I'm sorry if this was posted previously, but has anyone considered Miltank? Granted having a Miltank without Milk Drink seems almost sinful, but her base defence is 105 which is great and her Special Defence has always been meh. Upping those, along with giving her Power-Up Punch and Punishment (Which I believe works with the more boosts you have), could be potentially interesting. Opting out of Punishment, you could use Scrappy, but Thick Fat would prob. give her more survivability with those two added resistances.
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Item Assault Vest
- Thread starter Magcargo
- Start date
- Status
I have weten someone use a assault vest florges IT does iets werk as spdef Will ver goed wit help from a wish blissey / chansey
Have you tried just going for a non transforming special Meloetta with u-turn? IMO, it makes a much better user of AV than its physical counterpart.
The power of punishment depends on the opponent's boosts, not your own.
Its nothing OU worthy sadly. I suppose in lower tiers AV miltank would have uses, especially with sap sipper to gain additional attack boosts.
Wigglytuff @ Assault Vest
Ability: Competitive
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Def
Modest Nature
- Dazzling Gleam
- Hyper Voice
- Fire Blast/Flamethrower
- Coverage (Thunderbolt, Psychic, Shadow Ball, Ice Beam, etc)
Somewhat gimmicky but Sticky Web makes Competitive Wigglytuff shine. Switch in, get webbed and get +2 SpA without needing a boosting move, then use your STAB moves or coverage moves. Fire Blast can OHKO the famed Aegislash.
Ability: Competitive
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Def
Modest Nature
- Dazzling Gleam
- Hyper Voice
- Fire Blast/Flamethrower
- Coverage (Thunderbolt, Psychic, Shadow Ball, Ice Beam, etc)
Somewhat gimmicky but Sticky Web makes Competitive Wigglytuff shine. Switch in, get webbed and get +2 SpA without needing a boosting move, then use your STAB moves or coverage moves. Fire Blast can OHKO the famed Aegislash.
Without any speed investment, you're running 126 speed. Even with Sticky Web, you won't be outrunning Azumarill and T-tar, but I can't think of anything else significant. This thing also have base 75 special attack, and competitive is an extremely unreliable way of boosting it.
I say we let Wigglytuff do what it does best, and that's Wish passing. In NU.
Edit: Oh, you mean opposing sticky web. And what happens if your opponent doesn't run it? Does your Wigglytuff just remain a wasted team slot for the rest of the battle?
I say we let Wigglytuff do what it does best, and that's Wish passing. In NU.
Edit: Oh, you mean opposing sticky web. And what happens if your opponent doesn't run it? Does your Wigglytuff just remain a wasted team slot for the rest of the battle?
Not disagreeing with your post, but I just thought I'd point out that Wigglytuff has base 85 Special Attack now, since it got a 10 Base Stat buff in the gen shift.
I'm looking for a physical attacking assault vest user for my team, can somebody please recommend me one ?
Right now I'm using Assault Vest Hippowdon and it's really good, I managed to net 3 kills in one game against an 1700+ user who had a Mega Lucario on his team, but the problem is that the hippo has absolutely no way to check physically defensive Rotom-W which is so popular right now thanks to Talonflame.
Right now I'm using Assault Vest Hippowdon and it's really good, I managed to net 3 kills in one game against an 1700+ user who had a Mega Lucario on his team, but the problem is that the hippo has absolutely no way to check physically defensive Rotom-W which is so popular right now thanks to Talonflame.
If you want a strong physical Assault Vest user that doesn't get stopped cold by Rotom-W, then Conkeldurr is a good bet (honestly its one of the best assault vest users in general imo). As has been mentioned multiple times in the past few pages of this thread, Conkeldurr really appreciates the special defense boost provided by Assault Vest (it can take some really strong attacks both physical and special with it equipped, and doesn't care about Assault Vest's drawback at all. Meanwhile, Conkeldurr's massive base 140 Attack stat, priority, and decent coverage let it pose a massive threat to the opposing team in return, especially since Drain Punch makes it much harder to wear down than other Assault Vest users. As for the rotom-w problem, Conkeldurr can take all of its attacks with ease thanks to the Assault Vest boost and recover the damage off with Drain Punch while doing considerable damage in return, and Burning Conkeldurr just makes it that much more powerful thanks to guts, although the 12% every turn cuts into its staying power a little bit.
