Hey, so 2spoopy created a cool
summary post of a few good typings.
FILL IN SUMMARY QUZIEL
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Resource Development Day
So, we've covered some relevant questions of single typings, so lets move onto broad questions of dual typings.
a) Broadly looking over available dual typings, what are some that do what we want offensively (beating slowking, mandibuzz, toxapex, etc.) (please cover a bunch).
b) Broadly looking over available dual typings, what are some that avoid weaknesses to as many offensive threats as possible (Electric, Water, Psychic, Dark, Fighting) (please cover a bunch).
c) While resisting as many types as possible is nice, its often infeasible, what weaknesses won't break the bank?
d) What are some unique things we can do offensively and defensively with respect to dealing with pivots and pivot-move users?
e) Are there any final thoughts you have on particular single typings and their relevancy?
I don't want any explicit typing submissions, but broad overviews are very welcome.
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I'll move onto typing submissions soon, but the more resources we can generate the better (if you make a good one I'll link it in the summary post) (I promise to get the summary done before typing subs open).
a) Broadly looking over available dual typings, what are some that do what we want offensively (beating slowking, mandibuzz, toxapex, etc.) (please cover a bunch).
Obviously Electric has been mentioned a lot in this thread, and with good reason as it hits a lot of the bulky pivots in the tier, so I want to go over a few of the Electric typings that really shine offensively:
Electric/Flying - This is my favorite option currently. Electric hits the common bulky mons hard (outside of the blobs), while Flying covers the plethora of Grass types found on pivot teams (Amoonguss and Rillaboom). The only down side to running this typing is the lack of a neutral STAB against Zeraora, but I don't think that's too important given Zera's frailty.
Electric/Fighting - This is pretty tailor-made to hit all the Teleport users and bulky pivots in the tier at the moment. It may struggle against Grass types, but a mon with this typing would have fairly absurd spammable STAB moves. Additionally, this has great coverage in the tier, only being resisted by the two Grass/Poison types in the tier: Venusaur and Amoonguss.
Electric/Ice - Ice hasn't been talked about a whole lot, but it behaves similarly to Flying in that it gives CAP28 the ability to deal with the Grass types that come in on Electric moves. This has the bonus of being able to deal with Zeraora more effectively at the cost of being a very poor defensive type, only resisting itself. In addition, the lack of good or consistent physical STAB moves is concerning considering we're trying to not get walled by Blissey.
Electric/Dark - Pack it up, we're full on removing Slowking from the game! That's essentially what this typing does. Offensively, it hits a lot of the common bulky types super-effectively or neutrally, and STAB Knock Off is always a good thing. I do worry about this type going into Zeraora and Urshifu, but the added Dark type certainly has its merits.
And one that isn't Electric but still gets the job done:
Grass/Fighting - Breloom was a pretty good Stallbreaker back in the day, and the Loom's typing could certainly help us out here. While not hitting Mandibuzz or Toxapex (especially this one) hurts, Grass/Fighting gives us a clear cut way of hitting the two most common Teleport abusers in the tier. Additionally, I think this typing gives us access to some fun ideas like SubSeeding and SubPunching. Y'know, those good ol' Breloom strats.
I also want to mention
Bughouse's suggestion of
Ghost/Normal as being an interesting way to offensively pressure Blissey and Slowking.
b) Broadly looking over available dual typings, what are some that avoid weaknesses to as many offensive threats as possible (Electric, Water, Psychic, Dark, Fighting) (please cover a bunch).
Defensively, Dragon does a lot of what we're looking for in resisting the big attacks (Scald and Plasma Fists namely). Dragon also lends itself very nicely to phasing with STAB Dragon Tail. Here are a few combos I think have great potential defensively:
Flying/Dragon - A 4x resist to Grass and normal resists to Fire, Water, Bug, and Fighting alongside a Ground immunity makes this combo very appealing as a catch all to the common pivot mons and offensive threats paired with them. A lack of Electric resist is a little annoying when dealing with Zeraora, but that can be combated with a bit of extra bulk. The weaknesses of this typing aren't super relevant to stopping pivot teams, so it could work quite well.
Grass/Dragon - Here we have a 4x resist to Electric and Water, which are really the two most important types to resist for this concept, and Grass along with a less useful normal resistance to Ground. In terms of beating common pivot Pokemons' STAB moves, this type does it the best. The weakness to U-Turn is not ideal, but isn't a back breaker and comes at a good trade-off. I do worry about this typing offensively, but defensively it really gets the job done.
Bug/Dragon - Bug/Dragon possesses a 4x resist to Grass while normally resisting Ground, Fighting, Water, and Electric. I hadn't really thought about this type until someone else mentioned it in the Discord, but it certainly has it's merits as it covers a lot of our bases. Again, I would be worried about it providing a consistent offensive pressure, but defensively it is quite good, which to be honest is crazy to say about a bug typing.
Fairy/Dragon - Casting a wide net here in terms of resistances, Fairy/Dragon gives us resistances to Bug, Fighting, Dark, Electric, Fire, Water, and Grass along with a Dragon immunity. This typing might be too generically good to make it through, but it should get some consideration as it is the only one to resist at least 5 of the 6 types I think we really should resist (Bug, Dark, Fighting, Psychic, Water, and Electric) while not being weak to any one of them.
