Then why doesn't he use Tera Steel instead to counter both Ice and Fairy? Is he stupid?
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(Little) Things that annoy you in Pokémon
- Thread starter BriarRose
- Start date
...but far more effort
You were literally complaining about it not being fun, the Mt. Battle method is both faster and actually has you doing something rather than just waiting hours.
Doing something doesn't strictly mean it is more fun. Waiting for something to passively happen over say 3 hours while engaging yourself with something else is a valid consideration vs spending 1 hour focusing on something that will go faster/more efficiently but requires conscious input.
Saying Mt. Battle fixes his grievance arising from the "wrong" method entails Mt. Battle being engaging enough to entertain while doing the grinding, something pretty hard to do when grinding by nature is busywork that doesn't tend to hold attention in most video games. The complaint is that their most preferred method of mass purification is unfun. The most likely response to constantly button mashing through several areas of Level 20-35 Pokemon (i.e. most weaker than the level you first arrive at) for the first legs of Mt. Battle would be "this is not any more fun or engaging so this option does not address my criticism"
Mt. Battle really is a snoozefest. I almost get the idea behind it, but the levels just don't work for it to be a proper challenge.
I can understand them holding back a bit on Area 1 to allow your Shadow Mons to get some moves, that's fine. These fools are running around with Lv. 15-20 mons. Unless you want to purify Remoraid for some godforsaken reason, that's... not good. They're severely underleveled.
There's literally no reason for this and it has severe drawbacks. Mt. Battle is a textbook example of poor design.
^ this
Gen 2 has no moves that have drawbacks to the user outside of recoil and recharge turns. And that's terrible.
I really wish there was at least something like Superpower and Overheat. It would make my life so much easier...
I really wish there was at least something like Superpower and Overheat. It would make my life so much easier...
Outrage?
You're not wrong, but that's too much. There's a reason only Outrage really took off out of these moves.
If you put Belly Drum & Curse (Ghost) in the "recoil" bin, there's always Curse (everyone else)! -Speed, baby!!
I mean, I see where you're coming from but if you look at the moves introduced in Gen II I guess that wasn't really the general "vibe" of them.
Most of the moves with secondary effects introduced in Gen II were more geared around being "strategic" moves - by which I mean those with slightly more complex mechanics than the majority of those from Gen I. Perish Song, Pain Split, Psych Up, Beat Up, Belly Drum, Foresight, Thief, Reversal, Mean Look, Lock-On. And, of course, weather.
Going off that, partial example of "drawbacks to the user" but the woman who gives you Sandstorm in Gen II tells you ominously that "it damages both Pokemon, so it's for advanced trainers only".
Of course Rock, Ground, and Steel-types aren't damaged by sandstorm, but she doesn't TELL you that and it took me quite a while to realise that was even a thing at all. The way she frames it implies that you're expected to give the move to any old Pokemon and just have at it.
Huh. I looked up the list of moves introduced in Gen II and it is STARK. The first entry is Sketch and it just gets weirder from there. There's a handful of Mach Punch, Twister, Flame Wheel, etc moves that are just filling holes in the Gen 1 list, but the vast majority of them do SOMETHING odd.
I always kind of thought they were deliberately trying to up the ante with how many of Gen II's moves are more complex in nature. Kind of like someone thought "okay, we made all the basic moves in Gen I, now let's see what we can really do".
By contrast when you look at how many new moves in Gen IV are the "70-100 base power with a very small chance of a secondary effect" sort, it feels to me like they were making an effort to "patch up" a lot of the types that didn't have many high-powered offensive moves (or needed a physical/special option). Dark Pulse, Iron Head, X-Scissor, Flash Cannon, Dragon Rush, Cross Poison, Earth Power, Force Palm, Aqua Tail, Bug Buzz, Power Gem, Poison Jab, Stone Edge, Zen Headbutt. That, and the wide amount of Quick Attack variations for other types: Aqua Jet, Bullet Punch, Ice Shard, Vacuum Wave, Shadow Sneak, Sucker Punch (that one's only partial).
You'd be surprised at later gens...
Check by type too, especially Electric post-Gen 5 and Psychic post-Gen 3.
That was absolutely a big part of move design in Gen 4. It's telling that a lot of types that had to rely on Hidden Power for STAB got fixed in that generation. They also had to take a proper look at it because of the modern Physical Special Split.
Just Sinnoh casually saving the franchise as usual.
And then we went full circle by having post gen 4 primarily focus on trying new types of gimmicky or "weird" moves.
I tend to pick on Gen 6 for that the most but honestly even Gen 5 had a bunch of it. Moves that combo off other moves, stuff like Ally Switch, moves that always crit, Hex, Incinerate, Foul Play, etc etc.
I tend to pick on Gen 6 for that the most but honestly even Gen 5 had a bunch of it. Moves that combo off other moves, stuff like Ally Switch, moves that always crit, Hex, Incinerate, Foul Play, etc etc.
During my first playthrough of Colosseum, I LITERALLY fell asleep during Mt. Battle.
I managed to keep battling and training my Pokemon during my nap, but it's amazing that it could actually put me to sleep.
