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CAP 7 CAP 7 - Stat Spread Submissions/Discussion
- Thread starter Magmortified
- Start date
- Status
75/95/80/70/70/110
ODB = 20.0
PSB = 22.6
BSR = 255
BST = 500
Boosted HP and defence +5, due to the higher prerequisites in BSR.
Attack was boosted and Special attack dropped due to PSB.
General comments: Tried to keep the spread as neutral as possible, without crapping on one stat. With these stats, it will not become a defensive threat. As we attempted to show with the ODB poll. With physical stab, this will likely have to resort to Meteor Mash to do any damage, if it gets it. This is the most neutral spread i could make. (more comments to come)
ODB = 20.0
PSB = 22.6
BSR = 255
BST = 500
Boosted HP and defence +5, due to the higher prerequisites in BSR.
Attack was boosted and Special attack dropped due to PSB.
General comments: Tried to keep the spread as neutral as possible, without crapping on one stat. With these stats, it will not become a defensive threat. As we attempted to show with the ODB poll. With physical stab, this will likely have to resort to Meteor Mash to do any damage, if it gets it. This is the most neutral spread i could make. (more comments to come)
my problem with not being faster than those, is that CaP7 already has enough possible pokes that could check or counter it now, without us even having had the counters threat yet. azumarill is resistant to one STAB and immune to another. houndoom and kangskhan are possible, but not great in the metagame. ANY bulky water can possibly dismantle it if this poke doesn't get thunderpunch, leaf blade, etc. dugtrio=death to this poke. any speedy encore/trick user.
get the picture? it doesn't need more things to worry about.
And my point is, those things aren't things it should be concerned about anyway. Either way, Azelf and Infernape are either going to beat it or get done what they need to. As for Syclant, Arghonaut is the better switch in anyway, and it doesn't need to be scouted too much, so it's not much of a problem (remember, this thing's primary function is a scout, and not a sweeper. So, if it there's no need to scout something, then it doesn't really matter if it can't handle it).
So, I don't see why becoming slower than those three is much of an issue; two of the three will probably be able to deal with you either way, and the third there's better options for handling, and doesn't need scouting.
So, I don't see why becoming slower than those three is much of an issue; two of the three will probably be able to deal with you either way, and the third there's better options for handling, and doesn't need scouting.
98/95/70/57/60/120=500
Physical Sweepiness:151 Rank 4 (Very Good)
Physical Tankiness:107 Rank 0 (Average)
Special Sweepiness:92 Rank 0 (Average)
Special Tankiness:95 Rank 0 (Average)
ODB:18.9 (Moderate Bias To Offense)
PSB:34.0 (Large Bias To Physical)
Overall:251 (Quite Good)
BST:500
120 lets it outspeed base 115's while tieing with Dugtrio, something that I've come to prefer too outspeeding Dugtrio.
I realised with its High speed and accesibility to U-Turn, that with too much attack and Defenses, even those of an average level could make it overly powerful and could bar Uber debate. I wish we could know it's movepoll earlier on, I'm hoping for a really restricted attacking movepool. If it is given a diverse one, than lower speed would be better imo.
Physical Sweepiness:151 Rank 4 (Very Good)
Physical Tankiness:107 Rank 0 (Average)
Special Sweepiness:92 Rank 0 (Average)
Special Tankiness:95 Rank 0 (Average)
ODB:18.9 (Moderate Bias To Offense)
PSB:34.0 (Large Bias To Physical)
Overall:251 (Quite Good)
BST:500
120 lets it outspeed base 115's while tieing with Dugtrio, something that I've come to prefer too outspeeding Dugtrio.
I realised with its High speed and accesibility to U-Turn, that with too much attack and Defenses, even those of an average level could make it overly powerful and could bar Uber debate. I wish we could know it's movepoll earlier on, I'm hoping for a really restricted attacking movepool. If it is given a diverse one, than lower speed would be better imo.
I've also adjusted my submission to match the polls. Post #13, here:
http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1767891&postcount=13
http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1767891&postcount=13
Third Spread, damn polls:
BST=527
90/85/90/55/90/117
Phys. Sweep:134
Phys. Tank:125
Spec. Sweep:89
Spec. Tank:125
ODB: 4.0
PSB: 22.8
Overall Rating: 286 (Quite Good)
Basically lowered atk and sp.atk to comply with the Quite good rating, I kept the others the same, I really like the 90/90/90 defenses, but are they over the top?
BST=527
90/85/90/55/90/117
Phys. Sweep:134
Phys. Tank:125
Spec. Sweep:89
Spec. Tank:125
ODB: 4.0
PSB: 22.8
Overall Rating: 286 (Quite Good)
Basically lowered atk and sp.atk to comply with the Quite good rating, I kept the others the same, I really like the 90/90/90 defenses, but are they over the top?
