New and 'creative' moveset/EV spread thread Mk. 5

Well that's retarded, I figured Synchronize would be at least semi-useful. Oh well, in case you're wondering I only had just thought of using Synchronize, so I hadn't actually run into a sleep lead yet.
Yeah, I was really disappointed too. So I slapped a Lum Berry on my purely offensive version and made it a near-perfect Breloom counter. It also lols at Paraflinch Jirachi and various other status-abusers since Synchronize reflects the status first then the Lum Berry cures you. It's a bit gimmicky but the surprise still hasn't worn off months later:

Alakazam @ Lum Berry
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Nature: Timid
Psychic
Focus Blast
HP [Fire]
Shadow Ball

It lures in Tyranitar and Scizor, in that order, with nearly 100% efficiency, and can OHKO both with Focus Blast and HP [Fire], respectively. Even with the speed drop from HP [Fire] it still outspeeds +1 Ttar. Early in the match, most players will play conservatively with Scizor and either U-turn or Pursuit, giving you a free shot with HP [Fire] for the easy OHKO.

The idea is to bring it in early on something that it can finish off or OHKO directly, then use Focus Blast followed by HP [Fire] to KO Tyranitar then Scizor. Now they are down to half their team, and you have a nearly full health 120 base speed sweeper with the highest special attack allowed in OU and a Lum Berry.

You can really try any item you want, except for a Choice item, since then you will get dismantled by Ttar and Scizor. Expert Belt deserves a mention, since this set gets pretty good SE coverage, as well as Wide Lens, to cut down on the costly Focus Blast misses. Leftovers and Life Orb are useful in their own ways, but they really bring down the surprise value that makes this set such an excellent lure.
 
Revised EV's for Spore Puncher Breloom

Pokemon Name:Breloom

Moveset Name: Spore Puncher
Move 1: Spore
Move 2: Focus Punch
Move 3: Seed Bomb
Move 4: Substitute/Stone Edge
Item: Toxic Orb
Ability: Posion Heal
Nature(s): Adamant
EVs: Ordered 12 HP / 252 Atk / 116 Def / 128 Spe

Obviously this is just the Spore Puncher. But there was a peculiarity with the Spore Puncher EV's that I have a problem with. Originally, the idea with Spore Puncher is to invest 12 EV's into health to get 33 HP recovery from Posion Heal, which is the minimum HP needed to have a round number.

But after that, all the EV's are invested into speed. Now, speed is never a bad thing to have in the OU metagame, and granted, I'm not actually proposing this EV spread should take priority, I'm merely proposing it as an alternate EV spread, meant to maximize Breloom's effectiveness against other common OU pokemon.

The biggest thing to note, is Breloom's lacklust speed only being 70. It's not fast enough to outrun anything in a speed bracket above it, because most often pokemon in the OU metagame with speed higher than 70 invest heavily in speed EV's anyways. The only pokemon faster than Breloom that it is capable of outrunning is a defensive Suicune, which is where the 128 Spe EV's comes from. Assuming Suicune has invested it's last 4 EV's into speed, 128 EV's in speed allow Breloom to hit 208 speed. Which is 1 point higher than Suicune's 207 (given 4 Speed EV's).

The other thing to notice is pokemon slower than (or tied with) Breloom don't invest in speed EV's either. The only pokemon which is particularly worriesome is a Tyranitar which has invested in speed. If you are planning on using Breloom to force switches on a Tyranitar of a speedy moveset, then the extra speed is healpful, though I think you could find some better options.

As Breloom's greatest strength is it's wonderful sleep move, it makes it that much better if Breloom can outrun it's opponents and put them to sleep before they can attack. For this reason, the standard 244 EV's in speed seems justified. But to analyze the metagame, it's a waste of EV's that end up serving no purpose (assuming standard EV's).

So what great trade off can 116 Def EV's give you in exchange for lowering your speed? Well, Breloom's SpD is absolute crudettes, but it's physical defence isn't entirely terrible. The reason it's got such a poor reputation for itself is the fact that no one ever bothers to invest in it. But with 29 Def EV's Breloom's defence reaches 225. Which isn't stellar, but it's better than 196.

