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How does one counter Bisharp, exactly?

Of all of the potent out threats, it seems as if, personally, Bisharp is among the most lethal. Sucker Punch keeps offensive checks at bay, and they certainly aren't switching in. Knock off can 1hko max/max skarm of all things at +2 after a bit of hazards damage. Pokemon like lando-t that would otherwise be great end upboosting it even further with intimidate. What have you guys found to be the best ways to take on the power ranger on both offensive and defensive teams?

Chesnaught is really good for that.

+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Chesnaught: 227-269 (59.7 - 70.7%)

4 Atk Chesnaught Hammer Arm vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Bisharp: 460-544 (164.8 - 194.9%)

Iron Head Flinch chance is a fucking bitch though.

Keldeo does a good job, resisting both of its stabs and insta-gibbing it with Secret Sword.

Conkeldurr can switch into anything, taking only a bit less than half from Iron Head and OHKOs with Mach Punch.

Infernape sucks but it can also do it.

Poliwrath sucks harder but can also do it.

You can also play around Sucker Punch with Wisp and Substitute.
 
How does one counter Bisharp, exactly?

Of all of the potent out threats, it seems as if, personally, Bisharp is among the most lethal. Sucker Punch keeps offensive checks at bay, and they certainly aren't switching in. Knock off can 1hko max/max skarm of all things at +2 after a bit of hazards damage. Pokemon like lando-t that would otherwise be great end upboosting it even further with intimidate. What have you guys found to be the best ways to take on the power ranger on both offensive and defensive teams?
Quagsire does amazing! Other than that, Mandibuzz also does pretty well. Chesnaught can do okay, but beware of Psycho Cut. Lucario can also do decently, and even gets an attack boost from Sucker Punch.
 
How does one counter Bisharp, exactly?

Of all of the potent out threats, it seems as if, personally, Bisharp is among the most lethal. Sucker Punch keeps offensive checks at bay, and they certainly aren't switching in. Knock off can 1hko max/max skarm of all things at +2 after a bit of hazards damage. Pokemon like lando-t that would otherwise be great end upboosting it even further with intimidate. What have you guys found to be the best ways to take on the power ranger on both offensive and defensive teams?

Surprisingly, Defensive Mew checks it very well with a Colbur Berry, this Berry will be eaten before Knock Off hits and make it hit with only 65 BP rather than 195 BP:

252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off vs. 248 HP / 240+ Def Mew: 109-129 (27 - 32%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

After this Mew will outspeed and be able to WoW if Bisharp does stay in, neutering it for the rest of the match, the only problem with this is that the next time the Berry will not be there meaning Knock Off will do considerably more damage:

252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off vs. 248 HP / 240+ Def Mew: 218-257 (54 - 63.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

But between the 2 hits, even if you don't find the time to heal it still won't be enough to kill you even on max rolls without hazards.


Mandibuzz does fairly well too and even Klefki can tank a few hits and either cripple it with T-Wave or set up a Reflect to make it a lot easier to deal with, Gengar could SubDisable to get around Sucker Punch and OHKO with Focus Blast, physically defensive Hippowdon is a great check being at best 3HKO'd and OHKOing back after SR + 1 round of LO or no SR and 2 rounds of LO (even without LO or SR there's a 25% chance of OHKOing it) and anything with Mach Punch can OHKO it.
 
How does one counter Bisharp, exactly?

breloom.gif
 
252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Iron Head vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Breloom: 220-259 (83.9 - 98.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO. No.

252 Atk Technician Breloom Mach Punch vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Bisharp: 396-468 (118.5 - 140.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO. Yes.

Edit: Ah, my bad.
 
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252 Atk Technician Breloom Mach Punch vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Bisharp: 396-468 (118.5 - 140.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO. Yes.
A counter must be able to switch into the Pokémon it's supposed to counter, which is not the case of Breloom for Bisharp. With SR on the field Bisharp has a 37.5% chance to OHKO Breloom. So, no, Breloom is not a counter lol.
 
How does one counter Bisharp, exactly?

Of all of the potent out threats, it seems as if, personally, Bisharp is among the most lethal. Sucker Punch keeps offensive checks at bay, and they certainly aren't switching in. Knock off can 1hko max/max skarm of all things at +2 after a bit of hazards damage. Pokemon like lando-t that would otherwise be great end upboosting it even further with intimidate. What have you guys found to be the best ways to take on the power ranger on both offensive and defensive teams?
Mega Scizor with Superpower:
  • +2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Scizor: 207-243 (60.1 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • +2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Scizor: 168-199 (48.8 - 57.8%) -- 94.5% chance to 2HKO
 
Mega Scizor with Superpower:
  • +2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Scizor: 207-243 (60.1 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • +2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Scizor: 168-199 (48.8 - 57.8%) -- 94.5% chance to 2HKO

Is that a thing? I've never seen defensive M-Scizor run Superpower, it usually seems to 2 out of Bullet Punch/Knock Off/U-Turn.
 
