1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Wonkymons -- Updates

Discussion in 'Other Metagames' started by The Eevee General, Oct 8, 2012.

  1. Iceking

    Iceking

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Intriguing, one of the more deadly threats IMO is Contrary Palkia.
    Contrary Palkia=Draco Meteor Spam. It has a good movepool, to go along with it. Speed boost Keldeo is gonna be bad too.
  2. SpecsX

    SpecsX

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2012
    Messages:
    370
    Speed Boost Keldeo and Contrary Palkia will probably be banned for sure. Wonder Guard and Moody have to go.

    Water Absorb/Dry Skin Regirock lol
    Dry Skin Entei

    Ice Body Tenta or Overcoat Starmie for Hail spinners. Finally

    Also watch out for Sand Rush Torterra
  3. Relados

    Relados
    is a Battle Server Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2012
    Messages:
    1,045
    Shadow Tag Terrakion?

    What have I done to deserve this?
  4. Yarnus of Bethany

    Yarnus of Bethany

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2010
    Messages:
    2,065
    There should be a tournament of this: with Blaziken Unbanned, and see what needs a ban.
  5. Ace Emerald

    Ace Emerald Horsing around
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Super Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Visual Media Head

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2010
    Messages:
    2,045
    This is looking pretty good. There'll probably have to be some bans eventually, but I would be down for a tournament.
  6. Kenny

    Kenny don't expect me

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2012
    Messages:
    460
    Did some battles, Contrary Palkia pretty OP.
  7. The Eevee General

    The Eevee General The Adventures of Eevee, Queen of the Desert
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,666
    Are we still worried about Balloon Wonder Guard Elekid? There are some more Mold Breakers with the new second abilities added with Conkeldurr being really the only viable one.

    Also, I think Rattled/Motor Drive Giratina is a good check to Pure Power Galvantula as it resists both STABs and Bug activates Rattled while Electric activates Motor Drive. Plus it has tremendous bulk and can bypass Sucker Punch with Will-o-wisp and Rest off damage.
  8. SpecsX

    SpecsX

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2012
    Messages:
    370
    Being forced to run Conk on every team is kind of excessive, I think.
    Giratina can handle every Pure Power user. All other clauses should apply.

    Watch out for chlorophyll Swampert and Harvest Slowking
  9. Gerard

    Gerard

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2011
    Messages:
    4,373
    Does Meloetta's one applies with both formes?
    Looking forward to Tick Fat Vileplume, that seems oddly fitting... Levitate Muk seems cool too, Electrode is realy cool, eing able to use Thunder/Volt Switch, Paralyse with Thunder wave, or just use Explosion to take someone with it, it seems like it could make an amazing revenge killer, Regenerator Zapdos... Coolest thing ever! (why does Zapdos aways gets the cool stuff?),Weather Dragonite is interesting, an actually dangerous with STABed Hurricane, pseudo-STABed Suf and Thunder, Victory Star Mew :D, Rock Head Skarm looks pretty good too, also, FLower Gift Bliseey... as if her Special Defense wasn't already crazy, those three and Poison Heal Suicune seem to be creating a great future for stall, which it need with stuff such as Levitate Slaking, also yay! finally Latias being better than Latios. Intimidate Togekiss also seems to work as a bulky mon with an already high SpD. Something we'll need with Chandelure getting Magic Guard.

    Fun gimmicks in Simple Defense Guard Vespiqueen and Analytic Cradily, that Curse set in the sand actually seems quite effective now, No Guard Hypnosis Bronzong.

