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Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Ech0ez, Oct 13, 2010.

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  1. Ech0ez


    Oct 11, 2010
    #462 Magnezone

    This thread is dedicated to the discussion of the Pokemon competitively, not its tier placement or whether or not it will be banned.

    #462 Magnezone
    Typing: Electric / Steel
    Magnet Pull - Prevents Steel-type Pokémon from switching. 
    Sturdy - Prevents the Pokemon from been OHKOed
    Analyze (Dream World) - If the user moves after the opponent, the power of the user's attack is increased. 
    HP: 70
    Attack: 70
    Defense: 115
    Sp.Atk: 130
    Sp.Def: 90
    Speed: 60
    Level-Up Moves
    -- Mirror Coat
    -- Barrier
    -- Metal Sound
    -- Tackle
    Lv6 Thundershock
    Lv11 Supersonic
    Lv14 Sonicboom
    Lv17 Thunder Wave
    Lv22 Spark
    Lv27 Electra Ball
    Lv30 Lock-On
    Lv34 Magnet Bomb
    Lv40 Screech
    Lv46 Discharge
    Lv50 Mirror Shot
    Lv54 Magnet Rise
    Lv60 Gyro Ball
    Lv66 Zap Cannon
    Tutor Moves
    Iron Defense
    Role Play
    Signal Beam
    Snore Swift
    TM/HM Moves
    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM15 Hyper Beam
    TM16 Light Screen
    TM17 Rain Dance
    TM18 Protect
    TM21 Frustration
    TM24 Thunderbolt
    TM25 Thunder
    TM27 Return
    TM32 Double Team
    TM33 Reflect
    TM34 Shock Wave (Gen III/IV only)
    TM42 Facade
    TM43 Secret Power (Gen III/IV only)
    TM44 Rest
    TM48 Troll/Sing-A-Round
    TM57 Charge Beam
    TM58 Endure (Gen III/IV only)
    TM64 Explosion
    TM67 Recycle (Gen III/IV only)
    TM68 Giga Impact
    TM70 Flash
    TM72 Volt Change
    TM73 Thunder Wave
    TM74 Gyro Ball
    TM77 Psych Up
    TM82 Sleep Talk (Gen III/IV only)
    TM83 Natural Gift (Gen III/IV only)
    TM87 Swagger
    TM90 Substitute
    TM91 Flash Cannon
    TM93 Wild Bolt
    New Moves
    Electra Ball - X BP Special - [URL="http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3027789&postcount=621"]Deals more damage the faster the user is than the target.[/URL]
    Troll/Sing-A-Around - 60 BP Special - Does more damage if multiple users in the party know the attack.
    Volt Change -70 BP Special - Electric U-Turn basically.
    Wild Bolt - 130 BP Physical - The user takes recoil damage.

    Magnezone hasn't changed much since Gen IV but he still remains one of, if not the best Steel killer in the game, and with this generation shaping up to be even more dominated by Steels and Dragons than the last; Magnezone looks to still be thriving in its own little niche;

    • Magnet Pull - Magnezone's biggest selling point is its ability; been able to trap and kill Steel types is nothing to scoff at, especially considering how critical they are to most teams both offensively and defensively. Magnezone easily threatens Pokemon like Skarmory, Nattorei, Forretress, Scizor and almost every notable Steel type in the game.
    • Unique Typing - Electric/Steel is a typing exclusive to the Magnemite family and it gives Magnezone a rather interesting set of resistances and weaknesses. It resists Steel and Flying four times over whilst also resisting Normal, Electric, Rock and the ever dangerous Dragon type. Unfortunately it also gives poor 'zone weaknesses to Fire, Fighting and most notably a quadruple weakness to Ground; all of which are very common attacking types.
    • Decent Bulk - Magenzone certainly isn't going to be replacing your walls anytime soon, but 70/115/90 defenses let it take hits pretty well especially given its variety of resistances.
    • Lacking Speed - Although Magnezone doesn't really need to worry about outspeeding most Steel types, just about anything with decent speed is capable of coming in and revenging it due to it been pretty slow.
    • Limited Movepool - Unfortunately Magnezone's biggest flaw always has and probably always will be its sparse movepool. Offensively it's limited to STAB and Hidden Power where as defensively Magnezone's best options are things like Dual-Screen and T-Wave. In some ways Zone has even less options now that Explosion's been nerfed.
    Bet you wish you had Shed Shell now, huh?
    Magnezone @ Leftovers / Balloon
    Ability: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 40 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
    Nature: Timid (+Spe, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Substitute
    - Magnet Rise / Volt Change / Thunder Wave

