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Pokémon Medicham

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ArashiTheRainDancer said:
If you think about it, Ninjask can make time. He can protect and sub(respectively, in that pattern) until the end of time, otherwise known as when he reaches 25% HP from subs. If the opponent misses(if the Jask is holding Bright Powder for example. Yes, it's luck, but guess what? Luck can decide win or lose for the most part) then he can set up Hone Claws behind a substitute. The one problem with this method is priority, but you could just jump the gun if you are behind your subpass all that speed, and forget the attack and accuracy, onto fearsome super-gypsy Mega Medicham. If you are lucky, you can even pass the substitute so medicham gets in without taking direct damage. Jask can at least pass speed. This would be much more practical and OU worthy if Scolipede could learn Hone Claws and not invoke such risk using Ninjask.
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It isnt worth it, ninjask is predictable and not viable in ou. Both ninjask and regular medicham would be rejected if you try to get them an ou analysis. Scolipede completely outclasses ninjask it is bulkier, stronger, more utility moves, wont get recked by mamo's ice shard. Dont bother using hone claws, they both get swords dance anyway, +1 medicham isnt scary either, especcially with common flying priority or even aegislash. With my experience with opposing ninjasks, they try to settup and pass as i settup and sweep them with a mega gyarados.

Please dont talk about brightpowder, it is unreliable and overall you'd have to be a complete asshole to use it.
 
Giagantic said:
Again, I'd like to reiterate my point that I think it honestly depends on what your team needs and if said team lacks priority but has plenty of coverage then Bullet Punch is a fine option. Bullet Punch gives Mega-Medicham the ability to pick off faster threats that are weakened which is invaluable and though it does take away a bit of his wallbreaking potential, it is not as if you lose that much in the whole scheme of things. I have personally been in many situations where I predicted a switch and chunked an incoming target yet was unable to finish said target off due to my speed being limited at base 100 which is above average yet many threats still outspeed. I think this argument really comes down to personal preference rather then one option being superior to the other as both have their own niche on any given Medicham set.
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Bullet Punch is too situation based, and honestly the slot for it could be used for much more essential attacks on Mega Medicham; not to mention it's not Mega Medicham's job to pick off weaker offensive threats. Mega Medicham is a wallbreaker, and should be used as such, given that it can 2HKO any pokemon in the tier unboosted after Stealth Rock damage.
 
anty208 said:
It isnt worth it, ninjask is predictable and not viable in ou. Both ninjask and regular medicham would be rejected if you try to get them an ou analysis. Scolipede completely outclasses ninjask it is bulkier, stronger, more utility moves, wont get recked by mamo's ice shard. Dont bother using hone claws, they both get swords dance anyway, +1 medicham isnt scary either, especcially with common flying priority or even aegislash. With my experience with opposing ninjasks, they try to settup and pass as i settup and sweep them with a mega gyarados.

Please dont talk about brightpowder, it is unreliable and overall you'd have to be a complete asshole to use it.
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That's your opinion. I think I will stick with mine.
 
First post here, geetings. I have read all thread up and honestly, after tests and tests, I loved megachamp as an "anti-lead" pokemon, contrary to almost all previous comments, I think Fake out is quite useful for sash-breaking, then a powerful HJK, psycho cut/zen headbutt is not welcome by almost any poke.

but for the obvious incoming aegislash once megachamp is seen, Fire punch is quite handy since the li'l sword doesn't have recovery and wont like that 60% damage from the punch.

also, with good team support, Fake Out (with stealth rock on the field) can help to accumulate certain damage to OHKO various threats in the lategame after the flinch, notably most of the overused Rotom-W, or mega venusaur, mega blastoise etc, and even helps damaging the all-mighty BIRD, or finishing off faster damaged threats more efficiently than the crappy bullet punch, honestly I love faking out talonflame then luring a brave bird into a rough skin/rocky helmet teammate.

Anyway, my opinion is running High jump kick, Psycho cut/zen headbutt, fake out and fire punch, it works cool

I know it looks gimmicky, but it works.
 
Rockzor said:
First post here, geetings. I have read all thread up and honestly, after tests and tests, I loved megachamp as an "anti-lead" pokemon, contrary to almost all previous comments, I think Fake out is quite useful for sash-breaking, then a powerful HJK, psycho cut/zen headbutt is not welcome by almost any poke.

but for the obvious incoming aegislash once megachamp is seen, Fire punch is quite handy since the li'l sword doesn't have recovery and wont like that 60% damage from the punch.

also, with good team support, Fake Out (with stealth rock on the field) can help to accumulate certain damage to OHKO various threats in the lategame after the flinch, notably most of the overused Rotom-W, or mega venusaur, mega blastoise etc, and even helps damaging the all-mighty BIRD, or finishing off faster damaged threats more efficiently than the crappy bullet punch, honestly I love faking out talonflame then luring a brave bird into a rough skin/rocky helmet teammate.