Krow's Second CAP7 Build:
This is my second attempt for a build for CAP7. After hearing many good arguments, and seeing the new polls, this is my... evil creation, so to speak. Sadly, this build is almost completely built assuming Defensive Download will win the second ability (which it nearly is, at the time of creating this). 65 Def/SpD ensures coverage with Defensive Download, creating 130 Def/SpD when needed. 70 SpA is enough to cover some damage with Special Attacks, though this is a physical CAP. Now, the stats that I've had the toughest time with, thinking and doing calculations for the past half hour or so, I've come up with 90 HP to be sufficient. It gives the pokemon enough health to scout and take damage, without being a wall with Defensive Download. 103 Atk was also a really rough decision to make, I wanted it to have enough attack to hit things if needed to, but I didn't want this pokemon to have a choice band thrown on it and let it wreck everything. 107 Spe was easily the stat I had the most problem with. There are rarely any Steel types with over 100 Speed, which made this really hard to think about. I wanted it to follow it's typing but still follow the goal. I figured that 107 was perfect, because I thought that I wanted Infernape to be the biggest threat to this pokemon. 107 speed ensures to outspeed all Infernapes that have under 244 EVs in speed (with a +Speed Nature) but max speed halts it.
Anywho, whatever arguments I just made, this is my second build for CAP7, as pointed out. This build is completely based on Defensive Download winning, if it doesn't win then I'll have 1 last build created.
This is my second attempt for a build for CAP7. After hearing many good arguments, and seeing the new polls, this is my... evil creation, so to speak. Sadly, this build is almost completely built assuming Defensive Download will win the second ability (which it nearly is, at the time of creating this). 65 Def/SpD ensures coverage with Defensive Download, creating 130 Def/SpD when needed. 70 SpA is enough to cover some damage with Special Attacks, though this is a physical CAP. Now, the stats that I've had the toughest time with, thinking and doing calculations for the past half hour or so, I've come up with 90 HP to be sufficient. It gives the pokemon enough health to scout and take damage, without being a wall with Defensive Download. 103 Atk was also a really rough decision to make, I wanted it to have enough attack to hit things if needed to, but I didn't want this pokemon to have a choice band thrown on it and let it wreck everything. 107 Spe was easily the stat I had the most problem with. There are rarely any Steel types with over 100 Speed, which made this really hard to think about. I wanted it to follow it's typing but still follow the goal. I figured that 107 was perfect, because I thought that I wanted Infernape to be the biggest threat to this pokemon. 107 speed ensures to outspeed all Infernapes that have under 244 EVs in speed (with a +Speed Nature) but max speed halts it.
Anywho, whatever arguments I just made, this is my second build for CAP7, as pointed out. This build is completely based on Defensive Download winning, if it doesn't win then I'll have 1 last build created.
i thought it would only be like download, giving a mere +1? to double a current stat don't you need to have it gain a +2?
Not to criticize your stat spreads or anything, but when your Physical Sweepiness says "Extremely Good" or "Very Good", that should ring a bell.
A bell that notifies you that this Pokemon is a scout and not a physical sweeper that could be slapped a Choice Band and do very well. :(
EDIT: Defensive Download would boost a stat by +1, or by 1.5 times. However, it must be said that it's not the base stat that would be boosted, but the actual stat. If a base 65 defense has no EVs in it, it would have an actual stat of 166. If this is boosted by 1.5 times, it would become 249, which translates to having a base Defense of 106.5 without any EVs.
A bell that notifies you that this Pokemon is a scout and not a physical sweeper that could be slapped a Choice Band and do very well. :(
EDIT: Defensive Download would boost a stat by +1, or by 1.5 times. However, it must be said that it's not the base stat that would be boosted, but the actual stat. If a base 65 defense has no EVs in it, it would have an actual stat of 166. If this is boosted by 1.5 times, it would become 249, which translates to having a base Defense of 106.5 without any EVs.
*applause*
third draft,yes mostly a cut-n-paste from the last one
85/90/87/55/95/118
physical sweepiness: 142, rank 3 good
physical tankiness: 118, rank 1 above average
special sweepiness: 89, rank -1 below average
special tankiness: 127, rank 2 moderately good
O/D balance: 6.4, slight bias to offense
P/S balance: 22.0, bias to physical
BSR: 296 quite good
BST: 530
my stats needed revision since it is inevitable that physical will in the build bias. also, i have been swayed to drop the speed, mostly in part that my fears of alakazam and dugtrio doing anything to stop this poke happens to be unlikely when they are at 44 and 24, respectedly, on the usage for january. the 118 will allow this poke to outspeed starmie, azelf and syclant, of which syclant is the biggest fear since different sets run earth power and/or HP fire. it also gets it out of the way of jolly ttar and max speed magnezone, in addition to giving the chance to outspeed standard 216 Speed EV adamant dugtrio.
the 85/87/95 defenses make it bulkier than many other builds on here, but at the same time less bulk that others. i think it's a good middle path since it can even take a non-STAB SE (aka earthquake) or two before having to call it quits. also, the special defense is higher due prevalence of heatran, azelf (that sometimes runs fire blast), strat, and syclant (that on two sets runs earthpower and/or HP fire)
the 90/55/118 offensive stats reflect the message i recieved from the polls; the community seems to want a poke that is at least capable of scaring of enemies, but not strong enough to sweep, and that has a strong physical bias.
damage calcs coming soon, and when they do it will be my final submission.
