(Little) Things that annoy you in Pokémon

Or like how Azelf, Uxie, and Mesprit are said to be equal to either Dialga or Palkia (though that's actually one of the better examples: I actually think in a straight 1v3 battle there's a reasonable chance of either side emerging victorious). But they have no difficulty suppressing Dialga/Palkia's power in DP and it's said that they'd be able to do so in Platinum too if the other was not present. I think in a lot of these instances equal shades of Cutscene Power To The Max and Cutscene Incompetence apply.

I think being "equal" to Dialga/Palkia is meant to be how it's shown int the cutscene. Together they can stop the rampage from going out of control. Palkia could probably do something similar were it, too, not also rampaging out of control and also interested in actually stopping it (in fact that's kind of the gist in Legends Arceus, except the other one goes so out of control it goes a step above).
I always interpreted them "stopping" the Pokemon in question as being down to their quelling the actual rage emotion and breaking the Red Chain, rather than being powerful enough to actively undo or battle the mascot in question. The reason Giratina has to intervene in Platinum then came down to them only being able to stop one "in time," with Giratina showing up due to the continued distortion messing with its realm, at which point it steals Cyrus, Palkia/Dialga have no command anymore, and just go away after maybe the Lake Trio finishes up with both chains.

Legends Arceus presents the scenario working in the opposite direction, with the Red Chain being used to quell a rampaging Palkia/Dialga but the Lake Trio themselves not intervening when the other appears. It might be they can't match one of them at all, their influence literally just being to remove the Chain from the equation when it's the cause of the problem instead of the solution.
 
I always interpreted them "stopping" the Pokemon in question as being down to their quelling the actual rage emotion and breaking the Red Chain, rather than being powerful enough to actively undo or battle the mascot in question. The reason Giratina has to intervene in Platinum then came down to them only being able to stop one "in time," with Giratina showing up due to the continued distortion messing with its realm, at which point it steals Cyrus, Palkia/Dialga have no command anymore, and just go away after maybe the Lake Trio finishes up with both chains.

Legends Arceus presents the scenario working in the opposite direction, with the Red Chain being used to quell a rampaging Palkia/Dialga but the Lake Trio themselves not intervening when the other appears. It might be they can't match one of them at all, their influence literally just being to remove the Chain from the equation when it's the cause of the problem instead of the solution.

Mmm... that's not the impression I got from Cyrus's quotes in Platinum, which imply it is about the Pokemon's power levels:

"...I should have expected as much. Uxie, "The Being of Knowledge." Azelf, "The Being of Willpower." And Mesprit, "The Being of Emotion"... The Pokémon have come to protect Sinnoh? Pathetic and worthless. It takes the three of them, the three lake Pokémon that symbolize spirit, to balance either the Pokémon of time or space. But they can't maintain balance against the two. Not when both Dialga and Palkia are here. Their coming here is in vain. So much meaningless drama."

It might be the case that they quell Dialga/Palkia's emotion in DP but the Platinum quote suggests it's more about them literally holding back their power - the term "balance" would seem to infer that the three of them combined make a match for either Pokemon. Nothing in that sequence suggests that they didn't get there in time - in fact that'd be weird since you release them before you even go to Spear Pillar, they'd have plenty of time to get there.
 
Mmm... that's not the impression I got from Cyrus's quotes in Platinum, which imply it is about the Pokemon's power levels:

"...I should have expected as much. Uxie, "The Being of Knowledge." Azelf, "The Being of Willpower." And Mesprit, "The Being of Emotion"... The Pokémon have come to protect Sinnoh? Pathetic and worthless. It takes the three of them, the three lake Pokémon that symbolize spirit, to balance either the Pokémon of time or space. But they can't maintain balance against the two. Not when both Dialga and Palkia are here. Their coming here is in vain. So much meaningless drama."

It might be the case that they quell Dialga/Palkia's emotion in DP but the Platinum quote suggests it's more about them literally holding back their power - the term "balance" would seem to infer that the three of them combined make a match for either Pokemon. Nothing in that sequence suggests that they didn't get there in time - in fact that'd be weird since you release them before you even go to Spear Pillar, they'd have plenty of time to get there.
quelling the emotion, balancing the power, to me those are both the same read on the situation
 
obligatory Helix Chamber link incoming

Actually, several moves in Gen 1 were possibly designed around various singular Pokémon (including some cut ones) and then later doled out to other Pokémon; the Cardass set actually correlates with this theoretical listing, though whether this is by design or just coincidence only GF knows.

