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Battle Tree Discussion and Records
- Thread starter Eisenherz
- Start date
I don't actually see any real reason to run Focus Blast on Landorus anyway. It doesn't actually add any extra coverage, as things that resist Ground (Flying, Grass, Bug) are hit neutrally or supereffectively by Poison (Sludge Wave) and Ground moves are supereffective on Rock and Steel types that are also covered by Focus Blast. Celesteela does not exist on tree either, and you also run Tapu Koko who can make quick work of Skarmory. I'd suggest to run Psychic, or even U-turn to pivot out of Ice types while breaking sashes/sturdys.
It's also possibly considerable to run Smack Down which would allow you to make fliers/levitaters hittable by Earth Power implying you aren't at risk of a 1hko.
Unfortunately having already moved to Gen 7 you are missing out on possibility of running Superpower or Knockoff :(
It's also possibly considerable to run Smack Down which would allow you to make fliers/levitaters hittable by Earth Power implying you aren't at risk of a 1hko.
Unfortunately having already moved to Gen 7 you are missing out on possibility of running Superpower or Knockoff :(
What would be a good Pokemon to go with standard Mega Salamence and Kartana? I've tried using Ash-Greninja, but it just doesn't seem to be pulling its weight most of the time, and I just got swept by Red's Lapras on my first Battle Tree run (it dodged all of my attacks, which were 100% accuracy moves, and OHKO'd my entire team).
I like Landorus-I and have a perfect Sheer Force one, but the double weakness with Salamence seems like a massive problem.
I like Landorus-I and have a perfect Sheer Force one, but the double weakness with Salamence seems like a massive problem.
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Hard to go past Tapu Fini for the typing and status immunity :)
It's been a while, and I'm not sure if anyone uses this anymore, but I fixed the first bug, as bolded above. You can re-download / make a new copy of the spreadsheet at the same link, here. Then again, maybe there are other spreadsheets that do this better? I felt this needed to be fixed, though, so I fixed it. Cheers!
Tapu Fini is less ideal than it looks, seeing Salamence will not benefit from the status immunity.
Rarycaris Have you thought of just running Arcanine? You get another intimidate option, resists both the types that your other 2 are weak to, has +2 priority and can run both special and phisical set depending on preference, a gen 6 spatk arcanine can be running Dragon Pulse as well for added coverage if you so desire, while a gen 7 one can run the neverbad z-burnup set as well.
I think you definite need a special attacker to complement those two physical ones, or someone who can stall. scarf-Xurkitree and Suicune have been my go-to Pokemon when I just don't know what to use, since both can sweep so much just by themselves, and their low number of weaknesses means they can fit into so many teams.
Hey everyone! I’m here to report a completed streak of 344! This time, I decided to use a Trick Room team featuring Aromatisse, Hariyama, Araquanid, and Mega Camerupt.
Updated team
Here’s the team:
Aromatisse @ Lum Berry
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 252 HP / 180 Def / 76 SpD
IVs: 31/xx/31/31/31/0
Sassy Nature
- Dazzling Gleam
- Helping Hand
- Trick Room
- Protect
First, we have the Trick Room setter, Aromatisse. I decided to use her over Oranguru, simply because of her ability. With Aroma Veil, she can’t get taunted or encored so that was a huge plus. It also prevents the effects of Cute Charm and Cursed Body on both herself and her allies. The Lum Berry was used so she couldn’t get confused, paralyzed, frozen, etc. The last time I tried Aromatisse out, a Mega Gengar ruined my day with its Sludge Bomb, so I EV’d the Aromatisse to survive Sludge Bomb (252 SpA Gengar-Mega Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 76+ SpD Aromatisse: 174-206 (83.6 - 99%) -- guaranteed 2HKO). Dazzling Gleam is used for spread damage and to break potential sashes or Sturdy. I chose to put Helping Hand on this set to assist Aromatisse’s partners in KO-ing the bulkier Pokemon/potential threats. It came in handy a lot. Trick Room to take control of the battle, and Protect to stall out turns if needed.
Hariyama @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 32 HP / 252 Atk / 108 Def / 116 SpD
IVs: 31/31/31/xx/31/0
Brave Nature
- Fake Out
- Close Combat
- Knock Off
- Ice Punch
Pretty standard Hariyama. The EV spread isn’t mine, it was taken from a VGC team I came across a while back. I believe other users have used the same spread. Fake Out is used to help Aromatisse set its Trick Room, CC for instant nukes, and Knock Off to hit Psychic-types. The only thing different from this Hariyama, I believe is Ice Punch. Most other Hariyamas run Heavy Slam, but I chose Ice Punch to hit various Flying-types and Dragon-types without having to sacrifice Defense or Sp. Defense from CC. It worked out really well. Even with its low BP, it was able to OHKO or 2HKO a lot of Pokemon, thanks to Guts and Helping Hand.
Araquanid @ Waterium Z
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
IVs: 31/31/31/xx/31/0
Brave Nature
- Liquidation --> Hydro Vortex
- Leech Life
- Wide Guard
- Protect
Next up, we have Araquanid. Again, it’s a pretty standard set but I decided to use Wide Guard here to protect Camerupt from Surfs, EQs, Rock Slides, and whatever other spread moves exist in the Tree. It was a huge help in 2v1 situations when Trick Room was down. In fact, on about 3 separate occasions, Wide Guard helped vs Suicune spamming Surf so Camerupt would be able to take it out. Liquidation and Leech Life are STAB, and Hydro Vortex for Z-nuke if needed.
-->
Camerupt @ Cameruptite
Ability: Solid Rock --> Sheer Force
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
IVs: 31/xx/31/HT/HT/1
Quiet Nature
- Flamethrower
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power Grass
- Protect
And finally, Mega Camerupt. This guy is a monster. With the 1 Speed IV and Quiet Nature, Camerupt goes to 22 Speed after mega evolving, which lets it outspeed everything in the Tree except for Avalugg-4 thanks to its Iron Ball. It also speed-ties with both Shuckle-3 and Shuckle-4. But, none of those are threats so it didn’t really matter. Base 145 Sp. Attack, and Sheer Force make Flamethrower and Earth Power very powerful attacks and allowed Camerupt to run through a bunch of teams. Hidden Power Grass was a bit of an odd choice, but this guy was sitting in my box for a while and he’s shiny, so I didn’t really want to re-breed for HP Ice (which I felt I didn’t really need because of Ice Punch on Hariyama). HP Grass lets it hit Swampert and Gastrodon. However, without a Helping Hand or another attack going into those Pokemon, it’s a 2HKO on Mega Swampert, Swampert-4, and Gastrodon-4.
Main problems for this team were Water-types in general since I lacked Electric coverage, and HP Grass has pathetic damage, even with Mega Camerupt's amazing Sp. Attack. Gyarados was a huge problem mainly because of its Intimidate, but Mega Gyarados wasn’t that bad. In fact, Intimidate leads weren’t too much of a problem unless there was more than one. Hariyama still hits pretty hard, thanks to Guts and Helping Hand. Opposing Trick Room wasn’t too bad either, except for some Iron Ball users, such as Trevenant and Cresselia but usually, a Helping Hand-boosted Knock Off from Hariyama dealt with them pretty quickly.
Another problem was Mega Gengar, but as I said earlier, I did EV Aromatisse to have it survive its Sludge Bomb 100% of the time, barring crits, of course. Unfortunately, I ran into Mega Gengar once throughout this whole run and it tried to target down Hariyama instead of use Sludge Bomb on Aromatisse so it’s whatever, I guess.
Iron Head users were another issue, since Iron Head was almost always a 2HKO on Aromatisse AND it had that chance to flinch. I usually tried using Fake Out on the offenders, but Bisharp was a huge problem because of Inner Focus. Usually, if Pressure didn’t show, I would Protect Aromatisse, and try using CC on Bisharp with Hariyama, but Bisharp-4 is super annoying with its Sash. Fortunately, Aromatisse was only Iron Head flinched by it twice during the run, and it didn’t really matter in the end. Drapion can also KO Aromatisse with a Sniper crit from Cross Poison, but a nice Fake Out stopped that thing too. If the AI leads with Drapion and Bisharp, I usually Fake Out Bisharp if Pressure shows, but choose Drapion if it doesn’t. This combination only showed up twice during the run, both from Grimsley.
I had a lot of fun with this team, but I feel like I could have gone farther if it weren’t for that silly mistake I made in that losing battle. Oh well, shit happens, right? See ya.
Updated team
Here’s the team:
Aromatisse @ Lum Berry
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 252 HP / 180 Def / 76 SpD
IVs: 31/xx/31/31/31/0
Sassy Nature
- Dazzling Gleam
- Helping Hand
- Trick Room
- Protect
First, we have the Trick Room setter, Aromatisse. I decided to use her over Oranguru, simply because of her ability. With Aroma Veil, she can’t get taunted or encored so that was a huge plus. It also prevents the effects of Cute Charm and Cursed Body on both herself and her allies. The Lum Berry was used so she couldn’t get confused, paralyzed, frozen, etc. The last time I tried Aromatisse out, a Mega Gengar ruined my day with its Sludge Bomb, so I EV’d the Aromatisse to survive Sludge Bomb (252 SpA Gengar-Mega Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 76+ SpD Aromatisse: 174-206 (83.6 - 99%) -- guaranteed 2HKO). Dazzling Gleam is used for spread damage and to break potential sashes or Sturdy. I chose to put Helping Hand on this set to assist Aromatisse’s partners in KO-ing the bulkier Pokemon/potential threats. It came in handy a lot. Trick Room to take control of the battle, and Protect to stall out turns if needed.
