(Little) Things that annoy you in Pokémon

[earl]

Might be an unpopular opinion, but I think why Pokemon fails to advance gameplay at a rate of most other videogames is because it relies far too much on the Pokemon themselves. If we remove the Pokemon, what exactly does the game have going for it? Story? Pokemon's story has always taken a back seat, and SwSh has done nothing to change it. Battles? Battles are held back in-game by the lack of intelligence in the AI, and no difficulty settings does nothing to address it. Multiplayer is the only way to get a full feel of complex battles. Characters ( Human Characters ) ? With the exception of BW and SM, characters don't get enough time to be fleshed out, with SwSh's Marnie and Bede having development off screen. And don't get me started on programming, Models, and Animations, which are reused from XY for more than half a decade, with only minor adjustments to the splash effects.

I agree that Pokemon doesn't really have anything going for it beyond the Pokemon themselves, but I don't think a hypothetical no new Pokemon generation will really fix any of the other flaws of the series. It would just be a Sun&Moon quality game, with a new setting and hopefully better graphics.
Difficulty: The philosophy these games have had since virtually the beginning of time has been "make the games hard if you want to", leaving the baseline difficulty pretty trivial, with any spikes being easily fixed by grinding and/or simply bringing the correct type advantage. And they have to be brute force beatable by the starters lol. So I don't think more development time will suddenly change this deeply ingrained philosophy.
Story: This is a more solid idea of what could be improved, and I guess more time would hopefully lead to be a more fleshed-out story (given I don't think they'll ever go any deeper on a story beyond "friendship triumphs and damn why is the 10 yr old such a good trainer").
Animations: Yeah these would be better, altho it's a non-factor in terms of actual gameplay and it's really only a sore point because of Dexit. Given I don't think the models themselves are bad in the slightest, in fact they're so high-poly it's borderline detrimental.

I really think more development time for a more polished product is the most we can reasonably wish for, because I really can't see Pokemon (already hugely successful) suddenly becoming a super nuanced fantasy epic RPG, it's just not the identity it has established over the years and there's also no incentive for them to alter this identity.

 

[Volt-Ikazuchi]

My problem is not Dexit though. The reasons GF gave for Dexit have been proven to be false or questionable at worst.

I know, I was agreeing with you.

Difficulty: The philosophy these games have had since virtually the beginning of time has been "make the games hard if you want to",

And then they remove the option of turning off the Exp Share. Oops.

Yeah, nah, gimme actual difficulty options like in BW2 please. Especially because then they can actually use the good AI they have for Gym Leaders and other major trainers.

Animations: Yeah these would be better, altho it's a non-factor in terms of actual gameplay and it's really only a sore point because of Dexit. Given I don't think the models themselves are bad in the slightest, in fact they're so high-poly it's borderline detrimental.

The models themselves are high-quality, excellent even, and GF actually has high-quality animations available in SnS.

They just have the problem of not using them correctly for the most part.

Some examples: Double Kick's infamous hop animation could be solved by literally just calling a standard attack animation, which they already use for most other moves. Some of which fit perfectly.

They could do PBR-styled run animations before contact moves. Why is that? They also have run animations for every single mon in the game.

If I recall, all mons also have an animation for sleeping besides just closing their eyes.

These are all things that could just easily be patched in the game because the assets, which are arguably the most expensive and troublesome part of the work, are already done.

If I start asking for stuff that isn't in the game, like better idle and damage animations, better camera work, actual draw distance and non-N64 textures for the Wild Area, I'll have to make a thread for it.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

We couldn't live with our past discussions. Where did that bring us? Back to Dexit.

Between our returns to the topic, it cutting a little over half the Pokemon, and its frequent description as "inevitable", this thing could hardly be more similar to Thanos.

My thoughts on Dexit have evolved since its reveal. At first I was outraged just like everyone else, but soon it developed into somewhat of an indifference. While I recognized it was undoubtedly shitty for people who like to replay Pokemon games with zany teams, and wasn't of much actual benefit for people who didn't care about transferring, I was at least happy that it would have a big impact on what I enjoy most: watching a brand-new OU develop. I viewed it as a chance to explore (or rather watch other people explore) a post-apocalyptic world. Tragic in its conception, but nonetheless exciting. However, as it became known that Dexit would be backpedaled in updates, and as the OU discussion threads filled with complaints of a meta that centralized unreasonably hard and early, the silver lining I clung to began to slip away. In particular, adding Pokemon back through updates rubs me in a lot of weird ways. While I don't find it as scummy as some people do, as you don't need to buy the DLC to transfer up the returning Pokemon, it still feels a bit disingenuous to use the partial reversion of a controversial decision to build hype. Also, while shaking up the meta with a big influx of Pokemon certainly seems exciting, it's partly counteracted by it disincentivizing people from trying to develop the current metagame. While this apathy isn't prominent, the idea that whatever work done in this meta will become obsolete seems to lurk in the back of some OU posters. I rely on these people to drive the "story" of OU, the "story" that I follow in real time like a soap opera because I find it so incredibly entertaining. In this "story", long-term "character arcs" like Kartana's rise from low-ladder meme to top-tier menace, or the struggle between Protean and Battle Bond as the preferred form of Greninja, aren't as effective when the meta is periodically getting turned on its head.

Additionally, while I previously held this belief, I no longer think Dexit was inevitable. Maybe it would necessitate fewer new Pokemon each gen (they're already doing that). Maybe it would necessitate cutting back on flashy new stuff and instead refining what already exists. Maybe it would necessitate a return to sprites (reminder that Octopath Traveler is absolutely gorgeous). Maybe it would necessitate the second coming of Satoru Iwata to bail Game Freak out with compression wizardry. But there is no reason Dexit would ever need to happen.

One more thing. Because one of Masuda's excuses for Dexit was improved models and animations, I've seen many people say that Pokemon should improve its graphics. Yes, Masuda's excuse seems like bullshit (at least in the areas people were expecting). Yes, that tree is pretty ugly. Yes, this is coming from the guy who made like three or four posts about how move animations could be improved.