85/90/87/55/95/118
physical sweepiness: 142, rank 3 good
physical tankiness: 118, rank 1 above average
special sweepiness: 89, rank -1 below average
special tankiness: 127, rank 2 moderately good
O/D balance: 6.4, slight bias to offense
P/S balance: 22.0, bias to physical
BSR: 296 quite good
BST: 530
my stats needed revision since it is inevitable that physical will in the build bias. also, i have been swayed to drop the speed, mostly in part that my fears of alakazam and dugtrio doing anything to stop this poke happens to be unlikely when they are at 44 and 24, respectedly, on the usage for january. the 118 will allow this poke to outspeed starmie, azelf and syclant, of which syclant is the biggest fear since different sets run earth power and/or HP fire. it also gets it out of the way of jolly ttar and max speed magnezone, in addition to giving the chance to outspeed standard 216 Speed EV adamant dugtrio.
the 85/87/95 defenses make it bulkier than many other builds on here, but at the same time less bulk that others. i think it's a good middle path since it can even take a non-STAB SE (aka earthquake) or two before having to call it quits. also, the special defense is higher due prevalence of heatran, azelf (that sometimes runs fire blast), strat, and syclant (that on two sets runs earthpower and/or HP fire)
the 90/55/118 offensive stats reflect the message i recieved from the polls; the community seems to want a poke that is at least capable of scaring of enemies, but not strong enough to sweep, and that has a strong physical bias.
damage calcs coming soon, and when they do it will be my final submission.
Just wondering, if we wanted CAP7 to be faster than Timid Scarfzone, so it can escape from it with U-turn, what base speed should we give it?
And that's a problem how? I'm all for a defensive scout (aka causing switch-outs via indirect means like WoW or stat-downs) but they're no official stands on how CAP7 should do it's job. I was going to make a statement on how CAP7 wouldn't have to worry about knowing it's counters, but Veedrock explains it a little bit better than me. Having the ability to sweep via Choice Band isn't going to ruin "Ultimate Scout" career. We need to stop thinking that having the ability to sweeper slightly is a bad thing and think of it as another way of scouting.
Here's a thought said:
Since it appears Quite Good is going for a sweep:
Final Submission:
Name: The 3 Kings of Scouting
Spread: 70/100/92/70/73/118. BST: 523.
PSweep: 159 (Rank 5, Extremely Good)
PTank: 112 (Rank 1, Above Average)
SSweep: 111 (Rank 1, Above Average)
STank: 92 (Rank 0, Average)
ODB: 19.5 (Moderate Bias to Offense)
PSB: 30.3 (Large Bias to Physical)
Overall Rating: 298 (Quite Good)
This spread is named the 3 Kings because you can customize it to scout and threaten those pokemon that most threaten your team, providing you a way to protect your team from its specific weakness. Focused Kings can outrun opponents with 115 Base Speed, The Mixed King can outrun natured 100’s and Un-natured up to Base 115, but has inferior special defensive ability in exchange for hitting both sides of the spectrum. These are of course, not the only EVs you can run.
King 1:
Ifrit the Jolly: EVs: 248 Atk/32 SDef/ 228 Spe
King 2:
Ramuh the Naughty: EVs: 56 Atk/220 SA/232 Spe
King 3:
Shiva the Timid: EVs: 248 SA/32 SDef/ 228 Spe
Offensive Calculations:
Ifrit: Offensive Calcs:
Fake Out:
To Naive Infernape: 16-19%
To SubCM Stratagem: 10-13%
To Offensive Gyarados/DDMence: 13-16%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 4-5%
Iron Head:
To Boahtar: 50-59%
To CBTar: 52-62%
To SubCM Strategem: 91-108%
Shadow Claw:
To SubGar: 103-123%
To Max HP/SA Rotom A: 59-71%
To Max HP/Def Rotom A: 43-51%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 38-45%
To Defensive Celebi: 33-39%
To Choice Starmie: 83-99%
To Spinner Starmie: 63-73%
To BU Revenankh: 53-62%
Brick Break:
To Weavile: 137-163%
To BoahTar: 62-74%
To CBTar 65-77%
To Cleric Blissey: 38-44%
To Curse Snorlax: 32-38%
To SubCM Stratagem: 57-68%
Focus Punch:
To Weavile: 273-323%
To Boahtar: 123-146%
To CBTar: 129-153%
To Cleric Blissey: 75-89%
To Curse Snorlax: 62-76%
To SubCM Stratagem: 114-135%
Earthquake:
To Naive Infernape: 81-96%