Hariyama @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 32 HP / 252 Atk / 108 Def / 116 SpD
IVs: 31/31/31/xx/31/0
Brave Nature
- Fake Out
- Close Combat
- Knock Off
- Ice Punch
Pretty standard Hariyama. The EV spread isn’t mine, it was taken from a VGC team I came across a while back. I believe other users have used the same spread. Fake Out is used to help Aromatisse set its Trick Room, CC for instant nukes, and Knock Off to hit Psychic-types. The only thing different from this Hariyama, I believe is Ice Punch. Most other Hariyamas run Heavy Slam, but I chose Ice Punch to hit various Flying-types and Dragon-types without having to sacrifice Defense or Sp. Defense from CC. It worked out really well. Even with its low BP, it was able to OHKO or 2HKO a lot of Pokemon, thanks to Guts and Helping Hand.
Araquanid @ Waterium Z
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
IVs: 31/31/31/xx/31/0
Brave Nature
- Liquidation --> Hydro Vortex
- Leech Life
- Wide Guard
- Protect
Next up, we have Araquanid. Again, it’s a pretty standard set but I decided to use Wide Guard here to protect Camerupt from Surfs, EQs, Rock Slides, and whatever other spread moves exist in the Tree. It was a huge help in 2v1 situations when Trick Room was down. In fact, on about 3 separate occasions, Wide Guard helped vs Suicune spamming Surf so Camerupt would be able to take it out. Liquidation and Leech Life are STAB, and Hydro Vortex for Z-nuke if needed.
Camerupt @ Cameruptite
Ability: Solid Rock --> Sheer Force
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
IVs: 31/xx/31/HT/HT/1
Quiet Nature
- Flamethrower
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power Grass
- Protect
And finally, Mega Camerupt. This guy is a monster. With the 1 Speed IV and Quiet Nature, Camerupt goes to 22 Speed after mega evolving, which lets it outspeed everything in the Tree except for Avalugg-4 thanks to its Iron Ball. It also speed-ties with both Shuckle-3 and Shuckle-4. But, none of those are threats so it didn’t really matter. Base 145 Sp. Attack, and Sheer Force make Flamethrower and Earth Power very powerful attacks and allowed Camerupt to run through a bunch of teams. Hidden Power Grass was a bit of an odd choice, but this guy was sitting in my box for a while and he’s shiny, so I didn’t really want to re-breed for HP Ice (which I felt I didn’t really need because of Ice Punch on Hariyama). HP Grass lets it hit Swampert and Gastrodon. However, without a Helping Hand or another attack going into those Pokemon, it’s a 2HKO on Mega Swampert, Swampert-4, and Gastrodon-4.
Another problem was Mega Gengar, but as I said earlier, I did EV Aromatisse to have it survive its Sludge Bomb 100% of the time, barring crits, of course. Unfortunately, I ran into Mega Gengar once throughout this whole run and it tried to target down Hariyama instead of use Sludge Bomb on Aromatisse so it’s whatever, I guess.
Iron Head users were another issue, since Iron Head was almost always a 2HKO on Aromatisse AND it had that chance to flinch. I usually tried using Fake Out on the offenders, but Bisharp was a huge problem because of Inner Focus. Usually, if Pressure didn’t show, I would Protect Aromatisse, and try using CC on Bisharp with Hariyama, but Bisharp-4 is super annoying with its Sash. Fortunately, Aromatisse was only Iron Head flinched by it twice during the run, and it didn’t really matter in the end. Drapion can also KO Aromatisse with a Sniper crit from Cross Poison, but a nice Fake Out stopped that thing too. If the AI leads with Drapion and Bisharp, I usually Fake Out Bisharp if Pressure shows, but choose Drapion if it doesn’t. This combination only showed up twice during the run, both from Grimsley.
Losing battle vs Aether Foundation Luke: VDUG-WWWW-WWW8-5L68
So, here, I was kinda gambling with Sableye-4’s Fake Out, and hoped it would try using it on the protecting Aromatisse, but it ended up using it on Hariyama, and Flareon-4 used its Flare Blitz on Aromatisse. On the next turn, I do get my Trick Room up as Flareon uses Z-Flare Blitz on Hariyama (which KO’s it, unfortunately), and Sableye uses Will-O-Wisp on Aromatisse, which gets cleansed by its Lum Berry. Aromatisse gets Trick Room off and Araquanid comes out. I use Helping Hand+Z-Liquidation on Sableye, completely forgetting it has a Focus Sash, and it ends up using Metal Burst on Araquanid, taking it out. Flareon goes for a Flare Blitz, taking just over half of Aromatisse’s HP. M-Camerupt ended up taking out Flareon and M-Glalie in the backline with Earth Power and Flamethrower respectively, but Dragonite-4 was just a bit much for my last two Pokemon and beat them both down pretty handily with Iron Tail and Dragon Rush. Oh well.
Other battles I ended up saving:
Battle 50 vs Battle Legend Blue: MFXG-WWWW-WWW8-5L6D
Blue leads off with Gyarados-4 and Machamp-4. I use Fake Out on Gyarados after it Mega Evolves, and set Trick Room as Machamp uses EQ. Dazzling Gleam+Close Combat take out Gyarados, and enemy CC takes out Hariyama. Araquanid comes out. DG takes out Machamp, and Liquidation takes out Aerodactyl-?. Battle ends with Helping Hand+Hydro Vortex on Pidgeot-?.
Battle 132 vs Pokemon Center Lady Perri: 2XJW-WWWW-WWW8-5L6J
Perri leads off with Slowbro-4 and Lilligant-?. Lilligant uses Protect on my Fake Out, but I still get my Trick Room off as Slowbro uses Surf. I know Slowbro out-speeds Hariyama under Trick Room, but I just go with it. DG into Slowbro and Lilligant, and CC into Lilligant to take it out. Surf from Slowbro again. Slowking-2 up next. Surf from Slowbro finishes off Hariyama after DG from Aromatisse. Slowking uses Zen Headbutt on Aromatisse. Araquanid and M-Camerupt up next. AI switches out Slowbro into Togedemaru. Camerupt eats it up with Earth Power, and Leech Life from Araquanid Kos Slowking. Battle finishes with Earth Power from Camerupt.
Battle 238 vs Punk Guy Etta: P6YW-WWWW-WWW8-5L6S
Etta leads off with Rotom-Fan-3 and Arcanine-3. Fake Out into Rotom, Arcanine uses Sunny Day. Trick Room is set. DG and Ice Punch KO Rotom, Arcanine uses Overheat on Aromatisse, does about 60%. Staraptor-? out next. DG and Ice Punch again to take out Staraptor before it can even make a move, Arcanine uses Solar Beam into Hariyama, for some reason. Gyarados-4 out last, Intimidate activates. I take a chance and hope it is indeed Gyarados-4, and use DG+CC to take it out. That was risky. Arcanine finishes off Hariyama with Overheat, and Araquanid is out next. Battle finishes with Helping Hand+Hydro Vortex.
Battle 340 vs Pokemon Trainer Anabel: Y6HW-WWWW-WWW8-5L74
I saved this battle only because I love facing Anabel whenever she shows up. Anyway, she leads off with Latios-2 and Entei-3. Latios protects itself from my Fake Out, as Entei locks itself into Eruption. Aromatisse sets Trick Room. Aromatisse switches out into Araquanid and Hariyama’s Knock Off takes out Latios. Entei uses Eruption again, and that + the burn takes out Hariyama. M-Camerupt up next, Anabel sends out Lucario-4. M-Camerupt’s Flamethrower takes out Lucario, and Liquidation takes out Entei. Finally, Snorlax. I assume it’s Snorlax-3 based on Flamethrower’s damage but it doesn’t really matter because Hydro Vortex finishes it off right after.
So, here, I was kinda gambling with Sableye-4’s Fake Out, and hoped it would try using it on the protecting Aromatisse, but it ended up using it on Hariyama, and Flareon-4 used its Flare Blitz on Aromatisse. On the next turn, I do get my Trick Room up as Flareon uses Z-Flare Blitz on Hariyama (which KO’s it, unfortunately), and Sableye uses Will-O-Wisp on Aromatisse, which gets cleansed by its Lum Berry. Aromatisse gets Trick Room off and Araquanid comes out. I use Helping Hand+Z-Liquidation on Sableye, completely forgetting it has a Focus Sash, and it ends up using Metal Burst on Araquanid, taking it out. Flareon goes for a Flare Blitz, taking just over half of Aromatisse’s HP. M-Camerupt ended up taking out Flareon and M-Glalie in the backline with Earth Power and Flamethrower respectively, but Dragonite-4 was just a bit much for my last two Pokemon and beat them both down pretty handily with Iron Tail and Dragon Rush. Oh well.
Other battles I ended up saving:
Battle 50 vs Battle Legend Blue: MFXG-WWWW-WWW8-5L6D
Blue leads off with Gyarados-4 and Machamp-4. I use Fake Out on Gyarados after it Mega Evolves, and set Trick Room as Machamp uses EQ. Dazzling Gleam+Close Combat take out Gyarados, and enemy CC takes out Hariyama. Araquanid comes out. DG takes out Machamp, and Liquidation takes out Aerodactyl-?. Battle ends with Helping Hand+Hydro Vortex on Pidgeot-?.
Battle 132 vs Pokemon Center Lady Perri: 2XJW-WWWW-WWW8-5L6J
Perri leads off with Slowbro-4 and Lilligant-?. Lilligant uses Protect on my Fake Out, but I still get my Trick Room off as Slowbro uses Surf. I know Slowbro out-speeds Hariyama under Trick Room, but I just go with it. DG into Slowbro and Lilligant, and CC into Lilligant to take it out. Surf from Slowbro again. Slowking-2 up next. Surf from Slowbro finishes off Hariyama after DG from Aromatisse. Slowking uses Zen Headbutt on Aromatisse. Araquanid and M-Camerupt up next. AI switches out Slowbro into Togedemaru. Camerupt eats it up with Earth Power, and Leech Life from Araquanid Kos Slowking. Battle finishes with Earth Power from Camerupt.
