np: OU Suspect Testing Round 1 - ...wait, I'm not Jumpman16!

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I've found Dory to be quite managable. It can be forced out so easily and can't switch into any damaging move (except Earthquake, but not if Balloon pops).

Quite frankly, Dory is underwhelming to me. Now it could be that none of my opponents have used Dory correctly, but what are the odds that in all of GenV, I don't encounter a single properly-used Dory?
 
I agree with this. I have been saying on IRC in every tiering discussion I'm involved in that you know the metagame is a clusterfuck when perpetually Uber Pokemon (such as Wobbuffet) aren't even in the discussion.
That being said, I'd like to repost a few things from before from me.

(from a few pages ago)
I say that we make a decision about weather and other obvious and settle the questionable pokemon next round.
MY THOUGHTS ON EACH POKE (threat level is out of five)


MANAPHY
Threat level: ***** (in the rain) or ** (outside of rain)
Manaphy is truly a menace in the rain. With the ability to get +3 in a single turn, to completely heal itself, be immune to all status, get a STAB boost, and be incredibly bulky, this thing is extremely broken. The only problem is the rain. There are discussions for banning Politoed/Drizzle, so rain may not be such an issue. If one of these is banned, Manaphy becomes much less of a threat. Outside of the rain, Manaphy is a bulky, powerful, special sweeper, but it isn't too difficult because it can't heal itself and it's very prone to status
VERDICT: Politoed and Manaphy cannot be together in the same metagame. If Politoed is banned, keep Manaphy. If not, ban it. Definitely leaning towards banning Manaphy and not Politoed though.


DARKRAI
Threat level: ***
Isn't it a bitch when Darkrai puts one of your pokemon to sleep, and then just uses Nasty Plot on the switch? Darkrai is certainly a powerful pokemon with plenty of set up oppurtunities and is capable of 6-0'ing unprepared teams. The problem is that most teams are prepared. With Dory running around, every single team needs some kind of strong priority. In most cases, it's a mach punch, which will undoubtedly OHKO Darkrai, but even less powerful moves will probably take care of Darkrai. If your team has huge problems with Darkrai, you're really not prepared for this metagame.
VERDICT: Don't ban it, the current metagame weakens it a lot.


DOEXYS-A
Threat level: *****
Okay, this thing is really a problem. This needs to go. Not only is Deoxys-A faster than most Choice Scarf users, but it's really powerful too. After subbing once, it will pretty much destroy you. It's true that it's ridiculously frail, but if it outspeeds and OHKO's most pokemon on your team, then it really doesn't matter.
VERDICT: Ban it now.


DEOXYS-D
Threat level: *
Seriously, Deoxys-D really isn't too bad. There are many powerful wall breakers that can completely destroy it. Its defensive stats are pretty good, but its low HP lets it down. It's a great supporter with Spikes and all, but it just doesn't cut it. I don't see any reason why Deoxys-D can't stay in OU. Hell, even Registeel is bulkier than it and has better typing, yet that was in UU last gen.
VERDICT: Keep it in OU.


DEOXYS-S
Threat level: ***
Suicide leads really aren't as good as they were last gen. Deoxys-S fails to take care of some of the bulkier leads like Politoed and Hippowdon. Deoxys-S is destroyed by priority Taunt, which is a common anti-lead strategy. Furthermore, Espeon renders Deoxys-S useless. Don't get me wrong, Deoxy-S is a great lead, especially if your team needs spikes, but it's nowhere near as broken as it was last gen.
VERDICT: Keep it in OU.


MEW
Threat level: ***
Mew is a very well-rounded pokemon that really didn't change much in the generation shift. Mew was pretty good last gen, and still is this gen. The only thing is, there is really nothing too great about it anymore. It's nice that it can learn all the TMs and be a great baton passers, but other baton passers like Shell Smash Smeargle or Speed Boost Blaziken are just simply better. Mew can be a great support pokemon with TWave, SR and Taunt, but it doesn't stand out too much this generation and rounds out the OU tier nicely.
VERDICT: Keep it in OU.


LATIAS
Threat level: ***
Latias is a dangerous pokemon that can wreak havoc on the opponent's team. Aside from that, I still believe that it isn't too broken and can remain in OU for now. There are many pokemon capable of checking and countering it, and it really deosnt' pose as much of a threat now with powerful walls like Nattorei and Burungeru. Latias may still be a good pokemon, but it's not the monster it was in OU last Gen.
VERDICT: Let's keep it in OU for now.


LATIOS
Threat level: ****
Um, this guy's a different story. Latios is essentially everything Latias is, just amplified. Latias is a much scarier sweeper, and although it isn't nearly as bulky, it makes up for this by being better able to eliminate many of its counters. TrickSpecs or TrickScarf sets are particularly annoying and dangerous. Nevertheless, Latios hasn't really turned the OU tier upside-down as one might expect. The metagame seems to be doing fine with Latios, and I don't believe it's broken enough to warrant a ban.
VERDICT: On the fence a little, but leaning towards OU.


SKYMIN
Threat level: ****
There's a huge debate over Skymin, and it is true that Skymin is a ridiculous sweeper. Nothing can safely switch in due to Seed Flare's 80% special defense drop rate, allowing Skymin to choose the attack of its choice to finish you off. Its fast Air Slashes are tough to deal with and are guaranteed to cause a ragequit or two. Alternitively, it can run a SubSeed set that stalls out the opponent. There are two reasons why I believe that Skymin should not be banned, however. The first is Jarooda. Jarooda's Leaf Storm is very similar to Skymin's Seed Flare. Jarooda's Leaf Storm allows it to raise its special attack, making it easier to finish off the switch in just like Skymin's Seed Flare. Yet, we do not consider Jarooda anything near broken. Now, I understand that Perversity Jarooda hasn't been released yet, and that Skymin and Jarooda have very different stats, but they are still comparable. The second reason is outclassment as a subseeder. Erufuun is the subseeder of this generation, hands down. There are no other pokemon who do it better, including Skymin. With Erufuun running around, there is really no reason to use Skymin as a subseeder anymore. I understand that Skymin's offensive set is still incredibly dangerous, but i don't believe it's enough to warrant a ban.
VERDICT: Fairly undecided, but currently OU.


WOBBUFFET
Threat level: **
Wobbuffet is an odd pokemon in the sense that its performance is based entirely on those around it. Wobbuffet is used to counter/mirror coat pokemon it's against, encore non-damaging moves and to give that free turn to its teamate. Yet I feel like the brokeness of Wobbuffet is determined by the brokeness of its teamate. For example, if Wobby is being used to help set up a CM Spinda, then that's one story. If it's being used to set up a Kingdra in the rain, that's another. Wobbuffet really shouldn't have a tier in my mind, as its performance is the same in all tiers.
VERDICT: Definitely keep in OU for now, but I'd like to see Wobby in UU or even NU.


POLITOED
Threat level: *****
I think rain is the most dangerous of the weathers as it is capable of being bulky and deadly at the same time. Politoed is therefore the ultimate supporter for this playstyle. There are some saying that we need to ban Kingdra and some of the other sweepers, but there really is no way to cut down on rain's current brokeness except to ban Politoed or Drizzle. Sure, there are counters, but there are only a few and rain teams know how to seek them out and to eliminate them. I'd say that rain is an extremely broken playstyle and something needs to be done about it.
VERDICT: Politoed can be a bitch, but I believe it's only because of Manaphy. Let's see how things go with Manaphy banned and if rain is still overpowered, we'll ban Drizzle as well.


