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CAP 1 Smogon's First "Create a Pokemon": Poll 3

Discussion in 'CAP Process Archive' started by Cooper, Dec 9, 2007.

?

What is the function of our new pokemon?

Poll closed Dec 12, 2007.
  1. Physical sweeper

    21 vote(s)
    10.6%
  2. Special sweeper

    46 vote(s)
    23.1%
  3. Mixed sweeper

    87 vote(s)
    43.7%
  4. Physical tank

    8 vote(s)
    4.0%
  5. Special tank

    5 vote(s)
    2.5%
  6. Physical wall

    7 vote(s)
    3.5%
  7. Special wall

    3 vote(s)
    1.5%
  8. Supporter

    22 vote(s)
    11.1%
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  1. Deucalion2

    Deucalion2

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    Agreed. I'm liking Mixed Sweeper, with Bug + Ice, and Magic Guard. Plus, it would still have to be pretty damn good to escape Rock + Fire types (looking at TTar and Nape respectively), so it would be hard for it to abuse LO Guard.
  2. Cooper

    Cooper
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    Automatic: Have you not noticed the huge discussion going on above your post...?
  3. Deucalion2

    Deucalion2

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    Yes. I was commenting on it.
  4. DougJustDoug

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    What if the Shiver ability (automatic rapid spin) did not work when switched in against a Fire type or when Sunny Day was in effect? It strengthens the concept and limits the ability. Other abilities are affected by opposing types (e.g. Arena Trap) and weather (e.g. Chlorophyll, Swift Swim), so it's not too unorthodox within the framework of the existing game.
  5. gorm

    gorm
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    no, its still horribly broken, because you choose when to switch it in. its no like they have 6 fire types, and if they do, stealth rock is the least of your worries


    whats wrong with magic guard? it bypasses sr damage right?
  6. Dilasc

    Dilasc

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    I still think an weakness/resistance inversion ability would be very interesting, especially if it had a second choice ability to play mindgames (at least until Stealth Rock goes up)

    Let's look at its weaknesses.
    4x: Fire, Rock
    2x: Steel, Flying
    1/2x: Ice, Ground, Grass
    0x: N/A

    As we can see, if we swap weaknesses with resistances, we get
    1/4x: Fire, Rock
    1/2x: Steel, Flying
    2x: Ice, Ground, Grass

    Nifty swap, even if ice and ground weakness aren't very good. Eh...

    I think that the creature creation in general is focusing too much oin competitive. It's nice to be competitive, but are we going for our own new generation here?
  7. DougJustDoug

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    I have no problem with Magic Guard. I think it would work very well and fits conceptually. I've been proposing alternatives simply for the sake of creativity and to explore other ways to enhance the metagame. It sounds like my Shiver idea is not very popular, so I'll let it go.

    Whatever we do, the weaknesses on this thing are glaring. Because of typing, a sweeper is the only way to go. Based on voting, it looks like it will be mixed. I don't know if Magic Guard is sufficient to offset the 4x weaknesses, but it seems viable. Since there are no Fire or Rock priority moves, some speed on this thing could go a long way to offsetting the massive type deficiencies.

    Since Smogon is a competitive battling site, it seems really pointless to create an uncompetitive pokemon. IMO, we should be trying to create a VERY competitive pokemon. I'm thinking it should be viable with the top OU pokemon in the current metagame -- Garchomp, Gyarados, Salamence, etc. If this turns out to be an Illumise with Ice Beam, it will be a huge waste of Smogoners' time.
  8. eric the espeon

    eric the espeon maybe I just misunderstood
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    i disagree rapid spin is blockable but a auto spin ability is not, also look at the number of pokemon that use Growl, Sandstorm, Howl, and Mean Look, the first 3 are NEVER used (exept howl arcanine) and mean look is only viable on one pokemon (umbreon) but the ablitys that have the same effects are considored some of the best in the game.
  9. DougJustDoug

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    That is a very good point, and well-argued. The automatic invocation of an NU move is very different than the automatic invocation of an OU move. I'm dropping the Shiver idea, just on lack of popularity. Your well-reasoned argument makes it easier for me to forget the whole thing.
  10. Deucalion2

    Deucalion2

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    I'm thinking a:

    Type: Bug/Ice
    Ability: Magic Guard
    Classification: Ice Fairy Pokemon

    67/125/65/125/65/108

    Notable Moveset:
    Bug Buzz
    Ice Beam
    Sleep Powder
    Calm Mind
    Tail Glow
    Hidden Power
    Signal Beam
    Megahorn
    Swords Dance
    Ice Punch
    Brick Break

