Ahh, here's one from the recent media cycle: terrains affecting flying pokemon. I loved terrains since their inception and when i saw video evidence of corvinknight healing from grassy terrain i was pumped. Sadly, if you watched the whole video it was knocked down by a dwebble earlier. Would have been neat to see stuff like zapdos tske full advantage of electric terrain or lugia with psychic terrain
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Botched predictions for Pokemon games
- Thread starter Yung Dramps
- Start date
Theorymonning in the very beginning of new gens tends to yield some funny results. I recall an old issue of The Smog from early Gen V that postulated Reuniclus would define the metagame for generations to come. Haxorus would surely break the metagame forever with that ridiculous Attack stat - echoing what was said about Rampardos a generation before, by the way. Conversely, Mega Kangaskhan and Pinsir were both found to be rather underwhelming when they were fully revealed. And I think the general consensus of Gen 8 theorymonning was that Eiscue would be a Pokémon to really look out for in the higher tiers.
I also remember a bit of ridiculousness from Gen V, when BW2 were revealed. Kyurem was set to get new formes, and there were two moves hidden in the game data: Freeze Shock and Ice Burn. But these were both charge moves, making them somewhat underwhelming. A lot of people thought the ability of the Kyurem formes would negate the charge turn of these moves. I always found this one particularly stupid, because if the moves were only meant to be used by the Kyurem formes in the first place, why would they even be made as charge moves?
I also remember a bit of ridiculousness from Gen V, when BW2 were revealed. Kyurem was set to get new formes, and there were two moves hidden in the game data: Freeze Shock and Ice Burn. But these were both charge moves, making them somewhat underwhelming. A lot of people thought the ability of the Kyurem formes would negate the charge turn of these moves. I always found this one particularly stupid, because if the moves were only meant to be used by the Kyurem formes in the first place, why would they even be made as charge moves?
In fairness, that was before we knew how Ice Face worked and we thought it regenerated whenever hail was active, making it essentially immune to most physical damage
1. BW2 would have a Battle Frontier. Kind of silly, considering that PWT and Treehollow/Black Tower were enough of a facility.
2. XY would be sequels to BW. Kind of stupid, but I really loved Gen 5 and did not want it to end. I also thought Xerneas would represent Hell and Yveltal would represent Heaven.
3. SM would you allow you to Surf freely on the waters surrounding Alola. As you surf, you could find new islands to explore filled with different kind of Pokemon to catch explore. I knew it was unlikely due to GF's current design philosophy, but it would have been cool. Legend of Zelda: Phantom Hourglass did a similar thing on the DS, so surely 3DS handle it right? Nope. I guess it should have been expected considering GF's current design philosophy, but whenever I look at the Alola region's map I just can't help but think its a missed opportunity.
2. XY would be sequels to BW. Kind of stupid, but I really loved Gen 5 and did not want it to end. I also thought Xerneas would represent Hell and Yveltal would represent Heaven.
3. SM would you allow you to Surf freely on the waters surrounding Alola. As you surf, you could find new islands to explore filled with different kind of Pokemon to catch explore. I knew it was unlikely due to GF's current design philosophy, but it would have been cool. Legend of Zelda: Phantom Hourglass did a similar thing on the DS, so surely 3DS handle it right? Nope. I guess it should have been expected considering GF's current design philosophy, but whenever I look at the Alola region's map I just can't help but think its a missed opportunity.
Oh, this reminded me of another one: There was a theory that Xerneas represented the nervous system and that Yveltal was sinew and muscle, based off of their respective designs, and that the Z legendary would be somehow thematically based off of bone. Honestly, it was pretty cool--and could have been a nice little subtextual addition to the existing flavor of the Kalos legends being a life/death cycle. Though I suppose Zygarde does have a cellular motif already.
Probably not too far off, just in a different direction. Zygarde's cell connection is painfully obvious but Yveltal does faintly resemble anerve
I always saw a chromosome motif in Xerneas' horns.
And then mega evolution's symbol is a DNA helix.
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anyone remember when people thought Yveltal was blind and was Sound Type?