NINETALES
Threat level: ***
Sun teams are strong, don't get me wrong, but they pale in comparison to sand and rain. Sun teams aren't as broken as rain, and they really aren't too much of a problem. Chlorophyl can be just as much of a bitch as Swift Swim or Sand Throw, but it's really not the same thing. Sun can be handled easily, and there's really no reason for Ninetales to go to Ubers.
VERDICT: Keep it in OU.


INCONSISTENT
Threat level: *****
Inconsistent is by far the cheapest way to win a battle. It has no strategy, no counters, and no skill. There is no way I'm going to play with Inconsistent on the filed.
VERDICT: Ban the ability, because none of these pokemon are anywhere near broken besides their ability.




Now everyone pick apart and argue every single piece of this, because I know you will.
 
I've found Dory to be quite managable. It can be forced out so easily and can't switch into any damaging move (except Earthquake, but not if Balloon pops).

Quite frankly, Dory is underwhelming to me. Now it could be that none of my opponents have used Dory correctly, but what are the odds that in all of GenV, I don't encounter a single properly-used Dory?

Dory is ridiculous, Roobushin and Skarmory are about the only pokes that can safely switch into him while sand is up. I expect a ban on him, but not anytime soon. I think the main focus should be on the more obvious broken mons such as Inconsistent users, Darkrai, Skymin-S, and Deoxys forms.
 
sax king it is very difficult to take the post you keep referencing seriously; many of the arguments are flawed and you pull contexts from everywhere in support of your claims, but ignore those contexts when they might hurt your argument. But hey you got your wish, time to pick this apart.

MANAPHY
Threat level: ***** (in the rain) or ** (outside of rain)

Manaphy is truly a menace in the rain. With the ability to get +3 in a single turn, to completely heal itself, be immune to all status, get a STAB boost, and be incredibly bulky, this thing is extremely broken.
Firstly I just want to mention that the way you started off this argument, you're stating all these attributes Manaphy has with zero relation to how it perforoms in battle (ie theorymon); remember that it can't do everything in one turn. Secondly, the fact that you consider a pokemon with 100/100/100 defenses, excellent defensive and offensive typing, and the ability to get a +3 boost in one turn with practically unresisted coverage as "2 star threat" is ridiculous. It's very likely you haven't faced a Manaphy out of the rain, but that doesn't mean it's hardly a threat (lower than everything else you seemingly want discussed).

Darkrai
Threat level: ***
sn't it a bitch when Darkrai puts one of your pokemon to sleep, and then just uses Nasty Plot on the switch? Darkrai is certainly a powerful pokemon with plenty of set up oppurtunities and is capable of 6-0'ing unprepared teams. The problem is that most teams are prepared. With Dory running around, every single team needs some kind of strong priority. In most cases, it's a mach punch, which will undoubtedly OHKO Darkrai, but even less powerful moves will probably take care of Darkrai. If your team has Darkrai troubles, you really aren't prepared for this metagame.
The fact that Darkrai can completely incapacitate one of your pokemon with little to no risk says enough about him. You can't immediately switch to your counter because they risk getting put to sleep, meaning that even if the move misses they have another shot; and if you happened to sacrifice something that can't hurt Darkrai, it can set up without sleeping you. Relying solely on priority to handle Darkrai is poor, but this has already been pointed out (Darkrai can take a max attack Roobushin Mach Punch). Just because you can handle Dory does not mean you can handle Darkrai.

"If your team has Deoxys-A/Shaymin-S/Inconsistent troubles, you really aren't prepared for this metagame." That logic is sort of ridiculous, BUT it holds true to some degree so I'll let it slide. You should adjust to the metagame; it should not adjust to you. However you don't get to pick and choose which suspects you want this to apply to; if you think Darkrai is fine by this logic then so is everything else.

DOEXYS-A
Threat level: *****
Okay, this thing is really a problem. This needs to go. Not only is Deoxys-A faster than most Choice Scarf users, but it's really powerful too. After subbing once, it will pretty much destroy you. It's true that it's ridiculously frail, but if it outspeeds and OHKO's most pokemon on your team, then it really doesn't matter.
VERDICT: Ban it now.
If Deoxys-A is OHKOing everything on your team, you might need to go back to the drawing board because things like Lucario can be just as devastating. Deoxys-A isn't nearly as powerful as you think it is (again, calling theorymon). And going back to Darkrai one more time, you don't get to pick and choose where the "if it beats you then you aren't prepared." That applies for Deoxys as much as as it does for Darkrai.

DEOXYS-D
Threat level: *
Seriously, Deoxys-D really isn't too bad. There are many powerful wall breakers that can completely destroy it. Its defensive stats are pretty good, but its low HP lets it down. It lacks reliable recovery, even though it has good stat boosting moves. It's a great supporter with Spikes and all, but it just doesn't cut it. I don't see any reason why Deoxys-D can't stay in OU. Hell, even Registeel is bulkier than it and has better typing, yet that was in UU last gen.
Once again I going out on a limb to call you out on the grounds of "I haven't seen it or seen much discussion of it so it's legit." You say it lacks reliable recovery when it has Recover ffs. Additionally, you say it's not as bulky as Registeel which was UU last gen (completely irrelevant), when Registeel doesn't have any support options while Deoxys has every support move known to man. (hint: Deoxys has always been more controversial for its movepool than its stats)

DEOXYS-S
Threat level: ***
Suicide leads really aren't as good as they were last gen. Deoxys-S fails to take care of some of the bulkier leads like Politoed and Hippowdon. Deoxys-S is destroyed by priority Taunt, which is a common anti-lead strategy. Furthermore, Espeon renders Deoxys-S useless. Don't get me wrong, Deoxy-S is a great lead, especially if your team needs spikes, but it's nowhere near as broken as it was last gen.
Deoxys-S has ridiculous utility beyond the lead position; you act like it's condemned there. Deoxys-S has the ability to stop any frail sweeper cold with it's ridiculous speed and decent attack+bulk. On top of all of this you have his signature movepool. Severely hindered by 4-moveslots, but this is the Deoxys Forme of choice imo.

MEW
Threat level: ***
Mew is a very well-rounded pokemon that really didn't change much in the generation shift. Mew was pretty good last gen, and still is this gen. The only thing is, there is really nothing too great about it anymore. It's nice that it can learn all the TMs and be a great baton passers, but other baton passers like Shell Smash Smeargle or Speed Boost Blaziken are just simply better. Mew can be a great support pokemon with TWave, SR and Taunt, but it doesn't stand out too much this generation and rounds out the OU tier nicely.
I don't know where the "rounds out the OU tier nicely" comment comes from, you just spent the whole paragraph saying it's outclassed. Beyond that I doubt we've seen the true potential of Mew at play because there's focus on other pokemon right now.

LATIAS
Threat level: ***
Latias is a dangerous pokemon that can wreak havoc on the opponent's team. Aside from that, I still believe that it isn't too broken and can remain in OU for now. There are many pokemon capable of checking and countering it, and it really deosnt' pose as much of a threat now with powerful walls like Nattorei and Burungeru. Latias may still be a good pokemon, but it's not the monster it was in OU last Gen.
I like that you rate Latias above Manaphy out of the rain. The only reason she's "not the monster it was last Gen" is because there are much more ridiculously pokemon, so I'm not even sure why you brought her up. Hell your intention is to "focus on questionable pokemon"...looks to me like you're grabbing everything from last Gen. But then where's Garchomp? Salamence?

