Metagame Workshop

[DrPumpkinz]

I was meaning iv's not ev's. How should hidden power work?

It should just be Normal.

 

[icecat]

Name: Suicidemons

Metagame Premise: You win by losing. Basically, you just use self KO moves, like memento, or sabotage your opponent's self KO moves, like using snatch against healing wish for example, in order to KO all of your own Pokemon first.

Potential Bans
1. Explosion/self destruct: they can only be countered by the ability damp, but no damp user can learn a self KO move, so there are no viable counters.
2. Sticky Barb: abused by Shedinja

Threats (All Self KO Moves, and what counters them):
Memento: fails against substitute, or by the opponent fainting before you use it (so there is no target)
Final Gambit: fails against ghosts, or opponent fainting before you use it (so there is no target)
Healing Wish/Lunar Dance: stolen by snatch, fails if it is your last pokemon
Explosion/self destruct: banned

Questions for the community:
Does this metagame sound fun, would you play it?
Has this idea ever been pitched before? It sounds too simple for this to not have been thought of before.

 

[AquaticPanic]

Aight before submitting this, I wanted to hear some more general thoughts on it:

Pledge Power​

Pet Mod Premisse: Doubles based Pet Mod. When moves of two different types are used, a field effect (Chosen or created by submission) happens

Examples: Grass + Fire Pledge, when used together in a doubles battle, leave the Sea of Fire effect on the foe's team, damaging them for 1/8 of their HP each turn. Thus, let's suppose you sent out Heatran and Amoonguss. Heatran uses Heat Wave and Amoonguss uses Giga Drain. Since those two moves are Fire + Grass, after the second move is used, the Sea of Fire effect will activate.

Aditional Changes:
- The first move no longer has to wait to attack. (How it works in Vanilla is that if two pledges moves are used in a doubles battle, one of them won't work and the other will attack. This is what I intent to change here as well, so that the moves are a bit more viable)

- Swamp (Water + Grass) is nerfed to only reduce Speed by 1/2, as 1/4 would be broken (May still be broken rn and is subject to change)

Questions for the community:

- Does the idea sound nice?

- Would you submit if it was a thing?

- Is it too complicated?

- Does Swamp, Rainbow or Sea of Fire (The vanilla effects of the pledges) need any further nerf on them?

 

[HeatEdgeSword]

Aight before submitting this, I wanted to hear some more general thoughts on it:

Pledge Power​

Pet Mod Premisse: Doubles based Pet Mod. When moves of two different types are used, a field effect (Chosen or created by submission) happens

Examples: Grass + Fire Pledge, when used together in a doubles battle, leave the Sea of Fire effect on the foe's team, damaging them for 1/8 of their HP each turn. Thus, let's suppose you sent out Heatran and Amoonguss. Heatran uses Heat Wave and Amoonguss uses Giga Drain. Since those two moves are Fire + Grass, after the second move is used, the Sea of Fire effect will activate.

Aditional Changes:
- The first move no longer has to wait to attack. (How it works in Vanilla is that if two pledges moves are used in a doubles battle, one of them won't work and the other will attack. This is what I intent to change here as well, so that the moves are a bit more viable)

- Swamp (Water + Grass) is nerfed to only reduce Speed by 1/2, as 1/4 would be broken (May still be broken rn and is subject to change)

Questions for the community:

- Does the idea sound nice?

- Would you submit if it was a thing?

- Is it too complicated?

- Does Swamp, Rainbow or Sea of Fire (The vanilla effects of the pledges) need any further nerf on them?

That sounds simple enough unless you meant is it too complicated for programming.

I don't think you should do any further changes to the field effects, seems fine according to my book.

 

[Genuine_Angus_B33F]

Base Power Switcheroo

A metagame based a simple question;

What if the unique effects on weaker moves became worth using?​

The premise is simple; any move's base power is pivoted about 70. Mathematically, you would subtract the move's BP from​

70 and add that total back to 70*. For instance, Absorb sits at an utterly pitiful 20 BP. But in this metagame, it would​

reach 120 BP, becoming a force to be reckoned with. Meanwhile, the king of all powerful attacks, V-Create, becomes a trash-fire,​

hitting the absolute floor of base power, 1. Victini is far from screwed, however, and I'll get into some of the things to hype up about.​