Battle 238 vs Punk Guy Etta: P6YW-WWWW-WWW8-5L6S
Etta leads off with Rotom-Fan-3 and Arcanine-3. Fake Out into Rotom, Arcanine uses Sunny Day. Trick Room is set. DG and Ice Punch KO Rotom, Arcanine uses Overheat on Aromatisse, does about 60%. Staraptor-? out next. DG and Ice Punch again to take out Staraptor before it can even make a move, Arcanine uses Solar Beam into Hariyama, for some reason. Gyarados-4 out last, Intimidate activates. I take a chance and hope it is indeed Gyarados-4, and use DG+CC to take it out. That was risky. Arcanine finishes off Hariyama with Overheat, and Araquanid is out next. Battle finishes with Helping Hand+Hydro Vortex.
Battle 340 vs Pokemon Trainer Anabel: Y6HW-WWWW-WWW8-5L74
I saved this battle only because I love facing Anabel whenever she shows up. Anyway, she leads off with Latios-2 and Entei-3. Latios protects itself from my Fake Out, as Entei locks itself into Eruption. Aromatisse sets Trick Room. Aromatisse switches out into Araquanid and Hariyama’s Knock Off takes out Latios. Entei uses Eruption again, and that + the burn takes out Hariyama. M-Camerupt up next, Anabel sends out Lucario-4. M-Camerupt’s Flamethrower takes out Lucario, and Liquidation takes out Entei. Finally, Snorlax. I assume it’s Snorlax-3 based on Flamethrower’s damage but it doesn’t really matter because Hydro Vortex finishes it off right after.
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Hi guys, I have a few questions and I hope it's ok to post them all together. This is all for Singles keeping in mind I just cleared a Gen 7 game for the first time.
First and second, why aren't Mega Kangaskhan and Suicune used as much as in the Maison?
Third, can anyone give me a recommended set for Aegislash and Mega Salamence? And then something to pair with them for my team?
Thanks!
First and second, why aren't Mega Kangaskhan and Suicune used as much as in the Maison?
Third, can anyone give me a recommended set for Aegislash and Mega Salamence? And then something to pair with them for my team?
Thanks!
Parental Bond and Sucker Punch are nerfed, and Kangaskhan needed every bit of that power last generation to KO faster threats.
Suicune's main niche was that you could switch it back and forth with Gliscor to quickly stall something out of the BoltBeam coverage that the vast majority of opponents had and then set one of the two up, but now there are things with different coverage that can break through both of them.
If you're just trying to get 50 or so quickly I would recommend this team, which does about as well as I would expect any 'aggro' team to do:
Tapu Lele @ Psychium Z
Modest, 252 Spe / 252 SpA / 4 HP
-Psychic
-Moonblast
-Psyshock / Calm Mind
-Substitute
Aegislash @ Leftovers
Adamant, 252 HP/ 252 Atk /4 Spe
-Shadow Sneak
-Sacred Sword
-King's Shield
-Swords Dance
Salamence @ Salamencite
Jolly, 4 HP / 252 Atk / 16 SpD / 236 Spe
-Double-Edge
-Earthquake
-Roost
-Dragon Dance
Otherwise you can search for Salamence in the first page and click on a few of the teams there. The longer streaks will have a set of Return, Dragon Dance, Substitute, and Roost with the ideal third team member being something that can cripple and/or PP stall special attackers so Salamence can set up against even more leads. Eviolite Chansey does this the best.
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Hi,
i am sorry for posting only theoretical teams (i dont have SuMo), but lately i had much fun with theoryzing teams/ideas. Feel free if you want to test it. Maybe i'll do, someday.
All Mons are somehow pretty Standard, but i think they havent been used in this constellation yet, and maybe one could have some fun. Actually i think that this team has some serious potential.
@Choice Specs/LO (Choice Scarf)
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Discharge
-Dazzling Gleam
-Grass Knot
-HP Ground/Water...
@ Focus sash
Ability: Lightningrod
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Fake Out
-Discharge
-Surf
-HP Ice (Grass Knot)
@ Sceptilite
Ability: Overgrow -> Lightningrod
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Dragon Pulse
-Energyball/Gigadrain
-Protect
-Substitute/EQ/HP/Drain Punch/...
@ Leftovers
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252HP/Def/SDef
(nature depends on the final set)
-Wide Guard
-Protect
-Leech Seed
-Heavy Slam/Flamethrower (Earthquake)
I am uncertain about the last move. Heavy Slam against fairies, Flame Thrower against Plants that i cant Leech Seed or Steels (Mawile..), and Earthquake may be for Fire Types. But the first two suggestions are more useful i think. Especially the heaviest STAB Heavy Slam in the game looks delicious.
From the first turn on i try to spam Discharges and Boost Raichu in the mean time. Fake Out for dangerous/quick things or to prevent Trickroom. I first went for other Pokemon, but without Fake Out i feel so vulnerable.. The damage output of two terrain boosted STAB Discharges + one Lightningrod Boost/Specs is enormous.
Obviously this lead duo gets big problems especially with ground types. If one gets a Raichu with Surf, this should help a lot. Otherwise i do some damage with Grass Knots or switch one or both, Koko and Raichu out.
For the omnipresent Earthquakes that could wipe out my leads without much effort, i didnt want anything in the back row, that takes only neutral Ground hits. Mega-Sceptile resists and has also Lightningrod, so the boosting doesnt stop here (although i cant switch it in a Discharge because it has to Mega evolve first), and Ground Types dislike STAB Grass moves. And Celesteela with its Immunities to the only weaknesses of my leads (Ground and Poison) completes this team in such a good way. Wide Guard and its typing was how i came to him. Wide Guard stops Earthquakes/Blizzard/... as well as protecting Celesteela himself from my own Discharges. The Leech Seed set which is seen in many teams here that carry Celesteela seems to do exactly what i want: Counter Bulky Steel/Ground Types that make it past my other three attackers. With two Lightningrod-users it doesnt fear Electric Moves that much and may provocate them to boost my Pokemon even more. The only weakness of the other team members it doesnt cover is the 4xIce Weak from Sceptile, but that shouldnt be too terrible. Also his own Fire weakness isnt covered, so one should kill Fire Mons first. Usually one rule i never hurt when building a team is: only 100% accurate moves. With Leech Seed i made an exception because of its usefulness, its slot in the backrow and therefore a lower usage, and because i think against the Ground Types Celesteela is supposed to counter it is bearable to miss some times. Celesteela is more like a long term Pokemon.
(I dont know why the whole text is a link lol)
Team update probably no one ever will read:
@Choice Specs/LO (Choice Scarf)
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Discharge
-Dazzling Gleam
-Grass Knot
-HP Ground/Water...
@ Focus sash
Ability: Lightningrod
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Fake Out
-Discharge
-Surf
-HP Ice (Grass Knot)
@ Life-Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 HP/252SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Earthpower
-Sludgebomb
-HP Ice/...
-Protect
@ Leftovers
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 HP/Def/SDef/4Spd
(nature depends on the final set)
-Leech Seed
-Heavy Slam/Flamethrower (Earthquake)
-Wide Guard
-Protect
Changes:
The only difference is the change from Sceptile to Landorus. I think it is important to switch one lead out while the other can still use Discharge. Sceptile cant come in because it has to mega-evolve first to get its Immunity. Also this team is a bit weak to Fire (-> Threat List).
There arent many Pokemon with both Ground and Electric Immunity. I think the best choice for this team is Landorus. Great power, some bulk, few weaknesses, adequate speed. It needs to be a special set for the Ground STAB, since Earthquake shouldnt work too well in this team. Sludgebomb is a nice coverage move to Earthpower - only very few Mons resist both, and many of them are hit super effecitive by HP Ice. atsync used the same Landorus with similar leads.
Threat List:
Ground Types:
Most obvious threat. Actually i think they are not too dangerous since many of them have two times weaknesses to Surf/Grassknot/Ice... Also the backrow is immune to Ground, and can take some other hits as well as kill them fast (Lando) or stall them down (Steela). I think this Duo can easily take out many Mono-Type Ground teams.
Lightningrod/Voltabsorb:
Immune to the main attacks of my leads, but they cant hurt me much, too. Kokos HP Ground helps.
Fire Types:
This team has one Fire Weakness, but no resistance. There are some Fire Mons that dont go down quickly, but can deal huge amounts of Damage with STAB-FlareBlitz etc. My leads can do some damage of course, and Landorus (who has a really nice Speed, slightly outspeeding for instance Charizard (X/Y), Typhlosion, Entei, Ninetales, Mega-Blaziken (before Speed Boost), Volcarona.) can KO many of them with Sheer Force STAB LO Earthpower.
Scarfer:
Some Scarfer are really dangerous to this team. Garchomp sadly cant be KOed by Dazzling Gleam + Fake Out. Darmanitan also is super dangerous; only Lando survives non-crit Flareblitz savely.
Eruption Spam also can be unconvenient (as Fire Mons in general are) if it appears in the wrong situations. In turn one i can Fake Out + Discharge, reducing the damage. In other situations i might lose my leads since i cant switch Lando/Steela in. Once they are in, i can use Wide Guard/Earthpower.
As always with Scarfer one needs to play smartly around.
Alolan Marowak:
He gets a special mention. Only Landorus can OHKO him, but my whole team is a OHKO to Flareblitz. Thats one reason to play Koko with HP Ground: Together with Raichus Surf they also can kill Marowak.
