1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

OU CCAT - Mark III (Laddering/Discussing - See Post #547)

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Electrolyte, Oct 8, 2012.

  1. Electrolyte

    Electrolyte On a short LoA
    is an official Team Rateris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Battle Server Moderator
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,030
    OU CCAT - Mark III, directed by Electrolyte & Harsha
    Approved by NixHex, Pocket, and ginganinja

    [​IMG]
    Gliscor @ Toxic Orb *** PenguinX
    Trait: Poison Heal
    EVs: 248 HP / 24 Def / 236 Spe
    Impish Nature
    - Substitute
    - Baton Pass
    - Earthquake
    - Taunt / Toxic

    [​IMG]
    Keldeo @ Leftovers *** alexwolf
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Calm Mind
    - Hydro Pump
    - Secret Sword
    - Hidden Power Electric

    [​IMG]
    Tyranitar @ Choice Band *** bubbly
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 36 Atk / 220 SpD
    Adamant Nature
    - Pursuit
    - Crunch
    - Stone Edge
    - Superpower

    [​IMG]
    Bronzong @ Leftovers *** PenguinX
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
    IVs: 2 Spe
    Sassy Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Gyro Ball / Toxic
    - Hidden Power Ice / Toxic
    - Earthquake / Toxic

    [​IMG]
    Latias @ Life Orb *** The Great Mighty Doom
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 72 HP / 184 SpA / 252 Spe
    IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Draco Meteor
    - Surf
    - Hidden Power Fire
    - Recover

    [​IMG]
    Terrakion @ Choice Scarf *** DarkBlazeR
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge
    - X-Scissor
    - Rock Slide

    Hello everybody! It's that time of year again, the time where we crank up our teambuilding skills and, as a community, create a team to help us gain a better understanding of the new BW2 metagame. Hence, the name Community-Create-A-Team! For those of you who have no idea how this works, please check out Edition 1 and 2, led by the best of Pocket and ginganinja.

    Now that a ton of fresh, new Pokemon, abilities, and movesets have been allowed, it's time we make a fresh, new team as well. In the last CCAT, a couple new changes were implemented, including the vote for a checklist of teams. This time, I'm adding one new change: a new bonus voting point system.

    BONUS VOTING POINT SYSTEM: Many different voting systems have been used on Smogon in the past. Everything from holding a council to a public vote to even a plain dictated vote has been used. This time, our voting system will be a different form of a public vote, what I call a bonus voting point system. This is basically just a public vote, but with a little reward added into it. There will be a total of at least six public votes throughout this project. Everyone that submits a winning idea (1st come, 1st serve) will get +0.5 voting points. Keep in mind, voters recieve no change, only the submitters. From the start, everyone has one voting point, which basically means that your vote counts as a single vote. Once you win a round, however, your vote rises and suddenly counts as 1.5 votes. Although this might not seem like much in the beginning, it quickly racks up, and can be the major deciding point of some close cut votes. People that win multiple votes will continue to gain +0.5 voting points.

    Here's a list of the basic stages we will check off during our project.

    [box]Step 1: We select a pokemon to base our team around. This time, there will be no restrictions as to what pokemon you submit- but use common sense, and don't post stupid things like SubSD Caterpie. Try to think of beneficial pokemon to make a team around. What can we learn from making a team around that pokemon? How much experience has been gathered with that pokemon? Just like last time, this step is most important, and a lot of thought should be put in here. Be prepared with supports, as well. This is a discussion, so you're going to want to be able to fend for your idea and prove to the community that it's the best one. 1 vote here. SubPass Gliscor

    Step 2: We select what style of team we want to make. This will likely include something along the lines of Offense, Bulky Offense (closest form of stall..), Weather, Trick Room, and possibly more. 1 vote here. Balance/Bulky Offense

    Step 3: We select Pokemon that work well around our Pokemon and fit the team style and test it. 5 votes here.
    • Teammate #1: Calm Mind Keldeo
    • Teammate #2: Choice Band Tyranitar
    • Teammate #3: Specially Defensive Bronzong
    • Teammate #4: Life Orb Latias
    • Teammate #5: Choice Scarf Terrakion
    Step 4: We fine-tune the team based on our experiences in test-driving the team on the ladder!

