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Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v4
- Thread starter TPP
- Start date
Wonder if Lokix would rise to OU, or even get OU level usage stats. Fun to think about
Ting-Lu and Dragonite in the top 10? Meow finally falls to UU
every day lokix patiently waits for tier shifts so it can victimize the new uu mons...
anyways i have a sneaking suspicion araq is going further up than it was previously since webs is kinda this cool new trend. I've had a lot of fun with webs teams and i feel like webs makes it 10x easier to actually use ghold (i like my mons hitting first and ghold is just barely too slow to do that to most mons. idk ghold just feels awkward to me.)
everyone wants to play webs especially when the webs setter isnt complete and utter dead weight into everything else than clicking one or two buttons and keeling over on the spot (bum ass r*bombee)
Step one: Bring Maushold.
Step two: Lead Maushold versus webs.
Step three: Laugh as your opponent can't lead Araquanid.
What makes this a really fun matchup is that Araquanid doesn't OHKO Maushold, leaving Araquanid in a losing matchup. If it doesn't use defensive tera, it dies to Population Bomb, and if it does and attacks, Maushold can click Encore and sacrifice itself to keep webs off. Who wants a free Wellspring SD versus a team style that's usually built without much speed? If Araquanid clicks Sticky Web, Maushold can Tidy Up on its second turn instead, and the attack boost means that Sticky Web's higher PP doesn't matter.
Araquanid does avoid dying to +6 Bite unless Maushold clicks Tera Dark, but triggering the Custap is good enough. Take the attack, Tidy Up again to clear webs, and leave a crippled entry hazard setter. If you get attacked, just Encore the attack and you're once again sacrificing yourself for the enemy tera and keeping Sticky Webs off the field, which is a good trade.
On general Maushold notes, try using it as primarily an offensive mon, with the ability to clear hazards a bonus. There's a lot that gets outsped and OHKO'd by Population Bomb (uninvested Kyurem takes at least 99.3%, for example), and between Tidy Up and a fast Encore, Maushold isn't going to find itself deadweight very often.
Sub-Tect Kyurem? Encore. Last-mon Kingambit? Force it to use Sucker Punch with another mon, then Encore. Wellspring? Outsped and killed. Alomomola? Guaranteed 2HKO from Population Bomb, so it needs Rocky Helmet, and sets without it (either a different item, or due to Knock Off) can't switch in. Dondozo? Counting the miss chance, it's almost exactly a coinflip to die to two Population Bombs, meaning it's a risky switch in.
The ghosts? If you get the read right and Tidy Up on the switch, +1 Tera Dark Bite is an OHKO on offensive Gholdengo, a 2HKO on bulky Ghold (but survives 0 Spa Make It Rain before hazards, so there's a chance), an OHKO on Dragapult, a 2HKO on Pecharunt, even a 2HKO on specially defensive Skeledirge. The only ghost that really answers Maushold is Sinistcha, who can Strength Sap to force out the mice, but Sinistcha has mostly fallen off.
Maushold remains fragile as all hell, but as a revenge killer that doesn't matter so much. Keep it away from Flame Body or Rocky Helmet and it'll put in work.
Step two: Lead Maushold versus webs.
Step three: Laugh as your opponent can't lead Araquanid.
What makes this a really fun matchup is that Araquanid doesn't OHKO Maushold, leaving Araquanid in a losing matchup. If it doesn't use defensive tera, it dies to Population Bomb, and if it does and attacks, Maushold can click Encore and sacrifice itself to keep webs off. Who wants a free Wellspring SD versus a team style that's usually built without much speed? If Araquanid clicks Sticky Web, Maushold can Tidy Up on its second turn instead, and the attack boost means that Sticky Web's higher PP doesn't matter.
Araquanid does avoid dying to +6 Bite unless Maushold clicks Tera Dark, but triggering the Custap is good enough. Take the attack, Tidy Up again to clear webs, and leave a crippled entry hazard setter. If you get attacked, just Encore the attack and you're once again sacrificing yourself for the enemy tera and keeping Sticky Webs off the field, which is a good trade.
On general Maushold notes, try using it as primarily an offensive mon, with the ability to clear hazards a bonus. There's a lot that gets outsped and OHKO'd by Population Bomb (uninvested Kyurem takes at least 99.3%, for example), and between Tidy Up and a fast Encore, Maushold isn't going to find itself deadweight very often.