I guess once this team is played, some other threats will make it on that list.
i am sorry for posting only theoretical teams (i dont have SuMo), but lately i had much fun with theoryzing teams/ideas. Feel free if you want to test it. Maybe i'll do, someday.
All Mons are somehow pretty Standard, but i think they havent been used in this constellation yet, and maybe one could have some fun. Actually i think that this team has some serious potential.
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Discharge
-Dazzling Gleam
-Grass Knot
-HP Ground/Water...
@ Focus sashAbility: Lightningrod
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Fake Out
-Discharge
-Surf
-HP Ice (Grass Knot)
@ SceptiliteAbility: Overgrow -> Lightningrod
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Dragon Pulse
-Energyball/Gigadrain
-Protect
-Substitute/EQ/HP/Drain Punch/...
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252HP/Def/SDef
(nature depends on the final set)
-Wide Guard
-Protect
-Leech Seed
-Heavy Slam/Flamethrower (Earthquake)
I am uncertain about the last move. Heavy Slam against fairies, Flame Thrower against Plants that i cant Leech Seed or Steels (Mawile..), and Earthquake may be for Fire Types. But the first two suggestions are more useful i think. Especially the heaviest STAB Heavy Slam in the game looks delicious.
From the first turn on i try to spam Discharges and Boost Raichu in the mean time. Fake Out for dangerous/quick things or to prevent Trickroom. I first went for other Pokemon, but without Fake Out i feel so vulnerable.. The damage output of two terrain boosted STAB Discharges + one Lightningrod Boost/Specs is enormous.
Obviously this lead duo gets big problems especially with ground types. If one gets a Raichu with Surf, this should help a lot. Otherwise i do some damage with Grass Knots or switch one or both, Koko and Raichu out.
For the omnipresent Earthquakes that could wipe out my leads without much effort, i didnt want anything in the back row, that takes only neutral Ground hits. Mega-Sceptile resists and has also Lightningrod, so the boosting doesnt stop here (although i cant switch it in a Discharge because it has to Mega evolve first), and Ground Types dislike STAB Grass moves. And Celesteela with its Immunities to the only weaknesses of my leads (Ground and Poison) completes this team in such a good way. Wide Guard and its typing was how i came to him. Wide Guard stops Earthquakes/Blizzard/... as well as protecting Celesteela himself from my own Discharges. The Leech Seed set which is seen in many teams here that carry Celesteela seems to do exactly what i want: Counter Bulky Steel/Ground Types that make it past my other three attackers. With two Lightningrod-users it doesnt fear Electric Moves that much and may provocate them to boost my Pokemon even more. The only weakness of the other team members it doesnt cover is the 4xIce Weak from Sceptile, but that shouldnt be too terrible. Also his own Fire weakness isnt covered, so one should kill Fire Mons first. Usually one rule i never hurt when building a team is: only 100% accurate moves. With Leech Seed i made an exception because of its usefulness, its slot in the backrow and therefore a lower usage, and because i think against the Ground Types Celesteela is supposed to counter it is bearable to miss some times. Celesteela is more like a long term Pokemon.
This team is clearly inspired by R Inanimates subway team, that i tested and made first try to over 200 wins with - wow! (i thought i read somewhere that one can try this team, cant find it now, hope it was ok). It was very fun to boost Gastrodon with my own attacks and i wanted to try similar strategies. Sap Sipper + Petal Blizzard or Flash Fire + Lava Plume seemed not to be working very well due to the unmatching Pokemon that can learn it. For Lightningrod + Discharge it is much easier to build a fast and hard hitting team that doesnt suffer too much from similar types and uncovered weaknesses.
And yes, this lead duo is somehow the electric pendant to R Inanimate ones. The damage of two terrain boosted STAB Discharges + one Lightningrod Boost is also in about the same dimensions as the double Surfs (actually even higher when Koko is played with Specs) and there is also Fake Out. Alolan Raichu would fulfill absolutely the same role as Ludiculo (as seen here in other teams), but i rather wanted to get the constant boosting going.
(However Kokos Special Defense is much worse compared to Politoed. It doesnt survive 2 boosted Discharges from Raichu. Fortunately it survives a crit.)
And yes, this lead duo is somehow the electric pendant to R Inanimate ones. The damage of two terrain boosted STAB Discharges + one Lightningrod Boost is also in about the same dimensions as the double Surfs (actually even higher when Koko is played with Specs) and there is also Fake Out. Alolan Raichu would fulfill absolutely the same role as Ludiculo (as seen here in other teams), but i rather wanted to get the constant boosting going.
(However Kokos Special Defense is much worse compared to Politoed. It doesnt survive 2 boosted Discharges from Raichu. Fortunately it survives a crit.)
(I dont know why the whole text is a link lol)
Team update probably no one ever will read:
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Discharge
-Dazzling Gleam
-Grass Knot
-HP Ground/Water...
@ Focus sashAbility: Lightningrod
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Fake Out
-Discharge
-Surf
-HP Ice (Grass Knot)
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 HP/252SAtk/252Spd
Timid
-Earthpower
-Sludgebomb
-HP Ice/...
-Protect
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 HP/Def/SDef/4Spd
(nature depends on the final set)
-Leech Seed
-Heavy Slam/Flamethrower (Earthquake)
-Wide Guard
-Protect
Changes:
The only difference is the change from Sceptile to Landorus. I think it is important to switch one lead out while the other can still use Discharge. Sceptile cant come in because it has to mega-evolve first to get its Immunity. Also this team is a bit weak to Fire (-> Threat List).
There arent many Pokemon with both Ground and Electric Immunity. I think the best choice for this team is Landorus. Great power, some bulk, few weaknesses, adequate speed. It needs to be a special set for the Ground STAB, since Earthquake shouldnt work too well in this team. Sludgebomb is a nice coverage move to Earthpower - only very few Mons resist both, and many of them are hit super effecitive by HP Ice. atsync used the same Landorus with similar leads.
Threat List:
Ground Types:
Most obvious threat. Actually i think they are not too dangerous since many of them have two times weaknesses to Surf/Grassknot/Ice... Also the backrow is immune to Ground, and can take some other hits as well as kill them fast (Lando) or stall them down (Steela). I think this Duo can easily take out many Mono-Type Ground teams.
Lightningrod/Voltabsorb:
Immune to the main attacks of my leads, but they cant hurt me much, too. Kokos HP Ground helps.
Fire Types:
This team has one Fire Weakness, but no resistance. There are some Fire Mons that dont go down quickly, but can deal huge amounts of Damage with STAB-FlareBlitz etc. My leads can do some damage of course, and Landorus (who has a really nice Speed, slightly outspeeding for instance Charizard (X/Y), Typhlosion, Entei, Ninetales, Mega-Blaziken (before Speed Boost), Volcarona.) can KO many of them with Sheer Force STAB LO Earthpower.
Scarfer:
Some Scarfer are really dangerous to this team. Garchomp sadly cant be KOed by Dazzling Gleam + Fake Out. Darmanitan also is super dangerous; only Lando survives non-crit Flareblitz savely.
Eruption Spam also can be unconvenient (as Fire Mons in general are) if it appears in the wrong situations. In turn one i can Fake Out + Discharge, reducing the damage. In other situations i might lose my leads since i cant switch Lando/Steela in. Once they are in, i can use Wide Guard/Earthpower.
As always with Scarfer one needs to play smartly around.
Alolan Marowak:
He gets a special mention. Only Landorus can OHKO him, but my whole team is a OHKO to Flareblitz. Thats one reason to play Koko with HP Ground: Together with Raichus Surf they also can kill Marowak.
I guess once this team is played, some other threats will make it on that list.
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Posting a new 50 streak with my personal challenge with reaching 50 streaks with as many mega Pokemon as possible. I am now adding Blastoise to my list of completion that includes Kangashan, Medicham, Beedrill, Charizard Y, and Garchomp! I got to a streak of 54 with this team.
Team Mega Buff Guys
Blastoise @ Blastoisite
Ability: Torrent --> Mega Launcher
EVs: 200 Hp / 252 SpA / 56 SpD
Lax Nature (should just a neutral nature instead)
- Hydro Pump
- Aqua Jet
- Aura Sphere
- Dark Pulse
The star of the show, Mega Blastoise is a no fuss beater with great coverage, 2HKO just about everything not specially defensive while tanking like a champ. Hydro Pump is chosen to make it hit as hard as possible, because that's what it does the best. It can usually live with missing a hit here or there thanks to how tanky it is. I was pretty lazy with breeding, that's why I added some SpD EV to compensate, otherwise it would be 252 Hp.
Buzzwole @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 4 Hp / 252 Atk / 252 Sp
Bashful Nature (should be Adamant instead, this probably costed me the streak)
- Hammer Arm
- Leech Life
- Earthquake
- Poison Jab
Originally I had scarf-Xurkitree in this spot, but after getting beat down by grass teams, I turned to Buzzwole. It's job is to act as a finisher and to antagonize against grass Pokemon. With a wide coverage set, it is very good at doing just that.
Landorus-Therian @ Assault Vest
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 4 Hp/ 252 Atk / 252 Sp
Lonely Nature (should be Jolly instead, GTS trading not being kind to me...)
- Earthquake
- Fly
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
The pivot of the team. Landorus likes to come in, intimidate, and U-turn out if it cannot defeat the opponent, which is rarely. Some people don't like Fly, but it works just like any other attack in the Battle Tree since opponent rarely prepares for it (but when it did, I lost, see the video below). With Fly and Earthquake, Landorus becomes the perfect complement to fight against Blastoise's natural enemies.
I always enjoy playing teams that can come straight out the gate and beat face instead of ones that need to stall and setup. Every Pokemon in this team does just that. They don't think, they just smash you. Beat one down, and the next one will smack you just as hard. They also provide each other with coverage. I liken them to bunch of dumb thugs who spent too much time at the gym. They got each other's back alright.