    Other ones... I don't see anything too good aout Swift Swim Gengar, it's not like more speed is what he needed, kind of like Chlorophyll Weavile and Prankster Yanmega (wht's so cool about it's support movepool?), also lol Drought Lapras and Cute Charm Spiritomb, and Rotom-F getting the short end of the stick as usual

    I think you could use Conk or Exeguttor in order to defeat Elekid, but the thing is, he can just Volt Switch out of there, and it's not like you've broken the ballon anyway, and you just have to switch anyway, it's not like Dodrio or Camerupt can't switch in again later and wreck with Return/Brave Bird or Fire Blast/Eartquake, and that's not even going to Volcanora

    Moody too should be removed since there's no reason to use it other than evasion shenanigans, and at least Drifloon can Baton Pass it to an actually dangerous poke

    Right now I'm looking forward for a sun team: Blissey/Gallade/Chandelure/Hydreigon/Ho-oh (If possible) - Volcanora/Suicune seems like a powerul combination, third abilities wouldn't hurt...
  10. The Eevee General

    The Eevee General The Adventures of Eevee, Queen of the Desert
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,666
    So with No Guard we also have Vanillish with Sheer Cold. We'll need to address clauses like Sleep, Evasion, Species, and OHKO moves.

    Should Soul Dew/unique items be allowed?
  11. SpecsX

    SpecsX

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2012
    Messages:
    370
    I think we should keep all of these clauses as they are in OU

    Soul Dew is kinda strong, defensive Harvest Latios might become a thing. All other unique items should be allowed though.
  12. RitterCat

    RitterCat
    is an Artistis a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor Alumnus
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2010
    Messages:
    1,881
    Shadow Tag Purugly yessssss it has some usefulness now!
  13. The Eevee General

    The Eevee General The Adventures of Eevee, Queen of the Desert
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,666
    Yes.

    Luckily Stealth Rock does a number on Volcarona and Dodrio, limiting their switch-ins. Camerupt is so slow but can set up with Rock Polish, Curse or Howl. If it does manage a Rock Polish it's still not powerful enough to sweep a team and I believe is easily handled by anything packing a Water-type move (since it's 4x weak.)
    I think Volcarona and Elekid are the two we have to watch out for. Volcarona will die to just about any Rock move, especially physical ones, and since Ubers are allowed it will have a hard time getting past Giratina (who can Roar it away, see Stealth Rock), has Rattled, resists dual STAB, and can, but probably won't, run Stone Edge.
    Elekid it more of a problem. As you mentioned it can Volt Switch out of Mold Breaker Conkeldurr or Exeguttor, but will be hard pressed to do much to your team since it can only boost with Meditate and Charge Beam (Curse was mentioned earlier but it does not learn it.) It can be worn down by Sand, Hail, and other residual damage like Toxic and burn. And if your Mold Breaker carries a status move (which it should), Magic Bouncers will fail to prevent the corresponding status (Victreebel/Grimer can't be poisoned obviously...)

    I think you mean Drifblim. And yes Moody is a problem. It will probably be banned.
  14. Gerard

    Gerard

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2011
    Messages:
    4,373
    How do you abuse Harvest while holding Soul Dew? If Ubers are allowed then yes, I think that Soul Dew should be allowed, otherwise no

    My problem is they're really easy to switch, Dodrio is SR weak, but is also Immune to Spikes and has Roost to Heal Off (and so does Volcanora), while Baloon Camerupt is only affected by water moves, which are easy to spot, so you can always switch into something that resists it (I think no water type can get pass Poison Heal Suicune outside Rotom-W) and they all can fire powerful STABs or set up thanks to the free turns, Elekid can at least paralyse your team and just generally be unkilable
  15. SpecsX

    SpecsX

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2012
    Messages:
    370
    Whoa major derp there.

    Soul Dew is really only a big deal if Ubers aren't allowed; I agree with Gerard. Even if Ubers are banned, I don't think that Soul Dew should be banned without a test of some sort.
    Volcarona has some weakesses, yes, but it also has Roost to heal, although it won't like switching around. Elekid can spread status... except it has no phazing moves. It can sweep whole teams.... but it needs to boost to +6. Still, it's hard to kill unless you use Conkeldurr or Trick+Ground Move.
  16. The Eevee General

    The Eevee General The Adventures of Eevee, Queen of the Desert
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,666
    Some ideas...