The real question is will these extra 29 Defence EV's make the difference? It really depends on what you use Breloom for. I think though interesting, Damage calculations on this are somewhat irrelevant, as there are far too many factors influencing where I think the extra 29 Defence will really count. And that's in the ability to set up a substitute. If in the late game, you have Breloom still alive, but heavily damaged, your ability to potentially set up a substitute could be vital to getting in that all-important spore or attack that could determine the match. And to set up a substitute, Breloom needs a minimum of 67 health. As far as I see it, anything that can help Breloom potentially have 67 health instead of 66, is absolutely worth it, because it means you get an extra turn in, and an extra Spore thrown down.

Now the one thing to keep in mind after all this, is simply that the proposed alternate EV spread only functions under standard EV spreads of other pokemon. But considering the pokemon who are faster than Breloom invest in speed EV's anyways, and the pokemon who are slower don't, to invest all the extra EV's into speed seems a waste.
 
This set may have been mentioned before if it was one of the mods can delete it




Tentacruel-choice specs
move 1-hydro pump
move 2-ice beam
move 3-sludge bomb/giga drain
move 4- hp electric/giga drain
nature-modest/timid
evs 252 satk 252 spe 4 hp
ability-clear body

This tentacruels job is to pretty much surprise the opponent as they switch in Tentacruel's counters which get 2HKOed by a specs hydro pump, although life orb may do the same thing it can't switch in repeadietly into things like heatren's Fire blast. The choice between giga drain and hp electric is if you want to take out Swampert or Empoleon. Also if you think sludge bomb has terrible coverage you can use both.modest or timid is power or speed.

calcs with modest nature
hydro pump vs. defensive rotom 72.4%-85.2% small chance to ko with rocks
hydro pump vs. choice rotom 91.3%-107.5% ko with rocks
hydro pump vs. cm wish jirachi 57.4%-67.8% 2hko
hydro pump vs. scarf jirachi 68.4%-80.4%
hydro pump vs. spiker Skarmory 93.4%-109.9%
hydro pump vs. physically defensive forry 99.4%-117.2%

against empoleon and swampert
hydro pump vs. leadpert 62.9%-72.4% 2HKO
giga drain vs. lead pert 84.2%-100% ohko with 1 layer of spikes and sr
hp electric vs. Defensive Empoleon 40.3%-47.8% it will faint before Tentacruel goes down

I will do calcs for timid nature and sludge bomb calcs if you guys want me to

I am testing it on shoddy with a team that usually gets three layers of spikes and sr up so it's working fairly well, I've found that timid nature is worse than modest.
 
So, I'm thinking about adding a special sweeper Luke to my team, as his movepool and typing seem to fill the niche I'm missing. Thing is, I've already got 2 choice users on the team, and that's the most I like to have at any given time. So, I've been thinking about Luke's Special sweeping capabilities without the use of Specs. I'd love some feedback on these.



Lucario
@ Life Orb
~Inner Focus~
Agility/Metal Sound
Aura Sphere
Shadow Ball
Vacuum Wave


Timid Nature
252 SpA
4 SpD
252 Spe


Basically the idea is to set up, and unfortunately lacking Nasty Plot, the Agility variant works just like a Special-based version of his physical Agility set. As an added bonus, as soon as someone sees Lucario set up an agility, they're going to assume he's running a physical build and switch to a physical wall, which is easily broken down with strong Special Attacks.

Metal Sound is an idea I've been toying with, which would force switches more than set up to outpace people. This obviously gives away Luke's special-based build, but the ability to force switches might be worth the element of surprise. For all of the speed that I'm losing by not using agility, I'm making up for it with hard-hitting Vacuum Waves if I can get a Metal Sound to stick. My main concern with this choice is Lucario's lack of bulk, which doesn't complement the move too well.



Agility is definitely the moveset I'm leaning toward, and it's gotten generally positive outcomes in testing, but I didn't want to forsake the possibility of Metal Sound since this is the creative movesets thread. I just haven't seen it work as well, although granted I haven't tested it as often.