    The standard Steel Trapper from the last generation makes a return to put the hurt on metal birds and prickly plants everywhere. Thunderbolt is your obvious STAB choice for offensive power letting Magnezone get damage on just about anything that doesn't resist it and hitting Skarmory as well as Empoleon for super-effective damage. Hidden Power Fire lets you kill Nattorei, Forrtress, Scizor and most Steel types that don't resist it. Substitute keeps 'zone safe from damage and more importantly you can easily set it up in the face of Skarmory, Nattorei, Forretress and Bronzong is the latter three aren't packing Ground moves. Your final option is more filler than anything else but Magnet Rise gives you a Ground immunity which lets you put the hurt on Metagross and Doryuuzu, and T-Wave is typical paralysis support. Volt Change is an interesting option since it lets Magnezone scout and get out of unfavourable match-ups, but given that a lot of Magnezone's switch-ins are Ground types it may not be all too practical. Something interesting I'd like to note about this set is that the Electric/Fire combination means Magnezone is capable of beating the Nattorei/Burungeru defensive core people have been going on about as of late and unlike a lot of the other Pokemon that can break through it Magnezone is capable of actually trapping Nattorei if it isn't running Shed Shell.

    Another alternative option for this set is a new held item called the Balloon. I'll cover this a bit later on in the post, but the Balloon grants Magnezone a Ground immunity until it's popped and has a fair bit of potential use.

    Sort of moderately fast Magnezone
    Magnezone @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Nature: Timid (+Spe, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Fire] / Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Flash Cannon / Volt Change / Thunder
    - Flash Cannon / Volt Change / Thunder

    ScarfZone certainly isn't a Garchomp-level revenge killer but it does have the rather unique ability of been able to trap and revenge kill the fasters Steels slower variants of zone can't touch. Thunderbolt is your typical STAB move where as your Hidden Power mainly offers coverage; Fire beats various notable Steels where as Ice lets you hit Dragons and the assortment of Ground types running around. The finaly two slots have few options but they aren't all too terrible. Flash Cannon gives you a way of hitting Rock types (Tyrannitar notably) as well as making some use of Magnezone's Steel STAB. Volt Change works as U-Turn typically does on Choiced Pokemon and Thunder is a situational option if you want to put the hurt on Rain Dance teams.

    Where are you going Magnezone?
    Magnezone @ Light Clay
    Ability: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 252 HP / 96 Def / 162 SpD
    Nature: Bold
    - Reflect
    - Light Screen
    - Volt Change
    - Hidden Power [Fire] / Thunder Wave

    A rather uncommon set from last generation, Dual Screen Magnezone has arguably gotten both better and worse depending on your point of view. Explosion is a lot less viable now which prevents you going out with a bang so to speak, but Volt Change let's Magnezone get another Pokemon in for free whilst also keeping itself alive to come in and set up screens later on. With this in mind you can run Hidden Power in the last slot to still score KOs on Nattorei, Forretress and Scizor or you can go with T-Wave to spread status.
    *Note: EV spread may well be outdated given this is from the 4th gen analysis; if anyone has a better spread for the current generation feel free to suggest it.

