Tepig itself is fine, (though is overshadowed by the other starters in its gen) but Emboar is just a poor design and with no gimmicks to save it.
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Tepig itself is fine, (though is overshadowed by the other starters in its gen) but Emboar is just a poor design and with no gimmicks to save it.
Gary isn't a good rival.
Yes I agree. But Blue, on the other hand....
I've come to appreciate Blue a lot more in recent years, as he's the only rival in the first few generations who actually perseveres with trying to complete the Pokedex (as you'd expect from Professor Oak's grandchild). Not until Trevor in XY (who I'm also quite fond of) was there a rival so dedicated, all the other ones do a dreadful job.
- Brendan/May are stated to have already been a trainer for some time prior to meeting them in RSE, but eventually basically concede "you're better than me at both battling and collecting" and go home instead of continuing on. If you complete the Hoenn Dex in Emerald and get your Johto starter, they admit that it's your hard work that's getting them the National Dex.
- Dawn/Lucas straight-up tell you throughout DPP that they're not doing well at filling the Pokedex, and basically end up doing nothing by the end of the game except standing around (in BDSP they seem to be doing a bit better). Even their younger sister says that she wants you to do better than them!
- Neither Cheren or Bianca makes a great success of filling the Pokedex, though they do find success in other areas.
I especially like the addition FRLG made to his arc, as you meet him a couple of times in the Sevii Islands and find that he's still very much focused on completing the Pokedex, fittingly having already received an egg from the Daycare. He's found on Six Island having presumably just caught the Heracross he later uses, but we never learn what was in the egg he got. Could have been a Larvitar but equally he probably caught all manner of species, so maybe not. I guess his eventual declaration that "we can't complete the Pokedex by staying in one place [the Sevii Islands]" marks the point where he decides he'd rather focus on battling, though he does mention that he'll keep "collecting Pokemon at my own pace".
For all his arrogant bluster, he is legitimately really good at filling the Pokedex, since he mentions already having obtained 40 species on the SS Anne and later mentions that he's been looking at the listing to figure out which species evolve. Clever boy. Of all the rivals, he's overall probably the most accomplished: Champion, Gym Leader, battle facility leader, Pokedex completionist. Yeah. He's definitely pretty cool.
I’ll always love Silver as the best rival but yeah Blue is an easy second for me.
There is never going to be a plot worse than Sinnoh's (DPPt/Arceus movie/Giratina movie) in Pokemon.
Any butchery made to human characters in the series cannot overshadow the extreme butchery done in the execution of gods who were meant to define all of Pokemon lore and the universe(s) they shaped; Pokemon who were meant to be at the very pinnacle in terms of power-level. These Pokemon make digging into the lore feel meaningless at times because the games / movies expressed ridiculous amounts of plot armor against the entire lake trio, creation trio, and Arceus, in a manner either not as present or not as severe as in any other generation's media. Every time I bring this up people are like "isn't every Pokemon story like this?" The answer is no. No other generation gets this ludicrous amount of plot-induced stupidity.
For example, in Gen 6's case, Team Flare was able to get a hold of Xerneas/Yveltal by sneaking them into their base while they were sleep. Lysandre tried to get their life energy drained but they eventually woke up on their own, broke free from the weapon, took back their life energy, and showed Lysandre who was boss. - okay that's actually reasonable.
In Gen 3, Archie and Maxie raided building after building ran by human communities everywhere in order to gather the resources needed to access the legendary box art. They've obtained the resources and then reached out to Kyogre/Groudon, who then proceeded to break free, go out of control, and show Archie and Maxie who's boss - this is also reasonable.
A similar thing happened with BW as with Gen 3 except a legendary Pokemon willingly sided with the main antagonist of the game. N did not attempt to force Reshiram/Zekrom under his control.
In B2W2, Kyurem was captured and used. Okay sure, but conceptually, Kyurem is a soulless empty shell of a Pokemon deprived of any motivation to do anything but eat and sleep. It needs help. It needs to see the light in truth or ideals in order to gain the motivation to do something. This is a reasonable explanation for how Kyurem managed to get captured and used by Team Plasma in B2W2. Additionally, Kyurem was designed to be nowhere near the level of deities that control time, space, or all of existence. Kyurem is just able to freeze the world with ice. Not shape up entire universes or define the entire nature of Pokemon as we know it.
In Gen 7 the only legendaries captured by human antagonists were baby Pokemon. Aside from that, Necrozma managed to get control of Solgaleo/Lunala but Necrozma was designed to be a force above them anyway.
Gens 1 and 2 didn't really use their legendaries much in the plot aside from making them glorified trophies. Gen 9 turned their legendaries into glorified regular Pokemon with little substance.
Gen 8 simply had legendary Pokemon do their jobs. Nothing more.
