That's an awesome Quaggy set, kudos to you!
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New and "creative" moveset/EV spread thread. Mk. 4
- Thread starter darkie
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I hope that Quagsire set becomes popular, as it is just another reason for me to use Lead Torterra :) Awesome set though.
I would run Water Absorb over Damp on that Quagsire. That way you have a decent switch-in to Gyarados, Suicune, Empoleon, etc. and Encore them into a non-STAB move. Since you're Encoring every exploding lead anyway, Damp won't be that big a deal.
He can switch into Metagross later in the game though, which Water Absorb wouldn't allow. Empoleon typically runs Grass Knot, and since all of them are faster, you will likely be Encoring Gyarados's Earthquake or Bounce, Suicune's Ice Beam or Roar, and Empoleon's Grass Knot. I think Damp is overall better for insurance capabilities if they decide to Explode immediately(dunno why, but someone did it to me).
Ok, after looking at an overused leads thread i got an idea for this..
Alakazam @ focus sash
Ability: inner focus
EV's:4 Hp/ 252 Spatk/ 252 Spe
Timid nature (+ Spe, -Atk)
-Hidden Power Fire
-Focus Blast
-Taunt
-Shadow Ball
Lead-kazam. I designed this guy to be a taunt lead(obviously) and to be faster than the other leads today, while killing off some of the other leads in todays metagame. Hidden Power Fire takes care of abomasnow, jirachi,metagross,and takes a decent chunk out of bronzong. Focus blast will hit aerodactyl, heatran, and tyranitar hard, if it doesn't score a KO. Shadow ball hits azelf. tuant is there because alakazam is so fast that it can beat most SR leads in speed. I think that this thing could potentially be alot of use. I'm working on a anti-lead for him at the moment, i will post it later, tell me what you think of this, thanks.
Alakazam @ focus sash
Ability: inner focus
EV's:4 Hp/ 252 Spatk/ 252 Spe
Timid nature (+ Spe, -Atk)
-Hidden Power Fire
-Focus Blast
-Taunt
-Shadow Ball
Lead-kazam. I designed this guy to be a taunt lead(obviously) and to be faster than the other leads today, while killing off some of the other leads in todays metagame. Hidden Power Fire takes care of abomasnow, jirachi,metagross,and takes a decent chunk out of bronzong. Focus blast will hit aerodactyl, heatran, and tyranitar hard, if it doesn't score a KO. Shadow ball hits azelf. tuant is there because alakazam is so fast that it can beat most SR leads in speed. I think that this thing could potentially be alot of use. I'm working on a anti-lead for him at the moment, i will post it later, tell me what you think of this, thanks.
Ok, after looking at an overused leads thread i got an idea for this..
Alakazam @ focus sash
Ability: inner focus
EV's:4 Hp/ 252 Spatk/ 252 Spe
Timid nature (+ Spe, -Atk)
-Hidden Power Fire
-Focus Blast
-Taunt
-Shadow Ball
Lead-kazam. I designed this guy to be a taunt lead(obviously) and to be faster than the other leads today, while killing off some of the other leads in todays metagame. Hidden Power Fire takes care of abomasnow, jirachi,metagross,and takes a decent chunk out of bronzong. Focus blast will hit aerodactyl, heatran, and tyranitar hard, if it doesn't score a KO. Shadow ball hits azelf. tuant is there because alakazam is so fast that it can beat most SR leads in speed. I think that this thing could potentially be alot of use. I'm working on a anti-lead for him at the moment, i will post it later, tell me what you think of this, thanks.
Unfortunately, this set just isn't as effective as some other leads.
Other than Taunt, which is pretty much always predicted, all you can do it hit the with your other three moves, which doesn't even include Psychic. Hidden Power Fire does not handle scarf jirachi leads or metagross leads with occa berry at all. Focus Blast can't OHKO those pokemon you listed (if it even hits) while they all can OHKO back.
