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Gen V Balanced Hackmons
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You might just be missing their Mold Breaker message. Pay attention to the battle logs!
By the way, would people be interested in viability rankings like most of the official tiers have?
Ive been thinking about this for a few days, and im not sure quite how it would work. Would it be ranked by set like prankster heart swap rhydon? Or would it be sorted purely by mon? Should anything at the moment be s tier?
This could help lower the difficulty barrier of getting into bh, which is often cited as a significant reason not to join.
Ive been thinking about this for a few days, and im not sure quite how it would work. Would it be ranked by set like prankster heart swap rhydon? Or would it be sorted purely by mon? Should anything at the moment be s tier?
This could help lower the difficulty barrier of getting into bh, which is often cited as a significant reason not to join.
I don't think viability rankings would function here, because there are so many sets possible to run. It sounds good, but most pokemon have so many possibilities, getting them into viability depends on stats, and that is why most of hackmons is ubers used. (Obvious exceptions to the rule, but this is what it is normally.)
Yeah, if you want to get into this tier, it is kind of difficult because there are relatively few resources for which sets are actually viable in the meta. On one hand this encourages creativity, but on the other, this causes newer players to use sub-optimal sets, which then makes them discouraged and they stop playing. The more dedicated players, or even merely those who stick around for a few days quickly learn about the standard sets, but at first, this can be quite a barrier. Because of the nature of this metagame and the fact that most Pokemon species are outclassed by others, I don't think that a viability ranking would be feasible, but I do agree that we need more resources for the prospective newer players who might join the meta.
The viability rankings are basically a resource for newer players. As far as the Pokemon being outclassed is concerned, that's why the thread is organized by set rather than Pokemon. Honestly once you get the basis of the tier it's easy to experiment and be creative. It's no fun if new players get turned off by getting owned by an Imposter Blissey or Sturdy Shedinja. In addition, this will help them teambuild faster; this should increase participation somewhat.
True, but having to rank the Pokemon by set means that our viability ranking thread would have to take a different format than the others, because saying that a set is S rank and then not giving the set isn't going to help the newer players. So we would probably have to rank sets using hide tags. Due to all the sets, we would have quite a long original post. If anyone is willing to put in the effort of maintaining it, a viability ranking would be good, if we included the sets with the Pokemon instead of just species.
If someone does start it, Imposter Chansey for S rank!
You described almost exactly what we're doing.
Come on guys, help us out with the Balanced Hackmons viability rankings thread!
Come on guys, help us out with the Balanced Hackmons viability rankings thread!
I don't think anyone's thought of using this set. I use it a lot, and it fits this category.
Giratina @ Leftovers
252 ATK/252 Spatk
Naughty Nature
Ability: Shadow Taf
Shadow Force
Perish Song
U-Turn
Dragon Pulse
Easy killer. Perish Song + Wait then at last turn U-Turn(Since a switch would go first, shadow tag says no.) So ya...Even is they manage to survive Shadow Forces and Dragon Pulses, Perish Song and U-Turn Pwn it.
Giratina @ Leftovers
252 ATK/252 Spatk
Naughty Nature
Ability: Shadow Taf
Shadow Force
Perish Song
U-Turn
Dragon Pulse
Easy killer. Perish Song + Wait then at last turn U-Turn(Since a switch would go first, shadow tag says no.) So ya...Even is they manage to survive Shadow Forces and Dragon Pulses, Perish Song and U-Turn Pwn it.
It's not so much that no one's thought of it that Shadow Tag was banned, in part because of Giratina's abuse of it (Well and everything else).
Also, assuming you run that in, say, Hackmons, where everything is legal (As opposed to Balanced Hackmons), you might want to run Recover over Dragon Pulse or Shadow Force. You don't really need both, or even U-turn, really.
Also, assuming you run that in, say, Hackmons, where everything is legal (As opposed to Balanced Hackmons), you might want to run Recover over Dragon Pulse or Shadow Force. You don't really need both, or even U-turn, really.
