SPOILERS! Pokemon Sun and Moon Full Game Datamine General Discussion Thread

[Reila]

Overall, I'm disappointed with Sun and Moon.

I didn't like X/Y because the mega evolutions weren't really additions to the dex, since they are really just glorified form changes. We didn't get as many new pokemon, and since gamefreak didn't give more of them useable stats to make up for it, there weren't very many new additions to competitive play compared to Black/White. If it weren't for the introduction of Fairy types, it would have been more noticeable and caused some stagnation.

Sun/Moon are the same. Instead of mega evolutions, we have what may as well be called "Uber Beasts", which are a stark and unnecessary change in tone. The Alolan forms are much preferred to mega evolutions, since they're "permanently distinct" and therefore are more effective as world-building components, plus they aren't abominations of gameplay balance, but there could have been more of them, and then some of them are missed opportunities and it would have been interesting if they were given more base stats/slightly different spreads, since that would bolster the theme of island biogeography resulting in rapid adaptation.

And again, we have a regional dex with a lot of really cool concepts that won't see competitive play and some that are going to be hard to justify using even in-game. I'm especially angry about Golisopod, and Aquaranid; one has decent stats and a crappy ability, the other has crappy stats, a questionable movepool, and an interesting but useless ability. The fruit princess is funny but her signature move is lackluster, Lurantis is in the same boat, almost. Kommo-o doesn't get Close Combat, which is absolutely baffling, Vikavolt isn't tanky enough or fast enough to do much, Palossand is basically special Golurk in the worst way possible, we got a really interesting pikaclone that doesn't evolve because, you know, Pikachu evolved and that /totally ruined/ Pikachu's marketability.

The thing that baffles me the most is that so many of the new pokemon are so slow. I'd actually really appreciate it if they just slowed down the game in general (gen VI would have done this, but it also introduced megas, which overshadowed things like sticky web), but introducing a generation of mostly-slower pokemon isn't going to fix that; people will just pick the few that are faster and the rest will be relegated to oblivion, because making the new pokemon slower doesn't mean the existing pokemon are slower and they just stand out more. The silver lining is the new distribution of useful moves and better stats to older pokemon, which makes up for some of the disappointment, but really doesn't do nearly enough and is poorly applied in some cases (Farfetch'd, Masquerain).

I'll just stick to Pokemon Showdown. I'd love to be proved wrong on these points, because I was excited for Sun and Moon at first, but I think a lot of the new pokemon will just never get the spotlight for any niche or team strategy and the boosts to older pokemon weren't enough.

As someone who was massively disappointed with XY, I am loving SuMo. Yeah, I think the Ultra Beasts are bit over the top and that the Z-Moves is a pitiful attempt to attract the Yo-Kai Watch fandom to Pokémon, but overall the games are improvements over XY in most ways. Granted, I am a casual player as much as I am a competitive one, so I can enjoy the games even if literally all mons are not competitive viable (which is not the case).

Still not sure if those are the worthy BW sequels we deserve, but who knows, maybe they are

 

[Lord Raiden]

As someone who was massively disappointed with XY, I am loving SuMo. Yeah, I think the Ultra Beasts are bit over the top and that the Z-Moves is a pitiful attempt to attract the Yo-Kai Watch fandom to Pokémon, but overall the games are improvements over XY in most ways. Granted, I am a casual player as much as I am a competitive one, so I can enjoy the games even if literally all mons are not competitive viable (which is not the case).

Still not sure if those are the worthy BW sequels we deserve, but who knows, maybe they are

Oh, I forgot about the Z moves.

Yeah, they're really just very inelegant pandering, which is pretty much what mega evolutions were, too. It's interesting that players can turn any move into a Z-move, but I'm betting that's going to wind up being a big problem. What happens if you use Z-Stealth Rock? What happens if you use a Z-weather move? Does anyone know?

I think that gamefreak needs to stop shoving edgy/extreme things into the "Pokemon formula". It didn't feel "organic" or synergistic when they did it with mega evolutions, and it actually made the playing field even more hostile to defensive teams (especially outside Smogon's system) than it was in Black/White. Giving regional forms to existing pokemon was definitely the right way to go, and while I do disagree with some of the designs, a step in the right direction is most welcome.

Maybe we'll get lucky and they won't abandon regional forms and find more ways to make Pokemon interesting without making so many drastic or irrational design choices.

 

[Aura Flare Riolu]

Can someone confirm if breeding regular Pokemon with HA can result in Alora Pokemon with their own HA (e.g Get a Snow Warning Vulpix from Drought carrying Parents)? Kinda important for me as currently the only thing making me consider choosing Sun is getting a HA Aloran Ninetails. But I already have HA Vulpix from ORAS and I am happy to wait till Pokebank...

Actually that makes a good point. It is likely it will gain the hidden abilities.

 

[Bice]

So what I'm getting from this thread is that Sun and Moon are disappointing products of 2016 and I should cancel my pre-order?

 

[Amanroth]

So Hyper training doesn't let you actually manipulate the real IVs... just create "fake IVs" that are used to calculate stats in battle while "born IVs" are still there to determine Hidden Power and are what their children will inherit... And you can only increase IVs, there is no way to decrease an IV to zero for something like a trick room build... Well, there goes most the excitement for Hyper training. Definitely better than nothing, but it could have been handled soooooo much better.
This must also mean fairy type hidden power is still not possible. I say the best solution would have been to just make Hidden Power random with no relation to IVs and then just have something like a psychic NPC somewhere in the game that can not only tell you a pokemon's Hidden Power, but change it to a different type for you, thus letting you have whatever type Hidden Power you want without having to worry about IVs. Such a simple solution that would be so much better... Just another example of a choice that makes you wonder, "Do the people making these choices know the games even half as well as us veterans?..." lol
Looks like it is time to head back to B2W2 to start RNG abusing a bunch of perfect dittos since the dream of simply catching one and perfecting it from there is dead...

 

[Zangeese]

Wow that doesn't make sense about two regular rattata breeding giving an alolan rattata. I thought for sure that it would be the female that determined the form. Also that seems to mean that even after bank we will not be able to have non-Alolan forms with + symbols. At first I was so optimistic with Sun/Moon, I haven't looked at the story spoilers so I don't know what is happening there but it seems that a lot of fun features and quality of life improvements are gone.

Here's my take on Sun/Moon so far, bummed I will have to wait an extra week because of Europe but I am still excited.

Pros:
-Hyper Training: getting max stats with Hidden Powers is better than we expected.
-Trainer customization is back
-No HM's
-Mega Evolution is back and seems to work better now that the Pokemon use their Mega Evolved stats on the turn they Mega Evolve
-Call an ally feature seems like it might be a fun way to try to get shinies and hidden ability Pokemon
-Alolan form Pokemon are awesome, I love the look of almost all the new forms and will definitely use Raichu, Ninetails, Marowak and Persian on my team
-Mimikyu is one of my favorite Pokemon now
-Ice and Hail got some buffs with new weather setters and abilities but it should still have got either the defense buff or made ice attacks stronger
-Poke Finder and Pokemon Refresh look like they will be fun to use, QR code Pokemon seems to have potential


Cons:
-Not many new Pokemon and almost all of them are slow
-No Horde Battles, this makes me think that EV training will be back to being tedious again
-Triple and Rotation Battles: are these gone?
-No DexNav: Being able to pick which Pokemon you wanted to battle and then having the chance of higher IV's and egg moves was so useful, is there any kind of replacement?
-No sky battles: they didn't really work right in ORAS because you could battle with non-flying Pokemon while soaring in the air, but I had hope that they would be back
-No Blissey bases: I assume there is no way to gain experience as quickly now that we don't have suiciding Lvl. 100 Blisseys.
-Run Away still does not allow Pokemon to escape from Shadow Tag (At least let it have some use)
-Dark Void nerf seems like too much, I think it would have been enough to have let it only be used by Darkrai, since it is always banned from competitions anyway.
-No move tutors: to be expected, but still annoying


Neutral:
-Bummed about the Gengar nerf, but it didn't make sense to have Levitate before, so I can accept it and Mega Gengar will still be amazing.
-The Talonflame and Mega-Kangaskhan nerfs seem acceptable
-The wait for Pokemon Bank is not too long, but I hope it doesn't crash and then be delayed like for X/Y.