HOWEVER.

It's important make a distinction between graphics and aesthetics. To bring back the example of Octopath Traveler, that's a game that doesn't have great graphics. Its lighting system is pretty impressive, but the models and textures are incredibly basic. And yet, the game has some of the best aesthetics I've ever seen. Graphics is all about detail and fidelity, but detail and fidelity do not a good-looking game make. It's a pet peeve of mine, and I know most people really mean aesthetics when they refer to graphics, but I still think it's important to recognize the difference. If a developer interprets fans' cries for improved graphics literally, they run the risk of pumping time and money into creating something that is detailed yet ugly. I don't Pokemon as a whole is ugly in its current state, and it would take some serious fucking up to become ugly, but Game Freak has been shown to be incredibly poor at interpreting fan feedback.

 

[Pikadavid14]

So I've finally gotten around to transferring a whole bunch of Pokemon from every generation except for Generation 2 into Pokemon Home, and I've realized something that is probably not very important to most people but is very annoying to me. Why doesn't Pokemon Home tell you what game the Pokemon was originally from and what day you got the Pokemon on?

I know it tells you the region your Pokemon came from and the trainer name and ID of those Pokemon so you can narrow down which game they were from from there, but it honestly isn't enough for me. To be fair, I don't think Pokemon Bank told you when and in which game your Pokemon were caught on either and I don't think the date was displayed if a Pokemon was transferred to a future generation.

I've been playing Pokemon for over 12 years at this point and I am interested in knowing when I caught all 3,000 of the Pokemon that are currently in Pokemon Home.

 

[Volt-Ikazuchi]

We couldn't live with our past discussions. Where did that bring us? Back to Dexit.

To be fair, it is something that annoys me and I'm new to the thread lmao.

Since I mentioned idle animations, let me elaborate.

A lot of idle animations (Machoke immediately springs to mind) just don't have mons in any kind of battle stance. They just stand there.

 

[Pikachu315111]

At the end of the day I'm looking for my AI partners to attack barriers and/or survive, if they can do that I'm usually okay with them.

Not wanting to leave an idea half finished decided to challenge myself in coming up with Raid Partners

I restricted myself to the following rules:
1. One for each Type & had to be mono-type.
2. Keeping with the thought of not wanting to spoil an unannounced Pokemon, I only used Pokemon from older gens.
3. I kept within the Pokemon's Level-up moveset & only moves up to Level 60 (as that's the max level of Wild Pokemon in the Wild Area).

Type/Trainer Class: Pokemon (Ability. Item. Move, Move, Move, Move)
Normal/Cook: Snorlax (Thick Fat. Muscle Band. Body Slam, High Horsepower, Crunch, Hammer Arm)
Fighting/Black Belt: Grapploct (Limber. Binding Band. Superpower, Bind, Octolock, Topsy-Turvy)
* Programmed to try to Octolock when the shield is down. After that then tries to Bind. Will use Topsy-Turvy if Raid Pokemon has increased its stats.
Flying/Cabbie: Noctowl (Insomnia. Wise Glasses. Air Slash, Extrasensory, Moonblast, Roost)
Poison/Artist: Garbodor (Weak Armor. Black Sludge. Gunk Shot, Body Slam, Metal Claw, Clear Smog)
* Clear Smog if Raid Pokemon has increased its stats.
Ground/Hiker: Mudsdale (Stamina. Assault Vest. High Horsepower, Double Kick, Strength, Mud-Slap)
* Tries to Mud-Slap when shield is down.
Rock/Dancer: Sudowoodo (Rock Head. Zoom Lens. Head Smash, Wood Hammer, Hammer Arm, Sucker Punch)
Bug/Postman: Accelgor (Hydration. Expert Belt. Bug Buzz, Giga Drain, Acid Spray, Water Shuriken)
Ghost/Gentleman: Dusclops (Pressure. Eviolite. Shadow Punch, Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch)
Steel/Rail Staff: Klinklang (Plus. Blunder Policy. Gear Grind, Zap Cannon, Bind, Magnetic Flux)
* Magnetic Flux only when shield is down. After that tries inflicting a Bind.
Fire/Police Officer: Arcanine (Flash Fire. Luminous Moss. Flare Blitz, Extreme Speed, Crunch, Play Rough)
Water/Fisher: Octillery (Sniper. Scope Lens. Bubble Beam, Ice Beam, Rock Blast, Focus Energy)
* Focus Energy when shield is down.
Grass/Beauty: Cherrim (Flower Gift. Heat Rock. Sunny Day, Solar Beam, Morning Sun, Worry Seed)
* Sets up a Sunny Day whenever Sun isn't out. Tries to Worry Seed when shield is down.
Electric/Poke Kid (M): Raichu (Static. Air Balloon. Thunderbolt, Quick Attack, Light Screen, Double Team)
* Sets up Light Screen whenever one isn't up. Afterwards Double Teams when shield is down.
Psychic/Reporter: Reuniclus (Magic Guard. Leftovers. Psychic, Hammer Arm, Light Screen, Reflect)
* Sets up Reflect whenever one isn't up. Then does so with Light Screen. Only uses Hammer Arm if Raid Pokemon is immune to Psychic.
Ice/Musician: Glalie (Inner Focus. Never-Melt Ice. Freeze-Dry, Frost Breath, Ice Shard, Crunch)
Dragon/Worker: Haxorus (Mold Breaker. Snowball. Outrage, Slash, Crunch, Assurance)
Dark/Model: Liepard (Unburden. Focus Sash. Night Slash, Play Rough, Sucker Punch, Sand Attack)
* Sand Attack when shield is down.
Fairy/Doctor: Aromatisse (Healer. Big Root. Draining Kiss, Psychic, Heal Pulse, Aromatherapy)
* When shield is down focuses on healing & curing allies.

Also for main game I imagine they'd be using the basic stage/pre-evolution of their Pokemon. Post game is when they'll evolve their Pokemon to give you better partners for the 5 star Raids.

