOes this Arceus too while easily surviving Ice Beam..

    *Support Ghost Arceus: Kyogre OHKOes it, Ferrothorn annoys it with Leech Seed while Dialga can set up Stealth Rock and Roar it out. Gastrodon can Toxic too.

    *Support Grass Arceus: Dialga and Ferrothorn can wall it but hates Will-O-Wisps. Both can set up on Arceus and phaze it in Dialga's case. Giratina-O can Dragon Tail it out. Lugia can step into the scene and Toxic it while taking little damage from Ice Beam. Kyogre can 2HKO with Ice Beam after some prior damage such as Stealth Rock.

    *Seel Arceus: As fat as a seal but Kyogre can still cause major destruction with Water Spout. Ferrothorn can Leech Seed or set up on it, as can Dialga. Gastrodon can annoy it with Scald or Earth Power. Palkia 2HKOes it.

    *Poison Tankceus: Kyogre KOes with Water Spout while Dialga walls it. Ferrothorn can use it as Spikes time while Dialga easily phazes it out or Stealth Rock. Gastrodon can burn it with Scald and 3HKO with Earth Power. Palkia can Surf it out to death.


    [​IMG]Darkrai: Grrr...I hate this Darky.

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    Nasty Plot: Raped by Kyogre, if it lacks Focus Blast, then Ferrothorn and Dialga walls it. Can be annoying if Kyogre is down. Gastrodon can take on unboosted ones and use Toxic or Scald, Clear Smog if I have it. Relying on Kyogre to stop it is all this team has. Palkia beats it if someone is asleep.

    Swords Dance: I considered these as gimmicky because the standard Nasty Plot Darkrai sweeps a lot better. Anyway, Lugia walls it completely. Dialga and Ferrothorn can smack it with Dragon Pulse or Gyro Ball respectively and survive +2 Brick Break.


    [​IMG]Dialga: A large dinosaur, and has virtually no true counter, but Gastrodon, Lugia and Ferrothorn can somewhat harass it.

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    Choice Specs: They hit like a truck. Smart switching is the key here. Lugia can take any attack but hates Thunder. Ferrothorn survives everything bar Fire blast and can Leech Seed it. Gastrodon laughs at Thunder and Fire Blast, both are the only moves Dialga has to take out Ferrothorn and Lugia respectively.

    Choice Scarf: Gastrodon can take on any attack and Recover off or Earth Power it. Ferrothorn walls it too and annoys with Leech Seed. If Dialga chooses to lock himself into Fire Blast or Thunder, Gastrodon can switch in freely and my own Dialga can take it too. Lugia survives any attack, even Thunder fails to 2HKO, just to show how bulky Lugia is.

    Defensive Bulk Up: This one can be a bit trickier if it's the last pokemon. Lugia deals with it easily mid game. When it's the last pokemon, it takes the combination of Dialga and Ferrothorn's Leech Seed to take it out. Dragon Pulse + Leech Seed will 3HKO Bulk Up Dialga easily. If my Dialga goes down to boosted Outrages, Giratina-O or Kyogre can step into the scene and finish off poor Dialga. Gastrodon can 3HKO with Earth Power while surviving unboosted Outrage easily. If Dialga gets greedy, Palkia will 3HKO it with Spacial Rend at worst, a 2HKO is likely with Leech Seed damage.

    Mixed: Lugia is the arguably the best counter to it. Thunder is a large problem if it has it but even then Lugia generally outspeeds it and can Roost out. Gastrodon walls it and survives even Draco Meteor. At -2 Dialga must either Outrage or lose to Gastrodon. If it lacks Fire Blast, Ferrothorn owns it. In rain, Ferrothorn can actually survive Fire Blast. Palkia can easily pick off weakened ones and this will likely happen thanks to Spikes and potential Life Orb recoil.

    Trick Room Dialga: Lugia walls it completely as even Life Orb Draco Meteor does less than 67%. Kyogre can 2HKO it outside of Trick Room. In rain, Ferrothorn has some decent chance of annoying it, and if Trick Room is up, Ferrothorn outspeeds Dialga LOL. Gastrodon can squander most attacks other than Outrage.


    [​IMG]Giratina: A phat Pokemon but it can't really do much to my team because it is getting stalled out.

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    Physically / Specially Defensive: Destroyed by my entire team. While it can survive 2 Ice Beams from Kyogre, it likely won't because I usually get hazards up early in the match. Giratina is also unable to prevent Spike users from setting up on it, in my team, Ferrothorn. Dialga wrecks it with Dragon Pulse which will be a 2HKO while Lugia laughs at it, sets up a Sub and Dragon Tail it out. Specially Defensive sets wall Kyogre easily but that's all it's doing against my team, still utter Ferrothorn food. Lugia just loves facing this guys and get a Sub out for free. Giratina-O can always Dragon Tail it out or Draco Meteor it. Palkia beats it with Spacial Rend.

    Calm Mind RestTalk:Ferrothorn annoys if with Leech Seed, and sets up Spikes on it. Dialga can slowly kill it or Roar it out whenever Giratina gets greedy. Giratina-O can always Dragon Tail it out or Draco Meteor it while taking Dragon Pulse for less than 50%. Gastrodon can Clear Smog away all the boosts. Palkia beats unhealthy ones.


    [​IMG]Giratina-O: Best spinblocker in the game...as awesome as Jibaku?

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    Mixed Spinblocker: Lugia is likely the best counter to all Mixed Giratina-O sets, fearing only paralysis from Thunder. Lugia can then proceed to Toxic and Roost away. Kyogre can Ice Beam it while surviving at least one attack, Ferrothorn owns it in rain with Leech Seed then whittle away with Gyro Ball. Dialga works too by smacking poor Giratina-O with Dragon Pulse. My own Giratina-O can usually outspeed opposing ones and fry them with Draco Meteor. Gastrodon can Toxic it and Recover off most damage bar Outrage. Palkia OHKOes it with Spacial Rend.

    Sub Calm Mind: If it chooses Thunder over Aura Sphere, Ferrothorn will laugh at it. My whole team has good synergy with each other. Gastrodon can Clear Smog away any Calm Mind boosts and Recover off any damage taken. However, Gastrodon cannot touch Giratina-O's Substitute at all. Dialga defeats Giratina-O with Dragon Pulse and I usually outspeed it thanks to the Speed creep. If Giratina-O gets greedy, Dialga can just Roar it out. My Giratina-O usually out speeds the standard ones and OHKO it with Draco Meteor. Lugia beats it with Toxic and Roost. Palkia beats it one-on-one.


    [​IMG]Groudon: Tough but this is a rain team! I can drown this dinosaur with a tidal wave...

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    Support: Lugia walls it to hell and forth but cannot prevent Stealth Rock being set up. Toxic can hamper Groudon's bulk easily while Groudon has little hope of breaking Lugia's Sub. Gastrodon can sometimes survive 2 Earthquakes from Support Groudon and Toxic it. Giratina-O rapes it with Draco Meteor or can phaze it out with a faster Dragon Tail. Spacial Rend from Palkia easily 2HKOes.

    Rock Polish: Once again, Lugia is the best switch in. Even Stone Edge struggles to KO Lugia thanks to the impish nature. Lugia can then proceed to Toxic or just Roost off the damage. Kyogre survives Earthquake and can OHKO Groudon with Surf. Ferrothorn defeats any version lacking Swords Dance or Fire Punch. Without Stone Edge, Groudon will have no hope against Lugia. Giratina-O is one of the best checks to Rock Polish Groudon with Draco Meteor, Shadow Sneak and Dragon Tail to keep it in check. When unboosted Palkia can easily inflict major damage with Spacial Rend or Fire Blast.

    Chocie Band: Lugia is the best counter to Groudon for the team. Thanks to the extra Defense, Lugia can wall Groudon with Reflect + Roost or even stall out Stone Edge's meager 4 PP thanks to Pressure. Kyogre drowns any Groudon with a simple Surf but hates Earthquake. Ferrothorn can annoy those not stuck on Fire Punch. Giratina-O rapes it with Draco Meteor and is immune to Earthquake, fearing only Dragon Claw. If Groudon is stuck on Dragon Claw, Dialga, Lugia, Kyogre, Ferrothorn, Gastrodon can all defeat it. Palkia can destroy weakened ones around 60%.

    ParaDancer: Kyogre, Giratina-O and Lugia. Draco Meteor, Surf and Toxic stall will make Groudon sad. Palkia again has the potential to strip off about 60% of Groudon's health.


    [​IMG]Ho-Oh: Large phoenix (turkey?) but Drown All can swallow it in a mighty wave. Ho-Oh has virtually no sure fire counters with the possible exception of Rock Arceus or Giratina...

