Blaziken

[Omnipresent]

Give Blaziken PROTECT! It helps really .

HJK / Sky Uppercut .
Blaze Kick .
Thunder Punch ? (Flying and Water) .

Ooh it's a bad idea . It still can't OHKO some pokemon . Maybe Sword Dance ?

Infernape is good at sweeping. Protect isn't that bad, it ensures the speed boost but allows a counter to come in. The advantage with Infernape is that the speed is instant. Blaziken has many movesets to worry about, but late game it's less of a threat if something can wait to counter it later on.

Blaziken has to be played very carefully, late game it is more vulnerable, IMO.

 

[Santa_Clauz]

And then there's always Slowbro. Now amped up with its new ability Regeneration and its Psychic typing, Slowbro can easily wall most of Blazikens attacks with relative ease, and go for a Boiling Water and hopefully inflict a burn, thus ending Blaziken's sweep. That is, if Blazikens running a Swords Dance set.

Read the set calcs from the OP, Blaziken can 2HKO Slowbro

Also, Blaziken can just own Shanderaa, seeing as by that point he will at the very least speed tie with scafed Shanderaa, seeing as they have the same base speed.

Protect is just a waste of a move slot on a pokemon already suffering massive 4 move syndrome, seeing how many things cannot afford to stay in on Blaziken.

Sharpedo? Don't make me laugh, he's even more frail than Blaziken. Good luck even coming in. He has 10 less base HP, and 30 less base defences, on both sides. He also has less SpA, and his only advantage is more speed, which only helps against blaziken, which it really doesn't as you would need to bring them both in on the same switch. In addition, how do you deal with a physically bulky water? Your Crunch is nowhere near as powerful as HJK, and any HP you use will be less effective than Blazikens. The fact is, in this role, Blaziken is better in every possible way. Better offensive STABs, better stats, hell, even better defensively, and I never thought I'd say that about Blaziken.

 

[MrSupreme]

Blaziken can learn claw sharpen as, which will boosts its accuracy meaning there is slim chance of high jump kick, blaze kick and stone edge missing, especially if high jump kick misses you will loose HP.

The only downside to using claw sharpen over SD is the +2 attack boost

Stone edge is more effective than shadow claw as it hits bulky flying types (namely dragonite) very hard. It also hits the ghost/fire pokemon which would be only wall to this set

 

[Torchic]

I think Blaziken & Sanzando should be effective, Blaziken can baton pass the speed boost (also attak boost if Blaziken SD). Sazando can use Encourage to boost, it should be a effective combo.

 

[Benlisted]

Think I'm gonna try out a physical Hi-Jump Kick, Blaze Kick and Stone Edge Claw Sharpen set and see how that goes, with Sunny Day support to boost Blaze Kick's power.

 

[GLS]

You can use Protect for more than just getting the first speed boost. In fact I think it's even more important to get the second speed boost for your sweeping. Before that you are very susceptible to scarfers who come in on your swords dance turn. I'd have to see the calcs on what exactly Blaziken fails to OHKO without Stone Edge, but I'm willing to bet it's not a whole lot.

 

[Chillarmy]

Also, Blaziken can just own Shanderaa, seeing as by that point he will at the very least speed tie with scafed Shanderaa, seeing as they have the same base speed.

Blaziken's only option to OHKO Shanderaa is with Stone Edge and missing 20% of the time makes it semi-reliable at best, hence why I suggested Baton Pass so something else could take advantage of the Speed boosts while setting up on a Choice-locked Shadow Ball.

Protect is just a waste of a move slot on a pokemon already suffering massive 4 move syndrome, seeing how many things cannot afford to stay in on Blaziken.

4-move syndrome? Are you serious? HJK and Fire Blast deal with most of Blaziken's switch ins, limiting HP Grass's use to hitting Swampert and Crocune, both of whom should be weakened enough later in the game for HJK to KO. Yeah, Slowbro can switch in on either STAB, but Stone Edge could always be passed up for HP Grass / Electric since its really only useful for Shanderra, who seems pretty easy to trap IMO. Protect ensures that Blaziken can beat random Scarfers (Flygon isn't taking a 130 BP STAB attack anytime soon), and it helps scout for priority.

He also has less SpA, and his only advantage is more speed, which only helps against blaziken, which it really doesn't as you would need to bring them both in on the same switch

I have to disagree on this, as it's very unlikely that Blaziken is going to be running Vacuum Wave on any of its Speed Boost sets just to catch Sharpedo before it can use Aqua Jet.

