/weak fails
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
Hidden Type
- Thread starter The Immortal
- Start date
No. The SR weakness is bad for something with no lefties and the fire weakness means Chansey now gets destroyed by Zard-Y. I don't really see a reason to use any type other than Ghost on Chansey since the only relevant Dark type attacks are Knock Off, which Chansey should never stay in on anyway, and Dark Pulse, which is usually only run by things which wall Chansey like Gengar and Mega Sableye.
Does sableye run dark pulse?
not that it matters since no dark pulse is strong enough to break chanse.
252+ SpA Porygon-Z Dark Pulse vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 152-180 (23.6 - 28%) -- 85.7% chance to 4HKO
is the strongest one you're gonna be able to hit chanse with.
edit: forgot item and adapt
252+ SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Dark Pulse vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 304-360 (47.3 - 56%) -- 79.3% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Porygon-Z Dark Pulse vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 265-312 (41.2 - 48.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
So, unless you're specs you can't hit chanse strong enough for it to matter(subplot is can't get past seismic toss and chanse won't stay in at +2 if it knows you're dark)
People sometimes run Dark Pulse on Mega Sableye's Calm Mind set over Shadow Ball to hit Normal types, but even if Sableye is running Shadow Ball, it can PP stall Chansey because Chansey can't hit it with Seismic Toss or Toxic. As for Porygon-Z, its best typing is Normal / Ghost to completely wall Chansey with the SubPlot set (and Tri Attack + Shadow Ball gets good coverage). Normal / Ghost Chansey can at least get in a PP stall war with Porygon-Z, any other Chansey besides Steel Chansey (idk if anyone uses that) will just get demolished by Tri Attack after enough boosts. The point I was trying to make with my post is that you shouldn't worry about giving Chansey a Dark weakness because anything which runs a dark attack probably already beats any other Chansey anyway. The utility of being completely immune to fighting attacks (most notably walling Keldeo instead of being OHKOed by it) outweighs the benefits you get from running any other type on Chansey.
swapping a fairy weakness for a ground weakness isn't doing it any favors tbh.
A ground weakness isn't as big of a deal here and you can usually tell which mons have earthquake.
that's what I was saying too.
Also the grass resist is actually quite nice in this meta.
EDIT: Also just had a thought. What is everyone's opinion on Rock Mega Amphy or Rock Starmie. They would be the first viable users of special rock STAB in Power Gem. Not sure how big a niche this is but its a niche none the less. I don't really have an opinion as of yet but Flying and Fire are reasonably common in this meta.
Last edited:
Power Gem has a low Base Power and most Flying types are also Steel types, so I don't think you are going to hit many Pokemon for SE damage. To hit Fire / Flying / Steel types, you are better off just using Thunderbolt which Mega Ampharos gets STAB on naturally and Starmie can add it as its hidden type, and Electric is much better defensively than Rock.
Yeah probably, I was just theorymonning as we've never really had a pokemon using special rock STAB and was wondering is it would be decent but yeah.
(GF give Diancie Power Gem! Carbink gets it!)
Trading a fairy weakness for ground weakness is better for the reason that... what else? What else do you really want to use on Sableye, with poison you can't get poisoned on the switch. You're neutral to fairy, resists grass, quad resists poison you basically full out counter Mega Venusaur
It's probably worth noting that if you wanted to run a weird set like that on Chansey, Flying would be the best added type for it, providing the same resistances as Bug (as well as an immunity to Ground) and weaknesses to, besides Rock, mostly special types like Electric and Ice.
Not Chansey, as you take 25% on the switch in. Poison is also not obscure on Sableye, I'd argue it would be standard but it's to early in Hidden typer ORAS for that, and I haven't seen it used.
So you don't switch in on SR. Bug would actually help when you eat a Fighting move and KO them with Counter. Just have a good Spinner/Defogger.
I looked at the current viability rankings, I see there are no mainly special walls. Chansey definitely deserves being up in the A Ranks. Does Lati@s deserve to be there? Possibly. There are many mixed walls that could be physical or special walls. Also, I think Aggron (Mega) deserves to be in high B or low A Ranks. The A rank is filled with Attackers, so I want to see some walls get up there too.
There are two pokemon in the viability rankings, not time enough for special walls. Stall really isn't great in this meta though
Counter is not viable on Chansey, don't stay in on physical attackers. Your argument can't be "just don't switch into SR" what else are you going to switch in? You usually wouldn't have two special walls
Last edited by a moderator:
Counter chansey is viable as a lure. The entire logic of it is to eat hits with Chansey's massive HP and retaliate by dealing a lot of damage, so ofc you have to stay in on Physical attacks. There's a reason why a Counter Chansey got to finals in a 1v1 tour (not HT but as an example of it being good). It may not be as viable as it is there, but Counter Chansey is still a decent option.
Bug Chansey is not, There is a lot of things I'd use before that.
What, you think Stall is 5 Physical walls and 1 Special wall?