Unsure:
-Game difficulty: I haven't read how the difficulty of the game compares but it seems like it will not be as hard as Challenge mode Black 2
-Breeding: Does the destiny knot + everstone combo still work as well as before?
-Is there anyway to speed up hatching eggs? From the text it seems like both the bicycle and hatching o-powers are gone, does that mean that hatching will be even more tedious?
-Synchronize: Is it still the same percentage chance?

 

[Domens]

Are there some people that are playing the game in this subforum? If so, what do you think of it? I just want to know if it's good like it seems to be or not

 

[Riah]

EDIT #4: Includes all pokemon within the Alola dex!

So I wasn't really sure where to post this, but I compiled a list of all legal pre-bank egg moves as of now (unless the QR code catch thing really changes things up)! I used the basic forms of the pokemon, as well as just 1 parent compable of learning the egg moves for the sake of convenience (as well as to save breeding time). Anything in the field egg group only has it's egg moves listed as Smeargle is in the Alola dex, thus making any of the 4 possible. Please let me know if I missed something or got anything wrong!

Big Wall o' Egg Moves

Alola Pokemon

Rowlet (Flying): Haze/Confuse Ray: Zubat; Defog: Rufflet; Baton Pass: Oricorio
-Illegal: Curse (Farfetch'd); Ominous Wind (Xatu)


Litten (Field): Nasty Plot/Body Slam/Crunch/Fake Out/Revenge/Heat Wave


Popplio (Water 1/Field): Charm/Amnesia/Aqua Ring/Aromatic Mist/Perish Song/Wonder Room


Pikipek (Flying): Tailwind/Brave Bird: Rufflet; Mirror Move: Spearow
-Illegal: Boomburst (Noibat/Chatot), Uproar(Hoothoot/Doduo)


Yungoos (Field): Revenge/Last Resort


Grubbin (Bug): Harden: Pinsir; Mud Shot: Surskit (bred w/Poliwag for Mud Shot)
- Illegal: Electroweb (Galvantula);
- Legal via QR: Endure (Sewaddle)


Crabrawler (Water 3): Wide Guard: Tirtouga; Endeavour: Archen
-Illegal: Amnesia (Krabby/Lileep); Superpower (Requires ORAS move tutor Water 3 compatible pokemon)


Oricorio (Flying): Pluck: Spearow, Tailwind: Rufflet, Safeguard: It's a TM
-Illegal: Captivate (Woobat)


Cutiefly (Bug/Fairy): Baton Pass: Ledyba; Speed Swap: A-Raichu; Moonblast/Bestow: Clefairy
-Illegal: Skill Swap (Spritzee)


Rockruff (Field): Fire Fang/Thunder Fang/Crush Claw/Sucker Punch/Thrash


Wishiwashi (Water 2): Mist/Water Sport/Water Pulse: Wailmer; Muddy Water: Barboach


Mareanie (Water 1): Stockpile/Swallow/Spit Up: Shellos (bred w/Drifloon for moves); Haze: Surskit


Mudbray (Field): Body Slam/Double-Edge/Magnitude/Close Combat/Mud Bomb


Dewpider (Water 1/Bug): Stockpile/Spit Up: Shellos
-Illegal: Power Split (Shuckle)
-Legal via QR: Aurora Beam (Spheal)


Formantis (Grass): Aromatherapy/Giga Drain/Leaf Storm: Bellossom
-Illegal: Defog (Requires TM with Grass compatible from D/P/PT)
-Legal via QR: Weather Ball (Bellsprout/Roselia)


Morelull (Grass): Posion Powder/Stun Spore/Leech Seed: Exeggcute
-Illegal: Amnesia (Bulbasaur + Slowpoke required)


Salandit (Monster/Dragon):
-Illegal: Belch (Ekans); Fake Out (Scraggy/Squirtle + Smeargle required); Knock Off (Requires ORAS move tutor Monster/Dragon compatible pokemon)


Stufful (Field): Ice Punch/Thunder Punch/Force Palm/Endure/Mega Kick/Stomping Tantrum


Bounsweet (Grass): Synthesis/Play Rough: Comfey; Charm: Cottonee
-Illegal: Acupressure (Maractus), Feint (Breloom)


Comfey (Grass): Lucky Chant: Oddish; After You: Petilil
-Illegal: Amnesia (Bulbasaur + Slowpoke required), Endure (Bulbasaur + Shieldon/Paras + Heracross required)


Oranguru (Field): Extrasensory/Wonder Room/Psychic Terrain


Passimian (Field): Siesmic Toss/Vital Throw/Quick Guard/Iron Head/Quick Attack/Feint


Wimpod (Bug/Water 3): Spikes: Shellder; Aqua Jet/Wide Guard: Tirtouga, Harden: Pinsir; Metal Claw: Scizor


Sandyghast (Amorphous): Amnesia/Stockpile/Swallow/Spit Up: Drifloon; Destiny Bond: Ghastly
-Illegal: Ancient Power (Lileep)


Pyukumuku (Water 1): Endure: Poliwag (bred w/ Corsola for Endure); Venom Drench: Mareanie,
-Illegal: Bestow (Passed from Zizagoon/Smeargle -> Delibird -> Froakie); Tickle (Omanyte)

Komala (Field): Charm/Wish/Play Rough/Sing

Turtonator (Monster/Dragon): Wide Guard: Tirtouga; Head Smash: Cranidos,
-Illegal: Fire Spin (Charmander); Revenge (Druddigon)

Togedemaru (Field/Fairy): Reversal/Present/Encore/Twineedle/Wish/Fake Out/Tickle/Flail/Disarming Voice

Mimikyu (Amorphous): Grudge/Nightmare/Destiny Bond/Curse: Ghastly (bred w/ Misdreavus for Grudge)

Bruxish (Water 2): Water Pulse: Wailmer; Poison Fang/Ice Fang/Rage: Carvanha

Drampa (Monster/Dragon): Hurricane/Mist/Dragon Rush: Dragnonite (bred w/Wingull/Surskit for Mist)
-Illegal: Play Rough (Skrelp), Razor Wind (Tropius + Absol required)

Jangmo-o (Dragon): Dragon Breath: Gible
-Illegal: Counter (Goomy + Scraggy required)
-Legal via QR: Reversal (Axew + Ryhorn required)

Alola Form Pokemon

A-Rattata (Field): Snatch/Stockpile/Fury Swipes/Switcheroo/Counter/Reversal/Uproar/Swallow/Me First/Revenge/Final Gambit


A-Raichu (Field/Fairy): Bide/Reversal/Present/Encore/Wish/Charge/Double Slap/Fake Out/Thunder Punch/Tickle/Flail/Endure/Lucky Chant/Bestow/Disarming Voice/Electric Terrain


A-Sandshrew (Field): Flail/Counter/Icicle Spear/Metal Claw/Crush Claw/Night Slash/Icicle Crash/Endure/Chip Away/Curse/Amnesia


A-Vulpix (Field): Freeze-Dry/Hypnosis/Flail/Spite/DisableHowl/Agility/Encore/Moonblast/Power Swap/Charm/Tail Slap/Extrasensory
-Illegal: Secret Power (No pokemon in the Alola dex can be sketched for the move).