Well then. All the Cardass cards are drawn by Sugimori, who I could see having the idea of drawing the Pokemon doing an attack as a way to spice up, make them different from the previous set of Cardass cards they did, and of course promote the games by actually showing the Pokemon in action. So, if that's the case, it would make a lot of sense Sugimori ask the rest of the GF team what Moves he should showcase and them going "we actually have a list of Moves we based on each Pokemon" (or could also be possible Sugimori knew the list existed and got it himself).

1683712997830.png
1683712410476.png


The one on the right looks much more reasonable.

I like to think that, it's not that Groudon only has that small dinky rocky island to battle on, but rather that landmass only exists there BECAUSE Groudon is currently there. Groudon, being the physical manifestation of the land, defies physics and just has large (possibly floating) pieces of landmass form underneath it wherever it walks. The only reason the landmass isn't bigger is because Kyogre is there, but on the flip side the only reason Sootopolis isn't completely underwater is because Groudon's power is keeping the sea level from rising and filling the caldera its in.

Say Kyogre manages to knock Groudon into the water, a few seconds later a small mountain would probably shoot up from the water with Groudon on top of it none the weaker. And at times Groudon might be able to strange Kyogre on a land platform when it uses an attack (like Groudon uses Earthquake which forms two slabs of land to appear on either side of Kyogre and start crushing it). Kygore may have the homefield advantage, but Groudon is far from being out of its element.

But that just goes with the point that in instances like this lore overrides gameplay mechanics. Gameplay wise Kyogre may have a better chance of OHKOing Rayquaza with an Ice Beam, but lorewise the power Rayquaza is using is not only neutralizing their Abilities but also of their godly powers, thus are forced to retreat (ORAS story concerning their power conflict puts a better spin on things).

Articuno, Zapdos, and Moltres simply embody the common JRPG trope of "Fire, Ice, and Lightning" elemental trio as the original minor legendary trio (...)

Raikou, Entei, and Suicune were pretty similar as well, except Suicune is a Water-type capable of learning Ice moves as opposed to actually being an Ice-type.

I think the idea behind the Beast Trio was to base them on the story of how the Brass Tower was burned down. Raikou represented the quick and powerful lightning bolt that struck the tower, Entei represents the fire which physically destroyed it, and Suicune represents the rain which kept what was left of the tower from burning down.

Regi Trio likely resulted from the Weather Trio being based on Hebrew Mythical Beasts. Groudon and Kyogre are based on the Behemoth and Leviathan, while while both have expanded upon their original mythical purpose, their origin is Hebrew as masters of the land and sea, respectively. There was the master of the air, the Ziz, thus Rayquaza was made (though obviously each have a very different design from their mythical origins). Well, already got 3 Hebrew mythical creatures headlining, might as well base the lesser trio on another: the Golem of Prague. With them they thought what Types would a golem be easily made from (and didn't overline with the Weather Trio so no Ground), and so we got Rock, Ice, and Steel.

Lake Guardians were based on the Imperial Regalia of Japan plus aspects of the soul (maybe also the three attributes of god, considering Sinnoh's theme).

Swords of Justice are the Three Musketeers (and D'Artagnan) which they combined with common ungulate animal motifs of heraldry.

Forces of Nature are the three most well known Kami (well, two and than a third to balance them out).

And from there I feel any other Legendary groups origins are more evident.

Interesting point, but the way I see it, Kyogre's surrounded. What's beneath the ocean?
View attachment 515265
That's right , more earth!

Eh, I think their more focused on the surface rather than the mantle and core. The one which controls the surface controls what's underneath.

Mmm... that's not the impression I got from Cyrus's quotes in Platinum, which imply it is about the Pokemon's power levels:

"...I should have expected as much. Uxie, "The Being of Knowledge." Azelf, "The Being of Willpower." And Mesprit, "The Being of Emotion"... The Pokémon have come to protect Sinnoh? Pathetic and worthless. It takes the three of them, the three lake Pokémon that symbolize spirit, to balance either the Pokémon of time or space. But they can't maintain balance against the two. Not when both Dialga and Palkia are here. Their coming here is in vain. So much meaningless drama."