Anyway, my opinion is running High jump kick, Psycho cut/zen headbutt, fake out and fire punch, it works cool

I know it looks gimmicky, but it works.
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Agreed, i like using mega medicham as an anti lead too. Fake out helps medicham mega evolve too since medicham is not that fast in its base form. It can also revenge kill pokemon at low health, and is much more useful than bullet punch(even against fairies, doesnt stab psycho cut still do more?). Also, fake out really is helpful in judging how your opponent will play and whether hes competent(at lower ratings at least). If he has a ghost and yet does not switch when you fake out, its probably safe to go for high jump kick cause i doubt he would stay in on a high jump kick when he has a ghost, even if his lead has study or a sash.
From middle to late game, fake out should only be used to either revenge kill weaker pokemon, or to deal some dmg for you to estimate if high jump kick or psycho cut will OHKO the pokemon.(its also extra damage if you know your opponent will not switch). If you can tell that your opponent is competent from how he played, its better to just attack directly since megamedicham will force switches and fake out will be just useless except for revengekilling.

I think ice punch is much more useful than firepunch though, cause its helpful against stuff like gliscor and landorus(still OHKOs 252hp landorus after intimidate). Mega medicham is really powerful, and with highjumpkick it can 2HKO popular physical walls like rotom-w(lol max hp max def rotom-w can get KOed by the combination of fakeout+highjumpkick), mandibuzz, skarmory. Against stuff like aegislash, slowbro, sableye, and other bulky ghosts/psychics/fairies and anything it would not OHKO but would get OHKOed back, I think its better to just switch out instead and let your other pokemon take care of them(pursuit users?). Its also better to take out all the ghosts before spamming high jump kick unless the other guy is that bad.
Overall I think mega medicham is pretty underrated and its my favourite mega.
 
I don't even think Fake Out is worth it, it does even less damage on neutral hits than Bullet Punch and can only be used on the first turn, outside of getting to bypass your shitty pre mega speed tier for a turn it doesn't have all that much use.

HJK, Zen Headbutt, Ice Punch, Fire Punch/Baton Pass should be the only Medicham set imo.
 
I can agree with that. Fake out is otherwise essentially useless after the first turn. Though I would say thunderpunch is better than fire punch, as outside of nailing aegislash, the move is useless. Thunderpunch can nail talon on the switch as well as slowbro who otherwise completely walls mega medicham. it also hurts azumarill badly, and gyrados hates it.
 
I agree that its much less useful after that first turn where you mega evolve. But fire punch doesnt hit much that HJK cannnot which is mainly aegislash which should be dealt with by your other pokemon anyway. Whille thunderpunch OHKOs talonflame and hits azumarill for 80%, both talonflame and azumarill are 2HKOed anyway. T-punch barely 2HKOs slowbro though(46.7 - 55.3%), and these pokemon can be dealt with by the other 5 pokemon anyway.

While typing this i realised that maybe fake out is not that useful after all since t-punch and firepunch can remove these few pokemon stopping medicham especially fire punch for the super common aegislash which makes me scared to HJK.
Still, fake out allows medicham to break sashes, mega evolve, be annoying, pick off weaker pokemon and stuff, and save me if i somehow allow sweeper to set up.
 
If you keep rocks up (which you should be able to on a team with Mega Medicham imo) Talonflame can't check you at all it can obviously revenge kill you but even Bullet Punch won't help there, Thunder Punch is a viable option yes but Aegislash is just that much of a threat that I'd rather have Fire Punch or Baton Pass to hurt/trap Aegislash, Slowbro is quite rare and Gyarados is still hit pretty hard by your stabs unless it's the RestTalker which isn't that dangerous, Azumarill can't come in on any of Medicham's moves when rocks are up as it is outsped and any combination of HJK/Zen Headbutt + another hit will 2HKO it after rocks unless it carries a Sitrus Berry.

If you have a good way to deal with Aegislash then feel free to not run Fire Punch but tbh the main reason to use Mega Medicham is to spam HJK which you can't (safely) do until you take out Aegislash.
 