Team Galactic were actively messing with Pokemon gods, whether it was Uxie, Azelf, Mesprit, Palkia, or Dialga. Almost all of them canonically had the power to see what Galactic were doing well ahead of time and intervene. All 5 of these Pokemon had every capability possible to avoid the situations they were stuck in. Uxie could dismantle Team Galactic just by opening its eyes and even know what Galactic were doing before the team even reached it. Azelf can manipulate or remove their will, even control them for its own desires. Mesprit could play around with their emotions. All 3 could've done the exact same thing they usually do when you see them; just randomly disappear into somewhere far away. They could have done that to escape as the very last resort if that was ever needed, which it wasn't. Dialga is the embodiment of time. The literal nanosecond it appeared out of its portal it could have ended up in 50 different points of time simultaneously to stop Team Galactic from ever getting a hold of the Red Chain. Palkia could've just erased Cyrus within that same timeframe. Giratina was just shoehorned into the same climax as DP to save the day, with no real explanation until 13 years later with Legends Arceus. Giratina's lore barely even got fleshed out in Platinum. All we did was "enter its home". It's honestly less so than Xerneas/Yveltal (who got more than you'd probably expect but a lot of information is given by random NPCs in houses) but people disagree because "Distortion World looks cool". Aside from this, in Giratina's movie, Giratina got captured by an antagonist while alive, active, and awake, and nearly died to a machine, very much unlike the case with Xerneas and Yveltal, despite representing a concept beyond Xerneas and Yveltal. Arceus was... well, https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/unpopular-opinions.3530232/page-492#post-9432356. Unlike Kyogre, Groudon, Xerneas, Yveltal, they were not able to defend themselves from abuse/being misused/mishandled by antagonists. Unlike Reshiram/Zekrom, they were not willingly siding with the antagonist. Unlike Cosmog, they weren't babies designed to be among the weakest of Pokemon, and unlike Kyurem, all of their power-levels were above and beyond for the series. Gen 4 truly did more harm than good to Pokemon lore thanks to their stories. It's shown by how for example, people believe Arceus to not be the defining Pokemon in series lore due to how it almost died to a meteor and got defeated by silver water.
At the end of the day, the Gen 4 legendaries and mythicals were intended to be Pokemon far beyond every other box art in terms of power and relevance in the lore, but were simultaneously treated as the most pathetic ones. This severely lessened the value of Pokemon lore and theories in general imo and it's shameful.
/end rant
Any butchery made to human characters in the series cannot overshadow the extreme butchery done in the execution of gods who were meant to define all of Pokemon lore and the universe(s) they shaped; Pokemon who were meant to be at the very pinnacle in terms of power-level. These Pokemon make digging into the lore feel meaningless at times because the games / movies expressed ridiculous amounts of plot armor against the entire lake trio, creation trio, and Arceus, in a manner either not as present or not as severe as in any other generation's media. Every time I bring this up people are like "isn't every Pokemon story like this?" The answer is no. No other generation gets this ludicrous amount of plot-induced stupidity.
For example, in Gen 6's case, Team Flare was able to get a hold of Xerneas/Yveltal by sneaking them into their base while they were sleep. Lysandre tried to get their life energy drained but they eventually woke up on their own, broke free from the weapon, took back their life energy, and showed Lysandre who was boss. - okay that's actually reasonable.
In Gen 3, Archie and Maxie raided building after building ran by human communities everywhere in order to gather the resources needed to access the legendary box art. They've obtained the resources and then reached out to Kyogre/Groudon, who then proceeded to break free, go out of control, and show Archie and Maxie who's boss - this is also reasonable.
A similar thing happened with BW as with Gen 3 except a legendary Pokemon willingly sided with the main antagonist of the game. N did not attempt to force Reshiram/Zekrom under his control.
In B2W2, Kyurem was captured and used. Okay sure, but conceptually, Kyurem is a soulless empty shell of a Pokemon deprived of any motivation to do anything but eat and sleep. It needs help. It needs to see the light in truth or ideals in order to gain the motivation to do something. This is a reasonable explanation for how Kyurem managed to get captured and used by Team Plasma in B2W2. Additionally, Kyurem was designed to be nowhere near the level of deities that control time, space, or all of existence. Kyurem is just able to freeze the world with ice. Not shape up entire universes or define the entire nature of Pokemon as we know it.
In Gen 7 the only legendaries captured by human antagonists were baby Pokemon. Aside from that, Necrozma managed to get control of Solgaleo/Lunala but Necrozma was designed to be a force above them anyway.
Gens 1 and 2 didn't really use their legendaries much in the plot aside from making them glorified trophies. Gen 9 turned their legendaries into glorified regular Pokemon with little substance.
Gen 8 simply had legendary Pokemon do their jobs. Nothing more.