    Step 5: We finalize the team and write up a 5-star RMT![/box]

    As a final note, make sure that whatever you test is actually viable instead of theorymonning.

    Users with bonus points:
    1. PenguinX: 2
    2. alexwolf: 1.5
    3. The Great Mighty Doom: 1.5
    4. DarkBlazeR: 1.5
    Posts to keep in mind:
    1. Metagame Analysis - Harsha
    2. Team Skeleton - PenguinX
    A special thanks to all of the OU moderators who helped me perfect this project! Thank you all!
  2. dragonuser

    dragonuser The only thing I look up to is the sky
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Pyramid Kingis a Past WCoP Winner
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2011
    Messages:
    1,978
    I would like to nominate~

    [​IMG]
    Sharpedo (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Speed Boost
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Protect
    - Waterfall
    - Crunch
    - Zen Headbutt

    Sharpedo is a very deadly sweeper in BW2, and is often overlooked. Countless teams are weak to this little wonder and he can sweep very easily, as sometimes all it takes is a single Protect to get the sweep started. Earthquake can be used to get heavier damage on Jirachi and Ice Fang can be used for more damage on Dragonite and the like. Waterfall and Crunch are standard strong STAB, and Waterfall is also ridiculously strong in the Rain. Pocket suggested Zen Headbutt over Earthquake which seems really interesting, however this set will almost definitely need to be run with Spikes now.
  3. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Messages:
    8,580
    Thanks for the first nom, dragonuser. May I suggest Zen Headbutt > EQ to murder Keldeo?
  4. Somebody Anonymous

    Somebody Anonymous

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2012
    Messages:
    49
    I nominate:

    Deoxys-Defense @ Red Card
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SDef
    Bold Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Seismic Toss / Night Shade
    - Recycle
    - Cosmic Power
    - Recover

    Pros
    • Without phazing, taunting, statusing or trick, this can easily boost to +6 and defeat entire teams.
    • Crits are not as noticeable due to natural bulk.
    • Everybody expects hazards from this
    • Deoxys-D cannot be defeated by opposing Pokemon boosting alongside this set.

    Cons
    • This set should only be used in conjunction with hazards.
    • Defeated by phazing, taunting, statusing or trick

    Calculations:

    +1 Timid Genesect Bug Buzz vs +1 Deoxys-D - 134-158 (44.07 - 51.97%) -- 10.94% chance to 2HKO
    +1 Timid Volconora Bug Buzz vs +1 Deoxys-D - 146-174 (48.02 - 57.23%) -- 88.67% chance to 2HKO
    +1 Adamant Genesect Expolosion vs +1 Deoxys-D1- 64-194 (53.94 - 63.81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    Zoroark boosting alongside will result in this:
    +6 Timid Life Orb Zoroark Dark Pulse vs +4 Deoxys-D - 248-294 (81.57 - 96.71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (If it is uses Night Daze, it OHKOs 18.75%of the time)

    After tanking such hits, we recover our health as the opponent has to face the fact that they have an unboosted Pokemon vs an Deoxy-D with boosts on both sides of the spectrum.
    If this monster gets Circle Throw/ Dragon Tail/ Roar/ Whirlwind...BANNED
  5. asterat

    asterat

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2011
    Messages:
    965
    Nominating:
    [​IMG]
    Jynx (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Dry Skin
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Nasty Plot
    - Ice Beam
    - Lovely Kiss
    Jynx is an amazing sweeper when used correctly. With powerful SpA and good speed it can hit hard quickly. Once the few counters are removed jinx is ready to sweep. Jynx is really hard to counter though because of lovely kiss. Ice beam is only resisted by 4 types- ice, fire, water, and steel. Jynx can set up on water types and it is easy to exploit the weaknesses of the other types. Conkeldurr can easily beat most ice and steel types, as well as fire types in the rain (jynx works best in rain). Terrakion is also a cool teammate. A poison type is really nice because they remove annoying toxic spikes and can lay down their own toxic spikes which allow jynx to stall out bliss or chansey with ease due to dry skin and leftovers.
  6. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    2,959
    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Heatran @ Leftovers
    Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 SDef / 8 Spd
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Torment
    - Protect
    - Lava Plume