​

*Thanks to Red Metal for the correction. I'm bad at math.​

​

​

Notable Rules/Exceptions;​

​

1. Mutli-Hit Moves are completely exempt from these changes. Obviously a game with a 125 BP Priority Multi-Hit Move would be stupid. I considered giving these moves their own "pivot" of sorts, but most of them are about the same power anyway, and Triple Kick is a sin to humanity.
2. Moves with Conditional BP that is determined by an outside factor, or moves with a BP listed as '-'. These moves first calculate their damage and then have the pivot applied. Here is the list of these, and they can become very powerful. Flail and Reversal become 120 BP nukes at full health, while Water Spout and Eruption become Focus Sash best friends. Return and Frustration become normal moves that are guaranteed to hit the power ceiling of 139, which I'll mention in the concern/suspect section.
3. Moves with cases where their BP can increase or multiply with changes, such as Pursuit, Acrobatics, or Hex. For the sake of those moves, and making their uses more prominent, it would make sense to have the BP pivot change the attack's base attack, and then to have the doubling effect occur separately, making them plenty powerful. For instances like Rollout and Ice Ball, check the potential suspect list.
4. Priority Moves are unaffected. Nothing stands out as broken or damaging. Mega Pinsir and Feint. Even banning Mega Pinsir alone won't get rid of the centralizing of power around priority, and people have brought up stuff like Belly Drum/Aqua Jet Azu, Mach Punch Conk, and the huge amount of things with Quick Attack and Swords Dance alone. Priority moves won't be pivoted.

Potential Suspects/Bans
​

1. Return and Frustration are 139 BP moves with absolutely no downsides. It's a physical Boomburst available on any Pokemon. That's super boring and shits on the entire point of meta. Potentially not actually broken, but still not worth having.
2. Rollout and Ice Ball, if left as proposed, would be moves that start at 110 Base Power and then double to 220, 440, 880, and then 1760. The cost to this is the inability to switch, and the innate shakiness of 80% accuracy. Fury Cutter would be better, but it has a raw 160 power cap in place.
3. Stored Power and Power Trip. As proposed, they'd start at 120 Base Power, and increase by 20 for every boost. For instance, a Cosmic Power or Calm Mind would buff this attack to 160, in addition to the potential power/defensive boosts with it. This may end up fine, but it's might be broken.
4. Echoed Voice. Starts at 100 Base Power, gains 40 for every use, and if the first forces a switch this is another slippery slope.

Threats​

I got really wrapped up in this so I'm gonna share one thing. While it's entire set is based in suspect moves, it still stands;​

​

​

Mega Gardevoir​

Timid, 252 SpA/Spd, 4 Def​

Pixilate​

-Echoed Voice​

-Stored Power​

-Calm Mind​

-Charge Beam/HP Fighting/Icy Wind/Return/Mud Slap​

​

Welcome to hell! If this thing comes in and you can't kill it, get ready to face down a 180 BP Fairy attack that will only get stronger. Or it can boost with Calm Mind to make sure that you can't kill it, and that its Stored Power reaches 220 BP. Coverage can vary; Charge Beam is a 90 BP attack that can boost SpA and Stored Power, HP Fighting covers holes against Steel Types, and Icy Wind is an 85 BP attack that lowers the speed of a potential switch in. This isn't even considering other sets, like a potential 180 BP Snore/Rest set. And if Return/Frustration remains, well Swellow uses Boomburst successfully with less Special Attack that Gardevoir's Attack, and Pixilate + STAB brings it to 250.2 BP. Not to mention this monstrosity of power would be available on something like Mega Pinsir, so that may warrant a quick-ban​

​

Thoughts?​

Also I posted it here because I've absolutely no experience coding this stuff, and I'd be interested in pointers.

​

​

​

​

​

 

[Red Metal]

Base Power Switcheroo

A metagame based a simple question;

What if the unique effects on weaker moves became worth using?​

The premise is simple; any move's base power is pivoted about 70. Mathematically, you would subtract the move's BP from​

70 and add that total to the move's BP. For instance, Absorb sits at an utterly pitiful 20 BP. But in this metagame, it would​

reach 120 BP, becoming a force to be reckoned with.​

I assume that's supposed to say "add that total to 70", because the formula you've given just gives every move 70 BP.

70 minus Absorb's 20 BP gives a total of 50, which is then added to Absorb's BP of 20, for a sum of 70.