Team Galactic were actively messing with Pokemon gods, whether it was Uxie, Azelf, Mesprit, Palkia, or Dialga. Almost all of them canonically had the power to see what Galactic were doing well ahead of time and intervene. All 5 of these Pokemon had every capability possible to avoid the situations they were stuck in. Uxie could dismantle Team Galactic just by opening its eyes and even know what Galactic were doing before the team even reached it. Azelf can manipulate or remove their will, even control them for its own desires. Mesprit could play around with their emotions. All 3 could've done the exact same thing they usually do when you see them; just randomly disappear into somewhere far away. They could have done that to escape as the very last resort if that was ever needed, which it wasn't. Dialga is the embodiment of time. The literal nanosecond it appeared out of its portal it could have ended up in 50 different points of time simultaneously to stop Team Galactic from ever getting a hold of the Red Chain. Palkia could've just erased Cyrus within that same timeframe. Giratina was just shoehorned into the same climax as DP to save the day, with no real explanation until 13 years later with Legends Arceus. Giratina's lore barely even got fleshed out in Platinum. All we did was "enter its home". It's honestly less so than Xerneas/Yveltal (who got more than you'd probably expect but a lot of information is given by random NPCs in houses) but people disagree because "Distortion World looks cool". Aside from this, in Giratina's movie, Giratina got captured by an antagonist while alive, active, and awake, and nearly died to a machine, very much unlike the case with Xerneas and Yveltal, despite representing a concept beyond Xerneas and Yveltal. Arceus was... well, https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/unpopular-opinions.3530232/page-492#post-9432356. Unlike Kyogre, Groudon, Xerneas, Yveltal, they were not able to defend themselves from abuse/being misused/mishandled by antagonists. Unlike Reshiram/Zekrom, they were not willingly siding with the antagonist. Unlike Cosmog, they weren't babies designed to be among the weakest of Pokemon, and unlike Kyurem, all of their power-levels were above and beyond for the series. Gen 4 truly did more harm than good to Pokemon lore thanks to their stories. It's shown by how for example, people believe Arceus to not be the defining Pokemon in series lore due to how it almost died to a meteor and got defeated by silver water.
At the end of the day, the Gen 4 legendaries and mythicals were intended to be Pokemon far beyond every other box art in terms of power and relevance in the lore, but were simultaneously treated as the most pathetic ones. This severely lessened the value of Pokemon lore and theories in general imo and it's shameful.
/end rant
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I’m sorry, your points are wonderful and logical but as a Gen 4 fan this is how I truly feel.
I disagree that this is a bad thing. The whole point in Platinum is that no one knows anything about Giratina; all we have are Cynthia's musings based on a few scraps of old legends, which she herself admits are just speculation. It creates an interesting question about Giratina's motivations: is it trying to save our world or does it merely sense a risk to itself and its home, intervening in an act of self-preservation?
Tbh the problem with the Spear Pillar plot is less that Giratina was "shoehorned" in in Platinum and more that the original DP plot was so terrible, like the resolution is just that the Lake Guardians neutralise Dialga/Palkia because Cyrus was silly enough to let you release them. As a result, the final boss battle is rendered completely inconsequential in hindsight, whereas in Platinum you know that Cyrus' plan has already been foiled by the time you battle him and so you enter it knowing you're just putting down a dangerous sociopath so you can get back to your world.
Question
We know RS were not recieved well in terms of starting anew and no backporting. Masuda noted that the disconnect might've killed Pokemon if it didn't sell well
But what about DP's first reception? All I know is that people initially didn't like the Sp/Phys split, but the game itself I have nothing
We know RS were not recieved well in terms of starting anew and no backporting. Masuda noted that the disconnect might've killed Pokemon if it didn't sell well
But what about DP's first reception? All I know is that people initially didn't like the Sp/Phys split, but the game itself I have nothing
I can't speak much for older fans of that time, and I definitely imagine a lot of the older playerbase had that latter sentiment out of resistance to change from what they once knew. Naturally since I was a kid at the time I don't know the full extent what the online fandom was like.
But what I can say as someone who was one of those kids who grew up with Diamond and Pearl (and Gen 4 as a whole) is that DP was incredibly popular back then among us kids. Pokemon saw a new insurgence in popularity at the time with the DS and DP's debut on it, much moreso than what it was like with RS, with the DS's insane popularity at the time Diamond and Pearl were pretty revolutionary back then. Just about everyone around me was playing it, Pokemon was cool among us kids.
And frankly as a whole it was just really cool and new for Pokemon. Gameplay wise, it had a lot going for it, between wireless multiplayer (and stuff like the Underground and whatnot), being able to play with people all around the world (not to mention the GTS), tons of awesome mons, and just a whole lot to love about it. Pokemon was cool again. It was basically a second wave, and people my age were the beginning of a second wave of kids getting into Pokemon with it after the first one from Gen 1+2 died down (and Gen 3 was stuck in a rut where it was, and still is, a more niche set of games in the grand scheme of the Pokemon franchise).
Of course as a whole in the grand scheme of things and especially looking back, DP in and of itself is on the eh side because it has a lot of flaws, and nowadays Platinum outclasses it hard, but for what it was and for its time it was pretty popular and brought in a massive wave of kids. It still had a lot of new and cool stuff for Pokemon.
I do imagine the older fanbase was probably more critical of it though (DP deservingly so admittedly), and that started the everlasting infinite loop of every Pokemon game getting shit on during its time and then years later when the kids who grew up with it join the internet fandom it gets praised as the greatest time of Pokemon that continues to persist to this day.
