Megamons

[DEG]

e: [WIP] Almost done, will finish this tomorrow!


Instead of writing some papers I have due to tomorrow I'm going to contribute to this thread because why not. Interesting concept I see here, I'm going to break down different roles served by Pokemon defensively and offensively. I'm pretty sure I'm going to miss a lot but I'll do my best to cover most things.

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Defensive Pokemon

Role: Defensive Stealth Rocks
Item: Red Orb
Notable Moves: Stealth Rocks, Earthquake, Precipice Blades, Lava Plume, Roar, Rest
EVs: 252 HP / 200 Def / 52 SpD
Nature: Relaxed
Description: Thanks to its natural bulk, Primal Groudon finds itself being able to lay off the best form of hazards: Stealth Rocks; and used as a check to a plethora of offensive Pokemon such as Mega Lucario, Mega Mawile, and Mega Beedrill with the power of burning other Pokemon with a sun boosted Lava Plume, this Pokemon is easily splashable on teams that needs an offensive check and hazards.

Role: Defensive Tank and Stealth Rocker
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Stealth Rocks, Heavy Slam, Thunder Wave, Roar, Earthquake or Curse, Rest, Sleep Talk, Heavy Slam
EVs: 248 HP / 16 Def / 244 SpD
Nature: Impish
Description: In this meta, Mega Aggron gets something it doesn't have anywhere else which is recovery, well passive recovery in leftovers. Its great defensive typing combined with its ability in Filler and moveset makes it a defensive threat in the metagame as it is able to check offensive Fairy- types, Rock- Types and Bug- Types. It also have the capabilities of setting up Stealth Rocks and crippling the team with Thunder Wave. It is hindered by the prominence of Fighting- Types and mediocre special defense but it still can fit on most teams.

Role: Defensive Wall
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Calm Mind, Scald, Thunder Wave, Slack Off, Ice Beam, Psyshock, Toxic
EVs: EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Nature: Bold
Description: One of the best Pokemon defensively, with a whooping base 180 Def and ability in Shell Armor Mega Slowbro is easily splashable on any teams lacking a physically defensive Pokemon. There's lot of sets for this wall, a simple defensive with Scald, Toxic/T-wave, Slack Off and Ice Beam is good but what's better is its Calm Mind set. Mega Slowbro is able to boost its Special Defense which, mixed with its Defense, makes it an unbreakable wall. Thunder Wave usually accompanies Calm Mind Slowbro but Toxic can be used to stop opposing's Slowbro. Let's not forget scald is the best move in Pokemon!

Role: Defensive Wall
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Foul Play, Will-o-Wisp, Recover, Knock Off
EVs: EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Nature: Bold
Description: Mega Sableye is a great Pokemon in this meta specially on stall teams. Being able to bounce back hazards and status thanks to its ability in Magic Bounce and owning a great physical bulk and good movepool makes Mega Sableye a threat in the metagame. It is able to fire off STAB foul play in such offensive metagame and Knock off which is able to remove any boosting item from the foe's pocket. It also have Will-o-Wisp which cripples further physically offensive Pokemon and is blessed with Recover.

Role: Defensive Defogger
Item: Leftovers / Griseous Orb
Notable Moves: Dragon Tail, Defog, Rest, Sleep Talk, Will-o-Wisp
EVs: Impish
Nature: EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Description: Continuing with Ghost- types Giratina servers as a great defogger due to its raw bulk and typing being able to check Fire-, Water-, Bug-, Poison- types that are omnipresent in the form of Mega Charizad Y, Primal Kyogre, and Mega Beedrill. It also has the capability of phasing thanks to Dragon Tail. Unfortunately, it lacks recovery so Rest should be used but that doesn't stop it from being a premium defogger.

Role: Defensive Wall
Item: Black Sludge
Notable Moves: Synthesis, Sludge Bomb, Leech Seed, Knock Off, Giga Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Nature: Bold
Description: With thick fat and a great defensive typing Mega Venusaur joins this meta with a niche of its own. Usable as a defensive wall with Leech Seed and passive recovery with Black Sludge. Sludge Bomb is a nice move to hit the foe's Pokemon with a chance to poison it, same chance as scald!, Knock Off is also a good option as it also removes the item and the boost with it.

Role: Specially Defensive tank, Stealth Rocks user and sand abuse
Item: Leftovers / Smooth Rock
Notable Moves: Stealth Rocks, Fire Blast, Pursuit, Stone Edge, Ice Beam, Crunch, Earthquake, Thunder Wave, Toxic
EVs: EVs: 248 HP / 168 Def / 92 SpD
Nature: Impish
Description: One of the best specially defensive tank in the metagame. Thanks to its ability in Sand Stream it is able to boost its Special Defense and serves as a specially defensive tank. It is also able to trap them thanks to Pursuit and take out notable Ghost- and Psychic- types out of sight. It is also blessed with a great movepool, being able to choose from a plethora of moves helps it as it can cover its team's weakness. Mega Tyranitar is also usable as a sand abuser forming a great core with Excadrill.

Role: Prankster Support
Item: Leftovers / Focus Sash
Notable Moves: Thunder Wave, Destiny Bond, Knock Off, Shadow Claw, Will-o-Wisp, Taunt
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Nature: Adamant
Description: Not completely defensive but Mega Banette is a great support Pokemon thanks to Prankster. Its notable niche is hidden in its ability to spread status, able to Taunt and most importantly Destiny Bond which allows it to stop any sweep. It also has access to Knock Off.

Role: Unaware Wall
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Moonblast, Wish, Protect, Thunder Wave, Toxic, Heal Bell
EVs: 248 HP / 248 SpD / 12 Def or 248 Def / 12 Spdf
Nature: Calm / Bold
Description: Clefable holds a niche in this metagame specially on stall teams solely due to its Unaware ability and mono typing in Fairy which stops set up sweepers such as Arceus and cripple them with Thunder Wave or Toxic. It can also serves as a Wish passer and healer.

Role: Defensive Wall
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Toxic, Thunder Wave, Roost, Reflect, Whirlwind,
EVs: 252 HP / 120 Def / 136 Spe
Nature: Bold
Description: The great wall is back in megamons! Its already supreme ability in checking a good portion of the Ubers is boosted here as most Pokemon are going Offensive. Lugia's great typing in Flying/Psychic is appreciated due to the omnipresence of Fighting- types. It also possesses great recovery in Roost, a phasing move in Whirlwind and Status to spread. Let's not forget Multiscale!

Role: Supportceus
Item: Plate
Notable Moves: Judgment, Defog, Will-o-Wisp, Recover, Toxic
EVs: Depends
Nature: Depends
Description: Support Arceus also has a niche in this metagame as you can pick any type that covers your weakness and uses it as your Defogger and offense check.

Role: Support
Item: Leftovers / Soul Dew
Notable Moves: Roost, Draco Meteor, Defog, Psyshock, Toxic, Calm Mind, Dragon Pulse, Healing Wish
EVs: 212 HP / 120 SpA / 176 Spe
Nature: Timid
Description: Mega Latias might not be the choice at the first sight unlike other defensive Pokemon. Its access to Defog, good defensive typing and a great support moveset makes it a great choice on more offensive oriented teams.

Role: Defensive Tank and Hazards Setter
Item: Leftovers / Rocky Helmet
Notable Moves: Spikes, Stealth Rocks, Gyro Ball, Leech Seed, Protect, Power Whip
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Nature: Sassy
Description: Not a top tier defensive Pokemon but it has its niche due to its access to Stealth Rocks and Spikes. Leech seed makes great recovery while sapping the foe's health and the passive damage done if touched by physical attackers helps it.

Role: Defensive Healer
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Wish, Heal Bell, Knock Off, Protect, Dazzling Gleam
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Nature: Careful
Description: Niche Pokemon that is able to heal off its team mates thanks to Wish and Heal bell adding that its access to Knock Off. It's also bulkier than Clefable.

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Offensive Pokemon

Role: Physical Dragon Dance
Item: Life Orb / Leftovers / Sharp Break
Notable Moves: Dragon Dance, Roost, Return, Double Edge, Substitute, Refresh, Earthquake
EVs: 80 HP / 252 Atk / 176 Spe or 248 HP / 136 Def / 124 Spe
Nature: Adamant / Impish
Description: If you thought Mega Salamence couldn't get any better you were wrong! Now with its capability of being equipped with an item Mega Salamence will have fun terrorizing others. It's able to break through walls thanks to its refresh sets and roost. Mega Salamence is one of the best offensive Pokemon out there, so you better be prepared to it!

Role: Am I physical or special?
Item: Life Orb
Notable Moves: Sword Dance, Bullet Punch, Close Combat, Iron Tail or Nasty Plot, Vacuum Wave, Aura Sphere, Flash Cannon
EVs: 252 Spe / 252 Atk / 4 HP or 252 Spe / 252 Spa / 4 HP
Nature: Jolly
Description: Surprise, Surprise! You will have to guess which Lucario it is. The surprise factor combined with Adaptability places Mega Lucario high on the threat list. Backed up with Life Orb and Raw power and priority, Mega Lucario will find itself punching through walls.

