So, here is the scenario:
Its the middle of a game. You have a free switch in and a single turn of safety after you performed the switch... gg?
I want to know how people would abuse that scenario. You probably cant cover the entire metagame with just one hugely abusive sweeper, that sort of thing just doesnt happen.... but maybe you cover the metagame with just two or three. What kind of setup do you have to have to turn that situation into a victory, is there anything that could feasibly stop you?
Art by sirndpt, yay! (click for more art)
I've been pondering this problem for a few days now. So far I've been experimenting with various sweepers to see what kind of havoc I can wreak. However, I'm extremely concious that:
a) I havent been selecting sweepers that compliment each other, merely those with raw power
b) I've almost certainly forgotten some of the greatest sweepers
c) I've only used setup sweepers when there are probably a whole range of ways to use the free turn
So, what I want you guys to do is to show me how badly you can abuse this scenario and how badly broken some pokes can be. I'm looking for specific builds along with an explanation of why that poke is sick, possible team-mates, counters, and maybe a brief summary of how good the poke is outside of this specific scenario.
Here are some ideas to start us off....
Oh, btw, I dont want to hear about how "that would never happen", "a good player wouldnt give you a free turn", or even "the metagame is too varied to counter everything". Obvious comments are obvious. Besides, I am pretty confident that I can garuantee a turn of safety and, however varied the metagame is, a free turn is such a huge advantage that I'd be astonished if we cant find some combination that completely dicks 99% of everything.
.... Go!
Its the middle of a game. You have a free switch in and a single turn of safety after you performed the switch... gg?
I want to know how people would abuse that scenario. You probably cant cover the entire metagame with just one hugely abusive sweeper, that sort of thing just doesnt happen.... but maybe you cover the metagame with just two or three. What kind of setup do you have to have to turn that situation into a victory, is there anything that could feasibly stop you?
Art by sirndpt, yay! (click for more art)
I've been pondering this problem for a few days now. So far I've been experimenting with various sweepers to see what kind of havoc I can wreak. However, I'm extremely concious that:
a) I havent been selecting sweepers that compliment each other, merely those with raw power
b) I've almost certainly forgotten some of the greatest sweepers
c) I've only used setup sweepers when there are probably a whole range of ways to use the free turn
So, what I want you guys to do is to show me how badly you can abuse this scenario and how badly broken some pokes can be. I'm looking for specific builds along with an explanation of why that poke is sick, possible team-mates, counters, and maybe a brief summary of how good the poke is outside of this specific scenario.
Here are some ideas to start us off....
Shell Smash, Skill Link, Ice Spear.... this guy is obnoxious.
This guy is obviously the best shell smasher in the game but is he good enough to merit a place in the team? Ice Spear is ridiculous for both its power and the ability to smash past dragons, focus sashes, multiscale, and substitutes. Tbh I think this guy probably is powerful enough but only justifiable if we can find an adequate partner in crime.
If nothing else it'd be pretty useful to work out exactly what the best build is, given the brief.
This guy is obviously the best shell smasher in the game but is he good enough to merit a place in the team? Ice Spear is ridiculous for both its power and the ability to smash past dragons, focus sashes, multiscale, and substitutes. Tbh I think this guy probably is powerful enough but only justifiable if we can find an adequate partner in crime.
If nothing else it'd be pretty useful to work out exactly what the best build is, given the brief.
Half goat, half hammerhead shark, I've adopted this poke as an honourary dragon because it fills almsot exactly the same role.
Jolly (+Spe, -SpA), +252 Speed, +252 Attack @ Life Orb
Swords Dance
Leaf Blade
Close Combat
Stone Edge
With this set Virizion can one-shot a substantial part of the metagame even without any boosts. This makes it pretty dandy as a flexible attack, possible to use outside of the gimmick as well as being a potent abuser. After a single swords dance (which I hope to garuantee) Virizion can remove anything that doesnt resist both his main STAB attacks (and isnt weak to stone edge). i.e. anything that isnt Celebi, Lati@s, or something uncommon and unheard of. Priority and scarf users are also problematic but seldom lethal. Oh, and sturdy/band, I guess he needs stealth rock support if he wants to break those guys.
Protip: Virizion can one-shot every single weather user. Yay.
Jolly (+Spe, -SpA), +252 Speed, +252 Attack @ Life Orb
Swords Dance
Leaf Blade
Close Combat
Stone Edge
With this set Virizion can one-shot a substantial part of the metagame even without any boosts. This makes it pretty dandy as a flexible attack, possible to use outside of the gimmick as well as being a potent abuser. After a single swords dance (which I hope to garuantee) Virizion can remove anything that doesnt resist both his main STAB attacks (and isnt weak to stone edge). i.e. anything that isnt Celebi, Lati@s, or something uncommon and unheard of. Priority and scarf users are also problematic but seldom lethal. Oh, and sturdy/band, I guess he needs stealth rock support if he wants to break those guys.
Protip: Virizion can one-shot every single weather user. Yay.
I like Dragons. I like dragons sooooo much that I had to restrain myself from listing multiple different setups and describing each in detail. However, I only want to know about the most absolutely abusive dragons, their partners, and their tremendous coverage.
DD Dragonite, substitute Dragonite, hurricane Dragonite, mixed Latios, calm mind Latias, moxie Salamence, Kyurem.... lots to choose from here. Be cool, be inventive.
