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Other Current Metagame trends
- Thread starter reyscarface
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Pretty soon every team you run into will have an Aegislash on it, most likely the crumbler variant.
SubToxic is getting more and more popular too.
Honestly, I prefer facing Aegislash over Conk.
Keldeo gets common on the upper ladder too.
I think you will regret that statement as you get up the ladder, unless your team has an unusual amount of answers to him.
What sets do most high ladder Aegislashs run? I never had a major problem with Aegislash, in Wifi or Showdown. In my current team, I have Heatran and Excadrill to take on Aegislash and Rotom-W Volt Switch's does decent damage to Blade form.
Surprisingly enough, I managed to 1hko an Aegislash with Sableye today, still can't figure out how I managed that. Though I'm pretty sure skilled players using Aegislash can turn it into a deadly Pokemon.
Conkeldurr on the other is a major pain in the ass for me. Since it has 3 great abilities, it's hard to know which one it has. I try to avoid to burn or toxic Conk in fear of Guts, and every set I faced hits fucking hard. Not to mention the access to Knock Off and shitload of coverage moves and the fact that it's so fucking bulky with AV and can regain health with Drain Punch. Unlike Aegislash, it doesn't take a skilled player to use Conkeldurr, it works for anyone.
When I face Conkeldurr I try to take it out without switching in fear of losing my items to Knock Off.
name: The CRUMBLER
move 1: Shadow Ball
move 2: Iron Head / Sacred Sword
move 3: Shadow Sneak
move 4: Sacred Sword / King's Shield / Pursuit
ability: Stance Change
item: Life Orb / Spooky Plate
nature: Quiet
evs: 244 Atk / 252 SpA / 12 Spe
move 1: Shadow Ball
move 2: Iron Head / Sacred Sword
move 3: Shadow Sneak
move 4: Sacred Sword / King's Shield / Pursuit
ability: Stance Change
item: Life Orb / Spooky Plate
nature: Quiet
evs: 244 Atk / 252 SpA / 12 Spe
name: SubToxic
move 1: Shadow Ball
move 2: King's Shield
move 3: Toxic
move 4: Substitute
ability: Stance Change
item: Leftovers
nature: Modest
evs: 244 HP / 252 SpA / 12 Spe
move 1: Shadow Ball
move 2: King's Shield
move 3: Toxic
move 4: Substitute
ability: Stance Change
item: Leftovers
nature: Modest
evs: 244 HP / 252 SpA / 12 Spe
I've noticed that megas seem to follow trends very noticeably. One example is the transition of powerful megas being used a lot going from gengar and kangaskan to lucario, as they were banned, yet it keeps happening now. The next popular mega was probably venusaur, as everyone found out how good of a wall it was. Then Charizard X and Y got big, and now everyone knows the different threats they can pose.
Recently I've been seeing more and more Mawile and some Manectric too. Both are decent pivot options, scaring out physical threats and in mawile's case hitting really hard if slowly.
Which mega's do you think will become more popular as time goes on? Maybe NP Houndoom?
Also another trend i've noticed, maybe not relevant, is that everything that happens in the higher ladder eventually trickles down to the lower ladder, if like a month or two later.
Recently I've been seeing more and more Mawile and some Manectric too. Both are decent pivot options, scaring out physical threats and in mawile's case hitting really hard if slowly.
Which mega's do you think will become more popular as time goes on? Maybe NP Houndoom?
Also another trend i've noticed, maybe not relevant, is that everything that happens in the higher ladder eventually trickles down to the lower ladder, if like a month or two later.
._.
Baton passing teams
only way to beat them is via crit
HAZE META?!
n but yea how to viable stop it?
i see partingshots smeargle can also kind of dent it if they switch in to espeon.
They are getting common in top ladder and i have n0t seen anyone mention it
Baton passing teams
only way to beat them is via crit
HAZE META?!
n but yea how to viable stop it?
i see partingshots smeargle can also kind of dent it if they switch in to espeon.
They are getting common in top ladder and i have n0t seen anyone mention it
I can already tell you... Charizard-Y's popularity isn't going anywhere, the other rises were due to bans. Realistically, Gyarados-mega could very easily break out, everyone knows how good it is but no one seems to want to use it. Breaks unprepared stall teams in half (The mediocre ones saying "And physical setup sweepers are covered by quagsire) and after two boosts basically takes talonflame or a mach punch user to drag down. Best part of it probably is the fact that mach punch users can only check it AFTER it becomes a mega. The typing change is so huge that when you activate Mega Gyara's change can be a mindgame all it's own.
