Garchomp

ScarfChomp will definitely see tons of use. With all the new dragons raging around, it'll be too easy for a scarfed one to come in and smack down an Outraging Garchomp, unless you're using Invisichomp. I think it will be similar to Gengar's case in 4th gen: without the ability to ensure it will stay alive against revengers, it won't be sweeping. Sub or Haban (probably sub) is the way to go here. Especially since broken-as-all-hell Sand Veil is still in play.
 
even if garchomp goes back to OU, it still has ononkusu as competition who has more Atk AND it has dragon dance.

its like rampardos and salamence decided to have a child
 
^ It's more likely that Garchomp will outclass Ononokuso in my opinion. 102 Spe makes all the difference in the world. Ononokuso also has pretty hard counters in Skarmory and Nattorei due to it lacking a fire move, while Garchomp actually has a means of taking them down.
 
I'd like to point out that SubSalac/SD Chomp and Shanderra make an excellent core. Despite a lack of synergy, Shanderra removes Scizor and Skarmoy (For the SubSalac set) and Shanderra draws in Scarftar, who can easily be set up on by Garchomp. If you can think of others that can help this core, I'd like to know.

I can't wait to use Chomp, I've loved him since the dawn of D/P, but I started competitive battling a bit too late.
 
What do you all think about Stone Edge on Scarfchomp? I can't decide if its more useful than dragon claw or not. So it would be

@Choice Scarf
Jolly/Hasty
252 Atk/ 4 Def/ 252 Spe
Outrage
Earthquake
Stone Edge
Fire Fang/Fire Blast
 
If your team has Gyarados problems then yes. You can tailor your revenge-killer anyway you want, it's all based upon your team's needs.
 
wellwhynot said:
What do you all think about Stone Edge on Scarfchomp? I can't decide if its more useful than dragon claw or not. So it would be

@Choice Scarf
Jolly/Hasty
252 Atk/ 4 Def/ 252 Spe
Outrage
Earthquake
Stone Edge
Fire Fang/Fire Blast
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I personally am running Stone Edge and Dragon Claw over a Fire move to revenge kill Gyarados. I don't think Scarfed Garchomp needs a way to deal with walls, his best and main purpose is as a Revenge Killer.
 
Stickerz said:
I'd like to point out that SubSalac/SD Chomp and Shanderra make an excellent core. Despite a lack of synergy, Shanderra removes Scizor and Skarmoy (For the SubSalac set) and Shanderra draws in Scarftar, who can easily be set up on by Garchomp. If you can think of others that can help this core, I'd like to know.

I can't wait to use Chomp, I've loved him since the dawn of D/P, but I started competitive battling a bit too late.
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Yeah, I'm planning a Shanderaa-Garchomp core.

And same for me, I started Competitive battling too late.
 
Scarf Garchomp is the ultimate band-aid pokemon

Even if your team is filled with mediocre pokemon, throw in a Scarf-Chomp and you have a decent shot at beating the best of opponents. He's invaluable in this metagame and will definetely be a top 5 pokemon.

As for the pokemon itself he still has got what it takes to crush the metagame. Bulk, Speed and Power. Seriously, Garchomp is pokemon who definitely take hit when need be and strike back really hard.

As for countering Garchomp, here are a few pokemon who can manage to check him:
-Skarmory
-Nattorei
-Bronzong


Countering Choice Scarf isn't impossible, but problem lies in SD Yache who has very few counters.
(I can't think of any at the moment)
 
I honestly don't think he'll be as big a deal as Gen 4; 100 Spd was the "Standard" back then, but now we have a lot of higher speed pokemon. He's still insane, but everyone else is aswell.
 
moogleking said:
I honestly don't think he'll be as big a deal as Gen 4; 100 Spd was the "Standard" back then, but now we have a lot of higher speed pokemon. He's still insane, but everyone else is aswell.
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In relation to the opening of speed tiers, did you see the recent warstory "Whack-a-mole"? ScarfChomp's speed became an issue against a scarfed Kojondo, iirc. I honestly think there hasn't been much speed climb (though obviously there's some every generation). Rather, I think the issue is that the speed tiers have diversified, with many non-standard speeds. Yes, 102 speed is still excellent, as it outspeeds many crtical threats, old and new (Salamence, Sazandora, Randorosu, Zapdos, Hihidaruma, etc). However, I think that the speed tiers have been becoming less strict ever since early D/P, and these numerous base speed stats that are not divisible by 5 are a large cause of it.

So, I guess the main conclusion that can be drawn from my point is that while Garchomp's speed is very nice, it's not so much amazingly trolly as it is just really handy for the uses that Garchomp has, which appear to be revenge killing against offense, or stall breaking against defense.
 
the voice of reason said:
In relation to the opening of speed tiers, did you see the recent warstory "Whack-a-mole"? ScarfChomp's speed became an issue against a scarfed Kojondo, iirc. I honestly think there hasn't been much speed climb (though obviously there's some every generation). Rather, I think the issue is that the speed tiers have diversified, with many non-standard speeds. Yes, 102 speed is still excellent, as it outspeeds many crtical threats, old and new (Salamence, Sazandora, Randorosu, Zapdos, Hihidaruma, etc). However, I think that the speed tiers have been becoming less strict ever since early D/P, and these numerous base speed stats that are not divisible by 5 are a large cause of it.

