Ladder Almost Any Ability

Ability wise compared to AAA's banlist, I think this is probably the best way to start:

Ban: Arena Trap, Contrary, Huge Power, Pure Power, Illusion, Imposter, Parental Bond, Pure Power, Shadow Tag, Simple, Shedinja, Wonder Guard
  • Pure & Huge Power, Shadow Tag, Arena Trap, Wonder Guard, Imposter, Parental Bond and to a lesser extent Contrary would be very broken so I don't think anyone would have any objections with those.
  • Simple would be pretty unhealthy in my opinion since things like Simple Xerneas and Arceus would practically mandate an Unaware to avoid getting swept.
  • Illusion is probably the most controversial one here, but it's not broken as much as it is uncompetitive - it could be that it'll end up less useful in AAA Ubers than it is in regular AAA, but at the end of the day even if you know the opponent has Illusion it forces 50/50s if the Illusion player plays their cards right.
  • It's possible that Sturdy Shedinja could end up not being broken in AAA Ubers, but I think it would be healthier for the metagame to just ban it in advance because it's stupid to deal with in standard tiers.
Unban: Ability Clause, Aerilate, Fur Coat, Protean, Speed Boost
  • Aerilate was banned because it had multiple broken users, but this isn't really the case in Ubers.
  • Fur Coat could end up being too strong of a defensive ability, but I believe that the line is grey enough that it should be given a shot in the metagame.
  • Protean I thing may end up getting banned because it's pretty insane offensively, but like Fur Coat I believe it should be given a shot.
  • Speed Boost could pose some problems for HO teams, but yet again, grey area.
  • The ability clause could be implemented later if the meta needs it - there isn't really a way to know if it'll be necessary at this point in time.

There's also Mega Ray which might be worth a look for unbanning, but I think it's better to wait until we get a good idea of the metagame before looking into that.
 
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E4 Flint

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If it follows ubers isn't Megaray banned? Not that I'd complain if it was allowed.

I'm excited about this though I think you should start with ability clause especially if you are doing unbans. It already sounds a lot like bh lite with imposter FC Chans, aerilate espeed hyper voice Ray, protean deoA, ph slaking and more
 
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I love Reshiram, I wonder what abilities would be best? Tinted Lens would mean Ho-Oh couldn't switch in anymore, Adaptability makes it insanely strong, Magic Guard would make hazards a non issue (Ho-Oh could also use that well, no more Stealth Rock problems) while Desolate Land gives it its own perma sun.
 

The Immortal

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why dont we just use this as a guideline: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/almost-any-ability-ubers.3510951/ this is the AAA ubers that has been implimented on aqua before its death, so i dont see why "completely remaking it" would make sense when we have a perfectly fine template to work off. (and if more stuff needs to be banned then so be it.)
That ban list was quite excessive. It did not follow the mentality of an Ubers metagame. I believe that everything should be given a fair shot except the obvious stuff like Wonder Guard. Not to mention, it's never had a ladder before or anything, so it had minimal activity. That template isn't a good one to follow, basically.
 
In regard to banlists, I support everything on Klang's banlist. Ultimately the goal is to make a fun meta to play, and while having extra freedom is important in an ubers meta, the nature of AAA is that it tends to make things far more centralizing than pokemon in standard play.

Here's a messy list of abilities (red=very likely to have a major influence on meta, pink=less likely but still likely to influence the meta):

