Pokémon Kangaskhan

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TM13IceBeam said:
Knock Off doesn't work on MegaKhan afaik, since you need to actually remove the item to trigger the increased power. So you're still stuck with just HJK for Mienshao.
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Thanks. I double-checked the in-game mechanics thread, and it seems like you're right.

Talonflame is probably the best answer to MK right now, though it's still not that difficult to wear down between SR and recoil. Roost exists, but with a CB you can't Roost up and BB Kangaskhan...
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Thats why I listed Sharp Beak Talonflame, for all of those Roost sets out there. 54% is the magic number.
 
Shroomisaur said:
252+ Atk Landorus-T Superpower vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Kangaskhan: 310-366 (88.3 - 104.2%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

+1 252+ Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Return vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Landorus-T: 436-514 (114.1 - 134.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Not even a check. It's kinda sad when something with max investment 145 base attack and super effective 120 BP move still can't reliably KO an uninvested Mega Kangaskahn. Not to mention, as you said, it must be Scarf to outspeed the Return (which is an easy KO at +1 even to max HP Lando-T), and Lando must be Adamant to even have a small chance to KO.
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I already said that you need SR to get a guaranteed OHKO on Mega Kangakshkhan. Also, Mega Kangaskhan will never get the chance to hit Landorus-T with a +2 Return as you will either be switching into it, preferably into PuP or a coverage move, or coming in after something dies to revenge kill it.
 
Shroomisaur said:
If you have something that can reliably chip off the last 10-20% of Megakahn's HP (like Mega Pinsir, for example) and understand the risk, then I certainly can't argue with that.

Essentially, Ditto vs Mega Kangaskahn boils down to chipping 20-24% off Megakahn's health before sending in Ditto. If you can do that, Ditto can reliably KO either unboosted Kanga with Return, or boosted Kanga with Sucker Punch. Keeping SR+Spikes up is your best bet, and punishes it for switching out. One good Rocky Helmet switch-in will also do the trick!
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I didn't realize that Imposter would copy boosts that Kanga had received. I thought it just copied the Pokémon's core statistics. Switching in on a boosted Kanga then definitely becomes more viable.

It also makes me want to try Power Herb Imposter Ditto against Xerneas. Switch in, copy the stat boosts, and let loose your own Geomancy to reach +4.
 
Since the discussion has completely moved on to Kanga vs the world:

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Spd / 8 HP / 148 Atk / 100 Def
Jolly / Naive Nature
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw / Outrage
- Stone Edge / Fire Blast
- Swords Dance / Stealth Rock

With these EVs:

1. Earthquake deals a minimum of 148 damage to (4/0) Mega-Kangaskhan, thereby guaranteeing the KO with Rocky Helmet and Rough Skin: 148 + 2 * ( 58 + 44 ) = 352.
2. Therefore, Garchomp wins 1v1 and lives to tell the tale.
3. Jolly PUP followed by +2 Sucker Punch 2HKOs Garchomp less than 1% of the time. Adamant kills both Pokemon.
4. Therefore, Garchomp can switch in and always secure the KO, unless Mega-Kangaskhan switches.
 
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you know what makes this worse, megakanga could run ice beam for the 2HKO on garchomp and not have to worry about rocky helmet damage at all as to your garchomp set

0- Mega Kangaskhan Ice Beam vs 8/0 Garchomp: 75.2-88.5%
which is a 2HKO when combined with Sucker Punch

...i may have opened a new can of worms
 
Chandelure @ Air Balloon
Trait : Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Sp. Att/220 HP/36 Speed
Modest Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Fire Blast
- Will-o-Wisp
- Memento

I've been running this Chandelure set just for run, but it actually turned out to be not that bad at all. More importantly - Khan cannot touch this Chandelure. I think even 2x Crunch isn't enough to OHKO this thing (if not, then Khan obviously gets crippled by WoW). I am not sure about that though, so if anyone is really curious - go ahead and check that! It works pretty well anyway.
 