Any tips on these? Maybe some tips on using Metal Sound to greater effect? Or just I just say fuck it and slap Dragon Pulse or HP: Rock in the last slot? Input appreciated.
 
With Agility, you don't have to run anywhere near that amount of speed so you can invest more in Atk and go with Rash to go mixed. Close Combat is more powerful than Aura Sphere, even with a +SpAtk nature, and will help you take out Blissey who you wouldn't be able to beat otherwise. Lucario's main counters and checks are resistant Fighting, anyway, so Aura Sphere won't do more damage to them than Shadow Ball or HP Ice.

With Metal Sound, you should consider running Modest since you have a priority move and most of Lucario's checks and counters will be sure to outspeed Timid variants.

Other than that, I can't see anything wrong with it other than potentially not beating anything that already beats standard Lucario.
 
As DDRMaster said, you still don't beat your standard checks/counters.

Also it should be noted that Lucario really does lack in offensive power [other than his STAB Close Combat], and the SD Set is only powerful because of what Swords Dance does to his attack, Lucario won't be netting too many OHKOs [which he needs!] without a SpA/Atk boosting move, unless you want to go a mixed sweeper. All in all, agility Lucario is actually terrible IMO
 
Been running that same Metal Sound Luke with modest, and it hasn't worked particularly well, since most of Lucario's counters are faster than it or are unphaze by unboosted attacks. Ironically, it's most useful role in my battles with it is as a mediocre revenger with Vacuum Wave.

The other options I'm thinking about over Vacuum Wave are Close Combat and HP Ice CC for Blissey and duping others into thinking it's another set, HP Ice for Gliscor and possible 2HKOs on things like physical Zapdos (not sure if it'll actually 2HKO without stealth rock). The surprise factor is key, because everyone's expecting either SD or Specs.
 
Anti-lead Gardevoir


Timid Nature - Ability Trace
Choice Scarf
252 Sp. Atk / 252 Speed
Shadow Ball
Focus Blast
Will-o-Wisp
Trick

The main purpose of this set is to disable the enemy lead and hopefully achieve a small advantage at the start against many common leads.

Notably, Machamp, Roserade and Heatran are handled by the set thanks to Trace, but it does well against many others as well. The key to the set is outspeeding the enemy, as well as having Trick to mess up other dangerous threats like Swampert if they decide to stay in. Will-o-Wisp is an excellent and underused move on leads, as most anti-leads are physically based or hate having status.


Azelf - Outspeed Sash, Shadow Ball is sometimes an OHKO on Scarf if it stays
Aerodactyl - Outspeed and Trick
Swampert - Outspeeds and Trick Scarf, disabled for the rest of the match, or WOW
Machamp - Outspeeds and predict a switch (Gardevoir? PSYCHIC!) or Trick Scarf
Metagross - Outspeed and WOW
Jirachi - I would switch, totally not worth risking
Infernape - Outspeed and Trick Scarf works, Fire Blast won't OHKO after FO and locks into Rocks otherwise
Ninjask - Switch to a phazer or just attack
Roserade - If you Trace Natural Cure, go for the kill, switch if not or you are asleep
Hippowdon - Outspeed and WOW
Tyranitar - Outspeed and WOW
Dragonite - Outspeed and WOW
Heatran - Traces Flash Fire, blast it with Focus Blast for >83%
Uxie - Shadow Ball dents it or WOW, and it's choice locked if it Tricks Scarf
 

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Baldafor, I don't think your Gardevoir lead is nearly as effective as you're making it out to be. I'll comment on a set that uses Psychic>Shadow Ball, since I've had a glance at the matchups with Shadow Ball and it is useless.

Azelf - it will get Rocks up regardless, and survive Shadow Ball with Focus Sash (not that it particularly needs to, since Shadow Ball only OHKOes a Naive Azelf 18.75% of the time, and never OHKOes non-Naive Azelf). It can still come in later on in the game to Explode, and now you are stuck into Shadow Ball and will get destroyed by any Pursuiter, be it Tyranitar, Scizor, Metagross, Heracross, Snorlax, etc that switches in. Moral - don't use Shadow Ball.