For people my age though? DP was the shit. Everyone around my age group was into it. It certainly helped that it was on an immensely popular portable console at the time but the Sinnoh era was quite popular at the time. Much, much moreso than Hoenn previously (Gen 3 is forever that awkward transitional generation in the grand scheme of things).
Take this from my perspective specifically, the perspective of someone who was a kid who started Pokemon with Gen 4 and grew up with Gen 4. Older fans and especially those who were engaged in online fandom back then will have a different perspective ofc.
I was 16 when Pokemon Diamond and Pearl were released in Japan, so I remember the scanslations of the Corocoro Magazines up until release. The issue that revealed the Physical/Special Split gave specific examples of changed moves with Hyper Beam being Special and Ice Punch being Physical.
Some people were pretty upset. Pokemon like Typhlosion and Alakazam were going to lose their best coverage moves, and at the time many speculated that physical and special were going to be determined by whether or not the move made contact(Ended up not being the case since there were many physical non-contact moves, though most contact moves are physical, with the only exceptions in Gen IV being Petal Dance, Grass Knot, Wring Out, and Trump Card and the only others introduced since then being Infestation, Draining Kiss, and Electro Drift), so they were pre-emptively lamenting the loss of Rock Slide and Earthquake on a lot of Physical attackers, but some of things they were worried about changing category(like Crunch being Physical and Shadow Ball being Special) that ended up being correct also upset fans of Pokemon that used those moves as non-stab coverage(most of the complaining overall was based on Coverage moves rather than STAB moves). Also they had fears of Pokemon like Gyarados and Gengar becoming extremely overpowered since they would finally be able to use their higher offense with STAB moves.
Most of the people got over it after the game was leaked online and saw all of the category changes and, more importantly, many new moves created to fill the void of certain popular moves changing category(Like Dark Pulse).
Some people were pretty upset. Pokemon like Typhlosion and Alakazam were going to lose their best coverage moves, and at the time many speculated that physical and special were going to be determined by whether or not the move made contact(Ended up not being the case since there were many physical non-contact moves, though most contact moves are physical, with the only exceptions in Gen IV being Petal Dance, Grass Knot, Wring Out, and Trump Card and the only others introduced since then being Infestation, Draining Kiss, and Electro Drift), so they were pre-emptively lamenting the loss of Rock Slide and Earthquake on a lot of Physical attackers, but some of things they were worried about changing category(like Crunch being Physical and Shadow Ball being Special) that ended up being correct also upset fans of Pokemon that used those moves as non-stab coverage(most of the complaining overall was based on Coverage moves rather than STAB moves). Also they had fears of Pokemon like Gyarados and Gengar becoming extremely overpowered since they would finally be able to use their higher offense with STAB moves.
Most of the people got over it after the game was leaked online and saw all of the category changes and, more importantly, many new moves created to fill the void of certain popular moves changing category(Like Dark Pulse).
I'm glad that such upset was gotten over rather quickly after people found out how moves were distributed. At least Alakazam got more of a side grade with Shadow Ball and Focus Blast, if anything. Meanwhile, BoltBeam doesn't mean much anymore now that more Pokemon resist both, but since they're rare, it has its uses against stuff not named Magnezone.
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BoltBeam is still relevant to this day tbh as the pokemon that resist both are extremely rare
Aside parallels you can connect with the Professor, I do agree that Penny and Nemona feel tacked on for the final story and the only reason they're included was an excuse to not go right into the final story after defeating completing Path of Legends without completing the other two storylines.
Penny was brought along because they needed a tech expert. So, what is her contribution to the final story? Turning the lights on in the Area Zero Gate. That's it. No other time is her tech expertise needed. Don't get me wrong, I like her interaction with the crew, being sassy (though realizing when she went too far) and using common sense. However that's not why she was brought along, and the most baffling thing is that they could have given her further tech things to go. On our way down Area Zero we had to re-activate the Research Stations. Now, just entering them automatically gives the Professor access to them, but they could have at least had Penny be the one to turn it on (and maybe require the player, Arven, and Nemona to go check on something while she does her techy stuff) and contact the Professor. Yes, gameplay wise it doesn't change anything, but would have given Penny more of a reason to be there in-story.
Nemona was brought just to be extra muscle which she does so, always ready to jump into battle. However, I do feel the game missed an opportunity to add some depth to her character by making her realize her battling obsession (especially with finding another trainer as strong as she is) inadvertently prevented her from using her Champion position to actually help people in need. Because Nemona isn't just any strong trainer, she is a CHAMPION. A trainer which, in theory, if someone was having a problem that could be solved by battling they could go to her and ask her for help. On top of that, she's also the Student Council President, so once again any problems a student is having they in theory could approach her for help. While travelling through Area Zero they could have had Arven and Penny quickly tell the others about their struggle (Arven with healing Mabostiff and Penny with Team Star) and how the player helped them. And they could have then made Nemona realize how neglected of her positions she's been. Here are two students (or more if you count all of Team Star) who needed help from a strong trainer... but Nemona's obsession made it so they didn't even want to approach her, or worse she may not have even helped if they did. And considering how Nemona treated both Arven and the Team Star grunts at the beginning of the game (and now learning Arven was trying to get help for Mabostiff and all of Team Star bully victims), if I was Nemona I'd feel a little bit guilty. But no, all throughout Area Zero she is all cheery and battle-focused; even after Arven watches the robot version of his dead parent teleport themselves away, a pretty soul-crushing moment for him, does she try switching topic to how cool your 'Raidon looked while battling (Nemona, too soon...).