Youngster Joey44 said:
I'd suggest that Recover would be a great part of a Medicham HJK set because if it misses, just recover away the damage.
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When you have uninvested 60/85/85 bulk, pretty much every attack will do over 50%. Thus, Recover is usually a wasted moveslot, especially since medicham needs all the coverage it can get, and it already has a hard time choosing which Punch not to use.
 
I'd Like you guys to see my current medichamp set (i use this in my pokemon y cartridge and on showdown)


Evs: 252 Attack, 252 Speed, 4 HP
Nature: Jolly
Item: Medichamite
Movesets:
Bullet Punch
Ice Punch
Drain Punch,
Psycho Cut

I'm using drain punch, because it seems to be more useful than HJK. Protect, ghosts, and missing screws you over entirely. For instance, I was battling a guy who had his heatran right infront my medichamp. I went for Drain Punch, cuz its my only fighting move, otherwise HJK. He used protect first. Switches into to his gengar next.

drain punch is pretty good, as you get lots of hp from ohking chanseys and blisseys and ttars and anything that doesn't resist, (more like weak to it)
Bullet Punch is pretty good on this thing, as you know it got a new weakness, Fairy. Bullet Punch, damages frail fairys like gardevoir, when they are usually under 50% health.

this thing to proven to be a sweeper and wall breaker in my eyes. I used a team, and got 1780 as my highest ranking in showdown, until i got like bad loosing streak, which brought me down 1500.
But, I made a new account, "Dragofish" using the same team, I'm peaking 1600. This thing is beast.
 

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The problem I have with Drain Punch is that, well, you are no longer wall breaking as efficiently as with HJK. The difference between them is huge : HJK does nearly twice more damages than Drain Punch ! Without HJK, the sturdier physical walls, like Hippodown or Skarmory. For example, HJK just OHKOes Garchomp ! Yes, sure, Ice Punch does the same, but it's predictable. However, you can't really predict HJK because... Well, if it doesn't resist AND it's physically bulky, you are gonna be flat-out destroyed.
I do agree that the 90% accuracy can be painful, and the 50% too, but if I use a Medicham with Drain Punch, I think I'd rather use M-Mawile. It's bulkier and hits as hard as Medicham, better typing and easier to place. M-Medicham has one thing for it : a devastating Hi Jump Kick with no set-up AND the possibility to change move.

I wonder one thing though. In what cases Bullet Punch is better than more coverage ? I use Bullet Punch because I usually need the priority while I have something else against Aegis / Gyara, and even if Bullet Punch is weak, it's generally enough to finish off some targets. Latios is KOed by HJK + Bullet Punch and well, even it's reaaaally not common, Gyarados takes ~50% on HJK / Psycho Cut, so he is not going to set up... This leaves Aegis. I agree Fire Punch may be superior, but I think Bullet Punch has a niche.
 
Youngster Joey44 said:
Why not use both HJK and Drain Punch?
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Because Medicham needs all the coverage he can get. With only one Fighting move, you already have to choose 3 of: Zen Headbutt, Psyco Cut, Thunder Punch, Ice Punch, Fire Punch, Bullet Punch and (remotely) Fake Out. In Gen6 Medicham can no longer avoid mindlessly a Psychic move because of things like megaVenusaur and god, those stabs hit hard. Then you have to pick 2 out of 3 elemental punches, or a priority move. Clearly double stab is not the way to go with MegaCham, imho.
 
Drain Punch is a great move for bulky pivots/sweepers that can make use of the recovery to take repeated hits, Conkeldurr is the perfect example of a good Drain Punch user, especially when it carries a vest (which all Conks should do this gen tbh) as it has massive 105/95/65 defensive stats further amplified by AV, Mega Medicham has a very poor 60/85/85 bulk meaning it has trouble taking even strong resisted hits let alone neutral or SE ones, making Drain Punch rather useless, not to mention wallbreaking and coverage is absolutely vital for Cham so HJK + 3 coverage moves (or a psychic STAB and 2 coverage moves) is must.
 
Medichamp is frail, but I prefer drain punch, as I can recover damage from stealth rock and spikes and other attacks that dont really effect me that much.
Mega-Medichamp OH-KOs conkeldurr with psycocut

and for fake out, its only for one turn. Bullet Punch is obviosly better, just mega-evolve on a chansey or something, not on a pokemon thats faster than you when your not in your mega form. Bullet Punch hits fairys, a new weakness to medichamp. Easily revenge killing things that doesnt resist it.
 