    Hits incredibly hard with stackloads of speed, but will get killed with ease. The moveset fits with what most people seem to be thinking of it as.
  11. ultimifier

    ultimifier

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    we have been talking about abililties thus far, and i think that to decentralize the metagame from TSS stall teams, this new pokemon could have snow warning as an ability and be a mixed sweeper.

    this would do many things that could help make the metagame more exciting (less stall, stall is boring):
    1. another hail inducer would weaken sand teams and therefore weaken every pokemon that benefits from sand, such as skarmory and hippodawn
    2. ice/bug is a fairly good stall breaker type, having decent coverage against mixed walls.
    3. another ice pokemon would further decrease the number of garchomp and salamences and allow other pokemon to see more play
  12. eric the espeon

    eric the espeon maybe I just misunderstood
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    wow. thank you thats high prase inded

  13. Gothic Togekiss

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    [mini-rant]Will people please stop suggesting Megahorn on this thing when we don't know what the fuck this thing looks like yet. 99.9% say this thing isn't going to have a horn big enough for that attack to make much sense.[/mini-rant]

    I actually liked "Shiver" since it fitted the whole Ice theme but I guess people get butthurted when they hear of an auto-rapid spin ability.

    67/110/65/100/60/108 stat spread?
  14. eric the espeon

    eric the espeon maybe I just misunderstood
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  15. Gothic Togekiss

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    Hm....you're right about a few things, how bout this?

    67/102/63/112/60/108

    About the same as my first stat spread but with more sp. atk. Still want it to have somewhat decent attack score. Still iffy on the stat total though.

    I read you argument and I do agree on some things, I kinda hoping it have either that ability or magic guard(Artic veil?) to help it wth it's SR problem.
  16. DougJustDoug

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    Here's another anti-TSStall ability for discussion:

    What if the pokemon eliminated Stealth Rock/Spikes/Tspikes only after a full turn of battle? Kind of like how Speed Boost doesn't kick in on the switch in. Another possibility is to eliminate weather? Maybe both? Since this thing is fragile, it would have to survive at least one turn, which isn't easy. A switch in and out would not work. Don't give it Protect, to guarantee it has to duke it out for a turn. The concept needs some refining, but I like the idea of wiping the battlefield clean upon switching out. Kind of like Natural Cure for TSS. Since I'm a ski buff, I would name the ability -- "Fresh Powder".
  17. eric the espeon

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  18. Gothic Togekiss

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    ^ Execpt RegiFail oh and 67/102/63/110/60/108 or 67/102/61/112/60/108, pick your poison.
  19. Dilasc

    Dilasc

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    My honest problem with Shiver is the name. The fact is, the name sounds like it'd limit availability. I mean, haven't the likes of Starmie, Forretres and maybe a few nonspinning Pokemon been seeming worthy of a Spin ability for a long time? The problem is that 'Shiver' doesn't fit them.

    IMHO, Shiver isn't a bad name for something in Pokemon. To me, it'd be perfect as a Freeze based version of Yawn.
  20. ultimifier

    ultimifier

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    i like those stat spreads... maybe we can call it freezape :P
  21. eric the espeon

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    RegiFail???


  22. DougJustDoug

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    Eric: I've read your arguments and I think they are sound. I thought the idea of "Fresh Powder" was sufficiently different from Shiver to merit discussion. If you think it's basically the same thing with more convoluted conditions, so be it. (Good point about Protect, btw)

    Although I agree with your arguments against Shiver being too overpowered, I think we can do better than an ice version of Magic Guard. Maybe not. Magic Guard helps this pokemon deal with it's weakness to SR, no doubt. Is that enough to make it competitively viable? Perhaps. I think a new pokemon with a 4x weak to rock is a great opportunity to introduce something that could shift the tide against TSS. I think TSS is bad for the metagame. You may really love it, I don't know.

    I'll continue to present ideas, and you are free to shoot holes in them. Hopefully, you will find me to be open-minded enough to evaluate my positions in light of opposing arguments. In the end, I don't want a broken pokemon any more than you do.
  23. Gothic Togekiss

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    Regigigas who I have a hard spelling, mostly have to do with the three "g"
  24. eric the espeon

    eric the espeon maybe I just misunderstood
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    right bedtime bye ppl
  25. MegaMewtwo

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    I'm just wondering, what do you guys think of the picture I posted earlier? The only real problem I can see with it is that it was drawn by someone who saw the concept as a special sweeper. Remember, it was drawn by a ten-year-old, on Paint, on a laptop.
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