How does one counter Bisharp, exactly?

Of all of the potent out threats, it seems as if, personally, Bisharp is among the most lethal. Sucker Punch keeps offensive checks at bay, and they certainly aren't switching in. Knock off can 1hko max/max skarm of all things at +2 after a bit of hazards damage. Pokemon like lando-t that would otherwise be great end upboosting it even further with intimidate. What have you guys found to be the best ways to take on the power ranger on both offensive and defensive teams?
krookodile

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Krookodile: 113-133 (28.6 - 33.7%) -- 98.1% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
+3 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Krookodile: 187-222 (47.4 - 56.3%) -- 29.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

4 Atk Krookodile Earthquake vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Bisharp: 248-294 (88.8 - 105.3%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO
 
Is that a thing? I've never seen defensive M-Scizor run Superpower, it usually seems to 2 out of Bullet Punch/Knock Off/U-Turn.
Countering one of the most threatening offensive Pokemon (Bisharp) is enough reason to make Superpower a viable option on itself. However, Superpower is a generally useful move on Mega Scizor, as it allows it to OHKO physical attackers that it checks, such as offensive Excadrill and Mega Tyranitar (extremely important). The strong hit vs Pokemon such as Heatran, Mega Mawile, Mega Charizard X, and Chansey is great too, although situational in comparison with Superpower's primary pros.
 
Countering one of the most threatening offensive Pokemon (Bisharp) is enough reason to make Superpower a viable option on itself. However, Superpower is a generally useful move on Mega Scizor, as it allows it to OHKO physical attackers that it checks, such as offensive Excadrill and Mega Tyranitar (extremely important). The strong hit vs Pokemon such as Heatran, Mega Mawile, Mega Charizard X, and Chansey is great too, although situational in comparison with Superpower's primary pros.

I can see the point of Superpower vs Excadrill and to a lesser extent Mega Tyranitar (Ttar cant do too much back unless it's been boosting or packing Fire Blast/Flamethrower anyway, it needs to be +3 to have a CHANCE of OHKOing max defense Mega Scizor with Stone Edge) but Ttar is hurt by Bullet Punch too, Heatran outspeeds and OHKO's you so you'd have to hit it on the switch, Mega Mawile however is barely dented by it, you'd probably be better off to U-Turn on it to get a better matchup as it has a good chance of OHKOing Scizor with Fire Fang or worse, setting up all over you, the same goes for CharX kind of, hitting Chansey seems rather irrelevant as you cant 2HKO it and it will just heal up.

I can't really see Superpower being a thing on max def Mega Scizor unless you specifically need it to stop Bisharp or I suppose Excadrill neither of which has a reason to stay in on you if they know you have Superpower but I suppose it will catch most by surprise.


Krookodile is hardly a counter, Knock Off followed by Iron Head has a good chance of killing it as does Swords Dance into Iron Head and it does outspeed 252/252+ Krook unless Krook invests 80 EVs into speed
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Krookodile: 136-161 (34.5 - 40.8%) -- 63.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Krookodile: 226-266 (57.3 - 67.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+3 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Krookodile: 376-445 (95.4 - 112.9%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
 
I can see the point of Superpower vs Excadrill and to a lesser extent Mega Tyranitar (Ttar cant do too much back unless it's been boosting or packing Fire Blast/Flamethrower anyway, it needs to be +3 to have a CHANCE of OHKOing max defense Mega Scizor with Stone Edge) but Ttar is hurt by Bullet Punch too, Heatran outspeeds and OHKO's you so you'd have to hit it on the switch, Mega Mawile however is barely dented by it, you'd probably be better off to U-Turn on it to get a better matchup as it has a good chance of OHKOing Scizor with Fire Fang or worse, setting up all over you, the same goes for CharX kind of, hitting Chansey seems rather irrelevant as you cant 2HKO it and it will just heal up.

I can't really see Superpower being a thing on max def Mega Scizor unless you specifically need it to stop Bisharp or I suppose Excadrill neither of which has a reason to stay in on you if they know you have Superpower but I suppose it will catch most by surprise.
  • +1 252 Atk Mega Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Scizor: 166-196 (48.2 - 56.9%) -- 90.2% chance to 2HKO
  • 4 Atk Technician Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Tyranitar: 132-156 (38.5 - 45.6%) -- 9.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
  • 4 Atk Mega Scizor Superpower vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Tyranitar: 348-412 (101.7 - 120.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
So, Superpower definitely matters vs Mega Tyranitar, which can 2HKO Mega Scizor while avoiding the 2HKO from Bullet Punch.