I don't really read that as meaning power levels which one can actually measure. Breaking it down, why Cyrus is just saying that the three Lake Guardians combined represent the force of Spirit. When up against either Time OR Space, Spirit is able to nullify it. It's not more "powerful" than either one, but rather the traits that make up Spirit (emotion, willpower, and knowledge) can be used to overcome the being of Time or Space if they're in a rage and/or misusing their power. However Time and Space combined is too much; it's "man vs the world" at that point and when it's man vs the world, you bet on the world (paraphrasing Franz Kafka).

At this point we're talking about nebulous concepts here which fall into the realm of how much you're willing to give up to suspension of disbelief.
 
quelling the emotion, balancing the power, to me those are both the same read on the situation

Idk, there's a difference between me calming you down by talking you out of your murderous rage and physically grabbing you by the arms and holding you back.

Could easily be a bit of both though. Dawn/Lucas says that Dialga/Palkia is "suffering from being dragged out by Team Galactic" which strongly suggests that it's not been provoked into rampaging of its own accord; Rowan confirms that it's "out of control after being forced to use its power [...] it's impossible to tell if it is enraged or saddened [but] it seems to be entrusting you with stopping it") which basically confirms they're being compelled against their will. Why would the lake trio need to calm them down if they're not doing any of it off their own back? My take was that the trio simply limited the damage it was doing, but couldn't "switch off" its power entirely. You have to do that by capturing it in a Pokeball.

I like to think that, it's not that Groudon only has that small dinky rocky island to battle on, but rather that landmass only exists there BECAUSE Groudon is currently there. Groudon, being the physical manifestation of the land, defies physics and just has large (possibly floating) pieces of landmass form underneath it wherever it walks. The only reason the landmass isn't bigger is because Kyogre is there, but on the flip side the only reason Sootopolis isn't completely underwater is because Groudon's power is keeping the sea level from rising and filling the caldera its in.

Say Kyogre manages to knock Groudon into the water, a few seconds later a small mountain would probably shoot up from the water with Groudon on top of it none the weaker. And at times Groudon might be able to strange Kyogre on a land platform when it uses an attack (like Groudon uses Earthquake which forms two slabs of land to appear on either side of Kyogre and start crushing it). Kygore may have the homefield advantage, but Groudon is far from being out of its element.

Well yeah, that bit of rock isn't there before or after Groudon is present. It either generates land by pulling the earth up beneath it or, as in ORAS, has a constant "bubble" of lava around it that calcifies and becomes land under its feet, analogous to how someone with wind powers might walk on air.

I just think it looks dumb that it's balancing on a tiny boulder while Kyogre is literally in the ocean but that's by the by.

But that just goes with the point that in instances like this lore overrides gameplay mechanics. Gameplay wise Kyogre may have a better chance of OHKOing Rayquaza with an Ice Beam, but lorewise the power Rayquaza is using is not only neutralizing their Abilities but also of their godly powers, thus are forced to retreat (ORAS story concerning their power conflict puts a better spin on things).

This, basically. The weather pause from Air Lock is symbolic: in-story, Rayquaza is literally preventing Groudon/Kyogre from using any of their power and forcing them to go away.

At this point we're talking about nebulous concepts here which fall into the realm of how much you're willing to give up to suspension of disbelief.

Shhh, don't spoil it!
 
Well then. All the Cardass cards are drawn by Sugimori, who I could see having the idea of drawing the Pokemon doing an attack as a way to spice up, make them different from the previous set of Cardass cards they did, and of course promote the games by actually showing the Pokemon in action. So, if that's the case, it would make a lot of sense Sugimori ask the rest of the GF team what Moves he should showcase and them going "we actually have a list of Moves we based on each Pokemon" (or could also be possible Sugimori knew the list existed and got it himself).
I’m fairly sure Sugimori is one of the first members of GF, so he’d likely have known of that list, and thus likely have drawn inspiration for the Cardass pics from that bit of development.

Articuno, Zapdos, and Moltres simply embody the common JRPG trope of "Fire, Ice, and Lightning" elemental trio as the original minor legendary trio, and they are nothing more than a trio of birds who are exceptionally powerful and each specialize in a different "magic" element within the fire, ice, and lightning trio, as they learn the three elemental super-beams (Blizzard, Thunder, and Fire Blast), the original trinity of 120 BP Special moves. Keep in mind here that Gen 1, aka RGBY, was originally designed as a self-contained monster collecting JRPG and that the original 151 Pokemon from a gameplay standpoint are designed as RPG monsters and thus are all deeply rooted in JRPG tropes.