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    Offensive Tank Stealth Rock will limit it's lifespan by a whole lot. Dialga can wall Ho-Oh in rain, set up Stealth Rock and Roar it out. Kyogre can drown poor Ho-Oh if it's not behind a sub but it's still annoying because Ho-Oh hits like a truck. Lugia can somewhat cushion most blows and Toxic it, then Pressure stall. Giratina-O can Thunder it in the rain or Dragon Tail it out to seal the turkey's fate. It hits hard but since this team is rain based, I need to gain the weather advantage to stop Ho-Oh from causing much destruction. In rain, Palkia has no problem drowning it.

    Hell Charger: Due to Flame Charge, Ho-OH can outspeed Kyogre after one use. Nevertheless, Kyogre can usually survive one Brave Bird and KO back with Surf. Lugia can take any attack even a Sun boosted Sacred Fire isn't enough to take Lugia out. Lugia can then proceed to Toxic it and stall Ho-Oh to hell. Dialga walls Earthquake less Ho-Oh in rain but just cannot stomach a Sacred Fire in the sun. Gastrodon can take one Brave Bird and Recover off the damage to weaken Ho-OH a bit from recoil.

    Choice Scarf: This set lacks the power to break through my team. Lugia walls it to death, capable of surviving even sun boosted Sacred Fires with ease. Toxic will end Ho-Oh's life easily. Stealth Rock again is the best solution to handicap Ho-Oh. Kyogre drowns it and isn't phazed by anything but Brave Bird. Dialga takes anything easily bar Earthquake or Sun Sacred Fires. Dialga can Roar it out to rack up residual damage (Stealth Rock) on Ho-Oh. Gastrodon survives any attack and can Recover off. As long as it doesn't come in on Brave Bird, Gastrodon can wall this Ho-Oh. Ferrothorn can survive anything but Sacred Fire and can Leech Seed it. Giratina-O is bulky enough to take any attack, Thunder or Dragon Tail will cripple Ho-Oh easily. This Ho-OH is much less bulky so it isn't fond of taking Draco Meteor either. Palkia beats it in rain easily.

    Toxic Staller Phoenix: No where to be seen in this generation but I will just put it in the threat list. Kyogre takes everything easily since this set lacks Brave Bird and has no Attack investment. A Water Spout will vanquish Ho-Oh while Surf generally 2HKOes even the fattest Turkey. Lugia outstalls Ho-Oh with Substitute and a faster Toxic. Dialga is immune to Toxic, sets up Stealth Rock and Roar it out. Giratina-O can force it out with Dragon Tail but hates a possible burn. A much easier variant to face compare to the above sets.


    [​IMG]Kyogre: Large fishy and King of ubers, but I have Gastrodon or Palkia on the team mainly to counter it.

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    Mono Attacking RestTalk: Kyogre, Ferrothorn, Dialga, Giratina-O can all threaten it with Thunder, Roar or Leech Seed. Gastrodon walls it but can't touch Kyogre. Ferrothorn's Leech Seed will generally annoy Kyogre a lot but Ferrothorn cannot kill the bloated whale because I lack Power Whip. If unboosted, my own Kyogre can 2HKO it with Thunder. Alternatively, my Kyogre can defeat CMRestTalk Kyogre with Leech Seed support. Giratina-O is resistant to Water-type attacks, and can proceed to Dragon Tail it out or Thunder the fat whale. Kyogre takes a lot of damage from Spikes + Stealth Rock, so Giratina-O generally annoys RestTalk Kyogre with Dragon Tail. Lugia can survive any attack, Toxic to force Kyogre to Rest, then Lugia can phaze it out with Dragon Tail easily. Kyogre will usually die to hazards because it lacks reliable recovery outside of Rest. Palkia can beat it with Thunder should Kyogre not set up on the turn Palkia comes in.

    Choice Specs / Scarf: Gastrodon walls all of them. Dialga and Ferrothorn survives all but Specs Water Spout. Giratina-O can come in on Thunder and wreck havoc. Palkia beats it just like Gastrodon can but hates Thunder.

    Lead: Dialga, Ferrothorn and Gastrodon walls it. Palkia rapes it too but hates paralysis.

    Calm Mind attacker: Gastrodon trolls it with Toxic. Ferrothorn beats it with Leech Seed as can Dialga with Roar.


    [​IMG]Lugia: Great Wall edition one? Best physical wall but does nothing much against my team but phaze.

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    Great Wall: A very bulky mon, but I have Kyogre to 2HKO it with Water Spout. Ferrothorn sets up on it while Leech Seeding to recover tons of health. Dialga sets up Stealth Rock on it for free while my own Lugia and Gastrodon can Toxic. Lugia's attacks are rather weak so it can't really do much to my team. However, if Spikes are out against my team, Lugia can be a major nuisance since I can't OHKO it with any move so Toxic is the key to bringing it down. Giratina-O can also Thunder it and Dragon Tail it away once it's paralysed.

    Calm Mind: Ferrothorn, Gastrodon, Dialga and my own Lugia can Toxic stall it out.


    [​IMG]Manaphy: An annoying little water pixie..

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    Tail Glow: Kyogre OHKOes it after Stealth Rock. If it has Wacan, Kyogre still 2HKOes it with Thunder or Water Spout. Dialga can Roar it out. If it lacks Ice Beam, Giratina-O can Thunder or Dragon Tail it out. I hate this thing and might change Gyro Ball to Power Whip Ferrothorn to deal with it. If I have Power Whip taking it down will be much easier. With Palkia, I can deal with Manaphy better.

    Calm Mind: Ferrothorn can annoy it with Leech Seed but can't do anything back. Kyogre 2HKOes it after one Calm Mind factoring in Stealth Rock damage. Dialga can always Roar it out. Giratina-O can Thunder it and Dragon Tail it out. Extremely hard to kill for my team. Gastrodon can Clear Smog away everything if it lacks Grass Knot. Palkia can outspeed and 2HKO these.


    [​IMG]Mewtwo: Biggest killer in Gen5?

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    Psycho Killer: Kyogre rapes it with Water Spout even if it's at +1. Lugia can take most attacks and Toxic or Dragon Tail accordingly. Ferrothorn can annoy it with Leech Seed while surviving any attack in rain. Dialga can survive Aura Sphere and Roar it out. If Kyogre is down. Mewtwo will be very annoying. Giratina-O is a decent check since it can leave through Psytrike easily and 2HKO with Shadow Sneak. Palkia can OHKO unboosted Mewtwo with rain-powered Surf.

    StallTwo: Kyogre OHKOes it outside of Light Screen, Lugia can Dragon Tail it out while Dialga can annoy it with Dragon Pulse if Mewtwo lacks Light Screen. Giratina-O can Dragon Tail it out or annoy it with Draco Meteor + Shadow Sneak, Giratina-O hates Ice beam however. Palkia just outdamages StallTwo's Recover should it lack Light Screen. Even if Mewtwo has Light Screen, Palkia can spam Thunder till it paralyses Mewtwo. A paralyzed Mewtwo poses little threat if any to my team. Rain Surf will deal major damage to even the bulkiest StallTwo.


    [​IMG]Palkia: Commonly seen as a Scarf user...but Mixed still exists!

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    Choice Specs / Scarf : Gastrodon and Ferrothorn should wall most of its attacks. Gastrodon laughs at Fire Blast while Ferrothorn absorbs Dragon-type attacks easily. Lugia can stall out any move bar Specs Hydro Pump or Thunder. Dialga survives anything bar Specs Focus Blast and can OHKO it back with Draco Meteor. Choice Scarf is much easier to wall because it lacks the power and Lugia isn't even 2HKOed by Thunder.

    Mixed / SubPunch : Gastrodon and Lugia beats it. Dialga can take one Focus Punch and Roar it out or KO with Dragon Pulse. Palkia can gamble in a Speed tie to revenge as a last resort. Kyogre has Thunder to 2HKO it after Stealth Rock. It will generally find a hard time trying to set up a Sub on my team since even Ferrothorn's Gyro Ball might break it's Sub.


    [​IMG]Rayquaza: Deadliest sweeper?

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    Dragon Dance / Swords Dance: Lugia beats any version with Dragon Tail + Roost or Toxic it. Dialga can defeat any variant without Earthquake. Kyogre can OHKO non Dragon Danced versions with Ice Beam. If it lacks Overheat, Ferrothorn can annoy it with Leech Seed + Gyro Ball. Palkia beats non-Danced ones.

    Mixed: Lugia and Dialga can take one hit and kill it. Gastrodon walls it outside of Outrage while Ferrothorn only fears Fire Blast. Palkia beats it one-on-one.


    [​IMG]Reshiram: One of the few Special sweepers who can 2HKO Blissey but I have weather on my side against this beast.

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    Choice Specs / ScarfThis thing is a large ass to face. Kyogre summons permanent rain to weaken Blue Flare but has to wary off Specs Draco Meteors. If it is stuck on Draco Meteor in a choiced set, Lugia and Ferrothorn can defeat it. Dialga can take any attack in rain and KO with Draco Meteor. Entry hazards will make Reshiram sad. Gastrodon beats Scarf versions and KO with Mud Bomb. Choice Scarf is easier to wall. Palkia can come in on any move but Dragon-type attacks and OHKO it.