A-Meowth (Field): Hynosis/Assist/Foul Play/Spite/Charm/Amnesia/Parting Shot/Flail/Flatter/Punishment/Snatch/Covet


A-Geodude (Mineral): Block/Wide Guard/Magnet Rise: Probopass; Flail/Counter: Sudowoodo
-Illegal: Endure (Dwebble + Heracross/Yamask + Stunfisk required); Rock Climb (Ferrothorn); Curse/Screech (Steelix)
-Legal via QR: Autotomize (Honedge)

A-Grimer (Amorphous): Spite/Curse/Mean Look: Ghastly; Stockpile/Swallow/Spit Up: Drifloon; Imprison: Misdreavus
-Illegal: Shadow Sneak/Scary Face (Pumpkaboo); Clear Smog/Assurance/Haze (Weezing); Pursuit (Duskull)

A-Exeggutor (Grass): Lucky Chant/Moonlight/Giga Drain/Natural Gift/Grassy Terrain: Gloom; Leaf Storm: Bellossom
-Illegal: Block (Tangela); Power Swap/Nature Power/Synthesis (Seedot bred w/Smeargle for Power Swap); Curse (Ferroseed); Skill Swap (Requires Exeggutor from previous gen w/Skill Swap)
-Legal via QR: Ingrain (Roselia), Ancient Power (Chikorita bred w/Shieldon for move)

A-Marowak (Monster): Ancient Power/Iron Head/Endure: Shieldon; Perish Song: Lapras; Chip Away/Screech: Cranidos
-Illegal: Detect (Treecko); Double Kick (Nidoran-M); Skull Bash (Squirtle)


A-Diglett (Field): Feint Attack/Metal Sound/Ancient Power/Pursuit/Beat Up/Thrash/Reversal/Headbutt/Endure/Final Gambit/Memento

Returning Pokemon

Gen 1

GEN 1

Spearow (Flying): Astonish/Feint Attack: Murkrow; Quick Attack/Steel Wing/Razor Wind: Fletchling; Whirlwind/Scary Face: Rufflet; Feather Dance: Rowlet
-Illegal: Sky Attack (Pidove); Tri Attack/Uproar (Dodrio)


Clefairy (Fairy): Mimic: Jigglypuff, Present/Tickle: Pikachu (bred w/Smeargle); Amnesia: Castform (bred w/Drifloon)
-Illegal: Misty Terrain/Heal Pulse (Sprtizee); Covet (Skitty)
-Legal via QR: Aromatherapy (Roselia); Belly Drum/Splash (Marill bred w/Psyduck + Poliwag required); Wish (Togetic)


Jigglypuff (Fairy): Gravity: Clefairy; Sleep Talk/Present: Pikachu (bred w/Smeargle);
-Illegal: Captivate/Covet/Feint Attack (Skitty); Punishment/Fake Tears (Mawile); Heal Pulse (Spritzee)
-Legal via QR: Wish/Last Resort (Togetic); Perish Song (Marill bred w/Lapras)


Zubat (Flying): Brave Bird/Quick Attack/Steel Wing: Fletchling; Feint Attack/Nasty Plot/Pursuit: Honchkrow; Whirlwind: Rufflet
-Illegal: Zen Headbutt/Hypnosis (Hoothoot); Venom Drench/Gust (Woobat bred w/Seviper for Venom Drench); Giga Drain (requires ORAS tutor with Flying compatible pokemon)


Paras (Bug/Grass): Agility/Metal Claw/Pursuit: Scyther; Bug Bite/Psybeam: Butterfree; Fell Stinger: Ariados; Leech Seed: Cottonee; Natural Gift/Sweet Scent: Oddish; Screech: Ninjask
-Illegal: Counter (Heracross); Wide Guard (Turtwig); Rototiller (Cacnea bred from Lopunny + Smeargle)
-Legal via QR: Endure/Flail (Sewaddle)


Psyduck (Water 1/Field): Clear Smog/Confuse Ray/Cross Chop/Encore/Foresight/Future Sight/Hypnosis/Mud Bomb/Psybeam/Refresh/Simple Beam/Yawn/Sleep Talk/Synchronoise/Yawn
-Illegal: Secret Power (No pokemon in the Alola pokedex can be sketched for the move).


Mankey (Field): Beat Up/Counter/Encore/Focus Punch/Foresight/Meditate/Night Slash/Revenge/Reversal/Sleep Talk/Smelling Salts


Growlithe (Field): Body Slam/Close Combat/Covet/Crunch/Double-Edge/Double Kick/Fire Spin/Flare Blitz/Heat Wave/Howl/Iron Tail/Morning Sun/Thrash/Iron Tail


Poliwag (Water 1): Endure/Refresh/Splash: Milotic; Haze/Mist: Surskit; Water Pulse/Water Sport: Psyduck; Encore: Popplio
-Illegal: Endeavor (Mudkip),
Legal via QR: Ice Ball (Spheal)


Abra (Human-like): Fire Punch/Thunder Punch: Electabuzz; Knock Off: Machop; Skill Swap: Spinda (bred w/Smeargle)
-Illegal: Barrier/Encore/Guard Swap (Mr.Mime); Ice Punch/Power Trick (Meditite); Guard Split (Elgeyem); Psycho Shift (No pokemon in Alola dex are can be skecthed for the move).


Machop (Human-like): Close Combat/Smelling Salts/Heavy Slam: Hariyama; Fire Punch/Thunder Punch: Magmar; Counter: Lucario; Meditate: Drowzee
-Illegal: Bullet Punch (Hitmonchan), Encore/Tickle/Quick Guard (Mr.Mime); Power Trick/Ice Punch (Meditite); Rolling Kick (Hitmontop)


Tentacool (Water 3): Aqua Ring/Mirror Coat/Bubble: Corsola; Aurora Beam: Shellder
-Illegal: Rapid Spin (Kabuto bred w/Squirtle for Rapid Spin); Tickle/Haze (Omastar bred w/Surskit for Haze); Confuse Ray (Lileep); Muddy Water (Clauncher); Knock Off/Acupressure (Skorupi)


Slowpoke (Monster/Water 1): Block: Shieldon; Wonder Room/Future Sight: Psyduck (bred w/Smeargle for Future Sight); Mud Sport: Shellos; Belly Drum: Poliwag
-Illegal: Me First (Lickitung); Belch (Seel bred w/Seviper)
-Legal via QR/Other: Sleep Talk/Snore (Snorlax via Snorlium Z event); Stomp (Rhyhorn)


Shellder (Water 3): Aqua Ring/Rock Blast: Corsola; Barrier/Screech/Water Pulse/Bubble Beam: Tentacruel
-Illegal: Mud Shot/Rapid Spin/Take Down (Kabuto bred w/Squirtle + Seel for Rapid Spin + Take Down), Twineedle (Skorupi bred w/Beedrill)


Gastly (Amorphous): Astonish/Grudge/Perish Song/Psywave: Misdreavus; Disable: Grimer
-Illegal: Clear Smog/Haze (Weezing); Reflect Type (Stunfisk bred w/Omanyte + Tentacruel); Scary Face (Yamask); Ice Punch/Fire Punch/Thunder Punch (Dusclops)
-Legal via QR: Smog (Litwick)


Drowzee (Human-like): Assist/Skill Swap: Spinda (bred w/Smeargle); Role Play/Nasty Plot/Psycho Cut: Kadabra; Thuder Punch/Fire Punch: Magmar
-Illegal: Ice Punch (Meditite); Guard Swap/Barrier (Mr.Mime); Secret Power (Requires ORAS TM Human-like compatible pokemon)
-Legal via QR: Flatter (Gothita)


Chansey (Fairy): Gravity/Metronome: Clefairy; Natural Gift/Helping Hand: Cottonee (bred w/Oddish for Natural Gift); Present: Pikachu (bred w/Smeagle)
-Illegal: Heal Bell/Mud Bomb (Skitty bred w/Smeargle for Mud Bomb); Counter (Breloom); Endure (Pachurisu); Seismic Toss (Mawile bred w/Smeargle)
-Legal via QR: Last Resort (Togetic, requires luck incense); Aromatherapy (Roselia)


Kangaskhan (Monster): Disable/Trump Card: Slowking, Endeavor/Double-Edge/Focus Energy: Cubone;
-Illegal: Circle Throw/Uproar (Whismur bred w/Smeargle); Focus Punch (Charmander bred w/Scraggy); Foresight (Mudkip)
-Legal via QR: Counter/Crush Claw/Hammer Arm/Stomp (Rhydon bred w/Zangoose + Lucario for Crush Claw + Counter)


Goldeen (Water 2): Aqua Tail/Hydro Pump: Gyarados; ; Skull Bash: Sharpedo; Mud-slap/Mud Sport: Barboach; Body Slam: Wailmer (bred w/Torkoal)
-Illegal: Sleep Talk (requires Wailmer bred w/Whismur); Signal Beam/Psybeam/Mud Shot: Remoraid (bred w/Poliwag for Mud Shot)