Stat wise they share the same Special stat value (125) and a value of 100 in a different area. Articuno has 100 physical Defense, Zapdos has 100 Speed, and Moltres has 100 Attack. It's a similar vein to how the starter trio originally had their highest stat at 100 each in a different area (Venusaur had 100 Special, Charizard had 100 Speed, and Blastoise had 100 Defense).

Raikou, Entei, and Suicune were pretty similar as well, except Suicune is a Water-type capable of learning Ice moves as opposed to actually being an Ice-type. Their stat builds were simply poised in such a way that each had two "highest stats" in different areas at a value of 115. Raikou has its highest stats as Special Attack and Speed, making it a fast and specially oriented attacker, Entei has its highest stats as HP and Attack, making it more comparatively bulky but still an attacker, albeit physically oriented, and Suicune has its highest stats as Defense and Special Defense, making it defensive.

The three beasts altogether "specialized" in two stats as their main stats, and between the three of them they represented the six permanent stats of Pokemon (HP, Attack, Defense, Special Attack, Special Defense, and Speed).
GF was really keen on the Fire-Ice/Water-Electric triad for much of RG’s development. In fact, even beyond the Legendary Birds, Eeveelutions, and Jynx/Electabuzz/Magmar, there were actually gonna be two more triads; one was Pikachu, Vulpix (or rather, Mikon), and ID 86 and 87, which was likely a proto-Politoed, and then there was Goldeen (or rather, Gyopin), Ponyta (or rather, Puchikorn), and Kotora.

Concerning ID 86 and 87, if they are indeed a proto-Politoed line or some other variety of frog, I believe that they were meant to evolve from Poliwag; if it wasn’t so from the start than it was possibly implemented later. GF were experimenting with, and generally implementing, evolution during the time period they were created, plus there’s Dratini and Dragonair right after, evolving into the previously-created Dragonite. Therefore, there would possibly have been two evolutions to Poliwag; the more neotenic Poliwhirl and ID 86. Though, this might have been seen as too complex, so when it came time to cut Pokemon one set would be on the chopping block, and the rest is history.

However, this is just my theorizing, and we won’t know for certain until we get the RG source code.
 
Eh, I think their more focused on the surface rather than the mantle and core. The one which controls the surface controls what's underneath.
As someone in on the joke, this was a reference to something on r/Stunfisk (a Competitive Pokemon Subreddit with a lot of Smogon overlap).

Mmm... that's not the impression I got from Cyrus's quotes in Platinum, which imply it is about the Pokemon's power levels:

"...I should have expected as much. Uxie, "The Being of Knowledge." Azelf, "The Being of Willpower." And Mesprit, "The Being of Emotion"... The Pokémon have come to protect Sinnoh? Pathetic and worthless. It takes the three of them, the three lake Pokémon that symbolize spirit, to balance either the Pokémon of time or space. But they can't maintain balance against the two. Not when both Dialga and Palkia are here. Their coming here is in vain. So much meaningless drama."

It might be the case that they quell Dialga/Palkia's emotion in DP but the Platinum quote suggests it's more about them literally holding back their power - the term "balance" would seem to infer that the three of them combined make a match for either Pokemon. Nothing in that sequence suggests that they didn't get there in time - in fact that'd be weird since you release them before you even go to Spear Pillar, they'd have plenty of time to get there.
At the same time, what would Uxie/Azelf/Mesprit appearing much earlier have done? Cyrus in Platinum doesn't summon the Creation Dragons until literally the minute after your Tag Battle with Mars and Jupiter. Trying to interfere earlier would probably have gotten them beat down since we saw that Galactic is plenty capable of defeating and capturing them (not even just the Admins since Mars is pre-occupied with you and the Assistant at Verity compared to Saturn and Jupiter getting theirs before you arrive), and they show up anyway within seconds of Cyrus summoning the duo. And if it takes all 3 to pacify one Dragon, Cyrus could just as easily be referring to the fact they can't stop both in time.

The trio is not frequently depicted as above defeat by "mundane" opponents (Mystery Dungeon for example depicts them as being relatively handy to defeat for Grovyle or the player's party, compared to Dialga being someone that same Grovyle would be lucky to survive, much less beat, per Dusknoir's dialogue), at least in Gen 4's own era, perhaps in part because they represent spiritual aspects that have to manifest through other beings rather than the Creation Trio controlling Physical concepts that govern those beings instead. The balance line also makes me think of another idea: say they free Palkia from Cyrus's control. Dialga, a Pokemon it fights with universal catastrophe results in every depiction of the era, is right there. I don't think those two annihilating the existence around them in an ensuing fight (perhaps with one still under Cyrus's command) is "balance" either.
 