    TormenTran is an extremely obnoxious Pokemon to go up against, especially in the fast-paced offensive metagame that is BW2 OU. Since most Pokemon only have one method of hitting Heatran for any reasonable damage, Substitute + Torment + Protect makes for an evil combination, essentially ensuring multiple free substitutes and ridiculously easy recovery as soon as the opponent is subjected to Torment. Lava Plume makes for an excellent sole STAB attack, with a reasonable base power of 80 as well as an exceptionally trollish 30% chance of burn (think Scald, people). When all is said and done, TormenTran is the single most annoying threat for offensive teams to face, and I believe it's an excellent Pokemon to base a CCAT around.
  7. GatoDelFuego

    GatoDelFuego No matter if it seems so hard, friends are here
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
    Mentor

    Joined:
    May 29, 2011
    Messages:
    3,001
    [​IMG]
    Landorus @ Life Orb
    Trait: Sheer Force
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid/Modest Nature
    - Earth Power
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power Ice
    - Rock Polish

    While this is the first set listed on smogon's analysis and I have hear much talk of its sun-breaking capabilities, I've never actually seen it well in action myself. Landorus has great typing in the current metagame, and while being weak to genesect's ice beam is very annoying, boosting up to cleanly outspeed it is great. Actually, outspeeding almost everything in the game is great too. On top of that, sheer force + life orb just gives this thing unbelievable power, and on top it doesn't lose any HP. I'm confident that a special Landorus could be a very viable sweeper in the metagame.
  8. dragonuser

    dragonuser The only thing I look up to is the sky
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Pyramid Kingis a Past WCoP Winner
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2011
    Messages:
    1,978
    A Modest Nature should seriously be considered over a Timid Nature on Rock Polish Landorus. While unboosted it may seem like a huge waste of potential, but the power granted when it is +2 can be game changing. It really helps Landorus power through walls, and even with Modest it has 301 Speed unboosted.
  9. GatoDelFuego

    GatoDelFuego No matter if it seems so hard, friends are here
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
    Mentor

    Joined:
    May 29, 2011
    Messages:
    3,001
    Edited to include such; again I don't have much experience with it myself.
  10. Doughboy

    Doughboy house of champions
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Community Contributor Alumnus
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2011
    Messages:
    1,371
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Latias (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Calm Mind
    - Recover
    - Refresh

    Meet the most under rated Pokemon in all the OU tier. Coming in at #41 on the usage stats, Latias is the least used out of all the OU Dragons. Surely this shows the unrecognized prowess of this Dragon? Latias' ability to check and counter threats is remarkable: Special Landorus, Techniloom, Keldeo, and Sun teams (untrappable by Dugtrio!) all struggle to contend with Latias. Interestingly enough Latias can find itself on a variety of teams including all the weathers, defensive oriented teams, and balance. On this Latias, I choose the underrated 4th slot move: Refresh. With Refresh, Latias becomes an amazing pivot and great stall breaker. It can use its great set of resistances to switch in and with Refresh can remain unscathed by status. Calm Mind makes sure Latias has the capability to sweep. Great speed, great resistances, status "immunity", and Recover will make sure it has plenty of time to set up. Overall, Latias' unrecognized potential and universality makes it a good starting point for OU's next CCAT.
  11. StairFall

    StairFall

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2012
    Messages:
    254
    While I love tormentran and I second it's usage I suggest changing it to a more offensive spread of 252hp/252spatk/4spdef-modest and substituting lavaplume for flamethrower in order to preserve more of an offensive presence. The 30% to 10% chance to burn is largely irrelevant because tormentran often uses toxic and sandstorm support and two of it's three weaknesses are physically based so the loss of special bulk isn't as big a deal.