Hope i helped!
I'm new to competitive battling but I want to quickly drop a couple of ideas for assault vest users here. I've tried Carracosta with decent success, though haven't tried Ludicolo yet.
First, Carracosta. I think the pros of his AV set are that he has the stats to make use of the item, with a high defense and low special defense, and he has the utility movepool to work with it. He lacks recovery however, which is a pretty big downside for what is effectively a tank, and the loss of stealth rock and shell smash hurts. This can benefit Carracosta however since most people expect him to set up with shell smash or rocks, making the opponent deal with him in a different way.
Second, Ludicolo. That may seem like an odd option, but hear me out. Yes, Ludicolo's stats are already special defense oriented, but Ludicolo has the perfect movepool and an easy way to get around his low defense.
A couple of other suggestions, though ones I know are flawed, are:
Exeggutor: Higher defense than special defense, and recovery in Giga Drain. Could be pretty solid but Exeguttor needs Hidden Power so as to not be walled by steel types, and he lacks utility moves.
Hitmonchan: The base stats are already special defense oriented, but Hitmonchan has a great moveset for the item with drain punch, priority, fake out, rapid spin and PuP.
Throh: Though it misses the recovery of the resttalk set, Throh appreciates the extra moveslot to run Knock off, Body Slam and Circle Throw, making Throh potentially an excellent choice for crippling an entire team.
Hariyama: No recovery, but a high HP and low defenses, and a movepool with Knock off, priority and Force Palm could make Hariyama pretty threatening.
First, Carracosta. I think the pros of his AV set are that he has the stats to make use of the item, with a high defense and low special defense, and he has the utility movepool to work with it. He lacks recovery however, which is a pretty big downside for what is effectively a tank, and the loss of stealth rock and shell smash hurts. This can benefit Carracosta however since most people expect him to set up with shell smash or rocks, making the opponent deal with him in a different way.
Second, Ludicolo. That may seem like an odd option, but hear me out. Yes, Ludicolo's stats are already special defense oriented, but Ludicolo has the perfect movepool and an easy way to get around his low defense.
A couple of other suggestions, though ones I know are flawed, are:
Exeggutor: Higher defense than special defense, and recovery in Giga Drain. Could be pretty solid but Exeguttor needs Hidden Power so as to not be walled by steel types, and he lacks utility moves.
Hitmonchan: The base stats are already special defense oriented, but Hitmonchan has a great moveset for the item with drain punch, priority, fake out, rapid spin and PuP.
Throh: Though it misses the recovery of the resttalk set, Throh appreciates the extra moveslot to run Knock off, Body Slam and Circle Throw, making Throh potentially an excellent choice for crippling an entire team.
Hariyama: No recovery, but a high HP and low defenses, and a movepool with Knock off, priority and Force Palm could make Hariyama pretty threatening.
I posted this on the creative sets thread but I figured I might as well post it here:
Drapion @ Assault Vest
Battle Armor
252 HP/252 SpDef/4 Def
Careful nature
-Knock Off
-Poison Fang
-Pursuit
-Earthquake/Ice Fang
Drapion is notable for being the only good user of Assault Vest with the ability to inflict Toxic. Poison Fang has been buffed in XY, so now it has a 50% of inflicting Toxic instead of 30%, making it a reliable tool for that purpose.
This combined with Drapion's overall great bulk on both sides of the spectrum and Knock Off's crippling effect, you're bound to force a lot of switches so you can deal further damage with Pursuit.
The last move is for coverage; EQ hits Lucario and Heatran while Ice Fang is mostly for Gliscor.
Drapion @ Assault Vest
Battle Armor
252 HP/252 SpDef/4 Def
Careful nature
-Knock Off
-Poison Fang
-Pursuit
-Earthquake/Ice Fang
Drapion is notable for being the only good user of Assault Vest with the ability to inflict Toxic. Poison Fang has been buffed in XY, so now it has a 50% of inflicting Toxic instead of 30%, making it a reliable tool for that purpose.
This combined with Drapion's overall great bulk on both sides of the spectrum and Knock Off's crippling effect, you're bound to force a lot of switches so you can deal further damage with Pursuit.
The last move is for coverage; EQ hits Lucario and Heatran while Ice Fang is mostly for Gliscor.