Kind of confused what you're getting at here.
In term of personality, the Professor and AI are different characters. The Professor was obsessive to the point of madness, while the AI realized how wrong the Professor was and wanted to stop their plans. Thus, the player didn't crush the AI's dream, the player helped the AI achieve its goal of stopping what the Professor started since it was unable to. When you're battling the AI you're not battling the AI who called you down there, you're battling what is essentially the Professor's ghost in a computer program form. And even when it was all over, the AI still achieved what it wanted to do by teleporting itself into the past/future (yes, it did so because it "inherited" the curiosity of the past/future from the Professor, but the Professor wanted to bring the past/future to the present. The AI set its own path based on the Professor's interest, but was still its own path). The only dream that was crushed was the original Professor's, and they're dead; even if their ecological nightmare dream did come true they wouldn't be there to witness it; in a way they crushed their own dream by consequence of playing god to achieve their crazy & dangerous idea.
Which is probably why, for Arceus at least, they decided to go the "avatar" angle. It's not ACTUALLY god you're catching, but rather its the physical puppet god created to interact with the world cause it's too metaphysical to do so.
Thus, I wouldn't be surprised if all the other Sinnoh Legendaries connected to Arcues were too just "avatars" of what they represented. Dialga and Palkia aren't literally the embodiment of time and space, rather like the Arceus Avatar they're physical puppets with the power of time and space so it can have them manipulate those forces on a "miniscule" scale. Heck, maybe that is why Dialga and Palkia exist; why would Arceus need them anyway if its god of everything? Well because the Arceus Avatar doesn't have enough room to fit in the power of "time" and "space", so made a Time Avatar and Space Avatar as a compromise. Giratina exists as a Counterbalance Avatar, encompassing anti-matter (as well as anti-time and anti-space) so reality doesn't break down while the other Avatars bend reality (unfortunately this made Giratina a tad bit violent so Arceus had to shove it into the Distortion World where it can still do it's "job" but there's no concern of hurting anyone). As for the Lake Guardians, they were probably made not to create their spiritual traits but as yet as more tools for Arceus Avatar. Arceus Avatar doesn't look to have any control over sentient life, thus needs the Lake Guardians to manipulate them.
"Okay, so they're all "Avatars" of what they represent, so what? They're still incredibly powerful Pokemon who could have easily defended themselves from Team Galactic"
Could be Team Galactic, or rather Cyrus, pulled some loopholes in order to get around getting him & his team obliterated by them. Going after Dialga & Palkia directly was a no-go, they would be destroyed without something to control them. Hence they needed to go after the Lake Guardians to make the Red Chain. So, why didn't the Lake Guardians fight back? Cause they were inactive. Just like Dialga and Palkia as long as they were in their dimension (note the Lake Guardians dimension is the normal Pokemon World). Dialga, Palkia, and the Lake Guardians are loyal to Arceus (Avatar), so unless being actively used by it they're inactive. Giratina is the only exception as it has revolted against Arceus' control, but it's stuck in the Distortion World (at least until, in Platinum version, the timespace distortion caused by Dialga & Palkia allowed it to crossover though only to attack the one who was messing with the balance of the world: Cyrus). Galactic captured them while they were inactive, them only reactivating after what was needed to make the Red Chain was extracted from them. And so, with the Red Chain, Team Galactic could now summon the Dialge or/and Palkia and take control of them, forcing them to use the power they only use at Arceus' command to create a new universe (until its stopped).
So looking at them in that light it makes sense why Team Galactic was able to get the upperhand... of course this is a retcon as at the time they were very likely meant to be taken as deities.
Well if you go by comparing them to their base forms, yeah.
M-Garchomp losing 10 points in Speed is a pretty notable nerf, and one likely done on purpose. If they kept its Speed at 102 and instead only increased its Attack to 160 it would it would still be super busted. They couldn't add more to its HP, adding more to its SpA would just make it into a mixed attacker, adding more to its defenses would make it too bulky, and adding more to its Speed would just make the problem even worse. So, the only option they really had was decreasing its Speed, which turned out making it worse than base Garchomp who had no problem hitting hard. Also losing getting Evasion in Sandstorm for getting just more power (aka something it doesn't really need) was just an extra nail in the coffin.
Meanwhile M-Audino was an improvement to base Audino all around. No stat decreases, made into a wall by just pumping up its defense stats, and given a better Typing which helps soak damage from the most damaging Types. Sure its disappointing it lost Regenerator, but then again M-Audino is clearly meant to be a Double Battle partner and so makes sense using Healer instead.
