Most Generation PRNG Help / Information

Does the following all seem right? Or am I really mistaken in some parts?

Okay, so I've reached Ecruteak City, and want to start abusing for, let's say, Raikou.

First, I find a good spread that I want. Okay.

I use the Seed to Time function to work out a time and delay I need to hit, and I know what frame I need to hit. Fine.

Firstly, where exactly should I save? When exactly are Raikou's IVs generated? I enter the tower, chat with Eusine and Morty, battle Silver, climb down a ladder... Should I save on the steps down towards the dogs at the bottom of the ladder?

I put my target delay into emloop and try to hit it the first, calibrating, time. I assume I immediately Sweet Scent to try and catch a Pokémon to verify my initial seed. Does Sweet Scent work on those steps down towards the dogs? Or should I be a step further back?

I verify my seed by working out the IVs of the Pokémon I've caught. I guess I'm going to have to transfer a lot of rare candies to my game and use metalkid's IV calculator.

I adjust the delay in emloop so that it should now hit the correct delay and go again. (Possibly changing the year by one to account for odd/even switch? I heard scrolling to the bottom of the New Game/Continue screen and up again has the same effect; has anyone verified this?)

I Sweet Scent a wild Pokémon to verify my seed. If I've not hit my seed, begin again. (Possibly fine tuning emloop). If I've hit my seed, I now need to get to the right frame.

Is Raikou is a Method K Pokémon? Does using a syncher affect it? (If so, would the syncher affect Raikou and Entei?)

The Sweet Scent + battle advances the frame by 6, right? Then I need to use the radio to further advance the frame; and since there are wild Pokémon down here, turning/walking should advance the frame but maybe by a strainge amount... Does the step I take towards the dogs when they all flee increase the frame by one?

Basically, let's say I was trying to hit frame 100, for argument's sake. So 1 starting frame + 6 sweet scent + 1 walking towards them means I need to advance it 92 times with the radio? Is that right?

I don't really understand the difference between "frame" and "actual frame" at all. Is this important?
 
Showsni said:
Does the following all seem right? Or am I really mistaken in some parts?

Okay, so I've reached Ecruteak City, and want to start abusing for, let's say, Raikou.

First, I find a good spread that I want. Okay. Good.

I use the Seed to Time function to work out a time and delay I need to hit, and I know what frame I need to hit. Fine. Good.

Firstly, where exactly should I save? When exactly are Raikou's IVs generated? I enter the tower, chat with Eusine and Morty, battle Silver, climb down a ladder... Should I save on the steps down towards the dogs at the bottom of the ladder? Although I haven't abused for them in Ekruteak, you'll want to save just before the step that makes them run away. I'd save just before going down the ladder, then go down and find the square just before the release (like if taking 2 steps to the left makes them run, save one step left). Don't save on the square with the ladder, since sweet scenting doesn't work on that square.

I put my target delay into emloop and try to hit it the first, calibrating, time. I assume I immediately Sweet Scent to try and catch a Pokémon to verify my initial seed. Does Sweet Scent work on those steps down towards the dogs? Or should I be a step further back? See the last part.

I verify my seed by working out the IVs of the Pokémon I've caught. I guess I'm going to have to transfer a lot of rare candies to my game and use metalkid's IV calculator. Yeah, since the wilds there are around or under 20.

I adjust the delay in emloop so that it should now hit the correct delay and go again. (Possibly changing the year by one to account for odd/even switch? I heard scrolling to the bottom of the New Game/Continue screen and up again has the same effect; has anyone verified this?) I don't know about the scrolling part, but yeah you'll need to edit the timer a few times.

I Sweet Scent a wild Pokémon to verify my seed. If I've not hit my seed, begin again. (Possibly fine tuning emloop). If I've hit my seed, I now need to get to the right frame. Good.

Is Raikou is a Method K Pokémon? Does using a syncher affect it? (If so, would the syncher affect Raikou and Entei?) It's a runner, so Method 1 and a synchronizer won't work.

The Sweet Scent + battle advances the frame by 6, right? Then I need to use the radio to further advance the frame; and since there are wild Pokémon down here, turning/walking should advance the frame but maybe by a strainge amount... Does the step I take towards the dogs when they all flee increase the frame by one? Find the frame of the caught pokemon in Method K. Then look at it's "Actual Frame". Add 6 to this number and that's the frame you're on. Then use the radio, since turning/walking is inconsistent in this game as of now. From what I've heard, the step doesn't advance it.

Basically, let's say I was trying to hit frame 100, for argument's sake. So 1 starting frame + 6 sweet scent + 1 walking towards them means I need to advance it 92 times with the radio? Is that right? If it's 100, you would SS and catch the pokemon. Let's say it's Method K frame is 65, and the actual is 74. That means 74+6=80. 100-80=20.