 

[Genuine_Angus_B33F]

I assume that's supposed to say "add that total to 70", because the formula you've given just gives every move 70 BP. 70 minus Absorb's 20 BP gives a total of 50, which is then added to Absorb's BP of 20, for a sum of 70.

Uh, yeah, oops. Fixed.

 

[gmfc]

Mix and Mega
ANYthingMON GOES​

An off-shoot of Mix and Mega BH, MnM AMG allows players to use any pokemon in the current teambuilder, while still keeping true to what makes MnM popular. This essentially gives any mon the option to hold a mega stone, without the option of changing the pre-mega's ability, moveset, or having maximum EVs like in BH. This potentially includes megas for: ubers, unreleased mons, non-fully evolved mons, post-mega forms, post primal-forms, Ultra Necrozma, and any other form changes that exist due to in-match effects.

Examples:

Potential Threats:

1)Mega Rayquaza: Dragon Ascent, Pinsirite, Salamencite, Altarianite, Lucarionite, Red Orb​

- The King of Megas, Mega Rayquaza could possibly retain his crown; having access to Dragon Ascent allows him to mega and still hold an item, while Pinsirite, Salamencite, and Altarianite would make him the premier espeeder. Although, if Espeed spam isn't your cup of tea, Lucarionite/Red Orb would make D.A./V-Create two of the hardest hitting STABs in the meta.​

​

2) Primal Groudon/Kyogre: Lucarionite, Primal Orbs, Choice Items​

- Of course, Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre can run Lucarionite/Red Orb/Blue Orb and hit harder than before, however the main side effect of allowing any and every mon, is that they also aren't required to run a mega stone. Case in point, Porge is able to use it's Scarf+Water Spout set from ubers with Primodial Sea, while Pdon could run Rest and Chesto Berry due to his lack of recovery.​

​

3) Zygarde-Complete: Sablenite, Aggronite, Lucarionite​

- If MRay is the King of Megas, then Zygarde-C is undoubtedly the King of Bulk. There isn't much else to explain, Sablenite makes him one of the bulkiest mons in the meta, while Aggronite turns him into a defense stallworth with a much better typing to sport; and if bulky offensive is more your style, Lucarionite should suffice.​

​

4) Arceus: Altarianite, Pinsirite, Primal Orbs, Diancite, Lucarionite, Lopunnite, Sablenite, Plates​

- Last but not least, perhaps the most versatile mon in Ubers, Arceus continues the trend by being viable with virtually every mega stone. He can espeed spam; he can run both bulky and hyper offensive sets to perfection; he fits like a glove on any stall team; and because his formes are hardcoded for multitype, he can use a bit of trickery to turn the tides of a battle.​

​

Potential Clauses and Bans:

1) Clauses: At the moment, things would still lean closer to MnM/Ubers rather than say Anything Goes or Balanced Hackmons​

• Ubers Clauses
• Mega Stone/Orb Clause (only one of each stone on a team)

2) Bans: Again, leaning closer to MnM with a few exceptions​

• Baton Pass, Shadow Tag
• Beedrillite, Gengarite, Kangaskhanite, Mawilite, Medichamite
• No Pokemon at the moment

3) Unbans​

• Electricify: Heliolisk itself may not be good
• Blazikenite: I feel as though this stone needs to be tested, quickbanning if deemed broken
• Pidgeotite: Interested to see how potent this stone can be, suspect test worthy
• Mega Rayquaza: While the power creep may lessen his impact, this is still MRay afterall, he could be a threat even without a stone. Suspect Test worthy.

Questions for the Community:

1) Is MnMAMG a good name?​

2) Any potential threats that I missed?​

3) Should Mega Rayquaza be rebanned?​

4) Should the meta lean towards Mix and Mega, Balanced Hackmons, or Anything Goes? (In the sense of banning philosophy)​

5) Should banned stones be allowed on their native users? (e.i. Mega Kangaskhan holding Kangaskhanite)​

​

Thanks for your time!
​

 

[insaneguy1083]

Mix and Mega Balanced Hackmons

Metagame premise:

All Pokemon (regardless of forme) can Mega Evolve and use most moves they usually don't get. Basically a mashup of Mix and Mega and Balanced Hackmons (duh).

Potential bans and threats:

Primal Groudon has proven once again to be too powerful for the playing environment, and as such has been banned from Mega Evolving (unless being a Red Orb Groudon) in my preliminary MnM BH banlist.

