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Unpopular opinions
- Thread starter antemortem
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I can somewhat understand this with things like Oddish, Bellsprout, Wurmple, Cubone, etc. Quite a few of them seem like something you would find in an RPG, but I do feel like a lot of them don't feel like one. Stuff like Growlithe feels like they wouldn't be found as an enemy. I can definitely see what you mean, just don't agree with every gen 1 mon seeming like a random RPG enemy.
Level wise, it's baffling that 7th gym leader is weaker than the 6th. Many people prefer going west of Ecruteak, myself included, in order to get Fly as soon as possible. GSC/HGSS has plenty of daily events and I find Fly much more helpful.
The challenge aspect has always been the biggest highlight of Revolution for me. It is less casual friendly and practically demands you to play with a DS AND know the ins and outs of teambuilding and competitive battling in order to get the most enjoyment out of it, while the Stadium games and Shadow games offer more thanks to the rental options and minigames of the former, and campaigns of the latter. I consider Revolution inferior to those because of that (also wifi connection at the time was way worse), but I really had a blast when I brought a "totally legit" well trained team to beat the Master Battles.
That’s because they were at least partially designed as such; when Pokémon was still Capumon it was more akin to a ‘standard’ RPG, plus Dragon Quest (aka one of the quintessential standard RPG franchises, at least in Japan) was a major influence on the games.
That's the thing about it, and exactly what I was talking about when I said I understand why it didn't do well - it's appealing to competitive battlers like us, but that's only a tiny percentage of the fanbase. Everyone else, on the other hand? PBR lacks both the minigames of Stadium and the story of Colo/XD.
That said, tearing through the Masters sets with a competitive team after being stuck on them all throughout my childhood was an absolute joy.
hard agree, games are my favorite but replaying them and trying to not use the same 7/8 mons every play through leaves you with almost nothing
On the topic of Gen 2 and their remakes, I do agree with a lot of points said about their flaws, like how they poorly show off Pokémon and how bad the levels of wild Pokémon are in general are especially in the post game. I played HGSS before I played GS before I go into my post.
Kanto in Gen 2: I actually disagree saying that Kanto harmed Johto. I liked being able to travel Kanto and get all the gym badges in any fashion you want, it provides a sense of openness that no other game has tried to do. But my main reason why I like is the cultural contrast between the two regions. As someone who loves Art History, I love looking at artwork between of different People and how they used art to show off culture and I think Kanto and Johto show off that very well. When you look at Kanto, it’s 100% modern. No ruins, temples, legends, or myths of any kind, the only region to be like that in any Pokémon game. This is referenced by its Pokémon as well, with Porygon being the first artificial Pokémon, Eevee having an unstable genetic code that allows multiple evolutions, Fossils can be resurrected from labs, and even the Legendary Pokémon don’t have any lore: The Legendary Birds are merely stated to be rare Pokémon, and Mewtwo was created from Mew through its DNA. Cities like Saffron are huge modern Metropolises, while Pewter has a museum dedicated to science. Johto on the other hand, pays close attention to traditional rituals passed down through the years. Ecruteak honors old form of dance through a theatre, Pokeballs are created through hand instead of factories like in Kanto, and there are no fossils in Johto because the region does not respect new technology. The legendary Pokémon also reflect the lore as well. The Legendary Beasts were created from Ho-oh after lightning struck the two towers, causing Ho-oh and Lugia, guardians of the towers to flee. The towers remain untouched has a reminder of the past. Celebii is said to punish children by taking them through time.These are nice details that you are supposed to put to notice after playing the Johto games to show off the region.
Silver: Definitely my favorite of all the “ Jerk “ Rivals. I feel like Silver is less of a criminal and more of someone who need a warm hug.In all seriousness, I find Silver a lot more interesting because he’s less of a snob compared to Blue and Bede ( The only rivals I consider jerks ). Unlike Blue, who doesn’t change at all even when you beat him ( In the Sevii Islands he is still saying “ Smell you later “. ) while Bede just vanishes during the half of the story and makes a random appearance in the Climax as a gym leader. While Silver does do a lot behind the screens, he also shows the most change between the two, becoming different person in the end of the Johto games. And lastly, Silver’s personality is explained by the abusive relationship between him and Giovanni in HGSS, something that isn’t addressed in Blue and Bede. In HGSS, he even lets his starter follow him. That being said, most of Silver’s growth was explained in the remakes, not the original, so understandable why you may not like Silver.