As for the other targets i mentioned, you should catch most of them on the switch, such as Heatran (a common switch-in to Scizor) and Mega Charizard X (37.9 - 44.6%). Superpower also does ~35% damage to Mega Mawile, which is nice to let Mega Scizor revenge kill weakened ones if all else fails. Lastly, scrap Chansey, my bad, they never stay into Mega Scizor because they are expecting Knock Off, which fucks them up badly.

So, hitting three very important Pokemon (Excadrill, Mega Tyranitar, Bisharp), and having some other situational uses definitely makes Superpower a viable option on physically defensive Mega Scizor.
 
Well, I've personally been running a set that speed creeps max speed adamant Bisharp that is always able to ohko after one turn of Life Orb recoil. It doesn't lose out on lots of physical bulk either, so it works. It cannot take a combination of Knock Off and Sucker Punch if the Bisharp has used an SD, but no one Suckers a Krook anyways. It can switch in and KO, so that's cool.

Krookodile @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 80 Spd / 252 Def / 164 HP / 12 Atk
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Knock Off
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 164 HP / 252+ Def Krookodile: 136-161 (36.5 - 43.2%) -- 98.9% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Iron Head vs. 164 HP / 252+ Def Krookodile: 226-266 (60.7 - 71.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 164 HP / 252+ Def Krookodile: 113-133 (30.3 - 35.7%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

So, even if it does switch in on an Iron Head, it's fine. The only way the Bisharp wins is if it's Jolly or the opponent knows you're speed creeped.
+1 252 Atk Life Orb Bisharp Iron Head vs. 164 HP / 252+ Def Krookodile: 207-243 (55.6 - 65.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery


And if they do run lefties for some weird reason, then they will not be able to 2hko anyways.
+1 252+ Atk Bisharp Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Krookodile: 174-205 (44.1 - 52%) -- 14.8% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
 
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Mega Scizor with Superpower:
  • +2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Scizor: 207-243 (60.1 - 70.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  • +2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Scizor: 168-199 (48.8 - 57.8%) -- 94.5% chance to 2HKO
That doesn't sound like too good of a counter in a real situation. Scizor can't switch into one and even use Superpower to knock Bisharp out. I'm assuming a battle condition like Bisharp came into Defog to get to +2, then Knock Off'd as you switch to Scizor. Yes, it's a specific situation, but extremely likely. If it Swords Danced as you switch to Scizor, the calcs mean more and Scizor can more reliably counter - but only if it's already Mega Evolved. But if it nabbed the +2 from Defog or Sticky Web or the like, Scizor eats the Knock Off and the proceeding Sucker Punch. Superpower-wielding Scizor usually don't carry Roost, so it can't evade the Sucker Punch that way. By definition, Mega Scizor IS a counter because it can switch in on Bisharp, but in theoretical practice Scizor can't really do anything back because Bisharp can easily eat it for breakfast with even minimal residual damage.

This is really just an "I hate Bisharp" or "I REALLY hate DeoSharp" rant...
 
That doesn't sound like too good of a counter in a real situation. Scizor can't switch into one and even use Superpower to knock Bisharp out. I'm assuming a battle condition like Bisharp came into Defog to get to +2, then Knock Off'd as you switch to Scizor. Yes, it's a specific situation, but extremely likely. If it Swords Danced as you switch to Scizor, the calcs mean more and Scizor can more reliably counter - but only if it's already Mega Evolved. But if it nabbed the +2 from Defog or Sticky Web or the like, Scizor eats the Knock Off and the proceeding Sucker Punch. Superpower-wielding Scizor usually don't carry Roost, so it can't evade the Sucker Punch that way. By definition, Mega Scizor IS a counter because it can switch in on Bisharp, but in theoretical practice Scizor can't really do anything back because Bisharp can easily eat it for breakfast with even minimal residual damage.

This is really just an "I hate Bisharp" or "I REALLY hate DeoSharp" rant...
You got it all wrong, physically defensive Mega Scizor is the Defog user, which means that it's a fullproof counter to Bisharp, and one of the few Defog users that doesn't worry about Bisharp. The set i am talking about is max HP / max Def+, Defog / Roost / Superpower / (Bullet Punch / U-turn).
 
krookodile countering bisharp to some degree (only with speed creep tho)is cool and all but it still takes a shitton so it's not exactly a hard counter, also krookodile fuckin sucks lol
 
You got it all wrong, physically defensive Mega Scizor is the Defog user, which means that it's a fullproof counter to Bisharp, and one of the few Defog users that doesn't worry about Bisharp. The set i am talking about is max HP / max Def+, Defog / Roost / Superpower / (Bullet Punch / U-turn).
Ah. Gotcha there then. That works then. By mentioning Superpower I thought you meant an offensive version, as I've never seen/used Defog sets with Superpower. My confusion.
 