DragoFish said:
Medichamp is frail, but I prefer drain punch, as I can recover damage from stealth rock and spikes and other attacks that dont really effect me that much.
Mega-Medichamp OH-KOs conkeldurr with psycocut
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OHKOing Conkeldurr isn't important, I didn't bring up Conkeldurr as something that should be 1v1ing Medicham, simply as an example of something that makes good use of Drain Punch thanks to it's great bulk.

and for fake out, its only for one turn. Bullet Punch is obviosly better, just mega-evolve on a chansey or something, not on a pokemon thats faster than you when your not in your mega form. Bullet Punch hits fairys, a new weakness to medichamp. Easily revenge killing things that doesnt resist it.[/quote]

There's not a single fairy (in OU) that's faster than Mega Medicham and a resisted HJK does more damage than a super effective Bullet Punch, out of the things that do outspeed Medicham the only things that take significant damage from Bullet Punch are Deoxys-S, Terrakion and Ice Type Greninja, honestly a weak nonstab priority isnt really important for a fairly fast wallbreaker, not nearly important enough to sacrifice actual coverage for anyway (Bullet Punch is NEVER worth using on Mega Medicham if you outspeed the other mon outside of maybe if you expect Mega-Mawile's Sucker Punch but that's super niche).

High Jump Kick is non-negotiable, in fact this is the main(/only) reason to even be using Mega Medicham, without it you may as well use Gallade or Mienshao and save your mega slot.

That leaves room for 3 out of the following moves:

Zen Headbutt(/Psycho Cut): Secondary STAB, hits most fairies and flying types harder than HJK and makes short work of Mega Venusaur.

Ice Punch: Your only way of getting around Lando-T and Gliscor

Fire Punch: Your only way of dealing significant damage to Aegislash which will likely be your main check against most opponents considering how hard Megacham is to switch into and how popular Aegislash is.

Thunderpunch: Your only way of getting around Slowbro also does more damage than anything else to Azumarill and allows you to nail non-mega Gyarados which otherwise is a great check to Megacham.

Fake Out: IMO inferior option as it doesnt provide any coverage but it does allow for more of a Pivot playstyle turning some 2HKOs into OHKOs and let's you bypass your mediocre speed pre mega evolving.

Baton Pass: Provides momentum, pretty much only useful vs Aegislash and CM Rest Gothithelle (which is very very rare) allowing you to keep momentum/pursuit trap the former and escape the latter.

No other moves should ever be considered on Mega Medicham imo, if you disagree provide solid reasoning as to why other than 'Bullet Punch hits fairys' which is simply not true.
 
Bullet Punch, easily kills weakened pokemon that do not resist and that are faster than you (besides talonflame)
Out prioritizes most sucker punchs, making them fail, leading your opponent to switch to another move. (mind games)
hits fairys

this move help me win many games on showdown bring my rank where I peeking around 1600's. I don't even use HJK, and I still (sometimes) sweep teams with mega-champ.
I don't like to use the same sets, like everyone else does, because you can be easily predicted. Protect, Ghost, half of your life is gone. I also have Bisharp on my team, so Aegislash is not a threat to me.
even in my y cartridge, mega-champ sweeps like f, in rating battles and friend requested battles.

I gave my reasoning for Bullet Punch. It's better than fake out in my opinion.

good day
 
I agree that Fake Out is worthless, but Bullet Punch has some redeeming points. On paper, it's craptastic, but it saved my ass more often than once. Of course, it is inferior to Fire Punch / Thunder Punch, but it has a niche. It's still about 30% on targets like Garchomp or Landorus and it let you spam your STAB. For example, if there are a Bisharp and a Latios on the opposing team. You have to predict between High Jump Kick or Ice Punch, right ? Well, with Bullet Punch, you can just throw an High Jump Kick + Bullet Punch, which KOes Latios with SR.
A lot of threats to Medicham are Pokemon resisting to one of its STAB and faster than him. But Medicham is just so insanely powerful that you can just throw your STAB to nearly any switch and pick it off with Bullet Punch. Alakazam trying to RK you ? Bullet Punch. Thundurus thinking he is smart ? Psycho Cut + Bullet Punch. Pinsir trying to set-up on you ? HJK + Bullet Punch is a KO with SR (and Psycho Cut does not need it). Deoxys-S ? STAB + Bullet Punch.
These targets barely tank your STAB (even with SR), but when they do, they are outright scary. With Bullet Punch, just spam your STAB, press Bullet Punch where there are weak and you'll be fine.

Of course, M-Medicham will still be forced out after a KO, but that means that your opponent HAS to sacrifice a Pokemon. While without Bullet Punch... Well, with some predictions, you can bring your M-Pinsir for a sweep, for instance.
However, if you need to kill Aegislash on its switch-in, Fire Punch is here. And if Slowbro / Gyara annoys you, there is Thunderpunch. But to say Bullet Punch is useless is, for me, wrong.
 