Role: Sword Dance
Item: Life Orb / Leftovers
Notable Moves: Sword Dance, Play Rough, Iron Head, Fire Fang, Sucker Punch, Baton Pass
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 HP / 4 Spd
Nature: Adamant
Description: Slow but deadly. Huge Power and Life Orb combined with a Fairy/Steel typing is destructive. Sword Dance boosts Mega Mawile attack making it deadlier while Sucker Punch mitigates its mediocre speed.

Role: Double Hit
Item: Life Orb / Leftovers
Notable Moves: Fake out, Return, Earthquake, Crunch, Sucker Punch, Body Slam, Double Edge, Seismic Toss
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Nature: Jolly
Description: Thanks to Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan is a threatening Mega Evolution that likes being accompanied with Life Orb which makes it moves hit harder, adding to that Sucker Punch which seems great. Unfortunately, it doesn't have enough power to break through walls but it has a niche in the metagame.

Role: Dragon Dance Offense
Item: Life Orb / Leftovers
Notable Moves: Dragon Dance, Flare Blitz, Dragon Claw, Roost, Will-o-Wisp, Earthquake
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP or 252 HP / 252 Spe / 4 Atk
Nature: Jolly / Impish
Description: In its normal state Mega Charizard X can already be used as a bulky Dragon Dance or an offensive Dragon Dance. Its role becomes better in this metagame as the bulky set cherishes the passive recovery in leftovers and the offensive set becomes more destructive with Life Orb and roost.

Role: Special Sun
Item: Life Orb / Choice Specs / Heat Rock
Notable Moves: Fire Blast, Flamethrower, Focus Blast, Solar Beam, Roost,
EVs: 252 Spa / 252 Spe / 4 Spd
Nature: Timid
Description:

Role: E-KILLER!
Item: Lum Berry / Life Orb
Notable Moves: Sword Dance, Extreme Speed, Earthquake, Stone Edge, Shadow Claw
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Nature: Adamant / Jolly
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Role: Dark Void
Item: Life Orb
Notable Moves: Dark Void, Dark Pulse, Sludge Bomb, Nasty Plot, Focus Blast, Thunder
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Nature: Timid
Description:

Role: Offensive Pivot
Item: Life Orb / Choice Band
Notable Moves: U-Turn, Drill Run, Poison Jab, X-Scissor, Protect
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Nature: Adamant
Description:

Role: Sun Offense
Item: Life Orb / Choice Specs
Notable Moves: Fire Blast, Flamethrower, Nasty Plot, Sludge Bomb, Solar Beam
EVs: 252 Spa / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Nature: Jolly
Description:

Role: Aerilate Spam
Item: Choice Band / Life Orb
Notable Moves: Return, Close Combat, Sword Dance, Earthquake, Quick Attack
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Nature: Jolly
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Role: Bulky SD
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Sword Dance, Roost, Bullet Punch, Super Power, Knock Off, Bug Bite
EVs: 248 HP / 44 Atk / 16 Def / 200 SpD
Nature: Impish
Description:

Role: Wall Breaker
Item: Choice Scarf / Life Orb
Notable Moves: Close Combat, Rock Blast, Pin Missile, Bullet Seed, Sword Dance, Substitute
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
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Role: Mixed Attacker
Item: Life Orb
Notable Moves: Moonblast, Diamond Storm, Earth Power, HP Fire
EVs: 252 Spa / 252 Spe / 4 Spd
Nature: Naive
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Role: Bulky Offense
Item: Life Orb / Choice Band
Notable Moves: Sacred Fire, Brave Bird, Earthquake, Roost, Substitute
EVs: 248 HP / 196 Atk / 52 SpD / 12 Spe
Nature: Adamant
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Role: Mixed or SD offense
Item: Life Orb
Notable Moves: Earthquake, Stone Edge, Fire Blast, Dragon Claw, Draco Meteor, Sword Dance, Substitute
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Nature: Naive / Jolly
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Item: Life Orb / Expert Belt
Notable Moves: Zen Headbutt, Meteor Mash, Bullet Punch, Grass Knot, Hammer Arm, Ice Punch
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[HailFall]

Uh ive noticed a lot of people using mega rayquaza on the ladder even though the op says it should be banned? Is this a bug or am i missing something

 

[The Immortal]

Uh ive noticed a lot of people using mega rayquaza on the ladder even though the op says it should be banned? Is this a bug or am i missing something

My bad. I banned it from mega evolving but forgot to ban it from being used directly.

 

[Chopin Alkaninoff]

I've been having so much fun with Assault Vest Mega Tyranitar. It's sooo bulky, reaching 837 Special Defense max, though you probably don't need it that much. Then what? Do you think stats matter when Mega Diancie 2HKOs you?

Tyranitar-Mega @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 96 Atk / 160 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stone Edge
- Pursuit
- Crunch/Ice Punch
- Earthquake

224 SpA Life Orb Mega Diancie Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 160+ SpD Assault Vest Mega Tyranitar in Sand: 143-172 (35.3 - 42.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

No. This is the REAL. A Super Effective LO Mega Diancie can't even 2HKO, while you can just click Earthquake and it'll die. It also eat both Mega Latis by Pursuit and can easily sponge Draco Meteor.

People probably don't like full investment on Special Defense, so you can invest a little Attack. You need 96 Atk EVs to deal a minimum of 90% damage with Earthquake, meaning it's guaranteed KO if Mega Diancie has Life Orb recoil.

Anyway. What's the decision on Soul Dew?

 

[Whydon]

Alright! Welcome for the time being, Soul Dew is unbanned. The Lati twins don't seem to be broken with any items currently, so I don't think Soul Dew will be broken. If it proves to be too strong, we can ban it again.

 

[Stocke]

After doing a minimal amount of playtesting, it seems like the most important Speed stat to break in this meta is 350 (or a max-EV'd positive-nature base 110). Several important threats in the metagame (more specifically, Metagross, the Latis, and Diancie, as well as Gallade but it's not as significant as those four) have 110 as their base Speed, so if you're able to break that mark unboosted, you're golden. For the most part, anyway; there are several prominent Mega Dragon Dancers, in particular Salamence, as well as faster threats like Alakazam and Lopunny that you're still able to be revenge-killed by with that speed stat. Still, I think base 110 is a good base-line to work off of when determining whether something is fast here or not.

 

[Camara]

On non-completely-broken tier:

Mega Pidgeot @ Choice Specs
Timid
252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
~Hurricane
~Heat Wave
~Hyper Beam
~U-Turn/HP Ground/HP Fight

Meh, it's basically +1 MegaBirdJesus
Weakness Policy would work better when vs non-sweepers with super effective moves or unstabbed SE moves

 

[MilanesaCosmica]

Someone has tested Alakazam in this meta?

Alakazam-Mega @ Life Orb
Ability: Trace
IVs: 0 Atk
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Psychic/Psyshock
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast
- Encore/Recover/HP Ice/HP Fire/Dazzling Gleam

Sure, it loses to Sucker Punch and Scarfers but it outspeed and OHKO a lot of offensive threats like M-Mane, M-Lop, M-Gengar, Scarf M-Hera, M-Luke, M-Bee, M-Sceptile, Darkrai and 2HKO almost the entire Meta after SR with the right move.

Oh, and can live some priority from full:
252 Atk Choice Band Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Alakazam: 205-243 (81.6 - 96.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Adaptability Mega Lucario Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Alakazam: 177-208 (70.5 - 82.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Tough Claws Mega Metagross Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Alakazam: 169-200 (67.3 - 79.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Some irrelevant calcs:

Against Offensive Mons and Primals

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Metagross: 263-309 (87.3 - 102.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Latios: 244-289 (81.6 - 96.6%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Pinsir: 263-309 (97 - 114%) -- 75% chance to OHKO

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Focus Blast vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Normal Arceus: 364-429 (95.2 - 112.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Diancie: 220-261 (91.2 - 108.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Psychic vs. 252 HP / 200 SpD Primal Groudon: 212-251 (52.4 - 62.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Psyshock vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Primal Kyogre: 231-274 (57.3 - 67.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Against Walls

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Mega Tyranitar in Sand: 244-291 (60.3 - 72%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Psyshock vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 282-333 (43.9 - 51.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Dazzling Gleam vs. 252 HP / 144+ SpD Mega Sableye: 203-239 (66.7 - 78.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Giratina: 242-286 (48.1 - 56.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 240 SpD Filter Mega Aggron: 294-347 (85.4 - 100.8%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Slowbro: 341-403 (86.5 - 102.2%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

 

[Tornadus-Therian]

Why wouldn't you just use Deo-A? It has the same speed and typing but more power, mixed options, and extremespeed. It doesn't survive random priority, but neither does M-Alakazam after one round of LO and/or Rocks.

