Actually I've gone all of this time without Magnezone. Eventually, you learn some tricks of how to neutralise such threats to the passing and save Smeargle for a good opportunity. It's more reliable than it looks. The team currently consists of Granbull/Gallade/Rotom-w/Empoleon/Smeargle/Dragonite.
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Which team would Dragonite > Salamence?
- Thread starter lordkira
- Start date
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Although Salamence is a better sweeper than Dragonite because of higher attack, special attack and speed, Dragonite has more variety in moves. Dragonite can use some of the more common moves such as ice beam and thunderbolt. With that being said, Dragonite can take down some water threats along with some ground types with greater ease.
Going back on topic with this thread, I think that Dragonite might fit a support/stall team because it can have haze and mist or something like that. Dragonite has inner focus as an ability and that is worth something, right?
in a support? maybe,but not in stall,dragonite has great defenses and HP,and inner focus saved me a lot of times,but he dont got what it takes to stall like certain pokes(i am looking at you two skarbliss),but its not a bad idea to make him for support,since normal support pokes dont got base 134 atack,if the ocasion arise and it need to atack
Raj
CAP Playtesting Expert
Lately I've been using a bulky offense team with Dragonite as my star player. I had just about given up on my beloved hero until I came across a set in gorm's latest RMT.
The set:
Dragonite @ Leftover
Careful
252 HP, 6 Def, 252 Sp Def
~Dragon Dance
~Dragon Claw
~Heal Bell
~Roost
I'll put it as simply as gorm did: "How would you deal with this?"
Obviously this set has issues with Pokemon like Skarmory, but that's why you have 6 Mons. This Poke is great for supporting the team and being able to function on its own once late game kicks in. You wouldn't want this on a fast paced offensive team, but then again you wouldn't want Salamence on a team meant to last a while.
The set:
Dragonite @ Leftover
Careful
252 HP, 6 Def, 252 Sp Def
~Dragon Dance
~Dragon Claw
~Heal Bell
~Roost
I'll put it as simply as gorm did: "How would you deal with this?"
Obviously this set has issues with Pokemon like Skarmory, but that's why you have 6 Mons. This Poke is great for supporting the team and being able to function on its own once late game kicks in. You wouldn't want this on a fast paced offensive team, but then again you wouldn't want Salamence on a team meant to last a while.
I'd sent in my Dragon counter, Swampert and Roar it away. I'd sent in my Suicune to set up a Calm Mind and KO it with Ice Beam. Even easier would be to send in a Skarmory, Metagross, or Scizor and wall it completely. I could also send in my Latias and kill it with Draco Meteor, because after a Dragon Dance he still doesn't out speed and most Dragonite aren't throwing Draco Meteor's and Outrage's off the bat. (If it was Roared away in the past, I know it'll Dragon Dance.) Hell, I could send in my own Salamence and kill it with Draco Meteor since it only reaches 294 Speed after a DD with no investment. Thanks to Intimidate and no Attack EVs there is no way Dragon Claw would OHKO Salamence anyway, maybe not even Latias.
To be honest, this is a mediocre set. The idea is decent, use Heal Bell to cure status but the EVs are pretty bad. Not only are you revenged killed too easily, but you are "weak" or should I say "weaker" to Stealth Rock. 224 HP / 140 SpD / 144 Speed with an Adamant or Careful nature is a bit better, but I still wouldn't use this set. It does indeed stay around longer than Salamence, but it also does a lot less damage. Why put in a bunch of support to make this work when I can use Salamence, do more damage, and have a lot less support?
Mind sharing why? Your insight has not convinced me.
joshe
the best
Wrong, I use a very successful stall team with salamence as my main counter to lucario, heracross, etc... Salamence also provides some offensive power to a stall team that desperately needs it, killing weakened mons, through Spikes and Toxic Spikes with a STAB Dragon Claw, or crushing Lucario with a Fire Blast. Mence can also utilize Wish, freeing up blissey to either use Aromatherapy or something else. In the right environment, Salamence is perfect for all teams: Stall, Offense, Balance, etc... and more often than not, should it stay alive late game, it will be sweeping, fatmence or dd-mence. Dragonite has its value, but generally salamence has the stats in the right place, and the movepool to abuse it. Not to mention intimidate. And no i'm not bias toward Salamence, my kind of stall usually utilizes some kind of speed, and dragonite doesn't cut it in terms of speed.
So yeah, I'd love to see your reasoning behind dragonite doing well on stall.
one great thing about nite is that he can do almost everything,he can atack,wall to a certain extend,support and others,what he have of superior to other pokes is that normaly pokes that support and wall cant atack with effectines,what nite can,he support with heal bell and light screen,wall with bulkness,his ability might also not be that good,but he is a good check for fake out pokemons like ambimon,what is a good advantage.he take hits while support and also deal significant damage.
Well, Light Screen and Heal Bell help a lot, and Salamence can use neither, which enables Blissey to use Wish and Protect without fear of stuff like Swampert getting poisioned. Dragonite's base defenses are also higher, but you already knew that.
Myself, I prefer a phazing SleepTalker Gyarados.
The answer to the topic title would be the Dual Screen team. Essentially put in the bulky Dragonite set with Roost. Salamence can also function extremely well under the same circumstances, but has lesser defensive stats. 204 HP/52 Atk/252 Spe, etc. Take less than 47% with Light Screen from Swampert's Ice Beam. Add Roost's secondary effect and imagine the result. 2 easy DDs. Roost takes out the worry of residal damages. Skarm's only gonna get the 1-on-1 treatment at end-game.
Hey just really starting with competitive playing and wanted to use dragonite on my team...
i wanted to use a choice scarf version and use it more as a revenge killer with some bulk. and wanted to know the amount of speed ev's i would have to invest to take down 100base jolly natures such as jirachi/flygon/salamence/zapdos and the rest of the ev spread for a physical threat. i feel going all out on atk will give it an advantage over mixed mence's and can really break down walls with choice scarf and its superior movepool
Outrage
Superpower
Fire Punch
Earthquake <-- not sure if i wanted to use it or waterfall/aqua tail depending on my luck with flinching.
i wanted to use a choice scarf version and use it more as a revenge killer with some bulk. and wanted to know the amount of speed ev's i would have to invest to take down 100base jolly natures such as jirachi/flygon/salamence/zapdos and the rest of the ev spread for a physical threat. i feel going all out on atk will give it an advantage over mixed mence's and can really break down walls with choice scarf and its superior movepool
Outrage
Superpower
Fire Punch
Earthquake <-- not sure if i wanted to use it or waterfall/aqua tail depending on my luck with flinching.
From the Dragonite analysis.
"Choice Scarf is a viable option on Dragonite, although it is largely outclassed by Salamence. However, Dragonite has a wider movepool allowing it to use Superpower, Ice Beam, and Thunderbolt to decent success. 228 Atk / 108 SpA / 172 is a usable EV spread for such as set with a Naive or Hasty nature."
"Choice Scarf is a viable option on Dragonite, although it is largely outclassed by Salamence. However, Dragonite has a wider movepool allowing it to use Superpower, Ice Beam, and Thunderbolt to decent success. 228 Atk / 108 SpA / 172 is a usable EV spread for such as set with a Naive or Hasty nature."
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