    I don't have a mouth...
    Magnezone @ Cutsap Berry / Petaya Berry / Salac Berry
    Ability: Sturdy
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Sp.Atk / 252 Spe
    Nature: Modest (+Sp.Atk, -Atk) / Timid (+Spe, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Fire] / [Ice]
    - Flash Cannon
    - Thunder Wave

    Well this is an interesting little gimmick. Sturdy basically acts as a Focus Sash thi generatio which allows Magnezone to take any hit (Most notably Ground typed ones) and live, and then retaliate. Now generally speaking this is wouldn't be worth giving up Magnezone's ability to trap Steels but in combination with any of the listed berries it can almost gurantee Magnezone a kill. Generally speaking Magnezone is know to carry Magnet Pull, it's something the majority of players simply take for granted. With this in mind Magnezone is quite capable of bluffing Magnet Pull letting it kill a Steel (Ideally something that isn't attacking zone like Skarm or Nattorei) and then kill whatever comes in to finish it. The way this works is say if Garchomp comes in and hits you with an Earthquake; Magnezone lives and gets a berry boost and then smacks chomp in the face with Hidden Power Ice. That's just one example, but the general idea is Magnezone kills something like Skarmory and then either kills the revenger or at least takes a pretty big chunk out of it. Berry choice is up to you; Custap ensures you get two attacks off which is pretty useful but Petaya increases your chances of OHKOing whatever you're facing and technically speaking Cutsap is actually illegal at present. You can run Salac with Timid and then try to sweep with Magnezone which is an interesting idea, although attempting to sweep with 1 HP often isn't practical.

    What the fuck is this? Seriously?
    Magnezone @ Life Orb / Leftovers
    Ability: Analyze
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Sp.Atk
    Nature: Quiet (+Sp.Atk, -Spe)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Flash Cannon
    - Substitute / Magnet Rise

    Now this set is nothing more than theorymon at the moment but I thought it was worth mentioning regardless. It's currently unknown by how much Analyze boosts your offensive, or exactly how the mechanic works but the basic idea is if you attack after the opponent your attacks hit harder. With this in mind the idea of this set is to make use of Magnezone's various resistances and decent bulk to take hits and hit back harder. Thunerbolt and Flash Cannon are your STAB options and Hidden Power Ice can be used to give BoltBeam coverage. Your last move is to give Magnezone some longetivity, Magnet Rise lets you dodge Ground attacks for a while which is pretty helpful on ensuring nothing is going be KOing you, but Subtitute can be use to prevent status and you can set it up on Steels pretty easily if you bluff Magnet Pull.

    Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, that's Motherfucking Balloonzone!

    Magnezone @Balloon
    Ability: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 204 HP / 252 Sp.Atk / 52 Spe
    Nature: Modest (+Sp.Atk, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Fire/Ice]
    - Magnet Rise
    - Flash Cannon / Volt Change / Substitute

    In a world where Farfetch'd still sucks and Flareon will never get Flare Blitz, the poor Magnemite family have always had to put up with that rather unfortunate Ground weakness. Apparently floating above the ground with god damn bloody magnetism doesn't shield you from earthquakes while Pidgey can take a nap while completely immune. However the great gods at TrollFreak decided to have mercy on poor Magnezone and bless him with the greatest item Pokemon has ever seen. The Balloon for those of you that haven't read the Research Thread (That's your cue to go read it) gives the holder an immunity to Ground type moves as long as the balloon is intact. Should you be hit by a damaging move the balloon pops. What this means is until your opponent lands a hit on Magnezone their Earthquakes aren't doing anything. Now no one in their right mind is going to let Magnezone fly around untouched but the important detail is that for at least one turn Magnezone has a chance to put the hurt on anything that would otherwise kill it with EQ in one hit.