 

[QT]

Why wouldn't you just use Deo-A? It has the same speed and typing but more power, mixed options, and extremespeed. It doesn't survive random priority, but neither does M-Alakazam after one round of LO and/or Rocks.

Probably because deoxys-A has no bulk, (it cant even live resisted hits), has a worse ability, and cant even switchin on stall. if deoxys-A comies in on slowbro, it had better have an intact sash or it dies, while alakazam can force it out.

 

[The Guy Who Has Many Alts]

Is soul dew and mega lati@s not supposed to be banned? Cause I just fought 1 today and it's broken af, I couldn't switch even resists to it.

 

[Jajoken]

Is soul dew and mega lati@s not supposed to be banned? Cause I just fought 1 today and it's broken af, I couldn't switch even resists to it.

It was unbanned a few posts above you.

Alright! Welcome for the time being, Soul Dew is unbanned. The Lati twins don't seem to be broken with any items currently, so I don't think Soul Dew will be broken. If it proves to be too strong, we can ban it again.

Mega Tyranitar seems like a solid switch-in if you're looking for one.

 

[Chopin Alkaninoff]

Remember that this is Ubers. The metagame is based on checking things, not countering, because there are so many uncounterable pokes in Ubers. If you're looking for Mega Latis checks, you can try SpDef invested Mega Tyranitar, Mega Mawile, Defensive Arceus-Fairy and Klefki, which no one seem to use. Also Lugia if Multiscale is still intact.

 

[Imperator Romanum]

Maybe they're based on checking things, but I'd love it if we suspected

Suspect Mega salamence from holding an item

Mega Salamence is already a fearsome threat in ubers, it's amazing defensive and offensive capabilities are rarely rivaled, having amazing offesive stat and defensive ones. In OU it was probably the most broken thing to ever grace it, atleast from what I've personally seen, literally being capable of outstalling all of its checks, and having coverage to easily beat its supposed counters, in other words, fire blast, hydro pump, hyper voice or Draco meteor. Couple this with Refresh, substitue, reliable recovery, a powerful pre-mega ability, defog and only one or two real achilles heels, Ice weakness and Stealth rock weakness. In Ubers it's currently 05.04.2016 it sits in S rank in ubers.

In Megamons Mega Salamence gains a significant buff in being able to hold a large variation of items, almost anything under the sun actually! Life orb, Lum berry, Leftovers, Choice banded, Choice scarfed or choice speced! Of course it could also run a large variation of other items, sharp beak/sky plate or yetcha berry. I personally believe this buff is too significant for Mega Salamence, reducing previous counters to poor checks and checks... are no longer checks.

Tough bird Yveltal, Defensive Xerneas, Arceus fairy, rock, steel or Primal Groudon were all checks/counters before, now they cry in sorrow as Mega Salamence easily overpowers them. To show of some calcs!

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 441-519 (96.9 - 114%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Xerneas: 441-519 (96.9 - 114%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Mega Salamence Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 84 Def Arceus-Rock: 403-476 (90.9 - 107.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 56+ Def Primal Groudon: 343-406 (84.9 - 100.4%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 168-198 (50.2 - 59.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Mega Salamence Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Mega Tyranitar: 354-419 (87.6 - 103.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Dialga: 252-296 (62.6 - 73.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock/Shuca)
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 120+ Def Multiscale Lugia: 195-230 (46.8 - 55.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Mega Salamence Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 16+ Def Filter Mega Aggron: 164-193 (47.6 - 56.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 200+ Def Arceus-Water: 390-460 (87.8 - 103.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 156 Def Mega Aerodactyl: 285-335 (78.5 - 92.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Mega Slowbro: 281-331 (71.3 - 84%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

 

[Terrakion.]

e: [WIP] Almost done, will finish this tomorrow!


Instead of writing some papers I have due to tomorrow I'm going to contribute to this thread because why not. Interesting concept I see here, I'm going to break down different roles served by Pokemon defensively and offensively. I'm pretty sure I'm going to miss a lot but I'll do my best to cover most things.

Hide

Defensive Pokemon

Role: Defensive Stealth Rocks
Item: Red Orb
Notable Moves: Stealth Rocks, Earthquake, Precipice Blades, Lava Plume, Roar, Rest
EVs: 252 HP / 200 Def / 52 SpD
Nature: Relaxed
Description: Thanks to its natural bulk, Primal Groudon finds itself being able to lay off the best form of hazards: Stealth Rocks; and used as a check to a plethora of offensive Pokemon such as Mega Lucario, Mega Mawile, and Mega Beedrill with the power of burning other Pokemon with a sun boosted Lava Plume, this Pokemon is easily splashable on teams that needs an offensive check and hazards.

Role: Defensive Tank and Stealth Rocker
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Stealth Rocks, Heavy Slam, Thunder Wave, Roar, Earthquake or Curse, Rest, Sleep Talk, Heavy Slam
EVs: 248 HP / 16 Def / 244 SpD
Nature: Impish
Description: In this meta, Mega Aggron gets something it doesn't have anywhere else which is recovery, well passive recovery in leftovers. Its great defensive typing combined with its ability in Filler and moveset makes it a defensive threat in the metagame as it is able to check offensive Fairy- types, Rock- Types and Bug- Types. It also have the capabilities of setting up Stealth Rocks and crippling the team with Thunder Wave. It is hindered by the prominence of Fighting- Types and mediocre special defense but it still can fit on most teams.

Role: Defensive Wall
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Calm Mind, Scald, Thunder Wave, Slack Off, Ice Beam, Psyshock, Toxic
EVs: EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Nature: Bold
Description: One of the best Pokemon defensively, with a whooping base 180 Def and ability in Shell Armor Mega Slowbro is easily splashable on any teams lacking a physically defensive Pokemon. There's lot of sets for this wall, a simple defensive with Scald, Toxic/T-wave, Slack Off and Ice Beam is good but what's better is its Calm Mind set. Mega Slowbro is able to boost its Special Defense which, mixed with its Defense, makes it an unbreakable wall. Thunder Wave usually accompanies Calm Mind Slowbro but Toxic can be used to stop opposing's Slowbro. Let's not forget scald is the best move in Pokemon!

Role: Defensive Wall
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Foul Play, Will-o-Wisp, Recover, Knock Off
EVs: EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Nature: Bold
Description: Mega Sableye is a great Pokemon in this meta specially on stall teams. Being able to bounce back hazards and status thanks to its ability in Magic Bounce and owning a great physical bulk and good movepool makes Mega Sableye a threat in the metagame. It is able to fire off STAB foul play in such offensive metagame and Knock off which is able to remove any boosting item from the foe's pocket. It also have Will-o-Wisp which cripples further physically offensive Pokemon and is blessed with Recover.

Role: Defensive Defogger
Item: Leftovers / Griseous Orb
Notable Moves: Dragon Tail, Defog, Rest, Sleep Talk, Will-o-Wisp
EVs: Impish
Nature: EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Description: Continuing with Ghost- types Giratina servers as a great defogger due to its raw bulk and typing being able to check Fire-, Water-, Bug-, Poison- types that are omnipresent in the form of Mega Charizad Y, Primal Kyogre, and Mega Beedrill. It also has the capability of phasing thanks to Dragon Tail. Unfortunately, it lacks recovery so Rest should be used but that doesn't stop it from being a premium defogger.

Role: Defensive Wall
Item: Black Sludge
Notable Moves: Synthesis, Sludge Bomb, Leech Seed, Knock Off, Giga Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Nature: Bold
Description: With thick fat and a great defensive typing Mega Venusaur joins this meta with a niche of its own. Usable as a defensive wall with Leech Seed and passive recovery with Black Sludge. Sludge Bomb is a nice move to hit the foe's Pokemon with a chance to poison it, same chance as scald!, Knock Off is also a good option as it also removes the item and the boost with it.

Role: Specially Defensive tank, Stealth Rocks user and sand abuse
Item: Leftovers / Smooth Rock
Notable Moves: Stealth Rocks, Fire Blast, Pursuit, Stone Edge, Ice Beam, Crunch, Earthquake, Thunder Wave, Toxic
EVs: EVs: 248 HP / 168 Def / 92 SpD
Nature: Impish
Description: One of the best specially defensive tank in the metagame. Thanks to its ability in Sand Stream it is able to boost its Special Defense and serves as a specially defensive tank. It is also able to trap them thanks to Pursuit and take out notable Ghost- and Psychic- types out of sight. It is also blessed with a great movepool, being able to choose from a plethora of moves helps it as it can cover its team's weakness. Mega Tyranitar is also usable as a sand abuser forming a great core with Excadrill.

Role: Prankster Support
Item: Leftovers / Focus Sash
Notable Moves: Thunder Wave, Destiny Bond, Knock Off, Shadow Claw, Will-o-Wisp, Taunt
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Nature: Adamant
Description: Not completely defensive but Mega Banette is a great support Pokemon thanks to Prankster. Its notable niche is hidden in its ability to spread status, able to Taunt and most importantly Destiny Bond which allows it to stop any sweep. It also has access to Knock Off.