    Flame Charge: Kyogre still works here and Lugia + Dialga or Gastrodon help. An overall large threat. When unboosted, Palkia outspeeds and KOes it.


    [​IMG]Shaymin-S: Small doggy but hard to stop..

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    Choice Scarf / Specs: Dialga and Lugia are my best choices here. Ferrothorn works too but hates Air Slash. Lugia has Roost and Toxic to deal with it while Dialga can roast it or Gyro Ball in Ferrothorn's case.

    Sub Seeder: Annoys me but I have Dialga, Lugia and Ferrothorn to deal with this puppy. Dialga can Draco Meteor or roast it while Roaring out Sub. Lugia survives everything even HP Ice and can Dragon Tail it out or poison it. Ferrothorn is in a similar boat but uses Gyro Ball to kill it instead and is immune to Leech Seed. Kyogre OHKOes with Ice Beam.


    [​IMG]Zekrom: Jibaku's pet..

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    Choice Band / Scarf: Gastrodon prevents it from spamming Bolt Strike and somewhat checks Mixed Zekrom. Lugia survives everything bar Choice Band Bolt Strike. If Zekrom comes in on Lugia(a common mistake), Lugia can outspeed and Roost before Zekrom moves. Kyogre revenges weakened Zekrom with Ice Beam or Water Spout. Ferrothorn walls most any attack. Scarf ones are easier to beat because they are weaker. Without Gastrodon, I have Palkia to OHKO Zekrom directly but I lost my Electric-type immune.

    Hone Claws: Dialga can survive any attack and OHKO with Draco Meteor. Roar is for Sub ones. Dragon Tail Lugia can annoy it and Toxic. Gastrodon can beat it one-on-one unless it uses Outrage which is free food for Ferrothorn. Palkia beats it easily one-on-one.

    Mixed: Gastrodon is my best bet. If it gets stucked on Outrage to take out my slug, Ferrothorn beats it, as can Lugia who is also faster. Roost stalls out Bolt Strike :D Palkia can always revenge this variant.


    [​IMG]Blaziken: A rookie chicken in Ubers?

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    Swords Dancer: A large pain in the ass, but Kyogre's rain, powerful attacks can make it sad. Lugia and Giratina-O laugh at chicky meal in the rain while Gastrodon can survive an unboosted attack and OHKO with Scald. Lugia can survive a sun fueled Flare Blitz in the sun although a +2 one in the sun will likely KO. I won't let Blaziken set up while the weather is still sunny.


    Non-Ubers

    [​IMG]Blissey: Phat nurse but I can annoy it with my team easily...

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    Standard Ubers Wisher: Raped by Dialga's Roar and entry hazards. Dialga can set up Stealth Rock on her without trouble. Ferrothorn can Spike up on her all day thanks to Leech Seed recovery. I have to be wary of Sun Fire Blast though since it will 2HKO Ferrothorn. Lugia Subs and Toxics then Dragon Tails Blissey out for free. If anyone is dumb enough to use Bold Blissey in Ubers, Kyogre 2HKOes it with Water Spout. Giratina-O can Dragon Tail her out for huge amounts of damage when combined with hazards but the threat of Toxic means I won't switch Giratina-O in on Blissey unless it's a last resort.

    Ubers Calm Mind: Dialga can phaze it out, Lugia Toxics it, Ferrothorn can annoy it with Leech Seed while surviving +6 Ice Beam. Giratina-O can easily phaze it out with Dragon Tail which will take out a chunk of her health. Even with a naughty nature, Giratina-O can easily stomach Ice Beams.


    [​IMG]Chansey: Voted as the best Special Wall for Ubers...

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    Standard Blob: The bulkier defenses in exchange for lefties actually made Chansey more vulnerable to my team LOL Chansey dies a lot faster to hazards compare to Blissey. The concept is still the same, annoy it with Dialga, Ferrothorn and Lugia. Ferrothorn doesn't need to fear a Fire Blast from Chansey though :D Lugia gets a free Sub on it as long as I don't come in on Toxic.


    [​IMG]Cloyster: Freeze All...Shell Smash is boss. Why am I adding this on the threat list so soon? :P

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    Shell Smasher: It can't really set up on anyone, while Dialga and Ferrothorn should survive one hit and KO back. I am forced to use physically defensive Ferrothorn if I need a real check to Life Orb Cloyster but I won't since Cloyster is not only rare but can't set up on anyone in this team. Hazards end it's life fast and Giratina-O can Sneak it when it's weakened enough. Kyogre survives almost anything bar +2 LO Rock Blast after hazards damage I guess.


    [​IMG]Deoxys-D: The only Spiker with all rounded Defenses, Taunt, decent Speed and access to Recover.

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    Standard Utility: Kyogre can possibly OHKO it with Water Spout. Dialga can set up Stealth Rock on it faster than the Taunt because I Speed creep. Giratina-O can't do much to it, but Dragon Tail + hazards and Shadow Sneak will be it's demise. Lugia Subs and Toxics it but Deoxys-D can't do the same because I am faster. Palkia outspeeds and 2HKO it with Surf.

    Cosmic Power: It can't touch Dialga or Ferrothorn. Gastrodon can Toxic it too if it lacks Taunt. I can just switch around Dialga and Ferrothorn or even Lugia to stall it out. Kyogre can smash it to bits initially.


    [​IMG]Deoxys-S: Now an extinct lead in Ubers sadly. Wifi Clause, Forretress's popularity as the lead, Magic Coat...

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    Standard Spiker lead: A very annoying bugger to meet up with. I am considering Magic Coat Giratina-O just to stop it. Anyway, Giratina-O limits it to one layer of hazards but my team hates Spikes since only Lugia and Giratina-O are immune to it. Lugia is the only one who hates Stealth Rock but it has Roost to somewhat negate that annoyance.

    Choice Scarf:: Giratina-O and Kyogre can limit it to one layer. Since it lacks sash now, Kyogre OHKOes it with Water Spout. Ferrothorn can set up Spikes with it.

    Mixed Attacker: It's too weak to cause much damage. Giratina-O sneaks it, Kyogre, Dialga, Ferrothorn and Lugia survives everything.


    [​IMG]Excadrill: An amazing sweeper and spinner...

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    Swords Dance Sweeper: Giratina-O prevents any possible spinning and can Dragon Tail it out. While Excadrill seems to wall Giratina-O in rain, I can just Dragon Tail it out to weaken it to stop any sweeping attempts. Lugia can survive +2 Rock Slide easily and Dragon Tail it. Kyogre changes weather and drowns Excadrill in a tsunami. Gastrodon can beat it one-on-one. Kyogre is the best counter unless I predicted an Earthquake. Palkia survives one Earthquake and can OHKO back.

    Defensive Dancer: Giratina-O stops it from spinning while fearing only the occasional Shadow Claw. Kyogre takes hits from this a lot better and can outspeed + OHKO it easily. Gastrodon can survive most attacks and can drown it with Scald. Dialga survives unboosted Earthquake and can strike back with Fire Blast. Ferrothorn survives any attack and can Leech Seed it or kill with Gyro Ball. Palkia beats it with Fire Blast or Surf.


    [​IMG]Dugtrio: I think Duggy sucks, but the mods like them so ok.....

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    Choice Band: It can trap Dialga but even Earthquake will fail to KO Dialga. Dialga can OHKO Dugtrio in return with a damaging Draco Meteor :D Lugia survives even a +6 Stone Edge if Stealth Rock is not out while Kyogre outspeeds and OHKOes it. Giratina-O flies over Earthquake and can seal it's fate with Shadow Sneak or Dragon Tail. Palkia can survive Earthquake and OHKO with any move but Thunder.

    Claw Sharpen: It can't trap anyone except maybe Kyogre locked into Thunder. Not going to spam Thunder with Kyogre when I see Dugtrio. Kyogre outspeeds it and OHKOes. Giratina-O can survive any attack bar +6 Sucker Punch and KO back. Ferrothorn survives unboosted hit easily. Lugia beats it even at +6 unless Stealth Rock is out.


    [​IMG]Whimsicott: The new SubSeed annoyer...not common in Ubers at all

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    SubSeeder: Ferrothorn is immune to Leech Seed and has Gyro Ball to take it out. Dialga can Roar it out easily unless it Taunts. Giratina-O can Dragon Tail it, Kyogre's Ice Beam, Lugia's and Gastrodon's Toxic if it gets greedy with Leech Seed doesn't sub first. Palkia 2HKOes with Spacial Rend or Fire Blast.


    [​IMG]Ferrothorn: King of OU and now it's invading Ubers!