In gen V, I've been playing around with Cradily in a sandstorm team alot as some kind of SpD tank whom can switch in on water attacks, what most Sandstorm teams don't like. I thought: Let's revisit that idea, just for fun.
Little did I know I created a beast... Holy balls, Assault Vest Cradily in a sandstorm can tank hits like a madman.
Cradily @ Assault Vest
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 HP / 4 SDef (can also go pure tank with 252 HP / 252 SDef if you want with Calm nature)
Modest Nature
- Giga Drain
- Earth Power
- Ancient Power
- Infestation
To give you an idea how tanky this thing is:
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 135-164 (35.9 - 43.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4+ SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 127-151 (33.7 - 40.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 101-120 (26.8 - 31.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 112-132 (29.7 - 35.1%) -- 16.4% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4+ SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 102-120 (27.1 - 31.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 80-96 (21.2 - 25.5%) -- 0.5% chance to 4HKO
Infestation on when you can't directly kill someone, if you switched in early you get infestation + Sandstorm residue damage while being able to shrug of damage with Giga Drain. Ancient power on the guaranteed kill or obvious switch, might even get a boost. If you managed to switch in on a water attack with the 252 SAtk variant, proceed to wreck havoc. Things NEED to super effective hit you in order to kill you on the Special Defensive side, however you can deal neutral Giga Drain damage to get back health loss. I absolutely love this pokémon <3
Little did I know I created a beast... Holy balls, Assault Vest Cradily in a sandstorm can tank hits like a madman.
Cradily @ Assault Vest
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 HP / 4 SDef (can also go pure tank with 252 HP / 252 SDef if you want with Calm nature)
Modest Nature
- Giga Drain
- Earth Power
- Ancient Power
- Infestation
To give you an idea how tanky this thing is:
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 135-164 (35.9 - 43.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4+ SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 127-151 (33.7 - 40.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 101-120 (26.8 - 31.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 112-132 (29.7 - 35.1%) -- 16.4% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4+ SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 102-120 (27.1 - 31.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Cradily in Sand: 80-96 (21.2 - 25.5%) -- 0.5% chance to 4HKO
Infestation on when you can't directly kill someone, if you switched in early you get infestation + Sandstorm residue damage while being able to shrug of damage with Giga Drain. Ancient power on the guaranteed kill or obvious switch, might even get a boost. If you managed to switch in on a water attack with the 252 SAtk variant, proceed to wreck havoc. Things NEED to super effective hit you in order to kill you on the Special Defensive side, however you can deal neutral Giga Drain damage to get back health loss. I absolutely love this pokémon <3
I am jumping on this train eighty years too late but I just realized something. What would this mean for Baton Pass teams? Just imagine an Espeon with Stored Power getting all those boosts (the Acid Armors come to mind) holding an Assault Vest. I want to see the calcs that typical Special Attackers have against this thing because it seems insane on paper.
I am really late to that train, aren't I?
I am really late to that train, aren't I?
That would be a terrible way to plan a baton pass team. Espeon is one of the ideal final recipients of the snowball but it's also a vital part of the chain whenever the threat of being phazed exists. Mega Absol can't be used as that part of the chain unless you set it up before starting the snowball, which also runs the risk of stealing much needed momentum... you generally don't get too many second chances with a pass team.
Alright, it's time for me to share with you my favorite Assault Vest user that I've come across thus far.
Regirock @ Assault Vest
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Hp/252 Atk/4 Def
Adamant Nature
-Stone Edge
-Earthquake
-Fire Punch
-Drain Punch
Some notable calcs:
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Regirock: 265-315 (72.8 - 86.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Regirock: 109-129 (29.9 - 35.4%) -- 20.8% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Regirock: 204-240 (56 - 65.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Regirock: 174-206 (47.8 - 56.5%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO
Please keep in mind this is with absolutely no special defense investment. You can go bulkier for better results. These EV's aim to give Regirock high
survival along with the ability to hit things like a truck. Boasting 436 defense, and 354 special defense is nothing to scoff at (An amazing 531 in sand!).
Stone Edge, Earthquake, Fire Punch give Regirock solid coverage, allowing him to deal with a lot of big threats like Genosect, Talonflame, Gengar, Aegislash, and Alakazam to name a few. While Drain Punch gives Regirock much needed survival and longevity. This set aims to give the slow moving rock a chance to shine in OU, and take tanking literally to the next level!