Also, no one said that Sharpedo is, in any way, better than Blaziken as a mixed sweeper.

 

[Johnny_Darko]

Yeah, Slowbro can switch in on either STAB, but Stone Edge could always be passed up for HP Grass / Electric since its really only useful for Shanderra, who seems pretty easy to trap IMO. Protect ensures that Blaziken can beat random Scarfers (Flygon isn't taking a 130 BP STAB attack anytime soon), and it helps scout for priority.

Oh yeah, Stone Edge is only useful for Shanderaa. Blaziken will never have to deal with the two big Dragon/Flying types or Gyarados (if HP grass is used). It's not worth running HP Grass/Electric for one Pokemon that won't see nearly as much usage as Salamence or Gyarados.

Protect is amazing on Blaziken, screw Swords Dance. Swords Dancing only makes it extremely vulnerable to revenge killing, which will happen a LOT in the early meta with Garchomp and the like running around Scarfed. If you run both, you are limited to STAB which lets you be walled and scared off/trapped by multiple threats. Blaziken with Life Orb and maxed attack IVs packs so much punch in the first place, after all.

 

[Chillarmy]

Oh yeah, Stone Edge is only useful for Shanderaa. Blaziken will never have to deal with the two big Dragon/Flying types or Gyarados (if HP grass is used). It's not worth running HP Grass/Electric for one Pokemon that won't see nearly as much usage as Salamence or Gyarados.

4/0 Gyarados, Salamence, and Dragonite are 2HKOed by Fire Blast given they've taken SR damage. I'd rather spam a STAB attack than rely on Miss Edge...

 

[Johnny_Darko]

4/0 Gyarados, Salamence, and Dragonite are 2HKOed by Fire Blast given they've taken SR damage. I'd rather spam a STAB attack than rely on Miss Edge...

Fire Blast has 5% more accuracy than Stone Edge and lets them OHKO you instead of you OHKOing them.

 

[GMLW]

I don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but what about a Claw Sharpen set? Yes, Swords Dance seems better at first glance, but look again and you notice something. Hi Jump Kick? Do you really want to take that risk? What about Stone Edge? Not as big a risk as Hi Jump Kick, but you don't want to be KOed by Gyarados, Salamence or Dragonite. With Claw Sharpen, you don't get as much Attack, but you take away those big risks.

I have not done any calcs at +1 as opposed to +2, so I don't know if this would fail because you can't get the important KOs.

 

[Thorhammer]

I don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but what about a Claw Sharpen set? Yes, Swords Dance seems better at first glance, but look again and you notice something. Hi Jump Kick? Do you really want to take that risk? What about Stone Edge? Not as big a risk as Hi Jump Kick, but you don't want to be KOed by Gyarados, Salamence or Dragonite. With Claw Sharpen, you don't get as much Attack, but you take away those big risks.

I have not done any calcs at +1 as opposed to +2, so I don't know if this would fail because you can't get the important KOs.

It's been mentioned. The risk is worth the power increase.

 

[CocoaMax]

I like the idea of a mixed Cheer Up set, though I'm guessing this has been mentioned before. It might not be as immediately threatening as Swords dance, but it might allow it to get around certain counters that might give the SD set problems, most notably Slowbro or the Water/Ghost (I doubt the water/ghost guy could take a +2 Stone edge, though).

This is the set I came up with:
Blaziken @ life orb
Rash/Mild Nature
252 Sp. atk/ 252 speed/ 4 Hp
Cheer Up
Hi Jump Kick
Fire Blast/ Flamethrower
Hidden Power (Electric/Grass/Ice?)

Swords Dance will probably be better, but this can surprise some physically bulky pokemon that wouldn't expect a SE Hidden Power. It's s'posed to be like a sweeper version of Mixken.

 

[Santa_Clauz]

hmm... how about a mixed SD set, I know it's odd, but if you think about it, most of the things Blaziken will be hitting with Fire blast over HJK will be physically based, i.e. Skarm, any other steel wall, etc. and HJK packs enough punch to break through anything not resisting it. If you run that with Stone Edge, there's not much to stop you, and you already hit hard from both ends of the spectrum.