To Timid Heatran: 106-126%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 100-118%
To Boahtar: 41-49%
To CBTar: 43-51%
Thunderpunch:
To Offensive Gyarados: 100-118%
To Choice Starmie: 60-70%
To Spinner Starmie: 44-52%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 34-41%
To Recover/Def Arghonaut: 27-32%
Ice Punch:
To DDMence: 99-117%
To Defensive Gliscor: 48-57%
To Standard Hippowdon: 21-25%
U-Turn:
To Defensive Celebi: 44-52%
Ramuh: Offensive Calcs:
(All Tyranitar Calcs assume Sandstream is in effect for special attacks)
Fake Out:
To Naive Infernape: 16-19%
To SubCM Stratagem: 10-13%
To Offensive Gyarados/DDMence: 13-16%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 4-5%
Iron Head:
To Boahtar: 46-54%
To CBTar: 48-57%
To SubCM Strategem: 85-100%
Shadow Claw:
To SubGar: 96-113%
To Max HP/SA Rotom A: 55-65%
To Max HP/Def Rotom A: 40-48%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 34-41%
To Defensive Celebi: 32-38%
To Choice Starmie: 77-91%
To Spinner Starmie: 57-69%
To BU Revenankh: 48-57%
Shadow Ball:
To SubGar: 77-91%
To Rotom-A: 53-63%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 44-53%
To Defensive Celebi: 41-49%
To Choice Starmie: 74-87%
To Spinner Starmie: 65-77%
To BU Revenankh: 34-40%
Brick Break:
To Weavile: 127-150%
To BoahTar: 62-74%
To CBTar 60-71%
To Cleric Blissey: 35-41%
To Curse Snorlax: 30-35%
To SubCM Stratagem: 53-62%
Focus Punch:
To Weavile: 252-297%
To Boahtar: 114-135%
To CBTar: 120-142%
To Cleric Blissey: 69-82%
To Curse Snorlax: 60-70%
To SubCM Stratagem: 105-124%
Focus Blast:
To Boahtar: 51-61%
To CBTar: 54-64%
To SubCM Stratagem: 67-79%
Earthquake:
To Naive Infernape: 76-90%
To Timid Heatran: 99-117%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 91-108%
To Boahtar: 38-45%
To CBTar: 40-47%
Thunderbolt:
To Offensive Gyarados: 81-96%
To Choice Starmie: 58-69%
To Spinner Starmie: 52-61%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 25-30%
To Recover/Def Arghonaut: 32-38%
Ice Beam:
To DDMence: 97-116%
To Defensive Gliscor: 96-115%
To Standard Hippowdon: 41-49%
U-Turn:
To Defensive Celebi: 43-51%
Signal Beam:
To Defensive Celebi: 52-62%
Grass Knot:
To Defensive Swampert: 61-72%
To Standard Hippowdon: 52-62%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 27-31%
To Recover/Def Arghonaut: 34-40%
Shiva: Offensive Calcs:
(All Tyranitar Calcs assume Sandstream is in effect for special attacks)
Fake Out:
To Hasty Infernape: 13-15%
To SubCM Stratagem: 5-6%
To Offensive Gyarados/DDMence: 9-11%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 3-4%
Flash Cannon:
To Boahtar: 26-31%
To CBTar: 28-33%
To SubCM Strategem: 69-81%
Shadow Ball:
To SubGar: 78-93%
To Rotom-A: 53-63%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 45-55%
To Defensive Celebi: 43-50%
To Choice Starmie: 76-90%
To Spinner Starmie: 67-80%
To BU Revenankh: 35-41%
Earth Power:
To Hasty Infernape: 59-70%
To Timid Heatran: 76-91%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 88-104%
To Boahtar: 19-23%
To CBTar: 20-24%
Focus Blast:
To Boahtar: 53-63%
To CBTar: 56-66%
To SubCM Stratagem: 69-81%
Thunderbolt:
To Offensive Gyarados: 83-98%
To Choice Starmie: 60-71%
To Spinner Starmie: 53-63%
Ice Beam:
To DDMence: 100-118%
To Defensive Gliscor: 99-117%
To Standard Hippowdon: 42-50%
U-Turn:
To Defensive Celebi: 31-37%
Signal Beam:
To Defensive Celebi: 54-64%
Grass Knot:
To Defensive Swampert: 63-75%
To Standard Hippowdon: 54-64%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 27-32%
To Recover/Def: Arghonaut: 35-41%
Defensive Calculations:
Ifrit/Shiva (Ramuh shares physical attack Calcs, Any SE Special Calc becomes a KO.):
CBTar:
Crunch: 84-99%
Pursuit: 41-50% [84-99% on switchout]
Stone Edge: 52-61%
Earthquake: 140-165%
Aqua Tail: 62-74%
CB Scizor:
Bullet Punch: 30-36%
U-Turn: 17-21%
Night Slash: 47-56%
Pursuit: 41-48% [54-64% on switchout]
Brick Break and Superpower do 0
CB Metagross:
Meteor Mash: 52-61%
Earthquake: 140-165%
Thunderpunch: 52-62%
Ice Punch: 26-30%
Bullet Punch: 21-24%
Explosion deals 0
Naive DDMence (1DD, Lefties):
Outrage: 51-60%
Earthquake: 113-134%
Fire Blast: 84-99%
Stone Edge: 28-33%
Dragon Claw: 34-40%
Adamant Gyarados (1DD, Lefties)
Waterfall: 80-94%
Earthquake: 133-157%
Stone Edge: 33-39%
Ice Fang: 21-25%
Return does 0.