Role: Unaware Wall
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Moonblast, Wish, Protect, Thunder Wave, Toxic, Heal Bell
EVs: 248 HP / 248 SpD / 12 Def or 248 Def / 12 Spdf
Nature: Calm / Bold
Description: Clefable holds a niche in this metagame specially on stall teams solely due to its Unaware ability and mono typing in Fairy which stops set up sweepers such as Arceus and cripple them with Thunder Wave or Toxic. It can also serves as a Wish passer and healer.

Role: Defensive Wall
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Toxic, Thunder Wave, Roost, Reflect, Whirlwind,
EVs: 252 HP / 120 Def / 136 Spe
Nature: Bold
Description: The great wall is back in megamons! Its already supreme ability in checking a good portion of the Ubers is boosted here as most Pokemon are going Offensive. Lugia's great typing in Flying/Psychic is appreciated due to the omnipresence of Fighting- types. It also possesses great recovery in Roost, a phasing move in Whirlwind and Status to spread. Let's not forget Multiscale!

Role: Supportceus
Item: Plate
Notable Moves: Judgment, Defog, Will-o-Wisp, Recover, Toxic
EVs: Depends
Nature: Depends
Description: Support Arceus also has a niche in this metagame as you can pick any type that covers your weakness and uses it as your Defogger and offense check.

Role: Support
Item: Leftovers / Soul Dew
Notable Moves: Roost, Draco Meteor, Defog, Psyshock, Toxic, Calm Mind, Dragon Pulse, Healing Wish
EVs: 212 HP / 120 SpA / 176 Spe
Nature: Timid
Description: Mega Latias might not be the choice at the first sight unlike other defensive Pokemon. Its access to Defog, good defensive typing and a great support moveset makes it a great choice on more offensive oriented teams.

Role: Defensive Tank and Hazards Setter
Item: Leftovers / Rocky Helmet
Notable Moves: Spikes, Stealth Rocks, Gyro Ball, Leech Seed, Protect, Power Whip
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Nature: Sassy
Description: Not a top tier defensive Pokemon but it has its niche due to its access to Stealth Rocks and Spikes. Leech seed makes great recovery while sapping the foe's health and the passive damage done if touched by physical attackers helps it.

Role: Defensive Healer
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Wish, Heal Bell, Knock Off, Protect, Dazzling Gleam
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Nature: Careful
Description: Niche Pokemon that is able to heal off its team mates thanks to Wish and Heal bell adding that its access to Knock Off. It's also bulkier than Clefable.

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Offensive Pokemon

Role: Physical Dragon Dance
Item: Life Orb / Leftovers / Sharp Break
Notable Moves: Dragon Dance, Roost, Return, Double Edge, Substitute, Refresh, Earthquake
EVs: 80 HP / 252 Atk / 176 Spe or 248 HP / 136 Def / 124 Spe
Nature: Adamant / Impish
Description: If you thought Mega Salamence couldn't get any better you were wrong! Now with its capability of being equipped with an item Mega Salamence will have fun terrorizing others. It's able to break through walls thanks to its refresh sets and roost. Mega Salamence is one of the best offensive Pokemon out there, so you better be prepared to it!

Role: Am I physical or special?
Item: Life Orb
Notable Moves: Sword Dance, Bullet Punch, Close Combat, Iron Tail or Nasty Plot, Vacuum Wave, Aura Sphere, Flash Cannon
EVs: 252 Spe / 252 Atk / 4 HP or 252 Spe / 252 Spa / 4 HP
Nature: Jolly
Description: Surprise, Surprise! You will have to guess which Lucario it is. The surprise factor combined with Adaptability places Mega Lucario high on the threat list. Backed up with Life Orb and Raw power and priority, Mega Lucario will find itself punching through walls.

Role: Sword Dance
Item: Life Orb / Leftovers
Notable Moves: Sword Dance, Play Rough, Iron Head, Fire Fang, Sucker Punch, Baton Pass
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 HP / 4 Spd
Nature: Adamant
Description: Slow but deadly. Huge Power and Life Orb combined with a Fairy/Steel typing is destructive. Sword Dance boosts Mega Mawile attack making it deadlier while Sucker Punch mitigates its mediocre speed.

Role: Double Hit
Item: Life Orb / Leftovers
Notable Moves: Fake out, Return, Earthquake, Crunch, Sucker Punch, Body Slam, Double Edge, Seismic Toss
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Nature: Jolly
Description: Thanks to Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan is a threatening Mega Evolution that likes being accompanied with Life Orb which makes it moves hit harder, adding to that Sucker Punch which seems great. Unfortunately, it doesn't have enough power to break through walls but it has a niche in the metagame.

Role: Dragon Dance Offense
Item: Life Orb / Leftovers
Notable Moves: Dragon Dance, Flare Blitz, Dragon Claw, Roost, Will-o-Wisp, Earthquake
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP or 252 HP / 252 Spe / 4 Atk
Nature: Jolly / Impish
Description: In its normal state Mega Charizard X can already be used as a bulky Dragon Dance or an offensive Dragon Dance. Its role becomes better in this metagame as the bulky set cherishes the passive recovery in leftovers and the offensive set becomes more destructive with Life Orb and roost.

Role: Special Sun
Item: Life Orb / Choice Specs / Heat Rock
Notable Moves: Fire Blast, Flamethrower, Focus Blast, Solar Beam, Roost,
EVs: 252 Spa / 252 Spe / 4 Spd
Nature: Timid
Description:

Role: E-KILLER!
Item: Lum Berry / Life Orb
Notable Moves: Sword Dance, Extreme Speed, Earthquake, Stone Edge, Shadow Claw
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Nature: Adamant / Jolly
Description:

Role: Dark Void
Item: Life Orb
Notable Moves: Dark Void, Dark Pulse, Sludge Bomb, Nasty Plot, Focus Blast, Thunder
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Nature: Timid
Description:

Role: Offensive Pivot
Item: Life Orb / Choice Band
Notable Moves: U-Turn, Drill Run, Poison Jab, X-Scissor, Protect
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Nature: Adamant
Description:

Role: Sun Offense
Item: Life Orb / Choice Specs
Notable Moves: Fire Blast, Flamethrower, Nasty Plot, Sludge Bomb, Solar Beam
EVs: 252 Spa / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Nature: Jolly
Description:

Role: Aerilate Spam
Item: Choice Band / Life Orb
Notable Moves: Return, Close Combat, Sword Dance, Earthquake, Quick Attack
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Nature: Jolly
Description:

Role: Bulky SD
Item: Leftovers
Notable Moves: Sword Dance, Roost, Bullet Punch, Super Power, Knock Off, Bug Bite
EVs: 248 HP / 44 Atk / 16 Def / 200 SpD
Nature: Impish
Description:

Role: Wall Breaker
Item: Choice Scarf / Life Orb
Notable Moves: Close Combat, Rock Blast, Pin Missile, Bullet Seed, Sword Dance, Substitute
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
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Role: Mixed Attacker
Item: Life Orb
Notable Moves: Moonblast, Diamond Storm, Earth Power, HP Fire
EVs: 252 Spa / 252 Spe / 4 Spd
Nature: Naive
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Role: Bulky Offense
Item: Life Orb / Choice Band
Notable Moves: Sacred Fire, Brave Bird, Earthquake, Roost, Substitute
EVs: 248 HP / 196 Atk / 52 SpD / 12 Spe
Nature: Adamant
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Role: Mixed or SD offense
Item: Life Orb
Notable Moves: Earthquake, Stone Edge, Fire Blast, Dragon Claw, Draco Meteor, Sword Dance, Substitute
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Nature: Naive / Jolly
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Item: Life Orb / Expert Belt
Notable Moves: Zen Headbutt, Meteor Mash, Bullet Punch, Grass Knot, Hammer Arm, Ice Punch
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I think this is useful for people really trying to get into this OM but some of your stuff is wrong. You are giving Pinsir an even HP number with 4 HP EVs allowing it to only switch into Stealth Rocks twice instead of three times, which can be really game changing. Another thing I noticed is the lack of Iron Defense under moves for Mega Slowbro.

 

[Chopin Alkaninoff]

Maybe they're based on checking things, but I'd love it if we suspected

Suspect Mega salamence from holding an item

Mega Salamence is already a fearsome threat in ubers, it's amazing defensive and offensive capabilities are rarely rivaled, having amazing offesive stat and defensive ones. In OU it was probably the most broken thing to ever grace it, atleast from what I've personally seen, literally being capable of outstalling all of its checks, and having coverage to easily beat its supposed counters, in other words, fire blast, hydro pump, hyper voice or Draco meteor. Couple this with Refresh, substitue, reliable recovery, a powerful pre-mega ability, defog and only one or two real achilles heels, Ice weakness and Stealth rock weakness. In Ubers it's currently 05.04.2016 it sits in S rank in ubers.