And of course, one that isn't Dragon but still could be fun to work with:
Grass/Flying - This might seem like an unorthodox proposal for a defensive type, but it might be time to make it work considering Hidden Power Ice is gone. With a 4x resistance to Grass and resistances to Water and Fighting along with a Ground immunity, this typing does just enough defensively and very specifically targets the common mons on pivot teams. I feel like this is a type that is generically pretty bad but in this scenario could end up doing quite well, which I think could be a lot of fun to work around. Additionally, Grass/Flying allows for this mon to retain an offensive presence.
c) While resisting as many types as possible is nice, its often infeasible, what weaknesses won't break the bank?
I'm going to rate the weaknesses based off of how unimportant I think they are, with Tier 1 meaning that they're totally fine and tier 5 meaning that we should absolutely not have them as a weakness, so Tier 3 will mean that it's ok, just not great.
Tier 1 (totally fine) -
Dragon, Flying, Ice, Steel
Pretty simple. These types aren't commonly found on pivot mons except for the odd Syclant or Offensive Corviknight.
Tier 2 (really shouldn't be a problem) -
Ghost, Ground, Rock
I included Rock here instead of Tier 1 because Heavy-Duty Boots are a thing but they can get Knocked Off by Toxapex. Also, I did notice that I'm leaving CAP28 pretty weak to Dragapult here, but I don't think he's as big a threat as a lot of the other pivot mons currently being used.
Tier 3 (Would be nice to be neutral but if not that's ok as long as it isn't too many) -
Fairy, Fire, Grass, Poison
Fairy is here in case Zeraora players start running Play Rough instead of Knock Off. A Fire weakness might be troublesome with Astrolotl's Fire Lash spam. A Grass weakness would also be not great with Rillaboom in the game. Poison is on here purely because having some immunity to Toxic would be very helpful in dealing with the blobs.
Tier 4 (At most can only be weak to one of these) -
Bug, Fighting, Dark, Psychic
Here's where we get down to the types CAP28 definitely shouldn't be weak to. Bug is for the U-Turn spam from Urshifu, Dragapult, Rillaboom, and countless others. A Fighting weakness would leave CAP28 open for Urshifu and Zeraora CC to demolish. Dark again for Urshifu and the plethora of Knock Off users on pivot teams. A Psychic weakness would have CAP28 be forced out by Slowking's Future Sight
Tier 5 (Cannot under any circumstance be weak to these) -
Electric, Water
These are types that CAP28 cannot be weak to under any circumstance. Being weak to Electric just means losing to Zeraora which is not an option here. A Water weakness is equally unacceptable, as Scald is a very, very common move on pivot teams, coming from Slowking or Toxapex.
d) What are some unique things we can do offensively and defensively with respect to dealing with pivots and pivot-move users?
I think phasing is a really great idea here. Being able to disrupt the momentum pivoting affords is key to taking it down, and there might not be a better way to do that than phasing. A well-timed Dragon Tail or Roar can completely derail the chain of Volt Switching and Teleporting that pivot teams rely on. Additionally, there hasn't been a viable phaser in CAP for a very long time, so making a good one provides an interesting challenge to the community.
e) Are there any final thoughts you have on particular single typings and their relevancy?
I am still a big fan, though not as much now, of mono
Dragon as a potential type here. It's a pretty rare type, with only two fully evolved Pokemon having it, and it possesses two key resistances to Water and Electric, a trait that is only shared by Grass. Additionally, Dragon has access to STAB Dragon Tail, which would be a very useful tool in combating Teleport and VoltTurn spam.
Mono
Electric has been brought up a few times, and while an Electric typing does take care of the bulky pivot mons we are worrying about, I don't think Electric is diverse enough by itself in its STAB movepool to warrant consideration, especially given it's lack of strong physical moves (unless Mx is nice and lets us use signature moves). So, for the time being, I think we should lay off that idea.
Current Type Suggestion: Electric/Flying
, 
, 
, 
, 
, 
, 
, and 
. It really only struggles against 
, 
, and 
but that can be helped through it's ability and moveset later. Electric/Flying is quite strong against the majority of the defensive pivots in the tier, along with being a genuinely good and diverse STAB spread.
, 
, and 
is nothing to sneeze at. Resisting Close Combat is no joke amazing for CAP28. Additionally, this typing draws even with
(not even sure if Zeraora is a losing matchup, it might end up being even), 
, and 
.
, 
, 
, 
, and 
have a type disadvantage while the only high-tier offensive threats that succeed against it are 
(which really wrecks it), 
, 
(inconsitently), 
, and 
. It's a typing not seen in the tier currently that could really shake up the commonly used offensive threats. It's also a hard type to hit super-effectively by most of the tiers tanks. It additionally boasts a very nice set of resistances and immunities to common attacking types, having a Ground immunity and possessing resistances to Steel, Bug, and Fighting. Only being weak to Ice and Rock, two pretty uncommon attacking types, gives CAP28 respectable defensive potential.
, 
, and 
. Other than those, it beats or draws even with most of the tiers defensive Pokemon. Electric/Flying also provides a great spread of neutral damage across the tier and gives us some interesting options down the road when considering if CAP28 will be physically biased, specially biased, or mixed. Electric/Flying hits Water, Flying, Bug, Grass, and Fighting super effectively, which covers a good amount of the tier.