On the topic of Zygarde, the two later forms made it a whole lot more suspicious.
50% is based of Jormungrandr, the snake encircling the mortal world (it's actually not the only snake in the cosmology of Nordic myth, but the other one is completely unrelated to both life/death and balance). Okay, possibly not the most fitting to use something so out of focus in the myths but it's pretty obvious why you wanted a serpentine body, and you could possibly run with the fact that its a sign of the end times when J stops biting its own tail.
10% and 100% are based on J's siblings, the wolf Fenrir (complete with a collar as a nod to Fenrir's imprisonment) and the goddess Hel. Hel actually works surprisingly well as a basis for something in Zygarde's role despite being a deity of death: She's been depicted as half-alive and half-undead. Fenrir, however is a beast of destruction, whose only destined role is to kill Odin.
But the real stinger comes from the fact that all three of these entities are grouped together. In the nordic myths, they went their own ways pretty much immediately, and only come together to fight with their father during the end of the world. Their father is Loki, and they are not fighting to keep the world intact. If there is any motivation of balance here, it is declaring that the world is too far gone and needs to be purged and restarted. In other words, when Zygarde fights at full strength, do not expect it to be interested in not destroying everything you know and love.
Come to think of it, that 'irreperable unbalance' ideology is pretty close to what Team Flare was talking about, and while Loki's children kill the other gods, the actual destruction of the realms falls to a being of fire. Might have been interesting if Z had Lysandre convincing the legendary to help rather than forcing it to fuel the Weapon.
50% is based of Jormungrandr, the snake encircling the mortal world (it's actually not the only snake in the cosmology of Nordic myth, but the other one is completely unrelated to both life/death and balance). Okay, possibly not the most fitting to use something so out of focus in the myths but it's pretty obvious why you wanted a serpentine body, and you could possibly run with the fact that its a sign of the end times when J stops biting its own tail.
10% and 100% are based on J's siblings, the wolf Fenrir (complete with a collar as a nod to Fenrir's imprisonment) and the goddess Hel. Hel actually works surprisingly well as a basis for something in Zygarde's role despite being a deity of death: She's been depicted as half-alive and half-undead. Fenrir, however is a beast of destruction, whose only destined role is to kill Odin.
But the real stinger comes from the fact that all three of these entities are grouped together. In the nordic myths, they went their own ways pretty much immediately, and only come together to fight with their father during the end of the world. Their father is Loki, and they are not fighting to keep the world intact. If there is any motivation of balance here, it is declaring that the world is too far gone and needs to be purged and restarted. In other words, when Zygarde fights at full strength, do not expect it to be interested in not destroying everything you know and love.
Come to think of it, that 'irreperable unbalance' ideology is pretty close to what Team Flare was talking about, and while Loki's children kill the other gods, the actual destruction of the realms falls to a being of fire. Might have been interesting if Z had Lysandre convincing the legendary to help rather than forcing it to fuel the Weapon.
is 100% based on Hel? LikeI guess once you make the Fenrir connection, Hel is obviously something to be dragged in but I dunno...
Nothing about this really screams "Hel, the goddess of Hel" to me. Wasn't Hel's big "thing" being her imagry evoked life on the top half and death on the bottom half?
I mean, to be fair, I dont know what figure I would associate with 100% and Pokemon always takes extreme liberties with pokemon. Landorus is based on a female fox spirit, iirc.
But still seems like there would be something more concrete here. Over the years I think i've heard both Odin & Loki brought up as possibilities which is starting to make me think it might be too vague a concept to pin down to anything.
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But since we're still on the Zygarde train. I definitely remember thinking this thing would be on par or stronger than the Black/White Kyurems. Very powerful, if posibly slow. ANd, well, I mean. I think most people expected some severe buff to its stats but I don't think anyone expected moving 10 points from speed to Special Attack and then +108 HP.
I feel like I'm usually pretty good at guessing what if a Pokémon will get a move or not (not huge stretches for either, but I called Mienshao getting Aura Sphere when I first saw it, and assuming the Home TM datamine is at least somewhat legit, I assumed Registeel would get Body Press). The one case I specifically remember being wrong about, and one that still leaves me a little bitter, is Drifblim not getting Flamethrower/Heat Wave.