Timid Specs Scylant:
Bug Buzz: 22-25%
Ice Beam: 46-55%
Earth Power: 118-139%
Focus Blast does 0
Max SA Timid Rotom-A:
Thunderbolt: 59-69%
Shadow Ball: 50-59%
Overheat: 116-137%
Blizzard: 24-29%
Hydro Pump: 49-58%
Leaf Storm: 29-34%
Timid Specs Starmie:
Surf: 85-101%
Hydro Pump: 108-127%
Psychic: 40-48%
Ice Beam: 28-33%
Thunderbolt: 57-67%
Timid Specs Gengar:
Shadow Ball: 86-102%
Thunderbolt: 68-80%
Energy Ball: 28-34%
Focus Blast, Sludge Bomb, and Explosion do 0
Final Submission:
Name: The 3 Kings of Scouting
Spread: 70/100/92/70/73/118. BST: 523.
PSweep: 159 (Rank 5, Extremely Good)
PTank: 112 (Rank 1, Above Average)
SSweep: 111 (Rank 1, Above Average)
STank: 92 (Rank 0, Average)
ODB: 19.5 (Moderate Bias to Offense)
PSB: 30.3 (Large Bias to Physical)
Overall Rating: 298 (Quite Good)
This spread is named the 3 Kings because you can customize it to scout and threaten those pokemon that most threaten your team, providing you a way to protect your team from its specific weakness. Focused Kings can outrun opponents with 115 Base Speed, The Mixed King can outrun natured 100’s and Un-natured up to Base 115, but has inferior special defensive ability in exchange for hitting both sides of the spectrum. These are of course, not the only EVs you can run.
King 1:
Ifrit the Jolly: EVs: 248 Atk/32 SDef/ 228 Spe
King 2:
Ramuh the Naughty: EVs: 56 Atk/220 SA/232 Spe
King 3:
Shiva the Timid: EVs: 248 SA/32 SDef/ 228 Spe
Offensive Calculations:
Ifrit: Offensive Calcs:
Fake Out:
To Naive Infernape: 16-19%
To SubCM Stratagem: 10-13%
To Offensive Gyarados/DDMence: 13-16%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 4-5%
Iron Head:
To Boahtar: 50-59%
To CBTar: 52-62%
To SubCM Strategem: 91-108%
Shadow Claw:
To SubGar: 103-123%
To Max HP/SA Rotom A: 59-71%
To Max HP/Def Rotom A: 43-51%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 38-45%
To Defensive Celebi: 33-39%
To Choice Starmie: 83-99%
To Spinner Starmie: 63-73%
To BU Revenankh: 53-62%
Brick Break:
To Weavile: 137-163%
To BoahTar: 62-74%
To CBTar 65-77%
To Cleric Blissey: 38-44%
To Curse Snorlax: 32-38%
To SubCM Stratagem: 57-68%
Focus Punch:
To Weavile: 273-323%
To Boahtar: 123-146%
To CBTar: 129-153%
To Cleric Blissey: 75-89%
To Curse Snorlax: 62-76%
To SubCM Stratagem: 114-135%
Earthquake:
To Naive Infernape: 81-96%
To Timid Heatran: 106-126%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 100-118%
To Boahtar: 41-49%
To CBTar: 43-51%
Thunderpunch:
To Offensive Gyarados: 100-118%
To Choice Starmie: 60-70%
To Spinner Starmie: 44-52%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 34-41%
To Recover/Def Arghonaut: 27-32%
Ice Punch:
To DDMence: 99-117%
To Defensive Gliscor: 48-57%
To Standard Hippowdon: 21-25%
U-Turn:
To Defensive Celebi: 44-52%
Ramuh: Offensive Calcs:
(All Tyranitar Calcs assume Sandstream is in effect for special attacks)
Fake Out:
To Naive Infernape: 16-19%
To SubCM Stratagem: 10-13%
To Offensive Gyarados/DDMence: 13-16%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 4-5%
Iron Head:
To Boahtar: 46-54%
To CBTar: 48-57%
To SubCM Strategem: 85-100%
Shadow Claw:
To SubGar: 96-113%
To Max HP/SA Rotom A: 55-65%
To Max HP/Def Rotom A: 40-48%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 34-41%