The weird thing to me is they had a pretty reasonable set-up to use Penny's tech expertise at the stations: Stations 1 and 2 (or 2 and 3 if we make 1 "free"), have Penny need to hack in to get it online, when some aggressive Wild Pokemon attack and Nemona/Arven help you keep them off her back. The last station could be online already but have a mechanism she can't get into (EX: Arven using the Book to open the gate to Deep Area Zero) to fit Penny's Battle in. Then Station 4 is opened by the Professor and things proceed as we see in the final game. This mostly requires a few text box changes since you can just have the "hacking" off-screen while you're battling the Wild Pokemon.
One thing I'll mention initially, one of the Diamond/Pearl Manga adaptions depicts the Lake Trio as asleep during the Lake Valor sequence (the characters fighting back awakens Azelf briefly in response to their willpower), and they're drawn as being sort of painfully-shocked awake at the Galactic Building. I had always assumed the Legendaries were sleeping and captured/secured before they were awake enough to fight back (especially since the Lake Trio are in the "Minor" Legendary category that's usually depicted as catchable). Cyrus's plan is depicted as effectively ruined when the Red Chain is broken, so it's clear this object, which required an operation to catch 3 other Legendary Pokemon with heavy tech and a base they have lost now, is the only reason he could get Dialga/Palkia to even attempt what he was after. The Lake Guardians don't have a physical power over them, they just pacify them on a spiritual/emotional level to not say "screw the Universe, where's the reset button?" and then leave.
I also think it's important to note that in this Avatar theory, this particular idea is a retcon in the games without total consistency in the Anime Arceus, namely the fact that M12 features it fighting the Creation Dragon trio, which wouldn't make sense if thy were all extensions of the same will. I kind get the sense the Sinnoh Legends aren't really Avatars or Puppets the same way the God Llama is, at most they strike me as entities Arceus creates to give order to these forces but doesn't have direct control of. The HGSS event already confirms they can just be created on a whim by Arceus so it's not like they so-absolutely embody the concepts as to be the sole existence even before Multiverse shenanigans happened.
All this acknowledging it's retconning, because I think it's also the case that in 2005-6 (Development and release), Pokemon simply didn't emphasize story enough to consider what kind of scale a monster like Time & Space Deities should actually work on, something you do see in other media like how DC constantly has to figure out how the hell The Flash operates in a given iteration.
Personally, the Sinnoh Legend stuff never bothered me a great deal because I don't think the games depict them getting as far as proving the feats they're trying besides Giratina and the Distortion World existing, and a lot of their other powers/feats are brought up in lore books but never seen through outright in the Games. My interpretation had always been that the Sinnoh Legends aren't actually Capital-G God Pokemon equivalents, rather they're extremely powerful and revered as such by Sinnoh of old. In Gen 5 the equivalent would be the "Original" Tao Dragon, Gen 6 presents Mega Rayquaza as such in Hoenn, and I'd argue such an idea could be applied to Ho-oh and Lugia in Johto retroactively. As for the difference in feats/scales they recount, just consider how wild some Mythologies in the real world get compared to each other.
- Christianity/Judaism: "God speaks through a burning bush and unleashes 10 Physical Plagues on Egypt"
- Greece: "Kronos devours his kids and a rock only to be made to spit them out and be overthrown. Zeus eats another Goddess only to get a literal splitting headache which his Daughter Athena pops out of full grown in battle armor"
- Norse Mythology: "Every object and concept in existence swears not to hurt Baldur, making him basically invincible. Also Gleipnir is made out of 6 ideas that don't exist any more because they were used to make it."
I'm posting this since Pokemon community is obsessed with dual types, especially those who have never been used.
It's ok to be single-typed.
As a person who prefer serching explanations to certain choices of design / type rather than being outraged at them, I value coherence over originality, and I don't mind a Pokemon which is single typed if the reason behind it is coherent. Moreover, I'm generally pretty dubitative concerning the arguments of the people who want a certain type for X Pokemon. For example, Luxray, I don't get what could be "dark" in it, except maybe its edgy look, the Pokemon isn't described as mischievious, nor evil.
I'm open to justified typing changes though, for example, I wish Braviary was a fighting type due to its belligerent and brave nature, but giving new types out of the blue just for the sake of being dual typed just feel artificial to me.
It's ok to be single-typed.
As a person who prefer serching explanations to certain choices of design / type rather than being outraged at them, I value coherence over originality, and I don't mind a Pokemon which is single typed if the reason behind it is coherent. Moreover, I'm generally pretty dubitative concerning the arguments of the people who want a certain type for X Pokemon. For example, Luxray, I don't get what could be "dark" in it, except maybe its edgy look, the Pokemon isn't described as mischievious, nor evil.
I'm open to justified typing changes though, for example, I wish Braviary was a fighting type due to its belligerent and brave nature, but giving new types out of the blue just for the sake of being dual typed just feel artificial to me.