Aerodactyl - an intelligent player will use SR first since the threat of Gardevoir being scarfed and 2HKOing is too great to Taunt. Gardevoir can't use SR, and WoW isn't a threat to a suicide lead like Aero, so it will rarely bother Taunting.

Swampert - Gardevoir does decently, but any other Trick Scarfer does equally as well. Earthquake can do upto 70%.

Machamp - is designed to survive STAB Psychic from base 125 SpA. However, you don't even run it, so the best you can do is either waste its Lum Berry with WoW or make it faster with Scarf. Payback is a clean OHKO on you.

Metagross - many run Lum Berry to deal with Machamp, Roserade, Smeargle, so WoW fails. 75% chance to OHKO you with Meteor Mash alone, let alone Bullet Punch.

Jirachi - you lose.

Infernape - will still get Rocks up, and can come in later on for a shot with Blaze Overheat.

Ninkask - you lose.

Roserade - the only lead that Gardevoir deals with in an impressive way. Trace Natural Cure and waste its sash with Psychic, and then switch to something to kill it. Works quite well.

Hippowdon - burning it isn't a good idea imo since teams that carry hippo tend to carry a cleric too. Much better to give it your scarf. Earthquake hurts you a lot though, being able to do 70+%, and it still gets its Rocks up.

Tyranitar - if it's Phillip's Ttar lead then you're kinda screwed, since it has Lum Berry to negate WoW and your chance of OHKOing with Focus Blast is low + accuracy. And no, Gardevoir cannot take a Crunch.

Dragonite - you WoW it, then have to switch. Meantime it gets 2 basically free Draco Meteors against your team.

Heatran - nice how you trace Flash Fire, but Focus Blast won't OHKO even if Heatran has a -SpD nature, and it will still get its rocks up. You have a 49% chance of connecting with 2 Focus Blasts, meaning odds are in Heatran's favour for both getting Rocks up and then Exploding in your face, or alternatively getting rocks up then switching to Gyarados or Dragonite or whatever and dancing in your face.

Uxie - often Scarfed itself, Shadow Ball does lol damage, burning it doesn't do much, and it will get rocks up. Plus it's faster, too.


So you can see, Gardevoir fares pretty miserably against most of the common leads. Even wore is the fact that the set you were suggesting has very little utility later on in the game, since it has no STAB to capitalize on as a revenge killer, no Thunderbolt to Trace/revenge +1 Gyarados, etc.

The best Gardevoir can do as a lead is something utilizing Taunt / Destiny Bond, and even that is done better by Gallade as it hits the OU tier 100x harder with STAB Close Combat than Gardevoir's Psychic. Gardevoir's cool, but it doesn't work as a lead, sorry.
 

AGILINITE?
54hp/252atk/204speed
Life orb

Agility
Earthquake
Thunderpunch
Outrage

Basically I thought of this idea when I saw a dragonair use agility ingame (lol) and I was like WHAT? DRAGONITE CAN USE AGILITY? So I made a set for it. The speed evs allow it to outrun the bane of this pokemon's existence, scarfed Jirachi after one agility. A speedy Outrage is very devastating late game also.
 

AGILINITE?
54hp/252atk/204speed
Life orb

Agility
Earthquake
Thunderpunch
Outrage

Basically I thought of this idea when I saw a dragonair use agility ingame (lol) and I was like WHAT? DRAGONITE CAN USE AGILITY? So I made a set for it. The speed evs allow it to outrun the bane of this pokemon's existence, scarfed Jirachi after one agility. A speedy Outrage is very devastating late game also.
Why the big font?

Also which of your counters bar ScarfRachi or Scarf Flygon do you beat with this set over a Dragon Dance set? What advantages does Thunder Punch have? It has 150 Base Power when SE, neutral Outrage has 180 base power.
 