You're better off using Gengar or Azelf for Taunting + attacking. :)
edit: let's not forget that rotom-w set I posted on the previous page instead of talking about how a quagsire with encore will be the next #1 ou lead
Well, here's my first attempt at a lead. Its not on smogon's page, so I'm assuming its not made yet. Well, here goes:
Quagsire @ Leftovers
Ability: Damp
Nature: Relaxed
EVs: 252 Hp / 116 Def / 28 Sp A / 112 Sp D
Moves:
- Encore
- Earthquake
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam / HP Grass / Haze / Yawn
This looks really cool and I'd like to give it a try, but...I don't think Quagsire (or Wooper for that matter) learns Hydro Pump.
They don't, but Muddy Water could be used as a replacement most likely.
I thought he did, but I just re-checked it and I was wrong. Sorry guys.
Muddy Water is good because fof its 30% chance for the Acc drop, but the only think I don't like about it is its 85% Accuracy, which is a bit unappealing for a 95 BP move (IMO). So surf is better since its always gonna hit.
I'll work on the EV spread again, and re-post the new one. Sorry about the mistake.
Togekiss @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
Nature: Timid
EVs: 80HP / 252SpAtk/ 178Spd
~ Trick
~ Air Slash
~ Aura Sphere
~ Nasty Plot/Thunder Wave
So this is my anti-lead Togekiss. Timid+178 speed EVs make sure i out run Jolly/252Spd Aerodactyl. So the basic plan is to Trick them the Scarf while they try and set up stealth rocks then when they switch you set up your nasty plot and sweep or thunder wave their switch in and abuse paraflinch.
Pretty simple. Very, very effective.
Ability: Serene Grace
Nature: Timid
EVs: 80HP / 252SpAtk/ 178Spd
~ Trick
~ Air Slash
~ Aura Sphere
~ Nasty Plot/Thunder Wave
So this is my anti-lead Togekiss. Timid+178 speed EVs make sure i out run Jolly/252Spd Aerodactyl. So the basic plan is to Trick them the Scarf while they try and set up stealth rocks then when they switch you set up your nasty plot and sweep or thunder wave their switch in and abuse paraflinch.
Pretty simple. Very, very effective.
Since my contribution thread at the analysis workshop got closed.(due to my newb-ness at formatting,and prose errors on my part,not to mention infamiliarity around the boards.)
And i really want to share this set,might as well contribute it here.
Kingdra @ Scope Lens
Ability:Sniper
Nature:Modest
EVs:252 HP/252 SpA/4Sp.D
~Focus Energy
~Surf
~Ice Beam
~Draco Meteor
This is a gimmick set,designed to sweep with Sniper.
25% For 3x Critical Hit,is pretty good.
The EV spread allows you to take a couple of hits,and allows you to sweep 1 or 2 pokemon before dying.
Not recommended for serious battling,since you don't have DD,but if you're breeding,and you forgot Dragon Dance on your set,then this can be an alternative.
And i really want to share this set,might as well contribute it here.
Kingdra @ Scope Lens
Ability:Sniper
Nature:Modest
EVs:252 HP/252 SpA/4Sp.D
~Focus Energy
~Surf
~Ice Beam
~Draco Meteor
This is a gimmick set,designed to sweep with Sniper.
25% For 3x Critical Hit,is pretty good.
The EV spread allows you to take a couple of hits,and allows you to sweep 1 or 2 pokemon before dying.
Not recommended for serious battling,since you don't have DD,but if you're breeding,and you forgot Dragon Dance on your set,then this can be an alternative.
I've been using a Sunny Day themed team in OU recently and have had great success with a particularly bulky heatran which sets up Sunny Day time and again:
Heatran
Moveset Name: SunnyTran
Move 1: Sunny Day
Move 2: Lava Plume
Move 3: Rest / Roar
Move 4: Sleep Talk / Dragon Pulse
Item: Heat Rock / Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
Natures: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 SpA
This has longevity with the RestTalk combo or dragon pulse and roar for extra coverage and support instead. Lava Plume aids with the physical walling. Additionally the nature and EVs can be tailored to a specially defensive spread (252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD). Lava Plume still helps with the stalling nature that burn will aid in and taking off damage each and rounding off "all-rounder" tanking capabilities with the attack drop of burn. However, Flamethower becomes a more powerful option here if physical walling isn't the user's aim...