    As for my own nomination I suggest Sigilyph:
    [​IMG]
    Sigilyph @ Flame Orb
    Trait: Magic Guard
    EVs:252 HP / 200 Def / 56 Spe
    Bold nature (+def, -atk)
    -cosmic power
    -stored power
    -roost
    -psycho shift

    Sigilyph gets no love, in the lower tiers it wrecks things sideways. It's pretty much a super bulky CM reuniclus that also boosts its defence along its special defence and can cripple physical attackers. It's somewhat niche and has trouble doing its job in OU with tyranitar running around but it's got five other pokemon to help it out and prepare it for a slow and steady sweep. Underutilized, underestimated, unstoppable.
  12. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    2,959
    Completely agreeing with this, in my opinion Modest is better than Timid on many different levels. With a Modest Landorus, you can even run a bulky spread and spare being 2HKO'd by CB Scizor's Bullet Punch, among other things. The extra power is definitely worth it. My custom set is

    [​IMG]
    Landorus @ Life Orb
    Trait: Sheer Force
    EVs: 68 HP / 252 SAtk / 188 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Rock Polish
    - Earth Power
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Focus Blast

    188 Speed EVs mean at +2, you outspeed Timid Max Speed Venusaur in Sun, as well as Scarf Latios, Scarf Terrakion, Stoutland in Sand, Victreebel in Sun, etc. You also still beat Adamant Lucario, Timid Heatran, and almost all Gliscor at +0. The extra bulk is greatly appreciated, I've been in many situations where I've swept a battle and won 1-0 with Landorus at around 2% health.

    Oh yeah, and here's some damage calcs showing why Modest > Timid. For example, RP Landorus sweeps my Sun team if it gets +2, but only if it's Modest, because:

    252 SpAtk Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs 0 HP/0 SpDef Venusaur: 76.08% - 89.7% (hardly ever OHKO after rocks), whereas

    252 SpAtk Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus (+SpAtk) Earth Power vs 0 HP/0 SpDef Venusaur: 83.06% - 98.01% (almost always OHKO after rocks).

    Just plain makes sense to run Modest, you're really not missing out on much.
  13. alexwolf

    alexwolf Fear the D
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2009
    Messages:
    6,954
    I just got an interesting idea that might work:
    [​IMG]
    Riolu @ Leftovers / Eviolite
    252 HP evs / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly nature
    Ability: Prankster
    - Roar
    - Copycat
    - Protect
    - Substitute / Low Sweep

    Most of you already know the basic idea behind this set. Set-up hazards, then bring Riolu in after something dies, and start the shuffling with priority, while the opponent slowly dies from hazard damage. Then you only have to deal with the last poke on the opposing team, as it can't be phazed, or the last 2 pokes if the opponent is using 2 Regenerator pokes. The other moves except from Roar and Copycat are fillers. Protect lets Riolu scout to see if a poke uses priority or not, and can even be useful for stalling some turns from Perish Song (the Perish Song that another of your pokes used against the last mon standing). It also scouts for status, so you can maybe Sub more safely. Sub is to block status and again scout in general and works very well with Prankster. Low Sweep is used to prevent a last mon Speed booster from boosting speed and sweeping you, such as Volcarona, DDnite, etc.

    While this sounds very broken, there are many counters to this strategy. First of all it is very difficult for Riolu to get the first Roar off anyway because of it's frailty. Then even if you get the phazing started you have to beware of some things. 1. Sand and Hail damage if not using Lefties. 2. Faster priority than your own, namely ES from Dnite and Lucario and Mach Punch from Jolly Breloom and Infernape. 3. Protect users which interrupt the Roar + Copycat strategy. 4. Magic Bounce pokemon that can't be phazed with Roar, aka Espeon and Xatu. And this is it i think. Yeah that's quite a lot of problems to fix, but if we manage to fix them, we may find some really unfound potential on Riolu, and we may even change the OU metagame or even the world :D.

    Anyway this is my nom, take it as you will. Tbh i have zero experience with this thing, so many things about the set could change if given good reasons.
  14. alkinesthetase

    alkinesthetase <@dtc> every day with alk is a bad day
    is a Smogon IRC SOp Alumnus

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    inspired heavily by molk's fourth DHP run:

    Venomoth @ Black Sludge
    252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    Trait: Tinted Lens
    - Bug Buzz
    - Quiver Dance
    - Baton Pass
    - Sleep Powder / Roost

    oh yeah, venomoth. the cool thing about venomoth is that it is both a standalone mon (as such, one around which teams can be built) and a team player (as such, one that can assist in a team being built). due to tinted lens, mono-bug sweeping is suddenly possible (the number of 4x bug resists in OU is surprisingly low). however, if you should come up against something that forces you out or walls you, it's exceptionally easy to maintain momentum by BPing away your boosts to another special attacker. ANYTHING can benefit from a BPed QD which means venomoth synergizes reasonably well with other mons too - any attacker appreciates the speed boost and any mon ever will appreciate an sdef boost.