Sub-Tect Kyurem? Encore. Last-mon Kingambit? Force it to use Sucker Punch with another mon, then Encore. Wellspring? Outsped and killed. Alomomola? Guaranteed 2HKO from Population Bomb, so it needs Rocky Helmet, and sets without it (either a different item, or due to Knock Off) can't switch in. Dondozo? Counting the miss chance, it's almost exactly a coinflip to die to two Population Bombs, meaning it's a risky switch in.
The ghosts? If you get the read right and Tidy Up on the switch, +1 Tera Dark Bite is an OHKO on offensive Gholdengo, a 2HKO on bulky Ghold (but survives 0 Spa Make It Rain before hazards, so there's a chance), an OHKO on Dragapult, a 2HKO on Pecharunt, even a 2HKO on specially defensive Skeledirge. The only ghost that really answers Maushold is Sinistcha, who can Strength Sap to force out the mice, but Sinistcha has mostly fallen off.
Maushold remains fragile as all hell, but as a revenge killer that doesn't matter so much. Keep it away from Flame Body or Rocky Helmet and it'll put in work.
on a similar trend of shitmons that aren't used enough, I've been really impressed by H Lilligant. Life Orb Encore 3 attack has been putting loads of work in for me at the 1600s (tldr I'm ass not Lilligant lol). It's massive speed with Chlorophyll lets it go Adamant and still outrun the entire +1 metagame. It's frankly amazing speed control for Sun teams which otherwise have to rely on Speed booster Band Moon (waste of a Moon imo) for real speed or Wake and Venusaur for okayish speed. Even its typing is great for it speed control role, resisting all of Sucker, Thunderclap, Jet, and Glide. Personally I like Tera Ghost to also own Dragonite that think they can OHKO you with +1 ESpeed (they can).
Speed isn't the only thing Lilligant has going for it though. CC Solar Blade Triple Axel is really nice high base power coverage that can be boosted further by Life Orb given how frail Lilli is anyways. Your opponent better have either one of Moltres, Ghold, or Pecha or amazing predictions because everything else gets hit pretty hard (if they do have a Moltres you might as well just resign yourself to the fact that Lilligant will not click a single button ever). Solar Blade is a silly move which is both thankfully and unfortunately limited by Sun. It does like 35-40 to +1 IDBP Zama which you can further embarrass by clicking Tera Ghost.
Hopefully this can convince more Ninetales girlies to use Lilligant, it's a really nice revenger/breaker/cleaner that brings some nice utility to Sun teams. As long as you don't throw it into a Tusk Ice Spinner for no reason, it'll probably put in work in every game. Best Chlorophyll user, it does not deserve to be ranked lower than shit Venusaur. Sun RMT with neat techs incoming at some point when I can claim a higher peak than 1640 lol. shout-out to that one person that brought sand and made me very sad when I couldn't ever click Solar Blade.
Speed isn't the only thing Lilligant has going for it though. CC Solar Blade Triple Axel is really nice high base power coverage that can be boosted further by Life Orb given how frail Lilli is anyways. Your opponent better have either one of Moltres, Ghold, or Pecha or amazing predictions because everything else gets hit pretty hard (if they do have a Moltres you might as well just resign yourself to the fact that Lilligant will not click a single button ever). Solar Blade is a silly move which is both thankfully and unfortunately limited by Sun. It does like 35-40 to +1 IDBP Zama which you can further embarrass by clicking Tera Ghost.
Hopefully this can convince more Ninetales girlies to use Lilligant, it's a really nice revenger/breaker/cleaner that brings some nice utility to Sun teams. As long as you don't throw it into a Tusk Ice Spinner for no reason, it'll probably put in work in every game. Best Chlorophyll user, it does not deserve to be ranked lower than shit Venusaur. Sun RMT with neat techs incoming at some point when I can claim a higher peak than 1640 lol. shout-out to that one person that brought sand and made me very sad when I couldn't ever click Solar Blade.
The correct Lilligant set will always be CC Solar Blade Triple Axel Tera Blast with Tera Fire Adamant Life Orb. The receipt from the great Pinkacross below for proof (and I'll PM you the team). I'm looking forward to you topping 1800 with your sun build :).
Originally, I wanted to start a whole thread with this post, but I was asked to post this in here instead.