Here are the videos of legend battle and battle 55 in which I lost. I don't know what I could've done, that Eelektross was just too beastly and too bulky.
Legend battle:
P56G-WWWW-WWW8-5S5L
Battle #55:
BCGW-WWWW-WWW8-5S6C
Team Mega Buff Guys
Blastoise @ Blastoisite
Ability: Torrent --> Mega Launcher
EVs: 200 Hp / 252 SpA / 56 SpD
Lax Nature (should just a neutral nature instead)
- Hydro Pump
- Aqua Jet
- Aura Sphere
- Dark Pulse
The star of the show, Mega Blastoise is a no fuss beater with great coverage, 2HKO just about everything not specially defensive while tanking like a champ. Hydro Pump is chosen to make it hit as hard as possible, because that's what it does the best. It can usually live with missing a hit here or there thanks to how tanky it is. I was pretty lazy with breeding, that's why I added some SpD EV to compensate, otherwise it would be 252 Hp.
Buzzwole @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 4 Hp / 252 Atk / 252 Sp
Bashful Nature (should be Adamant instead, this probably costed me the streak)
- Hammer Arm
- Leech Life
- Earthquake
- Poison Jab
Originally I had scarf-Xurkitree in this spot, but after getting beat down by grass teams, I turned to Buzzwole. It's job is to act as a finisher and to antagonize against grass Pokemon. With a wide coverage set, it is very good at doing just that.
Landorus-Therian @ Assault Vest
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 4 Hp/ 252 Atk / 252 Sp
Lonely Nature (should be Jolly instead, GTS trading not being kind to me...)
- Earthquake
- Fly
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
The pivot of the team. Landorus likes to come in, intimidate, and U-turn out if it cannot defeat the opponent, which is rarely. Some people don't like Fly, but it works just like any other attack in the Battle Tree since opponent rarely prepares for it (but when it did, I lost, see the video below). With Fly and Earthquake, Landorus becomes the perfect complement to fight against Blastoise's natural enemies.
I always enjoy playing teams that can come straight out the gate and beat face instead of ones that need to stall and setup. Every Pokemon in this team does just that. They don't think, they just smash you. Beat one down, and the next one will smack you just as hard. They also provide each other with coverage. I liken them to bunch of dumb thugs who spent too much time at the gym. They got each other's back alright.
Here are the videos of legend battle and battle 55 in which I lost. I don't know what I could've done, that Eelektross was just too beastly and too bulky.
Legend battle:
P56G-WWWW-WWW8-5S5L
Battle #55:
BCGW-WWWW-WWW8-5S6C
So.... I've noticed that in both the spreadsheet and turskain's damage calculator, Incineroar3 holds a Firium Z but has no fire move... o.o Is it a data mining error, or were GF too sleepy when they did that?? My few encounters with it did seem to confirm the data is right, but it never stayed on the field long enough for me to confirm the whole moveset or the item.
(My apologies if this has been asked/answered before, I searched and couldn't find any reference to it!)
(My apologies if this has been asked/answered before, I searched and couldn't find any reference to it!)
Thanks I think I'll start there! I actually have Chanseys bred on XY, do you happen to have a set handy? I think mine are Bold with Seismic Toss and everything else is standard.
Reporting a completed streak of 221 wins for Super Doubles. Same lead with a few changes to the sets, and completely swapped out the back-ups to deal with Electric types better. Expect another run lol because I wasn't all too happy about the loss (burn stalled) and probably could have gone further. Nonetheless, the changes to the team and more experience with A.I. tendencies, did help me get a better streak, so I'm interested to see how far the team can go, and with KokoChu lead in general.
Tapu Koko @ Choice Specs
Nature: Timid
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Dazzling Gleam
- Volt Switch
- Grass Knot
Alolan-Raichu @ Focus Sash
Nature: Modest
Ability: Surge Surfer
EVs: 174 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 78 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Psychic
- Electro Ball
- Fake Out
Kartana @ Electric Seed
Nature: Careful
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 180 HP / 4 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpD / 68 Spe
- Leaf Blade
- Smart Strike
- Sacred Sword
- Detect
Garchomp @ Groundium Z
Nature: Jolly
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Poison Jab
- Protect
I enjoyed how fast and straightforward it is to use the team with some battles ending up without losing anyone. The team could still use some improvements but with only a few close calls, it was a good run overall.
Tapu Koko @ Choice Specs
Nature: Timid
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Dazzling Gleam
- Volt Switch
- Grass Knot
Swapped HP Ice for Grass Knot (again). Admittedly, I didn't do the calcs when choosing between Grass Knot vs. HP Ice. I realized that it's really just for Landorus and Gliscor, both of which, can easily be dealt with, using Fake Out + Dazzling Gleam then Psychic. Moreover, it doesn't OHKO all pseudo legend sets (Dragonite-1,3/2,4 with Multiscale, Yache Berry Salamence-3, Garchomp-4 (Mega)) and other x4 Ice weak mons like Altaria and Torterra. On the other hand, Grass Knot was a lot more useful and guaranteed OHKOs to certain Ground types as an added bonus.
Alolan-Raichu @ Focus Sash
Nature: Modest
Ability: Surge Surfer
EVs: 174 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 78 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Psychic
- Electro Ball
- Fake Out
Decided to go with a more defensive set because of Raichu's frailty and lack of Protect. Sash works notably well against Sucker Punch and baiting attacks at 1 HP, at that point often getting a free switch-in usually by Kartana after say, a failed Sucker Punch, or a priority move (all physical), in which case Kartana shrugs off comfortably. This allows for a second Fake Out when Raichu comes back to replace a teammate.
Psychic was indispensable for hitting Ground types and for finishing off scarfed EQ users after Fake Out + Dazzling Gleam. Electro Ball still does big damage to slower mons, mostly turning 3HKOs into 2HKOs, and is arguably more useful than Protect or Grass Knot (considering two Grass moves in the team already). 78 Spe EVs to hit 280 speed and deal 150 BP damage up to 70 speed mons (65 if uninvested).
I've also made a list of mons that Electro Ball OHKOs which otherwise Thunderbolt (or Psychic) would not (for the 3/4 sets), although it's important to know the exact set to be sure it does.
Psychic was indispensable for hitting Ground types and for finishing off scarfed EQ users after Fake Out + Dazzling Gleam. Electro Ball still does big damage to slower mons, mostly turning 3HKOs into 2HKOs, and is arguably more useful than Protect or Grass Knot (considering two Grass moves in the team already). 78 Spe EVs to hit 280 speed and deal 150 BP damage up to 70 speed mons (65 if uninvested).
I've also made a list of mons that Electro Ball OHKOs which otherwise Thunderbolt (or Psychic) would not (for the 3/4 sets), although it's important to know the exact set to be sure it does.
Conkeldurr-4 (87.5% chance)
Escavalier-3,4 (62.5% chance)
Sableye-3 (81.3 % chance)
Gigalith-3
Reuniclus-3
Cofagrigus-3
Avalugg-3 (unless Sturdy)
Musharna-3 (62.5% chance)
Araquanid-4,3-(50% chance with Thunderbolt)
Aggron-4
Hariyama-3-(56.3% chance with Psychic)
Carbink-4 (81.3% chance)
Armaldo-4
Rampardos-4
Audino-4
Sableye-4
Mawile-3,4
Aggron-3
Beartic-3
Scizor-3 (62.5% chance)
Glaceon-4
Glaceon-3 (unless sashed)
Exploud-3 (87.5% chance)
Escavalier-3,4 (62.5% chance)
Sableye-3 (81.3 % chance)
Gigalith-3
Reuniclus-3
Cofagrigus-3
Avalugg-3 (unless Sturdy)
Musharna-3 (62.5% chance)
Araquanid-4,3-(50% chance with Thunderbolt)
Aggron-4
Hariyama-3-(56.3% chance with Psychic)
Carbink-4 (81.3% chance)
Armaldo-4
Rampardos-4
Audino-4
Sableye-4
Mawile-3,4
Aggron-3
Beartic-3
Scizor-3 (62.5% chance)
Glaceon-4
Glaceon-3 (unless sashed)
Exploud-3 (87.5% chance)
Kartana @ Electric Seed
Nature: Careful
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 180 HP / 4 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpD / 68 Spe
- Leaf Blade
- Smart Strike
- Sacred Sword
- Detect
Probably the most defensive Kartana set anyone has used so far (in the tree at least). I wanted to make use of Kartana's great defensive typing and patch up the stats that were lacking and hence, the given nature and spread.
Didn't know which item to use at first, since Garchomp had the Z move, and Assault Vest was too risky to run without proper Fire support (Tectonic Rage can only be so useful). I was using Air Balloon for a while so Garchomp can EQ freely without having to use Protect, and switch in on Ground types, but it seemed lacking and breaks with one hit.
Eventually, I settled with Electric Seed to complement the set, and basically turned Kartana into a physical tank (minus SE hits but can tank some Fighting moves if necessary). The added defense allows Kartana to take on the bulkiest of physical attackers (mostly Ground, Rock, Steel, and Normal types) and hit them for SE damage. 68 Spe EVs to outspeed 137 speed Fighting type and coverage mons by 1 point. This makes Kartana the slowest member of the team and is particularly useful for picking off free boosts if the others weren't able to get the KO.
Take note, even with all the investment Kartana's SpD is still average at best. The intention was to tank neutral special attacks and shrug off NVE special attacks well enough to counter back at them while maintaining relatively high health, since Kartana doesn't always OHKO every special attacker out there and is prone to being revenge killed in return. Grass typing also provides an Electric resist, which is somewhat neutralized by terrain, but still useful (unless paralyzed).