My team is built for sacraficing. My focus sashed greninja is sacked, if needed or ferrothorn when sr/spikes are up. Bullet Punch saved me from a +3 speed togekiss in a baton pass team. Its effective. But it also has its cons.
Fake out has its pros, and cons same like Bullet Punch.
 
DragoFish said:
Bullet Punch, easily kills weakened pokemon that do not resist and that are faster than you (besides talonflame)
Out prioritizes most sucker punchs, making them fail, leading your opponent to switch to another move. (mind games)
hits fairys
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The only relevant sucker punches in OU are Mega Mawile who won't OHKO MegaCham from full HP with it and dies to HJK after SR (or 75% of the time without SR) and Bisharp who also doesn't OHKO from full and dies to HJK easily while Bullet Punch doesn't even 4HKO either of them.

Full_Korbe is at least making some decent points as to why Bullet Punch might be useful, I still don't think it's worth a slot and I flat out disagree with some of the examples or find them highly situational but still.

It does max 25% against Garchomp who can't check you anyway as both Ice Punch and HJK OHKO it and Zen Headbutt + Bullet Punch never kills it back unless it switched into SR/Spikes.

252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Zen Headbutt vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Garchomp: 228-268 (63.6 - 74.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Bullet Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Garchomp: 76-90 (21.2 - 25.1%) -- 0% chance to 4HKO
= 84.8 - 99.9%

And max 29.6% vs Landorus who also won't be checking you either unless it's Lando-T which is slower than you unless it
runs Scarf and that set takes an absolute pittance from Bullet Punch and can come in on any move but Ice Punch:

-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Landorus-T: 53-63 (16.6 - 19.7%) -- possible 6HKO
-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Psycho Cut vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Landorus-T: 139-165 (43.5 - 51.7%) -- 9% chance to 2HKO
-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Landorus-T: 75-88 (23.5 - 27.5%) -- 75.9% chance to 4HKO

this move help me win many games on showdown bring my rank where I peeking around 1600's. I don't even use HJK, and I still (sometimes) sweep teams with mega-champ.
I don't like to use the same sets, like everyone else does, because you can be easily predicted. Protect, Ghost, half of your life is gone. I also have Bisharp on my team, so Aegislash is not a threat to me.
even in my y cartridge, mega-champ sweeps like f, in rating battles and friend requested battles.

I gave my reasoning for Bullet Punch. It's better than fake out in my opinion.

good day
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You don't spam HJK when your opponent has a ghost type alive or something that likely carries protect (like Ferrothorn or Heatran), you have to play smart with it and when you do it's much more effective than Drain Punch as it's almost 70% more powerful and the healing from Drain Punch is not really a big deal on something as frail as MegaCham, Aegislash IS a threat even if you carry Bisharp as unless you double switch you can't garantee getting Bisharp in safely (Sacred Sword always OHKOs) and Aegislash isn't pressured to use Shadow Ball/Sneak if the strongest move you've got to hit it is Psycho Cut and the Bisharp switch is extremely obvious, if you do double switch to get Bisharp in vs Aegislash it obviously doesnt matter if you're using HJK or Drain Punch.

MegaCham is a wallbreaker and your set fails to beat:
Skarmory:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Skarmory: 118-139 (35.3 - 41.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

PhDef Mega-Scizor:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Scizor: 117-138 (34 - 40.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock

Quagsire:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 163-193 (41.3 - 48.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Psycho Cut vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 153-181 (38.8 - 45.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Clefable:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Psycho Cut vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 168-198 (42.6 - 50.2%) -- 39.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

PhDef Hippowdon:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 176-208 (41.9 - 49.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Any Aegislash set:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Psycho Cut vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Aegislash-Shield: 67-79 (25.6 - 30.2%) -- 43% chance to 4HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Psycho Cut vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Aegislash-Blade: 165-195 (63.2 - 74.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

RestTalk Gyarados:
-1 252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Psycho Cut vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Gyarados: 106-126 (26.9 - 32%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock

Mega Aggron:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Filter Mega Aggron: 118-141 (34.3 - 40.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock

Slowbro:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 69-81 (17.5 - 20.5%) -- possible 6HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Suicune:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Suicune: 135-159 (33.4 - 39.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

PhDef Tangrowth:
252 Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 170-200 (42 - 49.5%) -- 25.8% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Most of which are rather common and at least 2-3 of them will be on just about every stall team.
 
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