Clamperl doesn't need Trick Room support. It has access to Shell Smash which, after the ETS boosts and assuming it has maxed Speed EVs + Timid, is enough to outspeed every unboosted threat in the metagame (not including Scarfers ofc.) Even Modest is enough if you're willing to let Ninjask and Timid Electrode/Jolly Deoxys-S outspeed you, and those concerns aren't particularly relevant as Ninjask gets boosts after every turn anyway, Deoxys-S isn't offensive, and I have no idea who would run Timid Electrode unless they're that bent on being able to revenge-kill Clamperl without priority.
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EXTREME Tier Shift
- Thread starter Klang
- Start date
I just figured trick room explosion/ slow (fast) u turn(volt might be better to scare off waters) support would let it worry more about coverage and bulk and might pair with mega mawile
Heck if You could set up in front of a counter before explosion more power to ya
Heck if You could set up in front of a counter before explosion more power to ya
okay, so i want to bring up a pokemon i know im going to get weird looks for seriously sudgesting is good in this meta...
AbsolouteTank (Avalugg) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Recover
- Toxic/earthquake/Roar
- Avalanche
okay...so lets be on the same page here, im not saying "hurrdurr increas bulk maek this gud obz. im literally saying, avalugg is actually a decent threat in ets. as some people know, ive been running a very...bizzare team. and avalugg is my physical tank of the team. how physically bulky is avalugg...well...lets just say, you need super effective hits to even dream of 2hkoing avalugg. and even then, you better have STAB on it.
196+ Atk Choice Band Ho-Oh Sacred Fire vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 204-242 (43.1 - 51.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Slaking Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 177-208 (37.4 - 43.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Guts Ursaring Facade (140 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 165-195 (34.8 - 41.2%) -- 68.2% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
and the important part is, avalugg isn't a sitting duck vs them either with his beautiful 157 attack.
0 Atk Avalugg Avalanche vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Ursaring: 169-201 (42.1 - 50.1%) -- 34.4% chance to 2HKO after toxic damage not amazing, but a very good chunk for a physical wall to deal in ets. avalugg, despite an awful typing, is by far, a very effective spinner in ets, and although i wouldnt say the best physical wall (hello ironically best "partner in crime" quagsire) its definitely worthy of a team slot for anyone wanting to try out stall and want a spinner.
oh, and just for lulz:
+6 252 Atk Arceus Extreme Speed vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 195-229 (41.2 - 48.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
AbsolouteTank (Avalugg) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Recover
- Toxic/earthquake/Roar
- Avalanche
okay...so lets be on the same page here, im not saying "hurrdurr increas bulk maek this gud obz. im literally saying, avalugg is actually a decent threat in ets. as some people know, ive been running a very...bizzare team. and avalugg is my physical tank of the team. how physically bulky is avalugg...well...lets just say, you need super effective hits to even dream of 2hkoing avalugg. and even then, you better have STAB on it.
196+ Atk Choice Band Ho-Oh Sacred Fire vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 204-242 (43.1 - 51.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Slaking Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 177-208 (37.4 - 43.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Guts Ursaring Facade (140 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 165-195 (34.8 - 41.2%) -- 68.2% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
and the important part is, avalugg isn't a sitting duck vs them either with his beautiful 157 attack.
0 Atk Avalugg Avalanche vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Ursaring: 169-201 (42.1 - 50.1%) -- 34.4% chance to 2HKO after toxic damage not amazing, but a very good chunk for a physical wall to deal in ets. avalugg, despite an awful typing, is by far, a very effective spinner in ets, and although i wouldnt say the best physical wall (hello ironically best "partner in crime" quagsire) its definitely worthy of a team slot for anyone wanting to try out stall and want a spinner.
oh, and just for lulz:
+6 252 Atk Arceus Extreme Speed vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 195-229 (41.2 - 48.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
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Seems neat! Some other cool bulk showcases-
252+ Atk Primal Groudon Fire Punch vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg in Harsh Sunshine: 204-242 (43.1 - 51.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
That's right, not only can it live the most powerful physical attacker in users on an se stab weather boosted hit, it can recover on it.
It's special bulk isn't half bad either-
252+ SpA Soul Dew Latios Draco Meteor vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Avalugg: 393-463 (83 - 97.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Avalugg can even beat the most offensive hazard remover1v1, making it an excellent controller for stacking teams as well.
I'm not sure it'll be great in actual play, but it seems to have a lot of potential.