Didn't know which item to use at first, since Garchomp had the Z move, and Assault Vest was too risky to run without proper Fire support (Tectonic Rage can only be so useful). I was using Air Balloon for a while so Garchomp can EQ freely without having to use Protect, and switch in on Ground types, but it seemed lacking and breaks with one hit.
Eventually, I settled with Electric Seed to complement the set, and basically turned Kartana into a physical tank (minus SE hits but can tank some Fighting moves if necessary). The added defense allows Kartana to take on the bulkiest of physical attackers (mostly Ground, Rock, Steel, and Normal types) and hit them for SE damage. 68 Spe EVs to outspeed 137 speed Fighting type and coverage mons by 1 point. This makes Kartana the slowest member of the team and is particularly useful for picking off free boosts if the others weren't able to get the KO.
Take note, even with all the investment Kartana's SpD is still average at best. The intention was to tank neutral special attacks and shrug off NVE special attacks well enough to counter back at them while maintaining relatively high health, since Kartana doesn't always OHKO every special attacker out there and is prone to being revenge killed in return. Grass typing also provides an Electric resist, which is somewhat neutralized by terrain, but still useful (unless paralyzed).
Garchomp @ Groundium Z
Nature: Jolly
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Poison Jab
- Protect
Same set as in Josh C.'s team except the 4 EVs are in HP (no need to set up 4 subs now lol). Everyone was able to take advantage of Electric Terrain in one way or another (Terrain setter Koko and speed boost Raichu, while both gaining an Electric boost; Defense boost Kartana; anti sleep lol) but with the disadvantage of boosting opposing Electric types so I wanted something that would serve as an anti terrain abuser and a Ground type seemed to be the best answer.
Tectonic Rage was a must because the 2 leads didn't have Protect and also gets rid of (grounded) evasion boosters. Poison Jab hits Grass types which aren't much of a threat aside from Electric resist and some with Bug type coverage. It also hits Fairy types hard in case Garchomp has to deal with them.
Tectonic Rage was a must because the 2 leads didn't have Protect and also gets rid of (grounded) evasion boosters. Poison Jab hits Grass types which aren't much of a threat aside from Electric resist and some with Bug type coverage. It also hits Fairy types hard in case Garchomp has to deal with them.
Same as the first team although Electric and Ground types are much easier to deal with now thanks to the changes in the team. Haven't had a battle when TR went up during the streak but there was one with Tailwind, which is posted in the replays.
Rotom sets are particularly annoying since Z move can't hit them and the most dangerous one would have to be Rotom-Heat as it threatens Kartana and resists Koko's Dazzling Gleam.
Fake Out and Sucker Punch users are also bothersome so I use Fake Out on them turn 1 (or on the partner since Sucker Punch fails with Fake Out).
Hail and Sandstorm setters get a special mention for breaking Raichu's sash, but is usually good news for Kartana since it has coverage for them.
Inner Focus mons while not necessarily a threat can waste a Fake Out if not identified as such.
Rotom sets are particularly annoying since Z move can't hit them and the most dangerous one would have to be Rotom-Heat as it threatens Kartana and resists Koko's Dazzling Gleam.
Fake Out and Sucker Punch users are also bothersome so I use Fake Out on them turn 1 (or on the partner since Sucker Punch fails with Fake Out).
Hail and Sandstorm setters get a special mention for breaking Raichu's sash, but is usually good news for Kartana since it has coverage for them.
Inner Focus mons while not necessarily a threat can waste a Fake Out if not identified as such.
Battle 112 vs Punk Guy Dustin LJTW-WWWW-WWW8-628Q
Quadruple Intimidate which reminded me why I shouldn't lead with physical attackers lol.
Battle 172 vs Punk Girl Zed MCNG-WWWW-WWW8-6293
Beedrill immune to Psychic screwed up the first turn thanks to it actually being Zoroark but after that I always made sure to check if the trainer has possible Zoroark sets and avoid using Psychic if I can help it (Thunderbolt also OHKOs Beedrill).
Battle 187 vs Veteran Kikujiro VE8G-WWWW-WWW8-6296
All Electric team although I encountered him only once during the streak. Didn't use Tectonic Rage as the last two mons were part Flying and highlights the team's capabilities outside of Electric moves.
Battle 194 vs Ace Trainer Lea 5KVW-WWWW-WWW8-629D
The one battle when Tailwind was set up because I didn't want a Quiver or Teeter Dance party from Lilligant and knowing I had Kartana at the back to deal with Whimsicott.
Loss
Battle 222 vs Dancer Carrie 3VJG-WWWW-WWW8-629P
Should've targeted Weezing first but I was preoccupied with Abomasnow threatening Garchomp. Weezing mocks Garchomp with Levitate then takes nice little naps knowing full well that his enemies are slowly burning to death lol. The freeze didn't help at all (again) and I like the description if it's a 10HKO or more in turskain's damage calculator: 252 Atk burned Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. +3 252 HP / 0 Def Weezing: 12-15 (6.9 - 8.7%) -- possibly the worst move ever.
Quadruple Intimidate which reminded me why I shouldn't lead with physical attackers lol.
Battle 172 vs Punk Girl Zed MCNG-WWWW-WWW8-6293
Beedrill immune to Psychic screwed up the first turn thanks to it actually being Zoroark but after that I always made sure to check if the trainer has possible Zoroark sets and avoid using Psychic if I can help it (Thunderbolt also OHKOs Beedrill).
Battle 187 vs Veteran Kikujiro VE8G-WWWW-WWW8-6296
All Electric team although I encountered him only once during the streak. Didn't use Tectonic Rage as the last two mons were part Flying and highlights the team's capabilities outside of Electric moves.
Battle 194 vs Ace Trainer Lea 5KVW-WWWW-WWW8-629D
The one battle when Tailwind was set up because I didn't want a Quiver or Teeter Dance party from Lilligant and knowing I had Kartana at the back to deal with Whimsicott.
Loss
Battle 222 vs Dancer Carrie 3VJG-WWWW-WWW8-629P
Should've targeted Weezing first but I was preoccupied with Abomasnow threatening Garchomp. Weezing mocks Garchomp with Levitate then takes nice little naps knowing full well that his enemies are slowly burning to death lol. The freeze didn't help at all (again) and I like the description if it's a 10HKO or more in turskain's damage calculator: 252 Atk burned Garchomp Dragon Claw vs. +3 252 HP / 0 Def Weezing: 12-15 (6.9 - 8.7%) -- possibly the worst move ever.
I enjoyed how fast and straightforward it is to use the team with some battles ending up without losing anyone. The team could still use some improvements but with only a few close calls, it was a good run overall.
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I could be wrong, but I seem to remember hearing that Darkest Lariat was originally going to be a Fire-type move and was later changed to Dark-type.
If this is the case, the Firium-Z Incineroar-3 could be a hold over from that situation...
Ahhh, that's really interesting, and makes a lot of sense, it would also explain why Incineroar3 has both Darkest Lariat and Throat Chop!
I lost a streak at nearly one hundred fifty, but know I could get past two hundred with this team. I'm not losing because the team is flawed, I'm losing because I'm making stupid mistakes, but I'm learning from them. I don't feel like I'm struggling much with this team, so I don't think I need advice, but who knows? Maybe someone will think of something I haven't. (Like better EVs) I'm not posting for the leader board yet. I'm posting because I figured that some people would like to see what I've been up to. (I'm looking at you Smuckem. :D)
This team works in the same way all of my others do, by nuking everything with moves so powerful that resisting the moves is required to have a chance at survival. Unlike my other teams, this one uses Trick Room. I knew Mega Charizard Y and Scarf Typhlosion were just a little to weak to work in Doubles, and Discharge Spam didn't work that well, but there was one thing left to try. Sun. Again. By Adding Trick Room to Sun, I could use Torkoal and Mega Camerupt which would be enough extra power to succeed where my Triples Team would fail and give me Gen 3 Nostalgia. (Still annoyed about the removal of Triples...) Oranguru could also be used not just to set up Trick Room, but act as duplicate of its team mate with Instruct. It looked promising, but I still needed a fourth Pokemon. Exploud was in the Field Egg Group and I only had 0 Speed IV Pokemon in that Egg Group so I decided to try it. It want as badly as you'd expect, but not because of Boomburst KOing my own team or being fast for a Trick Room Pokemon. Exploud didn't work because the team fell apart if I couldn't get Trick Room up. After that I breed a Pangoro for it's low speed, niche in Parting Shot, and being in the Human Like Egg Group so I could breed a Hariyama with it. (I never tried the Pangoro.) Hariyama's Fake Out let Oranguru survive long enough for Trick Room every time and Flame Orb Guts Close Combat, like everything else on this team, is stupid when it hits twice. Now that I have my team, I just need to name it. After calculating the Spam Power, how this?
PRIMAL GROUDON TRICK ROOM ERUPTION SPAM!
Yes, really.
Shall we begin?
Oranguru @ Lum Berry
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 204 HP / 236 Def / 68 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Instruct
- Psychic
- Protect
- Trick Room
EVs Shamelessly stolen from kneeshoeshoe's team on Page 87. It's an interesting team, so you should check it out.
Tubby (Hariyama) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
Brave Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
IVs: 0 Spe
- Close Combat
- Facade
- Knock Off
- Fake Out
"Groudon" (Torkoal) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Drought
Quiet Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
IVs: 0 Spe
- Eruption
- Heat Wave
- Solar Beam
- Protect
I will admit that the choice of Choice Specs over a Flame Plate is purely a "Drunk on Power" choice and is likely to screw me over, but I honestly feel like the extra power can help a little bit and I'd rather have more fun with extra power even if it's more likely to make me lose.