Scyther (Bug): Baton Pass/Bug Buzz/Silver Wind: Ledyba
-Illegal: Counter (Heracross); Reversal/Quick Guard (Escavalier); Defog/Steel Wing (Requires previous gen TM/HM Bug compatible pokemon)
-Legal via QR: Endure (Sewaddle)


Electabuzz (Human-like): Cross Chop/Dynamic Punch/Karate Chop: Machop; Hammer Arm: Pangoro; Meditate: Drowzee; Feint: Lucario
-Illegal: Ice Punch/Focus Punch (Hitmnchan); Rolling Kick (Hitmonlee); Barrier (Mr.Mime)


Magmar (Human-like): Cross Chop/Dynamic Punch/Karate Chop/Focus Energy: Machop; Belly Drum: Hariyama; Screech: Electabuzz
-Illegal: Mach Punch/Flare Blitz (Monfero); Belch (Croagunk); Barrier/Power Swap (Mr.Mime); Iron Tail (requires previous gen TM Human-like compatible pokemon); Mega Punch: Hitmonchan


Pinsir (Bug): Feint Attack/Feint: Trapinch; Fury Attack/Bug Bite: Beedrill; Quick Attack: Surskit
-Illegal: Close Combat (Heracross); Me First (Accelgor)
-Legal via QR: Flail (Sewaddle)


Lapras (Monster/Water 1): Curse/Ancient Power: Tirtouga; Dragon Dance: Dratini; Future Sight: Psyduck (bred w/Smeargle); Refresh (Corsola); Dragon Pulse: Turtonator
-Illegal: Foresight/Whirlpool (Mudkip); Fissure (Stunfisk); Freeze-Dry/Avalanche (Aurorus); Tickle (Omanyte)
-Legal via QR/Other: Sleep Talk (Snorlax via Snorlium Z event); Horn Drill (Rhyhorn)


Eevee (Field): Captivate/Charm/Covet/Curse/Detect/Endure/Fake Tears/Flail/Natural Gift/Stored Power/Tickle/Wish/Yawn


Aerodactyl (Flying): Assurance/Pursuit/Tailwind: Murkrow; Roost/Steel Wing: Fletchling; Whirlwind: Rufflet; Dragon Breath: Archen; Wide Guard (Wingull bred w/Tirtouga)
-Illegal: Foresight (Hoothoot); Curse (Farfetch'd);


Snorlax (Monster): Belch/Zen Headbutt/Curse: Slowpoke (Bred w/Seviper for Belch, Zen Headbutt can only be passed to Munchlax); Pursuit: Cranidos; Double-Edge: Cubone
-Illegal: Natural Gift/Whirlwind (Tropius); Charm (Tyrunt); After You (Mareep bred w/Smeargle); Counter (Rhyhorn bred w/Slakoth); Fissure (Lapras + Stunfisk required); Self-Destruct (requires previous gen Snorlax, can only be passed to Munchlax)


Dratini (Dragon/Water 1): Dragon Breath/Dragon Pulse: Goomy; Aqua Jet: Psyduck; Haze/Mist: Surskit; Supersonic/Water Pulse: Wingull
-Illegal: Extreme Speed (Requires previous gen Dratini); Iron Tail (requires previous gen TM compatible Dragon/Water 1 pokemon)

Gen 2

GEN 2

Ledyba (Bug): Bide/Screech: Vibrava; Bug Bite/Silver Wind/Tailwind/Psybeam: Butterfree
-Illegal: Encore (Shuckle; Drain Punch/Focus Punch (requires ORAS tutor compatible Bug pokemon); Knock Off (Skorupi); Dizzy Punch (Volbeat bred w/Lopunny)

Spinarak (Bug): Baton Pass: Ledyba; Rage Powder/Psybeam: Butterfree; Pursuit/Night Slash: Scyther; Sonic Boom: Vibrava
-Illegal: Toxic Spikes/Twineedle (Beedrill); Electroweb/Signal Beam (Joltik); Megahorn (Heracross)

Chinchou (Water 2): Water Pulse/Whirlpool/Amesia/Mist: Wailmer; Screech/Agility: Carvanha
-Illegal: Shock Wave (requires previous gen TM compatible Water 2 pokemon); Soak/Psybeam: Remoraid

Sudowoodo (Mineral): Stealth Rock/Self-Destruct/Defense Curl/Rollout: Geodude; Harden/Headbutt: Roggenrola
-Illegal: Curse/Sand Tomb (Onix); Endure (Dwebble + Sewaddle required)

Murkrow (Flying): Assurance/Mirror Moe/Drill Peck: Spearow; Whirlwind/Roost: Wingull; Confuse Ray/Screech: Golbat; Feather Dance: Rowlet
-Illegal: Sky Attack (Pidove); Psycho Shift (Hoothoot); Perish Song (Swablu); Flatter (Woobat bred w/Smeargle)

Misdreavus (Amorphous): Curse/Destiny Bond/Spite/Sucker Punch: Gastly; Memento/Screech: Grimer; Ominous Wind (Drifloon)
-Illegal: Nasty Plot/Shadow Sneak (Spiritomb); Me First (Stunfisk bred w/Ducklett + Fletchling)
-Legal via QR: Imprision (Litwick); Skill Swap/Wonder Room (Solosis)

Snubbull (Field/Fairy): Close Combat/Crunch/Double-Edge/Fake Tears/Feint Attack/Fire Fang/Focus Punch/Heal Bell/Ice Fang/Metronome/Mimic/Present/Smelling Salts/Snore/Thunder Fang

Sneasel (Field): Assist/Avalance/Bite/Counter/Crush Claw/Double Hit/Fake Out/Feint/Ice Punch/Ice Shard/Icicle Crash/Punishment/Pursuit/Spite/Throat Chop

Corsola (Water 1/Water 3): Amnesia/Water Pulse: Slowpoke; Screech/Barrier: Tentacool; Bide/Curse: Tirtouga; Head Smash: Relicanth; Icicle Spear: Shellder; Confuse Ray/Mist: Lapras; Liquidation: Dewpider
-Illegal: Ingrain (Lileep); Nature Power (Lotad); Camouflage: Stunfisk

Delibird (Water 1/Field): Aurora Beam/Future Sight/Splash/Rapid Spin/Ice Ball/Ice Shard/Ice Punch/Fake Out/Bestow/Icy Wind/Freeze-Dry/Destiny Bond/Spikes

Skarmory (Flying): Assurance/Drill Peck/Pursuit: Spearow; Whirlwind/Brave Bird: Rufflet;
-Illegal: Curse (Farfetch'd bred w/Smeargle); Endure/Stealth Rock (requires previous gen TM/tutor Flying compatible pokemon); Guard Swap (Natu); Sky Attack: Pidove

Miltank (Field): Belch/Curse/Dizzy Punch/Double-Edge/Endure/Hammer Arm/Heart Stamp/Helping Hand/Natural Gift/Present/Punishment/Reversal/Seismic Toss/Sleep Talk

Gen 3

GEN 3

Wingull (Water 1/Flying): Aqua Ring/Twister: Corsola; Wide Guard: Tirtouga;
-Illegal: Knock Off (Farfetch'd); Gust (Pidgey);

Surskit (Water 1/Bug): Aqua Jet: Tirtouga; Bug Bite/Psybeam: Butterfree; Endure: Corsola; Mind Reader/Hydro Pump/Mud Shot: Poliwrath;
-Illegal: Foresight (Mudkip); Fell Stinger: Beedrill; Power Split: Shuckle; Signal Beam: Remoraid

Makuhita (Human-like): Counter/Detect/Feint: Lucario; Dynamic Punch/Foresight/Cross Chop/Wake-Up Slap/Wide Guard: Machop; Feint Attack: Magmar
-Illegal: Bullet Punch/Helping Hand (Hitmonchan)
-Legal via QR: Chip Away/Focus Punch (Conkeldurr)