I agree broadly with this, but I think it's a viewpoint that's influenced by hindsight.
What I mean is that I think expectations have a lot to do with people's thoughts on Pokemon types. People generally expect that new games will do things differently, and as the number of unexplored type combinations shrinks with each generation people naturally fixate on what hasn't been done before and/or what they'd like to see. So when people share details of new Pokemon, especially when the games arrive early and leakers start doing full breakdowns ("there's a new Electric-type Pokemon that can be caught early on, evolves twice and the final evolution is a big tough-looking feline") it's understandable that people might be a little let down to learn that it stays pure Electric. Of course we can say now that, actually, Luxray is fine as it is but certainly early on I remember a lot of people being disappointed in its supposed lack of potential.
Another example of wasted potential is Galarian Ponyta. It was a Pokemon that was teased prior to release - given that it's a regional form of an existing Pokemon I don't think it's unreasonable to expect something new from it. And it's... Psychic/Fairy. A typing that's been done before and has no connection to the original. I was expecting (or perhaps hoping for) it to be Fire/Fairy and I felt, not unreasonably I think, quite disappointed when that turned out not to be the case.
Generally speaking I don't have much investment in debates about "[species] should be [type]" but I am broadly onside with the mindset that, for a lot of Pokemon, they'd feel more feel more "interesting" if they had an additional type. Obviously that's subjective and varies from person to person - I've never thought that Gyarados needed to be a Dragon-type, for instance. And I don't think EVERYTHING needs to be dual-typed - Seadra is a good example of this as a Water-type that has strong Poison and Dragon affiliations (obviously it evolves into a Dragon, but still). On the other hand, I've always said that Zeraora feels like it should have been part Fighting because there's a definite affinity there (it learns a ridiculous amount of Fighting-type moves), and because I do legitimately think the novelty of it being the first Electric/Fighting species would have made it stand out more - it's not the most exciting or interesting mythical as it stands.
To give another example: Mega Glalie always struck me as wasted potential too. It's obviously stronger than base Glalie but it remaining simply pure Ice-typed feels like it's not mechanically adding anything new - and while Glalie itself doesn't have much Dark-type flavour beyond learning a few Dark moves, its Mega was a blank slate so could have been designed with that (or indeed any other type) in mind. Not every Pokemon changes type when they Mega Evolve, but I don't think Mega Glalie stands out in a particularly crowded field so I do think it could have benefited from the extra type. Again, it's moot now but at the time it wasn't an unreasonable immediate reaction to go "aw, why is this single-typed?"
In sum, I absolutely agree it's fine to be single-typed and that there should be a strong justification for making something dual-typed beyond "it'd be cool". But there are several examples in which I think it's completely justified for people to have wanted or expected something different.
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I think your memory is a bit scrambled regarding the Galarian Ponyta reveal. It was shown to be pure Psychic. I remember many people being really confused at the time and complaining that it should've been fairy type but when the game finally got leaked it was shown to gain the Fairy upon evolving into Galarian Rapidash.
Yes, I thought I'd probably gotten that wrong as soon as I pressed "post". I actually couldn't remember whether G-Ponyta was pure Fairy or pure Psychic, I just knew that G-Rapidash was Fairy/Psychic. It doesn't change the point I was making, though.
It’s true that not every new Pokémon needs to be dual-typed, but even then, there is the need for a reason why some Pokémon have to be single-type.
I think another issue it can cause is redundancy if you introduce too many single-type Pokémon at once.
And let’s not forget that too many single-typed Pokémon of the same type can end up resulting in wasted potential. There’s too many single-typed Fighting-type in Galar as far as I know, with all but one newcomer (Zamazenta in it’s Crowned form) being pure Fighting in the base game, being Galarian Farfetch’d line, Falinks and Clobberpus line. It also means it gets increasingly difficult for pure Water-type Pokémon to stand out in this regard as well, considering the countless amount of them back in the first five generations.
This same goes for repeated dual-typing. A dual type isn’t too bad if repeated once in a single generation, but if there are four or more, that becomes a problem. Dual type repeated throughout at leaat three generations in a row also become problematic if the next Pokémon doesn’t stand out, like how the Tepig line get a negative reaction once people notice that Pignite and Emboar are the third Fire / Fighting starter after Blaziken and Infernape, and the pigs doesn’t stood out significantly outside of slower in exchange of HP, which ultimately amounts to not-much after you discover or remember that their other defensive stats aren’t high.
Another example would be Grass / Poison back in Gen 1. Three lines of Grass / Poison, of which even Bulbasaur starts as one, does make them feel redundant since all of them have high Special Attack and similar Abilities. It resulted Roselia to get sadly overshadowed in RSE due to comparatively unimpressive stats, which is why it got an evolution (and a pre-evolution) in DPP, and Roserade does have Technician which was especially useful for Hidden Power back when it was a widely available TM, and still useful if niche nowadays.