    Fundamentally the set plays like a slower but bulkier version of the Steel Trapper set. The difference is the fact unlike the standard Steel Trapper you're free to set-up Magnet Rise in the face of Pokemon that would otherwise try and Earthquake you, notably things like Doryuuzu, Tyrannitar, Garchomp, Randorosu and so forth. The advantage this set has over the standard Steel Trapper is the fact Magnezone is now quite capable of beating certain Pokemon in one on one confrontations that it otherwise couldn't and this can in turn make Magnezone a surprisingly threatening revenge killer of sorts. The basic moveset is mostly the same as your typical Magnezone although unlike the dedicated Steel killer Hidden Power Ice is a viable option of this set since it lets Magnezone take on a lot of prominent revenge killers as well many key players on Sandstorm teams. Magnet Rise becomes in a very viable option since the Balloon gives you the turn need to set it up against faster Pokemon and basically making Magnezone a very difficult Pokemon to take down. You final move is up to you, Flash Cannon allows you to beat Tyrannitar and hit a few other things for STAB and is generally the better option. However Volt Change lets you get in another Pokemon in for free and Subtitute can be used in the same way it can on the Steel Trapper set especially given that this variant is quite bulky. The Speed EVs let you outrun standard Choice Band Scizor although you can just invest them in HP or Def if you prefer.

    Fuck Mole Magnezone
    Magnezone @Balloon
    Ability: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 200 HP / 210 Def / 100 Sp.Atk
    Nature: Bold (+Def, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Magnet Rise
    - Troll

    Does Doryuuzu rape your team? Do you lack an answer to that god damned mole? Perhaps you are sick of your Choice Band Roopushin getting OHKOed by a +2 Earthquake? Well fear no more, for the "Fuck Mole Magnezone" is the answer to all of your problems. Even with Stealth Rock, Life Orb and Swords Dance Doryuuzu can never 3HKO you with X-Scissor or Rock Slide, letting you Magnet Rise and Hidden Power in peace. Thunderbolt lets you 2HKO Skarmoy, and the excellent Normal typed Troll can be installed for a mere 16,000 Pokedollars, letting you deal 6 to 7 percent on standard Blissey. Factoring in Leftovers that's a 100HKO if you hit for max damage all one hundred times! Don't miss out on this fantastic offer; you too can Fuck Mole today.
    Please note that we here at TrollFreak Incorperated hold no responsibility for what happens to your team if you switch Magnezone in on an attacking move. We would also like to inform you your "Fuck Mole Magnezone" does not come with insurance or warranty, and if you break it that's your problem. Thank you for buying from TrollFreak Incorperated, have a nice day.

    All-in-all Magnezone hasn't changed all that much since last generation. Outside of Volt Change and Explosion getting nerfed its movepool is pretty much the same and the only new item Magnezone can really make use of is the Balloon. Sturdy and Analyze may get used as gimmicks, but on the majority of teams been able to trap Steels is far more important. However even with a limited number of tricks Magnezone remains an impressive Steel Trapper and will more than likely still fill the niche it used to as well as ever.

    *Note: I left out several sets that were on the D/P analysis since the only changes to the majority of them is slashing in Volt Change so I only 'updated' the ones that were either 'standard' or have arguably gotten more viable because of Volt Change and/or the Balloon.
  2. Moo

    Moo Professor
    is an Artist Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Jun 21, 2010
    Lol, great post mate :D
    I think Maggy is an amazing poke too.
    Although some of the EVs look a bit off, should be 216 speed on the first set
    Also you should know, the last 2 evs make no difference, so the should be 252 / 252 / 4
    Just a lil' nitpick^
  3. DDRMaster


    Jun 26, 2008
    Always max out HP on Magnezone before putting anything into Def. It has high Def already so more HP is more beneficial to Physical bulk and Special bulk.

    Edit: I guess if you're dead set on only having Magnezone taking physical attacks, you could go with Def before HP but the extra HP helps out immensely when it comes to taking Special attacks.

    I'm not really sure you need a separate set for Balloon, since it seems to be doing the same thing as the Steel Trapper set, but it is an interesting option for Magnezone. It lets it trap faster Steel types that only have Earthquake and a move it resists, since it allows it to get up a Magnet Rise before it gets KOd by Earthquake. It also lets Magnezone trap Heatran that are locked into Earthpower. I have a feeling that the Balloon will be popped fairly quickly by something like Scizor's Bullet Punch but it's still a good option.
  4. Ech0ez


    Oct 11, 2010

    The Balloon set was actually a rather bad attempt at poking fun at the people going on about how "broken" Doryuuzu is, although in hindsight that doesn't really come across at all. Ultimately though the set's just a humourous gimmick.