Nosepass (Mineral): Magnitude/Rollout/Stealth Rock/Double-Edge: Geodude
-Illegal: Endure (Dwebble bred w/Sewaddle)

Sableye (Human-like): Recover/Trick: Kadabra; Nasty Plot: Drowzee; Feint: Lucario
-Illegal: Metal Burst (Bisharp); Moonlight (Volbeat); Imprison (Elgeyem); Sucker Punch (Spinda)
-Legal via QR: Flatter (Gothita)

Carvanha (Water 2): Ancient Power/Hydro Pump/Double Edge: Relicanth; Brine: Wailmer; Thrash: Gyarados; Psychic Fangs (Bruxish)
-Illegal: Destiny Bond (Qwilfish); Swift (Remoraid bred w/Buizel)

Wailmer (Water 2/Field): Aqua Ring/Body Slam/Clear Smog/Curse/Defense Curl/Double-Edge/Fissure/Sleep Talk/Snore/Soak/Thrash/Tickle/Zen Headbutt
-Illegal: HSOWA (Skitty)

Torkoal (Field): Clear Smog/Endure/Eruption/Fissure/Flame Burst/Skull Bash/Sleep Talk/Super Power/Yawn

Spinda (Field/Human-like): Assist/Baton Pass/Disable/Encore/Fake Tears/Fake Out/Guard Split/Icy Wind/Psycho Cut/Role Play/Smelling Salts/Trick/Water Pulse/Wish/Spotlight
-Illegal: Psycho Shift (No pokemon in the Alola dex can be sketched for the move)

Trapinch (Bug): Focus Energy/Fury Cutter/Quick Attack: Scyther; Gust/Bug Bite: Butterfree; Mud Shot: Surskit (bred w/Poliwag)
-Illegal: Singal Beam (Venonat)
-Legal via QR: Endure/Flail (Sewaddle)

Barboach (Water 2): Dragon Dance/Thrash/Hydro pump/Flail: Gyarados; Spark/Take Down: Chinchou; Whirlpool: Wailmer; Mud Shot/Muddy Water: Relicanth (bred from Poliwag + Shellos for Mud Shot + Muddy Water)
-Illegal: Earth Power (requires ORAS tutor compatible Water 2 pokemon)

Feebas (Water 1/Dragon): Brine/Confuse Ray/Mist: Lapras; Mirror Coat: Corsola; Dragon Breath/Dragon Pulse: Goomy; Mud Sport: Shellos; Hypnosis: Poliwag; Haze: Surskit
-Illegal: Iron Tail (requires previous gen TM/tutor Water 1/Dragon compatible pokemon); Tickle (Omanyte)

Castform (Fairy/Amorphous): Amnesia/Hex/Ominous Wind: Drifloon; Cosmic Power/Lucky Chant: Clefairy; Disable (Grimer)
-Illegal: Guard Swap (Mawile bred w/Smeargle); Clear Smog (Koffing); Reflect Type (bred from Omanyte + Tentacruel w/Reflect Type)
-Legal via QR: Future Sight (Solosis)

Absol (Field): Assurance/Baton Pass/Curse/Double-Edge/Feint Attack/Hex/Magic Coat/Me First/Mean Look/Megahorn/Play Rough/Punishment/Zen Headbutt

Snorunt (Fairy/Mineral): Spikes: Klefki; Avalanche/Weather Ball: Vanilluxe; Block: Sudowoodo; Disable/Rollout: Jigglypuff; Switcheroo: Cottonee (bred w/Cacnea + Lopunny)
-Illegal: Fake Tears (Mawile); Hex (Yamask); Bide (Pachurisu)

Relicanth (Water 1/ Water 2): Amnesia/Water Sport/Zen Headbutt: Psyduck; Snore/Magnitude/Aqua Tail: Barboach; Muddy Water/Mud-Slap: Shellos; Mud Shot: Poliwag; Brine: Tirtouga; Skull Bash: Sharpedo; Sleep Talk: Wailmer (bred w/Smeargle)

Luvdisc (Water 2): Aqua Jet: Carvanha; Aqua Ring/Heal Pulse/Water Sport: Alomomola; Brine/Splash: Wailmer; Supersonic: Goldeen; Mud Sport: Barboach
-Illegal: Entrainment (Remoraid bred from Seel + Smeargle)

Bagon (Dragon): Dragon Dance/Dragon Rage/Hydro Pump/Thrash/Twister: Gyarados; Fire Fang/Dragon Rush: Garchomp; Endure: Turtonator
-Illegal: Defense Curl (requires previous gen tutor compatible Dragon pokemon)

Gen 4

GEN 4

Cranidos (Monster): Crunch: Garchomp; Curse: Slowpoke; Double-Edge/Thrash: Cubone; Iron Head: Shieldon
-Illegal: Iron Tail (Aron); Whirlwind (Tropius); Slam (Lickitung)
-Legal via QR: Stomp/Hammer Arm (Rhyhorn)

Shieldon (Monster): Body Slam/Fissure: Lapras; Focus Energy/Double-Edge/Headbutt: Cubone; Curse: Slowpoke; Scary Face/Screech: Cranidos
-Illegal: Wide Guard (Mudkip + Tirtouga required); Stealth Rock (Tyrunt); Fissure (Lapras + Stunfisk required)
-Leagl via QR: Counter (Lucario + Rhyhorn)/Guard Split (Spinda bred w/Smeargle + Rhyhorn)/Rock Blast (Rhyhorn)

Shellos (Water 1/Amorphous): Sludge/Memento/Acid Armor: Grimer; Amnesia/Curse/Trump Card/Yawn: Slowking; Stockpile/Spit Up/Swallow: Drifloon; Mist: Wingull; Mirror Coat/Brine: Corsola; Counter: Pyukumuku
-Illegal: Clear Smog (Weezing); Fissure (Stunfisk)

Drifloon (Amorphous): Body Slam: Shellos; Destiny Bond/Hypnosis: Gastky; Memento/Disable: Grimer; Weather Ball: Castform
-Illegal: Tailwind/Defog (requires previous gen tutor/TM Amorphous compatible pokemon); Haze/Clear Smog (Koffing)

Gible (Dragon/Monster): Body Slam/Dragon Breath/Outrage: Goodra; Twister/Thrash: Gyarados; Iron Head: Shieldon; Double-Edge: Cubone; Scary Face: Bagon
-Illegal: Iron Tail/Metal Claw (Aron); Mud Shot (Marshtomp); Rock Climb (Scraggy)

Lucario (Field/Human-like): Agility/Bite/Blaze Kick/Bullet Punch/Circle Throw/Cross Chop/Crunch/Detect/Follow Me/Iron Defense/Low Kick/Mind Reader/Sky Uppercut/Vacuum Wave

Finneon (Water 2): Splash/Brine: Wailmer; Sweet Kiss/CHarm/Agility/Flail: Luvdisc; Signal Beam: Chinchou; Tickle/Aqua Tail: Barboach
-Illegal: Aurora Beam/Psybeam (Remoraid)

Gen 5+6

GEN 5 + 6

Lillipup (Field): After You/Charm/Endure/Fire Fang/Howl/Ice Fang/Lick/Mud-Slap/Pursuit/Sand Attack/Thunder Fang/Yawn/Psychic Fangs

Roggenrola (Mineral): Gravity/Lock-On/Wide Guard: Probopass; Magnitude/Heavy Slam: Golem; Rock Tomb: Sudowoodo; Take Down: Trubbish
-Illegal: Curse (Onix)
-Legal via QR: Autotomize (Honedge)

Cottonee (Grass/Fairy): Encore: Clefairy; Worry Seed/Natural Gift: Exeggcute; Captivate: Steenee
-Illegal: Tickle (Tangela); Beat Up (Seedot bred w/Smeargle); Switcheroo (Cacnea bred w/Lopunny); Memento (Hoppip); Fake Tears (Mawile)
-Legal via QR: Grass Whistile (Roselia)

Lilligant (Grass): Charm: Cottonee; Ingrain: Trevenant; Natural Gift/Sweet Scent: Oddish; Worry Seed: Exeggcute
-Illegal: Bide (Seedot);
-Legal via QR: Grass whistle (Roselia); Healing Wish (Cherubi bred w/Clefairy); Endure (Paras bred w/Sewaddle)