Aggronite Zygarde-Complete, after calculations, has shown that its tremendous bulk combined with stellar typing makes it so that even super effective hits from powerful Pokemon (such as Lucarionite Mewtwo-Mega-X or Lucarionite Primal Groudon) cannot OHKO it unboosted, and in general is too bulky (complex ban, because regular Zygarde-Complete is far from broken and sets like Sablenite can be beaten by things like Glalitite Boomburst coming from Kyurem-White), and as such has been banned.

This also follows the Balanced Hackmons (and to an extent Mix and Mega) banlist, so Psychic Surge, Shadow Tag, Gengarite, Mawilite, Medichamite, and Beedrillite has been banned, however Blazikenite was unbanned, due to Speed Boost being somewhat bad even in Balanced Hackmons, and the existence of Spectral Thief as well as Prankster Haze. All Pokemon banned from Mega Evolving in regular Mix and Mega have been unbanned from using stones.

No Pokemon other than Primal Groudon is banned from Mega Evolving, though Gyaradosite Regigigas after testing has shown to be a great threat and a possible suspect is in order.

Questions for the community:

Is it boring and stale at the moment due to everything viable being either very bulky or very hard-hitting?

Has Unaware, Fur Coat as well as RegenVest (Regenerator + Assault Vest) lost their niche?

Will we see some previously rarely used Pokemon get some new usage?

What Pokemon that is viable in regular MnM is still viable here?

Is this mashup OM "too broken" per say?

Will pre-Mega abilities be a key part of teambuilding in MnM BH?

Should Gengarite be unbanned or is trapping still too much for now?

At the moment, different Arceus formes can Mega Evolve and retain their assigned typing, for example, Lucarionite Arceus-Ghost is Ghost type instead of pre-Mega where it is Normal type. (Due to a bug on ROM, which has not been fixed yet.) Should it be kept as a feature or removed as a bug? Does it make the metagame more fun?

 

[LordHelix]

I mean i like those ideas i really do, but is submitting a mashup om even allowed? Arent they uneligible for omotm too

 

[Whitephoenixace]

Well they can't be omotm but they can be chosen by the leaders for lcotm as when we had AAA sketchmons in the past. Also isn't MNM BH already on ROM? Heck there is discord for it as well.

 

[Quantum Tesseract]

Well they can't be omotm but they can be chosen by the leaders for lcotm as when we had AAA sketchmons in the past. Also isn't MNM BH already on ROM? Heck there is discord for it as well.

Its in rom, but its not eligible for Leader’s Choice in the form provided in thread because it doesnt follow Mix and Mega mechanics or bh mechanics, even in places where the two don’t interact, and it has unnecesary complex bans.

 

[Havens]

Eh, why not?

Random Typemons~

Metagame premise: A pokemon's typing is randomly switched each turn depending on the moves the user has. For Example, if a Mega Sableye had Knock Off, Will-o-Wisp, Recover and Toxic, it's typing could be changed to either Poison/Fire, Dark/Fire, Dark/Normal, etc, on the next turn of play, and is consistently randomized until the user switches out or the match is ended. However, a pokemon will always start off in its original typing whenever it is brought in for its first complete turn.

Potential bans: OU clause would apply; there will be additional bans of Mawilite, Medichamite, Tapu Lele and Kartana for their incredible base power and powerful coverage options that can work with any move they run. Protean may also be banned for now until we figure out how it would work with the type randomization.

Threats:

Kyurem-Black: Being an amazing wallbreaker with amazing coverage moves on both the physical and special spectrum, as well as a reliable recovery might just push Kyurem-Black over the edge at first.

Ash-Greninja: Choice Specs plus its standard 4mss is still incredible to utilize as a wallbreaker and revenge killer, but changing typings out of the move it's locked into may help the opponent.

Chansey: Chansey is already an amazing special wall in its own right, and the addition of an extra defensive typing like water and poison could be the centerpoint of stall archetypes in this meta.

Celesteela: Celesteela also has incredible defensive utility in its base typing, and having Protect to stall a turn out may change its typing to a way that it would be harder to kill in this meta; escaping Magnet Pull Magnezone for instance.

Questions for the community:

How would this affect pokemon that change typing upon Mega Evolution? (Mega Pinsir, Mega Gyarados?)
Would stall become too much for this metagame?
How would you want Protean to work with the type changes?