    the choice between sleep powder and roost is mainly between either a long-term venomoth that can set up multiple times (greatly reduces SR problems) or a highly independent sweeper that can force its own setup opportunities. roost also lets you handle stall even better because you're already immune to toxic. ofc if running another sleep user on the team, roost would be the clear choice

    venomoth has the perfect movepool and the perfect ability, but its flaws are equally obvious, and that's where the learning experience can come in. stats that are massively subpar in OU and a relatively crappy typing will all be problems that the team has to work around. in addition we will have to find a way to deal with venomoth's SR weakness if it becomes a problem. but venomoth being a relatively independent mon means that it won't excessively confine the teambuilding process.
  15. Ithilanor

    Ithilanor

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2010
    Messages:
    240
    Nominating:

    [​IMG]
    Victini @ Flame Plate
    Trait: Victory Star
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
    IVs: 0 Spe
    Brave Nature (+Atk, -Spe)
    -Trick Room
    -V-create
    -Brick Break
    -Fusion Bolt

    Trick Room Victini's a very potent sweeper with its 180 BP V-create, even outside of sun. Fusion Bolt and Brick Break give it coverage, naturally. What I like about using this as the starting point for our team is that it gives us some flexibility; we don't necessarily have to do a full Trick Room team, just one that uses TR Victini as a late-game sweeper and might happen to have other teammates such as Conkeldurr that benefit from TR, while being good on their own. By the same token, we don't necessarily have to go with sun, but it's definitely an option.
  16. alexwolf

    alexwolf Fear the D
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2009
    Messages:
    6,954
    I really dislike some of the nominations so far. RP Landorus is a monster and everyone knows this, and some other underused but useful pokes have alreay had their moments of glory, with good RMTs, such as TR Victini, Sharpedo, and Refresh Latias.

    As i see it, the CCATs purpose is to find viable and good mons with hidden potential, not just underused pokes. Yeah sure TR Victini is underused, but we all know what a good late game sweeper it is on Sun teams, so what would be the point of building a team with it?
  17. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    2,959
    May I direct you to my TormenTran, good sir?

    a) Has never had a "moment of glory"
    b) Has never been featured in any RMT of reasonable repute
    c) "Viable and good"

    Do we have a winner? :toast:
  18. Electrolyte

    Electrolyte On a short LoA
    is an official Team Rateris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Battle Server Moderator
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,030
    Here's my nomination:

    [​IMG]
    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Timid, 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    Substitute / Calm Mind / Thunderbolt / Flash Cannon

    Seriously, this thing is even more of a whore than Jynx. I've sweeped so many times with it- and the wide array of pokemon it can set up in is just so tantalizing. Its great typing gives it so many useful resistances and immunities. Although it's not as specially bulky as the SpDef set, nor doesnit use as much hax, it is definitely worth looking into, because of how bulky and powerful it gets when even as low as +1. It can even set up on Chansey and Blissey, who fall to break its Sub, and get Cannoned to death. Few pokemon resist its moves; primarily Ferrothorn, which Jirachi loves setting up on. Max speed allows you to outspeed E-Belt Genesect and tie with Salamence. I am not suggesting we use Rain, but noting that Jirachi becomes much scarier in it; beig able to use haxful Thunder and Water Pulse to great effect.

    Another reason why I think this Jirachi is a great pokemon to build a team around is because of its versatility. It has moderate uninvested bulk, so it can still act as a wall for Tornadus and Latios, and it has the offensive potential of sweeping as well. It can also play a role of passive damage- forcing a lot of switching, and allowing us to possibly use that to create a hazardous team. Jirachi's typing and coverage are also really open for some stable cores- Virizion work excellently with Jirachi, resisting ground and dark while nailing water/grounds that Jirachi hates. This Jirachi is also a team player- paralyzing and punching holes to open up sweeps for teammates.