Firstly, I want to preface this by stating that I do acknowledge that the power level in Gen9 is the highest it's ever been, and that bans are a way to combat the power creep of the metagame. I just want to maybe discuss some aspects of how this tool has been used during gen9.
(and yes, the title is a bit on the clickbait side.)
During the early days of the metagame, some threats that are now banned, such as Annihilape, Palafin, Chi-Yu, Chien-Pao, Espathra, Iron Bundle and Flutter Mane were indeed centralizing the whole meta, as once those mons got going, the game was as good as over.
However, the game has evolved over the now over 2 years it's been out. there were 2 DLCs that brought some answers to some of the mons that got banned before the DLC, however, the suspect tests were far and few since then.
Palafin was somewhat recently tested in OU, which led to it being banned once again.
I personally like the initiative of letting certain mons be suspect tested, if a thread asking for the suspect test reaches enough votes.
That, however, only allows for one specific mon to be tested at a time, which doesn't reflect the environment of a more generalized unban situation, which I personally believe would be a more interesting approach to the situation.
Using the Palafin suspect test as an example, I believe the votes would have been different if it was tested in an environment where other, currently banned threats, were also being tested.
Volcarona would be an interesting matchup, since a tera grass set would be a better answer, while it was the tera ground set that led to its ban.
Tera water Annihilape is also a good answer to Palafin, which now also has more answers than before, as the physically defensive Kanto birds that became popular in OU both can survive up to a +3 150bp rage fist from the ape, and have different answers to it. Moltres being able to burn and phase it out, or Zapdos having the ability to paralyze and even threaten a 2HKO with hurricane. (yes, Annihilape is still a very strong mon, I'm not saying it isn't.)
In other words, and I may be repeating myself, the dynamic of palafin being tested in OU on its own vs. being tested in OU alongside other currently banned mons is a valid thing to look into.
Whenever a strong offensive mon is removed from the tier, not only stall becomes ever so slightly stronger, which let's be honest here: nobody enjoys fighting against stall, but also a power vacuum is created, and now a different mon that used to have a losing matchup against the newly banned mon is even stronger, which eventually may lead to another suspect test banning it. at this point, it's just a matter of time until Raging Bolt, Kingambit, Iron Valiant and Kyurem (without the whole cheating incident) get banned. we got to the point where even Gliscor, that no longer has roost, has been banned before and suspected tested twice right now.
The current gen has many mons that are banned from OU and struggling to find any viable sets in Ubers.
And then there's also the Espathra case where, although it is a good mon, with a good ability and good coverage, it probably wouldn't be ban worthy if the move stored power was banned instead.
Understandably Smogon prefers to ban mons that have a strong signature move instead of banning just the move, as they initially did with Houndstone, due to it initially being the only mon able to learn Last Respects (which is currently even banned from the Ubers tier) but that is simply not the case.
arguably, stored power is the reason why Latias is banned from the UU tier, as well as one of the reasons why Magearna (which is undoubtedly a very strong mon) got banned as well.
Firstly, I want to preface this by stating that I do acknowledge that the power level in Gen9 is the highest it's ever been, and that bans are a way to combat the power creep of the metagame. I just want to maybe discuss some aspects of how this tool has been used during gen9.
(and yes, the title is a bit on the clickbait side.)
During the early days of the metagame, some threats that are now banned, such as Annihilape, Palafin, Chi-Yu, Chien-Pao, Espathra, Iron Bundle and Flutter Mane were indeed centralizing the whole meta, as once those mons got going, the game was as good as over.
However, the game has evolved over the now over 2 years it's been out. there were 2 DLCs that brought some answers to some of the mons that got banned before the DLC, however, the suspect tests were far and few since then.
Palafin was somewhat recently tested in OU, which led to it being banned once again.
I personally like the initiative of letting certain mons be suspect tested, if a thread asking for the suspect test reaches enough votes.
That, however, only allows for one specific mon to be tested at a time, which doesn't reflect the environment of a more generalized unban situation, which I personally believe would be a more interesting approach to the situation.
Using the Palafin suspect test as an example, I believe the votes would have been different if it was tested in an environment where other, currently banned threats, were also being tested.
Volcarona would be an interesting matchup, since a tera grass set would be a better answer, while it was the tera ground set that led to its ban.