Regirock @ Assault Vest
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Hp/252 Atk/4 Def
Adamant Nature
-Stone Edge
-Earthquake
-Fire Punch
-Drain Punch
Some notable calcs:
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Regirock: 265-315 (72.8 - 86.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Protean Greninja Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Regirock: 109-129 (29.9 - 35.4%) -- 20.8% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Regirock: 204-240 (56 - 65.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Regirock: 174-206 (47.8 - 56.5%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO
Please keep in mind this is with absolutely no special defense investment. You can go bulkier for better results. These EV's aim to give Regirock high
survival along with the ability to hit things like a truck. Boasting 436 defense, and 354 special defense is nothing to scoff at (An amazing 531 in sand!).
Stone Edge, Earthquake, Fire Punch give Regirock solid coverage, allowing him to deal with a lot of big threats like Genosect, Talonflame, Gengar, Aegislash, and Alakazam to name a few. While Drain Punch gives Regirock much needed survival and longevity. This set aims to give the slow moving rock a chance to shine in OU, and take tanking literally to the next level!
You know, this actually looks pretty interesting, but I'm hesitant to say it's game-changing. I'm gonna be running some calculations and below will be a list of what I find to be his matchups vs. OU threats. I did throw those 4 Def EV's into SpDef though.
- Vs. Talonflame- Regirock handily takes on Talonflame, KO'ing it with Stone Edge while taking nothing from anything Talonflame can do.
- Vs. Greninja- Hydro Pump does a minimum of 72.8% damage to this Regirock, with 252 HP/ 252 SpDef Gentle Regirock still being 2HKO'd outside of Sand (not that Regirock can really afford to not run 252 Attack an Adamant,) but Regirock also hits for 72.7% minimum with Stone Edge. Drain Punch hits equally hard if Regirock gets him on the switch, but that's not a likely scenario with Greninja. Neither can afford to switch into the other, but Greninja wins a 1-on-1 match.
- Vs. Aegislash- Notably, Regirock can "outslow," Aegislash, letting him hit Aegislash in Blade form whenever it attacks. Regirock's Earthquake OHKO's Aegislash-Blade 100% of the time, and the only common attack that OHKO's in return is a +2 Iron Head. Against boosting variants, Regirock can win if it switches in on a predicted boosting move or King's Shield if Aegislash lacks the Swords Dance + Iron Head combo. Against non-boosting sets, Regirock is still only 2HKO'd by Iron Head. This means Regirock can potentially get in and either force Aegislash out or KO it when it attacks. If Regirock outspeeds Aegislash, it can still 2HKO Aegislash-Shield, though it becomes a 3HKO if Aegislash has Leftovers. A kind of dicey match-up, overall.
- Vs. Rotom-W- With 4 SpA EV's, Rotom-W 2HKO's Regirock 49.2% of the time. Regirock threatens to 2HKO back with Stone Edge, but it's only an 11.2% chance with Leftovers factored in, and Rotom-W can always come in on a predicted Earthquake. Rotom-W can also WoW Regirock on the switch, making it too weak to be a threat. Rotom-W probably wins.
- Vs. Tyranitar- Tyranitar needs a Life Orb to possibly 2HKO Regirock with Earthquake, and Regirock easily heals off the damage with Drain Punch. This match-up is pretty heavily in Regirock's favor.
- Vs. Scizor- Fire Punch has a 93.8% chance to OHKO Scizor after Stealth Rock. Choice Band Superpower does a number on Regirock though, and Scizor is a bit faster. It depends a bit on what set Scizor is running, but Regirock can actually beat a lot of Scizor switch-ins. As seems to be a theme for Regirock though, it can't afford to switch in on much itself. Mega Scizor will likely survive a Fire Punch, making the match-up lean in his favor.
- Vs. Genesect- Fire Punch easily OHKO's Genesect, while the Choice Scarf variant fails to 2HKO with anything, really. To reliably OHKO this Regirock Genesect needs to use Flash Cannon, and even then only with a boosting item and/or +SpA nature. Since that's fairly rare, Regirock is likely to win against most Genesect.
- Vs. Heatran- Specially Defensive Heatran lost to Regirock pretty quickly, only managing 35.7% with Earth Power. Unlike Genesect though, there isn't really a Heatran variant that wins one on one. Air Balloon Heatran can take a Stone Edge or Drain Punch while Roaring it out, I guess.