LATIOS
Threat level: ****
Um, this guy's a different story. Latios is essentially everything Latias is, just amplified. Latias is a much scarier sweeper, and although it isn't nearly as bulky, it makes up for this by being better able to eliminate many of its counters. TrickSpecs or TrickScarf sets are particularly annoying and dangerous. Nevertheless, Latios hasn't really turned the OU tier upside-down as one might expect. The metagame seems to be doing fine with Latios, and I don't believe it's broken enough to warrant a ban.
If Latios is Latias++, still don't know why you even brought her up..and if your assessment is that "he's strong but there are scarier things" I'm not sure why you brought him up either. Has anybody even questioned his tiering at this point?

SKYMIN
Threat level: ****
There's a huge debate over Skymin, and it is true that Skymin is a ridiculous sweeper. Nothing can safely switch in due to Seed Flare's 80% special defense drop rate, allowing Skymin to choose the attack of its choice to finish you off. Its fast Air Slashes are tough to deal with and are guaranteed to cause a ragequit or two. Alternitively, it can run a SubSeed set that stalls out the opponent. There are two reasons why I believe that Skymin should not be banned, however. The first is Jarooda. Jarooda's Leaf Storm is very similar to Skymin's Seed Flare. Jarooda's Leaf Storm allows it to raise its special attack, making it easier to finish off the switch in just like Skymin's Seed Flare. Yet, we do not consider Jarooda anything near broken. Now, I understand that Perversity Jarooda hasn't been released yet, and that Skymin and Jarooda have very different stats, but they are still comparable. The second reason is outclassment as a subseeder. Erufuun is the subseeder of this generation, hands down. There are no other pokemon who do it better, including Skymin. With Erufuun running around, there is really no reason to use Skymin as a subseeder anymore. I understand that Skymin's offensive set is still incredibly dangerous, but i don't believe it's enough to warrant a ban.
Please read the bold and tell me you just facedesked, hard. Seriously one of your reasons is that we don't consider a pokemon that's not even in the metagame broken? Moving past the bold, they are not still comparable; after Jarooda uses Leaf Storm...what's it going to do? Shaymin-S has Air Slash to fall back on, and in many instances it is going to pay off BIG. Now your second reason about Erufuun being a better subseeder...it is if you want it to sit there. Believe it or not subseeding does not consist of hitting the substitute button. Shaymin-S not only has the Speed to subseed effectively, but it also has the Special Attack combined with a 60% flinch move to buy turns and weather the opponent down more.


WOBBUFFET
Threat level: **
Wobbuffet is an odd pokemon in the sense that its performance is based entirely on those around it. Wobbuffet is used to counter/mirror coat pokemon it's against, encore non-damaging moves and to give that free turn to its teamate. Yet I feel like the brokeness of Wobbuffet is determined by the brokeness of its teamate. For example, if Wobby is being used to help set up a CM Spinda, then that's one story. If it's being used to set up a Kingdra in the rain, that's another. Wobbuffet really shouldn't have a tier in my mind, as its performance is the same in all tiers.
VERDICT: Definitely keep in OU for now, but I'd like to see Wobby in UU or even NU.
The verdict here is really what made me feel the need to comment. That is NOT the way tiers work, and if you don't have a basic understanding of that. We do not and can not tier pokemon by their ability in a tier. If Smeargle is used enough to break into OU but is not broken in UU, we do not continue to allow it in UU. Secondly your example is ridiculous and you know it; you're implying that every pokemon can benefit from a turn of set up via Wobbuffet is broken, not Wobbuffet itself. But between all of these pokemon, what's the one thing they have in common? Wobbuffet. None of them are broken by their lonesome. You're making a bad argument here, you'd rather ban the beneficiary (of which there are many) than the benefactor.

Now, I don't necessarily think Wobbuffet is uber or that the single turn of setup is a big deal, but your argument is awful.

POLITOED
Threat level: *****
I think rain is the most dangerous of the weathers as it is capable of being bulky and deadly at the same time. Politoed is therefore the ultimate supporter for this playstyle. There are some saying that we need to ban Kingdra and some of the other sweepers, but there really is no way to cut down on rain's current brokeness except to ban Politoed or Drizzle. Sure, there are counters, but there are only a few and rain teams know how to seek them out and to eliminate them. I'd say that rain is an extremely broken playstyle and something needs to be done about it.

---

NINETALES
Threat level: ***
Sun teams are strong, don't get me wrong, but they pale in comparison to sand and rain. Sun teams aren't as broken as rain, and they really aren't too much of a problem. Chlorophyl can be just as much of a bitch as Swift Swim or Sand Throw, but it's really not the same thing. Sun can be handled easily, and there's really no reason for Ninetales to go to Ubers.
Not sure why you listed Politoed instead of Drizzle right there when you list Inconsistent later. Also I'd argue that Sun is equally as dangerous as rain; saying sun is kosher because rain is better isn't legitimate.

DORYUUZU
Threat level: **
Doryuuzu is dangerous, but guys, let's face it. It has a decent amount of counters. It's not overpowered. There are clear ways to take it down. If you are whining about Doryuuzu sweeping your team, I suggest that you A) Grow a pair, and B) Find something that can handle Doryuuzu.
Again you don't get to pick and choose which suspects you think people should get used to and which ones you don't want to handle. Why don't you "grow a pair" and handle Deoxys-A? You hardly go into any detail with this guy, your whole paragraph echoing "lol." "A decent amount of counters" is rather vague, considering he has less than Latios and and frankly Doryuuzu has the easiest time of all pokemon pulling off an end game sweep, very similar to Deoxys-S in DP (before the lead craze).



INCONSISTENT
Threat level: *****
Inconsistent is by far the cheapest way to win a battle. It has no strategy, no counters, and no skill. There is no way I'm going to play with Inconsistent on the filed.
Very poor attitude, the same one I've called you on in a few of your other paragraphs. It doesn't matter if it's the "cheapest" way to win a battle, and it most definitely does not matter if "there is no way you're going to play with Inconsistent." It's on the very same level as people that whine when you use legendaries. Come up with an actual argument and we'll talk, but you quite literally say "Waaah" and put your verdict on it.


Nearly everything you posted is balderdash, and this is not how arguments go. You did one of these three each time:

1) Liked something or could handle it, so you said it should be OU. You downplayed their impact on the metagame and told people to get over it. Likely that your team has no issue with them.
2) Hated something or could handle it, so you want it gone. These arguments got worse as you went down the page; you literally started just saying "I refuse" and demanded it be banned else you quit.
3) Made illegitimate comparisons, such as your Shaymin-S argument. You either said because one pokemon isn't broken that this one isn't, or claimed that because one thing is broken the other isn't (rain/sun).