Heatran
Moveset Name: SunnyTran
Move 1: Sunny Day
Move 2: Lava Plume
Move 3: Rest / Roar
Move 4: Sleep Talk / Dragon Pulse
Item: Heat Rock / Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
Natures: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 SpA
This has longevity with the RestTalk combo or dragon pulse and roar for extra coverage and support instead. Lava Plume aids with the physical walling. Additionally the nature and EVs can be tailored to a specially defensive spread (252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD). Lava Plume still helps with the stalling nature that burn will aid in and taking off damage each and rounding off "all-rounder" tanking capabilities with the attack drop of burn. However, Flamethower becomes a more powerful option here if physical walling isn't the user's aim...
No, the other one had Solarbeam on it also. This one seems to be prolonging Heatran's survivalbility so it can Sunny Day more.
That Heatran looks like it would be setup fodder for many things. With Rest Talk and only one offensive move, it will only choose the offensive move 33% of the time while asleep. Lava Plume's 30% burn chance still gives things like DDMence ample time to set up since there is a good chance of never burning the opponent after using it twice or three times. Sleep Talk will also often choose Sunny Day when Sun is already set up, and that wastes turns.I've been using a Sunny Day themed team in OU recently and have had great success with a particularly bulky heatran which sets up Sunny Day time and again:
Heatran
Moveset Name: SunnyTran
Move 1: Sunny Day
Move 2: Lava Plume
Move 3: Rest / Roar
Move 4: Sleep Talk / Dragon Pulse
Item: Heat Rock / Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
Natures: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 SpA
This has longevity with the RestTalk combo or dragon pulse and roar for extra coverage and support instead. Lava Plume aids with the physical walling. Additionally the nature and EVs can be tailored to a specially defensive spread (252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD). Lava Plume still helps with the stalling nature that burn will aid in and taking off damage each and rounding off "all-rounder" tanking capabilities with the attack drop of burn. However, Flamethower becomes a more powerful option here if physical walling isn't the user's aim...
Heatrans in the sun are full of win. But heatran setting up sun probably isn't. If you have something like tangrowth setting up sunny day, which is bait for a heatran switch in, then its is quite threatening. Heatran setting up his own sun is probably not very profiecent.
Diglett (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Protect
- Screech
- Stealth Rock
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This is my UU Lead Diglett.
Earthquake is stab
Protect to scout for Choice Items and Fake Outs
Screech to make the opposition Pursuit-bait and to juice up Diglett's Earthquakes
Steath Rock for obvious reasons
Arena Trap + Focus Sash gives me time to setup SR and Screech's.
As for Pursuit user.. I simply use LO Absol.
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Protect
- Screech
- Stealth Rock
---
This is my UU Lead Diglett.
Earthquake is stab
Protect to scout for Choice Items and Fake Outs
Screech to make the opposition Pursuit-bait and to juice up Diglett's Earthquakes
Steath Rock for obvious reasons
Arena Trap + Focus Sash gives me time to setup SR and Screech's.
As for Pursuit user.. I simply use LO Absol.
So any flier or person with levitate can either set up or OHKO it (well 2HKO after sash). Why use it over any other lead? The only lead I see it having an edge over is lead Registeel, but even then, Diglett's attack is so poor that it will at least get up SR and at most 2-3HKO with Iron Head.
Some comments:
There used to be a sniper set on the analysis, but it was removed due to being not that good.
Draco meteor is not recommended on a set that intends on setting up. You probably want Dragon Pulse instead
Ice Beam has largely redundant coverage with your Dragon move of choice. You probably want HP Electric, Fighting, or Ground instead to hit the one Pokemon that resists both of your STAB moves (Empoleon)
You say this is not really worthwhile, but let's do some math to show it. Scope Lens increases your chance to critical from 6.25 to 12.5%. A critical hit does 3x damage, an increase of 200%. So .0625 X 2.00 = .125, or a 12.5% average increase of damage. Likewise, Focus energy gives double that, for a 25% average increase in damage. Dragon Dance, on the other hand, gives a 50% increase in damage, and life orb gives a 30% increase. So yeah, those are probably better.