 

[Schpoonman]

Eh, why not?

Random Typemons~

Metagame premise: A pokemon's typing is randomly switched each turn depending on the moves the user has. For Example, if a Mega Sableye had Knock Off, Will-o-Wisp, Recover and Toxic, it's typing could be changed to either Poison/Fire, Dark/Fire, Dark/Normal, etc, on the next turn of play, and is consistently randomized until the user switches out or the match is ended. However, a pokemon will always start off in its original typing whenever it is brought in for its first complete turn.

Potential bans: OU clause would apply; there will be additional bans of Mawilite, Medichamite, Tapu Lele and Kartana for their incredible base power and powerful coverage options that can work with any move they run. Protean may also be banned for now until we figure out how it would work with the type randomization.

Threats:

Kyurem-Black: Being an amazing wallbreaker with amazing coverage moves on both the physical and special spectrum, as well as a reliable recovery might just push Kyurem-Black over the edge at first.

Ash-Greninja: Choice Specs plus its standard 4mss is still incredible to utilize as a wallbreaker and revenge killer, but changing typings out of the move it's locked into may help the opponent.

Chansey: Chansey is already an amazing special wall in its own right, and the addition of an extra defensive typing like water and poison could be the centerpoint of stall archetypes in this meta.

Celesteela: Celesteela also has incredible defensive utility in its base typing, and having Protect to stall a turn out may change its typing to a way that it would be harder to kill in this meta; escaping Magnet Pull Magnezone for instance.

Questions for the community:

How would this affect pokemon that change typing upon Mega Evolution? (Mega Pinsir, Mega Gyarados?)
Would stall become too much for this metagame?
How would you want Protean to work with the type changes?

I don't think Tapu Lele needs to banned. Every turn has a chance to carry it off Psychic-typing unless you run mono Psychic. Protect will be on every Stall Pokemon, but expect set-up to start attacking that trend.

 

[icecat]

PokeFusion

Metagame premise:
You nickname your pokemon another pokemon's species name in order to make it a hybrid between that species and the nicknamed species, making a PokeFusion with half the characteristics of the first pokemon and half of the second pokemon.

Actual species determines: Base HP, Base Attack, Base Defense, Movepool for moveslots 1 and 2, and ability
Nicknamed species determines: Base Sp. Attack, Base SP. Defense, Base Speed, Movepool for moveslots 3 and 4, and type.

Potential bans:
1. OU banlist
2. Nickname clause: no banned species as nickname. No duplicate nicknames.
2. Shedinja, because when paired with an electric type and holding a balloon, it becomes invincible.
3. Any species specific items or moves unless the nickname and the species name is the same

Potential threats:

Breloom (species)- great attack and access to Spore, but can now be paired with a pokemon with better speed.

Slaking (species)- has great Attack and HP, and can be paired with a skill swap user to pawn off its traunt ability

Jolteon (nickname) - great speed, good specials, good typing, and no longer held back by it's bad HP, attack, and defense


Questions:

Does this metagame sound fun?
Is there any other broken combo I overlooked?
How hard would it be to program making the pokemon's image half one pokemon half the other pokemon to make it look more like a hybrid?

 

[AquaticPanic]

PokeFusion

Metagame premise:
You nickname your pokemon another pokemon's species name in order to make it a hybrid between that species and the nicknamed species, making a PokeFusion with half the characteristics of the first pokemon and half of the second pokemon.

Actual species determines: Base HP, Base Attack, Base Defense, Movepool for moveslots 1 and 2, and ability
Nicknamed species determines: Base Sp. Attack, Base SP. Defense, Base Speed, Movepool for moveslots 3 and 4, and type.

Potential bans:
1. OU banlist
2. Nickname clause: no banned species as nickname. No duplicate nicknames.
2. Shedinja, because when paired with an electric type and holding a balloon, it becomes invincible.
3. Any species specific items or moves unless the nickname and the species name is the same

Potential threats:

Breloom (species)- great attack and access to Spore, but can now be paired with a pokemon with better speed.

Slaking (species)- has great Attack and HP, and can be paired with a skill swap user to pawn off its traunt ability

Jolteon (nickname) - great speed, good specials, good typing, and no longer held back by it's bad HP, attack, and defense


Questions:

Does this metagame sound fun?
Is there any other broken combo I overlooked?
How hard would it be to program making the pokemon's image half one pokemon half the other pokemon to make it look more like a hybrid?