    Belly Drum

    [​IMG]@ Sitrus Berry/Lum Berry w/ Harvest
    252HP/252Atk/4SpD
    -Belly Drum
    -Brick Break
    -Earthquake/Stone Edge
    -Ice Punch/Stone Edge/Bullet Punch/Rest

    Thanks to Harvest, Hariyama is virtually immune to status while holding a Lum Berry. Or instead, after it Belly Drums (hopefully on a switch) it will activate its Sitrus Berry and get 25% of its health back. Then it may proceed to plow through the enemy’s team with +6 Attack and 75% health. Brick Break is there for a reliable move with 100% accuracy. Cross Chop is stronger but riskier and at +6 Attack, Brick Break will still be doing a lot of damage. Earthquake or Stone Edge are nice coverage moves to run alongside it and Stone Edge ensures you’re not setup fodder for Wonder Guard Volcarona. Ice Punch puts the hurt on Giratina, Gliscor and others that resists Fighting and Ground/Rock. Bullet Punch is a nice (and only) priority move available to remove faster threats like Terrakion. Rest can also be added and works as instant full recovery thanks to Lum Berry (as long as Harvest renews one.)

    [​IMG]@ Leftovers w/ Arena Trap
    252HP/252Atk/4SpD
    -Belly Drum/Swords Dance
    -Substitute/Brick Break
    -Return
    -Ice Punch

    With good bulk and Arena Trap, Lickilicky can trap the right opponent and begin a setup while they helplessly flounder or attack for minimal damage. Belly Drum boosts Attack immediately but cuts your HP in half while Swords Dance can achieve the same affect after three turns but leaves you more vulnerable because you give your opponent two more turns to attack. Substitute is a nice option for blocking status and super-effective hits from oncoming foes after your helpless trapped target faints. Return is obligatory STAB. Ice Punch is nice to hit Giratina and other walls that block or resist Return while Brick Break gives you an option to hit Steels.

    Other ideas:

    [​IMG]@ Thick Club w/ Magic Bounce
    4HP/252Atk/252Spe
    -Belly Drum
    -Earthquake
    -Fire Punch
    -Stone Edge

    [​IMG]@ Leftovers/Life Orb w/ Magic Bounce
    4HP/252Atk/252Spe
    -Belly Drum
    -Waterfall
    -Ice Punch/Brick Break
    -Return/Brick Break

    [​IMG]@ Toxic Orb w/ Poison Heal
    4HP/252Atk/252Spe
    -Belly Drum
    -Waterfall
    -Brick Break
    -Ice Punch

    [​IMG]@ Sitrus Berry/Lum Berry w/ Harvest
    252HP/252Atk/4Def
    -Belly Drum
    -Aqua Tail
    -Return
    -Ice Punch/Brick Break/Rest/Zen Headbutt
  17. Gerard

    Gerard

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2011
    Messages:
    4,373
    You really like Bely Drum right?
    On Lickylicky you're better with something such as Curse and Rest, at +6 Def nothing will break you on the physical side, Return/Body Slam should be enough to murder everything, Earthquake for coverage is everything you need after that since the only ghost with Levitate is (lol) Frillish, just make sure Skarm and Drifblim are out of the way, altough Fire Pnch is also good even i it leaves you more open to Chandelure/Jellicent (both Intimidate but even more Tick Fat) and Giratina

    Obviously make sure every wonder guard user is out of the way, which is again a thing I think it's broken, one weather and Spinner/Magic Bouncer + some Hell Bell & Wish support (oh, and see, Audino does everything, so you can easily put her and Volcarona/Camerupt/Dodrio/Elekid/(Gliscor/Hydreigon/Spinner) on a team without anything to stop you as the best you can hope, Mod Breaker Conk, will be easily removed with STABed Brave Bird and Fire Blast in the sun)
    .
  18. The Eevee General

    The Eevee General The Adventures of Eevee, Queen of the Desert
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,666
    Before we start banning things (which is inevitable) I want to organize some matches with possible broken Mons e.g. Wonder Guard Elekid, Volcarona and Co., Contrary Palkia, Speed Boost Keldeo, Shadow Tag Terrakion, anything Moody and others. This weekend might be a good time for us (that are still interested) to get on #OM on IRC and hang out on PS looking for matches.