I might have to make a hail team honestly, but really depends on if walrein or articono have enough of a buff to use their abilities and abuse blizzard/hurricane and bulky toxic (please have taunt)
If you already have Unaware, Haze isn't needed. Also, 99% of the time, Roar/Whirlwind is more useful than Haze. You can also run Clear Smog on certain mons who can't phaze such as Amoongus or Weezing.
Also, regarding Avalugg's bulk:
252+ Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Rampardos Rock Slide vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 257-304 (54.3 - 64.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Rampardos not only has this immensely destructive wallbreaking, but also a decent 137/100/90 bulk and an (admittedly) below-average 98 base speed.
Also, regarding Avalugg's bulk:
252+ Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Rampardos Rock Slide vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 257-304 (54.3 - 64.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Rampardos not only has this immensely destructive wallbreaking, but also a decent 137/100/90 bulk and an (admittedly) below-average 98 base speed.
LightningLord2 said:
Haze has two advantages over Unaware in that it beats Baton Pass teams single-handedly (as it doesn't get blocked, reflected or anything) and can handle Stored Power sweepers like Swoobat, Sigilyph(?), etc. Though the Pokemon that have been listed don't enjoy dueling a boosted Swoobat besides one:
+2 252 SpA Swoobat Stored Power (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Articuno: 153-180 (32.9 - 38.7%)
Even after rocks, and even on a CM switch in you tank a hit and can Roost, Haze, Whirlwind, whatever. I think it's safe to say Amoonguss + Weezing don't stand a chance vs Swoobat thanks to their Psychic weakness. Quagsire falls to a Stored Power (or a Grass move) and Murkrow isn't that viable in the ETS meta but it can handle the bat with relative ease (dependant on its potential coverage move). Don't count out haze ma
I really don't understand why Ubers are allowed in Extreme. I mean, the boosting of lower tier Pokemon makes them viable enough to take on OU threats but having Primal Groudon available is plain stupid. There's barely a Pokemon boosted in PU that can even stand a chance against it. Not to mention a plethora of other Ubers that can only really be dealt with with Ubers.
Well, that's simply not true. Things like Golduck, Flygon, Altaria, Cresselia, quagsire... all these and more wall PDon. Every other uber is similar, especially since most of them are already beaten by some low tiered mon or anther (see Arceus with Skarmory and Quagsire). If you cant find a counter in the lower tiers, you aren't looking hard enough. Besides, there isn't anything wrong with using the Ubers, or inherently broken about them.
Baton pass unfortunate in that you need a dedicated counter, otherwise you just get swept. All the core baton pass mons get a disturbing amount of additional bulk with the stat boost which mean that with a few defensive stat changes, subs need 2 or 3 hits to break.
Fortunately, Quagsire exists, featuring both Haze, Unaware, Encore and Recover, which means that it can shut a BP team down by itself.
For example:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/extremetiershift-367731914
Another thing I have found hilarious is
Hustle Raticate
55 --> 95
81 --> 121
60 --> 100
50 --> 90
70 --> 110
97 --> 137
Raticate @ Choice Band
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Quick Attack
- Facade / Final Gambit / Sucker Punch <-- The lure slot
- Retaliate
- U-turn
Hustle gives you the same power boost as guts, but now you don't have to worry about using a flame orb and can get 1.5x more power with an item like choice band. Due to it's nice speed, it makes an amazing revengekiller. 140BP retaliate kills anything slower, and quick attack kills most weakened sweepers with the nice (mostly) neutral spread of normal typed priority. Final Gambit can be used if they try to plop a registeel in front of you.
Fortunately, Quagsire exists, featuring both Haze, Unaware, Encore and Recover, which means that it can shut a BP team down by itself.
For example:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/extremetiershift-367731914
Another thing I have found hilarious is
Hustle Raticate
55 --> 95
81 --> 121
60 --> 100
50 --> 90
70 --> 110
97 --> 137
Raticate @ Choice Band
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Quick Attack
- Facade / Final Gambit / Sucker Punch <-- The lure slot
- Retaliate
- U-turn
Hustle gives you the same power boost as guts, but now you don't have to worry about using a flame orb and can get 1.5x more power with an item like choice band. Due to it's nice speed, it makes an amazing revengekiller. 140BP retaliate kills anything slower, and quick attack kills most weakened sweepers with the nice (mostly) neutral spread of normal typed priority. Final Gambit can be used if they try to plop a registeel in front of you.