Tera water Annihilape is also a good answer to Palafin, which now also has more answers than before, as the physically defensive Kanto birds that became popular in OU both can survive up to a +3 150bp rage fist from the ape, and have different answers to it. Moltres being able to burn and phase it out, or Zapdos having the ability to paralyze and even threaten a 2HKO with hurricane. (yes, Annihilape is still a very strong mon, I'm not saying it isn't.)
+2 0 Atk Annihilape Rage Fist(200BP) vs. 248 HP / 248+ Def Moltres: 375-442 (97.9 - 115.4%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
+3 0 Atk Annihilape Rage Fist(150BP) vs. 248 HP / 244+ Def Zapdos: 364-430 (95 - 112.2%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
+3 0 Atk Annihilape Rage Fist(150BP) vs. 248 HP / 248+ Def Moltres: 351-414 (91.6 - 108%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
0 SpA Zapdos Hurricane vs. 240 HP / 252+ SpD Annihilape: 222-264 (52.7 - 62.7%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 240 HP / 252+ SpD Tera Water Annihilape: 182-216 (43.2 - 51.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Zapdos Volt Switch vs. 240 HP / 252+ SpD Tera Water Annihilape: 140-168 (33.2 - 39.9%) -- 19% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Moltres Flamethrower vs. 240 HP / 252+ SpD Annihilape: 91-108 (21.6 - 25.6%) -- possible 5HKO
+3 0 Atk Annihilape Rage Fist(150BP) vs. 248 HP / 244+ Def Zapdos: 364-430 (95 - 112.2%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
+3 0 Atk Annihilape Rage Fist(150BP) vs. 248 HP / 248+ Def Moltres: 351-414 (91.6 - 108%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
0 SpA Zapdos Hurricane vs. 240 HP / 252+ SpD Annihilape: 222-264 (52.7 - 62.7%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 240 HP / 252+ SpD Tera Water Annihilape: 182-216 (43.2 - 51.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Zapdos Volt Switch vs. 240 HP / 252+ SpD Tera Water Annihilape: 140-168 (33.2 - 39.9%) -- 19% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Moltres Flamethrower vs. 240 HP / 252+ SpD Annihilape: 91-108 (21.6 - 25.6%) -- possible 5HKO
In other words, and I may be repeating myself, the dynamic of palafin being tested in OU on its own vs. being tested in OU alongside other currently banned mons is a valid thing to look into.
Whenever a strong offensive mon is removed from the tier, not only stall becomes ever so slightly stronger, which let's be honest here: nobody enjoys fighting against stall, but also a power vacuum is created, and now a different mon that used to have a losing matchup against the newly banned mon is even stronger, which eventually may lead to another suspect test banning it. at this point, it's just a matter of time until Raging Bolt, Kingambit, Iron Valiant and Kyurem (without the whole cheating incident) get banned. we got to the point where even Gliscor, that no longer has roost, has been banned before and suspected tested twice right now.
The current gen has many mons that are banned from OU and struggling to find any viable sets in Ubers.
yes. the Ubers UU metagame has been created for that exact reason, but even then, there are some mons that aren't viable even on that.
also, I know some of you are thinking of Solgaleo right now. I personally can see a world where this mon would end up falling into the UUBL tier. I see you, Joey.
And then there's also the Espathra case where, although it is a good mon, with a good ability and good coverage, it probably wouldn't be ban worthy if the move stored power was banned instead.
Understandably Smogon prefers to ban mons that have a strong signature move instead of banning just the move, as they initially did with Houndstone, due to it initially being the only mon able to learn Last Respects (which is currently even banned from the Ubers tier) but that is simply not the case.
arguably, stored power is the reason why Latias is banned from the UU tier, as well as one of the reasons why Magearna (which is undoubtedly a very strong mon) got banned as well.
3-0 I'm literally the next oracle (I know there wasn't any shifts but Meow finally fell under the OU cutoff usage so I'm counting that as a win)
Garchomp being on the rise is really cool, nice to see it come back from like basically 0 usage.
Glimmora being so low is really shocking but it makes sense, I've always been a hater. It does nothing but get rocks up, set TSpikes that will be absorbed by GKing/Pecha without anything getting poisoned, and then die.