    Although uncommon, this set is certainly an underused threat. I've seen many players forfiet while seeing this deadly cosmic creature- and the wails of 'Oh no! Sub CM Rachi!' are not unusual. Let's see what this thing's true potential is, outside of haxing things to death.
  19. Somebody Anonymous

    Somebody Anonymous

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2012
    Messages:
    49
    C'mon, TormenTran is even featured in the analysis, but my Deo-D set isn't found anywhere. :P
  20. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Messages:
    8,580
    Riolu should have Focus Sash, since even with Eviolite, it's only 40 HP / 40 Def / 40 SpD. Max Atk with HJK is actually nice for some HJK + Copycat HJK KOs.
  21. tehy

    tehy

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2010
    Messages:
    1,546
    Viable and good mons with hidden potential? Did somebody say... SPDEF HIPPOWDON?
    Hippowdon (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 44 Atk / 212 SDef
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Slack Off
    - Roar
    - Stealth Rock

    You know you love it. Female because randomizer. Rapes the fuck out of sun? Yes please. Walls the fuck out of many electric types, even thundurus-T with a scarf and lacking GK? Yes please. Able to wall gk-less mixnape? Yes please. I mean, this guy just takes so many hits, sets up clutch SR, and can basically roar away almost any dangerous threat after one boost. It's an awesome mixed wall/sr pivot, so you can build almost anything except other weather teams around it-balance would probably like it, stall loves it, and even offense needs some kind of an SR user;and it's always cool to go "Oh shit sweeper got a boost SAVE ME HIPPO".
    I know i should really be saying more stuff, but I feel like the list could just kind of go on.

    And shoutout to lavos spawn, for pimping out a set about as old as the pokemon itself as having "hidden potential", not to mention one that's basically self-explanatory and doesn't really have anything hidden about it. And has probably had RMT's and moments of glory.

    Same deal with riolu really alexwolf, the potential isn't hidden, it's more about building a team to access that potential. I guess a riolu team would be interesting, but eh. It's an option if we want a departure from overly used teamstyles, though.

    I'd especially like deoxys-D, i love that set. Also down for RP lando, subNP jynx, and TRtini. Venomoth would be interesting for a quickpass team, i suppose, but... eh.
  22. dice

    dice follow @smogmogu for hot content
    is a Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Arcade Star

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2012
    Messages:
    2,115
    Meet the beast himself:


    [​IMG][​IMG]

    Feraligatr @ Mystic Water / Lum Berry
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 188 HP / 252 Atk / 68 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Swords Dance
    - Waterfall
    - Aqua Jet
    - Superpower / Crunch


    Feraligatr is quite the underrated Pokemon in the current metagame. Often thought to be outclassed by its fellow Water-type powerhouses like Gyarados and Azumarill, this crocodile often isn't thought of when teambuilding, but it is quite the sweeper! Unlike Gyarados, Feraligatr is not part Flying-type meaning that he isn't weak to the omnipresent Stealth Rock, which is a major deal. In such a highly offensive metagame it is often hard to find times to spin, and teams that are hazard heavy like stall or Deoxys-D teams run a Spinblocker to protect their hazards anyways. Feraligatr also recieves Aqua Jet, meaning it can revenge kill threats such as weakened Landorus, Terrakion, and other common Sand Sweepers. Now I know what you're thinking-- "Why wouldn't I just use Azumarill, yo!". The main asset Feraligatr has over Azumarill is Swords Dance. This may not seem like much, however the ability to Swords Dance endgame allows Feraligatr to actually sweep unlike Azumarill. Azumarill is often forced to be locked into Aqua Jet allowing a Pokemon like Dragonite the ability to simply set-up in its face, while Feraligatr would never have that problem. Feraligatr also has more overall speed than Azumarill meaning it can outspeed certain Pokemon like Skarmory and bulky Rotom-W, both of which could recover in its face without the speed that Feraligatr has. Lastly, one of the coolest and underrated aspects of Feraligatr is its ability Torrent. While often thought to be "situational" and "gimmicky", it is actually a very cool and powerful ability if used correct. Feraligatr's nice bulk allows it to tank a flurry of hits, and if you plan it correct and get it below that 33% mark you really have a devestating Pokemon on your hand. It can tank a variety of hits from several common Pokemon in OU, so let's just show some examples:

    lelele (open)

    252SpAtk Celebi (+SAtk) Giga Drain vs 188HP/0SpDef Feraligatr (Neutral): 73% - 87% (264 - 312 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.