i dont see how having titans in the tier like avalugg (almost twice as bulky then aggron, gets recovery, and 20 more attack) sweepers like scyther (145 attack and speed, technician) marowak(literally groudon-bulk with double attack.) and 170-200 attack behemoths like ursaring and rampardos classify as "viable enough to take on ou threats". theres a reason ou isn't used at ALL in ets, and thats because a single pu mon would curbstomp them into the ground like theres no tomorrow. like, some of these pu mons have stats that excel mega rayquaza. (eg: articuno). and then there are the bulkhemoths like mega audino (bulkier then giratina himself) quagsire (literally almost impossible to kill if it wasnt for his grass weakness). if anything, id say ubers actually have a tough as hell time in ets, as stuff like quagsire and maudino make their lives difficult.
HERE I COME
CHUCKLER THAN THE REST OF THEM
I hope you realize just how wrong that is after you read all of this. First off, that's literally wrong. Not only are most teams mostly PU mons, but given the ubiquity of Primal Groudon, this definitely isn't exclusively due to "new toy syndrome". Not only that, but Golduck outspeeds and oneshots almost all Primal Groudon sets, Marowak has pretty much eliminated Mega Mawile's role in the metagame, Mewtwo faces stiff competition from Beheeyem (only beating it in speed unless it goes mega), and Articuno beats out Mega Mewtwo and Rayquaza in terms of highest BST, among other things.
I definitely wouldn't use max defense. It has little to no use with that defense. I'd just go 248 hp 252 spdef for MAXIMUM TANKINESS
i mean, id consider tanking stuff like groudon, guts ursaring, and other pokemon stall cry's at the sight of a "use", but again, i was running a stall team, so special attackers weren't hitting ava anyways. if your running bulky offense and want a utility spinner, special def is definitely the better choice.
Idk if anybody mentioned this yet but I am going to.
Furfrou
115/120/100/105/130/142
This thing is very fast with decent support moves, and it is bulky as hell. 115/100/130 bulk with Fur Coat is insane. A specially defensive spread of 248/8/252 in defenses gives you 433 HP, 476 defense, and 394 SpDef, with 320 speed uninvested. If only it got recovery...
Furfrou
115/120/100/105/130/142
This thing is very fast with decent support moves, and it is bulky as hell. 115/100/130 bulk with Fur Coat is insane. A specially defensive spread of 248/8/252 in defenses gives you 433 HP, 476 defense, and 394 SpDef, with 320 speed uninvested. If only it got recovery...
Please implement Baton Pass clause. Even a simple quick SmashPass core of Taunt Koff Deo-S + Gorebyss is nigh unstoppable without dedicated counters. People have mentioned stuff like Haze, Unaware, and Ditto, but Ditto is niche at best, Haze users or PHazers are likely to get Taunted by Deoxys or simply killed outright by Gorebyss (and they're easily identified as such because most Haze mons can't viably do much else), and Unaware Quagsire cannot do anything back, and is OHKO'd by Solar Beam Primal Groudon, a common recipient of SmashPass. Even one-time checks like Haze Murkrow (which must come in on Gorebyss directly) may be worn down by hazards and Ice Beams, while the Smash Pass player only needs one successful pass to take out Murkrow, or even win the game. This isn't even getting in to stuff like full Baton Pass teams(which have ways to circumvent their checks).
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OK, I definitely stand corrected but damn if you weren't assholes about it. I clearly haven't explored enough options yet to deal with Uber threats, probably because I haven't even had to think about how to beat them for months.
What happens to blissey? She gets 265 base HP, but the cap is 255
Behold the tyranny of MAudino! I made a lot of missteps, but MAudino turned it around. Just an example of people needing more defenses against MAudino. He has heal bell as well by the way.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/extremetiershift-368272070
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/extremetiershift-368272070
Just like any other stat, it's capped at 255.
Just because this is couched in an Ubers environment doesn't mean we can't follow common sense.
I'm implementing the OU Baton Pass clause. The Immortal please.
I'm implementing the OU Baton Pass clause. The Immortal please.
Thing is no one was even crazy with it yet, because Shednija could be a 2nd win condition even if he could only pass hone claws and sub, he offers forced switches and smashes other baton passes with a boosted shadow sneak
Hey i made some cool sets(some of them are the same from Smogon but with several changes):
I love this tier :D
I love this tier :D
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/extremetiershift-368922164
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