Something that really bothered me is that they never bothered to make the Lake Guardians Fairy type when the type was introduced. Its quite obvious that they are based on pixies and fairies, with Uxie and Azelf having references to the pixies and gnomes, both of which are connected to the fey.

There are several Pokemon we thought should get the Fairy-typing. Several of the Mew Expies like Celebi, Jirachi & Victini (replacing Psychic). Other Mythicals/Legendaries like Manphy (& Phione), Meloetta (replace Normal), Cresselia, the Lake Guardians as you said. There's a batch of Pokemon in the Fairy Egg Group who didn't like Chansey family, Audino (though got a Mega which did), Skitty family, Snorunt & Glalie, Cherubi family. Then there are a batch of others like Misdreavus family, Chimecho family, Jynx (repace Psychic), Gothita family, Volbeat & Illumise, Kricketot family, & Vespiquen (replace Flying, also replace Pressure with Levitate).

... The heck? Falinks is in the Fairy Egg Group?

This is going to sound dumb, but if dexit was "inevitable" they should've just stopped making new mons.

Plus if you put a gun to my head and said "dexit or no more new pokemon", I'd choose new pokemon in a heartbeat.

What they need to do is stretch out the gens for longer so they don't need to make new mons all the time and make the problem worse.

Honestly, I'm on the no more new Pokemon bandwagon. Pokemon has almost 900 creatures at this point, and pretty every much has a cult following.

In addition to what Volt-Ikazuchi said (yes, please, let's go back to not getting a new gen for 5-6 years), there is also something else that needs to be done (well, a few actually): completely overhauling the current team building & battle UI. To just list a few thoughts:

1. Let us carry extra Pokemon in addition to our party of 6. Letting us access our PC is a nice start, however with us fast approaching 1k monsters just settling on 6 we'd want in our core party is starting to feel REALLY limited. At this point maybe having 6 "active" Pokemon and 6 "benched" Pokemon (while not active they still get experience from battles and can actively swap them with a Pokemon in your active party at any time) isn't such a crazy idea.
2. Let our Pokemon have more Moves. Number of Pokemon isn't the only thing that's increasing, number of Moves have also increased but a Pokemon can still only ever use 4. Now this one is a bit more complicated as I don't think they should give more move slots but rather expand what a move slot can do (like letting us stack moves which either are the same Type or are similar to one another). On top of that I think they could have five "extra" 1 PP slots which we can be any Moves that Pokemon can learn to give us more flexibility.
3. Let our Pokemon hold more Items. Another example of content bloat, but a bit more severe as there are just some items considered better than another. However if you let our Pokemon hold 3 items, one being active and 2 being inactive but on your turn can choose to switch the active item, I think would allow those items which don't see much use to have maybe a better chance of being used for the scenario where they're useful.
4. Easier Ability switching & let Pokemon learn more Abilities. Finally, while not as bad as Pokemon, Moves, or Items, there is now a number of Abilities but the restriction of 2 normal + 1 hidden per Pokemon feels outdated. Toss the Ability Capsule and just let us switch a Pokemon's Ability by seeing an Ability Tutor and let them able to teach your Pokemon the Abilities which makes sense for that Pokemon to learn. You can even keep the Hidden Ability concept if you do it carefully.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

Fighting/Black Belt: Grapploct (Limber. Binding Band. Superpower, Bind, Octolock, Topsy-Turvy)
* Programmed to try to Octolock when the shield is down. After that then tries to Bind. After that will use Superpower, followed by Topsy-Turvy, and Superpower two more times before repeating the cycle (basically if Grapploct's stats are at -1 is programmed to Topsy-Turvy).

Topsy-Turvy isn't self-targeting.

 

[Nuclearstomp]

Not wanting to leave an idea half finished decided to challenge myself in coming up with Raid Partners

I restricted myself to the following rules:
1. One for each Type & had to be mono-type.
2. Keeping with the thought of not wanting to spoil an unannounced Pokemon, I only used Pokemon from older gens.
3. I kept within the Pokemon's Level-up moveset & only moves up to Level 60 (as that's the max level of Wild Pokemon in the Wild Area).

Type/Trainer Class: Pokemon (Ability. Item. Move, Move, Move, Move)
Normal/Cook: Snorlax (Thick Fat. Muscle Band. Body Slam, High Horsepower, Crunch, Hammer Arm)
Fighting/Black Belt: Grapploct (Limber. Binding Band. Superpower, Bind, Octolock, Topsy-Turvy)
* Programmed to try to Octolock when the shield is down. After that then tries to Bind. After that will use Superpower, followed by Topsy-Turvy, and Superpower two more times before repeating the cycle (basically if Grapploct's stats are at -1 is programmed to Topsy-Turvy).
Flying/Cabbie: Noctowl (Insomnia. Wise Glasses. Air Slash, Extrasensory, Moonblast, Roost)
Poison/Artist: Garbodor (Weak Armor. Black Sludge. Gunk Shot, Body Slam, Metal Claw, Clear Smog)
* Clear Smog if Raid Pokemon has increased its stats.
Ground/Hiker: Mudsdale (Stamina. Assault Vest. High Horsepower, Double Kick, Strength, Mud-Slap)
* Tries to Mud-Slap when shield is down.
Rock/Dancer: Sudowoodo (Rock Head. Zoom Lens. Head Smash, Wood Hammer, Hammer Arm, Sucker Punch)
Bug/Postman: Accelgor (Hydration. Expert Belt. Bug Buzz, Giga Drain, Acid Spray, Water Shuriken)
Ghost/Gentleman: Dusclops (Pressure. Eviolite. Shadow Punch, Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch)
Steel/Rail Staff: Klinklang (Plus. Blunder Policy. Gear Grind, Zap Cannon, Bind, Magnetic Flux)
* Magnetic Flux only when shield is down. After that tries inflicting a Bind.
Fire/Police Officer: Arcanine (Flash Fire. Luminous Moss. Flare Blitz, Extreme Speed, Crunch, Play Rough)
Water/Fisher: Octillery (Sniper. Scope Lens. Bubble Beam, Ice Beam, Rock Blast, Focus Energy)
* Focus Energy when shield is down.
Grass/Beauty: Cherrim (Flower Gift. Heat Rock. Sunny Day, Solar Beam, Morning Sun, Worry Seed)
* Sets up a Sunny Day whenever Sun isn't out. Tries to Worry Seed when shield is down.
Electric/Poke Kid (M): Raichu (Static. Air Balloon. Thunderbolt, Quick Attack, Light Screen, Double Team)
* Sets up Light Screen whenever one isn't up. Afterwards Double Teams when shield is down.
Psychic/Reporter: Reuniclus (Magic Guard. Leftovers. Psychic, Hammer Arm, Light Screen, Reflect)
* Sets up Reflect whenever one isn't up. Then does so with Light Screen. Only uses Hammer Arm if Raid Pokemon is immune to Psychic.
Ice/Musician: Glalie (Inner Focus. Never-Melt Ice. Freeze-Dry, Frost Breath, Ice Shard, Crunch)
Dragon/Worker: Haxorus (Mold Breaker. Snowball. Outrage, Slash, Crunch, Assurance)
Dark/Model: Liepard (Unburden. Focus Sash. Night Slash, Play Rough, Sucker Punch, Sand Attack)
* Sand Attack when shield is down.
Fairy/Doctor: Aromatisse (Healer. Big Root. Draining Kiss, Psychic, Heal Pulse, Aromatherapy)
* When shield is down focuses on healing & curing allies.