In Megamons Mega Salamence gains a significant buff in being able to hold a large variation of items, almost anything under the sun actually! Life orb, Lum berry, Leftovers, Choice banded, Choice scarfed or choice speced! Of course it could also run a large variation of other items, sharp beak/sky plate or yetcha berry. I personally believe this buff is too significant for Mega Salamence, reducing previous counters to poor checks and checks... are no longer checks.

Tough bird Yveltal, Defensive Xerneas, Arceus fairy, rock, steel or Primal Groudon were all checks/counters before, now they cry in sorrow as Mega Salamence easily overpowers them. To show of some calcs!

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 441-519 (96.9 - 114%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Xerneas: 441-519 (96.9 - 114%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Mega Salamence Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 84 Def Arceus-Rock: 403-476 (90.9 - 107.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 56+ Def Primal Groudon: 343-406 (84.9 - 100.4%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 168-198 (50.2 - 59.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Mega Salamence Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Mega Tyranitar: 354-419 (87.6 - 103.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Dialga: 252-296 (62.6 - 73.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock/Shuca)
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 120+ Def Multiscale Lugia: 195-230 (46.8 - 55.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Mega Salamence Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 16+ Def Filter Mega Aggron: 164-193 (47.6 - 56.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 200+ Def Arceus-Water: 390-460 (87.8 - 103.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 156 Def Mega Aerodactyl: 285-335 (78.5 - 92.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Mega Slowbro: 281-331 (71.3 - 84%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

No ban

There are some things I must address in this.

1. Adamant is not a good set on Mega Salamence in Megamons. The standard Speed tier of Megamons is 110, and you obviously won't outspeed them if you run Adamant.

2. Unless you're the type to run Life Orb on Talonflame in OU, you DON'T want to carry Life Orb + Double Edge, as it will make you die so fast.

3. The main reason why I said no ban. There ARE some nice checks for Mega Salamence

Mega Aggron: The most obvious check for Mega Salamence. It can switch in to ANY of Mega Salamence's and retaliate with Avalance.

Mega Slowbro: This thing IS a check, idk why the hell you exclude this. The calc above already proves it. It LIVES a +1 Double-Edge and 1HKOs with Ice Beam. It's the most common switch ins to Mega Salamence because it CAN switch into almost all variants of Dragon Dance sets.

Mega Tyranitar: With 252 HP alone, no Defense investment, it LIVES a +1 Life Orb Earthquake and KO back with Stone Edge, Ice Beam or Ice Punch. it can switch to anything but Earthquake

Arceus-Steel: This thing ALSO lives a +1 Life Orb Earthquake, which means this is also a good check to Mega Salamence.

Skarmory: Pretty obvious for non Fire Blast variants. Don't say this thing is unviable, because this walls some nice things other than Mega Salamence.

Lugia: THIS is what I use to handle Mega Salamence. With max HP/Def and Multiscale, it can pretty much tank any hit and retaliate with Ice Beam.

Other ways to handle it?
Primal Groudon isn't a good switch in, but if it's healthy, it can Thunder Wave it.
PRIORITIES revenges it if it's weakened, since it doesn't have any priority. Life Orb Mega Kangaskhan with Fake Out + Sucker Punch is a good one since it's enough to deal 75% damage, meaning it'll be killed after Stealth Rock.

These are just my arguments, but the one who decides is runbabyrun. Actually, runbabyrun, before banning things, you should decide your banning philosophy, whether it's OU or Ubers, because by Ubers banning philosophy (read in policy review), this thing is obviously not banworthy.

 

[Imperator Romanum]

No ban

There are some things I must address in this.

1. Adamant is not a good set on Mega Salamence in Megamons. The standard Speed tier of Megamons is 110, and you obviously won't outspeed them if you run Adamant.

2. Unless you're the type to run Life Orb on Talonflame in OU, you DON'T want to carry Life Orb + Double Edge, as it will make you die so fast.

3. The main reason why I said no ban. There ARE some nice checks for Mega Salamence

Mega Aggron: The most obvious check for Mega Salamence. It can switch in to ANY of Mega Salamence's and retaliate with Avalance.

Mega Slowbro: This thing IS a check, idk why the hell you exclude this. The calc above already proves it. It LIVES a +1 Double-Edge and 1HKOs with Ice Beam. It's the most common switch ins to Mega Salamence because it CAN switch into almost all variants of Dragon Dance sets.

Mega Tyranitar: With 252 HP alone, no Defense investment, it LIVES a +1 Life Orb Earthquake and KO back with Stone Edge, Ice Beam or Ice Punch. it can switch to anything but Earthquake

Arceus-Steel: This thing ALSO lives a +1 Life Orb Earthquake, which means this is also a good check to Mega Salamence.

Skarmory: Pretty obvious for non Fire Blast variants. Don't say this thing is unviable, because this walls some nice things other than Mega Salamence.

Lugia: THIS is what I use to handle Mega Salamence. With max HP/Def and Multiscale, it can pretty much tank any hit and retaliate with Ice Beam.

Other ways to handle it?
Primal Groudon isn't a good switch in, but if it's healthy, it can Thunder Wave it.
PRIORITIES revenges it if it's weakened, since it doesn't have any priority. Life Orb Mega Kangaskhan with Fake Out + Sucker Punch is a good one since it's enough to deal 75% damage, meaning it'll be killed after Stealth Rock.

These are just my arguments, but the one who decides is runbabyrun. Actually, runbabyrun, before banning things, you should decide your banning philosophy, whether it's OU or Ubers, because by Ubers banning philosophy (read in policy review), this thing is obviously not banworthy.

I'm not entirely sure what you're saying here, I addressed all of these pokemon in my post, expect Mega Aggron. And I addressed your first point in chat, mostly that Mega Salamence has a stupidly high amount of sets. Like, what if I'm running wall-breaker Mega Salamence? READ: I acknowledge this set also has counters, I'm saying it's anti Meta in that beats all of the supposed checks, except mega TTar which isn't hard to widdle, roost also gives it the longwitity to survive longer.

Salamence-Mega @ Life Orb
Ability: Aerilate
EVs: 52 Atk / 204 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Fire Blast
- Double-Edge
- Roost

With this set you bait in physical bird checks, and you do significant damage to them. You're less prone to toxic, will o wisp and stealth rock meaning you can consisently come in and threaten slower mons, all the while maining the ability to check offensive mons by sheer speed. If you want to calc it, that's fine I'm not going to bother, I know this 2hkos all of your mentioned mons, assuming they're built to handle physically defensive Salamence, and that's the thing. I can't think of anything that checks... both. TTar can easily be roosted on for the DDD sets, stalling out of Stone edge, maybe not ice beam but how many runs that here? And all of this time it wont be hard to carry something on Salamence that lets it beat these checks, its to versatile at utilizing items. I'm not saying you ban it, I say we prevent it from holding an item, something that'll help balance the metagame and it wont make Mence unviable, it'll still probably be A or something.

Whatever set you throw at me to defeat mega salamence, i'll throw back another set for Mega mence, try to use another argument tbh. And if we're going to allow Mega Mence why can't Mega gengar? It's A+ in ubers, Mence is S.

 

[Chopin Alkaninoff]

I'm not entirely sure what you're saying here, I addressed all of these pokemon in my post, expect Mega Aggron. And I addressed your first point in chat, mostly that Mega Salamence has a stupidly high amount of sets. Like, what if I'm running wall-breaker Mega Salamence? READ: I acknowledge this set also has counters, I'm saying it's anti Meta in that beats all of the supposed checks, except mega TTar which isn't hard to widdle, roost also gives it the longwitity to survive longer.

Salamence-Mega @ Life Orb
Ability: Aerilate
EVs: 52 Atk / 204 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Fire Blast
- Double-Edge
- Roost

With this set you bait in physical bird checks, and you do significant damage to them. You're less prone to toxic, will o wisp and stealth rock meaning you can consisently come in and threaten slower mons, all the while maining the ability to check offensive mons by sheer speed. If you want to calc it, that's fine I'm not going to bother, I know this 2hkos all of your mentioned mons, assuming they're built to handle physically defensive Salamence, and that's the thing. I can't think of anything that checks... both. TTar can easily be roosted on for the DDD sets, stalling out of Stone edge, maybe not ice beam but how many runs that here? And all of this time it wont be hard to carry something on Salamence that lets it beat these checks, its to versatile at utilizing items. I'm not saying you ban it, I say we prevent it from holding an item, something that'll help balance the metagame and it wont make Mence unviable, it'll still probably be A or something.
Whatever set you throw at me to defeat mega salamence, i'll throw back another set for Mega mence, try to use another argument tbh. And if we're going to allow Mega Mence why can't Mega gengar? It's A+ in ubers, Mence is S.