We already have two metas and a mod with a pretty simillar concept: Frantic Fusions, Chimera and Fusion Evolution. I doubt we need something that's mostly simillar to them with only a few changes.

 

[icecat]

Chimera is a 1v1 game, fusing 6 pokemon where you can arrange the different parts on team preview.
Fusion Evolution requires a voting process.

These differences separate it enough IMO.

And I am having trouble finding the rules for Frantic Fusions.

 

[Yahooboo]

Chimera is a 1v1 game, fusing 6 pokemon where you can arrange the different parts on team preview.
Fusion Evolution requires a voting process.

These differences separate it enough IMO.

And I am having trouble finding the rules for Frantic Fusions.

Frantic Fusions is very similar to your ideas: You nickname a Pokemon the name of another Pokemon, their base stats are averaged out between the two, the type is split between the first Pokemon and second Pokemon's primary type but if you put the Pokemon as shiny it'll look for its second type instead or something like that.

 

[icecat]

Frantic Fusions is very similar to your ideas: You nickname a Pokemon the name of another Pokemon, their base stats are averaged out between the two, the type is split between the first Pokemon and second Pokemon's primary type but if you put the Pokemon as shiny it'll look for its second type instead or something like that.

Ok, that' mostly the same idea except it averages the stats instead of taking half and half. Ok, I'll try coming up with something more original next time.

 

[Tuthur]

First of all sorry for my bad english.

Shedmon
Metagame Premise: Every Pokémon has only one HP and a second ability which is Wonder Guard.
Bans:

• Safety Goggles because they make Sturdy and Magic Bounce broken, as well as invalidating weather teams.
• Focus Sash, Protect, Detect, Spiky Shield, King's Shield, Baneful Bunker, Mat Block and Endure because they allow you to scoot for your opponents moveset and will prevent bait and lure which are the key of this metagame.
• Confuse Ray (and all Confuse inducing moves) because they are basically OHKO-moves in this metagame.
• Mold Breaker, Teravolt, Turboblaze, Photo Geyser, Moongeist Beam, Sunsteel Strike and Core Enforcer because they invalidates Wonder Guard which is the center of this metagame and will make every game decide on a speed tie between 2 Choice Scarf Basculin.
• Stealth Rock, Spikes and Toxic Spikes are obviously banned since they kill you upon switch-in.

Potential Bans:

• 
  Sturdy and Overcoat are 2 of the best abilities in this metagame. Depending of which ability Forretress has, it has different counters and check. Moreover it has only one weakness and immunity to Poison and Sandstorm. It has access to Sandstorm as well as moves to hit almost every Pokémon immuned to Sandstorm (Struggle Bug for Zam, Flash Canon for Clef, Bulldoze for Groudon, Hidden Power [Water] for Heatran, Gliscor and Tyranitar, Hidden Power [Fire] for Aboma, Ninetales, Ferro, Steela Mamo and Snowslash, and Rock Slide for Mandibuzz, Rayquaza and Sigilyph). The only Pokémon it can't touch are Lickilicky, Golduck, Drampa and Kyogre, which can't also beat it if it's a Sturdy-version.
• 
  Skarmory is a worst Foretress but still good.
• 
  Magic Bounce is one of the best Abilities in this metagame, moreover Sableye only has one weakness: Fairy. Fairy coverage is really rare because there is no hidden power fairy. The best way to deal with Sableye-Mega is weather which has a lot of counters in Overcoat, Mamoswine, Sandslash-Alola, Magic Guard, Primal Groudon and Kyogre).
• 
  Thanks to its wonderful ability in Magic Guard and 2 unusual weaknesses in Poison and Steel, Clefable is a centralizing Pokémon which needs dedicates check. However it struggles to hit every Pokémon it is suppose to beat in one set.

Unbans:

• OHKO moves since every move is already an OHKO-moves.
• Ubers and Mega-Rayquaza
• Baton Pass

Potential Threats:

• Sandstream and Snow Warning
• Leech Seed
• Toxic
• Corrosion
• Will-O-Wisp
• Pokémon with immunities to common strategies (Mamoswine, Sandslash-Alola, Magic Guard, Magic Bounce, Overcoat, Poison Heal, Cloud Nine, Primal Weather, ...)
• Magnet Pull (removes a lot of immunities to Sandstorm and Toxic)
• Sturdy

Questions for the community: What do you think should be banned or unbanned ? Will this meta be fun ?

