I'm just saying it does happen, and I've seen it frequently enough that I'm caution about it.
Not anywhere nearly as common as it is now. I saw HP Fire on either maybe twice all of last gen, now it's on basically every set.
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np: OU Suspect Testing Round 4 - Blaze of Glory
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Not anywhere nearly as common as it is now. I saw HP Fire on either maybe twice all of last gen, now it's on basically every set.
HP fire is slashed into all but one of of Latios' Gen 4 sets.
Did you actually use Scizor during that time? HP Fire was always common.
Hitting Ferrothorn for super effective damage is almost never an issue. In my opinion, whining about Ferrothorn or wanting to ban it because you can't kill it is like whining about a Skarmory or a Scizor walling your team because you don't have super effective damage to take them out.
Also, counter weather can be used to take down rain, if that's the reason you can't take down Ferrothorn.
As someone mentioned earlier, setting up on it is USUALLY easy if it isn't a choice banded one (these things actually hit hard) and you can, if the person is stupid, get off 1-3 Swords Dance's on Garchomp or a Nasty Plot on Thundurus.
HP fire was EVERYWHERE 4th gen. I remember having it on almost, if not every one of the teams I made.
I don't see how hitting Ferrothorn Super-Effectively couldn't be an issue. Ferrothorn has a set of amazing resistances and neutral hits just don't cut it. I can't imagine how it wouldn't be an issue because it feels that most teams have to prepare for it more-so than other threats. Skarmory and Scizor are much easier to manage than Ferrothorn, because Skarmory usually runs one attack (Brave Bird) and Scizor is usually choice banded, essentially leaving it with that one attack. Magnezone can easily handle both of these. I've used a Magnezone to try and handle Ferro, but HP fire doesn't OHKO all the time. This becomes more problematic when it's on a rain team, as it can easily stall Magnezone out with a Leech Seed/Protect combo.
Having to run a weather inducer to take care of a wall seems a little ridiculous. I'll be honest and say that I haven't run Hail on pokemon of my own yet, but even then the pokemon using Hail has to be able to DO something to Ferrothorn or the spikes stack up pretty fast.
Setting up isn't as easy as you make it out to be. While rare, they can run Thunder Wave to stop sweeps before they even begin. I don't even think that Thundurus can DO much to Ferro unless it runs Hammer Arm or HP Fire (I'm not sure how much a boosted HP ice would do). Garchomp is an iffy. You're hurt by Gyro Ball ([I believe it's a 2HKO]limiting the time you can stay in if you run a Life Orb).
Thundurus can run focus blast which easily ohkos max hp max sp def Ferrothorn after a nasty plot.
252 +2 SpAtk Life Orb Timid Thundurus Focus Blast vs 252 HP/252 SpDef Sassy Ferrothorn: 122.16% - 143.75%
Volcorona still sets up in its face given that its best set is Chesto Rest.
Given that the EV spread for ChestoRest is Max HP/Def...
a-fuckin-gg
a-fuckin-gg
Yeah, that doesn't work unless the attack is called Stone Edge.
not to mention Flame Body neuters most physical attackers.
Also, setting up on Ferrothorn is pretty easy, especially if you force a switch to something you can take a hit from/outspeed.
I honestly don't see much that is ban worthy right now, especially since nothing stands out above all the rest and nothing is a staple.
Its perfectly possible to take down an Excadrill in the sand (which I would say is the largest threat right now, especially if you let it set up or are forced to let it set up) with some thought.
You don't see people (a large majority) wanting to ban Excadrill, they want to ban sand, which also isn't that big of a problem. Excadrill is easily walled by various things and if all else fails you could always whirlwind/roar it away and either clear the weather or set up for it in the future.
I honestly don't see much that is ban worthy right now, especially since nothing stands out above all the rest and nothing is a staple.
Its perfectly possible to take down an Excadrill in the sand (which I would say is the largest threat right now, especially if you let it set up or are forced to let it set up) with some thought.
You don't see people (a large majority) wanting to ban Excadrill, they want to ban sand, which also isn't that big of a problem. Excadrill is easily walled by various things and if all else fails you could always whirlwind/roar it away and either clear the weather or set up for it in the future.
I've read in Policy Review, that they were thinking of changing the voting requirements back down to 1400 to increase the voting pool. Is this going to happen? Because as of right now, with the 15+15 system, we'd only have 19 voters, which doesn't seem like that many
Let me introduce you to mixed LeadTar. And its friend Fire Blast.
wow
you guys are really pathetic if you cant handle a ferrothorn
sure theres sets to stop some of the checks
but honestly its obnoxiously easy to set up on
really its just a better foretress
i usually set up on it
or just kill it
fighting and fire moves are very common this gen
so its not hard to beat at all
you guys are really pathetic if you cant handle a ferrothorn
sure theres sets to stop some of the checks
but honestly its obnoxiously easy to set up on
really its just a better foretress
i usually set up on it
or just kill it
fighting and fire moves are very common this gen
so its not hard to beat at all
Well, Ferrothorn checks a LOT of things, hence the high usage. Isn't it a good thing for the metagame, keeping things OU instead of uber?
And as others said... if you get reckless with it you'll get set up upon and swept. A real team player, not a single man army like Salamence @ Outrage in 4th gen.
And as others said... if you get reckless with it you'll get set up upon and swept. A real team player, not a single man army like Salamence @ Outrage in 4th gen.
or Garchomp this gen
Garchomp isn't so bad this gen. Most don't run fire fang anymore or are scarfed and those aren't that hard to deal with. A lot of them opt for Dragon Claw over Outrage so it doesn't hit as hard either
Garchomp isn't a single man army. Bitch all you want about missing due to Sand Veil, but that is the nature of the game you are playing. Misses happen. Let's ban not flinching to Jirachi's Iron Head. After all, the odds are in my favour for it to happen, so if I have Jirachi out and you can't outspeed or KO it, you should be forced to forfeit.
Garchomp needs team support. It loses - badly - to Cloyster, or other mons with priority. SmashPass involves supporting it with something else, thus it is not a one-man army. Sure, it's a damn good mid-game sweeper, one of the best. But it's not banworthy, any more than Ferrothorn is banworthy for being one of the most versatile checks, or Haxorus for having the highest Attack stat, or Shuckle for having the highest defenses.
Garchomp needs team support. It loses - badly - to Cloyster, or other mons with priority. SmashPass involves supporting it with something else, thus it is not a one-man army. Sure, it's a damn good mid-game sweeper, one of the best. But it's not banworthy, any more than Ferrothorn is banworthy for being one of the most versatile checks, or Haxorus for having the highest Attack stat, or Shuckle for having the highest defenses.
Jirachi doesn't sweep a team with one flinch. Garchomp can with one miss. It's not the ability that's broken, it's the Pokemon. Also, Garchomp is very bulky, and lives most Priority attacks. (That don't miss) Substitute is a very common move for it, so priority usually wont hurt much anyway
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