Tiny question here: What about Multitype?
I saw somebody mention that on the cartridges, Multitype would only work on Arceus. Should that be true for (Balanced) Hackmons too? If it was to be made to work properly on everything, it would make for a few interesting strategies. Namely, it would be very hard to find out which type a Pokémon actually is before it starts sweeping. Splash Plate versions of Eruptran would be hilarious (That Water Spout would probably hurt a little, with the Plate boost and all), and Sky Plate Magnezone would probably fool an unfortunate Earthquake user from time to time. These Pokémon might not be viable in BH anyway, but I think you get the point: "What 4X weakness, you say? You mean my immunity?"
I saw somebody mention that on the cartridges, Multitype would only work on Arceus. Should that be true for (Balanced) Hackmons too? If it was to be made to work properly on everything, it would make for a few interesting strategies. Namely, it would be very hard to find out which type a Pokémon actually is before it starts sweeping. Splash Plate versions of Eruptran would be hilarious (That Water Spout would probably hurt a little, with the Plate boost and all), and Sky Plate Magnezone would probably fool an unfortunate Earthquake user from time to time. These Pokémon might not be viable in BH anyway, but I think you get the point: "What 4X weakness, you say? You mean my immunity?"
Sky Plate Hurricane+Secret Sword on Magnezone/Heatran or Mewtwo
Flame Plate V-Create Kyurem-Black
Just some ideas.
Multitype only works on arceus, so theres no point speculating...
And unfortunately, it isnt really viable even on arceus. Ghostceus would seem to be the best option, as ghosts hae the perk of being able to run spooky plate judgment to beat imposters. However, the loss of an ability keeps it from utilising skill swap + normalize, or any other ability to aid in set up or sweep really holds it back from being the premier offensive ghost as its stats would suggest it should be.
And unfortunately, it isnt really viable even on arceus. Ghostceus would seem to be the best option, as ghosts hae the perk of being able to run spooky plate judgment to beat imposters. However, the loss of an ability keeps it from utilising skill swap + normalize, or any other ability to aid in set up or sweep really holds it back from being the premier offensive ghost as its stats would suggest it should be.
Why is Shadow Tag banned? Also why is Moody allowed, the only Pokemon that got it sucked, so now that it can be used on anything it's more broken than ever.
Moody takes too long to really work in BH compared to things like contrary and simple (and is still vulnerable to Heart Swap/Unaware). Shadow Tag is banned because it was overcentralizing. There were teams abusing it that could nearly guarantee victory from turn 1 if your opponent led with a status move. Even discounting that strategy, perish trapping is really hard to reliably escape without slotting volt-turn/shed shell on most of your pokemon.
I don't mean to be the guy who asks why everything is legal, but why are evasion moves legal? The reason why they were banned in the first place was because they added a huge element of luck to the game and there was almost no way of dealing with them. Now it's even worse in the former regard because of simple and only slightly better in the latter regard.
1: Skill Swap can be learned by literally everything.
2: Moves like Aura Sphere (that always hit) can be learned by literally everything.
Evasion boosts can take down unprepared opponents (or in the later stages of battle, when they have less resources to rely on), but for many, they won't help too much.
Basically, largely because of the access to any boosting moves, the pdfs of actually getting a sweep out of +2 evasion as compared to something like a shell smash, evasion moves arent good enough to ever get real usage, so arent relevant enough to ban. It especially doesnt help them that two of the three ways of dealing with standard set up beat evasion, as heart swappers just steal your boosts and imposters abuse it better than you do because of superior bulk.
I refuse to give away all my secrets xD
...but I'll post an annoying pokemon I have, even usable in regular Hackmons :)
Giratina @ Leftovers (Prankster)
-Substitute
-Curse
-Recover
-Spore
Giratina's a good wall, prankster makes it speedy... just learn to use it right ;)
...but I'll post an annoying pokemon I have, even usable in regular Hackmons :)
Giratina @ Leftovers (Prankster)
-Substitute
-Curse
-Recover
-Spore
Giratina's a good wall, prankster makes it speedy... just learn to use it right ;)
Anyone use this??