    With that said a viable bulky Balloon set would be 200 HP / 58 Def / 252 Sp.Atk with a +Sp.Atk nature, or a variation on the standard Steel Trapper. I didn't really bring it up inititally since the Balloon was primarily just a joke, but now that I think about it there's no reason not to mention it. I'll edit something in anyway, thanks for the feedback.
  5. leingodf8


    Oct 1, 2010
    The old set of:
    Timid @ Salac Berry
    Charge Beam
    Hidden Power Ice/Hidden Power Grass
    Could work fairly well. Its not the easiest thing to set up and even after a salac boost its not that fast, but if you can catch a choice banded BP scizor, then your set. The ev's can vary, set your speed for however fast you wanna be after a boost (I usually go for just enough to outspeed base +110's), and I usually like to put in enough bulk to let your sub survive 2 BPs. That way, you can keep your sub up when you finish scizor off, and hopefully leave the encounter with +1 speed, and +2-4 SpA and a Sub intact
  6. lumpor


    Aug 18, 2010
    Your first set is the one I used last generation and I can tell you, magnet rise is no gimmick.

    I didn't really care for speed tiers, so I used timid with 252 speed EVs. With this I outsped magnezones and bronzongs, and magnet rised as they EQd. Then bronzong usually sets up stealth rocks/screens or gyro balls and metagross is stuck mashing a x4 resister. This basically lets you set up your sub for free. So I'd really recommend max speed, together with thunderbolt, hp fire, sub and magnet rise.

    I don't know how important balloon will be for a set. One problem I've had is switching into a metagross, and then see it using agility (which makes me go fuuuuuck). Also, some metagrosses have surprised me by being jolly. Balloon will solve that. Also, it would help vs tyranitars, as the vast majority will be fast in some way.

    Leftovers do help immensly in long battles, like vs bronzongs. And it might save you from dying by choice scarf jirachis (their iron heads deal like 8%, but the battle will last maybe 8 or so turns, so leftovers do help alot there).

    Must say though, a very nice guide
  7. Ech0ez


    Oct 11, 2010
    I thought about listing it but since it's unchanged from D/P and doesn't benefit from anything new in Gen V bar been able to set up on Nattorei I decided to just skip it.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you're using Hidden Power Fire you have a Speed IV of 30 so even with max Speed you only speed tie with a 252 Spe Metagross.
  8. IcyMan28


    Sep 18, 2008
    No love for SpecsMagnezone? It still boasts the highest special attack of all electric types, and has a whopping 13 resistances to come in on coupled with excellent defenses. A bulky special attacker always has some use.

    Magnezone@Choice Specs
    Modest; 252 HP / 252 SpA / 6 Spe
    Analyze / Magnet Pull

    HP Ice
    Tri Attack
    Flash Cannon

    Using Magnezone is a bit trickier than using something like SpecsTran due to its main STAB having an immunity in the form of ground types. However, that can be fixed. With all the dragons running around, HP Ice is too good not to pass up, unless you want Sazandora and Garchomp running all over you. Thunderbolt is the main STAB while Flash Cannon is filler; it does, however, provide a solid neutral hit against the likes of Tyranitar. Tri Attack is included because it deals decent damage to those who don't resist it, doing (38.86% - 45.79%) to 252/0 neutral Swampert. Steel types are unlikely to switch in for fear of being trapped, and Rock types fear Flash Cannon. The ghosts that are immune to it don't really have a reliable means of dealing with Magnezone, and are hit hard by either of its STABs. Thus, it is a nice opening move that may also status something.

    Finally, Analyze is an option for the ability. Though the details are unknown, Magnezone's low speed and bulk allow it to take a hit and move second, boosting the power of its attacks further.
  9. Bubble Head

    Bubble Head

    Jul 19, 2010
    i lol so much at every of your magnezone XDDDDDDD
    it's still hard to decide HP for zone though,ice let you hit the dragon,fire for scizor,forret and ground for the only heatran.Other than that,i still like the sub set for zone
  10. Chameleon


    Jan 18, 2010
    Great post! Quite hilarious.