- Vs. Excadrill- Both damage each other very heavily with Earthquakes, but unless Excadrill has prior damage he's gonna win by outspeeding. Excadrill also has an advantage with an Air Balloon.
- Vs. Dragonite- Stone Edge is the only way to really hurt Dragonite unless you opt for Ice Punch over Fire Punch. Ice Punch is only moderately more damaging though, and both activate Weakness Policy should you be up against that variant. Dragonite will need to get lucky with a Stone Edge miss though if he wants to win one on one.
- Vs. Azumarill- Choice Band Azumarill easily 2HKO's, while Regirock struggles to get a 2HKO with Stone Edge. They speed-tie, which can make the match-up more of a toss-up. If Azumarill holds Leftovers Regirock can no longer 2HKO it while Azumarill still 2HKO's back. As long as Azumarill doesn't do something stupid like Belly Drum while Regirock is out, he has the advantage.
- Vs. Lucario- This kind of depends on what kind of Lucario you're up against. Mega Lucario has just enough bulk to survive an Earthquake, but will likely not OHKO back with Close Combat. Regular Lucario doesn't really stand a chance, as his attacks are weaker and he can't take an Earthquake.
Also I totally meant to post about Conkeldurr but damn am I tired.
Conk easily wins the war due to resisting Stone Miss and thus evading crit hax. He can even switch in, take the best Regi has to offer, then beat him down if he stays in.
I meant in the sense that I came to the thread to talk about Conk in general. =P
Edit: Specifically, since people seem to be at a loss for how to deal with AV Conkeldurr, I wanted to go into detail about his checks and counters, but I got distracted by AV Regirock. I think AV Conk has problems with Skarmory, Mega Charizard Y (who can take any hit reasonably well and OHKO with Air Slash,) Mega Heracross (takes little from all Conk's moves,) and Mega Venusaur (tanks everything.)
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That's another good one, actually. Aerilate Return OHKO's 100% of the time. The only time the match-up isn't good is if M-Pinsir switches into SR and Ice/Thunder Punch simultaneously, which just means they've been outplayed in most cases. Otherwise M-Pinsir takes basically nothing from his STAB's and Knock Off does at most 30% without a boost from Guts or Iron Fist.
Mega Mawile is another good one, as she amazingly outspeeds standard AV Conkeldurr and OHKO's with Play Rough. She can also afford to take a hit, especially with Intimidate.
What else works other than Megas? While Mega Evolutions are great due to being unaffected by Knock Off, OHKOing or outdamaging Conkeldurr and a bunch of them being reasonably bulky/resisting STAB's, the one-Mega limit means you can only have one of those as your answer and only if you aren't using one of the other Megas.
I think it's a testament to conkeldurr's abilities that megas are one of the only ways to safely take this thing on when it wins a switch. That being said, there's one thing I fear the most when I have my conkeldurr in, more than MMawile and MSaur (and those make conk cry), and that is bulk up conkeldurr. That thing will win any fight against an AV conk, and I'm surprised I haven't seen any, since it seems just as dangerous.
Any thoughts on bulk up conkeldurr as an answer to AV Conk? and most AV users in general, actually. AV users don't have the greatest fire power so I could see them giving BU Conk the ability to set up and heal back anything they did do
Any thoughts on bulk up conkeldurr as an answer to AV Conk? and most AV users in general, actually. AV users don't have the greatest fire power so I could see them giving BU Conk the ability to set up and heal back anything they did do
BU Conk probably isn't seen as much right now because AV Conk is so stupidly durable. Being "one of the best" answers to AV Conk might not push it over the edge, since that means you can't run AV Conk yourself.
Except that Tyranitar can't use Stealth Rock while using the vest.
Now that PokeBank is (kinda) out, I really want to try an Assault Vest Lopouny set to screw with NU walls.
Lopunny @ Assault Vest
Ability: Klutz
EVs: 252 Speed / 252 HP / 4Def
Jolly Nature
- Switcharoo
- Encore
- Healing Wish
- Baton Pass
Since Klutz allows Loppy to ignore AV, she is the only Pokemon who can trick the vest onto other Pokemon. This will immediately neuter any wall. The rest of the moves allow Lopunny to not be dead weight after she has done her job and allows her to support a bulky offensive or hyper offensive team.
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