Of course there is no one that checks ALL of Mega Salamence's set, because that's called a COUNTER, which Ubers doesn't revolve around to. Also, you know that allowing Mega Gengar with items means that you allow instant PerishTrap and pretty much GUARANTEED KILLS every match, right? One major thing that holds Mega Gengar back in Ubers is, Gengar before Mega Evolving lets you SWITCH, and it ALREADY rips apart Stall, while with items, you rip apart ALL PLAYSTYLES because with Sash, it WILL get Guaranteed kill on not just Stall, but OFFENSE too, just like Wobbuffet in OU, except Wobbuffet is passive and helpless vs status while this isn't. It's just uncompetitive and requires no strategy at all to trap your opponent.

What matters about bans in Ubers is NOT banning something JUST to balance the meta. It's whether the mon is banworthy or not by Ubers philosophy. If the Ubers people ban something JUST to balance the meta, Pdon would've been banned from Ubers long ago.

 

[InfernapeTropius11]

I wanted to share a rather interesting set I've been using: AV Mega Metagross! This came about when I was trying to find a way to both counter Xerneas and counter/eliminate Mega Latios. It also checks Mega Pidgeot, Mega Gardevoir, Mega Diancie, Mega Sceptile, Mega Alakazam, and Mega Ampharos, and counters Mega Venusaur and Mega Audino... and more! These are just the Megas that it fares best against.

Metagross-Mega @ Assault Vest
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Bullet Punch
- Pursuit
- Zen Headbutt

Here's the set! EVs are pretty simple, I just run max HP/Atk, with the last 8 thrown into SpD for a small boost. Pursuit is absolutely mandatory for Mega Latios and Bullet Punch is necessary as well, for Mega Diancie killing and finishing off Sashed/weakened mons. I use Meteor Mash and Zen Headbutt for guaranteeing the kills on Xerneas (OHKO) and Mega Venusaur (2HKO) respectively, however EQ can be used over Zen Headbutt to hit Mega Manectric (MegaGross lives a Specs Overheat!) and Mega Ampharos. Meteor Mash is also it's strongest moves against neutral targets such as Mega Alakazam, Mega Pidgeot, and Mega Sceptile, so I would advise keeping it on the set, although it's really up to you what you do with this haha.

Offensive Calcs

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Pidgeot: 273-322 (88.9 - 104.8%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Pidgeot: 121-144 (39.4 - 46.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 184 HP / 28 Def Xerneas: 462-546 (105.2 - 124.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Pursuit vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Latios: 136-162 (45.1 - 53.8%) -- 38.7% chance to 2HKO (doubled if it switches, so it dies to one round of Rocks)

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Alakazam: 322-379 (128.2 - 150.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Mega Venusaur: 254-302 (69.7 - 82.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Diancie: 372-444 (154.3 - 184.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Sceptile: 288-339 (102.4 - 120.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Zen Headbutt vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Mega Ampharos: 195-229 (50.9 - 59.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Audino: 278-330 (67.8 - 80.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Defensive Calcs

252 SpA Choice Specs Mega Pidgeot Heat Wave vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Assault Vest Mega Metagross: 196-232 (53.9 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+2 252+ SpA Xerneas Focus Blast vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Assault Vest Mega Metagross: 176-208 (48.4 - 57.3%) -- 94.1% chance to 2HKO

252 SpA Soul Dew Mega Latios Draco Meteor vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Assault Vest Mega Metagross: 114-134 (31.4 - 36.9%) -- 75.2% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Soul Dew Mega Latios Psyshock vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Mega Metagross: 40-47 (11 - 12.9%) -- possible 8HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Alakazam Shadow Ball vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Assault Vest Mega Metagross: 174-205 (47.9 - 56.4%) -- 84.4% chance to 2HKO

0 SpA Mega Venusaur Hidden Power Fire vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Assault Vest Mega Metagross: 64-76 (17.6 - 20.9%) -- possible 5HKO

252 SpA Choice Specs Mega Gardevoir Focus Blast vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Assault Vest Mega Metagross: 143-169 (39.3 - 46.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Mega Diancie Earth Power vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Assault Vest Mega Metagross: 182-216 (50.1 - 59.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Life Orb Mega Sceptile Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Mega Metagross: 177-211 (48.7 - 58.1%) -- 96.1% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Mega Sceptile Focus Blast vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Assault Vest Mega Metagross: 113-134 (31.1 - 36.9%) -- 70.8% chance to 3HKO
(I put both max Atk and max SpA because people could use either)

252+ SpA Life Orb Mold Breaker Mega Ampharos Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Assault Vest Mega Metagross: 153-183 (42.1 - 50.4%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO

0 SpA Mega Audino Dazzling Gleam vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Assault Vest Mega Metagross: 22-27 (6 - 7.4%) -- possibly the worst move ever

Overall I feel like this is a pretty decent mon atm. Sure it loses to some common Pokemon (read: Mega Slowbro/Mega Sableye/Primal Groudon) but it does its job incredibly effectively, despite lacking recovery. It has amazing overall bulk and great attack, usually getting at least one kill per match, and I'm loving using it rn.

 

[Whydon]

I'm on my phone so this is going to be a short post, but I am personally against a Mega Salamence ban. Maybe a suspect in the future, but I would probably stray from a ban.

Here's the thing. Megamons has so many offensive mons that are so powerful. Mega Salamence is only one out of the many offensive threats that have been introduced, ex. Mega Latios, Mega Lucario, Mega Mawile, etc. In all honesty, the meta balances itself out, and Mega Salamence is part of that balance.

The only Pokemon to be banned from Ubers is Mega Rayquaza. Mega Ray completely broke the tier. I know that Mega Salamence is a good replacement for that lost power, but Mega Rayquaza had incredible attack, an incredible move pool that basically meant absolutely nothing good could even check it, and had an amazing ability. Mega Salamence is not broken for the tier by any means. This metagame is so offensive that even the walls are decent attackers: Mega Slowbro, Mega Tyranitar, Lugia, and everything else listed are great answers to Mega Salamence.

The metagame will adapt to it. I run Ice Beam over Psyshock on Mega Slowbro to beat Mega Salamence - also, there is a plethora of things that resist Psyshock in this metagame.

I think right now, the metagame is able to balance itself out and nothing is really able to become particularly broken because of all of the threats that exist already. That's how I see it, though.

 

[Imperator Romanum]

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/megamons-355831074

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/megamons-355834381 Chopin facing same guy


I'll return to mega Mence issue, but can we discuss a baton pass... Ban... or something? It's stupid, I can't prepare for 5 different pokemon all at +2 attack and speed. And yes, it's not hard to prepare for baton pass with roar and stuff, but it seems centralising. Roar is hard to fit.

 

[Chopin Alkaninoff]

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/megamons-355831074

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/megamons-355834381 Chopin facing same guy


I'll return to mega Mence issue, but can we discuss a baton pass... Ban... or something? It's stupid, I can't prepare for 5 different pokemon all at +2 attack and speed. And yes, it's not hard to prepare for baton pass with roar and stuff, but it seems centralising. Roar is hard to fit.

Actually, that's more or like my fault for not preparing against Baton Pass team. I was just testing some stuff instead of actually laddering. But I wouldn't agree to ban Baton Pass in this meta, JUST because this is Ubers. Unless Ubers ban Baton Pass or something, I still wouldn't agree. Same goes for Mega Mence. Banning/limiting either of those means treating the meta like OU.

Just carry Roar on your Pdon or Whirlwind on your Lugia. I learned from my mistake in that replay and carry Roar Pdon now.

 

[HumbleSpaceMan]

Okay one mon which is severely underrated is Mega-Manectric.

Manectric-Mega @ Choice Specs
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Overheat
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Great ability in Intimidate, amazing speed tier of 405 outspeeding virtually all relevant threats and hitting extremely hard with a Specs, this thing is an amazing pivot with Volt turn.

Tbolt has the potential to sweep late game, overheat takes a huge chunk from pdon and ohkos Scizor and other Steel's and HP ice takes on Dragon's especially the Lati twins and Mence.

It also helps that it's typing is solid defensively, resisting the two most common priority moves - Bullet punch and Pinsir's Quick Attack.

Calcs -

252 SpA Choice Specs Mega Manectric Overheat vs. 252 HP / 200 SpD Primal Groudon in Harsh Sunshine: 145-171 (35.8 - 42.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Choice Specs Mega Manectric Hidden Power Ice vs. +1 248 HP / 0 SpD Mega Latias: 96-114 (26.4 - 31.4%) -- 37.1% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Choice Specs Mega Manectric Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 176 SpD Mega Slowbro: 446-528 (113.1 - 134%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 SpA Choice Specs Mega Manectric Volt Switch vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Pinsir: 386-456 (142.4 - 168.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

While - 252 Atk Life Orb Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Manectric: 75-90 (26.6 - 32%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

 

[ScorrchingTheaph]

No ban

There are some things I must address in this.

1. Adamant is not a good set on Mega Salamence in Megamons. The standard Speed tier of Megamons is 110, and you obviously won't outspeed them if you run Adamant.