Also for main game I imagine they'd be using the basic stage/pre-evolution of their Pokemon. Post game is when they'll evolve their Pokemon to give you better partners for the 5 star Raids.

There are several Pokemon we thought should get the Fairy-typing. Several of the Mew Expies like Celebi, Jirachi & Victini (replacing Psychic). Other Mythicals/Legendaries like Manphy (& Phione), Meloetta (replace Normal), Cresselia, the Lake Guardians as you said. There's a batch of Pokemon in the Fairy Egg Group who didn't like Chansey family, Audino (though got a Mega which did), Skitty family, Snorunt & Glalie, Cherubi family. Then there are a batch of others like Misdreavus family, Chimecho family, Jynx (repace Psychic), Gothita family, Volbeat & Illumise, Kricketot family, & Vespiquen (replace Flying, also replace Pressure with Levitate).

... The heck? Falinks is in the Fairy Egg Group?






In addition to what Volt-Ikazuchi said (yes, please, let's go back to not getting a new gen for 5-6 years), there is also something else that needs to be done (well, a few actually): completely overhauling the current team building & battle UI. To just list a few thoughts:

1. Let us carry extra Pokemon in addition to our party of 6. Letting us access our PC is a nice start, however with us fast approaching 1k monsters just settling on 6 we'd want in our core party is starting to feel REALLY limited. At this point maybe having 6 "active" Pokemon and 6 "benched" Pokemon (while not active they still get experience from battles and can actively swap them with a Pokemon in your active party at any time) isn't such a crazy idea.
2. Let our Pokemon have more Moves. Number of Pokemon isn't the only thing that's increasing, number of Moves have also increased but a Pokemon can still only ever use 4. Now this one is a bit more complicated as I don't think they should give more move slots but rather expand what a move slot can do (like letting us stack moves which either are the same Type or are similar to one another). On top of that I think they could have five "extra" 1 PP slots which we can be any Moves that Pokemon can learn to give us more flexibility.
3. Let our Pokemon hold more Items. Another example of content bloat, but a bit more severe as there are just some items considered better than another. However if you let our Pokemon hold 3 items, one being active and 2 being inactive but on your turn can choose to switch the active item, I think would allow those items which don't see much use to have maybe a better chance of being used for the scenario where they're useful.
4. Easier Ability switching & let Pokemon learn more Abilities. Finally, while not as bad as Pokemon, Moves, or Items, there is now a number of Abilities but the restriction of 2 normal + 1 hidden per Pokemon feels outdated. Toss the Ability Capsule and just let us switch a Pokemon's Ability by seeing an Ability Tutor and let them able to teach your Pokemon the Abilities which makes sense for that Pokemon to learn. You can even keep the Hidden Ability concept if you do it carefully.

I'm going to go over each of these and explain why some of these aren't the best ideas.

1. Gaining exp for "benched" mons itself is not a bad idea, but this idea is invalidated by something you already mentioned: the PC. You can swap pokemon whenever so there's no real reason to have even more pokemon in the party. However, being able to get some EXP for weaker pokemon in the PC (say, level 1 pokemon that hatch from eggs, or pokemon like magikarp) would be nice.

2. Pokemon have only 4 moves for a reason. The balance of the game would absolutely be destroyed if more than 4 moves were present without some kind of limitation. (Z-moves in a way are like an extra move, but 1 time only.) Pokemon could run coverage up the wazoo, run even more setup moves on a single pokemon, ect. This also only benefits pokemon that already have good movepools and coverage, pokemon with bad movepools or not a lot of options like Jolteon will still be stuck with bad movesets.

3. It's not that tedious to just take a mons item and then give them a new one from the bag. However, if you're proposing to have multiple items in battle, that's just a wild idea. Could you imagine stuff like running both choice scarf and choice band on the same pokemon? Of course I'm sure you meant the former and not the latter though.

4. This is one I agree with. Easier ability switching would be nice, but maybe make it late / postgame as some mons abilities are really OP for base game. Also, I would love for mons to have at least 1 more ability. There are some mons who ONLY have trash abilities despite having 3 of them. I think expanding some pokemon to have up to 4 abilities would be OK, provided you don't give pokemon who already have good abilities more of them.

 

[Volt-Ikazuchi]

There are several Pokemon we thought should get the Fairy-typing. Several of the Mew Expies like Celebi, Jirachi & Victini (replacing Psychic).