    I'm excited to use volt change. It's annoying having the scarfer being set-bait after nabbing a KO, or more so blowing yourself up with the dual screen set to get a sweeper in more easily. It may not do as much damage as I hope, but picking off Skarmory, weaked Scizor, and water-types should be much safer. You can also swtich in on a double KO to hit-and-run with a scarf.

    And I'm glad you mentioned Thunder! 50% accuracy in sun is annoying, though, but maybe worth the risk if you have drizzletoed.
  11. Darkamber8828


    Dec 28, 2009
    I loled.

    Several times.

    Specs Maggy wants HP Fire, since Electric/Normal is only resisted by Rock/Ground types and Doryuuzu/Steelix, and the former is dealt with by Flash Cannon.

  12. Farukon_o_miru


    Sep 16, 2010
    A set with Enigma Berry and Sturdy can allow you to resist many Super-effective attacks.
  13. Nastyjungle

    Nastyjungle fat and sassy
    is an Artist Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Sep 28, 2010
    Not that is is really adding anything productive to the thread, but why doesn't Magnezone have Levitate? I mean, it's not like its touching the ground or anything. It seems like the perfect candidate.
  14. Gabe


    Sep 28, 2010
    This is the funniest OP so far.

    Anyway, Magnezone looks to fit the same role it did in the last gen, except now it makes a worthwhile check to the mole.
  15. Empress Mobile

    Empress Mobile

    Apr 10, 2009
    First of all, this "Maggy" shit has got to stop.

    Anyway, I really like the Fuck Mole set. The idea of a balloon to give a turn to Magnet Rise is pretty interesting. I'll probably test it out some.
  16. Manaphy


    May 5, 2010
    Nattorei, Cradily, the Bug/Steels, and the Bug/Rocks all resist Electric/Normal, luckily HP Fire and Flash Cannon takes care of most of them.

    EDIT: I don't know where I got the Bug- Types in my head, my bad :/
  17. M BLADE


    Jul 6, 2008
    Nattorei and Cradily does resist both attacks, but bug/steel and bug/rock pokes are neutral to electric.
  18. Ech0ez


    Oct 11, 2010
    But with Sturdy there isn't really any need for the Enigma Berry to be honest.

    TrollFreak does not adhere to any logic that we mere humans can comprehend.

    If I was to hazard a logical guess I'd assume they gave it Magnet Rise to fill in for Levitate so it could still utilize Magnet Pull.

    Bug/Steel and Bug/Rock are both neutral to Electric. Goruggu, Dialga and Giratina also resist Electric/Normal though.
  19. Granstafer


    Sep 3, 2010
    erm... Dory out speeds magnezone even without sand throw and can ko with earthquake.
  20. Ech0ez


    Oct 11, 2010

    This artistic masterpiece begs to differ.
  21. Empress Mobile

    Empress Mobile

    Apr 10, 2009
    Balloon + Magnet Rise = no
  22. the voice of reason

    the voice of reason

    Feb 1, 2007
    Think of it this way:
    1. you switch in on an earthquake; it misses
    2. you select magnet rise as they attack you with some other move. You use magnet rise and become immune to ground
    3. They still can't hit you with their earthquake now. You proceed to fuck them up.

    This is especially pertinent regarding steel trapping. Otherwise, they'd probably just switch in a pokemon that uses fire or fighting moves. It's slightly gimmicky, but it's a rather bright idea.
  23. KokoaKiwi


    Sep 22, 2010
    ...why can't all the ops be as darn good as this one?
    Magnezone is arguably my favorite competitive electric. With all this power creep thingie going on, a quiet nature woul be decent for a trick room set.

    Off topic, The Scope lens/life orb/lefties/wide lens pic just screams for a variant of the meme "Why can I, hold these lums?"
  24. Empress Mobile

    Empress Mobile

    Apr 10, 2009
    Wow, great job using context
  25. A2ZOMG


    Apr 10, 2009
    No sets using Sturdy? Oh well. I mean Sturdy is now a legit ability.
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