Oh, and will people stop insisting Blaziken has to use a boosting move. He works perfectly well with absolutely no boosting move, if people even bothered to READ THE FUCKING OP, we already have calcs for a mixken posted, which does a shitload of damage WITHOUT ANY BOOST. It can handle everything it needs too with 4 moves on a mixed set. However, I still maintain that it suffers 4 move slot syndrome. Yeah mixken is nice, but i wouldn't mind having a boosting move for late game, and protect would help against revengers, so yes, it does suffer 4 move slot syndrome.

Sweeper does not mean boosting. Things that are choiced can be sweepers, so no, a cheer up set is not better than mixken for sweeping, it just wastes a turn setting up for no significant KOs

 

[TheMrBassdude]

I don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but what about a Claw Sharpen set? Yes, Swords Dance seems better at first glance, but look again and you notice something. Hi Jump Kick? Do you really want to take that risk? What about Stone Edge? Not as big a risk as Hi Jump Kick, but you don't want to be KOed by Gyarados, Salamence or Dragonite. With Claw Sharpen, you don't get as much Attack, but you take away those big risks.

I have not done any calcs at +1 as opposed to +2, so I don't know if this would fail because you can't get the important KOs.

The calcs were done, and running SD with a Wide Lens does more damage than Life Orb and Claw Sharpen. You get the same + accuracy and more punch, without the health drops

 

[GMLW]

Okay, thanks for clearing that up for me. I had a feeling that it was a bad idea, but you can never be too sure.

 

[CocoaMax]

Oh, and will people stop insisting Blaziken has to use a boosting move. He works perfectly well with absolutely no boosting move, if people even bothered to READ THE FUCKING OP, we already have calcs for a mixken posted, which does a shitload of damage WITHOUT ANY BOOST. It can handle everything it needs too with 4 moves on a mixed set. However, I still maintain that it suffers 4 move slot syndrome. Yeah mixken is nice, but i wouldn't mind having a boosting move for late game, and protect would help against revengers, so yes, it does suffer 4 move slot syndrome.

Sweeper does not mean boosting. Things that are choiced can be sweepers, so no, a cheer up set is not better than mixken for sweeping, it just wastes a turn setting up for no significant KOs

Dag bro, I only put forward suggestions. It's not like I'm saying "OMG, BEST BEEZY SET EVAR LOLOLOL."
Anyway, I figure, since Mixken is more apt for wallbreaking than outright sweeping, it could use the extra power to aid it. But seeings how speed was its only problem before, and that little detail's taken care of itself, I guess you're right in saying it doesn't need the extra power. And yeah, without the fourth attack move SOMETHING'S going to end up walling it, probably either a dragon or slowbro. Swords Dance or just plain Life Orb Beezy wouldn't have that problem so I'll probably just run with that.

 

[Santa_Clauz]

Dag bro, I only put forward suggestions. It's not like I'm saying "OMG, BEST BEEZY SET EVAR LOLOLOL."
Anyway, I figure, since Mixken is more apt for wallbreaking than outright sweeping, it could use the extra power to aid it. But seeings how speed was its only problem before, and that little detail's taken care of itself, I guess you're right in saying it doesn't need the extra power. And yeah, without the fourth attack move SOMETHING'S going to end up walling it, probably either a dragon or slowbro. Swords Dance or just plain Life Orb Beezy wouldn't have that problem so I'll probably just run with that.

lol, nps, I'm just pissed because no one will even bother to read the OP, which would show them how much Blaziken does not need a boosting move to wreck teams and sweep late game. Not you specifically by any means

 

[Ouro]

lol, nps, I'm just pissed because no one will even bother to read the OP, which would show them how much Blaziken does not need a boosting move to wreck teams and sweep late game. Not you specifically by any means

The calculations shown on the OP are all after a Swords Dance boost.

 

[Santa_Clauz]

The calculations shown on the OP are all after a Swords Dance boost.

Wrong, if you read Lee's quote in the OP, they are for a mixken, which shows how easily it snaps walls in half, there's more than one set of calcs.

 

[gamer_reloaded]

Wow. Just finished reading the entire thread.

I'm very excited about combining the SD or sub with Baton Pass and a good teammate (Sazando being mentioned several times).

The prospect of having Blaziken wallbreak and set up his partner simultaneously is just way sexy. You set up twice for the price of one! Something like this (plz excuse me if this is in the OP, I don't remember seeing it)

Blaziken@Whatever
-SD/Substitute
-HJK
-Blaze Kick/Fire Blast/Stone Edge
-Baton Pass

It's been mentioned several times that Blazi rapes with just his STABs, especially once he SD's. Due to Speed Boost, merely staying in helps his fellow sweeper; and because he actually has immediate offensive power, unlike most any bp'er, clicking an attack helps too. I know I'm just stating the obvious but it's really cool to have the support and the power wrapped in one neat package; the fact that you don't have to choose between the two roles makes it so much scarier to think about. Long live the Cockfighter! :3

 

[IcyMan28]

While Baton Pass definitely has its merits on sweeping sets, I think that they provide enough support by breaking walls as it is, and should focus on such. Maybe a more dedicated Baton Pass set would be in order?