I was so sure that this hot-air balloon Pokémon would get Flamethrower for flavor (I may have also been guessing from it being on Flint's team), but it didn't. And when Platinum/HGSS rolled around with Heat Wave (Hot Wind) as a tutor, it didn't get that either, despite getting several other wind-based attacks (Gust, Icy Wind, Ominous Wind).
I'm also a little surprised it doesn't get HURRICANE.
I was so sure that this hot-air balloon Pokémon would get Flamethrower for flavor (I may have also been guessing from it being on Flint's team), but it didn't. And when Platinum/HGSS rolled around with Heat Wave (Hot Wind) as a tutor, it didn't get that either, despite getting several other wind-based attacks (Gust, Icy Wind, Ominous Wind).
I'm also a little surprised it doesn't get HURRICANE.
By power do you mean raw attack, or general viability? Because Zygarde-Complete is leagues better than the Kyurems in regards to viability, even if the stat spread is undeniably goofyis 100% based on Hel? LikeI guess once you make the Fenrir connection, Hel is obviously something to be dragged in but I dunno...
Nothing about this really screams "Hel, the goddess of Hel" to me. Wasn't Hel's big "thing" being her imagry evoked life on the top half and death on the bottom half?
I mean, to be fair, I dont know what figure I would associate with 100% and Pokemon always takes extreme liberties with pokemon. Landorus is based on a female fox spirit, iirc.
But still seems like there would be something more concrete here. Over the years I think i've heard both Odin & Loki brought up as possibilities which is starting to make me think it might be too vague a concept to pin down to anything.
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But since we're still on the Zygarde train. I definitely remember thinking this thing would be on par or stronger than the Black/White Kyurems. Very powerful, if posibly slow. ANd, well, I mean. I think most people expected some severe buff to its stats but I don't think anyone expected moving 10 points from speed to Special Attack and then +108 HP.
Yung Dramps
awesome gaming
Speaking of Zygarde-Complete, going back to when it was first revealed in CoroCoro(?) I remember seeing the little bands of red and blue color on its shoulder tentacle things and thought that base Zygarde would transform by fusing with/absorbing Xerneas and Yveltal.
Power as in actual power. Like punch you (or blast you) in the face power. Obviously the double HP is crazy enough to make him super useful (how many defensive pokemon would kill for decent defense AND special defense but with 200+ HP) but it's....not what I expected! I figured he'd get something like 150 attack or special attack or something as high, with a slight-but-noticeable bump to his defenses.
Complete Zygarde is one of those Pokémon who can't reasonably have its stats properly match with its lore for balance reasons IMO.
Even looking at 50% Zygarde in XY, it had some silly levels of "balance" if it was supposed to counter/combat Xerneas/Yveltal. Ignoring it being 80 BST below them, Aura Break just... didn't really help. Against Xerneas, it goes from taking 4x base Moonblast damage to 2.25x, still a hefty chunk on account of it being a STAB, super-effective hit (and it's going to hit even harder if Xerneas has a Geomancy boost). Yveltal isn't quite as bad, as Aura Break does nullify its Dark moves... but Yveltal's signature move is a Flying attack, not a Dark one. There's also the problem of Zygarde's then-only-available-signature-move not being able to hit Yveltal, and its other STAB typing not affecting Xerneas.
I love Zygarde but man is it a mess from a more perspective.
I mean let's be real its not like the kyurems (or necrozmas, for the matter) are that balanced either. Kyurem getting to be in OU is more a failing of its movepool than anything else.
Nor is +108 HP "balanced", really!
Sometimes a pokemon is just meant to have 700+ BST and be just absurdly OP and that's okay.
God juist imagine dynamax complete zygarde. have fun with that in ubers
I actually think that’s what’s supposed to be the “half-alive and half-dead” aspect for the supposed Hel connection - they’re supposed to represent the Pokémon of life and death... though in the end that’s mostly what they end up being - symbolic.