bassactiv said:
Chandelure @ Air Balloon
Trait : Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Sp. Att/220 HP/36 Speed
Modest Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Fire Blast
- Will-o-Wisp
- Memento

I've been running this Chandelure set just for run, but it actually turned out to be not that bad at all. More importantly - Khan cannot touch this Chandelure. I think even 2x Crunch isn't enough to OHKO this thing (if not, then Khan obviously gets crippled by WoW). I am not sure about that though, so if anyone is really curious - go ahead and check that! It works pretty well anyway.
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Even the bulkiest Ghosts struggle to take a Mega Kangaskahn Crunch. Even if you get in on one of your immunities, Chandy doesn't stand much of a chance:

252+ Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Crunch vs. 220 HP / 0 Def Chandelure: 306-363 (96.8 - 114.8%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

It works well against Crunch-less versions though, provided Kangaskahn has already Mega-evolved (no more Scrappy). If it hasn't Mega'd yet, it can easily 2HKO you with Scrappy Return as well (50.6 - 60.1%).

Speaking of Chandelure, when I first saw your post I thought it would be as a teammate for Megakahn, because it works extremely well. Mega Kangaskahn attracts 2 things like crazy: Fast Fighting-type moves and Will-O-Wisps. Guess who loves to switch in on both of those? Chandelure of course!

Scarf Chandy in particular can easily put an end your Mega Lucario woes. It outspeeds, packs immunities to ExtremeSpeed & Vacuum Wave, resists Bullet Punch, and OHKOs with STAB Fire moves.
 
It works well against Crunch-less versions though, provided Kangaskahn has already Mega-evolved (no more Scrappy). If it hasn't Mega'd yet, it can easily 2HKO you with Scrappy Return as well (50.6 - 60.1%).
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The coverage move after Crunch is Earthquake (Aegislash, Terrakion, and other ground-weaks). If it doesn't have Crunch, it probably has EQ. In which case, Scrappy PuP will break the Air Balloon, and Mega-Earthquake will KO.

The whole "win vs a ghost with Scrappy PuP -> Return sweeps" is pretty annoying with this guy...
 
I ruined mega kangastan with double intimidate mega manectric + Landorus-T XD kinda works but that's pretty specific..

why don't people use knock off I don't get it.. it hits a bit stronger only in the first hit but it ruins the enemy (except if he is a mega) (if he survives somehow)
 
I didn't know Kangaskhan could learn Knock Off until I saw it on the sim. Kangaskhan isn't listed in any database for Knock Off that I know of.
 
  • The elemental punches, which ruin Kang's most common checks (Fire Punch for Ferrothorn and Skarmory, Ice Punch for Garchomp if you even bothered with it)
  • Drain Punch, which recovers health and puts out an absurd amount of damage;
  • Body Slam, which could be used over Return; although you lose power, it has a 51% paralysis chance with Parental Bond, which can let you beat faster threats.
  • Seismic Toss, which does 200 HP of fixed damage with Parental Bond. Return is better on offensive sets, but see below.
  • Wish is accessible from a Generation 3 event. Kangaskhan can feasibly run a defensive set that effectively 2HKOs most of OU and beats many common checks to offensive sets, including bulky Rocky Helmet wearers. Wish / Protect / Seismic Toss / Knockoff was mentioned before, and it's surprisingly deadly.
Pokébank would arguably make it even more absurdly overpowered; its movepool is boundless.
 
SJCrew said:
I didn't know Kangaskhan could learn Knock Off until I saw it on the sim. Kangaskhan isn't listed in any database for Knock Off that I know of.
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It's actually Gen IV Move Tutor move for Kanga, according to Serebii. Apparently GameFreak removed Kangaskahn's ability to learn it from the BW2 Tutors, but you can still transfer a Gen IV Kanga with Knock Off so it doesn't matter.