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    Standard Spiker: Dialga can OHKO it if rain isn't present with Fire Blast while taking little damage from Gyro Ball. Leech Seed can be annoying but Dialga can generally force it out. My own Ferrothorn can set up alongside it. Lugia gets a free switch in, set up a Substitute and Dragon Tail it out. Giratina-O can smack it out with Dragon Tail and force it to swallow Spikes damage. An overall annoying mon to face. Palkia can 2HKO with Fire Blast even in rain.

    Choice Band: My own Ferrothorn, Dialga, and Lugia walls it. Ferrothorn laughs at eveyrthing while Dialga isn't even close to KOed by Level Field. Lugia stalls out Gyro Ball with Pressure before Ferrothorn can do too much damage. Lugia takes roughly 55% from Gyro Ball, alternatively, I can use Substitute to stall out that 4 PP of Gyro Ball ( Pressure). Kyogre 2HKOes it with Water Spout. Palkia fries it with Fire Blast.


    [​IMG]Forretress: A large shell which causes a lot of problems.

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    Standard Ubers Spiker: Man I hate this thing to death. Dialga roasts it with Fire Blast, Kyogre drowns it and Gastrodon can burn it with rain boosted Scald. However, it gets a free switch in on Lugia's Toxic and Ferrothorn. Ferrothorn can't really touch it while Lugia can only phaze it out. The most solution is to generally eliminate Forretress with Dialga. If it tries to spin, Giratina-O is there to stop it and Dragon Tail it out or Thunder it for decent damage. I am not willing to use Hidden Power Fire in a rain based team. Palkia always lures these in and OHKO them with Fire Blast.


    [​IMG]Heatran: So this is Jibaku's baby and it is infamous for harassing stall...

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    Stallbreaker: Kyogre's presence makes Heatran weaker than usual. Gastrodon eats Heatran alive with Earth Power or Scald. Kyogre's Surf drowns Heatran easily :) Lugia can hide behind a Substitute and Dragon Tail Heatran out before Heatran can try to Roar me out. Since Heatran hates Spikes and lacks recovery, it will die fast to the team. Lugia's thick hide means Heatran can't even break the Sub without sunlight. Palkia can KO with Surf.

    Choice Scarf / Specs: Kyogre again makes it sad. Gastrodon does the exact same thing and laughs at Dragon Pulse although it must be wary of Hidden Power Grass. Choice Specs versions hit hard but not enough to break my team. Giratina-O survives even Dragon Pulse but can't really strike Heatran hard. Palkia has Surf to 2-3HKO in sun, OHKO otherwise.


    [​IMG]Garchomp: The forgotten Land Shark...

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    Choice Scarf: Lugia walls it with Roost and Toxic it. Dialga survives everything even Earthquake and can OHKO it back with Dragon Pulse. Ferrothorn laughs at Outrage and can Leech Seed + Gyro Ball it. Earthquake doesn't KO Ferrothorn either. Gastrodon can kinda wall it with Recover.

    Choice Band: Lugia still walls it. Unless it tries to spam CB Stone Edge, Lugia can soak up almost anything. Dialga can take anything but Earthquake. Ferrothorn can still take most hits, Leech Seed it and Gyro Ball for the kill. Giratina-O eats up all but Dragon STABs. A mild threat to the team since it hits hard and might cause some problems here. Kyogre is there to revenge it.

    Swords Dance: Lugia survives even +2 Stone Edge and can Dragon Tail it out. Kyogre outspeeds and OHKO with Ice Beam or Water Spout. Ferrothorn can take a +2 Earthquake, Leech Seed than Gyro Ball it to hell.


    [​IMG]Heracross: The most powerful Bug-type in Ubers...and it has STAB Close Combat too!

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    Choice Scarf: Lugia walls it to death. Giratina-O does the same while immediately threatening Heracross with Draco Meteor or Dragon Tail. Kyogre can take one attack and OHKO it. Dialga and Ferrothorn can come in on the right moves save Close Combat.

    Choice Band: Lugia still soaks up everything. Kyogre now outspeeds and OHKO with Surf or Water Spout. Ferrothorn and Dialga takes Stone Edge and Night Slash easily. Dialga can swallow Megahorn too while Giratina-O can KO with Draco Meteor + Shadow Sneak. It hits hard but I can usually wall it anyway because it is limited to one move at a time. Palkia has rain Surf or Fire Blast to tear this poor bug to shreds.


    [​IMG]Jirachi: Cutie little pixie, awesome resistances, has a lot of potential in Ubers...

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    Wish Tank: Lugia sets up a Substitute and is safe from any status. Kyogre OHKOes with Water Spout and is resistant to Iron Head but has to be wary of Thunder Wave or Body Slam. Dialga walls it easily but cannot OHKO it especially in rain. Ferrothorn uses it as free Spikes food, iron thorns means Jirachi can't even spam Iron Head to kill me LOL Palkia has Surf or Fire Blast to 2HKO it depending on the weather, and since Palkia lures in Jirachi easily, I can surprise and take out Jirachi without much problem at all.

    Choice Scarf: Lugia once again walls all of it's moves, even Ice Punch does paltry damage. Trick can cripple Lugia though. Giratina-O walls most of it's attacks and can use Thunder to paralyse it or Dragon Tail away. Giratina-O is also immune to Trick. Dialga walls all of it's moves, has Fire Blast and doesn't mind Choice Scarf that much. Ferrothorn can take any attack, even Fire Punch in the rain!


    [​IMG]Kingdra: Sea Dragon sucks...Gyarados > Kingdra

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    Mixed Dragon Dancer: Ferrothorn is one of the best counters it to it. Walling everything easily, as even Outrage struggles to KO it. Lugia is the next best check. Roost + Dragon Tail can kill Kingdra easily while +1 Waterfall doesn't even come to KOing Lugia. Dialga takes any attack bar boosted Outrage easily, Dragon Pulse fries Kingdra alive. Gastrodon forces Kingdra to Outrage or lose.

    Specially Offensive Swimmer: Ferrothorn still rapes it and can easily survive rain-boosted Hydro Pump. Lugia walls it, but has to be wary of Hydro Pump if Stealth Rock is out. Dialga beats it with Dragon Pulse and is bulky enough to take any attack. Kyogre Thunders it for the 2HKO if Kingdra lacks Outrage. Gastrodon beats it easily since this set usually lacks Outrage for Waterfall.


    [​IMG]Hydreigon: Always underrated as a threat in Ubers...

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    Choice Scarf: Lugia walls it easily with Roost and can cripple with Toxic. Head Smash and Dark Pulse will not 2HKO Lugia. Dialga beats it too but hates too many Draco Meteors. Ferrothorn beats it with Leech Seed or Gyro Ball and can survive Fire Blast in the rain. Gastrodon walls Hydreigon too and can Toxic it or spam Scald to land a burn. Not a problem to my team and U-turn barely scratches all of my team members. Kyogre beats Hydreigon with Ice Beam while surviving Draco Meteor easily.


    [​IMG]Scizor: Once widely used as a Dragon-type resist, now it's extinct!

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    Ubers Choice Band: Lugia walls all of its attacks as even U-turn doesn't do too much when Roosting. Kyogre OHKOes it but hates U-Turn. Dialga can take any attack even Superpower and KO with Fire Blast. Giratina-O can Thunder it for the 3HKO or Dragon Tail it out. Palkia OHKOes with Fire Blast.

    Tank: Dialga rapes it with Fire Blast while resisting eveyrthing. Ferrothorn annoys it with Leech Seed while Kyogre OHKOes it with Water Spout. Scizor still has sub par Special Defense even with a defensive spread. Palkia has Fire Blast and Surf to KO it.


    [​IMG]Skarmory: I don't like facing these steel birds...

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    Standard Spiker: Kyogre OHKOes it with Thunder or Water Spout. Dialga KOes it with Fire Blast while Giratina-O can fry it with Thunder. Lugia phazes it out before Skarmory can do the same. It is rather annoying because Skarmory can set up on Ferrothorn or Lugia for free. Gastrodon can attempt to burn it with Scald.


    [​IMG] Terrakion: The strongest bull out there...

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    Choice Scarf: Lugia walls it since Stone Edge doesn't come close to Koing. Dialga and Ferrothorn can come in on Stone Edge easily while Lugia laughs at Close Combat. Giratina-O survives all and can demolish Terrakion with Draco Meteor + Shadow Sneak or Dragon Tail it out.

    Double Booster: Kyogre can survive one hit and KO it with Surf. Giratina-O survives at least one attack and can OHKO with Draco Meteor. Lugia can still live a Stone Edge and Dragon Tail it out.


    [​IMG] Tyranitar: Big bad tyranno...but this is a rain team. I still hate it Pursuiting my Giratina-O and Lugia ;_;

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    Choice Band: Lugia stalls out Stone Edge with Roost or Substitute. If it tries to Crunch, Dialga and Ferrothorn can easily switch in. Gastrodon can take Stone Edges easily. Kyogre hates taking attacks but Surf or Water Spout OHKOes. Palkia can 2HKO it with Surf.