How does one counter Bisharp, exactly?

Scarfed Tyranitar deals with it handily

252+ Atk Tyranitar Superpower vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Bisharp: 588-696 (210.7 - 249.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 168-198 (49.1 - 57.8%) -- 96.1% chance to 2HKO
 
krookodile countering bisharp to some degree (only with speed creep tho)is cool and all but it still takes a shitton so it's not exactly a hard counter, also krookodile fuckin sucks lol
It sure ain't a hard counter, but it is an option for teams that struggle with Bisharp and doesn't want to use Lando-T (for reasons like giving too many ice weaknesses, no dark/ghost resists on the team, is more of a defensively oriented team)

Also, Krook is basically a lando-t without u-turn and with a dark typing instead of flying typing, so it's not that bad either.
 
Scarfed Tyranitar deals with it handily

252+ Atk Tyranitar Superpower vs. 32 HP / 0 Def Bisharp: 588-696 (210.7 - 249.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 168-198 (49.1 - 57.8%) -- 96.1% chance to 2HKO
Only on a revenge kill though, since if Tyranitar comes in on Knock Off it loses its Scarf and becomes Iron Head fodder...

EDIT: Or a risky predicted switch of course...
 
How does one counter Bisharp, exactly?

Of all of the potent out threats, it seems as if, personally, Bisharp is among the most lethal. Sucker Punch keeps offensive checks at bay, and they certainly aren't switching in. Knock off can 1hko max/max skarm of all things at +2 after a bit of hazards damage. Pokemon like lando-t that would otherwise be great end upboosting it even further with intimidate. What have you guys found to be the best ways to take on the power ranger on both offensive and defensive teams?

I agree that Bisharp is quite the dangerous Pokemon right now, the combination of the new buffed Knock Off, ability to benefit from Defog thanks to defiant, and really strong Sucker Punch to take out faster opponents. Honestly i end up throwing out entire teams sometimes simply because i don't feel comfortable enough against opposing Bisharp, even if the team is really good otherwise.

As for checks and counters to Bisharp, personally i find Keldeo to be one of the best offensive checks to Bisharp, it resists both of Bisharp's STAB moves, and while not the bulkiest thing in the world can still take boosted Sucker Punches from it, meanwhile outspeeding Bisharp and easily KOing it in return with either Specs Hydro Pump or Secret Sword. The risk of losing Choice Specs to Knock Off is there, but i find Keldeo isn't off too badly even without the boost. Other Fighting-types such as Conkeldurr, Lucario, and the rare Mega Heracross work effectively against Bisharp too (and Terrakion too i guess but its weakness to Iron Head makes it harder to directly switch in, works fine if you get it in on Knock Off/Sucker or on the revenge though), being able to take Bisharp's Dark-type STAB moves easily while having the bulk to take an unboosted Iron Head, and can all either outspeed and easily OHKO, or force Bisharp to switch out or sucker with a priority move such as Mach Punch, just watch out for Defiant boosted Iron Heads on the switch in and you should be fine. If you're running a more defensive team, some Pokemon that can hold Bisharp off include Physically Defensive Hippowdon and Quagsire. Hippowdon has the sheer physical bulk to take even a boosted Life Orb Knock Off from Bisharp and can just EQ Bisharp, although it takes quite a beating in the process. Quagsire is unique in that Unaware ensures it doesn't care about Bisharp even if it has a Defiant/Swords Dance boost, and can take any move from Bisharp, recover off the damage, and eventually wear it down with either Scald or Earthquake.
 
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Only on a revenge kill though, since if Tyranitar comes in on Knock Off it loses its Scarf and becomes Iron Head fodder...

EDIT: Or a risky predicted switch of course...

Or a predicted Sucker Punch, which isn't too difficult.

To be fair I was mainly thinking on the revenge, as that's become what I figure to be the best way to KO Bisharp. Charizard Y has become something of my signature pokemon, causing my teams to get rather samey, so I've never really tried a lot of the mentioned counters. Mandibuzz and Skarmory phase it pretty well though.

Maybe I should branch out and try a different mega...
 
Only on a revenge kill though, since if Tyranitar comes in on Knock Off it loses its Scarf and becomes Iron Head fodder...

EDIT: Or a risky predicted switch of course...

It can't switch in on Iron Head either:
252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Iron Head vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 335-398 (97.9 - 116.3%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
 
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