Regigigas @ Life Orb
Trait: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Double-Edge
- Hi Jump Kick
- Flare Blitz
- Head Smash
Works stupidly well as a plain bulky hard hitter surviving and dishing out incredible damage(Alternatively Slacking can be used) works stupidly well
Articuno @ Shell Bell
Trait: Sturdy
Level: 2
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Careful Nature
IVs: null HP
- Endeavor
- Pain Split
- Protect
- Ice Shard
Endeavor still works very well and even better with hail in BH.
Registeel @ Leftovers
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Calm Nature
- Heart Swap
- Baton Pass
- Whirlwind
- Heal Order
No one has thought of registeel as a perfect heart swapper.. He resists dragon!
Deoxys-Attack @ BrightPowder
Trait: Snow Cloak
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Minimize
- Substitute
- Heal Order
- Psystrike
Insane with hail support spamming substitute until it you finally evade a move and attempt to sweep.
Regigigas @ Life Orb
Trait: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Double-Edge
- Hi Jump Kick
- Flare Blitz
- Head Smash
Works stupidly well as a plain bulky hard hitter surviving and dishing out incredible damage(Alternatively Slacking can be used) works stupidly well
Articuno @ Shell Bell
Trait: Sturdy
Level: 2
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Careful Nature
IVs: null HP
- Endeavor
- Pain Split
- Protect
- Ice Shard
Endeavor still works very well and even better with hail in BH.
Registeel @ Leftovers
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Calm Nature
- Heart Swap
- Baton Pass
- Whirlwind
- Heal Order
No one has thought of registeel as a perfect heart swapper.. He resists dragon!
Deoxys-Attack @ BrightPowder
Trait: Snow Cloak
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Minimize
- Substitute
- Heal Order
- Psystrike
Insane with hail support spamming substitute until it you finally evade a move and attempt to sweep.
Both of these sets are hard countered by Giratina. Assuming you're using all of these Pokemon on the same team...
252+ Atk Life Orb Regigigas Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Giratina: 190-224 (37.69 - 44.44%) -- 2.34% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and weather
Pathetic much?
Articuno's Pain Split is definitely something to think about, but without Prankster you switch in on SR once and you're done.
No damage output whatsoever. This is why Rhydon and Groudon see use as Heart Swap users instead of Registeel. Fire and Ground moves are also all over the place, both of which Rhydon handles far better than Registeel.
Countered by opposing weather, Unaware, and your own Registeel. In addition, that Psyshock is pretty weak.
252+ SpA Deoxys-A Psystrike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Giratina: 160-189 (31.74 - 37.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and weather
Just saw a set that is new to me today: harvest sitrus giratina(not my idea). After using it a bit it is amazing, heres the set.
Giratina @ Sitrus Berry
Trait: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Curse
- Substitute
- Thunder Wave
- Dragon Pulse
Good support for this set is drought and magic bouncers.
When used in sun this thing is a beast. If the enemy is lacking magic bounce, then thunderwave them and get a sub up. Then curse and sub while they die. Get the KO with dragon pulse and you keep your sub for the next pokemon.
Giratina @ Sitrus Berry
Trait: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Curse
- Substitute
- Thunder Wave
- Dragon Pulse
Good support for this set is drought and magic bouncers.
When used in sun this thing is a beast. If the enemy is lacking magic bounce, then thunderwave them and get a sub up. Then curse and sub while they die. Get the KO with dragon pulse and you keep your sub for the next pokemon.
I based it on my very old tropius team back in PO http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3448646
This strategy is surprisingly effective because if it has SR support it kind of OHKO's everything threatening to it barring chansey
God (Regigigas) @ Sitrus Berry
Trait: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
IVs: null Atk
- Belly Drum
- Substitute
- ExtremeSpeed
- V-create
- Status