Arceus - Offensive E-Killer - Tough Claws, Tinted Lens, Protean, Magic Bounce, Scrappy, Poison Heal, Mold Breaker
- Defensive - Unaware, Fur Coat, Multitype, Poison Heal, Soundproof, Prankster, Magic Bounce
- Other - Sheer Force
Darkrai - Special - Mold Breaker, Sheer Force, Protean, Tinted Lens
Deoxys-A - nuke - Protean, Sheer Force, Tough Claws, No Guard
Dialga - Defensive - Regenerator, Harvest? Magic Bounce?
- Offensive - Speed Boost, Adaptability, Tinted Lens, Sheer Force, Protean
Giratina-A - Defensive - Poison Heal, Regenerator, Fur Coat, Prankster, Magic Bounce, Filter, Harvest, Rough Skin(?)
Giratina-O - Offensive - Don't really know
Groudon - Offensive - Speed Boost, Poison Heal, Harvest
- Defensive - Poison Heal, Regenerator, Fur Coat
Ho-oH - Offensive - Gale Wings, Magic Guard, Tinted Lens
- Defensive - Magic Guard, Poison Heal, Regenerator, Fur Coat, Delta Stream
Hoopa-U - Offensive - Hustle?
Kyogre - Offensive - Swift Swim, Tinted Lens
- Defensive - Regenerator, Fur Coat, Poison Heal
Kyurem-W - nuke - Refrigerate, Adaptability, Tinted Lens, Sheer Force
Lugia - Defensive - Poison Heal, Unaware, Fur Coat, Magic Bounce, Multiscale, Magic Guard, Prankster, Regenerator
Mewtwo - Offensive- Protean, Sheer Force
Palkia - Defensive - Poison Heal, Regenerator, Magic Bounce, Harvest
- Offensive - Protean, Adaptability
Rayquaza - Offensive - Aerilate, Protean, Speed Boost
Reshiram - Offensive - Chlorophyll, Adaptability
Shaymin-S - Offensive - Sheer Force, Adaptability, Tinted Lens
Xerneas - Offensive - Tinted Lens, Protean, Sheer Force, Mold Breaker, Magic Bounce, fairy aura outrage
- Defensive - Regenerator, Poison Heal, Harvest
Yveltal - Offensive - Adaptability, Gale Wings, Sheer Force
- Defensive - Fur Coat, Unaware, Delta Stream, Magic Guard, Poison Heal, Regenerator
Zekrom/Kyurem-B/Weavile - Offensive - Adaptability, Refrigerate, Tinted Lens
noivern - boomburst - aerilate, protean

Obviously this list is missing some very central pokemon like Mega Gengar and Primal Groudon, leaves out banned things from regular AAA and is still very preliminary as the meta hasn't developed too far.

- A ton of other things from OU and below get Aerilate, and pokemon like Honchkrow and Braviary are still useful for bird-spam cores.
- Little in the Ubers tier can actually take on Rayquaza or Ho-oh except maybe Giratina-A, so lower tier pokemon will still likely be very viable
- On paper Deoxys-A looks broken as hell, you have to sack something every time it's in, and you can't let your priority pokemon get weakened.
- Xerneas might end up being even harder to deal with than in regular ubers; on one hand you can't just slap thunder wave on Ho-oh or primal groudon but on the other hand you can use things like unaware on everything.
- Regarding Arceus, see above.
- When I played this metagame about a year ago Fur Coat Chansey was actually ridiculous.
- Out of inexperience, what do Dialga, Palkia, and Giratina-A do exactly?
 
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bp scrub

rub a dub dub one scrub in a tub
btw, type changing abilites + arceus dont seem to go well together (obviously discouting multitype) so Protean (and Color Change) don't work on Arceus

at least thats how it is in hackmons and custom game
 
I doubt offensive teams will have to go down into lower tiers to pick up Flying resists if they really want them. Fur Coat cuts damage as much as a Flying resistance would, and gives you the opportunity to lure in opponents that expect to revenge kill you with physical attacks.

252+ Atk Choice Band Aerilate Rayquaza Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Fur Coat Reshiram: 156-184 (45.7 - 53.9%) -- 3.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery <<< I wouldn't necessarily recommend Reshiram as your offensive Aerilate check, but still, a Pokemon with passable uninvested bulk can recover off reasonably powerful Flying-type attacks.
 
Wow the LCotM is decided already? That was fast.

A set that looks like fun.

Slaking @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Bulk Up
- Facade
- Sucker Punch/Shadow Claw
- Taunt/Slack Off

Slaking actually have great movepool in Bulk Up, Sucker Punch, Slack Off, Taunt and various coverage like Earthquake, Play Rough Shadow Claw, Gunk Shot, Hammer Arm. It's also physically bulky (150 HP/100 Def is very similar to Arceus' bulk) and moderately fast considering standard Speed of Ubers is 90. It can also run Tough Claws with the coverage it has.