Yeah Gen 5 was 100% when they started leaning super hard into more gimmicky moves, and particularly ones that are all but useless in casual gameplay, like Wonder Room, Magic Room, Quash, Bestow, After You...
I love a gimmick move, but they don't fit neatly into the single-player experience. NPCs never use them (at least not effectively) and they don't offer anything to the average player, so they end up just being added bloat in level-up movepools (and goodness knows we already have enough of that).
Gen V's moves are interesting because there's a whole range of different moves introduced in that gen but there's lots of little runs of patterns; you can't really categorise them as one big set in the way you largely can with Gen II or IV, but you can see they were going for a lot of concepts. Some which spring out at me are:
Then by the time we hit Gen VI and VII it's basically "lots of signature moves and very little else". Like, aside from Fairy moves, event moves, and a small handful of new techniques like Ion Deluge and the terrain moves, Gen VI is just signature moves and a couple of different-typed variations to older moves (Infestation, Power-Up Punch, Sticky Web, Phantom Force). Discounting LGPE moves and the generic Z-Moves, Gen VII's list is basically 90% signature moves and the next two gens pretty much follow suit (barring Gen VIII's addition of the 18 tutor moves).
- stat boosting/nerfing moves for combinations of stats which mostly had not been done before (Hone Claws, Work Up) or for types which didn't have a move of that kind associated with them (Flame Charge, Struggle Bug, Low Sweep, Bulldoze, Snarl)
- stat boost moves which upped the ante (prior to Gen V no boosting move bar Belly Drum raised a single stat by more than 2 stages, or more than 2 stats by one stage at a time, but Gen V introduced a bunch of moves like Cotton Guard, Quiver Dance, Shell Smash, and Coil)
- moves basically designed for triple battles (Quash, Rage Powder, Telekinesis, Ally Switch, Round, Echoed Voice, Flame Burst, Incinerate, Wide Guard, Quick Guard, Heal Pulse)
- status moves which feel like tangents of mechanics Gen IV introduced (Wonder Room, Magic Room, Power Split, Guard Split)
- Different-typed equivalents to moves introduced in earlier games (Volt Switch, Dual Chop, Steamroller)
- offensive phazing moves (Dragon Tail, Circle Throw)
- guaranteed critical-hit moves (Frost Breath, Storm Throw)
Then by the time we hit Gen VI and VII it's basically "lots of signature moves and very little else". Like, aside from Fairy moves, event moves, and a small handful of new techniques like Ion Deluge and the terrain moves, Gen VI is just signature moves and a couple of different-typed variations to older moves (Infestation, Power-Up Punch, Sticky Web, Phantom Force). Discounting LGPE moves and the generic Z-Moves, Gen VII's list is basically 90% signature moves and the next two gens pretty much follow suit (barring Gen VIII's addition of the 18 tutor moves).
To be fair, once there's a good foundation to build upon, there's nowhere else to go but gimmicks and minor twists on the existing moves.
I do wish they focused more on type identities through moves, but it's not like we gotta deal with Hidden Power or bust anymore.
There's also ridiculous stuff like it taking 9 gens and two DLCs for a relatively drawback-free, well-distributed, Physical Electric move with more than 80BP.
I always thought inverse battles were a criminally underutilized gimmick and they should make an "inverse room" move that uses the inverse type chart for 5 turns (or maybe just 2, not sure how much of a nightmare it would be :P).
After gen 6 there were two battle spot seasons (1 single, 1 doubles) that used it and it hasn't been seen since.
Maybe we'll see the gimmick come back in some form in Legends ZA.
After gen 6 there were two battle spot seasons (1 single, 1 doubles) that used it and it hasn't been seen since.
Maybe we'll see the gimmick come back in some form in Legends ZA.
Fun Fact: Base gen 8 only introduced 5 moves that weren't signature moves at the time: Body Press, Breaking Swipe, Life Dew, Steel Beam, and Branch Poke.
A few others have since lost this status (Jaw Lock, Stuff Cheeks, amd Spirit Break), but yeah, outside of the Isle of Armor Tutor moves Gen 8 was almost entirely signatures.
A few others have since lost this status (Jaw Lock, Stuff Cheeks, amd Spirit Break), but yeah, outside of the Isle of Armor Tutor moves Gen 8 was almost entirely signatures.
With everything getting signature moves nowadays, you'd think that when introducing a Pokemon who can shoot oil to attack, they'd make an attack wherein the Pokemon shoots oil. It'd be one of the few instances where giving a Pokemon a signature move would actually be totally reasonable in my eyes, since no move that exists could be used to describe shooting oil.
Nope, it's just a thing the Pokemon can do. A Charizard shooting fire is using Flamethrower, a Blastoise shooting water is using Hydro Pump, but an Arboliva shooting oil is just doing a thing it can do. What even is a move.
Badge name have slowly gotten uncreative since Kalos (they were at least done 5/8ths right in that region) and came to a breaking point in Galar (more reasons to rag on Sword/Shield, hooray!). I know the badges of Galar are very different in appearance compared to other regions, but couldn't they at least have used a thesaurus or something? (i.e.: The Dark Badge should have been called the Demon Badge.)