Arguments and suspect tests alike do not work like that. To reference your own quote one last time, "If your team has <suspect> troubles, you really aren't prepared for this metagame." Your "discussion" post is either telling people "deal with it," "get rid of it," or "eh this is ok why not this?" Now will you please stop trying to reference your post? I understand you put a lot of time into it but note that I put a lot of time into this one, and you're only digging yourself a deeper hole. Your arguments are weak and flawed, and frankly you're just trying to shove your opinions on others by trying to get them to respond. You've laid your opinion out of the table, but unfortunately you did it in such a way that discussion is not going to spawn from it.

Note I only argued the points given, I did not (intentionally) reflect or respond with my personal opinion of each suspect.


Anyway, if we know he's going to be banned, why not now?
How do you know? That's a pretty heavy claim to be making.
 

SJCrew

Believer, going on a journey...
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Anyway, if we know he's going to be banned, why not now?
The metagame is a mess. It's very hard to get accurate data on it when we've got so much shit to prepare for that we can't tell whether it's a product of him being overpowered or the general metagame being imbalanced. Dory is a more complicated case that's best addressed later.
 
Dory is indeed hella powerful. I don't have a lot of problems with it though. Technitop eats it for breakfast, as well as dealing with a lot of other problem pokes (Darkrai, Deoxys, Latios, Skymin after rocks, and too many others to count.)

Full Health Hippo can often take it out. Unboosted Earthquakes do laughable. Boosted won't ohko. You can just (Insert Fang of Choice) and earthquake it down. Hippo is ridiculously useful as a physical sponge anyways, and does a number of dragons of all varieties.

The amazingly useful Balloon Magnezone can also be a complete and utter pain for Dory. First Magnet Rise while they pop your balloon, then Knock it out with Hidden Power Fire. Zone singlehandedly destroys nearly every single Steel in the format, as well as being a workhorse against rain teams.
 
It might be a bit of a stupid idea, but Magnet Rise Steelix might also be a counter to Doryuuzu. If you know your opponent has a Doryuuzu waiting, switch into something Steelix walls, and as your opponent switches in their Doryuuzu, you Magnet Rise. Doryuuzu's only coverage move that will damage Steelix is Brick Break, but most people prefer Shadow Claw/X-Scissor/Return/Rock Slide, all of which are resisted by Steelix, and backed up by a 200 Defense stat, it won't do much. Steelix in return can Earthquake it to death, or if a Balloon needs to be popped, Gyro Ball first.

Possible set:

Steelix @ Balloon
Nature and EVs of choice, to match the rest of your team
- Magnet Rise
- Earthquake / Aqua Tail
- Gyro Ball
- Explosion / Stealth Rock

Works in a similar way as Balloon Magnezone. Magnet Rise while they pop your Balloon, then use Gyro Ball followed by Earthquake. You can also use Aqua Tail as you don't have to Gyro Ball first, but outside of that it doesn't have to much use. Last slot is again preference of what your team needs. Might be a bit gimmicky, but I thing it can work semi-well as a Doryuuzu-counter/Stealth Rocker.
 

shrang

General Kenobi
is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
I beg to differ. The uber tier is no longer a simple banlist where you put obviously broken things like Gen 1 Mewtwo, it's definitely more than that. There is a difference between "broken" and "few counters". I personally find it to be far more balanced than OU.
I doesn't matter if appears more balanced, the point is that the Ubers is not supposed to be balanced.
 
It might be a bit of a stupid idea, but Magnet Rise Steelix might also be a counter to Doryuuzu. If you know your opponent has a Doryuuzu waiting, switch into something Steelix walls, and as your opponent switches in their Doryuuzu, you Magnet Rise. Doryuuzu's only coverage move that will damage Steelix is Brick Break, but most people prefer Shadow Claw/X-Scissor/Return/Rock Slide, all of which are resisted by Steelix, and backed up by a 200 Defense stat, it won't do much. Steelix in return can Earthquake it to death, or if a Balloon needs to be popped, Gyro Ball first.

Possible set:

Steelix @ Balloon
Nature and EVs of choice, to match the rest of your team
- Magnet Rise
- Earthquake / Aqua Tail
- Gyro Ball
- Explosion / Stealth Rock

Works in a similar way as Balloon Magnezone. Magnet Rise while they pop your Balloon, then use Gyro Ball followed by Earthquake. You can also use Aqua Tail as you don't have to Gyro Ball first, but outside of that it doesn't have to much use. Last slot is again preference of what your team needs. Might be a bit gimmicky, but I thing it can work semi-well as a Doryuuzu-counter/Stealth Rocker.
The main reason you'r using Magnezone is because it can Trap Dory and make sure it just can't switch out and wait till *Insert Dory Counter/Check here* Dies.If simply beating it with Balloon is what your looking for id much rather go with something like Terakion who can also set up with Rock Polish in the process while Dory breaks the Balloon.

And im still somewhat unsure about the Dory argument.You cant justify it being broken because it dsn't have any counters but it is particularly troublesome to handle and causes quite a bit of unhealthy centralization.I doubt Randorosu or the other abusers would be able to pull off such a feat if Dory was gone.I mean its not even funny how many Sandstorm teams you see when you hit a decent rank in leaderboard..

I still however think this is somewhat too early and would be quite rash to ban it outright and matters such as these should be left alone for now.Sjcrew explained it quite clearly.
 

Nastyjungle

JACKED and sassy
is a Top Artist Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnus
I beg to differ. The uber tier is no longer a simple banlist where you put obviously broken things like Gen 1 Mewtwo, it's definitely more than that. There is a difference between "broken" and "few counters". I personally find it to be far more balanced than OU.
How can you beg to differ? Ubers isn't anything more than a banlist; if it's too strong for OU, but gets it shit kicked around in Ubers, it still belongs in Ubers.
You can't look at it like Ubers is a real tier, because it isn't. It's just a place where every single Pokemon is allowed. And just because it isn't on-par with Kyogre doesn't mean it isn't too strong for OU.
 
"If your team has Deoxys-A/Shaymin-S/Inconsistent troubles, you really aren't prepared for this metagame." That logic is sort of ridiculous, BUT it holds true to some degree so I'll let it slide. You should adjust to the metagame; it should not adjust to you. However you don't get to pick and choose which suspects you want this to apply to; if you think Darkrai is fine by this logic then so is everything else.
Wait, you're claiming that everyone should run Mooaberu @ lefties/lo with clear smog, spore, and 2 ~? Because every team in existence without that has "Inconsistent troubles". Unless you have some super techy counter nobody told me about?

edit: which dies to shaymin-s ftr
 
Doryuuzu@Balloon (252 EVs, +Nature, +2) Earthquake vs Azumarill@Choice Band (0/0 EVs, Neutral Nature): 65.1 ~ 76.8% (222 ~ 262 HP) (Sandstorm)

Because after a +2 EQ, SR, and two turns of Sandstorm, Azumarill is completely useless.
And now tell me, when exactly does doryuuzu get to EQ? After switching out? While being dead?

Not if he's got a Swords Dance they can't.
If you let it set up a Swords Dance and then directly switch to your counter, you deserve to get swept.
 

Lee

@ Thick Club
is a Top Team Rater Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnus
I realise I'm a bit late to the party but I got the chance to jump online for a few hour yesterday so here's my thoughts on the 'suspects' thus far.