Also the king of Ubers in gen 3, 4 and 5 is back. You can now run the classic Specs Water Spout Kyogre but with Primordial Sea instead. Very few things can wall it to the point that people ran Shedinja back then just for Kyrogre. This time, it's more tolerable because you can switch desolate land mons but you still need to be wary of Specs Ice Beam and Thunder.

Looks like a fun meta I think.
 
I think Protean and Aerilate are going to need to be banned for obvious reasons. Protean would turn Deoxys-A and Mewtwo into veritable wrecking balls of destruction, while Aerilate basically turns Rayquaza into a frailer and slower, but much more powerful Mega Salamence with STAB priority. Ho-Oh can use it too so it doesn't have to worry about Brave Bird recoil anymore. Contrary (if it hasn't been banned already) would be absolutely ridiculous here with all the Dragons spamming Draco Meteor. And no, you can't just switch in your Fairy - Dialga can wreck them with STAB Flash Cannon, and they won't like taking an Overheat from Reshiram one bit. It's not just the Dragons - Shaymin-S gets STAB Leaf Storm; Deoxys-A gets STAB Psycho Boost. It would be way too much IMO. And you don't need to be Stephen Hawking to figure out how broken Huge Power, Pure Power and Fur Coat would be. Personally I think we should use the same ability ban list as standard AAA.

Some sets:

Yveltal @ Life Orb
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature / Modest Nature
- Hurricane
- Focus Blast
- Dark Pulse
- Roost

Mega Pidgeot 2.0! With accuracy taken out of the equation, Hurricane is incredibly spammable. Focus Blast gets almost perfect neutral coverage with Hurricane, and also appreciated No Guard. Dark Pulse is used to 2HKO Aegislash and physically defensive Giratina and Lugia. Roost heals off Life Orb recoil, letting you throw around attacks for longer. Timid Nature makes the most of that Speed tier, while Modest can be used for more power.

Xerneas @ Leftovers
Ability: Tinted Lens
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Shame about all those bulky Fairy resists isn't it? Well not anymore. With Tinted Lens Moonblast is basically unresisted. After 1 Calm Mind, support Primal Groudon is 2HKOed most of the time after Stealth Rock by Moonblast. This set is your standard bulky booster.

Zekrom @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 136 SpA / 120 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Bolt Strike
- Outrage
- Draco Meteor
- Roost / Volt Switch

Oh sorry Groudon, did you think you could switch in and wall me? Yeah...you keep thinking that when I drop an Adaptability Draco Meteor on your face! Since Zekrom rarely uses anything other than its STABs, Adaptability is perfect for it. The Hone Claws set could use Levitate to foil Groudon I guess.

What would be some good abilities for Dialga? Levitate leaves it with only 1 rare weakness, Sheer Force can power up Flash Cannon and Fire Blast, Regenerator gives it reliable recovery.
 
Why was Aerilate banned, but not Pixilate?

Also, after looking around for a somewhat random team to make, I decided to attempt STAB boomburst Noivern. While that was banned, I think I hit gold today with this. Tell me what you think.


Mew @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyper Voice
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Earth Power
 
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Why was Aerilate banned, but not Pixilate?

Also, after looking around for a somewhat random team to make, I decided to attempt STAB boomburst Noivern. While that was banned, I think I hit gold today with this. Tell me what you think.

Mew @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyper Voice
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Earth Power
There were a lot more Pokemon broken with Aerilate, like Extreme Speed Dragonite, Boomburst Noivern, as well as any Flying-type without a reliable STAB, such as Gyarados and Landorus-T.

As for that set, I think something else could pull that kind of thing off better. Mew's Special Attack is a bit low for this kind of set.
 
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I've been wanting to get into AAA for a while now, but maybe AAA Ubers is what I've been waiting for...

I have already constructed a team (I don't know how good it is) so feel free to challenge me on PS! if you want (we can use BH for now until the ladder comes up).

e: Nevermind, looks like the ladder is up
 

xJownage

Even pendulums swing both ways
I'm genuinely curious as to why Parental Bond, Imposter, and Contrary are still legal in this metagame. This is essentially BH with these elements in the metagame, which is honestly pathetic. I wanted to play something that has a resemblance of balance. I can understand wanting to test things like Protean and Aerilate, but parental bond, imposter, and contrary are all beyond broken. If I wanted to play BH 2.0 I would just go play BH; as is this is basically BH with move restrictions because the threats are so similar.
 