I don't really understand the difference between "frame" and "actual frame" at all. Is this important?
Click to expand...
Comments in bold.
 
Unanswered questions...

What really is roaming Lati@s' frame?
How about the Kanto/Hoenn starters?
And RNGing for Raikou/Entei post-E4 SUPER-HARD?
 
COKTAL said:
Basically, let's say I was trying to hit frame 100, for argument's sake. So 1 starting frame + 6 sweet scent + 1 walking towards them means I need to advance it 92 times with the radio? Is that right? If it's 100, you would SS and catch the pokemon. Let's say it's Method K frame is 65, and the actual is 74. That means 74+6=80. 100-80=20.
Click to expand...

can someone explain this bit to me? I'm assuming that when you refer to the "Method K frame", that's the Method K frame of the caught pokemon, yes? But how do you find the "actual" frame, and why is it different from the method K frame?
 
Emily said:
Unanswered questions...

What really is roaming Lati@s' frame?
How about the Kanto/Hoenn starters?
And RNGing for Raikou/Entei post-E4 SUPER-HARD?
Click to expand...

STOP.

Do not ask the same questions over and over again.

First off, some of these are researchable. So research it yourself. The rest of it is either not known or you need to to check back here or check the research linked in my signature.
 
So I'm on the step in the burnt tower..
I'm on frame 5119 (actual). My target frame is 5191. How many advancements do I need to make, taking into account the step to release the dogs, the battle I just had to sweet scent the poke, and maybe whatever else I'm missing?
 
all4game said:
So I'm on the step in the burnt tower..
I'm on frame 5119 (actual). My target frame is 5191. How many advancements do I need to make, taking into account the step to release the dogs, the battle I just had to sweet scent the poke, and maybe whatever else I'm missing?
Click to expand...
first of all this is the most craziest frame I ever heard of all4game.xD
Chances to screw up are pretty high if you askme.
But back to your question:

You don't have to take any steps into account if you already saved with your face in front of the dogs on one of the last stairs.
Where you still can use Sweet scent btw.

Sweet Scent was a 6.
So 72-6 makes 66.
Sweet Scent, tune the left bottom of the radio 22 times when you are on the last stair down to Raikou and Entei and you'd have an actual chance to hit your target frame
 
Lol okay, I just tried that. Caught entei and it was 5204 when looking at the method 1 frames. So I was off by 8?
edit: and why are the chances to mess up so much higher when i'm using a high frame, even though I narrow it to a smaller amount?
its just more work for me running around but I still got it down to 22 radios.
 
So anyhow, slimceagirls cousin told omega donut about some japanese program lets people verify initial seeds on HG/SS without capturing a pokemon, so I grabbed it and start checking it out. I am sorta stumped with the whole initial seed verification thing, so I started playing with it and noticed it supported IV inheritance for HGSS.

I was able to get in the code and to work out how it works, so we'll have that in RNG reporter pretty soon.

Now here are some interesting facts:

1. In HG/SS there is no longer a lower chance for HP or Def to pass. All IVs are now equal.

2. In HG/SS there is never any overlap. In other words, where a single IV could pass two of three times in emerald/DPPt that won't happen anymore. Three IVs will always pass now.

Here is where I go out on a limb (and honestly it's not important to anyone except maybe me, so whatever):

I believe the breeding mechanic where three IVs were not always inherited and that HP/Def were harder to pass were a bug, first introduced in emerald, that has lived until now, when they finally fixed it in HG/SS, allowing us to revert back to what is VERY likely the same internal mechanic that existed in Ruby and Sapphire.

Anyhow, I think this because of the way the game picks which IV to inherit from a shrinking block of IVs. In HG/SS this block shrinks because we remove IVs that we have already inherited. In emerald/DPPt each of the blocks always had the same items... The whole thing is just very similar and one of them makes sense and the other is very arbitrary and just *feels* likes a non working version of what we currently have.
 
Romsstar said:
Enteis Starting Frame opposed to Raikous is 6, did you took that into account?
and maybe you turned accidently.
Click to expand...

mingot said:
So anyhow, slimceagirls cousin told omega donut about some japanese program lets people verify initial seeds on HG/SS without capturing a pokemon, so I grabbed it and start checking it out. I am sorta stumped with the whole initial seed verification thing, so I started playing with it and noticed it supported IV inheritance for HGSS.

I was able to get in the code and to work out how it works, so we'll have that in RNG reporter pretty soon.

Now here are some interesting facts:

1. In HG/SS there is no longer a lower chance for HP or Def to pass. All IVs are now equal.

2. In HG/SS there is never any overlap. In other words, where a single IV could pass two of three times in emerald/DPPt that won't happen anymore. Three IVs will always pass now.