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Also "Groudon" (Camerupt) @ Red Orb (Cameruptite)
Ability: Magma Armor --> Sheer Force
Quiet Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
IVs: 0 Spe
- Eruption
- Heat Wave
- Earth Power
- Solar Beam
Team Weaknesses
Math about how stupidly Powerful Eruption Spam is
Don't worry, it's just multiplication, and it explains why I call this team "Primal Groudon Eruption Spam"
The way I view things, I've done the equivalent of not only smuggling The King of Ubers into The Battle Tree, but also breaking the Species Clause with it to make The Ultimate Spam Team. Some people go with well built teams with synergy, but me, Groudon. Just Groudon. I hope you enjoyed reading this as much as I liked writing it because that was my main reason for writing this.
This team works in the same way all of my others do, by nuking everything with moves so powerful that resisting the moves is required to have a chance at survival. Unlike my other teams, this one uses Trick Room. I knew Mega Charizard Y and Scarf Typhlosion were just a little to weak to work in Doubles, and Discharge Spam didn't work that well, but there was one thing left to try. Sun. Again. By Adding Trick Room to Sun, I could use Torkoal and Mega Camerupt which would be enough extra power to succeed where my Triples Team would fail and give me Gen 3 Nostalgia. (Still annoyed about the removal of Triples...) Oranguru could also be used not just to set up Trick Room, but act as duplicate of its team mate with Instruct. It looked promising, but I still needed a fourth Pokemon. Exploud was in the Field Egg Group and I only had 0 Speed IV Pokemon in that Egg Group so I decided to try it. It want as badly as you'd expect, but not because of Boomburst KOing my own team or being fast for a Trick Room Pokemon. Exploud didn't work because the team fell apart if I couldn't get Trick Room up. After that I breed a Pangoro for it's low speed, niche in Parting Shot, and being in the Human Like Egg Group so I could breed a Hariyama with it. (I never tried the Pangoro.) Hariyama's Fake Out let Oranguru survive long enough for Trick Room every time and Flame Orb Guts Close Combat, like everything else on this team, is stupid when it hits twice. Now that I have my team, I just need to name it. After calculating the Spam Power, how this?
PRIMAL GROUDON TRICK ROOM ERUPTION SPAM!
Yes, really.
Shall we begin?
Oranguru @ Lum Berry
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 204 HP / 236 Def / 68 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Instruct
- Psychic
- Protect
- Trick Room
EVs Shamelessly stolen from kneeshoeshoe's team on Page 87. It's an interesting team, so you should check it out.
This thing can not be OHKOed. Well, he can, but that's not much of an exaggeration. I'd post the small list of things that can OHKO this beast, but I'd rather not steal that from kneeshoeshoe's post too, but if you don't want to check it out, trust me. It's a small list. As I said earlier, this team falls apart without Trick Room, so I needed something that always sets up Trick Room. Inner Focus to prevent Flinch and a Lum Berry preventing Paralysis, Sleep, and Confusion lets Oranguru use Trick Room every time. Aggron and Thundurus can use Taunt on Oranguru, but Hariyama can use Fake Out on them. After Trick Room is used, I need four KOs in four turns. Oranguru's Attack Stats are pathetic for that, but he doesn't use his own stats when "attacking." When I said Instruct lets Oranguru act like a duplicate of its team mate, I meant it. Making a Pokemon attack a second time makes Oranguru unreplaceable. It's annoying when the team mate gets KOed between its move and Oranguru's because it pretty much wastes Oranguru's move, but even with that down side, Instruct is still way better than Helping Hand could ever be. I heard that Oranguru is arguably the best Trick Room setter there is, and after trying it, I agree.
Side Note: I usually don't like pure support Pokemon because even though I know they're helping a ton with moves like Helping Hand, there's not much of a visual way to tell how much they help and they deal disappointing damage with their attacks, so it doesn't feel like they don't do much. Oranguru is the complete opposite. (Unless he has to use Psychic on something other than Toxicroak.)
Side Note: I usually don't like pure support Pokemon because even though I know they're helping a ton with moves like Helping Hand, there's not much of a visual way to tell how much they help and they deal disappointing damage with their attacks, so it doesn't feel like they don't do much. Oranguru is the complete opposite. (Unless he has to use Psychic on something other than Toxicroak.)
Tubby (Hariyama) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
Brave Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
IVs: 0 Spe
- Close Combat
- Facade
- Knock Off
- Fake Out
You'd expect a team built around Groudon to lead with Groudon, but nope, Hariyama is needed as the second lead. Using Fake Out on the most threatening Pokemon will guarantee that Trick Room goes off. If there is no threat, you can use Fake Out to break Focus Sashes and Sturdy that the opponent might have. Turn Two, Hariyama gets burned and is ready to watch the world burn. Close Combat is a nuke that also lowers his defenses, which sounds like a down side, but if Hariyama goes down, that means I get to sent in Groudon. Because of that, I don't know if lowered defenses are a downside or not. That said, Hariyama can sweep teams, and often does despite the Primal Groudon Eruption Spam plan when he hits twice per turn. Facade is Power 140 compared to Close Combat's 180 with Stab and about as effective as the coverage for Fighting Resists would be, (Ice Punch being 150 against Birds and Knock Off being 195 + 130 averaging 162.5 over two hits against Psychic Types) so there's no reason not to use it. If you think that Ice Punch may be better, it's annoying using a Power 75 Move with Instruct after scoring a KO. It might be better if you're not using Instruct, but with Instruct, Facade is just better. The Fighting/Normal coverage is walled by Ghosts, which makes them annoying, but Knock Off hits them hard. Unfortunately, it's still a 2HKO on bulky Ghosts, but it's better than nothing.
Note to self about using Hariyama: Sturdy and Thunder Wave do not make a Pokemon the better target for Fake Out and Ghost does not mean kill on sight. Consider what's a bigger threat to the rest of the team instead of just what's a bigger threat to Hariyama.
Note to self about using Hariyama: Sturdy and Thunder Wave do not make a Pokemon the better target for Fake Out and Ghost does not mean kill on sight. Consider what's a bigger threat to the rest of the team instead of just what's a bigger threat to Hariyama.
"Groudon" (Torkoal) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Drought
Quiet Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
IVs: 0 Spe
- Eruption
- Heat Wave
- Solar Beam
- Protect
About the team name, wouldn't it be funny if you could smuggle Primal Groudon into the Battle Tree and spam Eruption with it? Well, Torkoal has -20 in both Defenses and -30 HP compared to Primal Groudon and he lacks the Ground Typing, but according to my calculations Choice Specs Torkoal has the same amount of power! A stupid amount of power that 2HKOs even resists like Salamence! Eruption is a Nuke, Survivors are classified as a Critically Endangered Species, and I am the leading cause of Global Warming. HAHAHAHA! Err, sorry about that. I tend to get drunk on power when I use Primal Groudon in the Battle Tree. Anyway, nothing can go wrong with Choice Locked Eruption! But seriously, I'm happy with Eruption's Power until Torkoal goes from 177 HP to 100 (About Power 85) and the boost from the far less inane Flame Plate to the Choice Specs does help score KOs against some otherwise threatening Pokemon like Mega Salamence and Primarina. Heat Wave is for when Torkoal is switching back in after switching out or when Trick Room is going to run out or is already down. Switching is rare, so it's almost always the latter. Solar Beam is worth it when it's at least four times more effective than Eruption and KOing the target is more important than using Eruption. It's rarely used, especially because Instruct doesn't work on it, but a still nice to have. Protect is leftover from when I was using a Flame Plate and even back then, it wasn't used. I need to replace Protect with Earth Power to hit Flash Fire Pokemon, but I'm pretty unmotivated to breed another Torkoal just for a move I'll probably only use once if ever.
Also "Groudon" (Camerupt) @ Red Orb (Cameruptite)
Ability: Magma Armor --> Sheer Force
Quiet Nature
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
IVs: 0 Spe
- Eruption
- Heat Wave
- Earth Power
- Solar Beam
When the Sun is out, Mega Camerupt is like ANOTHER PRIMAL GROUDON, but with an accurate typing instead of accurate defenses. On this team Mega Camerupt works both as a Backup Torkoal or Oranguru because his Eruption is as powerful as Choice Specs Torkoal's Eruption and Heat Wave, thanks to Sheer Force, only downgrades to a Flame Plate Torkoal's Eruption. If you asking if I should have a variety of attack types to spam instead of just fire, then I'd like to two things. First, what part of "Primal Groudon Eruption Spam" do you not understand? Second, What's "Variety?" Earth Power is a Secondary Stab that happens to takes out Flash Fire Pokemon and Solar Beam, again, is for Pokemon hit way harder by it that have to die.
Magma Armor is the Pre-Mega Evolution Ability because even though Sun also prevents Freezing, it seems like the least useless ability. That said, it's still only slightly less useless than Anger Point. Solid Rock is probably more useful because it can do something if Camerupt somehow takes an Earthquake before Mega Evolution, but it's still pretty close in "Usefulness."
Magma Armor is the Pre-Mega Evolution Ability because even though Sun also prevents Freezing, it seems like the least useless ability. That said, it's still only slightly less useless than Anger Point. Solid Rock is probably more useful because it can do something if Camerupt somehow takes an Earthquake before Mega Evolution, but it's still pretty close in "Usefulness."
Team Weaknesses
- Turn Six
That's when Trick Room runs out. If the battle isn't pretty much over at this point, it's going to start to hurt. The good news is that Torkoal can deal a surprisingly high amount of damage with a Power 10 Eruption. (By that I mean around 25 Damage. You're screwed if that's your last stand.)
- Trick Room
Everyone hates facing Trick Room, even Trick Room. I lost my second run with a surprisingly low 82 Wins because the opponent lead with Slowbro and Slowking. I had no idea what to do because they both could have used Trick Room. I used Fake Out on Slowbro and Trick Room. Slowbro Mega Evolved and Flinched while Slowking also used Trick Room, which canceled mine out. I hoped they'd use Trick Room again, but instead, I got slaughtered. On the bright side, on the third run I faced the same lead and got revenge.