    Choice Scarf: Dialga can take any attack even Superpower, and Dragon Pulse it for some damage. Gastrodon walls this dinosaur to death. Lugia can stall out any move even Stone Edge. Kyogre outspeeds and drowns it alive. Ferrothorn OHKOes with Gyro Ball while surviving even Fire
    Punch.

    Dragon Dance: Kyogre can outspeed it even at +1 and OHKO with Surf or Water Spout. Ferrothorn OHKOes it unless it has Fire Punch to KO Ferrothorn first. Lugia can Dragon Tail it out to bypass Taunt while surviving even a +1 Crunch. Gastrodon can Scald it for good damage and if a burn lands Tyranitar and kiss good bye and die.

    Lead:Kyogre OHKOes it with Water Spout. Ferrothorn hates Fire Blast but can Gyro Ball it for the 2HKO. Gastrodon can wall it fine but hates Defense drops. Lugia can take any attack and Toxic it but Defense drops are annoying. Still an irritating Pokemon to face, especially when it is paired with Grass Arceus. Palkia can 2HKO with Surf.


    [​IMG]Ludicolo: One of the best counters to Kyogre...and is a general annoyance.

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    Leech Seed: Ferrothorn is immune to Leech Seed but so is Ludicolo. I can set up Spikes on it with Ferrothorn but will not enjoy burns. Dialga sets up Stealth Rock and can phaze it out. Lugia Toxics it before Ludicolo can do much damage since even Ice Beam does LOL damage to Lugia. Giratina-O can Dragon Tail it out for massive damage, especially with hazards but it can heal up pretty quickly ;_; It doesn't enjoy Palkia's Spacial Rend either.

    Rain Attacker: Ferrothorn still walls it easily. Lugia can sort of soak up most attacks and Toxic Roost stall it. Dialga beats it with Dragon Pulse while resisting Hydro Pump. Giratina-O survives even Ice Beam and can finish it with Draco Meteor + Shadow Sneak.


    [​IMG]Mew: Boo..this thing finally dropped to UU...

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    Baton Passer: It has to choose either Substitute or Taunt. I have both Dragon Tail and Roar to stop any baton passing attempts. Kyogre OHKOes it outside of screens with Water Spout. Giratina-O puts it in a hotspot with Shadow Sneak, Dragon Tail and Draco Meteor. If it uses the gimmicky Dragon Tail instead of Taunt, Lugia can freely set up a Substitute on it (survive Mew's Dragon Tail) and Dragon Tail it out later. Ferrothorn can Leech Seed it too if Mew lacks Taunt or Substitute for Dragon Tail. Dialga can Roar out Substitute versions easily.

    Lead: This thing went extinct nowadays. Kyogre OHKOes it with Water Spout, Ferrothorn can 2-3HKO with Gyro Ball. Dialga can smack it with repeated Dragon Pulses while resisting Explosion, and with the nerf, it's even weaker. Lugia can wall it easily or Dragon Tail it out but cannot prevent Stealth Rock from being set up.


    [​IMG] Victini: New Fire-type in Ubers!

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    Choice Scarf: Kyogre changes weather and drowns it while surviving Bolt Strike. Lugia walls it to hell with Roost and can Toxic it. Giratina-O survives all and can Shadow Sneak or Draco Meteor poor Victini to death.

    Choice Band: Keeping the rain up is the best solution. Giratina-O can always sneak it. Kyogre outspeeds and OHKO with Surf. Lugia can take most attacks save V-Create in sun. Palkia can shrug off most attacks too and KO with Surf.

    Trick Room Tini: Kyogre rapes it. Lugia can do the same as long as the weather isn't sunny. Giratina-O can check it with Shadow Sneak and Draco Meteor or Dragon Tail to force it out.


    [​IMG] Wobbuffet: Oh no it's Woba!

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    Old Woba set: Kyogre OHKOes with Water Spout after Stealth Rock damage. It can trap Kyogre sometimes if I am not stuck on Water Spout. Lugia cripples it with Toxic and has Dragon Tail to force out any likely sweeper Wobbuffet is trying to set up. Ferrothorn can Spike up on it or Leech Seed. Gastrodon has Toxic to make Wobbuffet's life short. Giratina-O is immune to Counter, so I am free to spam Shadow Sneak or Dragon Tail on it. I still hate it because it can revenge kill my Kyogre removing my core of the team. Palkia always lures these in and 2HKO them with Surf easily.


    [​IMG] Bronzong: This metal piece can actually function quite well in the Ubers tier..but I have Kyogre, Ferrothorn, Dialga, Gastrodon...

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    Standard support: Kyogre OHKOes with Water Spout, Ferrothorn laughs at anything, sets up Spikes on it or even Leech Seed. Gastrodon can burn it or slowly kill with Scald and recovering off any damage with Recover. Dialga rapes it with Fire Blast while taking laughable damage from everything else. Palkia 2HKOes it with Surf or Fire Blast.

    Trick Room: Too bad for it, my team has little problems handling Trick Room teams. Lugia and Ferrothorn walls it to death. Kyogre can survive anything and KO with Surf. Dialga has Fire Blast to nail it while Gastrodon still soaks up everything but Grass Knot. Giratina-O can take some hits and Thunder or Dragon Tail it out.


    [​IMG] Cresselia: The best Groudon counter in the game, too bad Lugia exists in Ubers...

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    Great Wall 3rd version: Ferrothorn, Dialga and Lugia can all abuse it. Lugia is so bulky Ice Beam fails to break my Substitutes. Ferrothorn Leech Seeds it and Spike up. Dialga sets up Stealth Rock, wear it down with Dragon Pulse or Roar it out. Gastrodon can Toxic it. Kyogre changes weather to torrential rain, and drowns the celestial duck with Water Spout or Surf. Palkia can still harass it with Surf.

    Trick Room: It supports the team but that doesn't stop me from setting up every hazard on it. Dialga, Ferrothorn, Kyogre and Lugia still work the same. Lugia laughs at everything and Toxic it. Dual Screens are of little use against my team since the team is based on wearing down the opponent with passive damage. Giratina-O can throw it around with Dragon Tail, preventing any Trick Room setting attempts.


    [​IMG]Metagross: Poor Metagross lost it's glory and it's niche as a Dragon-type resist is taken over by Ferrothorn.

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    Choice Band / Scarf: Lugia survives any attack and can Dragon Tail it out if it gets any Attack boost. Kyogre outspeeds and OHKOes it and resists Meteor Mash at the same time. Ferrothorn walls it and can set up Spikes on it or Leech Seed. Dialga survives all but double Earthquakes and can Fire Blast it to hell. Giratina-O can defeat Choice Scarf versions with Thunder and resists most attacks bar Meteor Mash or Ice Punch. Gastrodon works here too and has Earth Power to 2HKO Metagross. Palkia again has Fire Blast and Surf to drown it.

    Agility: Same counters. Lugia, Kyogre, Ferrothorn and Giratina-O. Lugia still walls it to death and can stall out Metagross till it succumbs to Life Orb recoil. Kyogre OHKOes it. Gastrodon can wall it too with Recover and Earth Power to strike back.

    Dual Screens: Does this thing still exists? Anyway Ferrothorn annoys it with Leech Seed. Gastrodon can annoy with Scald or Earth Power. Kyogre OHKOes it when Light Screen isn't up, 2HKO otherwise.

    Lead: Dialga beats it with Fire Blast and easily survives Earthquake. Kyogre OHKOes it while Ferrothorn walls it easily and can set up Spikes for free.


    [​IMG]Kabutops: Another sucky Swift Swimmer, Gyarados rapes it alive...

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    Swords Dancer: Gastrodon walls it to hell and can KO with Earth Power. Kyogre and Dialga can survive unboosted hits and can OHKO back. Giratina-O survives everything and can Thunder for the OHKO.

    Choice Band: Gastrodon again stops it. Lugia takes any attack but Stone Edge. Dialga can come in on all but hates Low Kick. Ferrothorn stops this Kabutops easier since it can't switch moves while Gyro Ball will nearly OHKO it.


    [​IMG]Qwilfish: Awesome fishy and has some use in Ubers unlike Milotic...

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    Swords Dancer: Gastrodon walls it easily while being immune to Waterfall and resisting Poison Jab. Ferrothorn, Dialga, Lugia all stop it. Lugia is bulky enough to shake off Waterfalls while Ferrothorn and Dialga resist both STABs. Giratina-O is both tough and resists both of the STABs and has Shadow Sneak to bypass Destiny Bond. Ferrothorn can Leech Seed it to stop Destiny Bond.