Type Distrubution: I’m playing through the virtual console version of Silver, and OMG, I never realized how bad type distribution is.You thought DP had terrible Fire type distribution? Well GS, has it just as bad. No Fire Stone available means that Flareon, Arcanine, and Ninetales are unavailable until Kanto, while Entei is roaming legendary Pokémon who is incredibly difficult to catch. This leaves Magmar as your only option for a Fire type in the wild. Umbreon is the only Dark type available until the post game, and most Steel types are also quite rare, with Scizor and Steelix being unavailable. And they only introduced only one Ghost and Dragon type in Gen 2, despite being the rarest types in Gen 1. Thankfully, Crystal and HGSS fix these issues by allowing stones to be obtained before Kanto and letting lines like Houndour and Misdreavus be obtainable before Kanto giving more diversity.
Personally, I’d say Gen 2 is completely obsolete by HGSS.Most of the flaws that plague the original Johto games are more or less fixed in the remakes, the same way how Platinum fixed DP.
No, the mortal wounds weren't fixed, They put a band-aid on a grapeshot wound and didn't disinfect anything. It is like dabbing frosting (Following Pokemon) on a stale cake. It distracts for a few bites but nothing can hide the staleness that repeated bites provide.
HGSS didn't fix the awful Pokemon distribution, the lack of Johto Pokemon in the Johto Gym Leaders rosters, the terrible level curve, the lack of good training spots, an empty Kanto, and the lackluster TR plot. Johto Pokemon still felt like an overthought in their own region (provided they even appeared there).
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On the topic of Johto and Kanto's role in the games, in Tamashii Hiroka's retro review of Gen 2, where she defends Gen 2 from all the criticisms we give it, including Joe Merrick, who openly claimed Gen 2 is the worst for the reasons mentioned above. In her review, she notes the early staff of GF including Ken Sugimori and Satoshi Tajiri were inspired heavily by DragonQuest games, and Kanto and John were designed in a similar fashion to DragonQuest games. Actually, Sugimori's artwork of Gen 1 and 2 Pokemon are done in a similar style to Toriyama's work.
As you can see, they both have a very watercolor feel to them. On the topic of Kanto in Gen 2, Tamashii notes that GS was designed to be similar to DragonQuest game, hence why the non-linear direction for Kanto. In fact, post game-Kanto is very similar DQ11S is post game. In the DQ11S, you get to explore the entire continent again, and each town and dungeon has a new activity going for it, including a boss, who is usually just a more powerful version of the one fought in the storyline. In the end, it results in a final showdown with the Ultimate boss. Doesn't that sound familiar to the post game of GS? That's probably why the postgame of Kanto lacks a proper level curve, you are supposed to prepare in any order you'd like for the final boss.
And lastly, I never found the level curve of John to be an issue. When playing through Soulsilver for the first time, I remember my team being evenly leveled throughout the adventure throughout both Kanto and Sinnoh. Compared to the original Silver which I am playing on virtual console, HGSS did massive improvements to GS to the point that I consider them obsolete. One of them being updating the levels for the gym laeders, especially the Kanto ones. One thing to note I played the remakes before the originals, which explain my more positive note. I probably will do a post later on explaining everything I like about HGSS in a future post.
As you can see, they both have a very watercolor feel to them. On the topic of Kanto in Gen 2, Tamashii notes that GS was designed to be similar to DragonQuest game, hence why the non-linear direction for Kanto. In fact, post game-Kanto is very similar DQ11S is post game. In the DQ11S, you get to explore the entire continent again, and each town and dungeon has a new activity going for it, including a boss, who is usually just a more powerful version of the one fought in the storyline. In the end, it results in a final showdown with the Ultimate boss. Doesn't that sound familiar to the post game of GS? That's probably why the postgame of Kanto lacks a proper level curve, you are supposed to prepare in any order you'd like for the final boss.