- Rain
Raise your hand if you didn't see this coming. I rarely switch out Pokemon, but when I do, I'm panicking for a very good reason. Torkoal, Retreat! Must get Drought again! (Camerupt does not like what usually happens next... Sorry Camerupt...)
- Sandstorm and Hail
Hahaha. No. Not enough of a debuff from Sun for me to care. Besides, Sandstorm Trainers are easily dealt with by Hariyama and Rock Types have low enough Special Defense that Eruption Spam still scores easy KOs.
- Hax on Hariyama
Battle 29, Run 3 The opponent lead with Confuse Ray Minior and Tyranitar. Hariyama hit itself in confusion so many turns in a row and Trick Room ran out before I KOed anything. I came close to rage quitting, but I won. Paralysis, Sleep, and Freezing can happen on Turn One because Hariyama isn't burned until after the first turn. Flinching is pretty rare.
- Hax on Torkoal or Camerupt
If that happens, it's probably because Trick Room isn't up. If it happens while Trick Room is up, then I don't know what happened.
- Special Tanks
Do they even do anything back if they live?
- Flash Fire
I'm not sure if I should cross that out or not because even though I do worry about Pokemon with Flash Fire, and for a very good reason, Camerupt OHKOs them all with Earth Power. Also, every Pokemon with Flash Fire has at least one other Ability so they feel even less threatening because there's a chance that I can take them out with Eruption.
- The Person Using the Team (Pressing the wrong button / Stupid Mistakes)
Sadly, that's not a joke. Using Fake Out on the Pokemon that was threatening to a previous team instead of the one that could KO Oranguru cost me the first run and I almost lost the third run because I saw that all pokemon were full health and thought that was because the battle just started. (I had KOed the first two Pokemon on the same turn, something IRL got my attention, then I used Trick Room and Fake Out a second time in one battle. That was a close battle...) Stupid Moves are one of the the biggest threat because I don't think ever... Why am I even confessing this? I should end this post before I confess something worse like that I sucked my thumb until I was fourteen... wait...
You should check my signature to find out what the N in CTNC stands for. (Spoiler: It stands for Noob.)
That's when Trick Room runs out. If the battle isn't pretty much over at this point, it's going to start to hurt. The good news is that Torkoal can deal a surprisingly high amount of damage with a Power 10 Eruption. (By that I mean around 25 Damage. You're screwed if that's your last stand.)
- Trick Room
Everyone hates facing Trick Room, even Trick Room. I lost my second run with a surprisingly low 82 Wins because the opponent lead with Slowbro and Slowking. I had no idea what to do because they both could have used Trick Room. I used Fake Out on Slowbro and Trick Room. Slowbro Mega Evolved and Flinched while Slowking also used Trick Room, which canceled mine out. I hoped they'd use Trick Room again, but instead, I got slaughtered. On the bright side, on the third run I faced the same lead and got revenge.
- Rain
Raise your hand if you didn't see this coming. I rarely switch out Pokemon, but when I do, I'm panicking for a very good reason. Torkoal, Retreat! Must get Drought again! (Camerupt does not like what usually happens next... Sorry Camerupt...)
Hahaha. No. Not enough of a debuff from Sun for me to care. Besides, Sandstorm Trainers are easily dealt with by Hariyama and Rock Types have low enough Special Defense that Eruption Spam still scores easy KOs.
- Hax on Hariyama
Battle 29, Run 3 The opponent lead with Confuse Ray Minior and Tyranitar. Hariyama hit itself in confusion so many turns in a row and Trick Room ran out before I KOed anything. I came close to rage quitting, but I won. Paralysis, Sleep, and Freezing can happen on Turn One because Hariyama isn't burned until after the first turn. Flinching is pretty rare.
If that happens, it's probably because Trick Room isn't up. If it happens while Trick Room is up, then I don't know what happened.
Do they even do anything back if they live?
- Flash Fire
I'm not sure if I should cross that out or not because even though I do worry about Pokemon with Flash Fire, and for a very good reason, Camerupt OHKOs them all with Earth Power. Also, every Pokemon with Flash Fire has at least one other Ability so they feel even less threatening because there's a chance that I can take them out with Eruption.
- The Person Using the Team (Pressing the wrong button / Stupid Mistakes)
Sadly, that's not a joke. Using Fake Out on the Pokemon that was threatening to a previous team instead of the one that could KO Oranguru cost me the first run and I almost lost the third run because I saw that all pokemon were full health and thought that was because the battle just started. (I had KOed the first two Pokemon on the same turn, something IRL got my attention, then I used Trick Room and Fake Out a second time in one battle. That was a close battle...) Stupid Moves are one of the the biggest threat because I don't think ever... Why am I even confessing this? I should end this post before I confess something worse like that I sucked my thumb until I was fourteen... wait...
You should check my signature to find out what the N in CTNC stands for. (Spoiler: It stands for Noob.)
Math about how stupidly Powerful Eruption Spam is
Don't worry, it's just multiplication, and it explains why I call this team "Primal Groudon Eruption Spam"
When calculating how powerful a Pokemon is, I multiply the Attack Stat it's using, the Power of the Move being spammed, the Item and Ability boosts if any, and the Weather or Terrain that's buffing it. I call the result Spam Power, or SP for short. For example, Mega Camerupt has 216 Special Attack, Torkoal has a Special Attack of 150, and they both use the Power 150 Eruption which leads to this.
Quiet Mega Camerupt Eruption SP - 216 * 150 * 1.5 = 48600
Quiet Specs Torkoal Eruption SP - 150 * 150 * 1.5 * 1.5 = 50625
I didn't know I could hit 50000! To give you an idea of how insane that is, let's compare that to my leads for the Brute Force Triples team that got me over 700 wins.
Timid Solar Power Life Orb Heliolisk SP = 177 * 90 * 1.3 * 1.5 = 31063
Modest Mega Charizard Y Heat Wave SP = 232 * 95 * 1.5 = 33060
Modest Scarf Typhlosion Eruption SP = 177 * 150 *1.5 = 39825
Torkoal's power is like if you gave Choice Specs to Mega Zard Y! Even the heaviest hitter deals about 4/5 as much as Torkoal! Now because I've been calling this Primal Groudon Eruption Spam, why don't we calculate Primal Groudon Eruption SP?
Modest Primal Groudon Eruption SP = 222 * 150 * 1.5 = 49950
As you can see, that's just 675 lower than Torkoal's SP, or in other words, the equivalent of 3 points of Special Attack which is an undetectable difference. I wasn't joking when I said this team is Primal Groudon Eruption Spam. If any team gives me the right to go mad with power, it's this one.
Quiet Mega Camerupt Eruption SP - 216 * 150 * 1.5 = 48600
Quiet Specs Torkoal Eruption SP - 150 * 150 * 1.5 * 1.5 = 50625
I didn't know I could hit 50000! To give you an idea of how insane that is, let's compare that to my leads for the Brute Force Triples team that got me over 700 wins.
Timid Solar Power Life Orb Heliolisk SP = 177 * 90 * 1.3 * 1.5 = 31063
Modest Mega Charizard Y Heat Wave SP = 232 * 95 * 1.5 = 33060
Modest Scarf Typhlosion Eruption SP = 177 * 150 *1.5 = 39825
Torkoal's power is like if you gave Choice Specs to Mega Zard Y! Even the heaviest hitter deals about 4/5 as much as Torkoal! Now because I've been calling this Primal Groudon Eruption Spam, why don't we calculate Primal Groudon Eruption SP?
Modest Primal Groudon Eruption SP = 222 * 150 * 1.5 = 49950
As you can see, that's just 675 lower than Torkoal's SP, or in other words, the equivalent of 3 points of Special Attack which is an undetectable difference. I wasn't joking when I said this team is Primal Groudon Eruption Spam. If any team gives me the right to go mad with power, it's this one.
The way I view things, I've done the equivalent of not only smuggling The King of Ubers into The Battle Tree, but also breaking the Species Clause with it to make The Ultimate Spam Team. Some people go with well built teams with synergy, but me, Groudon. Just Groudon. I hope you enjoyed reading this as much as I liked writing it because that was my main reason for writing this.
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I have to give big credit to CTNC for making a weather/TR combination work.
Gives me hope to manage to make the TRain combination work. I'm also glad to see that I'm not the only one who finds "double status" leads threatening for TR setters.
As for Rain... I remind running some calc for Hariyama, and noticing that I couldn't find a single occurrence of Facade being useful, and Hariyama does learn Sunny Day. Just a thought.
Gives me hope to manage to make the TRain combination work. I'm also glad to see that I'm not the only one who finds "double status" leads threatening for TR setters.
As for Rain... I remind running some calc for Hariyama, and noticing that I couldn't find a single occurrence of Facade being useful, and Hariyama does learn Sunny Day. Just a thought.
I don't know how I missed that. Hidden Power is the move that isn't used.
Thanks. :)
It's weird that you couldn't find any good calcs for Facade, because it's extremely useful. Maybe that's because it doesn't OHKO anything threatening to the team or we're not looking at it the same way. Gaining OHKOs even on nonthreatening Pokemon is still really good when you have four turns to fight. There's a lot of frail Psychic, Fairy, and Flying Pokemon that are OHKOed by Facade, like Mega Alakazam, Sylveon, and Tornadus and Fake Out can help gain some more KOs. Because of Ornaguru, I'm also fine with 2HKOs, and everything that resists Fighting is 2HKOed. Even if Hariyama only gets one Facade on something before getting KOed, Eruption is a guarantee KO afterward.