Aegislash is super varied in the upper ladder. It can run straight attacker ("crumbler") sets that may or may not have King's Shield, and will have varying degrees of bulk and power, and these sets are the most common. It can run sub+toxic sets to get by the pokemon that normally wall it. It can run a Sub+King's Shield set just to screw with you (basically, they are more defensive, being able to stall for leftovers recovery, and also Subs really tempt you into attacking, which gets King's Shield drops, which in turn cause free subs or attacks...). There are still some sweeper sets. Swords Dance still exists, and run by people who know to run a move like Iron Head over King's Shield so that it's not weak as hell. Automatize+Weakness Policy is another sweeper set too.
Conkeldurr can't put up much of a fight against most fairies (assuming the usual set of Drain Punch, Mach Punch, Knock Off, Ice Punch with Assault Vest like nearly all of the Conkeldurr run), as well as a lot of physically bulky pokemon like Skarmory, Hippowdon, Mega Venusaur, Tangrowth, tank Mega Charizard, etc.
Conkeldurr is just a lot more predictable than Aegislash. In pretty much every area. Looking at the 1760 stats from february:
Aegislash's most popular EV spread has 12% of Aegislash using it. Conkeldurr runs max HP/ max attack / 4 SpD Adamant 33% of the time. This is due a lot to Aegislash capable of being a physical attacker, a special attacker, or mixed, and some players want speed, some don't care, and some go out of their way to get a slow Aegislash.
Conkeldurr has 4 moves it runs 88 to 98% of the time, those 4 moves making that cookie cutter set I listed above, with the next most common alternative only run 5% of the time. Aegislash has 4 moves it runs 69 to 92% of the time, meaning there are a lot more sets besides the "cookie cutter" set (which happens to be Kings Shield, Shadow Ball, Shadow Sneak and Sacred Sword). Aegislash's 5th most common move is run 20% of the time.
87% of Conkeldurr run Assault Vest. Meanwhile, 87% of Aegislash ran Leftovers, Spooky Plate, Life Orb or Weakness Policy.
About Conkeldurr having 3 abilities to pick from, it still takes Guts 89% of the time.
Hm... Mega Pinsir is the most obvious answer, it's freaking everywhere. Other common ones are Tyranitar, Scizor, Gyarados, Venusaur, Mawile and Charizards. Yzard is more common than X, but X seems to be catching up, specially in the upper ladder. Manectric and Garchomp are starting to become common. Manectric I think is probably going to become OU in the next usage statistics, and Garchomp seems to be getting more accepted after the "it's worse than regular Garchomp" first impression. Medicham and Gardevoir seem to be catching up too, the former more than the later.
The rest are nowhere to be seem, most of the time.
You're totally right. It's unfortunate that the other seven megas are pretty good; they're just harder to use than the ones you listed. But, I guess their placement in BL, UU, and RU reflects that.
These sets do seem troublesome but the Sword Dance King Shield set is easy to take on.
I'm not saying Aegislash is a bad Pokemon, or an easy one, my point is that not anybody can put Aegislash to a good use. It takes a skilled and experienced player to use Aegislash properly. Conkeldurr doesn't need much of experience. The thing is always bulky, unlike Aegislash which is frail in its blade form. If it run Guts, giving it a status effect will only make it stronger and all you need to do is run 4 attacks which will give you a great coverage and pick the effective one, or just spam Knock Off and deprive the other team of there items.
The stats prove that Aegislash is more varied, so I was wrong. I've seen some Conks running elemntal punches and I assumed they have the Iron Fist ability, but I can see why most of them run Guts.
If my team had any Fairy, I wouldn't have much of a problem with Conk, but of all of my teams the only fairy I have is Mawile. As for Skarmory, it take 2hko Conk with Brave Bird, but at the risk of losing my item.
I'm not sure if this is the place to ask, but I'm reading about Baton Pass being pretty strong right now (in fact on the Swagger suspect test thread there are people claiming it should be "nerfed"), can someone explain how that is the case? What do good BP teams run nowdays?