Sandile (Field): Beat Up/Counter/Double-Edge/Fire Fang/Focus Energy/Mean Look/Pursuit/Rock Climb/Thunder Fang/Uproar/Power Trip/Me First

Tiroutga (Water 1/Water 3): Body Slam/Water Pulse: Shellos; Liquidation: Dewpider; Whirlpool/Iron Defense: Shellder; Rock Throw: Archen; Slam: Dratini; Flail: Corsola
-Illegal: Knock Off (Skorupi); Guard Swap (Wooper bred w/Smeargle)

Archen (Flying/Water 3): Defog: Bravairy; Steel Wing: Fletchling; Earth Power/Head Smash: Corsola (bred w/Relicanth); Bite: Zubat
-Illegal: Knock Off: (Farfetch'd); Dragon Pulse: (Swablu); Switcheroo (Corphish bred w/Inkay); Ally Switch (requires previous gen TM Xatu)

Trubbish (Mineral): Spikes: Klefki; Rollout/Rock Blast/Mud Sport/Self-Destruct: Geodude; Sand Attack: Roggenrola
-Illegal: Curse (Onix); Haze (Yamask)

Vanillie (Mineral): Ice Shard/Powder Snow: Snorunt; Manget Rise/Iron Defense: Probopass; Klefki: Imprison
-Illegal: Natural Gift/Water Pulse (requires previous gen TM Glalie)
-Legal via QR: Autotomize (Honedge)

Emolga (Field): Air Slash/Astonish/Baton Pass/Charm/Covet/Ion Deluge/Iron Tail/Roost/Shock Wave/Tickle/Speed Swap

Alomomola (Water 1/Water 2): Endure/Refresh/Mirror Coat: Corsola; Tickle: Whiscash; Mist: Surskit; Pain Split: Pyukumuku

Vullaby (Flying): Foul Play/Mean Look: Murkrow; Roost/Steel Wing: Flethling; Scary Face: Rufflet
-Illegal: Knock Off (Farfetch'd); Fake Tears (Woobat bred w/Smeargle)

Ded Bird (Flying): Quick Guard: Archeops; Tailwind: Rufflet;
-Illegal: Snatch (requires previous gen TM compatible Murkrow/Zubat)

Pancham (Field/Human-Like): Foul Play/Me First/Quash/Quick Guard/Storm Throw/Power Trip

Goomy (Dragon): Endure: Turtonator
-Illegal: Counter (Scraggy + Smeargle required); Iron Tail (requires previous gen TM/tutor Gible/Axew); Poison Tail/Acid Armor (Skrelp + Shellos bred from Grimer required for Acid Armor); Curse (Tyrunt + Slowpoke required)


Klefki (Mineral): Iron Defense/Lock-On: Probopass
-Illegal: Switcheroo (Snorunt + Cottonee bred from Cacnea required)

Phantump (Grass/Amorphous): Bestow: Exeggcute; Grudge: Mimikyu (bred w/Ghastly)
-Illegal: Venom Drench (Roserade);
-Legal via QR: Imprison (Litwick)

 

[gabriel]

Good point. By the sounds of it, Pokepelago should be fast enough for people to prepare their gen 8 teams.

Seriously though, maxing one stat on one Pokemon takes over FIVE DAYS. One EV every 30 minutes, apparently.

Do you ev train even if your 3ds is off? And it only works one pokemon at a time, right?

 

[Azery]

Do you ev train even if your 3ds is off? And it only works one pokemon at a time, right?

It's been confirmed on 4chan that it does work while your 3ds is off and it can work on multiple pokemon(20~ at the very least). As I see it, it's a nice way to get some evs on Pokemon you don't want to actively train at the moment. The amount of evs you get increases the more you boost up the Poke Pelago too(Goes up to 4/8), so once it's maxed out, you'll probably be able to leave Pokemon in there over night and wake up to see them having made quite the progression in that department. Good for ev training en masse in the background while you're actively ev training/doing other things.

 

[HeartlessAngel1993]

So Hyper training doesn't let you actually manipulate the real IVs... just create "fake IVs" that are used to calculate stats in battle while "born IVs" are still there to determine Hidden Power and are what their children will inherit... And you can only increase IVs, there is no way to decrease an IV to zero for something like a trick room build... Well, there goes most the excitement for Hyper training. Definitely better than nothing, but it could have been handled soooooo much better.
This must also mean fairy type hidden power is still not possible. I say the best solution would have been to just make Hidden Power random with no relation to IVs and then just have something like a psychic NPC somewhere in the game that can not only tell you a pokemon's Hidden Power, but change it to a different type for you, thus letting you have whatever type Hidden Power you want without having to worry about IVs. Such a simple solution that would be so much better... Just another example of a choice that makes you wonder, "Do the people making these choices know the games even half as well as us veterans?..." lol
Looks like it is time to head back to B2W2 to start RNG abusing a bunch of perfect dittos since the dream of simply catching one and perfecting it from there is dead...

OK, so if I'm reading this right.... that means, say I take a Hyper Trained Gardevoir into battle in game vs or WiFi. It won't have those trained IVs in game, but it will over wifi?

 

[Groudon ex]

Losing Super Training and horde battles is a bummer but not a deal breaker for me. At least with vitamins + power items you can cut down the maximum amount of battles required to 32, or to 16 with pokerus. That's still considerably more than before when we could train using horde battles (which could take as few as 11 or 6 battles without vitamins), but it's not like it'll take too overly long either.

If on average you defeat one pokemon every ~40 seconds or so, this translates to about 1 EV every 8 seconds, or 7.5 EVs per minute. Assuming you've used 10 vitamins already in the appropriate stat, this means you only need to get 152 more to max out. At this rate it should take you approximately 20 minutes to max out one stat + another ~40 seconds to get the remaining 2 EVs. Of course this doesn't count for the additional time needed to scroll through level up or move learning text, so add another 3-5 minutes or so to this total. If you haven't used vitamins beforehand it should take roughly 33 minutes + one more battle.

With pokerus, EVs gained double to about 1 EV every 4 seconds, or 15 EVs per minute. This means it'll take only ~10 minutes to max out a stat after using vitamins or ~17 minutes without them.

With all logistics considered it could take anywhere from 25 - 90 minutes to fully EV train a pokemon in SuMo (assuming you use power items, if not it could take several hours). A bit disappointing considering that EV training was easily doable in less than 15 minutes in XY/ORAS, but I take it many Wi-Fi players have the patience of a saint anyway - considering some people are willing to spend weeks or months breeding for shinies or SRing for 5-6 IV legendaries.

I have yet to play the game myself but from what I've been hearing, Poke Pelago may prove invaluable for EV training faster. It may be slow, but with careful planning it will be massive help in the long run as it means you don't have to always be making a conscious effort to EV train your pokemon. It could make a real difference in the time it takes to train a full team of six, or it may not - but it still means that the time spent not playing the game doesn't go to waste.

 

[Bice]

Is it confirmed that Hyper Training works on Pokémon without the plus (i.e. those transferred via bank)?

 

[Adsiduus]

Does anyone happen to know what Pokémon (besides Mew, Mewtwo) would be worth transferring over from RBY to SuMo when pokebank opens?

I mean, there's probably a few Gen 1 'mons with moves that were only learnable during Gen 1, right? I just don't know if any of them are worth the trouble.

 

[Rarycaris]

Does anyone happen to know what Pokémon (besides Mew, Mewtwo) would be worth transferring over from RBY to SuMo when pokebank opens?

I mean, there's probably a few Gen 1 'mons with moves that were only learnable during Gen 1, right? I just don't know if any of them are worth the trouble.

Fissure Machamp if it still works.

 

[Adsiduus]

Fissure Machamp if it still works.

Thanks for the reply.

I can see that being spammed to no end on battle spot.

 

[SunWarrior]

So I wasn't really sure where to post this, but I compiled a list of all legal pre-bank egg moves as of now (unless the QR code catch thing really changes things up)! I used the basic forms of the pokemon, as well as just 1 parent compable of learning the egg moves for the sake of convenience (as well as to save breeding time). Anything in the field egg group only has it's egg moves listed as Smeargle is in the Alola dex, thus making any of the 4 possible. Please let me know if I missed something or got anything wrong!