So, I had always known that pvp battles would reset various aspects, like PP and Items. Makes sense
But to this day, I had always thought that Sketch was an exception. That it would be the primary method of trying to get moves on it, rather than just hoping the CPU does it or trying to jump through hoops in a double battle.

BUT NO: Smeargle's move will be reset to Sketch after the battle is over. So if you want a move on this stupid thing you have to go through significantly more roundabout methods


I'm not 100% certain, but I think in some games you have to abuse Ditto's transformation mechanic if you want some of the more specific moves





Yes this post is about Ice Burn & Freeze Shock
 
Yeah, it took a bit of thinking to get those moves registered into my Pokemon Home movedex. Which reminds me that I need to get ready for the SV update so I can easily register all of the new Abilities and Moves, and not just the new species and forms of Pokemon
Ultimately I had to trade a Reshiram & Smeargle over to Alpha Sapphire and go to secret bases until i found someone with a double or triple battle, then find grunt trainers weak enough that smeargle could get a sketch off without having to grind it up.

Which was still annoying since i then had to backtrack to fallarbor, use a heart scale for sketch again, swap the kyurem forms, fly BACK to the secret base, then do another battle.


I could have used Restaurant Le Nah in XY, but I couldn't find my Kyurem (I found it after the fact, of course...) and I forgot that there was an extremely weak restaurant I could have used. Though that was also a chain battle iirc so I'd rather not deal with that twice.

If you're in Gen 7 I...don't think you have a consistent double battle option? I think you have to run into a Ditto with Pokemon A (preferably one rigged so the Ditto will 100% use the move), then swap in Smeargle and also the Smeargle will probably need some item (Focus Sash, a status cure, etc) or be high enough level that it gets the Sketch off.
 
Idk, there's a difference between me calming you down by talking you out of your murderous rage and physically grabbing you by the arms and holding you back.

Could easily be a bit of both though. Dawn/Lucas says that Dialga/Palkia is "suffering from being dragged out by Team Galactic" which strongly suggests that it's not been provoked into rampaging of its own accord; Rowan confirms that it's "out of control after being forced to use its power [...] it's impossible to tell if it is enraged or saddened [but] it seems to be entrusting you with stopping it") which basically confirms they're being compelled against their will. Why would the lake trio need to calm them down if they're not doing any of it off their own back? My take was that the trio simply limited the damage it was doing, but couldn't "switch off" its power entirely. You have to do that by capturing it in a Pokeball.

Right. If I had to guess the Lake Guardians were doing their best trying to manipulate Dialga/Palkia with their powers but they could only do so much. I doubt they could "remove" anything like they do in their legend if a human disturbed them, the Spacetime Dragons are too powerful for that so I'd imagine:
  • Mesprit using its emotion power to give it joy and calmness to counteract its anger & sadness.
  • Uxie using its knowledge power to bring out its conscious reasoning to counteract it primal instincts.
  • Azelf using its willpower power to focus its control so that it can break free from Team Galactic and undo the reality warping.
But, as you said, this is was only a temporary fix to give the player character enough time to defeat Team Galactic and then defeat/capture it to restore itself completely.

Probably also why in Legends: Arceus they didn't appear to stop the Dialga/Palkia causing the problem there; they were in full control of themselves so nothing to "break them free of" not to mention empowering themselves with the rift energy to turn to their Origin Form.

I’m fairly sure Sugimori is one of the first members of GF, so he’d likely have known of that list, and thus likely have drawn inspiration for the Cardass pics from that bit of development.

He was, but his role was the chief artist. He may have been part of the conversation when they were making those list of inspired Moves, or it was something done between the programmers trying to figure out how move sets are going to work out. We may never know, but point is he did at some point have access to that list and based the Cardass cards on them.

Also not that any of this matters for the conversation at hand. :mehowth:
 
If you're in Gen 7 I...don't think you have a consistent double battle option? I think you have to run into a Ditto with Pokemon A (preferably one rigged so the Ditto will 100% use the move), then swap in Smeargle and also the Smeargle will probably need some item (Focus Sash, a status cure, etc) or be high enough level that it gets the Sketch off.
SOS Battles?
 