    Support Fishy: I don't like seeing these. Gastrodon, Ferrothorn, Dialga, Giratina-O, Lugia still wall it. However, this fish is for support and it can set up one layer of Spikes on Lugia if it comes in on Toxic or Substitute. Lugia can Dragon Tail it out however, and break the likely sash. Taunt won't stop Lugia from phazing it due to Dragon Tail. Giratina-O can pick it off with Shadow Sneak when needed. Ferrothorn can make it's life hard since Qwilfish might risk eating a Gyro Ball when Taunting Ferrothorn. Kyogre OHKOes it but has to be wary of Destiny Bond. Palkia can survive one hit and OHKO it back but hates Destiny Bond.


    [​IMG]Shedinja: Unlike it's past glory when entry hazards are really rare in Ubers, it sucks hard now...

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    Standard?: If entry hazards and spin blocking are insufficient, I have Ferrothorn's Iron Barbs, Lugia's Toxic and Dialga's Fire Blast to rape it. Giratina-O can Sneak it to it's shell.


    [​IMG]Parasect: ParaSUCK. Seriously, I tried this bug a lot and I even trolled Jibaku with it, but it sucked.

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    Standard: Lugia laughs at anything and sets up a Substitute for free in its face, and can Toxic it later. Kyogre's Ice Beam will end its life. Giratina-O can fly it around with Dragon Tail and hazards while Draco Meteor tears poor Parasect off. Dialga resists all and can roast it with Fire Blast.
    PS: Jibaku beats Parasect easily so don't use it against him !_!


    [​IMG]Magnezone: Steel trapper? I have two Steels in my team but Magnezone isn't killing both of them soon.

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    Choice Scarf:It's too weak to do much damage. Gastrodon, Kyogre, Ferrothorn and Dialga all beat it. Giratina-O does the same but can't do much back. Kyogre outspeeds and drowns poor magnet alive. Ferrothorn can easily swallow Hidden Power Fire in the rain and Leech Seed or Spike up on it. Dialga roasts it with Fire Blast while resisting both STABs. Palkia can OHKO with Surf.

    Choice Specs: Same thing actually but now Dialga outspeeds it. Gastrodon owns it bar Hidden Power Grass. If it has Hidden Power Grass instead of Fire, Ferrothorn will laugh at it. Lugia can take most attacks bar Thunder. Lugia can actually Roost stall out Thunder but the paralysis rate makes it a risky maneuver. Palkia's Fire Blast and Surf kills it.

    Charge Beam: This thing can trap Ferrothorn and set up but I can set up Spikes while it sets up with Charge Beam. Dialga can Roar it out later while Gastrodon resists everything and can Clear Smog away. Kyogre outspeeds and OHKOes it.


    [​IMG]Froslass: the worse Deoxys-S? This thing sucks now...

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    Spiker: Giratina-O limits it to one layer and can survive on Ice Beam easily. Dialga OHKOes it but has to beware of Destiny Bond. Kyogre outspeeds and OHKOes it. Ferrothorn can OHKO it with Gyro Ball.


    [​IMG]Roserade: Never like this thing in Ubers but absorbing Toxic Spikes and capable of setting up Spikes is awesome...

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    Leech Seed Spiker: Dialga, Ferrothorn, Giratina-O and Lugia take little damage from it. Giratina-O can break it's sash if it has it. Kyogre can KO with Ice Beam while Dialga fries it alive with Fire Blast. Ferrothorn's Gyro Ball OHKOes it. Sleep Powder can be annoying though. Gastrodon will most probably take the Sleep because it is mainly used to squander attacks from Kyogre. Palkia outspeeds and kills with Fire Blast.


    [​IMG]Jumpluff: Fast but it can't do much damage to my team sadly..

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    SubSeed: Ferrothorn beats it with Gyro Ball and loves Stun Spore while being immune to Leech Seed. Kyogre outspeeds it thanks to Choice Scarf and OHKO with Ice Beam. Giratina-O can annoy it with Thunder + Shadow Sneak. Dialga rapes it with Fire Blast and can Roar away any Substitutes.


    [​IMG]Bisharp: Power Rangers suck, Bisharp is the king of rangers and yet he is a bishounen?

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    Dirty Ranger: Dialga can fry it with Fire Blast while resisting Sucker Punch. Dialga doesn't enjoy Brick Break though. Lugia hates Night Slash but can set up a Substitute on a predicted Sucker Punch. Kyogre can survive unboosted hits and KO with Surf. Ferrothorn can annoy it with Leech Seed while Gastrodon has Scald to strip off a portion of Bisharp's health.

    Fat Ranger: This version is a lot weaker but now Ferrothorn cannot stop it at all. Kyogre OHKOes it with Surf, Dialga can 2HKO with Fire Blast in the rain, outside of rain will be a likely OHKO. Lugia can phaze it out with Dragon Tail but hates boosted Sucker Punch or Night Slash. Gastrodon can take some hits and Earth Power it. This time Palkia survives a hit and can OHKO with Surf or Fire Blast.


    [​IMG]Gyarados: As the last threat, Gyarados is the ultimate threat every Uber team should be prepared for...

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    Tauntrados: Lugia can Toxic it before the Taunt or Dragon Tail it out before the opposite happens. Giratina-O and Kyogre fry it with Thunder. It lacks recovery so isn't that hard to take out with repeated hits. Dialga can 3HKO it with Dragon Pulse while taking little damage. Palkia has Thunder to OHKO it, 2HKO otherwise with Spacial Rend and Stealth Rock damage.

    Dragon Dancer: This thing hits harder than any physical attacking rain abuser. Anyway, Stealth Rock limits poor Gyarados's life. Earthquake hurts both Dialga and Ferrothorn. However, Ferrothorn can just Leech Seed it and annoy Gyarados easily. Kyogre outspeeds and KO with Thunder regardless of Gyarados's bulkiness. Lugia beats it with Toxic or Dragon Tail while surviving any attack. Giratina-O survives anything bar +1 Outrage and OHKO with Thunder.


    Conclusion: This is the longest and best RMT ( I think) I ever made. Jibaku's RMT format is cool though X___X Done with the new threat list now. Credits go to Jibaku for finding my deleted threat list ;_; Happy rating!

    Drown All :) (open)
    Haha, fooled you. I don't have a story ( Golden Statues?) like Vulcan Fury ;_; Gyarados still rules in OU though so you have to live with it. Drown All! The ocean is vast and can easily swallow a small barn :D BLUE colour is the best because it represents the OCEAN! Can someone write a story for me? ;_;
  2. shrang

    shrang Defend the Headquarters of Revolution
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    Although not the biggest threat around, CM Grass Arceus with Ice Beam (Which you should have covered on your team, seeing that it's a rain team) decks your team pretty hard. Pretty much the only thing you can do right now is phaze it, and that isn't completely reliable, especially if it's last Pokemon left. Ferrothorn can't do much to it, since it's immune to Leech Seed, and Lugia isn't that safe, either.

    Fortunately, this is very easily fixed. All you have to do is replace Roar on Dialga for Toxic. End of story. Without a ton of boosts, Dialga isn't dying to Grass Arceus, so you can just switch in and use Toxic on it, completely nullifying that threat. You have enough phazers as it is.

    Otherwise, great team. I'm getting sick of the good teams being written here all using sun =O.
  3. trickroom

    trickroom
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    Uhm +1 Grass Arceus Ice Beam to my Lugia 37.5% - 44.2% This isn't even a 2HKO, and might not 2HKO even after Stealth Rock. My Lugia has Toxic which will kill Arceus in the end. Once poisoned, Grass Arceus is easy to take down. That said, I tried Toxic Dialga before and it worked OK. However, I think Toxic Lugia is enough to keep Grass Arceus in check for now.

    That's no SpA EVs Grass Arceus which is the standard one. I already have Toxic on Lugia and Gastrodon. I have used Toxic Dialga before but I like Dialga's phazing prowess. I could use Toxic Dialga but I like something to phaze pass Substitutes. Lugia is using Dragon Tail so I have to keep Roar in.

    Without Roar, Sub Hone Claws Zekrom or even Ho-Oh can annoy me a lot. I might try Toxic on Ferrothorn over Gyro Ball since Ferrothorn can afford to drop that attack. Gyro Ball is mainly to do some damage anyway and not utter Taunt bait. Toxic Ferrothorn stops Grass Arceus cold.

    Thanks for the rate though. I will mention more about Grass Arceus in the RMT, because it's a large ass to face for rain teams. It's time for more rain teams, Reshiram is now dying out due to the popularity of Kyogre. Drown All fire-types!
  4. Jibaku

    Jibaku Not taking FS requests atm.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Winner
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    I love this team.

    Anyways, keep in mind the Clear Smog doesn't help you stop Bulk Up Dialga as Dialga is immune to Poison. Also, Mud Bomb is cute and all but it's unreliable and you're better off with Earthquake or Earth Power (former hits Steel Arceus harder, while the latter his BU Dialga harder). I'd personally prefer Earthquake since Bulk Up Dialga can be covered by Ferrothorn + your own Dialga (you need to swap Draco Meteor to Dragon Pulse for this though. Leech Seed + Dragon Pulse easily 3HKOes BU Dialga and if your Dialga dies you can just finish off with Giratina-O).