Yeah, in the AAA finals that was hosted earlier today, my opponent practically had Imposter/Protean/Parental Bond/Contrary on every single one of his Pokemon (I had none on mine since I assumed all of those abilities were banned). Protean is more manageable, but Contrary on something like Rayquaza (who gets V-create, Dragon Ascent, Draco Meteor, etc.) and Parental Bond on something like Deoxys A is very abusable (especially on the ladder) and is very difficult to beat.
 
Seriously please ban Imposter. It's really tedious and MUCH harder to build imposterproofs because unlike in bh, you are limited to the mon's native movepool. Because of that, it severely limits the meta and really centralizing, as you need to build imposterproof teams with the mon's limited movepool. Same goes for Parental Bond. Parental Bond invalidates ALL other offensive ability including Adapt, Tough Claws, Sheer Force and even Protean (because it gives the same boost as Protean but gives an EXTRA Specs/Band boost to STAB moves).

The current meta is really ridiculous right now and it might drove people away from playing this meta if this condition is kept any longer.
 

The Immortal

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Alright, Kl4ng and I have decided to ban Parental Bond. Gave it a shot but it's clearly bad for the meta.

As for Imposter, it balances out Contrary/Simple/etc. We'll see if it causes more harm than good. Please post valid reasoning instead of "pathetic" and "I would just go play BH".
 
Alright, Kl4ng and I have decided to ban Parental Bond. Gave it a shot but it's clearly bad for the meta.

As for Imposter, it balances out Contrary/Simple/etc. We'll see if it causes more harm than good. Please post valid reasoning instead of "pathetic" and "I would just go play BH".
Keeping imposter in this metagame is pretty ridiculous. Saying that it balances out contrary and simple is not a very valid argument to keep imposter, because the negative effects it has on the metagame greatly overrule the somewhat positive effects it brings about by checking two abilities that will either be broken without imposter and thus be banned or not be broken without imposter; either way those two abilities should hold little influence into how imposter will influence the future of this metagame.
(If imposter is your contrary and simple check, it's a shaky, often-speed-tie-reliant check at best, and if this is the argument, then all that says is that simple and contrary are broken)

What imposter does is it basically centralizes the metagame around a few pokemon. Obviously imposterproofing is much harder in here than in BH, so 80% of the time you have to run a counter to your specified pokemon. Whereas on a normal team you have 6 pokemon that each have different functions and have synergy, in a metagame with imposter you have 4 pokemon and often at least 2 pokemon for beating imposter (at least on offense), severely hampering your ability to deal with other threats in the metagame such as Gale Wings Rayquaza and Contrary Rayquaza and Aerilate Rayquaza and Tinted Lens Rayquaza. As a result, to compress the roles, often times you're going to have to accept the fact you lose to certain things, go great lengths to innovate, or, (and this is what most people do), run standard offensive mons and run standard defensive mons to check them. As complicated of a process as this sounds, the reality is that this is what will happen in an imposter-filled meta, especially one where good walls are limited. Saying that you can control whether imposter chansey beats you is, at least in my opinion, a flawed argument, since you will usually have some teambuilding holes while imposter chansey still pulls its weight every game. The teambuilding holes chansey brings are also magnified in battles where chansey isn't present.

Basically Imposter makes for a stale metagame. Lures outside of magnet pull cores and virtually pointless because that imposter chansey knows. It's one of the single hardest things to kill since it can just come in and recover almost any time it wants as long as you're not some kind of grandmaster at double-switching.

In the end the fact is that imposter harms the metagame while doing little to help it.

You don't need imposter to check set up. Even then that's a weak argument because it only adds to the whole "metagame stays stale" thing.

(If this post didn't make it clear, I'm in full support of contrary and simple suspects if imposter does get banned.)
 