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Loxix will never be OU. It’s simply too niche of a pick and loses to common balancemons and fatmons like Garganacuck and Pecharunt. Against offense, it often relies on Tera to break certain threats such as Cinderace, Glimmora, and the ubiquitous elephants. Iron Moth and Iron Valiant in particular just completely feast upon it; It’s only really good into darkspam.
| 27 | Glimmora | 7.261%
I'm very surprised it still has over 7% usage, I swear this mon is such a fraud. I suppose high skilled players can take advantage of the sequencing that it forces, or get a guaranteed poison with Red Card, but everytime it comes out it does so little. Good speed tier and spa for webs though.
| 38 | Sinistcha | 4.572% |
On the other hand I'm very happy to see Sinistcha get OU usage, I said when Pecharunt rose that this was the next mon that we need to pay attention to.
Hey to all the people watching this thread - check out the council's post here on Pecharunt ^^
Hi folks, we're still discussing the recent survey results and are considering action in the nearish future, but there is something we didn't cover on the survey and as a result it got tons of write-ins. If you've been following SPL at all you've likely seen the dominance of Pecharunt, and the council has been questioning whether or not its metagame impact is positive.
Pech's bag of tricks is simple but extremely effective - its just-perfect Speed tier, mammoth physical bulk and, most importantly, combination of Malignant Chain & Poison Puppeteer make it a complete...
Pech's bag of tricks is simple but extremely effective - its just-perfect Speed tier, mammoth physical bulk and, most importantly, combination of Malignant Chain & Poison Puppeteer make it a complete...
if you pay attention to the post, I'm not advocating to just straight up unbanning Annihilape, I'm just using it as an example of a clearly broken mon that has more answers now with the DLC than it did back when it was originally banned.
what I am advocating for is suspect testing multiple mons at a time.
also, stored power is a pretty annoying gimmick strat, which caused bans from multiple tiers. power trip is fine because it has a terrible spread, while most stored power mons have better sets. banning it would probably have a more positive than negative impact on the whole metagame.
I don't really understand what you want to accomplish with suspecting multiple mons at once, because based on the example you gave, it sounds like you're advocating for broken to check broken, which is not something we want.
As for Stored Power, because it's a high distribution move, in order for the move to be banned, someone would have to make a compelling argument that the move is fundamentally uncompetitive, which is something I have yet to see.
I agree with you, but I think it's quite undeniable that there are certain traits that make any mon with Stored Power a good Stored Power sweeper. Like, consistently. Name it bulk, typing, ability, combination of boosting opportunities... Not every mon with Stored Power uses Stored Power successfully, but those that do are very similar to each other and that must be a symptom for something
tbh i just want magearna freed bc it would fix the metagame overnight so even if i like stored power and dont think its broken yeah ban stored power
Also Pecharunt is the healthiest mon we've had join OU in ages
Magearna's Specs set alone is enough to be broken. Its much better and consistent than Stored Power sets will ever be.
torn-t and lokix love terrorizing our drops
Torn-T really just runs uu with lokix now
anyway pecharunt being banworthy because of tera allowing it to check every physical threat and be an annoying piece of shit is unsurprising.
Guess tera is becoming more of a common thread between banworthy mons the more we go into the generation
Why is this a bad thing? in a tier with such a big threat list and those mons can change their types at the press of a button, we need strong, reliable blanket checks like pech and ting. Banning them for this reason, especially with how many ACTUALLY broken stuff is in the tier rn is beyond comical and deserves to be treated like a joke.
I am surprised Pecharunt is contentious enough to show up on a survey outright. Even with it improving in time I would have expected things like its common weaknesses to counteract its bulk, at least to such an extent that 1 free turn wasn't flipping its match-ups on status-able targets. Psychic Noise in particular is a Super Effective hit and a pretty hard shut down to its stalling ability.
Good to see the more things change, the more they stay the same though. You don't have to believe it, but with Ting-Lu and Pecharunt showing up by write-in and Tera Blast on the Survey actively, the simple explanation IS that Tera-as-a-mechanic simply is not contentious enough to reach that same threshold. Your entire accusation springs from an assumption (Tera is disliked but the Council is fudging the numbers) to subsequently question the integrity of the Surveys themselves, their understanding of the game (and your conflicting credential being...), and the prompt for Pecharunt's attention (as if it's arbitrary).
You then follow it up with talk about demanding your account deletion, in a thread dedicated to a Metagame you don't intend to continue participating in, while threatening legal escalation. Regardless of the validity of this request/demand, it has jack to do with this thread's purpose: if you cared so intently about your data being present, why would you not minimize its volume by limiting to a message reinforcing the request; if you have not checked online for a month, where do you get off lecturing the Council and Community about the direction tiering is going, whether on knowledge or simply on good faith?