MagikaripIsOP said:
Does kanga get any postbank moves worth using?
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Well yes, the Seismic Toss / Knock Off / Wish set is made up entirely of post-Pokebank moves and it lets Mega Kangaskahn 2HKO the majority of the tier while also supporting itself and the team with 105 base HP Wishes. You know, as if PuP Kanga wasn't good enough.
 
Shroomisaur said:
It's actually Gen IV Move Tutor move for Kanga, according to Serebii. Apparently GameFreak removed Kangaskahn's ability to learn it from the BW2 Tutors, but you can still transfer a Gen IV Kanga with Knock Off so it doesn't matter.
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I have a feeling that this was a mistake. I just checked Veekun and Bulbapedia, and neither listed Knock Off as a valid tutor move for Kangaskhan. Can we get someone to physically test this in-game?
 
Agent Gibbs said:
I have a feeling that this was a mistake. I just checked Veekun and Bulbapedia, and neither listed Knock Off as a valid tutor move for Kangaskhan. Can we get someone to physically test this in-game?
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Testing it now on my old HG cart.

EDIT: Just found that Kangaskahn can NOT learn Knock Off via HGSS Move Tutor. Looks like that's a serebii error and illegal on Kanga.
 
Liarliarpantsonfire said:
http://www.serebii.net/attackdex-dp/knockoff.shtml

Kangaskhan is on the list for Tutor moves. It's also listed on the Smogon site.

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/kangaskhan/moves

I don't see the problem.
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The problem is that database info isn't 100% accurate. Knock Off wasn't nearly as important in past generations so someone may have made a mistake, and it simply went unnoticed all these years. Again, I just tested it myself via the HGSS Move Tutor, and while Kingler could learn it, Kangaskahn could NOT learn Knock Off. It only gets the elemental punches and sucker punch from said Tutor, if you're curious.
 
Seismic Toss is absolutely amazing, with stealth rocks and spikes you 2hko almost everything that isn't immune. So with 0 attack investment, you have amazing offensive pressure. Fake out can be used to make pokemon get into the 2hko or even 1hko range with seismic toss.The other moves are a bit of a problem, depends what you want to be walled by. Drain Punch is incredible useful, allows you to recover hp against slower enemy's and stops you from getting walled by Chansey/Blissey. Priority is big this gen, so you want to run sucker punch, but then you have nothing to hit ghosts with.

You can ditch speed investment, for more bulk and drop sucker punch for crunch, you also don't have to worry about getting burned or attack drops, seismic toss set actually likes the burn so it doesn't get something more debilitating like paralysis/sleep/toxic.
 
Wish / Protect / Seismic Toss / Yawn seems like a decent possibility for a support set and I'm sure it has been mentioned somewhere in here before. Knock Off is/will be illegal judging from the comments above, so instead of attacking possible ghost switch ins you can go for the sleep and then use wish. I generally play stall so I'll be giving this guy a try. What I like so much is when the opponent sees khan in the team preview they'll probably be doing everything they can to hold on to their ghost or physical wall and never switch it in, which would mean the playing field is opened up a bit for any other physical attackers on your side like Mienshao or Garchomp.
 
252+ Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Porygon2: 139-163 (37.1 - 43.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
(139, 139, 141, 144, 144, 145, 148, 150, 150, 153, 154, 157, 157, 159, 162, 163)
252+ Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Power-Up Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Porygon2: 75-90 (20 - 24%) -- guaranteed 5HKO
(75, 75, 78, 78, 78, 81, 81, 81, 81, 84, 84, 84, 87, 87, 87, 90)
+2 252+ Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Porygon2: 274-324 (73.2 - 86.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(274, 276, 280, 283, 288, 289, 294, 297, 298, 303, 306, 310, 312, 316, 319, 324)
Pretty badly imo, considering it gets maimed by +2 Return even when going full defensive (in which case you lack the offensive presence to really do anything other than toxic)
 
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