Shaymin-S: Ugh, I find it very difficult to motivate myself to play in a metagame where this little shit exists. The list of Pokemon that can a) switch into Seed Flare and b) outspeed or survive the incoming attack after accounting for the SpD drop is ludicrously small. And even then, you need to consider the threat of the SubSeed set. And even if you pack a good counter and scout the set well, there's always the chance the Skymin player will just shrug his shoulders and think 'may as well just try my luck' and flinch you to death. Shaymin-S has no redeeming factors in this metagame, it just makes the whole game notably less enjoyable.

Darkrai: I've came up against surprisingly few Darkrai considering how good it looks on paper. Normally when I do encounter it, it puts something to sleep and damages a Pokemon or two before going down. I''ll need to face a few more of them before I say anything definite.

Manaphy: Incredibly good Pokemon, both in and out of Rain. It's skating the line between 'top tier OU threat' and 'probably uber' so I wouldn't like to say at the moment. A lot is being made of how threatening it is in Rain, but it should be noted that if you want to use Manaphy in Rain you have to bring Politoed along for the ride too which not only doubles up on weaknesses but forces you to adapt an entirely different playstyle and begs the question 'are Politoed + Manaphy teams really all that?' I never had huge problems with them whilst using my Sandstorm team (granted I had CBTar to Pursuit Politoed hehe). I view Manaphy as the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow for any Rain player that manages to play smartly and win the 'weather-war.'

A lot is being made of Tail Glow's 'OMG +3!' powers but you need to put it into perspective and note that that produces 747 SpA for Timid Manaphy after a boost. Swords Dance Garchomp hits 718 Atk, NP Lucario hits 722, Jolly Doryuuzu hits 738. The +3 isn't the important thing - what's important is the number that you land at after using it and 747 is impressive but it isn't exactly out of proportion with other threats. He isn't that easy to revenge kill to be fair but this metagame is dominated by hard hitting Pokemon with higher than 100 base Spe (Randorosu, Garchomp, Terakion, Latios, Volotoros, Skymin, Deoxys-A) not to mention all the Pokemon that force him into deadly speed ties (Zapdos, Celebi, Shaymin-L). I think we've been a bit quick to condemn Manaphy, I would like to see him given more of a chance.

Politoed: I've found Rain to be a lot weaker than Sand, thanks to the fact that Choice Band Tyranitar can come in on Politoed and Pursuit it (72% - 85% vs 252/0) or Stone Edge it (90% - 107% vs the same Toed). Even when I wasn't using Sand, I just randomly slapped Sunny Day on one of my support Pokemon's filler moveslots and forced a tonne of ragequits against opponents who saw that I didn't have Ttar/Hippo/Ninetales/Aboma and thought they could sacrifice Toed. I hated Rain in 4th Gen as much as anybody and was sure that it would be broken as hell in this generation but I'm finding it surprisingly manageable. Still, there has been occassions where I never got momentum in my favor and just got steamrollered but I could say the same thing has happened to me against offensive SS teams or whatever.

Deoxys-A: Not sure yet, I've had occassions where it absolutely kicked my ass, but I've also had occassions where it got off one resisted attack and then died to priority or Pursuit. Gimme more time on this one.

Doryuuzu: A good Pokemon but overated to hell and should never have even been mentioned as a suspect. I find Terakion much more threatening.
 
Yeah... not quite understanding the love for Dory here. He's evidently a very good Pokemon but from my experience hasn't been too much to handle. For my own bulky offensive team, he's not a big deal because most mons can take any hit before he Swords Dances and retaliate for high damage.

I get the impression that Dory's power largely depends on the kind of team he's up against. He's a nightmare for more fragile offensive teams because he's got all the revenge power of a scarfer but isn't hindered by being locked into attacks. Maybe if Dory was capable of eliminating an entire playstyle in this manner then I'd consider him suspect material.

Skymin can go fuck itself.
 
It can also come into every other move because it's unboosted in that moment.

E: actually the calc is wrong, that's not a +2 EQ, so azumarill can really only come into SD (or random move to hit random checks)
 
May I present this log to show you that Inconsistent REALLY needs to go?
I played like junk in this game yet still won simply due to getting the right boosts on Bibarel, this while my opponent pretty much had me by the balls all game long.
Oh and the setup happened against a Latios. In the sand.

Battle between Yo Captain and The Jokester started!

Tier: Wifi
Variation: +23, -8
Rule: Rated
Rule: Sleep Clause
Rule: Species Clause
Rule: Wifi Battle

The Jokester sent out Smeargle!
Yo Captain sent out Motisma-Eau! (Rotom-W)

Start of turn 1
The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
Smeargle lost 208 HP! (66% of its health)
Yo Captain called Motisma-Eau back!
Yo Captain sent out Tyranocif! (Tyranitar)

The foe's Tyranocif's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm!

Smeargle used Spore!
The foe's Tyranocif fell asleep!

The sandstorm rages!
Smeargle is buffeted by the sandstorm!

Start of turn 2
Yo Captain called Tyranocif back!
Yo Captain sent out Motisma-Eau! (Rotom-W)

Smeargle used Ingrain!
Smeargle planted its roots!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Motisma-Eau is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Smeargle is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Smeargle absorbed nutrients with its roots!

Start of turn 3
Smeargle used Protect!
Smeargle protected itself!

The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
Smeargle protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Motisma-Eau is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Smeargle is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Smeargle absorbed nutrients with its roots!

Start of turn 4
The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
Smeargle lost 87 HP! (27% of its health)
Smeargle fainted!
Yo Captain called Motisma-Eau back!
Yo Captain sent out Latios!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The Jokester sent out Politoed!

Politoed's Drizzle made it rain!

Start of turn 5
Yo Captain called Latios back!
Yo Captain sent out Tyranocif! (Tyranitar)

The foe's Tyranocif's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm!
Politoed used Protect!
But it failed!

The sandstorm rages!
Politoed is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Politoed restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 6
The Jokester called Politoed back!
The Jokester sent out Vaporeon!

Yo Captain called Tyranocif back!
Yo Captain sent out Fracasse! (Nattorei)

The sandstorm rages!
Vaporeon is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Vaporeon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 7
Vaporeon used Substitute!
Vaporeon made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Leech Seed!
Vaporeon's substitute blocked Leech Seed!

The sandstorm rages!
Vaporeon is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Vaporeon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 8
Vaporeon used Aqua Ring!
Vaporeon surrounded itself with a veil of water!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
Vaporeon's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Vaporeon is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Vaporeon's HP.
Vaporeon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 9
Vaporeon used Substitute!
Vaporeon made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
A critical hit!
Vaporeon's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Vaporeon is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Vaporeon's HP.
Vaporeon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 10
Vaporeon used Baton Pass!
The Jokester called Vaporeon back!
The Jokester sent out Octillery!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
Octillery lost 270 HP! (76% of its health)

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 11
Octillery used Protect!
Octillery protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Stealth Rock!
Pointed stones float in the air around The Jokester's team!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Att.!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 12
Octillery used Substitute!
Octillery made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
Octillery's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Defense!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 13
Octillery used Protect!
Octillery protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
The attack of the foe's Fracasse missed!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Def.!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Accuracy!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 14
Octillery used Surf!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Fracasse lost 11% of its health!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
The attack of the foe's Fracasse missed!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Fracasse restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 15
Octillery used Protect!
Octillery protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
Octillery protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Def.!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Speed!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Fracasse restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 16
Octillery used Substitute!
Octillery made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
Octillery's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 17
Octillery used Protect!
Octillery protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
Octillery protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Accuracy!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 18
Octillery used Surf!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Fracasse lost 10% of its health!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
A critical hit!
Octillery lost 84 HP! (23% of its health)
Octillery fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Fracasse restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The Jokester sent out Tentacruel!
Pointed stones dug into Tentacruel!