My current favourite is dragon dance Haxorus. He might not have multiscale but its not as if a whole heap of things can one shot him anyway and almost nothing can stand in his way once he starts to sweep.
Adament, +252 Attack, +252 Speed, Mold Breaker @ Life Orb
Dragon Dance
OUTRAGE
Earthquake
Dual Chop
Ok, so this defiantely isnt the best build to abuse free setup but it is an incredible build if you want to make enormous dents in the other team and set the stage for my particular trick shot. While its not an especially good abuser you could use it as a benchmark when recommending dragons. I just happen to like this build too much to resist posting it.
DD Dragonite, substitute Dragonite, hurricane Dragonite, mixed Latios, calm mind Latias, moxie Salamence, Kyurem.... lots to choose from here. Be cool, be inventive.
My current favourite is dragon dance Haxorus. He might not have multiscale but its not as if a whole heap of things can one shot him anyway and almost nothing can stand in his way once he starts to sweep.
Adament, +252 Attack, +252 Speed, Mold Breaker @ Life Orb
Dragon Dance
OUTRAGE
Earthquake
Dual Chop
Ok, so this defiantely isnt the best build to abuse free setup but it is an incredible build if you want to make enormous dents in the other team and set the stage for my particular trick shot. While its not an especially good abuser you could use it as a benchmark when recommending dragons. I just happen to like this build too much to resist posting it.
Linoone is pretty special. A turn of freedom will buy him a single belly drum which sets him up for a garuanteed team sweep if he isnt hard countered.
He can only really use one build as described here. Hard counters are:
- bulky steel types
- fake out users
- er....
- fast ghost types
If your opponent has none of the above (lets assume you killed them :P) then they just lost.
He can only really use one build as described here. Hard counters are:
- bulky steel types
- fake out users
- er....
- fast ghost types
If your opponent has none of the above (lets assume you killed them :P) then they just lost.
Most baton pass tactics are completely off limits because they require two turns to setup. Two turns is enough for your opponent to switch and then phase you, which is obviously a failure. However...
Smeargle @ White Herb + some EVs
Shell Smash
Spore
Baton Pass
Ingrain
So, Smeargle can use the free turn to perform a shell smash. As soon as the phaser enters the battle Smeargle is fast enough to auto-sleep the threat or use ingrain if you think Smeargle can take a hit. Spore gives Smeargle a second free turn with which to baton pass and it also cripples an opposing poke into the bargain.
I have no idea what you would partner this with but there must be something out there.
Counters would include pokemon who are immune to sleep although these are probably only soft counters - you could bypass the spore step and survive by passing to something that can take a hit or two. Breloom might be a genuine hard counter.
Baton passing to Espeon might be a valid alternative to using Smeargle but I have no idea how effective that would be, is a free turn enough? I have a suspicion that baton passing is basicly just this big gimmick that relies on your opponent not having a good phaser. This is probably wrong so hopefully someone can correct me here and maybe demonstrate how baton pass can use a free turn.
Smeargle @ White Herb + some EVs
Shell Smash
Spore
Baton Pass
Ingrain
So, Smeargle can use the free turn to perform a shell smash. As soon as the phaser enters the battle Smeargle is fast enough to auto-sleep the threat or use ingrain if you think Smeargle can take a hit. Spore gives Smeargle a second free turn with which to baton pass and it also cripples an opposing poke into the bargain.
I have no idea what you would partner this with but there must be something out there.
Counters would include pokemon who are immune to sleep although these are probably only soft counters - you could bypass the spore step and survive by passing to something that can take a hit or two. Breloom might be a genuine hard counter.
Baton passing to Espeon might be a valid alternative to using Smeargle but I have no idea how effective that would be, is a free turn enough? I have a suspicion that baton passing is basicly just this big gimmick that relies on your opponent not having a good phaser. This is probably wrong so hopefully someone can correct me here and maybe demonstrate how baton pass can use a free turn.
Priority Swords Dance (Weavile, Scizor)
Nasty Plot (I havent tried any nasty plot users yet, wtf?)
Rollout, Charge Beam, Moxie, attack-to-setup sweepers?
Calm Mind, Stockpile, Cotton Guard, etc?
Substitute abusers
Demon creatures that setup their own tailwind (or rain, screens, whatever)
I feel like there is something creative and hugely evil lurking out there but I couldnt tell you what it might be or what form it might take. Please help me find it :)
Nasty Plot (I havent tried any nasty plot users yet, wtf?)
Rollout, Charge Beam, Moxie, attack-to-setup sweepers?
Calm Mind, Stockpile, Cotton Guard, etc?
Substitute abusers
Demon creatures that setup their own tailwind (or rain, screens, whatever)
I feel like there is something creative and hugely evil lurking out there but I couldnt tell you what it might be or what form it might take. Please help me find it :)
Oh, btw, I dont want to hear about how "that would never happen", "a good player wouldnt give you a free turn", or even "the metagame is too varied to counter everything". Obvious comments are obvious. Besides, I am pretty confident that I can garuantee a turn of safety and, however varied the metagame is, a free turn is such a huge advantage that I'd be astonished if we cant find some combination that completely dicks 99% of everything.
.... Go!