Anti-Lead Gallade
@Lum Berry
-Close Combat
-Psycho Cut/Return/Leaf Blade
-Shadow Sneak
-Encore
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 Atk, 212 Spe, 44 HP
I was gonna post an Anti-Lead gallade set, but then I scrolled down to see that you beat me to it :(

Looks like i have to add a twist to my set now


AGILINITE?
54hp/252atk/204speed
Life orb

Agility
Earthquake
Thunderpunch
Outrage


Basically I thought of this idea when I saw a dragonair use agility ingame (lol) and I was like WHAT? DRAGONITE CAN USE AGILITY? So I made a set for it. The speed evs allow it to outrun the bane of this pokemon's existence, scarfed Jirachi after one agility. A speedy Outrage is very devastating late game also.
I am questioning this set's effectiveness. Why use agility when you can use dragon dance? I can understand if the pokemon is extremely slow and needs immediate speed, but dragonite has average speed, and can use dragon dance effectively, plus with salamence gone, dragonite is the next best thing. Thunderpunch does nothing besides the odd gyarados switch in. You're better off with a mixed set with Fire Blast.
 
I've been testing this recently, and although it doesn't seem complex or much different from the standard Dragon Dance sets, it plays a LOT differently:

Dragonite @ Life Orb
Ability: Inner Focus
Nature: Jolly (+Spe, -SpA)
EV: 24 HP / 252 Atk / 236 Spe
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Earthquake / Aqua Tail
- Fire Punch

Dragon Dance is there for the late game, which allows it to sweep teams once you've removed their revenge killers. Outrage is the main STAB here because Dragon Claw doesn't really cut it, and with the Jolly nature Dragonite needs all the help he can get. Earthquake covers Metagross and Jirachi nicely, but it won't OHKO so you might want to go with Aqua Tail to 2HKO Gliscor without locking yourself into Outrage. Fire Punch is there for all of the grass types out there. With a Jolly nature and Life Orb Fire Punch, you can outspeed and OHKO most Breloom variants. It also hits Bronzong and Skarmory for 2HKOs after a DD.

EVs: The EVs are pretty basic. Maximum attack to get the most out of its sweeping capabilities. 236 Speed EVs + Jolly nature allows you to outspeed all Heatran and Adamant Lucario before a Dragon Dance, and Aerodactyl and Jolteon after. The rest went into HP, which nicely allows for a good Life Orb number.

Personally, I find this set a lot more effective than the standard DD sets on the analysis because it suits this new metagame better, imo. The metagame slowed down since Salamence and Latias moved out, which allows Dragonite to take advantage of its decent speed. It can usually get 2-3 kills per game, typically on stuff like Breloom and Heatran not expecting a fast Dragonite. If you manage to keep Stealth Rock off the field (fairly easy to do with leads like Scarf Roserade, LO Starmie, or Aerodactyl) then it can even help revenge kill SD Lucario for you.
 
I've tested this set for a bit, and it works pretty well:

Miltank UU Lead
Miltank @ Leftovers
Jolly - (128 HP/166 Att/216 Speed)
Scrappy
Thunder Wave/Stealth Rock/Return/Brick Break

The goal of this set is simple: Thunder Wave the opponent if you can survive an attack, and Stealth Rock if you can't. It's worked in nearly every battle I've used it in, except the tests in OU. Return is a strong stab move, and Brick Break helps for coverage on Steel and Rock types. Normal Ghosts would completely wall this set, but Miltank's Scrappy takes care of that. Although it doesn't pack a very hard punch, it gets the job done, and can sometimes be used again later in the battle to Paralyze pokemon like Adamant Scyther, Jolly Arcanine, and other slower sweepers.

I also recently started making a OU EV spread (
252 HP/32 Def/176 SpDef/48 Speed, with Careful Nature, and Lum Berry). It survives Machamp's DynamicPunch, Infernape's FakeOut/Close Combat combo, Gengar's Focus Blast, and can Paralyze Sleeping leads like Roserade and Smeargle after Lum Berry wakes it up. However, it has less attacking power, so moves like Counter, Milk Drink, and Seismic Toss could be better options than attacking moves.

EDIT: After a test of OU lead Miltank against Machamp, it Countered Champ's D-Punch, Paralyzed the Switch in, and got up it's rocks.
 