    Foreshadowing? Freeze All?

    Also I took Drown All off kickwords a long time ago x_x
  5. Paradoxus

    Paradoxus

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    Try Sky Drop on Lugia. It is amazing for stalling out Toxic Damage.
  6. Moo

    Moo Professor
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    Quagsire > Gastrodon :(
    Derp All!

    @Paradoxus: Sky Drop is really cool imo, but I think Lugia suffers from the 4 moveslot syndrome, it has better things to be doing tbh
  7. calze6

    calze6

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    Just wondering, why isn't ferrothorn on the threat list? Top 8 seems to be worthy enough. Speaking of which, you seem to be able to do nothing to it bar dialga (which is iffy) except somehow wear it down. I would reconsider ghost arceus over giratina-o for that reason.
  8. trickroom

    trickroom
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    Just came back, after some busy issues.

    Bulk Up Dialga is annoying to most rain teams :P Mud Bomb misses sometimes but it's cute and reduces accuracy! I used Mud Slap once :) I am willing to change Draco Meteor to Dragon Pulse since it doesn't matter much anyway, minus the OHKO on Giratina after Stealth Rock damage. Dragon Pulse is a lot weaker initially though ;_; but since it helps vs Bulk Up Dialga and Ho-OH / Arceus (X___x), I am using it.

    Freeze All sucks with Cloyster :( Haven't try much Cloyster yet in Ubers but most hail Ubers teams are threatened by Reshiram, Ho-Oh and Mixed Palkia. Abomasnow is fine but I don't like using hail stall at the moment because hail's passive damage weakens Giratina and Chansey <---- both likely to be in hail ubers team.

    It was Drawn All.. :P

    No on Sky Drop, Lugia has no empty moveslot for it, and I think Sky Drop is a sub par move on Lugia. I like Quagsire but it can't take most Special Attacks though which is bad.

    Sorry, I haven't finished the threat list yet. I am going to update it now. Fixed Dialga and Gastrodon too.

    Who Removed my Threat list? I was working on it
  9. Fireburn

    Fireburn BARN ALL
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    The biggest weakness to this team is actually Wobbuffet lol. It can trap and KO Kyogre which will render you vulnerable to a ton of crap since he's the glue of the team really. I can't do anything about it though. :P

    I'm not sure how good this would be, but to curb your weaknesses to Ghost Arceus and last man Bulk Up Dialga (whom you can't take on at all really), you could try swapping out Gastrodon for Grass Arceus. (Try something like Max HP, enough Speed to beat Garchomp, rest in SpD, and either Timid or Calm nature depending on which is more efficient with the EVs with a set of Judgment/Will-O-Wisp/Perish Song/Recover). Perish Song means that last man Bulk Up Dialga will never sweep you ever while also putting Ghost Arceus on a timer. Your team is also a bit (a lot) Mixed Zekrom weak, so Will-O-Wisp will pretty much mean that it will never break Arceus. If Zekrom isn't that big of a deal, you could use Toxic to help more against Ghost Arceus and to stop Ho-Oh for coming in for free I guess. It also gives you another defense against Garchomp as SD variants seem pretty annoying to this team as Lugia despite Bold nature will loathe a +2 Stone Edge.

    Grass Arceus is still a great Kyogre counter and with Perish Song it can even fight off CMOgre, and it gives you a much more stable answer to Palkia so you don't need to predict as much around it.

    This team is also really weak to Manaphy lol. The now standard (I think) TG 3 Attack set with Wacan Berry will probably sweep you if Dialga is weakened. (Surf will 2HKO guaranteed after one Tail Glow.), and it uses Gastrodon as pure set up fodder if it lacks Clear Smog. (Also Ferrothorn can't hit it X_X). Grass Arceus would obviously fix this weakness cuz faster and SE Judgment though.

    nine dot nine

    Seriously though, great team bro and it really shows how much of a freaking unkillable douchebag Lugia can be. X_X
  10. trickroom

    trickroom
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    Oh no it's Wobbuffet LOL. Anyway Kyogre's Water Spout OHKOes any non Calm variants. After SR, any variants are KOed. If I lost Kyogre, the team still works fine except Thunder from Giratina-O sucks now. I don't have any rain abusers anyway except Ferrothorn taking random Fire Blast.

    Ugh, Ghost Arceus is stopped by Toxic and I always tried to predict around it with Kyogre to OHKO (Water Spout) :P That's risky but Kyogre can take unboosted Judgment easily and 2HKO with Surf. Bulk Up Dialga is actually rather easy to beat :P Leech Seed it with Ferrothorn and my own Dialga beats it with Dragon Pulse. If that some how fails, Giratina-O or my Kyogre can finish it with Draco Meteor or Water Spout, like what Jibaku posted. Mid game, Lugia rapes Dialga.

    Actually, if you noticed above, I made the team to try Gastrodon LOL. A funny choice but I rather not removed it in this RMT. Swords Dance Garchomp is owned by Scarf Kyogre. I like Grass Arceus a lot but Gastrodon gives the team an Electric-type immune, pretty useful for rain teams.

    I have Ferrothorn + Dialga + Giratina-O to pick it off :) Gastrodon 3HKOes with Earth Power so it should weaken Dialga bit. Grass Arceus deals with them better with Perish Song but I rarely find time to use it ;_; Oh yeah, I already have Ferrothorn, so adding Grass Arceus means I have 2 Grass-types on a Uber team !_! Mixed Zekrom is annoying as ever, but Gastrodon actually beats it unless it tries to Outrage. Lugia beats Mixed Zekrom with Substitute, since Bolt Strike has only 4 chances and Lugia can Roost it out and Toxic. Kyogre Ice Beams slightly weakened ones. Dialga and Ferrothorn can survive at least one hit and Dragon Pulse or Leech Seed it.

    Grass Arceus also lures in Reshiram to spam Draco Meteor or Blue Flare ;_; Swords Dance Garchomp is a big bad boy. I have Kyogre to check it besides Lugia :) Ferrothorn can handle some hits and Leech Seed it. Dialga survives unboosted Earthquake and can OHKO back. Garchomp can't really set up anyone though other than Gastrodon?

    I know Grass Arceus owns Kyogre but this team is actually made to try Gastrodon. Lugia, Ferrothorn, Dialga and Gastrodon beats Palkia :) I think that's good enough for a Palkia counter :P

    Manaphy is kinda rare and I was using Power Whip Ferrothorn earlier. I just changed it to Gyro Ball not long ago. Gyro Ball is stronger and Leech Seed + Kyogre still beats Manaphy anyway :P Dialga can Roar it out mid game. If it's Wacan Berry, the attacks will be much weaker and I can beat it with Giratina-O if it somehow drops Ice Beam for Grass Knot.

    PS: Kyogre's Thunder + SR + Shadow Sneak still rapes Wacan Berry Manaphy :P I will have to use Power Whip Ferrothorn I think or Clear Smog Gastrodon if Manaphy suddenly becomes overly common.

    :P Thanks Bro

    I am actually popularizing Lugia too :P Gastrodon did well actually, but you already approved it anyway. If I change Gastrodon, I lack an Electric-type immune and Gastrodon won't be there ;_; It was meant to be Gastrodon Ubers team..
  11. reachzero

    reachzero the pastor of disaster
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    We talked on IRC about how this team really has serious issues with Spikes, especially considering how easily Forretress especially comes in on Lugia and Ferrothorn. Forcing Forry out isn't hard for this team, but that extra turn here and there really adds up in terms of Spikes layers. This team does pretty well in terms of covering the "major" threats; most of the problematic Pokemon are the peripheral useful ones in Ubers, like Adamant LO Lucario. The team is totally dependent on Kyogre to beat Darkrai, but that's pretty much status quo for Ubers, I guess.
  12. trickroom

    trickroom
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    Spikes can be an issue because 4 of my Pokemon hates it. Changing to Ghost Arceus just makes me more Spikes weak so I am keeping it. Although Ghost Arceus can defeat Bulk Up Dialga, Lucario and Ferrothorn easier, Giratina-O brings many resistances to the team and Shadow Sneak + Dragon Tail. Dragon STAB is really important in Ubers !_!

    Generally, Dialga is the key to defeating Forretress by lowering it down to 1HP on turn 1. Predicting a likely switch in is the best solution here. Lucario is stopped by Kyogre and Lugia can somewhat take a boosted hit and phaze it out. Lucario is actually quite annoying for the team but it is quite rare in Ubers at the moment.

    Thanks for rating. I am probably not dropping Gastrodon out for Arceus because this team is made to test it.
  13. Koinzell

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    Don't take this the wrong way, but this is a very wierd team to test Gastrodon.
    I mean, you already have 4 Water Resists including a SDef Ferrothorn and a bulky Dialga, hell, your only Water neutral Pkmon is Lugia, I think that's saying a lot.