Mew itself should be a Fairy-type imo. It's weird how inconsistent the Fairy-type is thematically when it comes to Legendaries.

Also, how is Galarian Ponyta not a Fairy!?

Oddly, I pretty much disagree with every suggestion you made besides the "bench", but since you mentioned Hidden Abilities...

Can we *please* get a Hidden Ability Capsule? It's annoying enough as is to get Hidden Abilities, especially because they change the method pretty much every game.

I vividly remember having to body 30 Alolan Vulpix in USUM for one. And that's one of the easiest ones because Snow Warning triggers when it shows up.

I honestly wouldn't mind it having a lower chance of showing up in regular encounters either. Maybe 10 or 20% so it keeps the "Hidden" concept. But I really want a Hidden Ability Capsule.

Especially because there are a lot of mons that went entire gens without getting them released. (Shoutouts to Contrary Serperior's memetic status in Gen 5.)

 

[Yung Dramps]

Here's a better idea: Ditch HAs entirely, just make them regular 3rd abilities

 

[DrPumpkinz]

3. It's not that tedious to just take a mons item and then give them a new one from the bag. However, if you're proposing to have multiple items in battle, that's just a wild idea. Could you imagine stuff like running both choice scarf and choice band on the same pokemon? Of course I'm sure you meant the former and not the latter though.

It sounded like each Pokemon could hold multiple items at once (three to be exact) BUT only one of them is active at a given point, and you can switch which one is active on the fly during battle. If it works kinda like Rotation Battle "switching" apparently works where you can swap your item and attack on the same turn, I could see it being kinda cool. Like you could have Leftovers most of them time, but switch to a resist berry if you predict an incoming super effective attack, or switch to Sitrus Berry for a quick heal before swapping back to Leftovers. It would likely demolish the item balance as we know it, and choice items would be really weird, but I could see it being a cool OM.

 

[Pikachu315111]

Topsy-Turvy isn't self-targeting.

Of course it isn't, why should it be, that would only make sense.

Eh, Topsy-Turvy could still be useful to flip any stat increases the Raid Pokemon gave to itself.

1. Gaining exp for "benched" mons itself is not a bad idea, but this idea is invalidated by something you already mentioned: the PC. You can swap pokemon whenever so there's no real reason to have even more pokemon in the party. However, being able to get some EXP for weaker pokemon in the PC (say, level 1 pokemon that hatch from eggs, or pokemon like magikarp) would be nice.

2. Pokemon have only 4 moves for a reason. The balance of the game would absolutely be destroyed if more than 4 moves were present without some kind of limitation. (Z-moves in a way are like an extra move, but 1 time only.) Pokemon could run coverage up the wazoo, run even more setup moves on a single pokemon, ect. This also only benefits pokemon that already have good movepools and coverage, pokemon with bad movepools or not a lot of options like Jolteon will still be stuck with bad movesets.

3. It's not that tedious to just take a mons item and then give them a new one from the bag. However, if you're proposing to have multiple items in battle, that's just a wild idea. Could you imagine stuff like running both choice scarf and choice band on the same pokemon? Of course I'm sure you meant the former and not the latter though.

1. Maybe have a special box in the PC where Pokemon gain experience from the number of battles done? Also played with the thought of somehow making Levels transferable between Pokemon, like maybe it's not the Pokemon which retains the Level but the Party Slot?

2. The ideas I have I don't think are that broken:

Hide

Idea 1. Move Stacking: (two ways the four move slots can be expanded upon without adding any more move slots)
A. Hierarchy Stacking: Non-Status Moves of the same Type can be stacked on top of each other going from most PP to least.
(Example: Ember (25 PP) > Flame Charge (20 PP) > Flamethrower (15 PP) > Heat Wave (10 PP) > Fire Blast (5 PP))
B. Parallel Stacking: Moves that have a similar effect to one another as long as they have same amount of PP.
(Example: You can Parallel Stack two Slash variations onto one move slots instead needing two separate move slots)
C. Other Notes:
C1. Hierarchy Stack & Parallel Stack CANNOT be mixed.
C2. PP usage is shared. Hierarchy Stacking is relational rounded up (EXAMPLE: 2 Ember=1 Flamethrower; 5 Ember=2 Flamethrower=1 Heat Wave). If one move runs out of PP the entire Stack is no longer usable.
C3. When a PP Up or PP Max is used on a Stack all Moves in the Stacks have their PP increased. If a Move is added/replaced in a Stack that move will have the PP increase added.

Idea 2. Sleeve Slots:
In addition to the four main move slots, there are five additional slots (called "Sleeve Slots", after the phrase "ace up the sleeve") that can hold any move the Pokemon can learn but can only be used once. Can switch out what move the Sleeve Slot has at anytime, but if Sleeve Slot has been used it won't recharge it. Sleeve Slot are recharge when you heal at the Pokemon Center (or something equivalent), a Leppa Berry is used on the Sleeve Slots, or an Ether/Elixir is used.
NOTE: I got the idea from Dungeon & Dragons. In D&D, Spellcasters only have a number of spells they can cast per in-game day. I thought doing something similar for Pokemon would be a neat way to give Pokemon more access to moves they'd like to have one or two uses of but didn't want to dedicate a whole moveslot to.

However I can understand if my idea is too extreme, so how about backing up and maybe just having 2 additional moves? Or let us have say maybe 8 BUT we can only use four, after selecting the 4th move the other four moves get locked?

3. No, I meant the latter. Here's how I wrote it in my personal notes:

Hide

Pokemon can hold multiple items (maybe up to three?), however only one can be active at a time (though there are exceptions). At the start of each turn can switch to another item before choosing a move or item from the bag.