Here is where I go out on a limb (and honestly it's not important to anyone except maybe me, so whatever):

I believe the breeding mechanic where three IVs were not always inherited and that HP/Def were harder to pass were a bug, first introduced in emerald, that has lived until now, when they finally fixed it in HG/SS, allowing us to revert back to what is VERY likely the same internal mechanic that existed in Ruby and Sapphire.

Anyhow, I think this because of the way the game picks which IV to inherit from a shrinking block of IVs. In HG/SS this block shrinks because we remove IVs that we have already inherited. In emerald/DPPt each of the blocks always had the same items... The whole thing is just very similar and one of them makes sense and the other is very arbitrary and just *feels* likes a non working version of what we currently have.
Click to expand...


Could it be that it's the talking to your pokemon seed verification that was already mentioned once?
Also: Could you share this program with us?
As I speak Japanese maybe I could figure some things out?
 
Romsstar said:
Could it be that it's the talking to your pokemon seed verification that was already mentioned once?
Also: Could you share this program with us?
As I speak Japanese maybe I could figure some things out?
Click to expand...

It uses the location of the dogs and the call to prof elm, as far as I can tell. Anyhow, it will get worked out later. I am happier about egg IVs this second, since that has been annoying.

Dig around here:
http://ohirugohan1018.blog98.fc2.com/
 
I've been trying Latias recently. There is only one explanation I can think of for the inconsistent monster frames. Its monster frame is prob something like 1 or 5, but NPCs in Vermilion city advance it before steven talks to you. There are no NPCs in the fan club that move randomly, so only NPCs in vermilion could possibly advance it.
Update: I hit the same seed I hit before in one of my attempts. The initial frame was the same as the last time I hit it (7).
Update 2: I've just succeeded in RNG'ing it. Even though the initial frame is not consistent, it appears to be the same for 1 seed every time. I got the same initial frame on my seed twice.
 
mingot said:
It uses the location of the dogs and the call to prof elm, as far as I can tell. Anyhow, it will get worked out later. I am happier about egg IVs this second, since that has been annoying.

Dig around here:
http://ohirugohan1018.blog98.fc2.com/
Click to expand...

As it seems it is really something about the calls or it least it seems so.
I tried the seed
D120287 which game me the combination:菌 カ し し 菌 カ 菌 カ 菌 消費seed数:0


Elm Call
し：ポケモンの　しんかというのは～
カ：カントーには　まだ　ぼくの～
菌：ポケルスが　くっついた～ウツギ

stand for textes, and the program says this are responses you get from Elm when you call him but I never got any of these responses there must be something I didn't understand yet^^

But the good news after all is: There is a way to verify your seed after all.
I know this is basically nothing, I gotta install Desmume and check that stuff.

Edit: At least I got how it works with the dogs.

Example Seed:
c5150212

c5150208:ライコウ:29　エンテイ:34　ラティ: 4　強制消費seed数:3
c5150209:ライコウ:35　エンテイ:36　ラティ:24　強制消費seed数:3
c515020a:ライコウ:44　エンテイ:39　ラティ: 6　強制消費seed数:3
c515020b:ライコウ:32　エンテイ:43　ラティ:26　強制消費seed数:3
c515020c:ライコウ:38　エンテイ:46　ラティ: 7　強制消費seed数:3
c515020d:ライコウ:29　エンテイ:31　ラティ: 1　強制消費seed数:3
c515020e:ライコウ:35　エンテイ:33　ラティ: 8　強制消費seed数:3
c515020f:ライコウ:43　エンテイ:36　ラティ: 2　強制消費seed数:3
c5150210:ライコウ:32　エンテイ:38　ラティ:10　強制消費seed数:3
c5150211:ライコウ:38　エンテイ:43　ラティ: 4　強制消費seed数:3

given out list.
Raikou, Entei, Lat.
The numbers, mark positions on the map.
The program gives you a map where the numbers stand and by looking at which position the dog is you can verify your seed.

Damn cool to have at least this found out.
I'll try out later if this actually works.
 
How much does Fishing seem to advance by these days? Are there any fishing places with no moving NPCs? (I remember seeing a list or locations with Static NPCs somewhere, but have since lost it).
 
Christian said:
Can anybody tell me a good modest hp grass spread (method J)? (ability doesn't matter since i will rng heatran with it)

I found a modest hp grass 68: 30/29/30/30/31/31

but the frame is high (2960)
Click to expand...
Try these 2:

5d1303dc 102 5ef76e6d MODEST 1 31 26 31 30 31 31 GRASS 70
c502035c 696 cf0a4f77 MODEST 1 31 2 31 30 31 31 GRASS 70
 
Is it possible to sweet scent in the Safari Zone? I ask here because somebody told me it was, but there is no chart for encounter slots in the safari zone.