Edit: Oops! I forgot to clarify. This is only for the new Alola pokemon. I didn't check the Alola form pokemon. I will do that later.

Big Wall o' Egg Moves

Rowlet (Flying): Haze/Confuse Ray: Zubat; Defog: Rufflet; Baton Pass: Oricorio
-Illegal: Curse (Smeargle -> Farfetch'd + Skarmory required); Ominous Wind (Xatu)


Litten (Field): Nasty Plot/Body Slam/Crunch/Fake Out/Revenge/Heat Wave


Popplio (Water 1/Field): Charm/Amnesia/Aqua Ring/Aromatic Mist/Perish Song/Wonder Room


Pikipek (Flying): Tailwind/Brave Bird: Rufflet; Mirror Move: Spearow
-Illegal: Boomburst (Taillow/Noibat/Chatot), Uproar(Hoothoot/Spearow/Doduo)


Yungoos (Field): Revenge/Last Resort


Grubbin (Bug): Harden: Pinsir; Mud Shot: Surskit (bred w/Poliwag for Mud Shot)
- Illegal: Electroweb (Galvantula); Endure (Heracross)


Crabrawler (Water 3): Wide Guard: Tirtouga; Endeavour: Archen
-Illegal: Amnesia (Krabby/Lileep); Superpower (Requires ORAS move tutor Water 3 compatible pokemon)


Oricorio (Flying): Pluck: Spearow, Tailwind: Rufflet, Safeguard: It's a TM
-Illegal: Captivate (Woobat)


Cutiefly (Bug/Fairy): Baton Pass: Ledyba; Speed Swap: A-Raichu; Moonblast/Bestow: Clefairy
-Illegal: Skill Swap (Spritzee)


Rockruff (Field): Fire Fang/Thunder Fang/Crush Claw/Sucker Punch/Thrash


Wishiwashi (Water 2): Mist/Water Sport/Water Pulse: Wailmer; Muddy Water: Barboach


Mareanie (Water 1): Stockpile/Swallow/Spit Up: Shellos (bred w/Drifloon for moves); Haze: Surskit


Mudbray (Field): Body Slam/Double-Edge/Magnitude/Close Combat/Mud Bomb


Dewpider (Water 1/Bug): Stockpile/Spit Up: Shellos
-Illegal: Aurora Beam (Spheal); Power Split (Shuckle)


Formantis (Grass): Aromatherapy/Giga Drain/Leaf Storm: Bellossom
-Illegal: Weather Ball (Bellsprout/Roselia); Defog (Requires TM with Grass compatible from D/P/PT)


Morelull (Grass): Posion Powder/Stun Spore/Leech Seed: Exeggcute
-Illegal: Amnesia (Bulbasaur + Slowpoke required)


Salandit (Monster/Dragon):
-Illegal: Belch (Ekans); Fake Out (Scraggy/Squirtle + Smeargle required); Knock Off (Requires ORAS move tutor Monster/Dragon compatible pokemon)


Stufful (Field): Ice Punch/Thunder Punch/Force Palm/Endure/Mega Kick/Stomping Tantrum


Bounsweet (Grass): Synthesis/Play Rough: Comfey; Charm: Cottonee
-Illegal: Acupressure (Maractus), Feint (Breloom)


Comfey (Grass): Lucky Chant: Oddish; After You: Petilil
-Illegal: Amnesia (Bulbasaur + Slowpoke required), Endure (Bulbasaur + Shieldon/Paras + Heracross required)


Oranguru (Field): Extrasensory/Wonder Room/Psychic Terrain


Passimian (Field): Siesmic Toss/Vital Throw/Quick Guard/Iron Head/Quick Attack/Feint


Wimpod (Bug/Water 3): Spikes: Shellder; Aqua Jet/Wide Guard: Tirtouga, Harden: Pinsir
-Illegal: Metal Claw (Krabby)


Sandyghast (Amorphous): Amnesia/Stockpile/Swallow/Spit Up: Drifloon; Destiny Bond: Ghastly
-Illegal: Ancient Power (Lileep)


Pyukumuku (Water 1): Endure: Poliwag (bred w/ Corsola for Endure); Venom Drench: Mareanie,
-Illegal: Bestow (Passed from Zizagoon -> Delibird -> Froakie); Tickle (Omanyte)

Komala (Field): Charm/Wish/Play Rough/Sing

Turtonator (Monster/Dragon): Wide Guard: Tirtouga; Head Smash: Cranidos,
-Illegal: Fire Spin (Charmander); Revenge (Druddigon)

Togedemaru (Field/Fairy): Reversal/Present/Encore/Twineedle/Wish/Fake Out/Tickle/Flail/Disarming Voice

Mimikyu (Amorphous): Grudge/Nightmare/Destiny Bond/Curse: Ghastly (+ Misdreavus for Grudge)

Bruxish (Water 2): Water Pulse: Wailmer; Poison Fang/Ice Fang/Rage: Carvanha

Drampa (Monster/Dragon): Hurricane/Mist/Dragon Rush: Dragnonite (bred w/Wingull/Surskit for Mist)
-Illegal: Play Rough (Skrelp), Razor Wind (Tropius + Absol required)

Jangmo-o (Dragon): Dragon Breath: Gible
-Illegal: Counter (Goomy + Scraggy required); Reversal (Axew + Ryhorn required)

Great list man! Thanks a lot :)

Just one question, isn't Farfetch'd enough to pass down Curse to Rowlett? I mean, it could get Curse from Smeargle and then directly can be put with a Rowlet to breed, there's no need for a Skarmory as far as i know.


Also, the only Alolan Pokemon i know whose egg moves are all available pre-Pokebank is Vulpix :P (I've been researching for them), it can get all from a Smeargle (just a little help for your Alolan forms egg move list)

 

[Jalathas]

Hey, newbie here. I'm trying to make sense of the encounter tables in the mining thread. Specifically, the different "slot types." If I encounter a Pichu in a grass patch on Route 1 for example, it's drawing from one of these two tables, depending on day/night:

Table 3:
Slot Type 1 (Levels 3-5): Yungoos (30%), Pikipek (20%), Ledyba (15%), Metapod (10%), Caterpie (10%), Grubbin (10%), Pichu (5%)
Slot Type 2 (Levels 3-5): Yungoos (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Ledyba (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pikachu (5%)
Slot Type 3 (Levels 3-5): Yungoos (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Ledyba (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pikachu (5%)
Slot Type 4 (Levels 3-5): Yungoos (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Ledyba (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pikachu (5%)
Slot Type 5 (Levels 3-5): Yungoos (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Ledyba (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pikachu (5%)
Slot Type 6 (Levels 3-5): Yungoos (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Ledyba (15%), Grubbin (10%), Happiny (5%)
Slot Type 7 (Levels 3-5): Yungoos (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Ledyba (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pichu (5%)
Slot Type 8 (Levels 3-5): Yungoos (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Ledyba (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pichu (5%)
Table 4:
Slot Type 1 (Levels 3-5): Rattata (Forme 1) (30%), Pikipek (20%), Spinarak (15%), Metapod (10%), Caterpie (10%), Grubbin (10%), Pichu (5%)
Slot Type 2 (Levels 3-5): Rattata (Forme 1) (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Spinarak (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pikachu (5%)
Slot Type 3 (Levels 3-5): Rattata (Forme 1) (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Spinarak (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pikachu (5%)
Slot Type 4 (Levels 3-5): Rattata (Forme 1) (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Spinarak (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pikachu (5%)
Slot Type 5 (Levels 3-5): Rattata (Forme 1) (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Spinarak (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pikachu (5%)
Slot Type 6 (Levels 3-5): Rattata (Forme 1) (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Spinarak (15%), Grubbin (10%), Happiny (5%)
Slot Type 7 (Levels 3-5): Rattata (Forme 1) (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Spinarak (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pichu (5%)
Slot Type 8 (Levels 3-5): Rattata (Forme 1) (30%), Caterpie (20%), Pikipek (20%), Spinarak (15%), Grubbin (10%), Pichu (5%)

Does that mean I will never encounter a Pikachu or Happiny in the grass patch I found the Pichu? Or does it mean that there's a 1 in 8 change it'll pick slot type 6, and then a 1 in 20 chance it'll pick Happiny, making Happiny a total of a 1/160 encounter rate?
Assuming the former, has anyone started putting together lists for which grass patches have what encounters?