To Defensive Celebi: 32-38%
To Choice Starmie: 77-91%
To Spinner Starmie: 57-69%
To BU Revenankh: 48-57%
Shadow Ball:
To SubGar: 77-91%
To Rotom-A: 53-63%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 44-53%
To Defensive Celebi: 41-49%
To Choice Starmie: 74-87%
To Spinner Starmie: 65-77%
To BU Revenankh: 34-40%
Brick Break:
To Weavile: 127-150%
To BoahTar: 62-74%
To CBTar 60-71%
To Cleric Blissey: 35-41%
To Curse Snorlax: 30-35%
To SubCM Stratagem: 53-62%
Focus Punch:
To Weavile: 252-297%
To Boahtar: 114-135%
To CBTar: 120-142%
To Cleric Blissey: 69-82%
To Curse Snorlax: 60-70%
To SubCM Stratagem: 105-124%
Focus Blast:
To Boahtar: 51-61%
To CBTar: 54-64%
To SubCM Stratagem: 67-79%
Earthquake:
To Naive Infernape: 76-90%
To Timid Heatran: 99-117%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 91-108%
To Boahtar: 38-45%
To CBTar: 40-47%
Thunderbolt:
To Offensive Gyarados: 81-96%
To Choice Starmie: 58-69%
To Spinner Starmie: 52-61%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 25-30%
To Recover/Def Arghonaut: 32-38%
Ice Beam:
To DDMence: 97-116%
To Defensive Gliscor: 96-115%
To Standard Hippowdon: 41-49%
U-Turn:
To Defensive Celebi: 43-51%
Signal Beam:
To Defensive Celebi: 52-62%
Grass Knot:
To Defensive Swampert: 61-72%
To Standard Hippowdon: 52-62%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 27-31%
To Recover/Def Arghonaut: 34-40%
Shiva: Offensive Calcs:
(All Tyranitar Calcs assume Sandstream is in effect for special attacks)
Fake Out:
To Hasty Infernape: 13-15%
To SubCM Stratagem: 5-6%
To Offensive Gyarados/DDMence: 9-11%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 3-4%
Flash Cannon:
To Boahtar: 26-31%
To CBTar: 28-33%
To SubCM Strategem: 69-81%
Shadow Ball:
To SubGar: 78-93%
To Rotom-A: 53-63%
To Defensive Dusknoir: 45-55%
To Defensive Celebi: 43-50%
To Choice Starmie: 76-90%
To Spinner Starmie: 67-80%
To BU Revenankh: 35-41%
Earth Power:
To Hasty Infernape: 59-70%
To Timid Heatran: 76-91%
To SteelKiller Magnezone: 88-104%
To Boahtar: 19-23%
To CBTar: 20-24%
Focus Blast:
To Boahtar: 53-63%
To CBTar: 56-66%
To SubCM Stratagem: 69-81%
Thunderbolt:
To Offensive Gyarados: 83-98%
To Choice Starmie: 60-71%
To Spinner Starmie: 53-63%
Ice Beam:
To DDMence: 100-118%
To Defensive Gliscor: 99-117%
To Standard Hippowdon: 42-50%
U-Turn:
To Defensive Celebi: 31-37%
Signal Beam:
To Defensive Celebi: 54-64%
Grass Knot:
To Defensive Swampert: 63-75%
To Standard Hippowdon: 54-64%
To BU/SDef Arghonaut: 27-32%
To Recover/Def: Arghonaut: 35-41%
Defensive Calculations:
Ifrit/Shiva (Ramuh shares physical attack Calcs, Any SE Special Calc becomes a KO.):
CBTar:
Crunch: 84-99%
Pursuit: 41-50% [84-99% on switchout]
Stone Edge: 52-61%
Earthquake: 140-165%
Aqua Tail: 62-74%
CB Scizor:
Bullet Punch: 30-36%
U-Turn: 17-21%
Night Slash: 47-56%
Pursuit: 41-48% [54-64% on switchout]
Brick Break and Superpower do 0
CB Metagross:
Meteor Mash: 52-61%
Earthquake: 140-165%
Thunderpunch: 52-62%
Ice Punch: 26-30%
Bullet Punch: 21-24%
Explosion deals 0
Naive DDMence (1DD, Lefties):
Outrage: 51-60%
Earthquake: 113-134%
Fire Blast: 84-99%
Stone Edge: 28-33%
Dragon Claw: 34-40%
Adamant Gyarados (1DD, Lefties)
Waterfall: 80-94%
Earthquake: 133-157%
Stone Edge: 33-39%
Ice Fang: 21-25%
Return does 0.