    I'll be free Saturday after 6 and most of Sunday Pacific time. Feel free to PM me too if you want to battle.
  19. zpattack12

    zpattack12

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2012
    Messages:
    71
    Drizzle Mewtwo FTW.
  20. The Eevee General

    The Eevee General The Adventures of Eevee, Queen of the Desert
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,666
    Wonder Guard

    [​IMG]@ Balloon w/ Wonder Guard
    4HP/252SpA/252Spe, Timid (+Spe, -Atk)
    -Volt Switch
    -Thunder Wave/Discharge
    -Body Slam
    -Secret Power/Toxic

    The ultimate annoyer. Since it’s not weak to any type, Elekid must only watch out for residual damage (poison/Toxic, burn, sand, hail, confusion, Stealth Rock, Leech Seed) and Mold Breakers. In the meantime it can paralyze foes with Thunder Wave, Discharge or Body Slam, Toxic those it can’t, and be a general nuisance. It can even use Secret Power to lower the target’s accuracy, further aggravating them. Volt Switch helps it get out of tricky situations like Mold Breaker Conkeldurr and Exeggutor and Shadow Tag Terrakion and Kyurem-B (the first two wanting to attack while the latter two wanting to status.) Rest is also an option since it won’t be able to heal itself besides allied clerics and Wish-passing.

    4HP/252Atk/252Spe, Jolly (+Spe, -SpA)
    -Meditate
    -Thunder Punch
    -Ice Punch
    -Focus Punch/Brick Break

    Given the chance Elekid can start to set up with Meditate. Though it slowly boosts its Attack by only one stage at a time, it has plenty of opportunity to do it when it’s not taking any direct damage due to Wonder Guard and the balloon. Thunder and Ice Punch are good STAB and coverage moves respectively. Focus Punch is worth considering since Elekid can’t be knocked off focus while it charges unless a Mold Breaker hits it. This set also isn’t walled by Golurk unlike the previous one but still must watch out for Aftermath.

    [​IMG]@ Life Orb w/ Wonder Guard
    4HP/252SpA/252Spe, Timid (+Spe, -Atk)
    -Quiver Dance
    -Bug Buzz
    -Fire Blast/Fiery Dance
    -HP Ground/Giga Drain/Roost/Morning Sun/U-turn

    Volcarona must only be wary of Rock, Flying, and Water. Until your opponent comes up with such a move, Volcarona is free to Quiver Dance to begin its assault. Bug Buzz and Fire Blast or Fiery Dance are probably its best STAB options, hitting a lot of things for good amounts of damage, especially under Sun support (which halves Water damage, hint hint…) HP Ground or Giga Drain hits things that would try and wall or counter it like Heatran, Flash Fire Sawk, Keldeo and Terrakion with Sand support, but it’s still hopelessly vulnerable to Flash Fire Staraptor. Roost alleviates Life Orb recoil but Morning Sun is superior if you can maintain your Sun support. U-turn should be included if you’re worried about getting trapped by an incoming Scarf Terrakion. The Speed is set so you can speed tie Scarfed Staraptor.
    It should be noted that Volcarona, while the strongest of the Wonder Guarders, is the weakest to entry hazards, losing half its health to Stealth Rock, plus it takes damage from Spikes and can be poisoned by Toxic Spikes.
    Possible checks/counters: Thick Fat Entei, Flash Fire Staraptor, Thick Fat Jellicent, Rattled Giratina, Flower Gift Blissey, Ho-oh, Moltres, Charizard, Trace Crobat, Emboar, Infernape, Flash Fire Sawk, Heatran, Keldeo, Shadow Tag Terrakion, Archeops, Chandelure, Reshiram, Drizzle Dragonite, Salamence, Rayquaza, Chlorophyll Swampert, Chlorophyll Mantine, Eviolite Liquid Ooze Chansey, Poliwrath

    [​IMG]@ Balloon w/ Wonder Guard
    4Atk/252SpA/252Spe, Hasty (+Spe, -Def)
    -Rock Polish
    -Fire Blast/Eruption
    -Earthquake
    -HP Ice