Glaciate doesn't have a chance to freeze you third-rate Dick Dastardly villain (such a downgrade from the cool character in BW1, I might add)

Doesn't freeze a Pokemon who has elemental power keeping them from becoming stiff, but I don't think a human as the same kind of defense. Also he's pretty much saying he's gonna freeze you to death, so in that regard you'll also be "frozen".
 
View attachment 515757

View attachment 515758

Glaciate doesn't have a chance to freeze you third-rate Dick Dastardly villain (such a downgrade from the cool character in BW1, I might add)

also Absofusion isn't a move, for that matter

I remember this being discussed when B2W2 first came out; in the original doesn't he actually threaten to kill you? Hence the ice spikes that almost impale you. That would explain why it's "I'll freeze you" in English
 
I remember this being discussed when B2W2 first came out; in the original doesn't he actually threaten to kill you? Hence the ice spikes that almost impale you. That would explain why it's "I'll freeze you" in English

No, he threatens the freeze the player in the Japanese version too. It was just the wording was vague, and combined with the animation of Glaciate manifesting as icy spikes pointed toward the player, some interpreted as Ghetsis was ready to impale the player. However what Ghetsis actually says is that he'll have the player "frozen here". The English version just made the wording more obvious. And if GF intended it to have the double meaning, well I guess you can say the English version downplayed the direct death threat though, as I just did, not hard to re-piece it so that it's a slight death threat.
 
What's even more hilarious is that Stadium applies the 1/65,536 roll to Swift. The move actually functioned as intended in the Game Boy games and bypassed the accuracy check, and it's one of the few things Stadium broke. (In case you were wondering, Swift still ignores accuracy and evasion modifiers in Stadium.)

Also from that same video: while I kind of appreciate how the devs handled rental balance to make you consider some NFEs, the moveset they gave Dragonite is a travesty.
 
Last edited:
Always made 100% sense to me. Massive niche, probably rare because it can’t compete that well in the ecosystem. Should be very rare.
Despite the intention of a “pre-promotion”, I can see why the niche of most of the gimmick Pokémon just can’t compete in the ecosystem because of how poorly they adapt to the competition, resulting in dwindling number. To give some examples…

:farfetchd: Kantonian Farfetch’d, as a “joke” Pokémon, have been hunted because of their juicy meat, as well as their luxually delicious leek they carry with them. The species were generally too weak to fight back against predators, thus their number dwindle over time.

:ditto: One argue that Ditto can compete well in the ecosystem, but the confusion they can cause will end up backfiring on Ditto. Transform and Imposter can be a double-edged sword for Ditto in the fauna.

:delibird: Similar issues with Farfetch’d, except replace Leek with Present.

:smeargle: It can go on and paint scary thing that could at the very least stuns potential predators, but without any real strength to fight back, once ambushed or surrounded, the Smeargle is good as dead.

:castform: The Porygon line, while manmade, can escape to cyberspace from mugglers to predators alike. Castform doesn’t have that perk obviously, and their stats aren’t even good enough to make the most of it’s Ability, which means that any predator that relies on brute force will quickly take down Castform.

:volbeat: + :illumise: The two firefly Pokémon runs into a problem of “master of none“ syndrome, and Illumise tend to be too independant despite their lack of specialty other than their aroma, while Volbeat tend to be too distracted by Illumise’s aroma. As a result, are easy pray for quick, swift predators, among them being bird Pokémon like Talonflame and frog Pokémon like Greninja.

:luvdisc: Not exactly “stupidly rare”, but their blind obsession of love and mating, they leave themselves wide-open to predators like Sharpedo.

:cherubi: + :cherrim: I included them as “stupidly rare but also weak” Pokémon considering the good-in-theory, awful-in-practice luck-based Honey Tree that encourages save scumming more than most other situations. Due to their lack of capacity of battling, and Cherrim’s gimmick, Flower Gift, leave it even more open to physically-inclined predators and especially Fire-type predators.

:eiscue: Their big icy head scares off potential symbiotic allies, and specially-inclined predators can easily bypass it’s Ice Face. Eiscue can only hope to run away, but if cornered, they are toast.

:stonjourner: Trying too hard to mimic the famous Stonhenge only leaves Stonjourner with effectively no Ability if lonesome, and still crippingly weak against Special Attacking moves. Pokémon that would eat the minerals found within Stonjourner will just use a multi-targeting Special move, especially Surf, to kill them swiftly.

Those are just several examples, too.
 
Back
Top