OU anti lead

Moltres @ Choice Scarf
Modest, 4 HP/252 SpA/252 Spe
-Overheat
-Air Slash
-U-turn
-HP Grass/Will-o-wisp/HP Ice
People often overlook Moltres's great stats when looking at it's x4 SR weakness,
but this lead can beat most of todays common OU leads.
Overheat can beat Skarmary, Forretress, Metagross, Roserade, Azelf, Weavile, Celebi, Jirachi, and Abomasnow,
Air Slash can take out Machamp and Breloom, (10% to OHKO), and gets great coverage lategame.
U-turn lets you switch out of a bad match up, also letting you scout your opponents team.
HP Grass is there to take are of Swampert, who otherwise walls you.
Will-o-Wisp allows you ruin physical sweeper, which is very useful, and HP Ice can take care of Nite or Flygon.
Scizor is a good teammate for this set, as you can u-turn out of Aerodactyl, and the bullet punch it. (You can do much the same with most leads).
There used to be a UU anti-lead similar to this, but it was taken off site. This set is more aimed towards OU, as well.
As Fatecrashers pointed out, Swampert also pairs well with Moltres, and is can get rocks up and counter Heatran, who walls you.
 
Forretress @ leftovers
252hp/252Atk/4def

Rapid Spin
Earthquake/Explosion
Payback
Substitute

This set is similar to the physically defensive set with a major difference: it has substitute instead of spikes. This is a good set for a team that already gets stealth rock out reliably and does not require spikes, but badly needs a good rapid spinner because of a weakness to sr, spikes, or tspikes. This set allows forretress to be a completely reliable spinner, since it can take on any spin blocker that isn't a defensive rotom-h or dusknoir running fire punch. Since it gets a free turn to scout their attack because of sub, it leaves an easy predict for fire resistant pokes like heatran or suicune to come in on the 3x%-4x% damaged ghosts and finish the job, allowing forretress to come back in another time and spin. The sub comes in handy most against opponents like gengar or speed invested rotom forms, where they could OHKO you after correctly predicting your rapid spin. Leading with a payback means that if it's an infernape or heatran switch you're in big trouble. With a sub, forretress has almost 100% odds of OHKOing infernape after SR damage, and 100% to ohko scarfed heatran. Shuca berry heatran takes considerably less, but can't be used many times as a counter and allows an easy rapid spin then predict. Explosion can be used if your team fears gyarados, dragonite, or other bulky setup as it prevents future problems from them and still gives you the turn while they set up to get off a rapid spin from behind a sub.

The biggest problems to this set are bulky rotom-h and dusknior, both only because of fire-type attacks. This means that probably the best friends of forretress are pokemon that outspeed these two, and can deal the 70% damage necessary to KO them. Heatran, infernape, suicune and mixnite are all very good choices to take that fire damage, retaliate with a ohko, and possibly even cause more damage.
 
Ok, so I've been reworking the EV spread for the HeaTrap set. The original spread was built with surviving MixMence's EQ after Stealth Rock damage. With Salamence gone, however, Heatran does not need to be EV'd as such.

The two common Dragonite sets that Heatran should try to beat are MixNite and DDNite. Incidentally, both have very similar speed stats, with MixNite sitting at 246 and DDNite sitting at 247. Note that it is useless to use Heatran against CBNite, as EQ easily OHKOs past Shuca with some SR damage.

With this in mind, the new EV spread I've worked out for HeaTrap is Modest 66 HP / 212 SpA / 232 Spe. 232 Speed EVs put Heatran at 248 speed, outspeeding both DDNite and MixNite. 212 Special Attack EVs are from the former set, which grants Heatran all the necessary KOs from before.

I'm not so sure where the remaining 66 EVs should go. HP would increase bulk, but Attack would boost the power of Explosion.

Thoughts?

Also, Shuca Berry does not need to be used anymore as Dragonite won't be hitting Heatran with an EQ in the first place.
 
I'm not so sure where the remaining 66 EVs should go. HP would increase bulk, but Attack would boost the power of Explosion.

Thoughts?