2. Unless you're the type to run Life Orb on Talonflame in OU, you DON'T want to carry Life Orb + Double Edge, as it will make you die so fast.

3. The main reason why I said no ban. There ARE some nice checks for Mega Salamence

Mega Aggron: The most obvious check for Mega Salamence. It can switch in to ANY of Mega Salamence's and retaliate with Avalance.

Mega Slowbro: This thing IS a check, idk why the hell you exclude this. The calc above already proves it. It LIVES a +1 Double-Edge and 1HKOs with Ice Beam. It's the most common switch ins to Mega Salamence because it CAN switch into almost all variants of Dragon Dance sets.

Mega Tyranitar: With 252 HP alone, no Defense investment, it LIVES a +1 Life Orb Earthquake and KO back with Stone Edge, Ice Beam or Ice Punch. it can switch to anything but Earthquake

Arceus-Steel: This thing ALSO lives a +1 Life Orb Earthquake, which means this is also a good check to Mega Salamence.

Skarmory: Pretty obvious for non Fire Blast variants. Don't say this thing is unviable, because this walls some nice things other than Mega Salamence.

Lugia: THIS is what I use to handle Mega Salamence. With max HP/Def and Multiscale, it can pretty much tank any hit and retaliate with Ice Beam.

Other ways to handle it?
Primal Groudon isn't a good switch in, but if it's healthy, it can Thunder Wave it.
PRIORITIES revenges it if it's weakened, since it doesn't have any priority. Life Orb Mega Kangaskhan with Fake Out + Sucker Punch is a good one since it's enough to deal 75% damage, meaning it'll be killed after Stealth Rock.

These are just my arguments, but the one who decides is runbabyrun. Actually, runbabyrun, before banning things, you should decide your banning philosophy, whether it's OU or Ubers, because by Ubers banning philosophy (read in policy review), this thing is obviously not banworthy.

Although there are a small handful of checks to Mega Salamence, it still OHKO's or 2HKO's almost everything useable this metagame and it also has great speed. It is very versatile and it is difficult to stop without a dedicated counter, and even then it is still a problem. Also keep in mind that I formed my opinion before seeing any of these posts.
For this list I am using the standard life orb 252 atk set in the damage calc, unless otherwise stated. For the sake of space I am not going to put every single calculation here. Fully defensive means 252 HP, 252+ Def. Ez means it outspeeds too. (rest assured that i'm not using +1 Adamant Life Orb Double-Edge after Stealth Rocks and 3 layers of spikes on a critical hit)

Abomasnow-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive
Gallade-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive
Heracross-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive
Medicham-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive (252+ LO fakeout+bulletpunch wont kill)
Pinsir-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive (252+ band quickattack wont kill)
Venusaur-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive
Beedrill-Mega: return OHKO even if fully defensive (nothing standard kills)
Lopunny-Mega: return OHKO even if fully defensive (252 LO fakeout+return wont kill)
Sceptile-Mega: return OHKO even if fully defensive (sceptile can ohko and is faster)
Blaziken-Mega: return OHKO even if fully defensive (stone edge may ohko and is faster after speed boost)
Mewtwo-Mega-X: return OHKO even if fully defensive (icepunch can ohko)
Shaymin-Sky: return OHKO even if fully defensive (airslash can hax)
Alakazam-Mega: return OHKO if no bulk investment, 50% chance to OHKO if fully defensive
Absol-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, 43.8% chance to OHKO if fully defensive
Gardevoir-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, 6.3% chance to OHKO if fully defensive
Camerupt-Mega: ez EQ OHKO, if no bulk investment, 37.5% chance to OHKO if standard RU Tank, or else ez EQ 2HKO even if fully defensive
Charizard-Mega-Y: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Diancie-Mega: ez EQ OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Glalie-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Houndoom-Mega: ez return/EQ OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Latios-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Lucario-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive (nothing standard kills)
Mawile-Mega: ez EQ OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive (252+ band sucker wont kill)
Pidgeot-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Genesect: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Landorus: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Sharpedo-Mega: return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (icefang will kill non-bulky mence)
Gengar-Mega: return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (nothing standard kills)
Mewtwo-Mega-Y: return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (icebeam can ohko)
Darkrai: return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (darkvoid can revenge)
Greninja: return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (icebeam can ohko)
Banette-Mega: return OHKO, or return 2HKO after burn (unless fully defensive which still can't switch in unless you run rest) tbh ez revenge kill w/ sash dbond
Kyogre-Primal: return has 87.5% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (icebeam can ohko)
Altaria-Mega: return has 81.3% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Palkia: return has 75% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Rayquaza: return has 75% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive (espeed wont kill)
Charizard-Mega-X: return/EQ have 68.8% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez EQ 2HKO even if fully defensive
Ho-Oh: return has 68.8% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Ampharos-Mega: EQ has 50% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Reshiram: return has 37.5% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Manectric-Mega: EQ has 31.3% chance to OHKO after Intimidate if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive
Blastoise-Mega: return has 25% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive (assuming no scald burn)
Kangaskhan-Mega: return has 25% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive (252+ LO fakeout+suckerpunch wont kill)
Latias-Mega: return has 18.8% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Gyarados-Mega: return has 12.5% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Deoxys-D: return has 6.3% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Kyurem-White: return has 6.3% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Scizor-Mega: ez return 2HKO even if fully defensive (bulletpunch wont kill)
Swampert-Mega: ez return 2HKO even if fully defensive (assuming no scald burn)
Aegislash: ez EQ 2HKO even if fully defensive (shadow sneak wont kill)
Xerneas: ez return 2HKO even if fully defensive
Yveltal: ez return 2HKO even if fully defensive
Dialga: ez EQ 2HKO, 91% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive (dracometeor kills)
Zekrom: ez EQ 2HKO, 91% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive (outrage may kill)
Salamence-Mega: return 2HKO if no bulk investment, 87.5% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive which can't 2HKO
Garchomp-Mega: ez return 2HKO, 85.9% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive which can't 2HKO
Metagross-Mega: ez EQ 2HKO, 50.8% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive (ice punch kills)
Arceus: return 2HKO if no bulk investment, 10.9% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive which can't 2HKO
Aerodactyl-Mega: return 2HKO if no bulk investment, 3HKO if standard UU bulky set (aero cannot switch-in b/c mence will live stone edge and kill after ddance)

Whatever set you throw at me to defeat mega salamence, i'll throw back another set for Mega mence

^pretty much this

Audino-Mega: Choice Band 2HKO's fully defensive. dazzlinggleam wont kill
Sableye-Mega: Lum Berry beats willowisp and 2HKO's (if sableye is fully defensive and the first turn has slower willowisps the standard set still has 65.2% chance to 2HKO or 28.6% chance to 2HKO after leftovers recovery, still not able to switch in anyways)
Slowbro-Mega: Hyper Voice 2HKO's even with Jolly and no investment
Steelix-Mega: Fire Blast 2HKO's even with Jolly and no investment
Tyranitar-Mega: Brick Break 2HKO's fully defensive
Groudon-Primal: Choice Band Double-Edge 2HKO's fully defensive. stoneedge wont kill
Giratina: Choice Band Double-Edge 2HKO's fully defensive

Things that might work:
Aggron-Mega: This beats Salamence-Mega 1 on 1, but Mence will simply switch out. Fire Blast does decent damage, but Aggron's Avalanche will OHKO. The problem with Aggron is that it's easily countered by other pokemon. It's a predictable switch-in to Salamence. It's problem is that it lacks reliable recovery so it will get worn down easily by Fire Blast. It also straight out loses to Sableye-Mega.
Lugia: This beats Salamence-Mega 1 on 1 because it can live and Ice Beam will OHKO. Again, Mence still can switch out because it is hard to apply offensive pressure with a stallmon. Lugia does get the ability Pressure so you could apply that if you wanted. It's quite predictable but it works to an extent. Teams centering around Salamence will easily be able to beat Lugia. Sableye-Mega again works wonders.

What matters about bans in Ubers is NOT banning something JUST to balance the meta. It's whether the mon is banworthy or not by Ubers philosophy. If the Ubers people ban something JUST to balance the meta, Pdon would've been banned from Ubers long ago.

Please remember that we are not asking for banning Mega-Salamence, just a ban on allowing it to have an item. This cannot be applied to "Ubers philosophy" because such bans do not exist. When something destroys almost all of the meta, it's definitely a problem that needs to be addressed.

I'm on my phone so this is going to be a short post, but I am personally against a Mega Salamence ban. Maybe a suspect in the future, but I would probably stray from a ban.

Here's the thing. Megamons has so many offensive mons that are so powerful. Mega Salamence is only one out of the many offensive threats that have been introduced, ex. Mega Latios, Mega Lucario, Mega Mawile, etc. In all honesty, the meta balances itself out, and Mega Salamence is part of that balance.