Legends: Arceus and Scarlet + Violet did repeared the Fire / Ghost with Hisuian Typhlosion and Skeledirge, respectively. However, it’s not an issue in the long run since Hisuian Typhlosion is faster, while Skeledirge is slower but much tankier, especially if getting access to Unaware. Had GF made Pignite and Emboar swapped SpA with either Defense or Special Defense, it’ll make much better use of their high HP and it wouldn’t be that bad.
Still, type repeat can be a real problem because it can squander potentials completely in the case of single-type, or make them feel redundant or even outright lazy for dual-type, so it’s a detail that may be small, but still very important when you consider what has already been done before.
I think another issue it can cause is redundancy if you introduce too many single-type Pokémon at once.
And let’s not forget that too many single-typed Pokémon of the same type can end up resulting in wasted potential. There’s too many single-typed Fighting-type in Galar as far as I know, with all but one newcomer (Zamazenta in it’s Crowned form) being pure Fighting in the base game, being Galarian Farfetch’d line, Falinks and Clobberpus line. It also means it gets increasingly difficult for pure Water-type Pokémon to stand out in this regard as well, considering the countless amount of them back in the first five generations.
This same goes for repeated dual-typing. A dual type isn’t too bad if repeated once in a single generation, but if there are four or more, that becomes a problem. Dual type repeated throughout at leaat three generations in a row also become problematic if the next Pokémon doesn’t stand out, like how the Tepig line get a negative reaction once people notice that Pignite and Emboar are the third Fire / Fighting starter after Blaziken and Infernape, and the pigs doesn’t stood out significantly outside of slower in exchange of HP, which ultimately amounts to not-much after you discover or remember that their other defensive stats aren’t high.
Another example would be Grass / Poison back in Gen 1. Three lines of Grass / Poison, of which even Bulbasaur starts as one, does make them feel redundant since all of them have high Special Attack and similar Abilities. It resulted Roselia to get sadly overshadowed in RSE due to comparatively unimpressive stats, which is why it got an evolution (and a pre-evolution) in DPP, and Roserade does have Technician which was especially useful for Hidden Power back when it was a widely available TM, and still useful if niche nowadays.
Legends: Arceus and Scarlet + Violet did repeared the Fire / Ghost with Hisuian Typhlosion and Skeledirge, respectively. However, it’s not an issue in the long run since Hisuian Typhlosion is faster, while Skeledirge is slower but much tankier, especially if getting access to Unaware. Had GF made Pignite and Emboar swapped SpA with either Defense or Special Defense, it’ll make much better use of their high HP and it wouldn’t be that bad.
Still, type repeat can be a real problem because it can squander potentials completely in the case of single-type, or make them feel redundant or even outright lazy for dual-type, so it’s a detail that may be small, but still very important when you consider what has already been done before.
My big issue with type combinations is when I get the distinct sense the Pokemon's flavor is supposed to play into traits that don't match its singular or double typing. It's not so much that I need everything to be dual typing, but there are several Pokemon where I see the resulting mon and question feel like this specific creature is off.
My most immediate examples are opposite sides of a coin: Psyduck and Slowpoke lines. Early depictions of the Psyduck and Golduck line emphasize them as having Psychic Powers, including certain moves like Confusion or using Telepathy in some Manga, which always makes it bizarre to me that the line is Pure Water in both stages and every depiction. By comparison, no Dex entry for Kanto Slowpoke or Slowbro ever describes anything that entails their Psychic typing, and most appearances play up their dopey/oblivious nature more in terms of thought pattern, so by comparison they feel like Pure Water to me (Slowking makes sense to me since the Headbite is said to make it highly intelligent, a common trait in early Psychics).
This is also the closest thing I get to calling for certain type combinations: because the type should factor into the design, I'd like to see (one of) the ways an unexplored type would translate to a creature. I also think the first time is the hardest bandage to "rip off" before exploring the type further and trying a few other concepts (compare Kommo-o and Koraidon, or Zekrom to Miraidon, which share the same fairly rare typings but have pretty distinct designs from each other)
My most immediate examples are opposite sides of a coin: Psyduck and Slowpoke lines. Early depictions of the Psyduck and Golduck line emphasize them as having Psychic Powers, including certain moves like Confusion or using Telepathy in some Manga, which always makes it bizarre to me that the line is Pure Water in both stages and every depiction. By comparison, no Dex entry for Kanto Slowpoke or Slowbro ever describes anything that entails their Psychic typing, and most appearances play up their dopey/oblivious nature more in terms of thought pattern, so by comparison they feel like Pure Water to me (Slowking makes sense to me since the Headbite is said to make it highly intelligent, a common trait in early Psychics).
This is also the closest thing I get to calling for certain type combinations: because the type should factor into the design, I'd like to see (one of) the ways an unexplored type would translate to a creature. I also think the first time is the hardest bandage to "rip off" before exploring the type further and trying a few other concepts (compare Kommo-o and Koraidon, or Zekrom to Miraidon, which share the same fairly rare typings but have pretty distinct designs from each other)
This should be required viewing for every modern Pokemon fan
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