Thats weird, i thought zygarde was Niddhog, Yveltal was the unnamed eagle, and Xerneas was Ygdrassil. Tho i guess that would make a lack of a ratotoskr pokemon more glaring, hmmm
The Eagles name is Hresvelgr.
That i believe is a seperate eagle. As fsr as i know the one who sits in the tree has no name.
1. Well once they showed PWT I think that was the nail in the coffin for a Gen V Battle Frontier, but until then a lot were expecting a Battle Frontier since the last two gens did. But it makes sense they replaced it with the PWT as it was sort of a last hurrah/celebration of the sprite based games by including the characters most players would likely remember: Gym Leaders & Champions.
3. I wasn't only expecting being able to Surf around the islands bit for them to have caves only accessible by surfing and diving spots. Silly me to think an island-based region would have a lot of water exploration options...
Honestly it feels like Zygarde 100%, if not a bit of all Zygarde formes, take inspiration from Yggdrasil itself. Yes 10% is obviously a dog and 50% is obviously a serpent, but 100% Megazord-like design makes it feel like its supposed to be more than just a humanoid. Oh, and let's not forget Giants/Jotunn are very important figures in Norse mythology.is 100% based on Hel? LikeI guess once you make the Fenrir connection, Hel is obviously something to be dragged in but I dunno...
Nothing about this really screams "Hel, the goddess of Hel" to me. Wasn't Hel's big "thing" being her imagry evoked life on the top half and death on the bottom half?
However, if you want to connect it to Hel let's take a look at her Wikipedia page:
So from this alone I can make some loose connections:
Was ruler of a realm: Zygarde does look like its wearing a crown and could be considered sort of ruling Kalos.
Half alive, half dead: Zygarde is the balance between Xerneas and Yveltal having their colors on each side of it.
Mansion full of servants: Zygarde is actually a structure which houses 5 Cores and 100 Cells.
Is female: If you would let me be a bit crass, well, the two green spots on its chest (which itself is bulged out) and that green slit on its crotch brings to mind certain parts of female anatomy more than male.
Landorus is based on Inari Okami, kami who one of their attributes are foxes but they aren't foxes themselves (rather white foxes are their messengers), they look like a human. How they relate to Landorus is that their other attributes include fertility & agriculture. Also this should be noted this is for their Incarnate Forme, their Therian Forme is likely based on the White Tiger of the Chinese Four Symbols constellations.
I can understand why it wouldn't get Hurricane but it not getting Heat Wave is a missed opportunity.
True but Hresvelgr translates to "corpse swallower". Though granted the other (named) eagle on Yggdrasil name, Vedrfolnir, translates to either "storm pale", "wind bleached", and/or "wind-witherer".
Yung Dramps
awesome gaming
Here's a classic that was more prominent than usual during the SWSH hype cycle: New Eeveelutions!
The idea was simple. Every even numbered generation prior had introduced more of the guys: Espeon and Umbreon in Gen 2, Leafeon and Glaceon in Gen 4 and Sylveon in Gen 6, so of course the 8th generation had to continue the trend. As for the most desired/predicted types, Steel and Dragon were proposed assumably for their connections with knights and classic dragon stories prominent to ye olde English culture.
The idea was simple. Every even numbered generation prior had introduced more of the guys: Espeon and Umbreon in Gen 2, Leafeon and Glaceon in Gen 4 and Sylveon in Gen 6, so of course the 8th generation had to continue the trend. As for the most desired/predicted types, Steel and Dragon were proposed assumably for their connections with knights and classic dragon stories prominent to ye olde English culture.
Okay TOO BE FAIR, we did get Gigantimax Eevee out of it, which is a new form for the eevee line.
I think you're confusing the datamine of the Sun and Moon demo for Nintendo's official reveal. iirc, a good chunk of the new Pokemon were first discovered that way.
Nope, it was the other way around. THe pre-release period for Sun & Moon seriously revealed like 75% of all Pokemon up to the demo's release and then it was like 90% by the time the games actually came out.
I didn’t look at the datamine anyway, so which happened first isn’t relevant to what I was saying.