Start of turn 19
Tentacruel used Toxic Spikes!
Poison spikes were scattered all around the feet of Yo Captain's team!

The foe's Fracasse used Leech Seed!
Tentacruel was seeded!

The sandstorm rages!
Tentacruel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Tentacruel's health is sapped by leech seed.

Start of turn 20
Yo Captain called Fracasse back!
Yo Captain sent out Roobushin!
The foe's Roobushin was poisoned!

Tentacruel used Toxic Spikes!
Poison spikes were scattered all around the feet of Yo Captain's team!

The sandstorm rages!
Tentacruel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Roobushin is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Tentacruel's health is sapped by leech seed.
The foe's Roobushin is hurt by poison!

Start of turn 21
Tentacruel used Rapid Spin!
The foe's Roobushin lost 2% of its health!
Tentacruel blew away Leech Seed!
Tentacruel blew away Stealth Rock!

The foe's Roobushin used Bulk Up!
The foe's Roobushin's Attack rose!
The foe's Roobushin's Defense rose!

The sandstorm rages!
Tentacruel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Roobushin is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Roobushin restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Roobushin is hurt by poison!

Start of turn 22
Tentacruel used Surf!
The foe's Roobushin lost 32% of its health!

The foe's Roobushin used Drain Punch!
It's not very effective...
Tentacruel lost 163 HP! (44% of its health)
Tentacruel had its energy drained!
Tentacruel fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Roobushin is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Roobushin restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Roobushin is hurt by poison!
The Jokester sent out Politoed!

Politoed's Drizzle made it rain!

Start of turn 23
Politoed used Protect!
Politoed protected itself!

The foe's Roobushin used Bulk Up!
The foe's Roobushin's Attack rose!
The foe's Roobushin's Defense rose!

Rain continues to fall!
The foe's Roobushin restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Roobushin is hurt by poison!

Start of turn 24
The foe's Roobushin used Mach Punch!
Politoed lost 250 HP! (65% of its health)

Politoed used Boil Over!
The foe's Roobushin lost 41% of its health!
The foe's Roobushin fainted!

Rain continues to fall!
Politoed restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
Yo Captain sent out Motisma-Eau! (Rotom-W)

Start of turn 25
Politoed used Protect!
Politoed protected itself!

The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
Politoed protected itself!

Rain continues to fall!
Politoed restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 26
The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
It's super effective!
A critical hit!
Politoed lost 182 HP! (47% of its health)
Politoed fainted!
Yo Captain called Motisma-Eau back!
Yo Captain sent out Tyranocif! (Tyranitar)

The foe's Tyranocif's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm!

The sandstorm rages!
The Jokester sent out Vaporeon!

Start of turn 27
Yo Captain called Tyranocif back!
Yo Captain sent out Motisma-Eau! (Rotom-W)

Vaporeon used Aqua Ring!
Vaporeon surrounded itself with a veil of water!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Motisma-Eau is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Vaporeon is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Vaporeon's HP.
Vaporeon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 28
The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
It's super effective!
Vaporeon lost 242 HP! (58% of its health)
Yo Captain called Motisma-Eau back!
Yo Captain sent out Latios!

Vaporeon used Baton Pass!
The Jokester called Vaporeon back!
The Jokester sent out Bibarel!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Speed!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Att.!

Start of turn 29
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
It's super effective!
Bibarel's substitute faded!
The foe's Latios is hurt by its Life Orb!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 30
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Speed!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 31
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
It's super effective!
Bibarel's substitute faded!
The foe's Latios is hurt by its Life Orb!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 32
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Latios used Recover!
The foe's Latios regained health!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Defense!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 33
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
It's super effective!
Bibarel's substitute faded!
The foe's Latios is hurt by its Life Orb!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Defense!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 34
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Speed!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 35
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
It's super effective!
Bibarel's substitute faded!
The foe's Latios is hurt by its Life Orb!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Speed!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 36
Bibarel used Frustration!
The foe's Latios lost 56% of its health!
The foe's Latios fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
Yo Captain sent out Fracasse! (Nattorei)

Start of turn 37
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
It's not very effective...
Bibarel's substitute took the damage!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 38
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Speed!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Accuracy!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 39
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Defense!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 40
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel already has a substitute.

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
It's not very effective...
Bibarel's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 41
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
The attack of the foe's Fracasse missed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 42
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
The attack of the foe's Fracasse missed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Defense!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 43
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Defense!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 44
Bibarel used Protect!
But it failed!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
Bibarel's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 45
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
The attack of the foe's Fracasse missed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 46
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 47
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel already has a substitute.

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
It's not very effective...
Bibarel's substitute took the damage!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 48
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Stealth Rock!
Pointed stones float in the air around The Jokester's team!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 49
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel already has a substitute.

The foe's Fracasse used Stealth Rock!
But it failed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Speed!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 50
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Stealth Rock!
But it failed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Accuracy!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 51
Bibarel used Frustration!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Fracasse lost 29% of its health!
The foe's Fracasse's Iron Barbs hurts Bibarel

The foe's Fracasse used Stealth Rock!
But it failed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Defense!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Fracasse restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 52
Bibarel used Frustration!
It's not very effective...
A critical hit!
The foe's Fracasse lost 64% of its health!
The foe's Fracasse's Iron Barbs hurts Bibarel

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
It's not very effective...
Bibarel's substitute took the damage!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Fracasse restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 53
Bibarel used Frustration!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Fracasse lost 18% of its health!
The foe's Fracasse's Iron Barbs hurts Bibarel
The foe's Fracasse fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
Yo Captain sent out Scorvol! (Gliscor)

Start of turn 54
Bibarel used Waterfall!
It's super effective!
The foe's Scorvol lost 84% of its health!

The foe's Scorvol used Roost!
The foe's Scorvol landed on the ground!
The foe's Scorvol regained health!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Scorvol restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 55
Yo Captain called Scorvol back!
Yo Captain sent out Motisma-Eau! (Rotom-W)

Bibarel used Waterfall!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Motisma-Eau lost 48% of its health!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Motisma-Eau is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 56
Bibarel used Waterfall!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Motisma-Eau lost 27% of its health!
The foe's Motisma-Eau fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
Yo Captain sent out Scorvol! (Gliscor)

Start of turn 57
Bibarel used Waterfall!
It's super effective!
The foe's Scorvol lost 71% of its health!
The foe's Scorvol fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Speed!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
 

idiotfrommars

HODOR HODOR HODOR
is a Tutor Alumnusis a Tournament Director Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Four-Time Past WCoP Champion
May I present this log to show you that Inconsistent REALLY needs to go?
I played like junk in this game yet still won simply due to getting the right boosts on Bibarel, this while my opponent pretty much had me by the balls all game long.
Oh and the setup happened against a Latios. In the sand.

Battle between Yo Captain and The Jokester started!