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It's basically denisse's team. Gets some boosts, runs into Espeon... the standard, but it is impossible to phaze because smeargle carries ingrain and there's no common haze user that can take away the issue. What exactly makes it so strong is probably the fact that Sylveon sets second key to blast any dark types that traditionally neutered baton pass (esp Mandi/TTar destroying Espeon)... And, my own personal problem of having been haxed instead of getting the crits needed...
Basically: Scolilipede is a better Ninjask. Sylveon is a good espeon/Mew, Mr Mime has a better typing and countering these teams forces you to go out of the general way that building teams takes. If you aren't having problems, you probably have a really good set up sweeper to lead with that attacks from the special side. TG Manaphy destroys these teams early for the most part, but can be spored.
Basically: Scolilipede is a better Ninjask. Sylveon is a good espeon/Mew, Mr Mime has a better typing and countering these teams forces you to go out of the general way that building teams takes. If you aren't having problems, you probably have a really good set up sweeper to lead with that attacks from the special side. TG Manaphy destroys these teams early for the most part, but can be spored.
Yeah people are finally starting to branch out from using only mega Charizard and venusaur.
Gardevoir, who was considered too slow and weak is now being appreciated for its ability to burn and smack things with hyper voice.
Mega gyarados and tyranitar remain under appreciated and under used threats. Seriously, after a SINGLE dragon dance, tyranitar has the power and bulk to wreck while teams that lack a dedicated stab fighting type hit.
Gyarados also can be ev'd to survive a brave bird, especially if you switch in as normal gyarados, who is mega gyarados' best partner tbh.
So many underrated megas that aren't used merely because their immediate power levels aren't sky high.
Gardevoir, who was considered too slow and weak is now being appreciated for its ability to burn and smack things with hyper voice.
Mega gyarados and tyranitar remain under appreciated and under used threats. Seriously, after a SINGLE dragon dance, tyranitar has the power and bulk to wreck while teams that lack a dedicated stab fighting type hit.
Gyarados also can be ev'd to survive a brave bird, especially if you switch in as normal gyarados, who is mega gyarados' best partner tbh.
So many underrated megas that aren't used merely because their immediate power levels aren't sky high.
I've been trying to use Mega Gardevoir lately but it's not really working. Her defenses are just horrible, she provides almost no defensive sygerny for the team, and the fact that she has to start at 80 speed before mega evolving doesn't help. I can see her being good, but it seems a lot harder in practice than it is on paper.
Mega Tyranitar is just awesome. It's ridiculosuly easy to set up, and the list of things who can stop its sweep isn't very big. It's also a very useful pokemon even if you don't use DD.
Mega Tyranitar is just awesome. It's ridiculosuly easy to set up, and the list of things who can stop its sweep isn't very big. It's also a very useful pokemon even if you don't use DD.
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Something I am noticing at the moment while playing suspect ladder is the omnipresence of Keldeo and Thundurus... I dont know, maybe I just didnt notice it that much in the OU ladder but those 2 are basicly on every team I am facing usually acompanied by one of the Landorus forms and Aegisslash... makes it a bit boring when every team looks the same -.-
Mega Gardevoir has nice special bulk, and will-o-wisp to punish any physical attackers that try to switch in (well, any that can stomach a Hyper Voice at least, like Scizor.)
I think Antar mentioned somewhere it could go OU with the next set of stats (which would kinda suck because then UU would pretty much just have Florges for good fairy types, as omnipresent as she is.)
Tyranitar resists every move Chandelure has except Energy Ball which doesn't even 2HKO and it can Pursuit trap or set up on it depending on what varient you're running.
About the Baton Pass teams, it appears, they're gaining popularity precisely because of the Swagplay test. Baton Pass teams generally carry at least one Magic Bouncer and very oft Sylveon, both of which are checks to a typical Swagplay moveset (usually - but Espeon and M-Absol are 3HKO'd by Foul Play and anything can just lose to sheer hax), and because much of the team is specially based, many of its teammates have attack-lowering natures and IVs. Plus, if any one of the full Staffette-roundabout suffers a +2 Attack, any teammate can just freeload off the free attack boost, so long as you're eventually cured of confusion.
Plus there's that one person on the main OU ladder who gets top ratings on like seven different alts with a BP team.
Plus there's that one person on the main OU ladder who gets top ratings on like seven different alts with a BP team.
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