Blaziken@Wide Lens
Rash; 60 Atk / 252 SpA / 196 Spe

Fire Blast
Baton Pass
Hi Jump Kick
Cheer Up / Swords Dance / Substitute

The last slot takes care of the passing. Behind a Sub, Blaziken can gain an additional speed boost and do some damage, or even pass the sub off. Cheer Up is providing the recipient with +1 Atk/+1 SpA/+1 Speed, which could easily mean GG if given to a mixed sweeper. Swords Dance would be great to pass to physically inclined pokemon, especially those starved for move coverage.

Notably, Cheer Up passing could prove devastating when paired with something like Dragon Claw Arrogance MixMence. Firing off attacks from boosted stats, boosted speed, and the potential for even further attack abuse is scary.

 

[latenlazy]

hmm... how about a mixed SD set, I know it's odd, but if you think about it, most of the things Blaziken will be hitting with Fire blast over HJK will be physically based, i.e. Skarm, any other steel wall, etc. and HJK packs enough punch to break through anything not resisting it. If you run that with Stone Edge, there's not much to stop you, and you already hit hard from both ends of the spectrum.

Oh, and will people stop insisting Blaziken has to use a boosting move. He works perfectly well with absolutely no boosting move, if people even bothered to READ THE FUCKING OP, we already have calcs for a mixken posted, which does a shitload of damage WITHOUT ANY BOOST. It can handle everything it needs too with 4 moves on a mixed set. However, I still maintain that it suffers 4 move slot syndrome. Yeah mixken is nice, but i wouldn't mind having a boosting move for late game, and protect would help against revengers, so yes, it does suffer 4 move slot syndrome.

Sweeper does not mean boosting. Things that are choiced can be sweepers, so no, a cheer up set is not better than mixken for sweeping, it just wastes a turn setting up for no significant KOs

This is similar to the Nasty Plot Infernape set I'm running right now, but better. Give it +sp att full EVs, switch in on something that wants to switch out, and SD, giving you +2 att and +1 speed, and then proceed to tear apart everything they try to switch in as a counter.

 

[Santa_Clauz]

This is similar to the Nasty Plot Infernape set I'm running right now, but better. Give it +sp att full EVs, switch in on something that wants to switch out, and SD, giving you +2 att and +1 speed, and then proceed to tear apart everything they try to switch in as a counter.

A little off topic, but it it's an NPape with CC, drop it and your third move and run NP/Fire Blast/Focus Blast/Vacuum Wave. You do have to rely on miss blast, but the ability to both run Max speed and OHKO everything slower than you bar tentacruel is fun. Note, anything faster Vacuum wave not hit for Super effective damage is a hard counter though, so Jolt, Azelf, Gengar, Flygon, etc. you need to watch out for.

 

[Hidden Power]

Wow. Just finished reading the entire thread.

I'm very excited about combining the SD or sub with Baton Pass and a good teammate (Sazando being mentioned several times).

The prospect of having Blaziken wallbreak and set up his partner simultaneously is just way sexy. You set up twice for the price of one! Something like this (plz excuse me if this is in the OP, I don't remember seeing it)

Blaziken@Whatever
-SD/Substitute
-HJK
-Blaze Kick/Fire Blast/Stone Edge
-Baton Pass

It's been mentioned several times that Blazi rapes with just his STABs, especially once he SD's. Due to Speed Boost, merely staying in helps his fellow sweeper; and because he actually has immediate offensive power, unlike most any bp'er, clicking an attack helps too. I know I'm just stating the obvious but it's really cool to have the support and the power wrapped in one neat package; the fact that you don't have to choose between the two roles makes it so much scarier to think about. Long live the Cockfighter! :3

Can somebody explain to me how this works? Please?

If I remember correctly, Blaziken's Baton Pass is an Egg move.

And thus far, unless I've missed something, Speed Boost (a Dream World Ability) is incompatible with Baton Pass. If it's obtained in the Dream World it can't be bred for BP.

I'm confused right now.