The only Pokemon to be banned from Ubers is Mega Rayquaza. Mega Ray completely broke the tier. I know that Mega Salamence is a good replacement for that lost power, but Mega Rayquaza had incredible attack, an incredible move pool that basically meant absolutely nothing good could even check it, and had an amazing ability. Mega Salamence is not broken for the tier by any means. This metagame is so offensive that even the walls are decent attackers: Mega Slowbro, Mega Tyranitar, Lugia, and everything else listed are great answers to Mega Salamence.

The metagame will adapt to it. I run Ice Beam over Psyshock on Mega Slowbro to beat Mega Salamence - also, there is a plethora of things that resist Psyshock in this metagame.

I think right now, the metagame is able to balance itself out and nothing is really able to become particularly broken because of all of the threats that exist already. That's how I see it, though.

I think that I have proved that there aren't very good answers to Mega-Salamence and those that do counter it can be easily handled by teammates. Some offensive mons may check it, but then you are forced to run almost full defensive stats. I'm not asking for a full-on ban, just something similar to what has been done for Mega-Gengar, Mega-Mewtwo-X, and Mega-Mewtwo-Y. Even just a suspect would be very much appreciated.

Thank you for reading my lengthy post or just skipping to the end and hoping for a tl;dr. I hope that I may have convinced you that Salamence-Mega with an item is broken and needs to be banned or tested.

 

[Imperator Romanum]

Although there are a small handful of checks to Mega Salamence, it still OHKO's or 2HKO's almost everything useable this metagame and it also has great speed. It is very versatile and it is difficult to stop without a dedicated counter, and even then it is still a problem. Also keep in mind that I formed my opinion before seeing any of these posts.
For this list I am using the standard life orb 252 atk set in the damage calc, unless otherwise stated. For the sake of space I am not going to put every single calculation here. Fully defensive means 252 HP, 252+ Def. Ez means it outspeeds too. (rest assured that i'm not using +1 Adamant Life Orb Double-Edge after Stealth Rocks and 3 layers of spikes on a critical hit)

Abomasnow-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive
Gallade-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive
Heracross-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive
Medicham-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive (252+ LO fakeout+bulletpunch wont kill)
Pinsir-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive (252+ band quickattack wont kill)
Venusaur-Mega: ez return OHKO even if fully defensive
Beedrill-Mega: return OHKO even if fully defensive (nothing standard kills)
Lopunny-Mega: return OHKO even if fully defensive (252 LO fakeout+return wont kill)
Sceptile-Mega: return OHKO even if fully defensive (sceptile can ohko and is faster)
Blaziken-Mega: return OHKO even if fully defensive (stone edge may ohko and is faster after speed boost)
Mewtwo-Mega-X: return OHKO even if fully defensive (icepunch can ohko)
Shaymin-Sky: return OHKO even if fully defensive (airslash can hax)
Alakazam-Mega: return OHKO if no bulk investment, 50% chance to OHKO if fully defensive
Absol-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, 43.8% chance to OHKO if fully defensive
Gardevoir-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, 6.3% chance to OHKO if fully defensive
Camerupt-Mega: ez EQ OHKO, if no bulk investment, 37.5% chance to OHKO if standard RU Tank, or else ez EQ 2HKO even if fully defensive
Charizard-Mega-Y: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Diancie-Mega: ez EQ OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Glalie-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Houndoom-Mega: ez return/EQ OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Latios-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Lucario-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive (nothing standard kills)
Mawile-Mega: ez EQ OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive (252+ band sucker wont kill)
Pidgeot-Mega: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Genesect: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Landorus: ez return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Sharpedo-Mega: return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (icefang will kill non-bulky mence)
Gengar-Mega: return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (nothing standard kills)
Mewtwo-Mega-Y: return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (icebeam can ohko)
Darkrai: return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (darkvoid can revenge)
Greninja: return OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (icebeam can ohko)
Banette-Mega: return OHKO, or return 2HKO after burn (unless fully defensive which still can't switch in unless you run rest) tbh ez revenge kill w/ sash dbond
Kyogre-Primal: return has 87.5% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive (icebeam can ohko)
Altaria-Mega: return has 81.3% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Palkia: return has 75% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Rayquaza: return has 75% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive (espeed wont kill)
Charizard-Mega-X: return/EQ have 68.8% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez EQ 2HKO even if fully defensive
Ho-Oh: return has 68.8% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Ampharos-Mega: EQ has 50% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Reshiram: return has 37.5% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Manectric-Mega: EQ has 31.3% chance to OHKO after Intimidate if no bulk investment, or else 2HKO even if fully defensive
Blastoise-Mega: return has 25% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive (assuming no scald burn)
Kangaskhan-Mega: return has 25% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive (252+ LO fakeout+suckerpunch wont kill)
Latias-Mega: return has 18.8% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Gyarados-Mega: return has 12.5% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Deoxys-D: return has 6.3% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Kyurem-White: return has 6.3% chance to OHKO if no bulk investment, or else ez 2HKO even if fully defensive
Scizor-Mega: ez return 2HKO even if fully defensive (bulletpunch wont kill)
Swampert-Mega: ez return 2HKO even if fully defensive (assuming no scald burn)
Aegislash: ez EQ 2HKO even if fully defensive (shadow sneak wont kill)
Xerneas: ez return 2HKO even if fully defensive
Yveltal: ez return 2HKO even if fully defensive
Dialga: ez EQ 2HKO, 91% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive (dracometeor kills)
Zekrom: ez EQ 2HKO, 91% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive (outrage may kill)
Salamence-Mega: return 2HKO if no bulk investment, 87.5% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive which can't 2HKO
Garchomp-Mega: ez return 2HKO, 85.9% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive which can't 2HKO
Metagross-Mega: ez EQ 2HKO, 50.8% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive (ice punch kills)
Arceus: return 2HKO if no bulk investment, 10.9% chance to 2HKO if fully defensive which can't 2HKO
Aerodactyl-Mega: return 2HKO if no bulk investment, 3HKO if standard UU bulky set (aero cannot switch-in b/c mence will live stone edge and kill after ddance)


^pretty much this

Audino-Mega: Choice Band 2HKO's fully defensive. dazzlinggleam wont kill
Sableye-Mega: Lum Berry beats willowisp and 2HKO's (if sableye is fully defensive and the first turn has slower willowisps the standard set still has 65.2% chance to 2HKO or 28.6% chance to 2HKO after leftovers recovery, still not able to switch in anyways)
Slowbro-Mega: Hyper Voice 2HKO's even with Jolly and no investment
Steelix-Mega: Fire Blast 2HKO's even with Jolly and no investment
Tyranitar-Mega: Brick Break 2HKO's fully defensive
Groudon-Primal: Choice Band Double-Edge 2HKO's fully defensive. stoneedge wont kill
Giratina: Choice Band Double-Edge 2HKO's fully defensive

Things that might work:
Aggron-Mega: This beats Salamence-Mega 1 on 1, but Mence will simply switch out. Fire Blast does decent damage, but Aggron's Avalanche will OHKO. The problem with Aggron is that it's easily countered by other pokemon. It's a predictable switch-in to Salamence. It's problem is that it lacks reliable recovery so it will get worn down easily by Fire Blast. It also straight out loses to Sableye-Mega.
Lugia: This beats Salamence-Mega 1 on 1 because it can live and Ice Beam will OHKO. Again, Mence still can switch out because it is hard to apply offensive pressure with a stallmon. Lugia does get the ability Pressure so you could apply that if you wanted. It's quite predictable but it works to an extent. Teams centering around Salamence will easily be able to beat Lugia. Sableye-Mega again works wonders.


Please remember that we are not asking for banning Mega-Salamence, just a ban on allowing it to have an item. This cannot be applied to "Ubers philosophy" because such bans do not exist. When something destroys almost all of the meta, it's definitely a problem that needs to be addressed.


I think that I have proved that there aren't very good answers to Mega-Salamence and those that do counter it can be easily handled by teammates. Some offensive mons may check it, but then you are forced to run almost full defensive stats. I'm not asking for a full-on ban, just something similar to what has been done for Mega-Gengar, Mega-Mewtwo-X, and Mega-Mewtwo-Y. Even just a suspect would be very much appreciated.

Thank you for reading my lengthy post or just skipping to the end and hoping for a tl;dr. I hope that I may have convinced you that Salamence-Mega with an item is broken and needs to be banned or tested.

Thank you, you worded it perfectly.

I'd like to emphasis the point that the ability to have an item is that makes Mega Salamanca to good. So first of all Mega Salamence is the second best pokemon in Ubers right now, only surpassed by Primal Groudon. This means that this pokemon works effectively even without an item. So any potential weakness sough after is solved by an item. Wether it's Yatche berry, Leftovers, sky plate, life orb, any of the choice items or even a focus sash it's going to be a massive threat to your team. Like, there are so few teams that aren't atleast a little bit weak to one of its sets.