    Gastrodon is supposed to fix a huge Kyogre weakness and your team is all but Kyogre weak. I you feel like you need an Electric immune, and again with Ferro/Dialga/GiraO I'm not sure you do, Garchomp or Arceus-Ground will do much more for the team. Another option is switching back Gastrodon for Palkia, Palkia gives you the one time buffer you need in the worst case scenario where Specs Kyogre gets in at full health, but that should not happen too often.

    Good team otherwise, Focus Sash Darkrai forces you to sac your only revenge killer to Sleep on turn 1, but there is not much to do about it.
  14. trickroom

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    OK, Garchomp and Arceus-Ground get wrecked by Kyogre easily. I rather be prepared to take full power Water Spouts than sacking something. Oh yeah Gastrodon stops Dialga decently. Ground-Arceus can stop it too but it gets wrecked by Kyogre.

    Generally I need something to take on Specs Kyogre and is a Ground-type. Garchomp isn't coming in on Kyogre and is OHKOed by Zekrom and Electric Arceus. Switching back to Palkia and Ground Arceus just makes my team 99% identical to Jibaku's. Why should I change Gastrodon for Garchomp or Arceus-Ground can be a better question. Don't encourage me to use back Jibaku's team, I want something FRESH and new.

    All of those Electric-type resists hate Zekrom's Choice Band Bolt Strike and they don't like paralysis minus Ferrothorn. Also, switching Gastrodon to Palkia makes me lose to Electric Arceus, Steel Arceus and even more vulnerable to Ghost Arceus. Switch in on Thunder and get paralysed? Not something my Dialga and Giratina-O will like to enjoy. Although they are both slow, I want to outspeed slow base 90s.

    The Water-type resists aren't enough to me. All of them will falter against Specs Kyogre.
    Next, Gastrodon can actually check other things besides Kyogre. Gastrodon beats Focus Sash Darkrai next turn after Kyogre breaks it's sash. Giratina-O can just Shadow Sneak it to death after Kyogre's Surf while capable of surviving a Dark Pulse. I find Scald's moderate burn rate to be pretty useful for spreading status and I tried Palkia over Gastrodon before. In the end, I favor Gastrodon more.

    EDIT: Still updating the threat list.
  15. firecape

    firecape This is the end...
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    I've actually used this team quite a bit and I've never had any problems vs heavy stall teams spikestacking. If I can double switch into Ferrothorn vs Ferrothorn I will stack up. Once you get a few layers up just go to Giratina-O and start spamming D tail and not many Stall teams can touch it out of 1-2 Pokemon and was those D tails start flying good luck getting those Pokemon in. If needed go to Dialga and "sac" it to leech seed while getting its fair share of roars in. Once chansey falls to hazards (it will quite quickly) the entire team crumbles.

    Spikes on regular is annoying I guess because this team has no "Safe" switch in for Nattorei but eh...

    ps: Big moody weakness -_-

    (You kept bugging me to post so I did, HAPPY)

    Jibaku edit: 9.9
  16. trickroom

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    That's the same strategy I was using earlier..Stap stealing my strategy ;_;

    Once both sides have Spikes up, I can send in Lugia and annoy the hell out of the opponent with Dragon Tail and Substitute. Giratina-O is my main thing to annoy stall together with Dialga :D

    Oh yeah, I won't sack Dialga so fast. I am keeping it to phaze around later, not wanting it to succumb to Leech Seed damage. Lugia is a safe switch in to Ferrothorn :P assuming Spikes are up on both sides.

    Moody is banned :P I have Clear Smog, Dragon Tail and Roar, that's close enough X___X Kyogre can own them with Thunder..but since it's going to be banned..not mentioning it anymore.

    (You kept bugging me to post so I did, HAPPY) <---- Booo..I didn't bug you, I just PMed you and you didn't respond ;_;

    Last edited by Jibaku; Jun 7th, 2011 at 8:35:15 PM. <--- This is skills! I like it.
  17. The_Chaser

    The_Chaser RVW
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    Yeah, its a great team almost impossible to beat once hazards are set up. Kinda weak to cm ghost arceus with focus blast but lets face it what teams aren't arceus weak
  18. Colonel M

    Colonel M I don't suck it's my team that sucks!
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    Like others said, Kyogre really stands as the main glue to the team. Wobbuffet and Dugtrio are probably the main things to worry about only because of trapping (though thankfully Dugtrio can only enter on choice Thunders, but when you have to play painful choice...). I also love how I'm Dialga the boss.

    I'd also choose between Earthquake or Earth Power. Mud Bomb also has that nasty problem with its troll-ish accuracy. I actually think Clear Smog is a decent idea since it prevents Calm Mind Kyogre from setting up, though it is kind of limited for uses I guess.

    Arsome team otherwise. Tyranny in this RMT!
  19. trickroom

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    Tyrants Rule just like Dialga owns in this RMT.

    Thanks for rating Colonel_M. Dugtrio and Wobbuffet aren't really problematic because the only thing Wob is trapping will be Kyogre. Kyogre 2HKOes Woba easily with Surf while Water Spout might OHKO it. Dugtrio is weak and the only chance to trap someone is Kyogre stuck Thunder.

    I chose Earth Power now for reliability. Going to try Clear Smog!

    Done with the Threat list now.
  20. shrang

    shrang Defend the Headquarters of Revolution
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    You're missing the mighty Qwilfish from your threat list... which can actually cause some problems because it too, can use Spikes in your face, especially against Lugia. When it's done its job, it can use Destiny Bond and take one of your Pokemon down.
  21. trickroom

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    Whoops, just added Qwilfish and a few others in the threat list. I can Shadow Sneak Qwilfish to bypass Destiny Bond and it can only get one layer on Lugia at a time because I can just Dragon Tail it out. Taunt doesn't stop Lugia. Ferrothorn can annoy it with Iron Barbs LOL so Qwilfish dies if it decides to attack me.
  22. ShinyAzelf

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    I'm not very good at the Uber tier, but I can tell this is a very solid team.

    Good job!

    he asked me to post
  23. polop

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    Specs ogre looks like it can dent giratina-o a bit especially if it's bluffing a scarf... and that would kinda screw over the team a bit if that did happen since forretress the little bug that causes problems and tentacreul something that scarf ogre 2hkoes (around 60% damage with thunder) can do even more then that.

    Fixing giratina-o's ev spread to a slightly more bulky one or 160 hp/76 sp. atk/ 236 atk/ and 36 speed can enable it to live a specs ice beam and take two rounds of stealth rock, always 2hko standard specs ogre with a thunder if it takes rocks, and be able to keep its physical attacking ability .

    But other then that problem great team (even though i cant really imagine a specs scarf bluff actually working after a post warning that XD)
  24. trickroom

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    I am sure Specs Kyogre can dent Giratina-O! However, I rarely switch in Giratina-O on Kyogre unless it's the mono attacker or stuck on Surf / Thunder. Gastrodon pretty much walls all Kyogre variants.

    I can usually see the difference between Scarf and Specs Kyogre since my initial switch in to Kyogre is Gastrodon. Specs Ice Beam does less than 43% to Gastrodon while Scarf does ~24%. I will think about a bulkier Giratina-O spread but I generally like the larger power since I find myself spamming Dragon Tail most of the time.

    Thank you for rating...

    EDIT: Just done with the complete Arceus threat list...
  25. Hugendugen

    Hugendugen Noam Chompsky.
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    Ahh another great team from the king of Ubers (sorry Jibaku :P). Like a lot of others, my first reaction to Gastrodon... O.o really? But you've proven just how well it can work. There are a few minor weaknesses though:

    As I mentioned earlier, Tyranitar could be troublesome. Especially if they've managed to set up Spikes with Ferrothorn (which will be easy, considering your strategy is generally to set up alongside them. God forbid they also manage to get T-Spikes up). It does significant damage to Gira-o and Lugia with Crunch or Pursuit, can cripple both Dialga and Ferrothorn with Superpower and brings in the sand which will allow Excadrill to pile on the hurt. Ogre would be the obvious switch-in, but Spikes will eventually put an end to that speedy whale and Gastrodon struggles against Ttar's trusted helper Grasseus.

    Now Wish would be hugely beneficial, and I was considering Jirachi over Dialga. Not only can it heal Ogre with a vital wish-pass, but messes with Ttar, sets up rocks and can spread status like no one's business. However this switch will make you a lot more vulnerable to Bulk Up Dialga and makes Ferro even more of an asshole. Xatu, which I've been trying to spread lately, could also be a cool addition, since it dominates Ferro and can wish-pass, however the synnergy on your team is so strong that it's almost impossible to simply replace something with it.

    I can't think of much more, that others haven't already mentioned... like how annoying sun teams can be after Ogre is dead or how annoying Darkrai, Grasseus and Manaphy are in general. However, most of the issues that I've brought up are rather situational, and often disregard how well you predict. All in all it's really solid: one more of your archive-worthy teams :P

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