Timid Specs Scylant:
Bug Buzz: 22-25%
Ice Beam: 46-55%
Earth Power: 118-139%
Focus Blast does 0
Max SA Timid Rotom-A:
Thunderbolt: 59-69%
Shadow Ball: 50-59%
Overheat: 116-137%
Blizzard: 24-29%
Hydro Pump: 49-58%
Leaf Storm: 29-34%
Timid Specs Starmie:
Surf: 85-101%
Hydro Pump: 108-127%
Psychic: 40-48%
Ice Beam: 28-33%
Thunderbolt: 57-67%
Timid Specs Gengar:
Shadow Ball: 86-102%
Thunderbolt: 68-80%
Energy Ball: 28-34%
Focus Blast, Sludge Bomb, and Explosion do 0
Bang, my final submission. Don't look surprised, they wasn't no official stands on how Scoutmon should scout so I went on a more offensive stand. I also like to give a shout out for DK, his organization of damage calculations is genius.
Gothic Togekiss said:
Please finalize your stat spread submissions and post them in a neat format in this thread. Would be appreciated if you could clearly state that it is your final submission in your post.
Make sure they fall in the voted guidlines: 0 to 20 (Somewhat Offensive) Style Bias, a 20 to Infinity (Physical) Build Bias, and a Quite Good (250-299) Base Stat Rating.
Make sure they fall in the voted guidlines: 0 to 20 (Somewhat Offensive) Style Bias, a 20 to Infinity (Physical) Build Bias, and a Quite Good (250-299) Base Stat Rating.
I'll give about a day longer for people to finish up on their stat spreads. So you should have enough time.
90/90/90/50/90/116
Physical sweepiness: 142 (good)
Physical tankiness: 125 (moderately good)
Special sweepiness: 82 (moderately bad)
Special tankiness: 125 (moderately good)
Offence/defence balance: 7.2 (slightly offensive)
Physical/special balance: 30.6 (largely physical)
Overall rating: 297 (quite good)
Base stat total: 526
90/90/90 is a good defensive spread that, combined with CAP7's typing, makes it easy to switch in. Given that Frisk is its primary ability, this is extremely useful. Then, when faced with a threat, base 90 attack is enough to leave a dent with U-Turn, which is what CAP7 will most likely be doing when threatened.
In my opinion, we should not give CAP7 a base attack stat of 100 or more, because that combined with the speed screams sweeper, then unless we severely limit the movepool to U-Turn, support moves and special attacks, we will end up creating a sweeper rather than a scout. With a mediocre attack stat, we have more freedom in our movepool without worrying about making CAP7 broken.
To be honest, I disagreed with making CAP7 too offensive, which is why my stat spread sticks closer to the 0 end of the scale rather than the 20 end.
Physical sweepiness: 142 (good)
Physical tankiness: 125 (moderately good)
Special sweepiness: 82 (moderately bad)
Special tankiness: 125 (moderately good)
Offence/defence balance: 7.2 (slightly offensive)
Physical/special balance: 30.6 (largely physical)
Overall rating: 297 (quite good)
Base stat total: 526
90/90/90 is a good defensive spread that, combined with CAP7's typing, makes it easy to switch in. Given that Frisk is its primary ability, this is extremely useful. Then, when faced with a threat, base 90 attack is enough to leave a dent with U-Turn, which is what CAP7 will most likely be doing when threatened.
In my opinion, we should not give CAP7 a base attack stat of 100 or more, because that combined with the speed screams sweeper, then unless we severely limit the movepool to U-Turn, support moves and special attacks, we will end up creating a sweeper rather than a scout. With a mediocre attack stat, we have more freedom in our movepool without worrying about making CAP7 broken.
To be honest, I disagreed with making CAP7 too offensive, which is why my stat spread sticks closer to the 0 end of the scale rather than the 20 end.
Okay, another attempt.
BST: A Base Stat Total of 510. This is shared with three pokemon, Gliscor, Steelix and Weavile. There is not much to say here, but I favour a lower BST for CAP7. Weavile is a fairly good scout, and accomplishes a great deal with a 'low' BST. Since CAP7 will probably be more specialised for this role, I firmly believe it can be a good scout with a more specialised ability and movepool, and therefore the BST is better left as it is without unnecessary trinkets added on (ie. a bit more speed, etc)
HP, DEF, SDEF: This spread is also comparable to a popular scout. The overall defenses of 80/85/85 are comparable to Flygon's, with the slightly higher stats and making up for Flygon's more common immunities. Also, I prefer an equilibrium in terms of defence and special defence. Jolly, LO Dugtrio will always OHKO assuming > 200 HP EVs on CAP7.
ATK, SATK: The special attack stat is deliberately negligible, as per request through the voting process. As for the attack, it is equal to Ninjask. This pretty much ensures that, while remaining a fairly offensive threat, it still does not threaten to sweep any time soon; still, it could function as a revenge killer, if that what the trainer wants to use it for. I am not, however, sure whether it should be higher to compensate for the somewhat 'poor' STAB choices that some people seem to be complaining about. I would like feedback on this, if possible.
SPD: The final area. The speed. Important people taking different stands on it makes this area difficult to pin down; the most important stat for any scout. It has been said that Steels should not cross 100 speed, for that is their classic stopping point. However, I still firmly believe that this speed has to be more than 100, to optimise its chances of being a good scout (without relying on Scarf, etc.) but the exact number is hard to pin down.