So, I guess the main conclusion that can be drawn from my point is that while Garchomp's speed is very nice, it's not so much amazingly trolly as it is just really handy for the uses that Garchomp has, which appear to be revenge killing against offense, or stall breaking against defense.
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Yup, I've read it, and thats a fair point. However, we now have a few STeel types (Aianto, for example) who outspeed him and Mischevious Heart to come in and Encore a Swords Dance. Garchomp didn't get much besides competition this gen. Doryuzu springs immediately to mind.
 
Yah sadly Garchomp just came back into a far diverse invironment without anything new.I suppose this would actually be a good thing in general because it was seirusly way too broken last gen...Anyway i think Scarf will probably be Ideal as i dont think SD with 102 base speed and no proirity is going to be as broken as it was before.
 
As allready said before, Chomp wont be the Monster with Sd he was in Gen4, but im not sure wether the Scarfer will be that good, too. He has no move like trick or U-Turn or boom, so all he can do is revenche kill if the oppenent dont switch and hell give the oppenent lot of Freeturn, EQ is easily walled by flyers, FF is just to weak to hurt somebody really hard, and Outrage is walled by all the Steels.

Thats just Theorymon, but in the last days of Gen4 there wasnt much Choicer without one Supporting-Move like U-Turn, Trick or Boom, and im not sure wether this will really hurt Chomp or not.

ANyway a Sub-Salac-Set in tghe Sandstorm or a Yache-Sd-Chomp will still be viable as well, because theyll give Stall huge problems.
 
cosmicexplorer said:
It won't break Focus Sash, but it will break subs.
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This has been confirmed to be no longer true in Gen V; multi-hit attacks will now break through Sash after the first hit.


Oh, BTW, Skill Link Cloyster with Defensive investment can switch in on an SD, take SR damage, eat a +2 Outrage, and OHKO back with Icicle Spear.

IIRC, it could always do this, but Icicle Spear Cloyster is actually viable now.
 
I never played in a Garchomp era, but if he goes to OU, I can't wait to try him out, I've already tried the scarfer on PO and it works great (fuck you flygon!) =D
 
XienZo said:
This has been confirmed to be no longer true in Gen V; multi-hit attacks will now break through Sash after the first hit.


Oh, BTW, Skill Link Cloyster with Defensive investment can switch in on an SD, take SR damage, eat a +2 Outrage, and OHKO back with Icicle Spear.

IIRC, it could always do this, but Icicle Spear Cloyster is actually viable now.
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I was just about to post this.
Cloyster is no gimmick anymore and is actually rather dangerous with Shell Break, Skill Link and the boost to Icicle Spear's BP.
There are also Pokemon that can switch into Sub or SD and force Encore due with Mischievous Heart but most of those can't take an attack.
 
Just a nitpick, but Double Chop is superior to Dragon Claw on ScarfChomp and probably all other sets. 80 Base power distributed between 2 hits means that it carries the possibility of breaking a weak Sub and still doing damage.

As far as ScarfChomp goes, everyone has already said it. It will be useful to check the 100 speed crew and below (and lol Randorosu at 101), but basically Garchomp will need it if it wants to go for a late-game sweep. Too many things are faster than it otherwise. Scarf Shandera, the fighting crew, Meloia, various rain sweepers aiming to outrun +speed base 100s, the newly reintroduced Lati twins, and even ScarfTran from last gen. SD Chomp is...too slow these days.

That said, a Choice Band set seems all the more attractive, and it distinguishes itself from Onono by carrying a decent fire move and much more bulk and speed. Just a thought.
 
Bliss said:
As allready said before, Chomp wont be the Monster with Sd he was in Gen4, but im not sure wether the Scarfer will be that good, too. He has no move like trick or U-Turn or boom, so all he can do is revenche kill if the oppenent dont switch and hell give the oppenent lot of Freeturn, EQ is easily walled by flyers, FF is just to weak to hurt somebody really hard, and Outrage is walled by all the Steels.

Thats just Theorymon, but in the last days of Gen4 there wasnt much Choicer without one Supporting-Move like U-Turn, Trick or Boom, and im not sure wether this will really hurt Chomp or not.

ANyway a Sub-Salac-Set in tghe Sandstorm or a Yache-Sd-Chomp will still be viable as well, because theyll give Stall huge problems.
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ScarfChomp is still very viable. I used it during the PO 5th gen beta and it still just revenges so with stuff with tht speed (Got me to #3 on the ladder). Sure there are faster pokemon now but most of them don't usually wear a scarf.

Tht said, i don't like Fire Fang tht much. I didn't try Double Chop but i see it being okay.

Personally i used ScarfChomp with:
Outrage
Earthquake
Dragon Claw
Stone Edge
 
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