    With maximized Speed, Camerupt outspeeds Moxie Meloetta after a Rock Polish, otherwise dump Speed for Attack until you outspeed the benchmark you’re aiming for.
    While on a balloon, Camerupt is only vulnerable to Water and thus enjoys a healthy dose of Sun support to halve that quadruple weakness. And unlike its Wonder Guard brethren Elekid, Volcarona, and Dodrio, it has an immunity to passive Sand damage and like Volcarona can’t be burned, meaning unless you pack a Water attack you’ll have to wear it down with Hail, Leech Seed or poison. Fire Blast is a strong, fairly reliable STAB attack. Eruption is worth considering since you’ll probably either be at or close to full health thanks to Wonder Guard or dead. So while you’re alive it will be hitting with maximum power. You’ll need HP Ice for Flash Fire Staraptor, who would otherwise wall you, and Golurk.

    [​IMG]@ Life Orb w/ Wonder Guard
    4HP/252Atk/252Spe, Jolly (+Spe, -SpA)
    -Brave Bird
    -Return
    -Roost
    -Work Up/Agility

    Dodrio is the least effective of the four Wonder Guarders listed here namely because it really only has its dual STAB to attack with and thus is walled by any sturdy Rock, Steel, or better yet Rock/Steel type. The types it must watch out for are Rock, Ice and Electric. Its strategy is pretty straightforward. Hit things. Roost off damage. Boost when you can. Like Volcarona it’s weak to Stealth Rock, although it only takes 25% damage from it. And like the Balloon-holders it floats over Spikes and Toxic Spikes, but it’s still vulnerable to all the other passive damage. It does beat Mold Breakers Conkeldurr and Exeggutor without much sweat, however.

    [​IMG]@ Leftovers/Expert Belt w/ Aftermath
    252HP/4Atk/252SpD, Careful (+SpD, -SpA)
    -Gravity
    -Earthquake
    -Stone Edge
    -Toxic/Rock Polish

    Golurk has one goal in mind: Defeat all teh Wonder Guardz! Gravity is essential at beating Balloon Elekid and Camerupt, who then become vulnerable to STAB Earthquake. Plus it boosts the accuracy of Stone Edge, which it needs to hit Dodrio and Volcarona. Rock Polish can be used on the switch after Gravity or Toxic an incoming check. You’re still open to Castform and Gabite, who can be Toxicked, or if you really want you can throw Drain Punch or Ice Punch in there (but I doubt they will be as popular Wonder Guarders as the other four.)
    The stat spread almost guarantees you’ll live a Timid Life Orb Volcarona Fire Blast in the Sun (85.1-100.5%.)
  21. neptunianity

    neptunianity

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    18
    This looks really fun, and I think a tournament should be organized to test this out further.

    Also, surprised Simple Groudon hasn't been mentioned. 252 Atk Adamant Groudon after a Swords Dance hits 1752 Atk, which basically OHKO's everything. Not only that, but it can also use Rock Polish to outspeed everything, Bulk Up to get insane physical bulk, or Hone Claws to boost Stone Edge's accuracy.

    Here's a set:

    Groudon @ Leftovers/Life Orb/Whatever
    Ability: Simple
    252 Atk/252HP/4 Spe Adamant Nature

    -Swords Dance
    -Earthquake
    -Stone Edge
    -Rock Polish/Coverage Move

    EDIT: In addition, Shadow Tag Kyurem-Black sounds frightening.
    EDIT2: I don't think Wonder Guard should be banned, but Elekid and possibly Volcarona should be.
  22. The Eevee General

    The Eevee General The Adventures of Eevee, Queen of the Desert
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,666
    If people are still interested in this, let's arrange some battles this weekend!
  23. Ace Emerald

    Ace Emerald Horsing around
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Super Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Visual Media Head

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2010
    Messages:
    2,045
    Gone all day Saturday, but would not be opposed to something Sunday afternoon/evening.
  24. neptunianity

    neptunianity

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    18
    That sounds great, although I Australia, so it might be difficult for me to be on while you guys are.
  25. Rajaion Tagami

    Rajaion Tagami

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2011
    Messages:
    54
    Simple Celebii, Natural Cure Archeops, and Shadow Tag Black Kyurem? I think I may have found a couple unnoticed game breakers here.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)