And lastly, I never found the level curve of John to be an issue. When playing through Soulsilver for the first time, I remember my team being evenly leveled throughout the adventure throughout both Kanto and Sinnoh. Compared to the original Silver which I am playing on virtual console, HGSS did massive improvements to GS to the point that I consider them obsolete. One of them being updating the levels for the gym laeders, especially the Kanto ones. One thing to note I played the remakes before the originals, which explain my more positive note. I probably will do a post later on explaining everything I like about HGSS in a future post.
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She's very bland yes, that said this
is just disturbing
she's like eleven
do not equate eleven year olds with masturbation aids, no, not even the fictional ones, I can't believe I even need to say this
I don’t like Marnie being considered a waifu either, but I swear 99% of her popularity is from people finding her cute. If the second collection focused on the rest of her team, her relationship with Piers, or her being a Gym Leader, I wouldn’t’ be suspicious, but it’s instead her trying to act more cute.
Ah, yes
this may be as old a Go Nagai but I personally blame Ken Akamatsu for plunging japanese cartoons into the frankly horrible depths in which the industry finds itself in (they're making anime about how great it would be to have sex slaves sex slaves!)
and you'd think that when chinese cartoons inevitably replace their now clearly in decline japanese counterparts the chinese communist party would at least prevent this from happening again but that's not what's gonna happen will it Tencent?
anyway POKEMON
you'd think that when Masamitsu Hidaka said that "they like to switch up the girls because it gives the boys some new eye candy every once in a while" he must be clearly joking
because a writer of a literal children's cartoon couldn't possibly be serious about sexualizing literal children right?
WHY? just...
look
I like animation and comics, I've seen animation and comics from, if not all over the world, a few different countries; the medium in and of itself has huge potential in stories that can't be told otherwise either feasibly or at all
but this shit right here? that's not normal! you don't see this in Tintin or in Mortadelo & Filemon or in the Yellow Woodpecker Farm or in the Moomins or in Hijitus or in the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
you don't see this in el Chavo or in Chip & Charlie or in Miraculous or in Steven Universe
and don't bring stuff like Barbarella or Cybersix up, those are explicitly for adults and we are talking about Pokemon here
and yes japanese cartoons like the Knight Ramune series are much worse about sexualizing underage girls while still being intended for children but that's not exactly an excuse now is it?
so in conclusion, yes, your first statement was probably right but that doesn't mean we shouldn't condemn it
(oh and just to be clear this isn't an indictment on Imperial Magala or anything like that
is a statement on how we shouldn't tolerate people sexualizing children, fictional depictions or not, we don't tolerate Scrub Me Mama With a Boogie Beat now do we?)
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Yeah, but the suggestion of it becoming a Feathered Serpent is too good of an idea to pass up. Maybe a Regional Variant? Base Dunsparce remain as is and get a new Dunsparce which evolves.
Agreed, but you know the otaku culture has this problem. It's not new with Pokemon but GF sadly plays into it. In addition to the above example with Serena, have you forgotten about Lillie so quickly? Or how about Mallow and Lana who they made a bit too obvious with their waifu teasing in SM (Lana talking about wanting to meet a handsome swimmer, the mini-game with Mallow has you looking at her crotch while making a gooey drink) they had to backup their characterizations up in USUM. Going back to XY, we also had Shauna who, notably if you played as the boy, during the Parfum Palace sequence watching the fireworks she mentions this is the first time she's been alone with a boy. Heck, going back to Gen I we've had Misty often made to be a pin-up girl in several media.
... I'm sorry, that paragraph gave me whiplash. Where did THAT come from?!
because a writer of a literal children's cartoon couldn't possibly be serious about sexualizing literal children right?
WHY? just...
Pfft, softcore, I see your Serena dressing up as a Fennekin and raise you:
And note this isn't the only time and only bikini she has, and let's not even discuss what they had her wearing in the Electric Tales of Pikachu manga...
So there's been quite a few dissertations on G/S/C/HG/SS in this thread recently, and as someone who has fond memories of HG but really didn't enjoy my recent playthrough, I think a lot of the praise people give the Johto games comes from a feeling of wonder that people tend to have when playing through Pokémon games as children. Johto feels very mysterious as a kid because you don't know anything about anything (and this is true even in the digital age, I'm a zoomer who had Internet access when playing HG as a kid and I still got this feeling) but that feeling of mystery is intrinsic to being a kid and almost impossible to recapture when you're older. The Ruins of Alph seemed really cool when I was a kid, but now they feel kinda lame because I know everything about them.