EDIT: I mean the Great Marsh, I'm going for a Skorupi
So what I mean to ask is what are the encounter slots for the daily binocular pokemon?
 
gameman87 said:
I've been trying Latias recently. There is only one explanation I can think of for the inconsistent monster frames. Its monster frame is prob something like 1 or 5, but NPCs in Vermilion city advance it before steven talks to you. There are no NPCs in the fan club that move randomly, so only NPCs in vermilion could possibly advance it.
Update: I hit the same seed I hit before in one of my attempts. The initial frame was the same as the last time I hit it (7).
Update 2: I've just succeeded in RNG'ing it. Even though the initial frame is not consistent, it appears to be the same for 1 seed every time. I got the same initial frame on my seed twice.
Click to expand...

So in order to successfully RNG for the Latis, we need to calibrate the number of frame advances on said seed. Since it'll most likely be the same advances.

Also, does soft resetting affect the seed or frame advances?

EDIT: Also what method do I use for wild pokemon in HGSS?
 
Romsstar said:
As it seems it is really something about the calls or it least it seems so.
I tried the seed
D120287 which game me the combination:菌 カ し し 菌 カ 菌 カ 菌 消費seed数:0


Elm Call
し：ポケモンの　しんかというのは～
カ：カントーには　まだ　ぼくの～
菌：ポケルスが　くっついた～ウツギ

stand for textes, and the program says this are responses you get from Elm when you call him but I never got any of these responses there must be something I didn't understand yet^^

But the good news after all is: There is a way to verify your seed after all.
I know this is basically nothing, I gotta install Desmume and check that stuff.

Edit: At least I got how it works with the dogs.

Example Seed:
c5150212

c5150208:ライコウ:29　エンテイ:34　ラティ: 4　強制消費seed数:3
c5150209:ライコウ:35　エンテイ:36　ラティ:24　強制消費seed数:3
c515020a:ライコウ:44　エンテイ:39　ラティ: 6　強制消費seed数:3
c515020b:ライコウ:32　エンテイ:43　ラティ:26　強制消費seed数:3
c515020c:ライコウ:38　エンテイ:46　ラティ: 7　強制消費seed数:3
c515020d:ライコウ:29　エンテイ:31　ラティ: 1　強制消費seed数:3
c515020e:ライコウ:35　エンテイ:33　ラティ: 8　強制消費seed数:3
c515020f:ライコウ:43　エンテイ:36　ラティ: 2　強制消費seed数:3
c5150210:ライコウ:32　エンテイ:38　ラティ:10　強制消費seed数:3
c5150211:ライコウ:38　エンテイ:43　ラティ: 4　強制消費seed数:3

given out list.
Raikou, Entei, Lat.
The numbers, mark positions on the map.
The program gives you a map where the numbers stand and by looking at which position the dog is you can verify your seed.

Damn cool to have at least this found out.
I'll try out later if this actually works.
Click to expand...

@mingot: All right, I'm still not really further.
The thing is: The verification with Entei Raikou and lat might be fine but I wanna get how this calls with Elm work.

PHS says there are these three answer patterns:
し：ポケモンの　しんかというのは～ - This one is about Evolutions of Pokemon
カ：カントーには　まだ　ぼくの～ - This one is about Kanto
菌：ポケルスが　くっついた～ - This one tells you about Pokerus.

The thing is: I get none of these but only about his research of Eggs.
Well I'll try further, I just thought I might let you know things I have found out (damn which is basically nothing:()
 
Sweet Scent is advancing by 27 frames for me in HG (or at least I'm moving from frame 7 to frame 34 once the screen goes black), is this normal? I've been hearing numbers like 2-3. :/
 
LaFrozen said:
Sweet Scent is advancing by 27 frames for me in HG (or at least I'm moving from frame 7 to frame 34 once the screen goes black), is this normal? I've been hearing numbers like 2-3. :/
Click to expand...
Is your target the pokemon you are sweet scenting, or are you using sweet scent to just advance the frame?
 
OmegaDonut said:
Did you show him Togepi yet?
Click to expand...
Yeah of course this was the very first thing I thought of.

He doesn't say that he wants me to show him the Egg but just something basic about eggs.
And this is the only answer I can get out of him.xd

Edit: Also a japanese guy ran into the same issue he couldn't get this pokerus message to appear and they answered him that he needs to have a pokemon that was infected with pokerus. gee that sure would make things tough, I'd rather stick then to the Entei/Raikou Verifyer method

Edit2: All right I got now two different messages, (just had to fly to a different city) this is definetely a success.xD But still then there is this Pokerus Message missing. Also, although the messages are different, they are not like the messages PHS actually gives out. If there are ideas of implementing this into RNG Reporter then I suggest it would be very nice to make it work also the other way around. (means, you can input answer patterns and it shows you your seed)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top