NOTES:

• If the Pokemon consumes/loses an item it'll act as if it had no item for that turn (Acrobatics will get its Power boost, Unburden doubles Speed), however next turn you'll need to select which of its remaining items will now be its active item (Acrobatics & Unburden losing its Power & Speed boost unless that item is also consumed/lost during that turn). Acrobatics & Unburden will only keep its Power & Speed boost if all held items are consumed/lost.
• Items which lock its holder into a move (such as Choice items) will have that affect be active even if switched to another item.
• If a Pokemon steals a held item:
  • It's the active item that's stolen.
  • Stolen item goes into the next open item slot.
• Knock Off only removes the active item.
• Symbiosis will let the player choose which of its held item to give to its ally.
• Trick swaps active items.
• Switcheroo mix up all held items and distributes them randomly.
• Fling & Bestow uses active item.
• The effects of EV-enhancing items, Lucky Egg's experience boost, Amulet Coin's money boost, and Smoke Ball's wild battle escaping are always active even if they aren't the active item.
• Can only have one Plate, Memory, and Drive. Even if not the active item Arceus' Type, Silvally's Type, and Techno Buster's Type will be the one corresponding to the Plate, Memory, and Drive (however any additional effects such as Plate's Type boost will not be active).
• Affects of Weather Rocks & Terrain Extender will only be applied if they were the active item when the weather or terrain was summoned.
• Affects of Binding Band, Grip Claw, & Light Clay will only be applied if they were the active item when their move was used.
• Mental Herb's & White Herb's affect will activate when made active if the Pokemon has a status ailment that Mental Herb cures or decreased stats for White Herb to remove.
• Terrain Seeds will activate if made the active item while the Terrain is active.
• If Metronome is switched from being active item and holder uses a different move it loses the power boost, but if holder keeps using the same move and switches back to Metronome it'll keep and continue the power boost it had (while Metronome isn't the active item it won't get the power boost).
• Berries with condition requirements will activate if made the active item if their condition requirement had been met.

 

[earl]

Any more than 4 moves really, really hurts defensive play. Things with 4MSS can suddenly run the moves they need to lure their checks with, and boom, only Hyper Offense

 

[Volt-Ikazuchi]

Here's a better idea: Ditch HAs entirely, just make them regular 3rd abilities

I honestly kinda agree, it's an annoying artifact. Not on the same tier as Exp. Groups. However, I can see people legit liking the idea of a Hidden, more rare Ability.

It sounded like each Pokemon could hold multiple items at once (three to be exact) BUT only one of them is active at a given point, and you can switch which one is active on the fly during battle. If it works kinda like Rotation Battle "switching" apparently works where you can swap your item and attack on the same turn, I could see it being kinda cool. Like you could have Leftovers most of them time, but switch to a resist berry if you predict an incoming super effective attack, or switch to Sitrus Berry for a quick heal before swapping back to Leftovers. It would likely demolish the item balance as we know it, and choice items would be really weird, but I could see it being a cool OM.

That's turbo broken lmao. Imagine being able to rotate between Scarf, Band/Specs and the 50% Healing Berries/Leftovers.

It'd be straight up unbearable.

 

[DreamPrince]

Any more than 4 moves really, really hurts defensive play. Things with 4MSS can suddenly run the moves they need to lure their checks with, and boom, only Hyper Offense

Maybe, but defensive Pokémon can also use Defensive moves with additional move slots; For example Toxapex can run Toxic, Haze, Recover, Toxic Spikes, Scald , and Poison Jab, allowing much more role compression.

 

[earl]

Maybe, but defensive Pokémon can also use Defensive moves with additional move slots; For example Toxapex can run Toxic, Haze, Recover, Toxic Spikes, Scald , and Poison Jab, allowing much more role compression.

More role compression doesn’t really make up for suddenly losing to what you could previously counter (Think of Mega Metagross in gen 7 OU being able to fit HP Fire to get around Scizor as an example). A Ferrothorn with both spikes and stealth rocks doesn’t have more walling potential

 

[Nuclearstomp]

It sounded like each Pokemon could hold multiple items at once (three to be exact) BUT only one of them is active at a given point, and you can switch which one is active on the fly during battle. If it works kinda like Rotation Battle "switching" apparently works where you can swap your item and attack on the same turn, I could see it being kinda cool. Like you could have Leftovers most of them time, but switch to a resist berry if you predict an incoming super effective attack, or switch to Sitrus Berry for a quick heal before swapping back to Leftovers. It would likely demolish the item balance as we know it, and choice items would be really weird, but I could see it being a cool OM.

That would be a cool OM. However I could see it being broken in actual play.

Now, I'll give an actual little thing that annoys me cause I haven't in a while: Wally.

This is probably a hot take, but I really dislike Wally in recent years. Everyone praises Wally for being this sick little boy that suddenly becomes a great trainer and yada yada yada but... that's literally all there is to his character arc. He doesn't HAVE a character beyond that. Sure other rivals don't really have much character either (well some of them at least), but I can't understand why people praise Wally for his lack of it. Not to mention that even in Gen 6 you don't actually get to see that much of Wally's adventure or even hear about it from him.

The thing that kinda cracks it for me is that in Gen 6 Wally's just suddenly badass? He has his own theme, mega evolution and a good team. However, I think that goes against his whole thing of growing into a decent trainer by just suddenly being a good trainer without much development on his end in the eyes of the player. Originally I hated the fact that in Gen 3 Wally had a subpar team besides Gardevoir, but I think it makes more sense that he built a team of Pokemon he found and then struggled to the top with them. Although both of those are just nitpicks based on the original aspect.

So yeah I don't like Wally as a character. I like his design though.

 

[Codraroll]

Hot take: ALL the human characters in the Pokémon games are pretty one-note. Well, most at least, I'm sure there are exceptions. But in general, you don't really interact much with anybody but the main rivals. The most you get out of the other NPCs is a few lines of dialogue, maybe a few lines of exposition from somebody else who knows them. The writers don't really get the opportunity to flesh out any characters. Most have just got one shtick and that's it. Wally at least has a character arc, he changes as the game goes on and that's kinda cool to see. Not even all the rivals do that.