Pokemon Name: Lapras
Moveset Name: Thunder Dancing
Move 1: - Ice Beam
Move 2: - Rain Dance
Move 3: - Thunder
Move 4: - Dragon Pulse
Item: Damp Rock
Ability: Water Absorb
Nature(s): Modest
EVs: HP 175/SpA 252/Spd 252
Lapras can defeat dragon and flying types with ice beam and dragon pulse and rain dance plus damp rock makes the rain dance ever longer and thunder will by 100% accurate to hit it's target. If a water type attack attacks lapras water absorb will kick in and give lapras HP.
Surf offers more type coverage than dragon pulse and has STAB. Ice Beam hits every single dragon SE and most 4x, there's no need for Dragon Pulse.
Pokemon Name: Lapras
Moveset Name: Thunder Dancing
Move 1: - Ice Beam
Move 2: - Rain Dance
Move 3: - Thunder
Move 4: - Dragon Pulse
Item: Damp Rock
Ability: Water Absorb
Nature(s): Modest
EVs: HP 175/SpA 252/Spd 252
Lapras can defeat dragon and flying types with ice beam and dragon pulse and rain dance plus damp rock makes the rain dance ever longer and thunder will by 100% accurate to hit it's target. If a water type attack attacks lapras water absorb will kick in and give lapras HP.
I really don't see the use of this. You can't trap Moltres and Yanmega and Uxie, so those three will beat you out anyway, and Diglett is frail and not very fast. Out of the things that you trap . . . Ambipom has U-turn and is faster, so it can escape; bulky Rock- and Steel-types will possibly kill Diglett since they have huge Def and can take a couple of Earthquakes (Steelix will just EQ you twice while you Screech + EQ and fail to KO, I'm pretty sure; correct me if I'm wrong about this); Arcanine will Intimidate you and Flare Blitz + Extremespeed should kill you for sure, while you have to either EQ him twice or Screech + EQ to have a shot at killing him (min-Atk Steelix does about 50% to Arcanine with EQ after being Intimidated, so I really doubt max-Atk Dugtrio is doing significantly more).
This thing has impossible EVs ._. The 192 HP/ 112 Def/ 160 SAtk/ 44 SDef listed in the analysis would be better to keep Gorebyss and Omastar from getting 2HKOs on it with HP Grass. As stated earlier Dragon Pulse gives redundant coverage, especially in UU where it would be used. Toxic or Sing for status, or Surf for STAB, would be better in the final slot.
Pokemon Name: Lapras
Moveset Name: Thunder Dancing
Move 1: - Ice Beam
Move 2: - Rain Dance
Move 3: - Thunder
Move 4: - Dragon Pulse
Item: Damp Rock
Ability: Water Absorb
Nature(s): Modest
EVs: HP 175/SpA 252/Spd 252
Lapras can defeat dragon and flying types with ice beam and dragon pulse and rain dance plus damp rock makes the rain dance ever longer and thunder will by 100% accurate to hit it's target. If a water type attack attacks lapras water absorb will kick in and give lapras HP.
I'll just be straightfoward: I was looking around RMTs and shoddy battle statistics trying to figure what lead was the best. It seems like most either set up Stealth Rock or try to prevent Stealth Rock. So, I've thought about it, done some calcs, and came up with this guy:
Pokemon Name: Salamence
Moveset Name: Lead SpecsMence
Move 1: - HP Grass (70)
Move 2: - Hydro Pump
Move 3: - Fire Blast
Move 4: - Dragon Pulse / Draco Meteor
Item: Choice Specs
Ability: Intimidate
Nature(s): Modest
EVs: 36 Hp / 216 Sp.Atk / 252 Speed
What drew me into this guy was his raw power. With this moveset and EV spread, he can successfully OHKO nearly all the usual leads, including quiet a few of the big-names that currently plague the current OU tier. 216 Sp.A EVs ensures OHKO's on the what you expect to kill, and the rest is dumped in HP to make it bulkier (although you could take a bit more off of the Sp.A and invest that into HP if needed).