Here's what I believe the logic is behind Bug Chansey:
"I want a Fighting neutrality at least while not being weak to Knock Off." The only other option for this would be Flying Chansey, which has weaknesses to Electric/Ice over Fire/Flying weaknesses (Psychic is still weak to knock off). Both are weak to Stealth Rock, which can be gotten around by team support. Who knows, Flying may very well be better due to the weaknesses, but at the same time things like Magnezone do exist which Chansey wants to wall. Besides, a Stealth Rock weakness does not stop you from walling, it just impedes it (Arcanine in UU as an example). Dark is also more common as STAB than you think (IE: Landorus-I, Conkeldurr, etc. We also have Bisharp existing), meaning that Ghost Chansey will, more likely than not, take way too much damage from some random Knock Off for it to safely handle.
I don't see you making any better suggestions yourself that satisfies the niche I've stated.
Fairy though, resists fighting and knock off. Bug doesn't even resist knock off lol. There are better typings for Chansey to use than bug, bug isn't a particularly good defensive typing.
Weak to Poison Jab, which Conkeldurr sometimes run, and Sludge Wave, which Landorus-I typically runs. It also suffers a Steel weakness, so Magnezone that carry Flash Cannon and STEEL DRAGONITE can deal with Chansey far more easily. Also fairy cannot be obtained
Fairy also resists dark, fighting and dragon three very good typings in this metagame. Poison jab isn't exactly the best set to use on Conkuldurr, and why would you even stay in with Conkuldurr? It carries Knock off 100% of the time. Magnezone does carry Flash cannon, which is what teammates are for. If Chansey is your dragonite check I suggest you go back to the drawing board. Landorus-I also carries Knock off, using fairy over bug means that you basically trade a special wall you now can't handle. If you use Bug you can't handle Charizard Y,
252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Sludge Wave vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 205-244 (29.1 - 34.6%) -- 8.9% chance to 3HKO
You're really going to keep going?
EDIT:
252 SpA Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 168-200 (23.8 - 28.4%) -- 95.5% chance to 4HKO
Get. Rekt.
There is no Hidden Power Fairy.
Also, I deleted a few posts because they were uncivil or off topic. From a neutral point of view, Jernmax, you don't seem all that knowledgeable or experienced in the art of competitive battling. You claimed to have reached number one on the ladder (in a post I deleted) but anyone could have been number one when the ladder was not populated. What are you ranked now is the real question. If you want to answer that, you can post on my profile instead of here.
Also, I deleted a few posts because they were uncivil or off topic. From a neutral point of view, Jernmax, you don't seem all that knowledgeable or experienced in the art of competitive battling. You claimed to have reached number one on the ladder (in a post I deleted) but anyone could have been number one when the ladder was not populated. What are you ranked now is the real question. If you want to answer that, you can post on my profile instead of here.
I'm currently ranked number two, with the account Alljokesaside. You can ask for proof of my number one peak or you can take my word for it an take a look at the ladder. What I was trying to get across is that bug type is not something you'd want to use, it's something that you'd post on "Don't use this that, use this instead" It has it's niches, as resisting fighting(But you can run poison there as well, since it's not weak to Fighting and is immune to toxic) but all types has it's niches, it goes that way with all pokemon on the ladder, there are very few typings who are purely negative.
I think my score was like 53-15
- Flying - Chansey is now immune to ground and resist fighting, sure it's alright but it also gaines stealth rock weakness so It's totally a possibility, but I wouldn't recommend it to anyone because of the SR weakness, Landorus-I will for example "HKO Chansey if it was at 75%. It is immune to spikes though
- Water - Chansey doesn't really gain anything from water type, though water type in general isn't a bad defensive typing. Grass and electric are both mainly special attacking typings. A fire resist is also nifty in this metagame. It loses to Manaphy now
- Grass - Grass is okay, I guess. It's immune to spore and leech seed, which is nice. But it gains a ton of weaknesses, not that they really matter since Chansey is super bulky, but stacking the damage with all those weaknesses isn't particularly helpful
- Fire - Wow, don't use this. Stealth rock weakness, neutral to spikes. Fire is a great offensive typing, not as good of a defensive typing. It loses to Manaphy now
- Dark - It now resist knock off, which shouldn't be an argument as you should never stay in on a knock off regardless. It's now 4x weak to fighting as well.
- Dragon - Why though? It doesn't gain anything from this, except a couple of mainly special based resistances. It's also weak to dragon, Dragonite, and fairy, Altaria.
- Steel - Steel is good as a defensive typing on everything. It now has a boatload of resistances and a stealth rock weakness. However... It's now weak to Fighting... Fire... Ground! But yes, Steel is a viable option
- Psychic - Now weak to knock off, but that's not an argument. Psychic is meh... It doesn't gain anything and it doesn't lose anything in particular, it's neutral to fighting.
- Ground - Eh, same thing with many of these typings. It resists Stealth, yeah, but thats basically where the list ends
- Poison - again, I mentioned this. It resists fighting without being weak to SR and having a handful of resistances plus it's immune to toxic, which is neat.
- Ghost - Here you have it the best typing for this pokemon. It's immune to fighting and resists stealth rock, while at the same time being immune to ghost leaving it with one weakness, dark.
I think my score was like 53-15
Attachments
Last edited: