BH Balanced Hackmons

You omitted Sandstream, so since you are using Galvanize - and not Electric Terrain, would actually be:

252 SpA Galvanize Manectric-Mega Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Aerodactyl-Mega in Sand: 308-366 (84.6 - 100.5%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

Thanks Rumors, I appreciate your feedback, and your choice of wording: informative, and friendly.
Thank you.

But note that I actually did include both Sand and Terrain (assuming teammate as a setter, since Sand Force Aero would need a setter and I'm not about to try to determine whether Sand Force or Sand Stream Aero is more viable or common). The calculator won't display them in the calculation because, in this instance, they cancel each other out. Not something I agree with since it can be confusing (and I thought about manually adding them into the calculation), but... I didn't program the thing. It's weird, but try it for yourself if you have any doubts.
 

Champion Leon

Banned deucer.
Thank you.

But note that I actually did include both Sand and Terrain (assuming teammate as a setter, since Sand Force Aero would need a setter and I'm not about to try to determine whether Sand Force or Sand Stream Aero is more viable or common). The calculator won't display them in the calculation because, in this instance, they cancel each other out. Not something I agree with since it can be confusing (and I thought about manually adding them into the calculation), but... I didn't program the thing. It's weird, but try it for yourself if you have any doubts.
I think canceling out is inaccurate. Imagine if something has 100 Defense and a Move has 100 Base power.

If increasing your defense by x2 (Fur Coat) halves Damage (-50% damage), then we know that increasing defense by 50% effectively removes a quarter (-25%). (You reduce by half as much because you increased by half as much).

While increasing base power by 50% (Terrain) effectively adds exactly 50% Base Damage.

Thus if you have Sandstream up to reduce 25% damage from special attacks from 50% boosted base power, you effectively cut 150 to 3/4 or 112.5%. Thus they don’t negate, the damage boost still provides 12.5% more damage.

Nevertheless, Aero is a Nuke.

Head Smash breaks walls, 225 x 1.3 x 1.5 = 438.5 Base Power with Choice Band and Sand Force.

Diancie-Mega is also fairly fast but packs almost as much power as Tyranitar. Might be a useful middle ground between power and Speed (Aero can afford to go Adamant, while Diancie-Mega needs to stay Jolly).
 

cityscapes

Take care of yourself.
is a Tiering Contributoris a Community Contributor Alumnus
hey i wrote the xurk analysis. now originally, i made it modest, but the qc team said timid so there you go. either way it doesn't matter because timid still ohkos aerodactyl in sand anyway:

252 SpA Galvanize Xurkitree Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Aerodactyl-Mega in Sand: 372-440 (102.1 - 120.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

if something increases your defense by 50%, it's a x1.5 boost, or x3/2. this means that attacks do two thirds the normal damage to you, or one third less (33%).

aerodactyl absolutely cannot afford to run adamant because it needs to outspeed threats like mmy, mscept, and beedrill.

scarf xurk is a bad set because the whole draw of using xurkitree in the first place is really strong electric moves, which some teams aren't prepared for. scarf doesn't break any defensive teams. plus, the only mon i can think of that scarf xurk actually ohkos is mega ray (with ice beam) and maybe mega diancie or something. stuff like mmy and mmx easily take a hit and ohko back.
 
I think canceling out is inaccurate. Imagine if something has 100 Defense and a Move has 100 Base power.




If you think the calculator is being inaccurate in these regards, you discuss it with the people responsible for coding the calculator and/or the simulator. Telling me won't do any good. This is what the calculator is spitting out.

...Although comparing the two with sand/terrain up and down, it does result in 2% less damage with no field conditions. Checking it with BH EVs and Galvuburst results in .5% higher damage for Boomburst with field effects up. So... effectively cancel out.

And before anyone comments, the calc in my image is not relevant to BH. Just using it to show the calculator weirdness.
 

a loser

I'm a loser, baby, so why don't you kill me?
is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
Beedrill typically has Focus Sash, and Sceptile-M isn’t too common.

MMY I agree it should outrun, but if that’s the only frequently used one, then perhaps you can run Adamant at 399 speed and still serve the purpose of outspeeding M-Gar, etc. for hitting everything else harder.

Anyways, it wasn’t about the KO, just for the point about the tone. ;)
I know it isn’t up to you, just going over what I thought the Calcs would be. I have used the Calcs and saw the effects canceled out myself. No need to defer me to them Rumors ;(
I haven't looked at usage stats lately, but I would gamble and say that most competent Beedrill users do not run focus sash. I normally see choice band or life orb on good Beedrill sets.
 
I haven't looked at usage stats lately, but I would gamble and say that most competent Beedrill users do not run focus sash. I normally see choice band or life orb on good Beedrill sets.
It's ok fam I looked at the stats on your behalf.
Screen Shot 2018-06-21 at 17.43.20.png


Regardless that's still a pretty bad excuse to justify adamant aero. Just like any excuse you could come up with to justify running adamant aero. Just don't run adamant aero and you won't have to make up bad excuses, as simple as that.
 

Champion Leon

Banned deucer.
It's ok fam I looked at the stats on your behalf.
View attachment 123156

Regardless that's still a pretty bad excuse to justify adamant aero. Just like any excuse you could come up with to justify running adamant aero. Just don't run adamant aero and you won't have to make up bad excuses, as simple as that.
1/6 uses isn’t that low.

To correct you, I didn’t have a bad excuse, the damage Calcs I provided were 1HKOs due to an Adamant Nature, with Jolly they don’t achieve the same results.

I called it a Wall Breaker not a sweeper breaker. Afterall, what is switching into Aerodactyl-Mega? Walls, not other sweepers that get KOed or outsped, unless you slow pivots into priority sweepers like Kyurem-B that will go first regardless.

Again here are the Calcs:
Aerodactyl-Mega breaks walls, like literally 1HKOs them.

Damage Calcs: *Note After means - I included the -18.75% Damage from Stealth Rocks + Sandstream; set HP at 81% holding Safety Goggles
252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Diamond Storm vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lugia in Sand: 432-510 (103.8 - 122.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Audino-Mega in Sand: 322-380 (78.5 - 92.6%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after including Sandstream and Stealth Rocks damage

252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Precipice Blades vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Registeel in Sand: 340-402 (93.4 - 110.4%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

For a Nuke:
252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Arceus in Sand: 375-442 (84.4 - 99.5%) -- 100% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and sandstorm damage

252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Giratina in Sand: 375-442 (74.4 - 87.6%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after factoring in Stealth Rocks and Sandstream damage (81.25% HP)
Needing a Nature for a KO is a good reason to use that Nature. Further, most people would expect Jolly and would assume that they need to send in something else. They don’t usually see Adamant so this would only benefit you. It’s not like the nature reveals itself when it switches in.

Lastly, motherlove cut the tone, you don’t have an excuse for that... not even a bad one. thanks
 
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I would highly suggest running Jolly or any speed boosting nature on any fast offensive mon as the amount of mons you lose on far outweighs the extra power. The only mons you run Ada or Modest are bulky stuff or fast set up including Pogre, Pdon, Gigas, Xern. Most notably, running Jolly can let you clean, which is arguably its niche over something bulkier like TTar or something with more diversity and coverage like Diancie. Ada lets you get rked by MMY (which can actually switch in to ada with some hax) and Scept as well as some scarfers. After all, Aero's niche is that speed tier and decent power. Another point about this interesting set is how would you improof? With Edge Quake and Sunsteel there aren't that many, fur coats that resist steel can as can levitate steels but.
252 Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Mewtwo-Mega-Y Bolt Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Aerodactyl-Mega: 432-510 (118.6 - 140.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Diamond Storm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y in Sand: 354-417 (85 - 100.2%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (I used secondary ground typing as well as doubling DStorm base power to account for sand damage)
This is the only OHKO that mmy and scept get. But if you are wallbreaking and clicking head smash you are taking a heck ton of recoil so from there basically any set rks.
 
Venusaur-Mega @ Leftovers
Ability: Triage
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Giga Drain
- Oblivion Wing
- Rapid Spin
- Toxic

Alakazam-Mega @ Focus Sash
Ability: Contrary
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psycho Boost
- Overheat
- Fleur Cannon
- Destiny Bond

Tyranitar-Mega @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
- Head Smash
- Stealth Rock
- Spore
- Brave Bird

Aerodactyl-Mega (F) @ Rockium Z
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Toxic
- Topsy-Turvy
- Diamond Storm
- Power Trip

Rayquaza-Mega @ Assault Vest
Ability: Mega Launcher
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Lonely Nature
- Extreme Speed
- Dragon Pulse
- Aura Sphere
- Fake Out

Aggron-Mega @ Big Root
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Aqua Ring
- Infestation
- Leech Seed
- Cosmic Power

MY TEAM ^^^
 

Pikachuun

the entire waruda machine
MY TEAM ^^^
i'm sorry but
why
what is the improof to anything i can just send in Imposter and beat 90% of your team regardless of what it is i send it in on lmao (DBond as a trade is a bad excuse and depends heavily on 50/50s)

first off, Venu's special attack is very lackluster in the meta by comparison to everything else and appreciates a Flash Fire set a lot more than what you're running, it's the only reason i'd see Rapid Spin on it making sense besides something like MBounce; if you really do wanna run a Triage set, why not put it on MRay to take advantage of that Oblivion Wing STAB rather than Giga Drain?

why are you running Alakazam at all? MMY is far superior to it in every aspect, switch it out for that, this also is heavily imposter weak because if you can't get the DBond off due to either speed ties or other factors your team just instantly loses to it

On the other hand, TTar is an ok mon but its potential isn't truly reached with the set it has, you're far better off taking advantage of its ability to beat that Psychic user you have on your team (side note but Magic Guard is an ability and it is always superior to Rock Head, please run that instead on your future teams)

M-Aero is really redundant on this team considering TTar exists, if anything it'd be a better Magic Guard abuser than TTar but I digress (at least you're running Jolly), Speed Booost is a similarly redundant ability and any hazer/topsy-turvy cteams it

Why are you running Fake Out/Extremespeed on a non-Aerilate MRay? There's no reason it loses a massive amount of power without it. Mega Launcher isn't really worthwile over the other abilities MRay can utilize (Triage, Aerilate, even Contrary to an extent)

M-Aggron is ok and it has Magic Bounce which is a step in the right direction, but outclassed unless you have a specific niche you want to run on it, typically Registeel, Celesteela, and Aegislash are the goto steels (Magearna also has its uses, same with M-Steelix and this one but those are more niche). The set however is terrible, and I would change it to a more support-oriented role

to keep things as consistent with your original idea as possible yet still have them be viable on ladder, here are my overall suggestions

Triage M-Venu > Triage M-Ray
basically just a straight upgrade, don't run Giga Drain on it though
an example set for Triage M-Ray is Tail Glow / Oblivion Wing / Spore / Substitute or Core Enforcer or Moongeist Beam
Moongeist Beam lets M-TTar serve as an answer if you want to do that, Core Enforcer lets the Steel-type serve as one instead, Substitute is sometimes helpful for improofing. You could also run something like Secret Sword, but make the steel Aegislash if you do so.
you can also put your Z move on here (Flyingium Z) for a sick Supersonic Skystrike that hits like a truck, harder than your Aero's ever will

Contrary M-Alakazam > Contrary MMY
similar set, but run Pixie Plate Judgment instead of Fleur Cannon. 4th move can be Destiny Bond, but I'd recommend something else unless you're really partial to it. Overheat + Psycho Boost already hits a lot, plus this allows the 3rd mon to have a bit more utility...
just don't run anything else to hit TTar besides that Judgment I just mentioned, otherwise it defeats the point of running it

Current M-TTar > Poison Heal / Regenerator + Assault Vest / Sand Stream M-TTar
either of these choices will allow your TTar to serve as an answer to MMY in different ways. PH allows for more reliable recovery, RegenVest as well but it gives it some nice special bulk, and Sand Stream to accomplish something similar to RegenVest but instead of getting healing on the switch, it gets more Shore Up recovery
the point of this is to serve as a reliable answer to MMY, so don't go full ham on offense, U-Turn allows TTar to serve as a slow pivot, Knock Off is nice for getting rid of items and Pursuit can help with Imposter, but don't forget about potentially useful things like Shore Up, Will-o-Wisp (run this on Poison Heal only please), and even keeping Stealth Rock (or throwing Rapid Spin on there) can be a boon. RegenVest also likes Spectral Thief so feel free to run that if you have the room
with Poison Heal, though, you can run a Shift Gear set (Knock Off / Sacred Fire OR Diamond Storm / Spore OR Spiky Shield OR Leech Seed) that works relatively well, which probably is more up your alley if you choose to run Poison Heal tbh

M-Aerodactyl > Some Bulky Prankster
a bunch of options here, such as Giratina (don't run if you're running Aegislash in the below), Audino-Mega, Xerneas, just depends on what you think you want. basically if something is fast and setting up all over you, send this out (probably)
pick the moves accordingly, Prankster loves slow pivoting with U-turn as well as Recover/clone, Destiny Bond is risky (but knowing you you'll pick it), Haze is quite oftentimes a very good setup answer, you can even run stuff like Nuzzle, Knock Off, Core Enforcer, Parting Shot instead of U-turn, Stealth Rock/Spikes depending on if TTar already has it, just depends on what you want it to do (note that Xerneas can also run Moonblast since it does ok chip)

Launcher M-Ray > idk probably Imposter
if you're in doubt slap an Imposter Chansey on the team that usually works
you should run Fake Out / Whirlwind / filler moves depending on Eviolite vs Choice Scarf on it since the moves only matter if you don't transform (which can happen)

Bounce Aggron-Mega > Bounce basically any other steel
like I said before, Registeel, Celesteela, and Aegislash(-Shield) > M-Aggron in almost every scenario, so use those instead
make them support the team! don't just have them try to stall, sure you should keep moves like Recover/any clone but Rapid Spin/Defog support is crucial to the relatively offensive nature of the team. you could also run things like Topsy-Turvy to have an almost perfect Regigigas/Slaking answer, Spectral Thief for other things, Entrainment to force Poison Heal users to switchthe list goes on. pivoting options are Baton Pass (more PP) and U-turn.

bit of a wall but yea i'm pretty sure you're new so there you go have fun
 

Champion Leon

Banned deucer.
I would highly suggest running Jolly or any speed boosting nature on any fast offensive mon as the amount of mons you lose on far outweighs the extra power. The only mons you run Ada or Modest are bulky stuff or fast set up including Pogre, Pdon, Gigas, Xern. Most notably, running Jolly can let you clean, which is arguably its niche over something bulkier like TTar or something with more diversity and coverage like Diancie. Ada lets you get rked by MMY (which can actually switch in to ada with some hax) and Scept as well as some scarfers. After all, Aero's niche is that speed tier and decent power. Another point about this interesting set is how would you improof? With Edge Quake and Sunsteel there aren't that many, fur coats that resist steel can as can levitate steels but.
252 Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Mewtwo-Mega-Y Bolt Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Aerodactyl-Mega: 432-510 (118.6 - 140.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Diamond Storm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y in Sand: 354-417 (85 - 100.2%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (I used secondary ground typing as well as doubling DStorm base power to account for sand damage)
This is the only OHKO that mmy and scept get. But if you are wallbreaking and clicking head smash you are taking a heck ton of recoil so from there basically any set rks.
But doesn’t your point just mean that even at Adamant it isn’t a 1HKO, therefore outspeeding MMY with Jolly won’t KO it, and therefore you have 1 less reason to go Jolly?

Jolly:
252 Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Diamond Storm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y in Sand: 322-381 (77.4 - 91.5%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and sandstorm damage

Why use a Ground Typing in your Calcs and why double Diamond Storm’s base power? Just use the actual calc:
EEEB94F6-5B84-4911-A269-B87343B5DADA.jpeg

Anyways here is the % of winning with Adamant:
252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Diamond Storm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y in Sand: 355-418 (85.3 - 100.4%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and sandstorm damage

Also for Imposterproof I like Ferrothorn:
252 Atk Ferrothorn Gyro Ball (150 BP) vs. +1 252 HP / 252 Def Aerodactyl-Mega: 230-272 (32.6 - 38.6%) -- 99.3% chance to 3HKO

*i gave it Chansey’s Base HP, and +1 to account for Eviolite. Also it can Prankster Spore, and can sit there and stall.

Whereas:
252+ Atk Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Precipice Blades vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn in Sand: 114-135 (32.3 - 38.3%) -- 1.8% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

*Remember, Imposter doesn’t copy Choice Band...

Mind you, that’s with a neutral Defense nature, and not Fur Coat. Plus, since it would be on my Sandstorm team, it would carry Shore Up to go with Prankster Spore...

They make a great pairing since Ferro can switch into Rock, Electric, Water, Ice, Steel... Spore, Toxic, literally all of its weaknesses.

Aero can switch into (Special) Fire moves.

Head Smash is a last resort, sorta like how people use Final Gambit to take down walls, or Destiny Bond to take down sweepers.
Head Smash only does a % of the damage dealt. And as you can see in the Giratina Calc (reposted here for convenience), it will actually be able to do it multiple times unlike a successful Final Gambit or Destiny Bond.

252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Giratina in Sand: 375-442 (74.4 - 87.6%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and sandstorm damage

*Factor in 6.25% Sandstream Damage and Stealth Rock (and it’s really 93.15% minimum Damage- Leftovers would heal after Sandstorm).

(51.5 - 60.7% recoil damage)

I disagree with diancie’s Versatility, as the only moveslots for a Sand Force Set would be 1 with Sunsteel Strike, Diamond Storm, and Precipice Blades, and Play Rough (to differentiate it from Aero).

Only going mixed, would Diancie-Mega have versatility, but again it would need 3 Rock, Steel, and Ground moves on a Sand Force Set, and only 1 moveslot for Fairy. So unless it goes Weather Ball, Earth Power, Sunsteel Strike and Moon Blast, I don’t see it going mixed, at least not with the Sand Force Ability.

I heard some people run their specs Ray timid, crazy I know.
It can’t afford to be slower than its counters, like Magic Guard Diancie, so yes it must be Timid. But Mewtwo (without Sheer Force Bolt Strike) as Chessking345 mentioned, won’t be able to 1HKO always Aero, regardless of Speed, and Aero can’t for sure Guarantee 1HKO MMY. The answer is to not have Aero fight MMY, because it will take a hit before it KOs MMY and you would rather just send in a Counter to MMY than take a heavy hit before KOing first if Jolly.
Only Head Smash KOs MMY; and I would rather use that to KO a wall.


TLDR- Sand Force Choice Band Mega-Aero is the Choice Specs Mega Launcher Ash-Greninja of Sand Teams. Both have 399 Speed, weather boosted moves, and just enough power to justify using over their bulkier counterparts.

I think discovering it’s Sand Force Power will make it an essential part of any Sand team that needs to justify not using another weather.
 
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But doesn’t your point just mean that even at Adamant it isn’t a 1HKO, therefore outspeeding MMY with Jolly won’t KO it, and therefore you have 1 less reason to go Jolly? (1)

Jolly:
252 Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Diamond Storm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y in Sand: 322-381 (77.4 - 91.5%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and sandstorm damage

Why use a Ground Typing in your Calcs and why double Diamond Storm’s base power? Just use the actual calc:
View attachment 123402

Anyways here is the % of winning with Adamant:
252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Diamond Storm vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y in Sand: 355-418 (85.3 - 100.4%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and sandstorm damage

Also for Imposterproof I like Ferrothorn:
252 Atk Ferrothorn Gyro Ball (150 BP) vs. +1 252 HP / 252 Def Aerodactyl-Mega: 230-272 (32.6 - 38.6%) -- 99.3% chance to 3HKO (2)

*i gave it Chansey’s Base HP, and +1 to account for Eviolite. Also it can Prankster Spore, and can sit there and stall.

Whereas:
252+ Atk Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Precipice Blades vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn in Sand: 114-135 (32.3 - 38.3%) -- 1.8% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

*Remember, Imposter doesn’t copy Choice Band...

Mind you, that’s with a neutral Defense nature, and not Fur Coat. Plus, since it would be on my Sandstorm team, it would carry Shore Up to go with Prankster Spore...

They make a great pairing since Ferro can switch into Rock, Electric, Water, Ice (3), Steel... Spore, Toxic, literally all of its weaknesses.

Aero can switch into (Special) Fire moves.

Head Smash is a last resort, sorta like how people use Final Gambit to take down walls, or Destiny Bond to take down sweepers.
Head Smash only does a % of the damage dealt. And as you can see in the Giratina Calc (reposted here for convenience), it will actually be able to do it multiple times unlike a successful Final Gambit or Destiny Bond.

252+ Atk Choice Band Sand Force Aerodactyl-Mega Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Giratina in Sand: 375-442 (74.4 - 87.6%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and sandstorm damage (4)

*Factor in 6.25% Sandstream Damage and Stealth Rock (and it’s really 93.15% minimum Damage- Leftovers would heal after Sandstorm).

(51.5 - 60.7% recoil damage)

I disagree with diancie’s Versatility, as the only moveslots for a Sand Force Set would be 1 with Sunsteel Strike, Diamond Storm, and Precipice Blades, and Play Rough (to differentiate it from Aero).

Only going mixed, would Diancie-Mega have versatility, but again it would need 3 Rock, Steel, and Ground moves on a Sand Force Set, and only 1 moveslot for Fairy. So unless it goes Weather Ball, Earth Power, Sunsteel Strike and Moon Blast, I don’t see it going mixed, at least not with the Sand Force Ability.

It can’t afford to be slower than its counters(5), like Magic Guard Diancie, so yes it must be Timid. But Mewtwo (without Sheer Force Bolt Strike) as Chessking345 mentioned, won’t be able to 1HKO always Aero, regardless of Speed, and Aero can’t for sure Guarantee 1HKO MMY. The answer is to not have Aero fight MMY, because it will take a hit before it KOs MMY and you would rather just send in a Counter to MMY than take a heavy hit before KOing first if Jolly.
Only Head Smash KOs MMY; and I would rather use that to KO a wall.


TLDR- Sand Force Choice Band Mega-Aero is the Choice Specs Mega Launcher Ash-Greninja of Sand Teams. Both have 399 Speed, weather boosted moves, and just enough power to justify using over their bulkier counterparts. (6)

I think discovering it’s Sand Force Power will make it an essential part of any Sand team that needs to justify not using another weather.
As always, follow numbers on the quoted text.
1) The main reason one should use Aerodatcyl is its speed. Without Jolly it is outspeed by MMY and it loses a lot of value. Also, because it can be faster than MMY, Aerodatcyl actually scares away MMY. If it doesn't outspeed then it can't even revenge kill MMY. SF variants simply OHKO Aero with bolt strike, while contrary would boost on hitting and overpower aero at +2. A jolly one would at least severely damage MMY.
2) Use anchor shot, so you trap imposter and it doesn't annoy you anymore. Damage dealt is irrelevant if you can beat it 100% of the times. Gyro ball also has only 8 pp.
3) Scarf -ate Kyu-b strongly disagrees; OHKO and outspeeds aero and 2hkoes best case scenario ferrothorn.
4) How many times does tina takes that much damage? Between googles negating sand, fur coat, prankster heal (an possibly shore up so it heals even more), beak blast last ditch effort, and hands down missing the target (80% isn't nice), head smash doesn't to much. Not to mention that ziggy walls this set so easily it makes aero cry.
5) Diancie is not a counter to specs ray. By definition, a counter must be able to switch into what it is supposed to counter and win every time, unless really bad hax. Diancie takes 70% from boomburst and it cannot switch well on Ray, so it isn't a counter (even with sand up it's a 2hko with SR up). So call it a check.
6) They are not justified as they require mandatory team support to function properly meanwhile their counterparts do not. Any reasonable team builder would pick the less restrictive options when choosing what to use.

And all in all, why don't you just use Adaptability/Tough Claws/Sheer Force so you don't have to rely on weather? Weather doesn't last forever and it gets erased by the occasional Primal don, or Primordial sea Celesteela being a common answer to pdon, meanwhile adapt does more damage (sightly, ok), tough claws works on every type (but only on contact, which are plentiful anyway) and sheer force lets you use a free life orb so that it doesn't lock you into one move.
 

Champion Leon

Banned deucer.
As always, follow numbers on the quoted text.
1) The main reason one should use Aerodatcyl is its speed. Without Jolly it is outspeed by MMY and it loses a lot of value. Also, because it can be faster than MMY, Aerodatcyl actually scares away MMY. If it doesn't outspeed then it can't even revenge kill MMY. SF variants simply OHKO Aero with bolt strike, while contrary would boost on hitting and overpower aero at +2. A jolly one would at least severely damage MMY.
2) Use anchor shot, so you trap imposter and it doesn't annoy you anymore. Damage dealt is irrelevant if you can beat it 100% of the times. Gyro ball also has only 8 pp.
3) Scarf -ate Kyu-b strongly disagrees; OHKO and outspeeds aero and 2hkoes best case scenario ferrothorn.
4) How many times does tina takes that much damage? Between googles negating sand, fur coat, prankster heal (an possibly shore up so it heals even more), beak blast last ditch effort, and hands down missing the target (80% isn't nice), head smash doesn't to much. Not to mention that ziggy walls this set so easily it makes aero cry.
5) Diancie is not a counter to specs ray. By definition, a counter must be able to switch into what it is supposed to counter and win every time, unless really bad hax. Diancie takes 70% from boomburst and it cannot switch well on Ray, so it isn't a counter (even with sand up it's a 2hko with SR up). So call it a check.
6) They are not justified as they require mandatory team support to function properly meanwhile their counterparts do not. Any reasonable team builder would pick the less restrictive options when choosing what to use.

And all in all, why don't you just use Adaptability/Tough Claws/Sheer Force so you don't have to rely on weather? Weather doesn't last forever and it gets erased by the occasional Primal don, or Primordial sea Celesteela being a common answer to pdon, meanwhile adapt does more damage (sightly, ok), tough claws works on every type (but only on contact, which are plentiful anyway) and sheer force lets you use a free life orb so that it doesn't lock you into one move.
1) I know the value it brings to outspeeding. My focus is on the power it loses to hitting everything else.
2) That’s a good point, and it would work well with Prankster Spore.
3) Prankster Spore outspeeds Scarf -ate Kyurem-B using anything but Extreme Speed...
4) Ziggy is irrelevant to the Calcs. Ziggy walls a lot so it doesn’t mean a sweeper is bad, people would even use Galvanize PDon and Zekrom and their main attacks did 0% damage and a dragon or coverage move. Ziggy should be considered for sweepers, but if a sweeper can hit many other things hard then you can just focus on the majority of its targets and not just Ziggy.
5) Fair enough, but without SR, I guess it is under Sandstorm. Could be called either way.
6) Again, my point was relative to weather teams to begin with. I said Mega—Aero was a Choice for people looking to justify Sandstream instead of other weathers. I didn’t say to slap it on any team. Same with Shedinja needing hazard team support to function. A team built with it in mind can make it more useful compared to others.

Your final point doesn’t consider that these moves are all boosted by 1 ability, that was the only reason. Otherwise If I just wanted Head Smash I would use Magic Guard.
 

E4 Flint

-inactive in BH due corrupt leader-
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Thought I'd post here and give a revive as well, with an idea I've been throwing around from an NU game I saw quite a while ago

The main purposes of this core are:
  • The key idea here is to use Liquid Ooze's interaction with Strength Sap (lowers HP instead of increases) and then Unaware ignores the attack drops from Pursuit and allow it to defeat Chansey
  • Offensively check some PH special setup mons, potentially Oblivion Wing MegaRay and this as well:
    252 SpA Spooky Plate Gengar-Mega Judgment vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 336-396 (80.7 - 95.1%)
  • Yveltal is also a check for Oblivion Wing as Ray is forced to use that over EP or Moongeist
  • Leech Seed is helpful for recovery, shed etc and if bounced, the opponent loses HP
I'm still trying to perfect the actual sets since I'm not fully satisfied with them. Other ideas I've had are:
  • change M2y to have Ice Beam which will help it take on Megaray and most other sets better e.g. Celesteela
  • change M2Y to Gengar Mega with Moongeist and Ice Beam instead, and improof with Gyarados or something else

The problem is, it kinda takes the wind from the sails of using Liquid Ooze. Also, Unaware sweeper could just have trapping built in like some of my old sets and Liquid Ooze is not really even required. Another ability besides Unaware could be used as well.

Overall, just theorymonning for fun and decided to share the first draft of the idea. Unfortunately, I don't have replays of my initial tests but I was able to KO chansey pretty easily using the Str Sap + Pursuit combination.

E: got one replay here with a lot of action from Yveltal with Leech + Pursuit, and Liquid Ooze Leech Seed from their Chansey led to killing their Shed which gave me the thought of even opening up ww strategies
 
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Thought I'd post here and give a revive as well, with an idea I've been throwing around from an NU game I saw quite a while ago

The main purposes of this core are:
  • The key idea here is to use Liquid Ooze's interaction with Strength Sap (lowers HP instead of increases) and then Unaware ignores the attack drops from Pursuit and allow it to defeat Chansey
  • Offensively check some PH special setup mons, potentially Oblivion Wing MegaRay and this as well:
    252 SpA Spooky Plate Gengar-Mega Judgment vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 336-396 (80.7 - 95.1%)
  • Yveltal is also a check for Oblivion Wing as Ray is forced to use that over EP or Moongeist
  • Leech Seed is helpful for recovery, shed etc and if bounced, the opponent loses HP
I'm still trying to perfect the actual sets since I'm not fully satisfied with them. Other ideas I've had are:
  • change M2y to have Ice Beam which will help it take on Megaray and most other sets better e.g. Celesteela
  • change M2Y to Gengar Mega with Moongeist and Ice Beam instead, and improof with Gyarados or something else

The problem is, it kinda takes the wind from the sails of using Liquid Ooze. Also, Unaware sweeper could just have trapping built in like some of my old sets and Liquid Ooze is not really even required. Another ability besides Unaware could be used as well.

Overall, just theorymonning for fun and decided to share the first draft of the idea. Unfortunately, I don't have replays of my initial tests but I was able to KO chansey pretty easily using the Str Sap + Pursuit combination.

E: got one replay here where Liquid Ooze Leech Seed from their Chansey led to killing their Shed which gave me the thought of even opening up ww strategies
Just listing optimization benchmarks.
First and foremost, I'd slash Strength Sap on Leech Seed since bouncers are gonna take so much damage. Example right here. You can spam strength sap since not even tina lives 2 of them, accounting the attack drop, so they either switch out or they die.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7balancedhackmons-768754024
This sadly means you can't safely use it on imposter, but it's still an option. Unless trapping, then running double recovery + trap might work).
Then, running 15 IV, 0 EV and -def on MMY means imposter is guaranteed ohkoed after Liquid Ooze with neutral natured Pursuit.
Alternatively, by removing Black Glasses and running +Atk, we can achieve the same ohko, this time even with 6 extra IV on def.
If running +atk, yveltal OHKOes everything with less than 97 base HP with reversed sap. Most walls die with neutral attack anyway, and is thus not necessary.
And as a side note, the uncommon pikachu imposter dies immediately.

But all in all the trick doesn't end in Yveltal. In case of strenght sap, the higher the attack the better it gets reversed. Mega Gyarados can OHKO tina after stealth rock when running +atk.
In case of recovery attacking moves, it's not going to consistenly revenge kill, given that said moves do not restore that much health (best is 75% of damage dealt). It will discourage their use, but it's not going to be as devastating as sap is.
 
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While I really like Liquid Ooze, it seems to be a better ability on something like Mustacho mentioned or on a trapping set so people can't simply switch out of the seeds. And on something really bulky and difficult to force out so, if seeds get bounced, you can remain in to torment the opponent (although with all the wall breakers running around, filling that second criteria is... hard).

For the core itself, I think that particular core would be better served with Magic Bounce Yveltal and any non-Mold Breaker Mewtwo. I can't think of many situations where I personally would want to stay in to Strength Sap when both my attacks won't hit the opponent in front of me anyway. Bounce would have more practical applications and general use than Liquid Ooze either way. Ticking off Triage M-Ray is really cool though and using Liquid Ooze to improof that set might be a better option since this core seems a bit convoluted to function efficiently and its unique attributes seem to mostly catch edge-case situations, such as Y-two not being able to check Smash Gengar if it's been chipped or Gengar is running Moongeist.
 

Champion Leon

Banned deucer.
What about this:
Entrain your Magic Bounce, and then Leech Seed, followed by a Baton Pass to a Liquid Oozer like Zygarde-Complete so your Leech Seed carries on to your recipient. Endlessly heal with Shore Up as they take damage. You can stack with Infestation to trap. Suddenly they take endless 25% passive damage each turn.

But in general; is Bad Dreams comparable without as much team support?
Lovely Kiss/Spore + Bad Dreams + Infestation = 25%, while trapping. Sleep keeps you safe, and prevents any pHaze (Dragon Tail) or switching out moves like U-Turn. A user like M-Sceptile is immune to Leech Seed + Spore, and can take advantage of its immunities to avoid Magic Bouncers/Imposters, and often go first. Bad Dreams impacts Comatose, which blocks Entrain and any status.
As a side note: Another way to block Sap Sipper (Imposterproof), could also come via Prankster Dark Types, and works especially well with low HP Pokémon like Sabeleye-M, where even an opponent with moderate Attack (or already affected but Sap Sipper) can heal a lot, but Imposter cannot.

Not a proposed set, just an idea:
Hoopa-U: Shell Smash, Photon Geyser, Encore/Me First, Nature Power = Imposterproof, Unawareproof.
Misty Terrain turns Nature Power into Moonblast, so Prankster Haze Giratina/Zygarde, etc. are outspeed and 1HKOed.

Encore is for set-up (Misty Terrain blocks Spore), while Me-First can work as priority against the foe such as Draco Meteor Contrary Necrozma-U / M-Sceptile, Precipice Blades PDon, etc.

Cals Vs Tina
+2 252+ SpA Life Orb Hoopa-Unbound Nature Power vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Giratina: 502-593 (99.6 - 117.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

+2 252+ SpA Life Orb Hoopa-Unbound Nature Power vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Giratina: 458-541 (90.8 - 107.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
Calcs Vs Zygarde:
+2 252+ SpA Life Orb Hoopa-Unbound Nature Power vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 590-697 (92.7 - 109.5%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
 
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Pikachuun said:
bit of a wall but yea i'm pretty sure you're new so there you go have fun
First of all, I really want to say thank you. This has really improved this team, along with a boost of team-making skills for the future. In general I am happy with how the team ended up as. A more bulky, yet still offensive team. Much more powerful than before.

However, when testing it I found that it is majorly weak (or at least for me) to VoltTurn. This was a big problem for me and I am not sure how to counter it. The strategy was quite basic: all of the opponents Pokemon had either, Volt Switch or U-Turn and repeated the moves to chip away damage. In addition, much of them also had high-damaging moves, hard to switch into. If you have any tips for me, or any more changes to this team, please try to help me out!

For my team I trusted you with the options you gave me. However, I added a little of my own desires. It seemed to work against certain strategies, and definitely wasn't a 'bad' choice.

For the M-Ray, it was quite simple to just do exactly what you told me. The Secret Sword was a great addition, and overall the Pokemon was handy, but I didn't see any chance to use Tail Glow. If you know the right tactic for this moveset, let me know.

M-Mewtwo Y is a strong special sweeper. But the team was missing some physical attack so I changed the extra slot to Superpower, which also counters Dark-types. At first I had Taunt - although when I used it it was easy to take half of my health, and then the rest on the second move.

There is nothing to say about the Tyranitar, really. So, let's move onto the Prankster! An unusual choice you may think, nevertheless my preferred bulk is M-Venusaur. A great paranoid staller and tanker, yet also a Hazer. Destiny Bond might work well with this to create less stress on me losing it, and therefore not being a waste of a slot.

Again, there is nothing much to say about Chansey. Imposter, from my short experience, is very reliable on luck, and after that luck, skill. But Aegislash was my Steel-type choice. I did this to have a specific counter to Fighting-type moves. Spectral Thief works perfectly - not only does it have the unique ability of stealing stats, but also decent STAB damage.

So, is this what you were looking for? Or am I still doing it wrong? I really want to get an amazing team that works miracles, so do your competitive Pokemon magic!

Rayquaza-Mega @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Triage
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Tail Glow
- Oblivion Wing
- Spore
- Moongeist Beam

Mewtwo-Mega-Y @ Pixie Plate
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Overheat
- Psycho Boost
- Judgment
- Superpower

Tyranitar-Mega @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Shore Up
- Knock Off
- Pursuit
- Spiky Shield

Venusaur-Mega @ Black Sludge
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Trick
- Nuzzle
- Roost
- Haze

Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Imposter
Happiness: 1
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Relaxed Nature
- Fake Out
- Whirlwind
- Parting Shot
- Final Gambit

Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
- Entrainment
- Rapid Spin
- Recover
- Spectral Thief
 

Pikachuun

the entire waruda machine
First of all, I really want to say thank you. This has really improved this team, along with a boost of team-making skills for the future. In general I am happy with how the team ended up as. A more bulky, yet still offensive team. Much more powerful than before.

However, when testing it I found that it is majorly weak (or at least for me) to VoltTurn. This was a big problem for me and I am not sure how to counter it. The strategy was quite basic: all of the opponents Pokemon had either, Volt Switch or U-Turn and repeated the moves to chip away damage. In addition, much of them also had high-damaging moves, hard to switch into. If you have any tips for me, or any more changes to this team, please try to help me out!

For my team I trusted you with the options you gave me. However, I added a little of my own desires. It seemed to work against certain strategies, and definitely wasn't a 'bad' choice.
unfortunately, to my knowledge, there isn't much of a way to beat VoltTurn even though you can get away with punishing in some cases (Ground types are immune to Volt Switch, and Rocky Helmet is useful for U-turners by dealing some chip); i'd also like to mention that you can control the momentum a bit more by slowing down the mons with those moves to ensure you switch second more often than not (aka -Speed nature + 0 IV/EVs); basically it's about out-momentum'ing your opponent if that makes sense

as for the team composition now, it's certainly better but something i'd like to remind you of is the purpose of the set i proposed for MMY: it's supposed to be walled by Tyranitar if it doesn't have its plate, right (Imposters very rarely carry a plate themselves which is why it's designed around that)? and Superpower beats Tyranitar, right? yeah you can kinda see where this is going. if you want to hit things on the physical side, there's always Psystrike, or even V-create if you really want a physical attacking move, otherwise there just isn't really much of a purpose. Since you are running PH TTar, you can get away with something like Spore on MMY (since TTar is immune to status if it's poisoned, be careful of Magic Bounce) or Taunt to maybe stop those special walls you pointed out from healing (be careful of Assault Vest).
an alternate option for this is to simply swap venu and aegislash, making Venu the MBouncer and Aegislash the prankster, in this case ofc you'd be removing trick from Aegis in favor of a momentum move (U-turn anyone)
post-doing this, and probably giving Aegislash Safety Goggles, you can then keep superpower on MMY, and design its set around Aegislash instead, making it look more like Psycho Boost / Fleur Cannon / Superpower / a move that doesn't hit Aegislash hard (very important, could be something like Photon Geyser, Spore if your Aegis is Safety Goggles, or even Judgment again if you feel like running something like Flame/Earth Plate as your item). As for the item on this set, it depends on whether you keep Judgment or go for another move, if you go for another move you basically have free will (Life Orb for instance) as long as it's not a terrible idea
Through Haze and Recovery, assuming you did not run a move to hit Aegislash outside of an item-based move, Aegislash then pretty much beats your MMY, so as long as you keep it at good HP, you can switch it in if they transform into you
your TTar would then deal with the opposing Aegislashes nicely, for the most part
venu is a more niche prankster, but if you want to run it I won't stop you, the set looks fine enough to me

you could fit U-Turn/Baton Pass on Aegislash's set somewhere to deal with the momentum problem that you pointed out through VoltTurn as well as gain some momentum yourself (just remember to run the slow EVs/IVs in this case since Aegislash is relatively slow, not slow enough to beat Registeel/etc. but at least slow enough), i'm not sure which move to swap though since they're all valid options

everything else seems fine to me, glad i could help with your team and good luck!
 

Champion Leon

Banned deucer.
unfortunately, to my knowledge, there isn't much of a way to beat VoltTurn even though you can get away with punishing in some cases (Ground types are immune to Volt Switch, and Rocky Helmet is useful for U-turners by dealing some chip); i'd also like to mention that you can control the momentum a bit more by slowing down the mons with those moves to ensure you switch second more often than not (aka -Speed nature + 0 IV/EVs); basically it's about out-momentum'ing your opponent if that makes sense

as for the team composition now, it's certainly better but something i'd like to remind you of is the purpose of the set i proposed for MMY: it's supposed to be walled by Tyranitar if it doesn't have its plate, right (Imposters very rarely carry a plate themselves which is why it's designed around that)? and Superpower beats Tyranitar, right? yeah you can kinda see where this is going. if you want to hit things on the physical side, there's always Psystrike, or even V-create if you really want a physical attacking move, otherwise there just isn't really much of a purpose. Since you are running PH TTar, you can get away with something like Spore on MMY (since TTar is immune to status if it's poisoned, be careful of Magic Bounce) or Taunt to maybe stop those special walls you pointed out from healing (be careful of Assault Vest).
an alternate option for this is to simply swap venu and aegislash, making Venu the MBouncer and Aegislash the prankster, in this case ofc you'd be removing trick from Aegis in favor of a momentum move (U-turn anyone)
post-doing this, and probably giving Aegislash Safety Goggles, you can then keep superpower on MMY, and design its set around Aegislash instead, making it look more like Psycho Boost / Fleur Cannon / Superpower / a move that doesn't hit Aegislash hard (very important, could be something like Photon Geyser, Spore if your Aegis is Safety Goggles, or even Judgment again if you feel like running something like Flame/Earth Plate as your item). As for the item on this set, it depends on whether you keep Judgment or go for another move, if you go for another move you basically have free will (Life Orb for instance) as long as it's not a terrible idea
Through Haze and Recovery, assuming you did not run a move to hit Aegislash outside of an item-based move, Aegislash then pretty much beats your MMY, so as long as you keep it at good HP, you can switch it in if they transform into you
your TTar would then deal with the opposing Aegislashes nicely, for the most part
venu is a more niche prankster, but if you want to run it I won't stop you, the set looks fine enough to me

you could fit U-Turn/Baton Pass on Aegislash's set somewhere to deal with the momentum problem that you pointed out through VoltTurn as well as gain some momentum yourself (just remember to run the slow EVs/IVs in this case since Aegislash is relatively slow, not slow enough to beat Registeel/etc. but at least slow enough), i'm not sure which move to swap though since they're all valid options

everything else seems fine to me, glad i could help with your team and good luck!
What about using Baneful Bunker/Spiky Shield to punish U-Turn? (Rocky Helmet forces them to take a second turn of damage as they U-Turn). Pursuit on T-Tar works well, but a slow Metal Burst can punish the recipient if you are trying to underspeed (some U-turner pivots are strong and/or fast like STAB U-Turn Pheromosa).
 

Pikachuun

the entire waruda machine
What about using Baneful Bunker/Spiky Shield to punish U-Turn? (Rocky Helmet forces them to take a second turn of damage as they U-Turn). Pursuit on T-Tar works well, but a slow Metal Burst can punish the recipient if you are trying to underspeed (some U-turner pivots are strong and/or fast like STAB U-Turn Pheromosa).
this is an alternate option, but the issue then would be finding a suitable moveslot to replace it, and i don't believe there'd be many options on this team to do so effectively (TTar also has spiky shield though)
metal burst is a very niche way to punish u-turn on most mons (Chansey being a notable exception because FC chans runs it due to its high HP) so let's not even go down that road
 

Champion Leon

Banned deucer.
this is an alternate option, but the issue then would be finding a suitable moveslot to replace it, and i don't believe there'd be many options on this team to do so effectively (TTar also has spiky shield though)
metal burst is a very niche way to punish u-turn on most mons (Chansey being a notable exception because FC chans runs it due to its high HP) so let's not even go down that road
I agree, I was more thinking Baneful Bunker over Nuzzle on Venusaur so you won’t get undersped by the foe’s U-Turns, so that Imposter can’t poison it (Imposter can Paralyze Your Team/Venusaur), and so that it won’t be a threat to most of your team (Aegislash, Venusaur, Tyranitar aren’t hurt by Poison, and Rayquaza/MMY use Special moves). But it’s only a suggestion.

The only reason I thought of It was because I think one of the concerns brought up was an opponent taking advantage of slow U-Turn pivots, which paralyzing can contribute to.

Thus, only Chansey would be afraid of Baneful Bunker on the off chance their Imposter would come in on your Venusaur as you switch out to your Chansey. Due to the their Imposter blocking yours, you would just have to avoid using Fake-Out on their Baneful Bunker. If your Chansey was hit with Nuzzle, however, your Chansey could lose a future would-be speed-tie.

Because Venusaur isn’t the bulkiest, it would also provide an extra turn of healing from Black Sludge, and scout for moves.

Edit- Lastly, since Baneful Bunker doesn’t target Poison, Steel, or Special attackers, it would allow a Rayquaza to Spore more threats to your team.

I’m sorry for the long post.
 
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Champion Leon

Banned deucer.
Used Revive on Balanced Hackmons!
Used Max Potion on Balanced Hackmons!

To not make this a double post with no direction, let’s Transform this into a brand new starter topic.

Topic Transformed into a Poll!

What is the most difficult part of teambuilding?

A. Imposterproofing your own teammates.
B. Building a team with role compression in mind.
C. Having to fear Illusion/Imposter when taking a look at Team Preview.
D. Trying to determine which set each Pokémon your opponent has.
E. Equally 2 or more of the above statements.

Baton Passes this discussion to the next poster.
 
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