What's important about this is that it doesn't just apply to the Johto games. I have fond memories of wandering around in that one island in B/W trying to find a legendary that I was convinced could be found there because of an (in retrospect) obviously hacked YouTube video. Pokémon games lend themselves very well to this childlike sense of wonder and mystery, there's nothing all that special about the Johto games in that regard. Strip that magic away, and HG/SS are potentially great games held back by glaring issues (level curve, lack of strong Pokémon) that don't hold up as well as the games around them (Platinum and the Unova games are much better IMO).
That's not to say that there's nothing to like/appreciate about HG/SS. The games have probably my favorite general aesthetic of any Pokémon game, the soundtrack is great, and I think the story with the Kimono Girls is massively underappreciated. The problem is that, for me at least, they're just not very fun to play, and I think that a lot of what I enjoyed about them as a kid is impossible to get back now.
What's important about this is that it doesn't just apply to the Johto games. I have fond memories of wandering around in that one island in B/W trying to find a legendary that I was convinced could be found there because of an (in retrospect) obviously hacked YouTube video. Pokémon games lend themselves very well to this childlike sense of wonder and mystery, there's nothing all that special about the Johto games in that regard. Strip that magic away, and HG/SS are potentially great games held back by glaring issues (level curve, lack of strong Pokémon) that don't hold up as well as the games around them (Platinum and the Unova games are much better IMO).
That's not to say that there's nothing to like/appreciate about HG/SS. The games have probably my favorite general aesthetic of any Pokémon game, the soundtrack is great, and I think the story with the Kimono Girls is massively underappreciated. The problem is that, for me at least, they're just not very fun to play, and I think that a lot of what I enjoyed about them as a kid is impossible to get back now.
Well, first a few background details... I'm sorry, that paragraph gave me whiplash. Where did THAT come from?!
While the english speaking internet would have you believe otherwise Tencent is not, in fact, a videogame company; yes they do make a lot of money from videogames but so does Apple, and speaking of Apple, Tencent is also not comparable to it as a company they're more related to Google, they have their finger in every pie in China, and beyond if I'm been frank
Now that little red headed girl whose image I posted? that's Tencent Animation and Comics' official mascot, TAC being notable for being China's largest publisher of webcomics and animation, traditional comics never having left a mark in the market
for the last nine years or so, chinese webcomics have become not only incredibly prolific but quite popular as well while at the same time manga has taken a considerable nosedive in quality (and yes there may be a correlation between the two) it's gotten bad enough that japanese animators have started to sound the alarms
also, if you actually been reading them in the last decade you would've noticed a general decline in manga specifically; sure there're still great things out there but the average japanese comic has gotten so bad is making shit like Mouse look actually presentable
now that's not to say that chinese webcomics have reached as high as heights as japanese comics have yet (they tend to be very "shonen" to put it simply, and I hope you like Xianxia cause there're cultivation methods literally in every 4 out of 5 of them), but on average? much better than yet another story about been transported to another world, and they have those too (sadly) if not as poorly scripted
back to the issue at hand, I brought up TAC not just because their mascot is straight out of a moe hellhole but because they're falling for the same trappings that japanese comics have
now leaving aside things like Cupid's Chocolates which at least stars college aged students (and that's the communist party influence at work make no mistake) the sexualization of children still crops up
to give just one example this is Hua Ling from Yin Zhi Shoumuren, one of the most popular and best plotted franchises TAC has
and do you seriously need to sexualize the 15 year old that much you guys? there's like five other female characters, all of them college aged and you have to pick the 15 year old
clearly she's the sexiest
clearly
so yeah, there's your context for that paragraph 315111
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I never really liked that to be honest. The whole appeal of dunsparce is that its chubby and a bit silly, making it elegant just makes it more boring.
I think the ideal dunsparce evolution would keep the fatter proportions of it. Could be based on the more fatty bearded dragons or the tiny limbs of skinks, for example.