I think the Gen VII main characters might be the biggest exceptions to this rule, but then again, the games are extremely cutscene-heavy and you barely have meaningful interactions with anybody outside the core crew. The games were very focused on giving character to a handful of people (Hau, Kukui, Lillie, Gladion, Guzma and Lusamine), almost to the point of detriment to the game experience, and the other characters stuck to that one-note formula common to the other games.

So yeah, character building isn't the strongest suit of Pokémon, and it probably won't ever be. That's not where the focus of the games are. The NPCs are just there to further the story, while the gameplay consists of interaction with your Pokémon. That's where the personal bonds are formed in this franchise. Not with the humans, but with the Pokémon.

 

[Antihaxxer]

Hot take: ALL the human characters in the Pokémon games are pretty one-note. Well, most at least, I'm sure there are exceptions. But in general, you don't really interact much with anybody but the main rivals. The most you get out of the other NPCs is a few lines of dialogue, maybe a few lines of exposition from somebody else who knows them. The writers don't really get the opportunity to flesh out any characters. Most have just got one shtick and that's it. Wally at least has a character arc, he changes as the game goes on and that's kinda cool to see. Not even all the rivals do that.

I think the Gen VII main characters might be the biggest exceptions to this rule, but then again, the games are extremely cutscene-heavy and you barely have meaningful interactions with anybody outside the core crew. The games were very focused on giving character to a handful of people (Hau, Kukui, Lillie, Gladion, Guzma and Lusamine), almost to the point of detriment to the game experience, and the other characters stuck to that one-note formula common to the other games.

So yeah, character building isn't the strongest suit of Pokémon, and it probably won't ever be. That's not where the focus of the games are. The NPCs are just there to further the story, while the gameplay consists of interaction with your Pokémon. That's where the personal bonds are formed in this franchise. Not with the humans, but with the Pokémon.

I don't understand Codraroll, you say that there is too many cutscenes in Alola, which gives the characters a lot of personality, reactions and stories, but then you complain about the lack of character development ... I don't get it or maybe we don't have the same definition of cutscene ...

From Google :
cutscene : (in a video game) a scene that develops the storyline and is often shown on completion of a certain level, or when the player's character dies.

 

[Pikachu315111]

I think the Gen VII main characters might be the biggest exceptions to this rule, but then again, the games are extremely cutscene-heavy and you barely have meaningful interactions with anybody outside the core crew. The games were very focused on giving character to a handful of people (Hau, Kukui, Lillie, Gladion, Guzma and Lusamine), almost to the point of detriment to the game experience, and the other characters stuck to that one-note formula common to the other games.

I'd also give an exception nod to Gen V (which thanks to having a sequel pair of games was able to show payoff for what happened in the first pair of games).

Cheren and Bianca both go through a character arc which changes their perspective. Cheren starts out as the "hard" rival with eyes on only becoming stronger so he can become Champion. However he is then no sooner hit with a hard question from the current Champion: what then after? He learns that the pursuit of strength he's on shouldn't be the only thing he should focus on and everyone has their own strength and he starts training to truly find his. Bianca meanwhile started out as the "meek" rival, she just wanted to go on a Pokemon journey to get away form her father and her actual opinion on Pokemon probably was more neutral to Cheren's and the player (presumably). However as she trained and grew closer with her Pokemon and seeing all the things people can do by working with their Pokemon, she was inspired to stand up to her father so she could find her own course in life which she believed was helping people better understand and work with Pokemon. Jump two years later in BW2 and we discover that Cheren has become both teacher and Gym Leader at the new Pokemon School and Bianca has become Professor Juniper's assistant to become a professor herself once day.

However the game's story might as well have been about N's story arc (as much as SM's was about Lillie's). Abandoned as a child for having the ability to talk with Pokemon, he was adopted by a man who taught him Pokemon and humans should not be together and had N grow up alongside abused Pokemon with little human interaction. N would later then be told his "destiny": to become king of Team Plasma and use the Legendary dragon's power to separate all Pokemon from their human oppressors. When the player firsts meet N he spouts out Team Plasma's beliefs as both an ideal and the truth. However as N is finally exposed to the real world the shield starts to crack as he sees that all is not what he was told and there's plenty of people who share a loving and equal bond with Pokemon, especially the player. However he held fast to his beliefs no matter how much they were challenged, accomplishing Team Plasma's plans but with a wrinkle: he wanted the one trainer who made him question everything to get other dragon of legend and clash their ideals and truths against each other to finally decide who was right. And he lost, and if that didn't completely shatter the shield then his adoptive father, Ghetsis, coming out and revealing he was using N as a pawn certainly did. Once Ghetsis was defeated N was fully freed and set out on a journey to find himself. He did not return to Unova until BW2 when his dragon told him that Kyurem was suffering at the hands of Team Plasma (I think that's why he returned at least) and he returned not only to help Kyurem but also speak with his father. On his two year journey he met many more people and Pokemon and learned that both working and playing together brought each other to greater heights. He wanted to tell Ghetsis this, that Pokemon aren't tools for humans but partners. Despite all what Ghetsis did to him for N to call him father (though admits it's difficult) and show just agitation instead of outright anger and hate shows how much N has moved on with his life (which is compared to Ghetsis who clings to his world domination schemes and has become stark raving mad).

While we only had one game with him, Hugh also showed a greater character arc then previous rivals. He starts the game with one mission: to get his sister's Purloin back from Team Plasma who stole it two years ago. Originally a noble goal, especially after encountering Neo Team Plasma who confirms his bias that Team Plasma are nothing but a group of thieves. However then he meets the original members of Team Plasma, the members who are trying to redeem themselves because they realized what they did was harmful. Hugh at first doesn't believe them, but as the game goes on he realizes things aren't as black and white as he thought they were. And then finally he gets back his sister's Purloin, except now its a Liepard and its loyal to Team Plasma so hisses and tries scratching at him. This temporarily breaks down Hugh, but bigger things are going on so he snaps back to it to help the player but now more shaken and questioning his extreme bias. Post game shows that he has forgiven the ex-members of Team Plasma and is now working with them to help return the Pokemon they had taken. We also see he is working with his sister to reform Liepard which if you play long enough you'll see is successful (at first it only stays in its Poke Ball as Hugh's little sister is only allowed to pet it like that, however at the end you can see it outside of its Poke Ball and interacting kindly to Hugh's sister).