I personally believe that yes, 120 and above is overkill. But why have I gone with 115, 5 points more than what I previously had? The two great trappers of OU, Magnezone and Dugtrio, can both trap CAP7 (given correct prediction). Dugtrio cannot be beaten, talking in terms of speed, if we are to go with < 120 as a speed. That is why I chose 115, because, apart from everything else, it is both apt and fitting. As pointed out by Petrie (thanks, btw) a Timid Scarfzone with max speed hits 360. However, a base 115, positive-natured CAP7 with max speed hits 361. Outspeeding Magnezone by one point is fitting, in my opinion. If, however, this translates into your minds as fanboyish, then I would change this to that I think that CAP7 should not be easily trapped. Of course, you could argue that even with no Sp. Def EVs, even Modest Scarfzone cannot OHKO with any move, and then you can bring a counter in for free. However, although this constitutes as scouting, this should not be what I call a 'suicide scout'; ie. something that is built to kill itself to give you an advantage. I would prefer this to be sustainable for long periods of time. Therefore, not necessitating Shed Shell on CAP7 allows it to run the more standard items.
Do you agree? I would be grateful for your opinion.
Well, that's that. Is this one better than my last attempt?
BST: A Base Stat Total of 510. This is shared with three pokemon, Gliscor, Steelix and Weavile. There is not much to say here, but I favour a lower BST for CAP7. Weavile is a fairly good scout, and accomplishes a great deal with a 'low' BST. Since CAP7 will probably be more specialised for this role, I firmly believe it can be a good scout with a more specialised ability and movepool, and therefore the BST is better left as it is without unnecessary trinkets added on (ie. a bit more speed, etc)
HP, DEF, SDEF: This spread is also comparable to a popular scout. The overall defenses of 80/85/85 are comparable to Flygon's, with the slightly higher stats and making up for Flygon's more common immunities. Also, I prefer an equilibrium in terms of defence and special defence. Jolly, LO Dugtrio will always OHKO assuming > 200 HP EVs on CAP7.
ATK, SATK: The special attack stat is deliberately negligible, as per request through the voting process. As for the attack, it is equal to Ninjask. This pretty much ensures that, while remaining a fairly offensive threat, it still does not threaten to sweep any time soon; still, it could function as a revenge killer, if that what the trainer wants to use it for. I am not, however, sure whether it should be higher to compensate for the somewhat 'poor' STAB choices that some people seem to be complaining about. I would like feedback on this, if possible.
SPD: The final area. The speed. Important people taking different stands on it makes this area difficult to pin down; the most important stat for any scout. It has been said that Steels should not cross 100 speed, for that is their classic stopping point. However, I still firmly believe that this speed has to be more than 100, to optimise its chances of being a good scout (without relying on Scarf, etc.) but the exact number is hard to pin down.
I personally believe that yes, 120 and above is overkill. But why have I gone with 115, 5 points more than what I previously had? The two great trappers of OU, Magnezone and Dugtrio, can both trap CAP7 (given correct prediction). Dugtrio cannot be beaten, talking in terms of speed, if we are to go with < 120 as a speed. That is why I chose 115, because, apart from everything else, it is both apt and fitting. As pointed out by Petrie (thanks, btw) a Timid Scarfzone with max speed hits 360. However, a base 115, positive-natured CAP7 with max speed hits 361. Outspeeding Magnezone by one point is fitting, in my opinion. If, however, this translates into your minds as fanboyish, then I would change this to that I think that CAP7 should not be easily trapped. Of course, you could argue that even with no Sp. Def EVs, even Modest Scarfzone cannot OHKO with any move, and then you can bring a counter in for free. However, although this constitutes as scouting, this should not be what I call a 'suicide scout'; ie. something that is built to kill itself to give you an advantage. I would prefer this to be sustainable for long periods of time. Therefore, not necessitating Shed Shell on CAP7 allows it to run the more standard items.
Do you agree? I would be grateful for your opinion.
Well, that's that. Is this one better than my last attempt?
Now, I haven't read through the descriptions for every stat spread, but bugmaniacbob's is looking VERY nice to me. I would prefer a spread with 110 speed, but none of them have other appealing stats for a scout. He's made his points very well, and unless another spread can really catch my attention, he's got my support.
We should aim for over 120, to outspeed CB/LO Dugtrio, who traps this Pokemon just like Magnezone, with the main difference being Dugtrio can most likely OHKO with Band STAB Earthquake regardless of CAP7's stats (with the given requirements).
It won't be a good scout if it can get trapped, outsped, and OHKO'd by Dugtrio.
Dugtrio aren't seen that often on CAP. If you regulate the server, you would know this, but a competent player would also be able to predict and U-Turn out of this situation to a suitable counter. Why not just let it get trapped by Dugtrio? It might increase the usage of that, and that way we have a decent counter for this thing that isn't generic OU.
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