Tier: Wifi
Variation: +23, -8
Rule: Rated
Rule: Sleep Clause
Rule: Species Clause
Rule: Wifi Battle

The Jokester sent out Smeargle!
Yo Captain sent out Motisma-Eau! (Rotom-W)

Start of turn 1
The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
Smeargle lost 208 HP! (66% of its health)
Yo Captain called Motisma-Eau back!
Yo Captain sent out Tyranocif! (Tyranitar)

The foe's Tyranocif's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm!

Smeargle used Spore!
The foe's Tyranocif fell asleep!

The sandstorm rages!
Smeargle is buffeted by the sandstorm!

Start of turn 2
Yo Captain called Tyranocif back!
Yo Captain sent out Motisma-Eau! (Rotom-W)

Smeargle used Ingrain!
Smeargle planted its roots!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Motisma-Eau is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Smeargle is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Smeargle absorbed nutrients with its roots!

Start of turn 3
Smeargle used Protect!
Smeargle protected itself!

The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
Smeargle protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Motisma-Eau is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Smeargle is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Smeargle absorbed nutrients with its roots!

Start of turn 4
The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
Smeargle lost 87 HP! (27% of its health)
Smeargle fainted!
Yo Captain called Motisma-Eau back!
Yo Captain sent out Latios!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The Jokester sent out Politoed!

Politoed's Drizzle made it rain!

Start of turn 5
Yo Captain called Latios back!
Yo Captain sent out Tyranocif! (Tyranitar)

The foe's Tyranocif's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm!
Politoed used Protect!
But it failed!

The sandstorm rages!
Politoed is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Politoed restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 6
The Jokester called Politoed back!
The Jokester sent out Vaporeon!

Yo Captain called Tyranocif back!
Yo Captain sent out Fracasse! (Nattorei)

The sandstorm rages!
Vaporeon is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Vaporeon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 7
Vaporeon used Substitute!
Vaporeon made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Leech Seed!
Vaporeon's substitute blocked Leech Seed!

The sandstorm rages!
Vaporeon is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Vaporeon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 8
Vaporeon used Aqua Ring!
Vaporeon surrounded itself with a veil of water!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
Vaporeon's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Vaporeon is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Vaporeon's HP.
Vaporeon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 9
Vaporeon used Substitute!
Vaporeon made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
A critical hit!
Vaporeon's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Vaporeon is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Vaporeon's HP.
Vaporeon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 10
Vaporeon used Baton Pass!
The Jokester called Vaporeon back!
The Jokester sent out Octillery!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
Octillery lost 270 HP! (76% of its health)

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 11
Octillery used Protect!
Octillery protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Stealth Rock!
Pointed stones float in the air around The Jokester's team!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Att.!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 12
Octillery used Substitute!
Octillery made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
Octillery's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Defense!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 13
Octillery used Protect!
Octillery protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
The attack of the foe's Fracasse missed!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Def.!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Accuracy!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 14
Octillery used Surf!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Fracasse lost 11% of its health!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
The attack of the foe's Fracasse missed!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Fracasse restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 15
Octillery used Protect!
Octillery protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
Octillery protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Def.!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Speed!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Fracasse restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 16
Octillery used Substitute!
Octillery made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
Octillery's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 17
Octillery used Protect!
Octillery protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
Octillery protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Octillery is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Octillery's HP.
Octillery's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Octillery's Inconsistent lowers its Accuracy!
Octillery restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 18
Octillery used Surf!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Fracasse lost 10% of its health!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
A critical hit!
Octillery lost 84 HP! (23% of its health)
Octillery fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Fracasse restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The Jokester sent out Tentacruel!
Pointed stones dug into Tentacruel!

Start of turn 19
Tentacruel used Toxic Spikes!
Poison spikes were scattered all around the feet of Yo Captain's team!

The foe's Fracasse used Leech Seed!
Tentacruel was seeded!

The sandstorm rages!
Tentacruel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Tentacruel's health is sapped by leech seed.

Start of turn 20
Yo Captain called Fracasse back!
Yo Captain sent out Roobushin!
The foe's Roobushin was poisoned!

Tentacruel used Toxic Spikes!
Poison spikes were scattered all around the feet of Yo Captain's team!

The sandstorm rages!
Tentacruel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Roobushin is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Tentacruel's health is sapped by leech seed.
The foe's Roobushin is hurt by poison!

Start of turn 21
Tentacruel used Rapid Spin!
The foe's Roobushin lost 2% of its health!
Tentacruel blew away Leech Seed!
Tentacruel blew away Stealth Rock!

The foe's Roobushin used Bulk Up!
The foe's Roobushin's Attack rose!
The foe's Roobushin's Defense rose!

The sandstorm rages!
Tentacruel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Roobushin is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Roobushin restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Roobushin is hurt by poison!

Start of turn 22
Tentacruel used Surf!
The foe's Roobushin lost 32% of its health!

The foe's Roobushin used Drain Punch!
It's not very effective...
Tentacruel lost 163 HP! (44% of its health)
Tentacruel had its energy drained!
Tentacruel fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Roobushin is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Roobushin restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Roobushin is hurt by poison!
The Jokester sent out Politoed!

Politoed's Drizzle made it rain!

Start of turn 23
Politoed used Protect!
Politoed protected itself!

The foe's Roobushin used Bulk Up!
The foe's Roobushin's Attack rose!
The foe's Roobushin's Defense rose!

Rain continues to fall!
The foe's Roobushin restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Roobushin is hurt by poison!

Start of turn 24
The foe's Roobushin used Mach Punch!
Politoed lost 250 HP! (65% of its health)

Politoed used Boil Over!
The foe's Roobushin lost 41% of its health!
The foe's Roobushin fainted!

Rain continues to fall!
Politoed restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
Yo Captain sent out Motisma-Eau! (Rotom-W)

Start of turn 25
Politoed used Protect!
Politoed protected itself!

The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
Politoed protected itself!

Rain continues to fall!
Politoed restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 26
The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
It's super effective!
A critical hit!
Politoed lost 182 HP! (47% of its health)
Politoed fainted!
Yo Captain called Motisma-Eau back!
Yo Captain sent out Tyranocif! (Tyranitar)

The foe's Tyranocif's Sand Stream whipped up a sandstorm!

The sandstorm rages!
The Jokester sent out Vaporeon!

Start of turn 27
Yo Captain called Tyranocif back!
Yo Captain sent out Motisma-Eau! (Rotom-W)

Vaporeon used Aqua Ring!
Vaporeon surrounded itself with a veil of water!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Motisma-Eau is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Vaporeon is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Vaporeon's HP.
Vaporeon restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 28
The foe's Motisma-Eau used Volt Change!
It's super effective!
Vaporeon lost 242 HP! (58% of its health)
Yo Captain called Motisma-Eau back!
Yo Captain sent out Latios!

Vaporeon used Baton Pass!
The Jokester called Vaporeon back!
The Jokester sent out Bibarel!

The sandstorm rages!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Speed!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Att.!