Also, Shuca Berry does not need to be used anymore as Dragonite won't be hitting Heatran with an EQ in the first place.
Two things. First, I suppose you can take the Shuca off in exchange for something like Life Orb or Leftovers, but there are still lots of pokemon that pack ground attacks to take you out. I would probably keep Shuca unless you need the extra power.

For the EVs, I would probably put them into Sp. Atk. to improve your chances at hitting switch-ins with. The HP EV's are an interesting idea if you can EV Heatran to survive common attacks like Timid LO Starmie's Surf or Hydro Pump after a couple Stealth Rocks or something like that, but do the calcs to even see if that's possible.
 
I would put the 66 left over into HP for that set. Keep in mind Explosion halves your opponent's Defense and there aren't very many things Heatran is afraid of throwing SpA at, the first one that comes to mind is Blissey, which to the best of my knowledge will not survive an Explosion from Modest Heatran unless it's a physically defensive set.

Edit: Blissey will only survive Modest Shuca Berry 0 Atk Heatran Explosion if it is Bold 252 HP 200+ Def. With a Life Orb, you are almost guaranteed the 1HKO against 252 HP 252 Def Bold Blissey

I was trying to make a Swalot set to counter Breloom and that works wonderfully, but when I tried to make it do anyting else it failed completely. All it can do is counter Breloom, Encore, and make 101 HP Substitutes. I don't think Swalot is cut out for any niche in OU, has anyone else tried to fit Swalot in?
 
AgiliNite just lacks raw power, like Rock Polish Ttar and Agility Lucario. It does outspeed its fast scarfed counters like Jirachi/Flygon/Infernape/Heatran with Dragon Pulse. What stops it from being like AgiliGross and Rock Polish Rhyperior is the fact that it cannot take hits and outspeed for the 2HKO like these 2 can. It still can, however, attempt to run an extremely defensive set like the ClericNite or ClericDancer but it still lacks raw power. Hence, I think it can be used well, just only as a late-game sweeper with a LOT of wallbreaking support.
 
for the forretress set a few posts back, im a little worried about not being able to spike at all. it seems this forretress is trying to be much more offensive which makes me wonder why i can't just use starmie who can hp ghosts on the switch-in. "lucario" might not be able to set up on you, but stuff like gyarados still is and no spikes really hurts the utility of forry =[
 
I've been using this set for a while now, and mostly it works well. Somehow, it's an extremely good Swampert killer.



Crobat @ Leftovers
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Mean Look
- Toxic
- Confuse Ray
- Fly

It works well as a revenge killer, not as a switch in, unless you predict a ground type attack.
Confuse on the first turn. Most people don't switch out then. If you know Crobat can take hits from the opposing Pokémon well, trap them with Mean Look, otherwise just poison them, and trap them in the next turn. Than spam Fly, while lefties recover the token hits. It the opponent snaps out of it's confusion, confuse again, and wait for the toxic to do its work while it misses its attacks or hurts itself.
 
Steel steel and more steel. Swampert has Ice Beam, which IIRC is 2HKO. Is 252 Atk really needed, as I believe Fly is there to stall, not to deal damage. And seriously Adamant nature? If anything, the set would be better with a build like this.

Crobat @ Leftovers
Jolly
EVs: 168 HP / 88 Def / 252 Spe
Moves:
~Super Fang
~Toxic
~Taunt / Mean Look
~Fly / U-Turn

Haven't tested it or anything, but it would probably work better.
 
you are rarely ever going to want fly on this set. if something needs one extra turn to die of poison, it would just be koed by brave bird anyway. u-turn or bb would be much better in those last slots. fly lets too many pokemon get a free turn to come in, like rotom, zapdos, etc. if they can predict well, it really can hurt you fairly bad.

as for the mean look trapper, you might as well run roost over fly. crobat wants survivability, especially if its mean look toxic/confuse trapping. i don't think the set is really worth it, but roost is certainly an improvement over fly.
 
Thanks for the replies. I'm not convinced to throw away Confuse Ray though. I'll try a few battles with this set and see what it gives.

Crobat @ Leftovers
Jolly
EVs: 168 HP / 88 Def / 252 Spe
Moves:
~Confuse Ray
~Toxic
~Mean Look
~Roost
 

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