    252Atk Mold Breaker Salamence (Neutral) Outrage vs 188HP/0Def Feraligatr (Neutral): 56% - 66% (202 - 238 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.

    252Atk Terrakion (Neutral) Close Combat vs 188HP/0Def Feraligatr (Neutral): 54% - 64% (195 - 231 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.

    252Atk Mold Breaker Haxorus (+Atk) Outrage vs 188HP/0Def Feraligatr (Neutral): 66% - 77% (237 - 279 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.


    Those were just some random ones off the top of my head. Think about resisted hits like from bulky waters, too! Amoonguss.. -2 Latios.. It even has about a 1/4 chance of surviving a +1 Genesect Thunderbolt too! Anyways, after you have a Swords Dance, Rain Support, and Torrent, that's pretty much gg with Stealth Rock support and proper team support.

    As I just mentioned Feraligatr desperately needs rain support, much like Sharpedo. With Rain Feraligatr has a much easier time sweeping. For an item I typically opt for Mystic Water for a slight power boost in your STAB, however if you wish to set-up on bulky waters like Tentacruel without hoping Lady Luck is on your side, Lum Berry is for you! Another cool thing about Feraligatr is that it single-handedly can defeat the idiotic HAS core if you sack a Pokemon to Spore or you run Lum Berry on Feraligatr. The Feraligatr EV's I listed allow you to outspeed 0 Speed Rotom-W which is becoming the norm. nowadays due to the Specially Defensive spreads.

    For the last move you can choose either Crunch, if you're worried about things like Jellicent, or you can run Superpower for annoying Pokemon to rain like Ferrothorn. Overall, Feraligatr is a really cool Pokemon and I think it'd be a great Pokemon to base a CCAT upon. We could build a really solid rain offense or balance team featuring this underrated sweeper and taking the PS! ladder by storm!

    EDIT: Lavos picked TormenTran...
    lol the irony (open)
    [​IMG]
  23. King

    King

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2010
    Messages:
    597
    I would like to nominate:

    [​IMG] @ Salac Berry
    252 Atk/ 252 Spd/4 Hp
    ~Substitute
    ~Swords Dance
    ~Close Combat
    ~Stone Edge

    This set for terrakion is a fantastic set due to the changes of the black and white metagame from the release of berries. Terrak is really easy to build around as well, you have spin blockers like Gengar that take care of its fighting and ground weaknesses and you can use a Sr Tyranitar to set up the sand and be a good counter for the Psychic weaknesses. It also pairs up with LO Sheer force landorus for a good sp.attacker.

    Now for the fun part- why the set is so good:
    1st of all we all hate the Scarf Terrakions and Banded terrakions. This is a set combining both if we play our cards right and becoming a Scarf Double band mon. I know that sounds really silly but I think we all know where that comes from. +2 attack and +1 speed outspeeds most of the metagame barring Scarf latios, Scarf Gengar, Scarf Alakazam and such. But, we will have Tyranitar for that! So it's a great mon to base a team around in my opinion.
  24. ginganinja

    ginganinja Dating Haunter
    is a Forum Moderatoris a CAP Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2009
    Messages:
    3,751
    I should make some things clear here (since I already had to moderate a post or two) that just because a set is "common" doesn't mean its not for CCAT. This time, basically anything can be nominated, its not limited to the forgotten wonder theme of the previous CCATs (which several people said they didn't like). By all means, you can disagree with peoples nominations and such like, but I don't want to see flaming or whatever, just because someone suggested a set that's not "uncommon".
  25. GatoDelFuego

    GatoDelFuego No matter if it seems so hard, friends are here
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
    Mentor

    Joined:
    May 29, 2011
    Messages:
    3,001
    Landorus may "be a monster", but I have yet to see any experience of a well crafted team built around the mon itself. Most landoruses seem tacked on to sand teams, and special landorus doesn't seem locked in to that. It could fit on most offensive teams, not just sand ones, and could I think function perfectly in an environment like CCAT

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)