 

[HeatEdgeSword]

First of all sorry for my bad english.

Shedmon
Metagame Premise: Every Pokémon has only one HP and a second ability which is Wonder Guard.
Bans:

• Safety Goggles because they make Sturdy and Magic Bounce broken, as well as invalidating weather teams.
• Focus Sash, Protect and Endure because they allow you to scoot for your opponents moveset and will prevent bait and lure which are the key of this metagame.
• Confuse Ray (and all Confuse inducing moves) because they are basically OHKO-moves in this metagame.
• Mold Breaker, Teravolt and Turboblaze because they invalidates Wonder Guard which is the center of this metagame and will make very game decide on a speed tie between 2 Choice Scarf Basculin.
• Stealth Rock, Spikes and Toxic Spikes are obviously banned since they kill you upon switch-in.

Potential Bans:

• 
  Sturdy and Overcoat are 2 of the best abilities in this metagame. Depending of which ability Forretress has, it has different counters and check. Moreover it has only one weakness and immunity to Poison and Sandstorm. It has access to Sandstorm as well as moves to hit almost every Pokémon immuned to Sandstorm (Struggle Bug for Zam, Flash Canon for Clef, Bulldoze for Groudon, Hidden Power [Water] for Heatran, Gliscor and Tyranitar, Hidden Power [Fire] for Aboma, Ninetales, Ferro, Steela Mamo and Snowslash, and Rock Slide for Mandibuzz, Rayquaza and Sigilyph). The only Pokémon it can't touch are Lickilicky, Golduck, Drampa and Kyogre, which can't also beat it if it's a Sturdy-version.
• 
  Skarmory is a worst Foretress but still good.
• 
  Magic Bounce is one of the best Abilities in this metagame, moreover Sableye only has one weakness: Fairy. Fairy coverage is really rare because there is no hidden power fairy. The best way to deal with Sableye-Mega is weather which has a lot of counters in Overcoat, Mamoswine, Sandslash-Alola, Magic Guard, Primal Groudon and Kyogre).
• 
  Thanks to its wonderful ability in Magic Guard and 2 unusual weaknesses in Poison and Steel, Clefable is a centralizing Pokémon which needs dedicates check. However it struggles to hit every Pokémon it is suppose to beat in one set.
• 
  This item makes you immuned to ground type. It allows Electric-types not to have weakness and reduces the number of weaknesses of top tiers such as Salazzle, Heatran and Tyranitar making them even harder to beat.

Unbans:

• OHKO moves since every move is already an OHKO-moves.
• Ubers and Mega-Rayquaza
• Baton Pass

Potential Threats:

• Sandstream and Snow Warning
• Leech Seed
• Toxic
• Corrosion
• Will-O-Wisp
• Pokémon with immunities to common strategies (Mamoswine, Sandslash-Alola, Magic Guard, Magic Bounce, Overcoat, Poison Heal, Cloud Nine, Primal Weather, ...)
• Magnet Pull (removes a lot of immunities to Sandstorm and Toxic)
• Sturdy

Questions for the community: What do you think should be banned or unbanned ? Will this meta be fun ?

Why would you allow Sturdy? A Pokemon with Sturdy that only has 1 HP cannot be KO by almost every attack.

 

[Tuthur]

Why would you allow Sturdy? A Pokemon with Sturdy that only has 1 HP cannot be KO by almost every attack.

Because a Pokémon with sturdy isn't immune to Poison, Hail, Leech Seed, Sandstorm and Burn which are (unlike in other metagames) the most common waies to deal damages. Sturdy makes the Pokémon immune to one way of dealing damages juste like Overcoat, or Steel-type. However I think that the combination of Steel-type, Sturdy and access to Sandstorm pushes Skarmory and Forretress over the edge.

 

[Gravity Monkey]

First of all sorry for my bad english.