Just gonna drop some sets. there are probably better spreads but im too lazy to find them rn

Contrary
Deoxys-Attack @ Life Orb / Focus Sash
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Psycho Boost
- Superpower / Focus Blast
- Shadow Ball / Knock Off
- Extreme Speed

pretty standard contrary attacker not a lot to say. psycho boost is powerful stab that gets stronger every time you use it. Superpower lets you hit on the physical side, you can run focus if u need it to get walled by unaware bliss tho. Shadow ball provides coverage against fat psychics like ph lugia or w/e. Espeed is useful priority.
Imposter
Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Imposter
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Skill Swap
- Soft-Boiled
- Seismic Toss
- Healing Wish / Aromatherapy

imo mandatory on teams rn as it just gives counterplay to sooo much going around. Skill swap lets you bother mons behind a sub. soft boiled is recovery. seismic toss lets you break illusion and hit taunt mons behind sub. hw is really just to heal a teammate up because chansey doesnt have anything else to run. Aroma is an option to give some nice cleric support in super ultra niche situations.
Fur Coat Don
Groudon @ Leftovers
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Dragon Tail / Thunder Wave / Roar
- Stealth Rock
- Precipice Blades
- Stone Edge

Very nice rocker that beats like 90% of physical attackers in the tier. dtail lets you phaze shit, twave lets you para switchins, roar lets you phaze faries (though this set shouldnt rlly be doing that imo). sr is a great utility move and don finds tons of chances to set it up. pblades is stab so you can deal damage, stone edge hits birds like ho-oh.
Poison Heal Calm Mind
Kyogre @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 236 HP / 252 Def / 20 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Calm Mind
- Protect
- Roar

this set is fat as fuck and its basically just a great wincon overall. evs are just to hit a poison heal number. scald gives you delicious burns, cm lets you set up, tect lets you recover health, and roar lets you phaze other setup mons

Fur Coat Calm Mind
Kyogre @ Leftovers
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Calm Mind
- Sleep Talk / Roar
- Rest

This is another variant on the previous set. idk this one might be better. both pretty similar in their roles
Adapt Scarf
Hoopa-Unbound @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Trick

Takes advantage of its gr8 stab combo to be a decent rkiller with scarf. Run timid because you want to outpseed stuff like m2. Dark pulse and psyshock are obviously just stabs, focus blast is coverage for steels and such. Trick lets you cripple stuff like fur coat bliss which laughs at your psyshocks otherwise
Speed Plot
Hoopa @ Focus Sash
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psyshock
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Nasty Plot

This lets u take one hit and set up a np boosting your spatk to insane levels while also getting some speed to clean. Again worth running timid so you can outspeed arc. Moveset is similar to hoopa one for similar reasons. only major change is shadow ball>dark pulse. Its important to note that this is better on hoopa-c than hoopa-u because hoopa-c cant be rkilled by espeed giving it more potential.
 
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I honestly thought it was a joke when I found out Contrary and Impostor were legal. I already explained why Contrary is broken, but Impostor is even worse in this meta. In Balanced Hackmons, you could change a Pokemon's movepool to Impostor Proof it (like giving a Dragon type Draco Plate Judgment, for example) but you can't do that here. Impostor makes virtually all boosting sweepers unviable, and pure walls aren't great with such powerful attacks being thrown around, so all you've got left are all out attackers. AAA Ubers is a broken mess that borders on being unplayable. That isn't meta bashing, that's stating facts. You should've listened to me when I said to use the standard AAA ability bans
 
I'd rather ban both Imposter and Contrary as soon as possible instead of suspecting Contrary after banning Imposter. We all know how bad Imposter in a meta where you can't have Judgment and Recover on every mon and Contrary literally requires Imposter to beat because even Unaware users struggle with the high powered Overheats/Draco Meteors/V-creates in the meta. And again, not all mon can have Recover, so Imposter is not an excuse to keep Contrary in the meta.
 
As for that set, I think something else could pull that kind of thing off better. Mew's Special Attack is a bit low for this kind of set.
I just checked, Mew has the highest Special Attack stat (barring banned pokemon) in AAA that has the needed moves for BoltBeam + Pixilate. Gardevoir has best for Dazzling Gleam and Thunderbolt, with Refrigerate.
 

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