This whole thing reads to me like trolling for attention by making accusations and a ruckus while inciting argument with a "superior" attitude. I am fully aware I am contributing to such a hypothetical mentality by replying to this, but at this point you add nothing to anyone's conversation and I'm torn between endorsing the account deletion to end this nonsense and voting against it simply because this behavior does not deserve any reward or positive reinforcement.
Good to see the more things change, the more they stay the same though. You don't have to believe it, but with Ting-Lu and Pecharunt showing up by write-in and Tera Blast on the Survey actively, the simple explanation IS that Tera-as-a-mechanic simply is not contentious enough to reach that same threshold. Your entire accusation springs from an assumption (Tera is disliked but the Council is fudging the numbers) to subsequently question the integrity of the Surveys themselves, their understanding of the game (and your conflicting credential being...), and the prompt for Pecharunt's attention (as if it's arbitrary).
You then follow it up with talk about demanding your account deletion, in a thread dedicated to a Metagame you don't intend to continue participating in, while threatening legal escalation. Regardless of the validity of this request/demand, it has jack to do with this thread's purpose: if you cared so intently about your data being present, why would you not minimize its volume by limiting to a message reinforcing the request; if you have not checked online for a month, where do you get off lecturing the Council and Community about the direction tiering is going, whether on knowledge or simply on good faith?
This whole thing reads to me like trolling for attention by making accusations and a ruckus while inciting argument with a "superior" attitude. I am fully aware I am contributing to such a hypothetical mentality by replying to this, but at this point you add nothing to anyone's conversation and I'm torn between endorsing the account deletion to end this nonsense and voting against it simply because this behavior does not deserve any reward or positive reinforcement.
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Lokix has 8% overall usage in SPL, more than all of Mola, Garg, Ace, and Glimm. Non Darkspam HO also struggles with Lokix a ton and Lokix is deadweight into no matchups at all, there is no playstyle that is unscathed by tinted lens knock+fimp+uturn. Even mons like Great Tusk and Zamazenta get beaten down with repeated hits which opens up teammates immensely. Mon is in A tiers in the vr for a reason and the only reason it isn't OU by usage is because the OU ladder works in mysterious ways and randomly decides to never use some good mons and spam a lot of mediocre mons.
You could say the same thing about Weave and any other UUmons in the A ranking though. Lokix is a Pokemon that requires a very high level of skill to pilot and requires a good amount of support from hazard removal to keep CB variants alive, special wallbreakers to handle physical walls, and Pokemon that can attempt to handle quad resists to FI that aren't actually super uncommon. Ladder isn't using it because the ladder is not full of Pinkacrosses that can always make Lokix work.
Tbh, lokix is incredible into almost all offensive teams and its unresisted knock first impression and u turn ensures its far from useless into balance either. Also this comes with the side effect of heavily discouraging 4x resists like val from using their tera, which is incredible. Overall a incredible mon that performs into pretty much every matchup, if anything A on the VR is too low for it
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No idea what you mean by this, Weavile has nearly risen up to OU on ladder and in tour it's been successful in SPL and SCL with 4.96% usage in SCL and 5.93% usage in SPL already. Tinkaton is the same, very successful in tournaments.
Lokix definitely is not a skill intensive mon, its pretty brainless if anything as someone whos laddered with both band and sd sets. Removal is not at all a problem for ladder players when ladder spams removal more than tournament does and uses one of the best spinblockers in pecharunt half as much. Special wallbreakers to break physical walls are just... something nearly every physical attacker wants (Lokix can also break nearly every wall with only hazard support if played well). OU only has a few quad resists to bug, of which Moltres, Pecharunt, Gholdengo, Iron Moth, and Enamorus hate either rocks or its Dark STABs, while mons like Glimm and Valiant don't like taking repeated knocks.
Making Lokix work only requires being a decent teambuilder and having enough of a brain to click a priority move that ohkos the majority of the offensive meta vs offense or set hazarfs and click knock off vs bulkier teams
Lokix is clearly a good option in OU. I do not know why it is January 2025 and this is up for debate or people are painting it as gimmicky. It has a unique role that fits a lot of teams and has a ton of utility, fitting in among OU peers as a premier option on balance and bulkyO with priority, knock, and pivoting.