The usual leads will want to still set up rocks on you, as they think either you'll want to switch out, or they have an item that will help them set up SR (shucca berry, focus sash, ect). Well, if they stay in, they're toast. Specsmence has lost so much popularity as the metagame keeps changing. The surprise is in how much power it does, and the unexpectedness of the set. The damage calcs speak for themselves for this guy:
-Hidden Power Grass (70) against: 252 Hp/0 Sp.D Neutral Swampert: Damage: 119.80% - 140.84%
-Fire Blast against: 252 Hp/92 Sp.D Positive Bronzong: Damage: 82.54% 97.04% (252 Hp/92 Sp. D Neutral Bronnzong: Damage: 90.53% - 106.51%)
-Fire Blast against: 252 Hp/0 Sp.D Neutral Metagross: Damage: 102.20% - 120.05%
-Fire Blast against: 252 Hp/0 Sp.D Neutral Jirachi: Damage: 93.32% - 109.65% (80 Hp/0Sp.D Neutral: Damage: 104.43% - 122.71%)
-Hydro Pump against 252 Hp/0 Sp.D Neutral Hippowdon: Damage: 117.14% - 137.86%
-Hydro Pump against: 4 Hp/0 Sp.D Neutral Heatran: Damage: 110.80% - 130.25%
Most Swamperts, Metagross, and (to an extent) Shucca Berry Heatran will usually stay in and set up rocks, as any physical variation would fail to kill these 3. But, the tricks on them when you move first, net the surprise KO, AND they don't get Stealth Rock up. This is the reason to use this set, and has helped me enough to the point where I felt I had to come here and right up a brief summary of him.
Edit: After some thought, it might be possible to take off some Speed EVs as well since it'll still loose to things faster than it now (jirachi), but it'll still be able to win on things slower than it (Swampert, non-scarf Heatran).
Pokemon Name: Salamence
Moveset Name: Lead SpecsMence
Move 1: - HP Grass (70)
Move 2: - Hydro Pump
Move 3: - Fire Blast
Move 4: - Dragon Pulse / Draco Meteor
Item: Choice Specs
Ability: Intimidate
Nature(s): Modest
EVs: 36 Hp / 216 Sp.Atk / 252 Speed
What drew me into this guy was his raw power. With this moveset and EV spread, he can successfully OHKO nearly all the usual leads, including quiet a few of the big-names that currently plague the current OU tier. 216 Sp.A EVs ensures OHKO's on the what you expect to kill, and the rest is dumped in HP to make it bulkier (although you could take a bit more off of the Sp.A and invest that into HP if needed).
The usual leads will want to still set up rocks on you, as they think either you'll want to switch out, or they have an item that will help them set up SR (shucca berry, focus sash, ect). Well, if they stay in, they're toast. Specsmence has lost so much popularity as the metagame keeps changing. The surprise is in how much power it does, and the unexpectedness of the set. The damage calcs speak for themselves for this guy:
-Hidden Power Grass (70) against: 252 Hp/0 Sp.D Neutral Swampert: Damage: 119.80% - 140.84%
-Fire Blast against: 252 Hp/92 Sp.D Positive Bronzong: Damage: 82.54% 97.04% (252 Hp/92 Sp. D Neutral Bronnzong: Damage: 90.53% - 106.51%)
-Fire Blast against: 252 Hp/0 Sp.D Neutral Metagross: Damage: 102.20% - 120.05%
-Fire Blast against: 252 Hp/0 Sp.D Neutral Jirachi: Damage: 93.32% - 109.65% (80 Hp/0Sp.D Neutral: Damage: 104.43% - 122.71%)
-Hydro Pump against 252 Hp/0 Sp.D Neutral Hippowdon: Damage: 117.14% - 137.86%
-Hydro Pump against: 4 Hp/0 Sp.D Neutral Heatran: Damage: 110.80% - 130.25%
Most Swamperts, Metagross, and (to an extent) Shucca Berry Heatran will usually stay in and set up rocks, as any physical variation would fail to kill these 3. But, the tricks on them when you move first, net the surprise KO, AND they don't get Stealth Rock up. This is the reason to use this set, and has helped me enough to the point where I felt I had to come here and right up a brief summary of him.
Edit: After some thought, it might be possible to take off some Speed EVs as well since it'll still loose to things faster than it now (jirachi), but it'll still be able to win on things slower than it (Swampert, non-scarf Heatran).
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