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Chandelure

Scicky said:
Honestly Dugtrio and Shandera make an excellent team, one kills faster things and one likes em slow. Either way, if you want something taken out, it's out. Ditto works better than Duggy though I suppose.
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I believe I pointed out how Scarf Shandera is Choice Band Dugtrio beefed up a little, and swaps attack for special attack. But Duggy is probably the second best and is useful once you used up your Shandera spot.
Edit: Bulbapedia says Shandera and its pre-evolutions are in the DW.
 
KokoaKiwi said:
I don't think Nasty Plot Houndoom is remotely decent for this Gen...
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you cant deny though, that he is probably the best shandera counter. hes immune to both stabs, faster, and can run pursuit to catch a fleeing shandera.

he wont be terrible vs the gen 5 line up. like any poke, he has good an bad matchups. even though he cannot be switched into alot of things, switching into shandera is basically free and maybe even beneficial for that flash fire boost.
 
The problem with countering Shandera is that you can't do it at all with Shadow Tag in effect. Without, his OU counters start to line up, all of whom are better than Doom.
 
Khan!!! said:
you cant deny though, that he is probably the best shandera counter. hes immune to both stabs, faster, and can run pursuit to catch a fleeing shandera.

he wont be terrible vs the gen 5 line up. like any poke, he has good an bad matchups. even though he cannot be switched into alot of things, switching into shandera is basically free and maybe even beneficial for that flash fire boost.
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Houndoom isn't Immune to Shadow Ball, and it'll take a beating from an attack of that magnitude.
 
lmitchell0012 said:
But he has to get a dragon dance up before he can outspeed it. Houndoom, on the other hand, needs no time to set up and can just come in and kill it.
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...Dude wtf. Just. wtf are you saying.
Anyway are there people who actually use DD T-Tar?
After ~300 battles in this week, most of the have choice scarf/bands.
 
I use DDTar...

Houndoom isn't viable at all.

@SJCrew: Shadow Tag is why I use Shed Shell on my Blissey, although strangely I haven't seen any SubCM Shanderaa. But Choice Scarf Shanderaa is wrecked by Pursuit, and many viable pokemon learn it. So it's not too difficult to restrict it to one kill.
 
cosmicexplorer said:
I use DDTar...

Houndoom isn't viable at all.

@SJCrew: Shadow Tag is why I use Shed Shell on my Blissey, although strangely I haven't seen any SubCM Shanderaa. But Choice Scarf Shanderaa is wrecked by Pursuit, and many viable pokemon learn it. So it's not too difficult to restrict it to one kill.
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The reason you don't see SubCM Shandera is because it's as awesome as a SubPunching Blissey holding a Lucky Punch.
Also sorry about DD T-Tar, but I seriously haven't encountered one in a LONG while. IMO, the only decent dragon dancers this gen are Saggarmander(zuruzukin), Gyara, Dragonite, and Salami.
 
Kokoa, what about Salamence? Or Ononokosu?

/offtopic

Now that I've had the experience of playing agaist Shandera for a while, it's been pretty much guaranteeing a kill unless the opponent is using it badly. It can easily revenge kill any non-Speed boosting sweeper without a super-effective priority move, or it can set up all over CB Scizor (I was locked into Superpower, so it's situational) and get even more KOs.

It would be alright, except for Shadow Tag, if you ask me.
 
ungulateman said:
Kokoa, what about Salamence? Or Ononokosu?

/offtopic

Now that I've had the experience of playing agaist Shandera for a while, it's been pretty much guaranteeing a kill unless the opponent is using it badly. It can easily revenge kill any non-Speed boosting sweeper without a super-effective priority move, or it can set up all over CB Scizor (I was locked into Superpower, so it's situational) and get even more KOs.

It would be alright, except for Shadow Tag, if you ask me.
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Most Salamence I've faced fire Draco Meteor or Outrage right off the bat, so I wouldnt know. Ono is an excelent Dancer, I totally forgot abouot him.

Meep, Balloon Flash fire shandy pretty much got my in the top ten from the ladder, and even when I switched to Dream World Tier, FF still proves way more useful than Shadow Tag, imo. Played correctly, FF CAN actually sweep late game.
 
In case anyone's wondering, Im using
Shandera (f) @ Balloon
Modest Nature, (80hp, 252SpA, 178speed)
~Fire Blast
~Shadow Ball / Energy Ball
~Nitro Charge
~Hidden Power Ice (although Ground and Fighting are extremly useful, too).

The evs seem a bit awkward, but work good. Max special attack is obvious. 178 speed allows me to outrun everything at 361 or less after a nitro charge (which is extremely easy to get). Dual stab is always nice, and the Hidden Power type depends on what you want to beat. Ground nails fires (especially Heatran), Fighting is there mainly for T-Tar (although it never ohkos), and ice hits dragons that are on literally every team.

Whatever you do, do not nitro charge early in the match, since it'll be easier to kill later on, implying your opponent has decent prediction skills. Instead, save it for late game. Bring in on an obvious Earthquake, thanks to balloon, nitro charge on the switch, and proceed to thrash stuff with a massive SpA, stab Fire Blast, and some rather decent coverage. For maximum overtroll, I team her up with volt change denchura on obvious fire moves.
 
Flareon said:
I've been using a set of
@life orb, Flash Fire
Shadow ball
Fire blast
Energy ball
Will-o-wisp

To some success
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i've been using a scarf trapper.
@choice scarf, shadow tag
252 sp.atk, 252 spe, 4 hp
shadow ball
fire blast
energy ball
over heat/tba( i can't find a good move for the 4th set.)
 
ungulateman said:
Now that I've had the experience of playing agaist Shandera for a while, it's been pretty much guaranteeing a kill unless the opponent is using it badly. It can easily revenge kill any non-Speed boosting sweeper without a super-effective priority move, or it can set up all over CB Scizor (I was locked into Superpower, so it's situational) and get even more KOs.

It would be alright, except for Shadow Tag, if you ask me.
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Counting revenge killing is silly, though. From my experience (read: my team), all that Shandera ever killed was my Metagross lead AFTER it has done it's job (i.e. knocked out one opponent and/or laid down rocks) or Breloom AFTER it already spore'd an enemy. Since Metagross is in most cases already weakened after fighting the lead, both of these kills could have easily been scored by Dugtrio.

What I want to say: Probably, what Shandera does best is revenge killing. Nonetheless, revenge killing is an easy job. Remember that in order to revenge kill something, something has killed a Pokemon of yours.
 
I've also been using a Scarf'd Trapper with good results.
@Choice Scarf,Shadow Tag
252 Sp.Attack,252 Spe,4 HP
Shadow Ball
Energy Ball
Fire Blast
HP Ice

Gets me 1-3 kills per game,unless they have T-Tar(I've only seen ONE ._.) or something with more than 388 speed OR my Aianto(this thing rocks) and Rankurusu already pwned everything.
 
Everyone and their mom uses Scarf Shadow Tag shandy, wtf. You guise need to think outside the box for a second, imo. But still, whatever floats your boat. Imo, Nitro Charge Shandy is way better than Scarf.
 
KokoaKiwi said:
Everyone and their mom uses Scarf Shadow Tag shandy, wtf. You guise need to think outside the box for a second, imo. But still, whatever floats your boat. Imo, Nitro Charge Shandy is way better than Scarf.
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>.>
Seriously,stop this.
If it works for us,then what should stop us from using it? Creativity? Just because a lot of people use it,doesn't mean WE should stop using it.
 
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