Quoting for re-ask, if anyone knows.

EDIT: Looking further, I'm seeing nonsense like a level 9 Salamence later on in the slot types. Maybe the non-1 slot types are just filler?

 

[Khaelis]

So I wasn't really sure where to post this, but I compiled a list of all legal pre-bank egg moves as of now (unless the QR code catch thing really changes things up)! I used the basic forms of the pokemon, as well as just 1 parent compable of learning the egg moves for the sake of convenience (as well as to save breeding time). Anything in the field egg group only has it's egg moves listed as Smeargle is in the Alola dex, thus making any of the 4 possible. Please let me know if I missed something or got anything wrong!

Edit: Oops! I forgot to clarify. This is only for the new Alola pokemon. I didn't check the Alola form pokemon. I will do that later.

Big Wall o' Egg Moves

Rowlet (Flying): Haze/Confuse Ray: Zubat; Defog: Rufflet; Baton Pass: Oricorio
-Illegal: Curse (Smeargle -> Farfetch'd + Skarmory required); Ominous Wind (Xatu)


Litten (Field): Nasty Plot/Body Slam/Crunch/Fake Out/Revenge/Heat Wave


Popplio (Water 1/Field): Charm/Amnesia/Aqua Ring/Aromatic Mist/Perish Song/Wonder Room


Pikipek (Flying): Tailwind/Brave Bird: Rufflet; Mirror Move: Spearow
-Illegal: Boomburst (Taillow/Noibat/Chatot), Uproar(Hoothoot/Spearow/Doduo)


Yungoos (Field): Revenge/Last Resort


Grubbin (Bug): Harden: Pinsir; Mud Shot: Surskit (bred w/Poliwag for Mud Shot)
- Illegal: Electroweb (Galvantula); Endure (Heracross)


Crabrawler (Water 3): Wide Guard: Tirtouga; Endeavour: Archen
-Illegal: Amnesia (Krabby/Lileep); Superpower (Requires ORAS move tutor Water 3 compatible pokemon)


Oricorio (Flying): Pluck: Spearow, Tailwind: Rufflet, Safeguard: It's a TM
-Illegal: Captivate (Woobat)


Cutiefly (Bug/Fairy): Baton Pass: Ledyba; Speed Swap: A-Raichu; Moonblast/Bestow: Clefairy
-Illegal: Skill Swap (Spritzee)


Rockruff (Field): Fire Fang/Thunder Fang/Crush Claw/Sucker Punch/Thrash


Wishiwashi (Water 2): Mist/Water Sport/Water Pulse: Wailmer; Muddy Water: Barboach


Mareanie (Water 1): Stockpile/Swallow/Spit Up: Shellos (bred w/Drifloon for moves); Haze: Surskit


Mudbray (Field): Body Slam/Double-Edge/Magnitude/Close Combat/Mud Bomb


Dewpider (Water 1/Bug): Stockpile/Spit Up: Shellos
-Illegal: Aurora Beam (Spheal); Power Split (Shuckle)


Formantis (Grass): Aromatherapy/Giga Drain/Leaf Storm: Bellossom
-Illegal: Weather Ball (Bellsprout/Roselia); Defog (Requires TM with Grass compatible from D/P/PT)


Morelull (Grass): Posion Powder/Stun Spore/Leech Seed: Exeggcute
-Illegal: Amnesia (Bulbasaur + Slowpoke required)


Salandit (Monster/Dragon):
-Illegal: Belch (Ekans); Fake Out (Scraggy/Squirtle + Smeargle required); Knock Off (Requires ORAS move tutor Monster/Dragon compatible pokemon)


Stufful (Field): Ice Punch/Thunder Punch/Force Palm/Endure/Mega Kick/Stomping Tantrum


Bounsweet (Grass): Synthesis/Play Rough: Comfey; Charm: Cottonee
-Illegal: Acupressure (Maractus), Feint (Breloom)


Comfey (Grass): Lucky Chant: Oddish; After You: Petilil
-Illegal: Amnesia (Bulbasaur + Slowpoke required), Endure (Bulbasaur + Shieldon/Paras + Heracross required)


Oranguru (Field): Extrasensory/Wonder Room/Psychic Terrain


Passimian (Field): Siesmic Toss/Vital Throw/Quick Guard/Iron Head/Quick Attack/Feint


Wimpod (Bug/Water 3): Spikes: Shellder; Aqua Jet/Wide Guard: Tirtouga, Harden: Pinsir
-Illegal: Metal Claw (Krabby)


Sandyghast (Amorphous): Amnesia/Stockpile/Swallow/Spit Up: Drifloon; Destiny Bond: Ghastly
-Illegal: Ancient Power (Lileep)


Pyukumuku (Water 1): Endure: Poliwag (bred w/ Corsola for Endure); Venom Drench: Mareanie,
-Illegal: Bestow (Passed from Zizagoon -> Delibird -> Froakie); Tickle (Omanyte)

Komala (Field): Charm/Wish/Play Rough/Sing

Turtonator (Monster/Dragon): Wide Guard: Tirtouga; Head Smash: Cranidos,
-Illegal: Fire Spin (Charmander); Revenge (Druddigon)

Togedemaru (Field/Fairy): Reversal/Present/Encore/Twineedle/Wish/Fake Out/Tickle/Flail/Disarming Voice

Mimikyu (Amorphous): Grudge/Nightmare/Destiny Bond/Curse: Ghastly (+ Misdreavus for Grudge)

Bruxish (Water 2): Water Pulse: Wailmer; Poison Fang/Ice Fang/Rage: Carvanha

Drampa (Monster/Dragon): Hurricane/Mist/Dragon Rush: Dragnonite (bred w/Wingull/Surskit for Mist)
-Illegal: Play Rough (Skrelp), Razor Wind (Tropius + Absol required)

Jangmo-o (Dragon): Dragon Breath: Gible
-Illegal: Counter (Goomy + Scraggy required); Reversal (Axew + Ryhorn required)

Thanks a ton for this, it will really help me when I start breeding stuff. Going in blind is never fun.

 

[hypno28]

Wow! Thanks game! We gotta wait for the next game to get regular forms of Pokemon through breeding.

https://twitter.com/KazoWAR/status/797343460277755904

Breeding 2 normal Rattata still gets eggs that hatch into Alolan Rattata. That's just great...

Wow. This is unbelievably stupid and can't possibly be justified. It's like they're intentionally working to undermine the credibility of the in-game world so blatantly that it becomes impossible to ignore.

 

[Azery]

Wow. This is unbelievably stupid and can't possibly be justified. It's like they're intentionally working to undermine the credibility of the in-game world so blatantly that it becomes impossible to ignore.

It's weird as fuck and I can't understand it but w/e tbh. Wasn't going to use the regular forms much anyways so it really doesn't matter to me.

 

[hypno28]

It's weird as fuck and I can't understand it but w/e tbh. Wasn't going to use the regular forms much anyways so it really doesn't matter to me.

That's not the point, but, yeah, whatever I guess. As baffling as it is, it's relatively inoffensive in the face of things as comical and embarrassing as the Z-Moves and a mechanic that's unironically called "Mega Evolution." Still...wow.

 

[Azery]

Mega Evolution descriptions are pretty graphic now, ngl. Feels bad after a whole generation of using them only to find out that it can and probably does hurt the Pokemon using it.

GF why. :[

 

[PokeTroopa]

So with super training gone, we dont have access to reset bags anymore. We still have access to the EV reducing berries right?

 

[Kairez Lightkeeper]

So with super training gone, we dont have access to reset bags anymore. We still have access to the EV reducing berries right?

I heard there was a facility in the Festival Plaza for EV reduction. Or something.