Shedmon
Metagame Premise: Every Pokémon has only one HP and a second ability which is Wonder Guard.
Bans:

• Safety Goggles because they make Sturdy and Magic Bounce broken, as well as invalidating weather teams.
• Focus Sash, Protect, Detect, Spiky Shield, King's Shield, Baneful Bunker and Endure because they allow you to scoot for your opponents moveset and will prevent bait and lure which are the key of this metagame.
• Confuse Ray (and all Confuse inducing moves) because they are basically OHKO-moves in this metagame.
• Mold Breaker, Teravolt and Turboblaze because they invalidates Wonder Guard which is the center of this metagame and will make every game decide on a speed tie between 2 Choice Scarf Basculin.
• Stealth Rock, Spikes and Toxic Spikes are obviously banned since they kill you upon switch-in.

Potential Bans:

• 
  Sturdy and Overcoat are 2 of the best abilities in this metagame. Depending of which ability Forretress has, it has different counters and check. Moreover it has only one weakness and immunity to Poison and Sandstorm. It has access to Sandstorm as well as moves to hit almost every Pokémon immuned to Sandstorm (Struggle Bug for Zam, Flash Canon for Clef, Bulldoze for Groudon, Hidden Power [Water] for Heatran, Gliscor and Tyranitar, Hidden Power [Fire] for Aboma, Ninetales, Ferro, Steela Mamo and Snowslash, and Rock Slide for Mandibuzz, Rayquaza and Sigilyph). The only Pokémon it can't touch are Lickilicky, Golduck, Drampa and Kyogre, which can't also beat it if it's a Sturdy-version.
• 
  Skarmory is a worst Foretress but still good.
• 
  Magic Bounce is one of the best Abilities in this metagame, moreover Sableye only has one weakness: Fairy. Fairy coverage is really rare because there is no hidden power fairy. The best way to deal with Sableye-Mega is weather which has a lot of counters in Overcoat, Mamoswine, Sandslash-Alola, Magic Guard, Primal Groudon and Kyogre).
• 
  Thanks to its wonderful ability in Magic Guard and 2 unusual weaknesses in Poison and Steel, Clefable is a centralizing Pokémon which needs dedicates check. However it struggles to hit every Pokémon it is suppose to beat in one set.

Unbans:

• OHKO moves since every move is already an OHKO-moves.
• Ubers and Mega-Rayquaza
• Baton Pass

Potential Threats:

• Sandstream and Snow Warning
• Leech Seed
• Toxic
• Corrosion
• Will-O-Wisp
• Pokémon with immunities to common strategies (Mamoswine, Sandslash-Alola, Magic Guard, Magic Bounce, Overcoat, Poison Heal, Cloud Nine, Primal Weather, ...)
• Magnet Pull (removes a lot of immunities to Sandstorm and Toxic)
• Sturdy

Questions for the community: What do you think should be banned or unbanned ? Will this meta be fun ?

Every mon would be running toxic

 

[Nospho Dhemmos]

Every mon would be running toxic

This means poison and specially steel types have a huge advantage. This makes me think Salazzle would be a good pokemon. It can poison everything while being immune to burns and poison (unless facing a opposing Salazzle), all while having 117 speed.

now on the attacking moves, any priority moves aside quick attack look good since they ohko when it can hit. I also think that there are a lot of pokemon that have very few weaknesses which makes it too hard to hit, like water/ground or bug/steel, althought every mon can use HP to deal with threats.

Eelektross, and any electric or Poison/Dark pokemon with an Air Baloon have no weakness.

Poison heal can deal with status, but you will need to either predict a Toxic or use a Toxic Orb.

I would also like to point out that Burn Up makes a pokemon have no weaknesses, and with safety goggles you are forced to use a status move to defeat it.

 

[AquaticPanic]

Ferrothorn is stupid


Ferrothorn @ Rowap Berry
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Leech Seed
- Worry Seed
- Sandstorm
- Iron Head or something idk

Barbs means most physical attackers just die
Leech Seed takes care of the rest.
Worry Seed removes Magic Bounce / Guard
Sandstorm is for other Grass-Types.
Rowap Berry instantly OHKOs anything that attacks it with a Special move
EVs investments only in speed is because nothing else matters when everything has 1 HP.


You know what else is incredibly stupid? The ability to change your type every turn

Greninja @ Lum Berry
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Ice Beam
- Water Shuriken
- Aerial Ace
- Shadow Sneak

Grenninja is pretty fast. All it needs to do is use a move before getting hit. Even if the foe has priority, you have Water Shurken (Which breakes Sturdy, btw) and Shadow Sneak to be immune to every priority move.