It ticks me that people act like this can't be conditioned or influence/encourage bad behaviors just because "it's fiction"Ah, yes
this may be as old a Go Nagai but I personally blame Ken Akamatsu for plunging japanese cartoons into the frankly horrible depths in which the industry finds itself in (they're making anime about how great it would be to have sex slaves sex slaves!)
and you'd think that when chinese cartoons inevitably replace their now clearly in decline japanese counterparts the chinese communist party would at least prevent this from happening again but that's not what's gonna happen will it Tencent?
anyway POKEMON
you'd think that when Masamitsu Hidaka said that "they like to switch up the girls because it gives the boys some new eye candy every once in a while" he must be clearly joking
because a writer of a literal children's cartoon couldn't possibly be serious about sexualizing literal children right?
WHY? just...
look
I like animation and comics, I've seen animation and comics from, if not all over the world, a few different countries; the medium in and of itself has huge potential in stories that can't be told otherwise either feasibly or at all
but this shit right here? that's not normal! you don't see this in Tintin or in Mortadelo & Filemon or in the Yellow Woodpecker Farm or in the Moomins or in Hijitus or in the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
you don't see this in el Chavo or in Chip & Charlie or in Miraculous or in Steven Universe
and don't bring stuff like Barbarella or Cybersix up, those are explicitly for adults and we are talking about Pokemon here
and yes japanese cartoons like the Knight Ramune series are much worse about sexualizing underage girls while still being intended for children but that's not exactly an excuse now is it?
so in conclusion, yes, your first statement was probably right but that doesn't mean we shouldn't condemn it
(oh and just to be clear this isn't an indictment on Imperial Magala or anything like that
is a statement on how we shouldn't tolerate people sexualizing children, fictional depictions or not, we don't tolerate Scrub Me Mama With a Boogie Beat now do we?)
Tell me, how come WW2 propaganda on the depiction of the Germans then the Japanese were so successful, leading to concentration camps for the latter that barely anyone questioned?
Tell me how moe culture BECAME a culture instead of remaining isolated?
Tell me how an entire industry didn't have this issue until the mid 80s, with it skyrocketing after the 2000s?
And if it's "freedom of expression", why is it so unoriginal/generic at this point? Artists rarely even think of the implications
Look this is all very fascinating and all but I think we're just slightly veering off course
I saw the words "WW2 propaganda" and stopped reading, what the hell are we talking about right now?
It feels irresponsible to attribute Japanese internment solely to wartime propaganda and not, say, decades of institutional racism against Asian-Americans dating to the Chinese Exclusion Act if not further, and believe me I am able and willing to go there (see signature), but ANYWAY since I would rather the thread not be locked...
The topic was the sexualization of girls in the franchise, which I hope we can agree is a shitty thing, and in any event has been a problem in official media well before the fandom decided to make a waifu out of Marnie. Witness Leaf's original design for example:
That is a dangerously short skirt for anyone, but Leaf is, canonically, a preteen.
The topic was the sexualization of girls in the franchise, which I hope we can agree is a shitty thing, and in any event has been a problem in official media well before the fandom decided to make a waifu out of Marnie. Witness Leaf's original design for example:
That is a dangerously short skirt for anyone, but Leaf is, canonically, a preteen.
Aight this shit's gettin goofy time for a change of pace
While the overworld NPC models are a liiittle wonky, I gotta say the more I look into it the more unironically, genuinely impressed I am by ILCA's attention to small details from what little we've seen of BDSP. For example, I love how in open areas during battles you can see Mt. Coronet literally looming over the horizon.
I especially would like to highlight this thread I discovered recently. There's so many cool little tweaks I never noticed that are mentioned here (like the thing about the shadows and their direction depending on time of day, damn that's saucy), I know this all sounds small and meaningless but that's what makes it so impressive to me. ILCA ain't half-assing this, they're genuinely working hard and putting lots of love into this game I can just feel it.
While the overworld NPC models are a liiittle wonky, I gotta say the more I look into it the more unironically, genuinely impressed I am by ILCA's attention to small details from what little we've seen of BDSP. For example, I love how in open areas during battles you can see Mt. Coronet literally looming over the horizon.
I especially would like to highlight this thread I discovered recently. There's so many cool little tweaks I never noticed that are mentioned here (like the thing about the shadows and their direction depending on time of day, damn that's saucy), I know this all sounds small and meaningless but that's what makes it so impressive to me. ILCA ain't half-assing this, they're genuinely working hard and putting lots of love into this game I can just feel it.