Start of turn 29
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
It's super effective!
Bibarel's substitute faded!
The foe's Latios is hurt by its Life Orb!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 30
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Speed!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 31
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
It's super effective!
Bibarel's substitute faded!
The foe's Latios is hurt by its Life Orb!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 32
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Latios used Recover!
The foe's Latios regained health!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Defense!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 33
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
It's super effective!
Bibarel's substitute faded!
The foe's Latios is hurt by its Life Orb!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Defense!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 34
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Speed!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 35
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Latios used Thunderbolt!
It's super effective!
Bibarel's substitute faded!
The foe's Latios is hurt by its Life Orb!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Latios is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Speed!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 36
Bibarel used Frustration!
The foe's Latios lost 56% of its health!
The foe's Latios fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
Yo Captain sent out Fracasse! (Nattorei)

Start of turn 37
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
It's not very effective...
Bibarel's substitute took the damage!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 38
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Speed!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Accuracy!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 39
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Defense!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 40
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel already has a substitute.

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
It's not very effective...
Bibarel's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 41
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
The attack of the foe's Fracasse missed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 42
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
The attack of the foe's Fracasse missed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Defense!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 43
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Defense!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 44
Bibarel used Protect!
But it failed!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
It's super effective!
Bibarel's substitute faded!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 45
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel made a substitute!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
The attack of the foe's Fracasse missed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 46
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Power Whip!
Bibarel protected itself!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 47
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel already has a substitute.

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
It's not very effective...
Bibarel's substitute took the damage!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 48
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Stealth Rock!
Pointed stones float in the air around The Jokester's team!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 49
Bibarel used Substitute!
Bibarel already has a substitute.

The foe's Fracasse used Stealth Rock!
But it failed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Speed!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 50
Bibarel used Protect!
Bibarel protected itself!

The foe's Fracasse used Stealth Rock!
But it failed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Accuracy!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 51
Bibarel used Frustration!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Fracasse lost 29% of its health!
The foe's Fracasse's Iron Barbs hurts Bibarel

The foe's Fracasse used Stealth Rock!
But it failed!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Accuracy!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Defense!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Fracasse restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 52
Bibarel used Frustration!
It's not very effective...
A critical hit!
The foe's Fracasse lost 64% of its health!
The foe's Fracasse's Iron Barbs hurts Bibarel

The foe's Fracasse used Gyro Ball!
It's not very effective...
Bibarel's substitute took the damage!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Fracasse restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 53
Bibarel used Frustration!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Fracasse lost 18% of its health!
The foe's Fracasse's Iron Barbs hurts Bibarel
The foe's Fracasse fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
Yo Captain sent out Scorvol! (Gliscor)

Start of turn 54
Bibarel used Waterfall!
It's super effective!
The foe's Scorvol lost 84% of its health!

The foe's Scorvol used Roost!
The foe's Scorvol landed on the ground!
The foe's Scorvol regained health!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Evasion!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Att.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The foe's Scorvol restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 55
Yo Captain called Scorvol back!
Yo Captain sent out Motisma-Eau! (Rotom-W)

Bibarel used Waterfall!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Motisma-Eau lost 48% of its health!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
The foe's Motisma-Eau is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Evasion!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Start of turn 56
Bibarel used Waterfall!
It's not very effective...
The foe's Motisma-Eau lost 27% of its health!
The foe's Motisma-Eau fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Attack!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Sp. Def.!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
Yo Captain sent out Scorvol! (Gliscor)

Start of turn 57
Bibarel used Waterfall!
It's super effective!
The foe's Scorvol lost 71% of its health!
The foe's Scorvol fainted!

The sandstorm rages!
Bibarel is buffeted by the sandstorm!
Aquaring restored Bibarel's HP.
Bibarel's Inconsistent sharply raises its Speed!
Bibarel's Inconsistent lowers its Attack!
Bibarel restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
I love logs like that. They demonstrate perfectly why inconsistent should be banned.
 
Thats why im whoring it. 8 out of 10 times im setting inconsistent up against bad players who let their Foretress in to allow Smeargle setting up Spore-Ingrain-Pass and then Sub on Octillery while they set up 6 layers of entry hazards.
The other 2 times tho are against skilled players. This guy was outplaying me for 95% of the time, but the fact that Vaporeon got the slower BP off to Bibarel meant his end.

I'm far from a good player which even furthers my point. Even people like me can sweep stuff just by getting the luck of Octillery/Bibarel.
 

idiotfrommars

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I tried a team like that as well and was able to get around 1250 CRE with it until I hit the above average players. Obviously luck isn't going to take you much farther than that but the times you do get the right boosts it can be devastating, causing the opponent to lose unnecessary games. I don't think this strategy will allow anyone to get to the top of the ladder, but its what it does against the rest of the ladder that is the problem that should lead to this being banned. As was said earlier all you need is a speed, evasion, or correct defensive boost and you have a highly elevated chance of winning, when you wouldn't have much of a chance at all without inconsistent when playing a better player.
 
As you can see, the only thing I needed in a battle against a far stronger opponent was the speed boost Bibarel got. From there on out I won. Thats the whole issue here.
 

SJCrew

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A lot is being made of Tail Glow's 'OMG +3!' powers but you need to put it into perspective and note that that produces 747 SpA for Timid Manaphy after a boost. Swords Dance Garchomp hits 718 Atk, NP Lucario hits 722, Jolly Doryuuzu hits 738. The +3 isn't the important thing - what's important is the number that you land at after using it and 747 is impressive but it isn't exactly out of proportion with other threats. He isn't that easy to revenge kill to be fair but this metagame is dominated by hard hitting Pokemon with higher than 100 base Spe (Randorosu, Garchomp, Terakion, Latios, Volotoros, Skymin, Deoxys-A) not to mention all the Pokemon that force him into deadly speed ties (Zapdos, Celebi, Shaymin-L). I think we've been a bit quick to condemn Manaphy, I would like to see him given more of a chance.
I think you're missing a couple of key points regarding Manaphy here. For one, the party doesn't stop at +3; if I click Tail Glow one more time, I'm at +6. Plus, imagine Lucario with 100/100/100 Defenses. I think I'd be getting more than one Nasty Plot off, don't you? Finally, give him a free Rest under Rain - but ah fuck, Tyranitar/Hippowdon just switched in! ...on Surf (it's happened before). I have yet to face a Stall team that could beat it.

Another thing is that 'requiring' Politoed on the same team for maximum effectiveness isn't a big deal at all. You're doubling up on the same weakneses, but BOTH Pokemon are pretty bulky in Sp. Def and won't die to anything short of a Specs Thunder or Leaf Storm if you invest. Your signature Grass/Electric type can only switch into Manaphy so many times. If I suspect it's not Specs, I'll just OHKO with my +3 Rain-boosted Surf. The best part of it is that you can do this throughout the game as long as he's higher than 12% or no Rocks are up.
 

Mario With Lasers

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Politoed: I've found Rain to be a lot weaker than Sand, thanks to the fact that Choice Band Tyranitar can come in on Politoed and Pursuit it (72% - 85% vs 252/0) or Stone Edge it (90% - 107% vs the same Toed).
Tyranitar has to be really ballsy to switch in on Politoed, who does 87% - 102.6% with Specs Hydro Pump on 180/0 Adamant CBtar. And there's also lol Boiling Water on more defensive sets, and Focus Blast for Nattorei.

Doryuuzu: A good Pokemon but overated to hell and should never have even been mentioned as a suspect. I find Terakion much more threatening.
I've played for only, what, three hours?, and I've found quite the opposite; Terakion is a walk in the park - unless you play horribly dumb and let it set up even once - while Doryuuzu kills shit anytime and will nab a Swords Dance. Man, if only Ditto were allowed...
 
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