And this is just for the rivals. Many of the other characters like the Professors, Gym Leaders, and Champions aren't as one note as past characters who shared that title were. Not to say there aren't disappointments, the other major players of Team Plasma (Sages, Shadow Triad, Anthea & Concordia) really don't get much spotlight shined onto them and all Elite Four members except Marshal get the short end of the stick on character development (though Grimsley gets a bit role in Gen VII).

 

[Ironmage]

NOTE: I got the idea from Dungeon & Dragons. In D&D, Spellcasters only have a number of spells they can cast per in-game day. I thought doing something similar for Pokemon would be a neat way to give Pokemon more access to moves they'd like to have one or two uses of but didn't want to dedicate a whole moveslot to.

This is an interesting thing to take inspiration from. Since I'm most used to D&D 3.5 and its derivatives, one of the biggest discussion points of the spellcasting system is that it is considered game-breakingly overpowered on... pretty much anything with a large enough movepool and the slots to use it. In the case of pokemon, I wouldn't expect niche moves that don't currently see use to fill limited-use slots. I would expect those slots to be filled by things people consider worth filling a slot now even if they only end up being used once. Things like Explosion, belly drum, anything used for a one-off Z, or Geomancy.

 

[Pikachu315111]

This is an interesting thing to take inspiration from. Since I'm most used to D&D 3.5 and its derivatives, one of the biggest discussion points of the spellcasting system is that it is considered game-breakingly overpowered on... pretty much anything with a large enough movepool and the slots to use it. In the case of pokemon, I wouldn't expect niche moves that don't currently see use to fill limited-use slots. I would expect those slots to be filled by things people consider worth filling a slot now even if they only end up being used once. Things like Explosion, belly drum, anything used for a one-off Z, or Geomancy.

I'd also imagine that what they be used for, and I think that's alright. I imagine it would be most helpful with coverage moves, if you can keep moves meant to handle a threat to just a few it frees up a main move slot your Pokemon can use for its greater strategy it'd otherwise have to waste.

 

[Codraroll]

I don't understand Codraroll, you say that there is too many cutscenes in Alola, which gives the characters a lot of personality, reactions and stories, but then you complain about the lack of character development ... I don't get it or maybe we don't have the same definition of cutscene ...

From Google :
cutscene : (in a video game) a scene that develops the storyline and is often shown on completion of a certain level, or when the player's character dies.

But what I mean with too many cutscenes is that they take you out of the gameplay loop. Instead of playing a game, you're watching characters spout exposition. That's what I mean with them being detrimental to the game experience. Consider that the distance from the player's house to the open road of Route 2 is a couple hundred meters as the crow flies. It takes more than an hour of button mashing before you're allowed to go there, because of all the conversations you have to go through along the way. During that span of time, you might have a dozen Pokémon battles in total.

Also, don't be so quick to equate cutscenes with actual character development. A lot of the cutscenes and tedious dialogues on Melemele consist of mere explanation: Tapu Koko is watching you, this curious stone will probably do something funny, here's a Pokédex, now there's a Rotom in it, let's find the professor, let's have a battle during the festival, here's the Trainer's School, oh look there's a Tauros, this is Team Skull, Hau likes his malasadas... only the latter of those really gives a character any personality, the rest is just exposition.

And while some of the cutscenes in Alola do add some personality to the main characters, there's still only a half-dozen or so of them who benefits from it, and there's an awful lot of repetition. See Olivia, for instance. All that's ever said about her is that she doesn't have a boyfriend. Lillie keeps lamenting she's not a Pokémon trainer. For an even better example, have a look at the Leon memes from Sword and Shield. Leon features prominently in many cutscenes, but it all boils down to "he's the undefeated Champion who has a Charizard and is pants with directions". Those few characteristics are hammered in again and again, and there's nothing else to Leon's character, that's why it became a meme. So much time is spent talking about Leon, and so little is actually said.

Cutscenes take you out of the gameplay and onto a scripted set of rails, there's nothing to do but coast through them and wait for the fun to start again. For them to be worth the diversion, they have to be telling you something worthwhile, and the ones in Alola tend not to do that.

 

[UninspiredLunch]

Yeah, the 27th cutscene about how much Hau loves Malasadas didn't contribute much to his character development.

 

[Volt-Ikazuchi]

Also, don't be so quick to equate cutscenes with actual character development. A lot of the cutscenes and tedious dialogues on Melemele consist of mere explanation:

While we're at it, we can look at two examples of worldbuilding and characterization being done a lot better.

The first is one of my favorite games just because of how it tells its story: Metroid Prime.

Instead of shoving cutscenes on top of cutscenes on the player all the time, the story is told seamlessly by the gameplay. The environments themselves tell a lot of the story and you can scan things to get more detailed information. This is all done to deepen the sense of isolation and more importantly, the exploration.

But how can that be applied to Pokémon? Good mapping and actually giving the player the initiative to pursue those plot threads themselves, preferably at their leisure.

Instead of just forcing the player to stop and listen to their drivel, it's much more engaging to actually have Lillie stand outside the clothing store and actually let the player initiate contact. You don't need to change a single line of dialogue and that immediately gives me the option of:
A) Actually interact with these characters and figure out what are their motivations, which is much more satisfying than having them dump uncalled for exposition on me.
B) Ignore them on a second run since I already know what they're going to say, saving time and not boring me before I get to the actual gameplay loop.

I did mention 2 games, but I only talked about Metroid Prime as a good example, right? What's the other one?

Some older Pokémon games. They actually did that kind of thing better in the older games without cutscenes and exposition dumps. For example, RBY and the creation of Mewtwo.

They have all this info about both Mew and Mewtwo lying around in the Pokémon Mansion and you can just explore and find it at your leisure.