Metagame Workshop

[Yak Attack]

Move Combination​

The move in moveslot 1 combines with the move in moveslot 2. The powers are averaged, the effects halved and then stacked. The type remains the type of the move in moveslot 1.
Stat stage boosts are rounded down to the nearest whole number, stat stage drops are rounded up to the nearest whole number, priority moves are rounded down to the nearest whole number. There would be a 50% chance of the effect to occur if the effect previously always occurs. Multi-hit moves are rounded down to the nearest whole number.
Potential bans and threats:
Combining with:
Fake Out
Volt Switch
U-Turn
Beat Up
Questions for the community
What bans/threats would there be?
Has this been submitted already?
Is this a qualified idea?

 

[SadisticMystic]

So let's suppose a Kommo-o has Close Combat + Draco Meteor: 125 power, 95 accuracy, physical fighting...that lowers SpA by 1 and both defenses by 0.5 each? Huh?

What about more exotic combos like Seismic Toss + Beat Up? Is that just a free 600 damage on anything that's not immune? Fake Out + U-turn for an effect similar to what it does in Linked but it's only 55 power, and in exchange it actually gets to have +1.5 priority instead of 0?

 

[Yak Attack]

So let's suppose a Kommo-o has Close Combat + Draco Meteor: 125 power, 95 accuracy, physical fighting...that lowers SpA by 1 and both defenses by 0.5 each? Huh?

stat stages are tricky, didn't think of that

What about more exotic combos like Seismic Toss + Beat Up? Is that just a free 600 damage on anything that's not immune? Fake Out + U-turn for an effect similar to what it does in Linked but it's only 55 power, and in exchange it actually gets to have +1.5 priority instead of 0?

i would say seismic toss + beat up should be banned. that'd be a max 300 damage on any pokemon, the way i look at it. fake out + u-turn would be 55 bp normal type that flinches and switches, but can only be used on turn 1.
edit: that would only be 150 bp because seismic toss's effect would be divided by 2. doesn't sound broken to me, yet, but somebody could change my mind, probably
now that i think about it, what if there was a rounding rule? obviously, stat stages and priority can't be anything other than integers. how about:
stat boosts: round down
stat drops: round up
priority: round down

 

[SadisticMystic]

Even if you round down, Fake Out + U-turn at 1 priority means that if the opponent has two Pokemon with that combo, they can keep using it back and forth, and unless you have priority 2+ (or 1 and higher speed than them), you never get to move at all until they're flat out of PP. Combined with the ability to run, say, Protective Pads on a Technician Ambipom to both hit reasonably hard each time and avoid falling for a Rocky Helmet trap, this pretty much becomes an obligation of "you NEED Protect, standalone Fake Out, and/or Inner Focus on every team to avoid falling for this".

In Linked, priority differences aren't averaged: the single lowest priority in the link wins out absolutely, so Fake Out + U-turn is a 0 there and it's somewhat more plausible for you to have something that outspeeds them (additionally, keeping it as two atomic transactions there means that if they get a KO with the Fake Out part of the move, they don't pivot out, and you'll have one turn where you're at least assured that your replacement won't flinch, as they either have to hard switch or standalone U-turn).

 

[Yak Attack]

Multi-hit moves would be rounded down to the nearest whole number. So I did the Beat Up calculation wrong. It would turn out to be 150 damage with all 6 Pokemon participating. Also, multi-hit moves hit on an average of 3 times. I'd like to go by that calculation and divide that number by 2 to get 1.5. Instead of rounding that down to 1, leaving combining with multi-hit moves useless, combining with these moves could multiply the power of the combined move by 1.5.

Also, combining with Volt Switch, U-Turn, or Fake Out in general should be banned.

 

[CoolMan6001]

SHARING
​

In this metagame, two Pokemon get to share attributes such as abilities, moves, and stats with each other. Sharing is activated by having the pair of Pokemon (Slots 1+2, 3+4, and 5+6) have natures affecting a single stat. (Adamant and Jolly work for this. Both affect Special Attack) Once activated the two Pokemon get to use one of the other's moves or abilities. (Has to be the same thing they share, and both are required to share something) If the natures affect the same stats however, (Neutral natures, Timid and Quiet, and double natures work) they now need to share either two moves, or a move and an ability. Lost? Here's some help:

help

case 1: Nothing changes

Camerupt-Mega @ Cameruptite
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Nature Power
- Rock Slide

Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Seismic Toss
- Toxic
- Soft-Boiled
- Heal Bell

Due to the natures affecting completely different stats, nothing changes for the two. neither can use the other's ability, stats, nor moves.

case 2: Move exchange

Dragonite @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Extreme Speed
- Earthquake
- Drill Peck
New Stats: 91/134/95/100/90/80

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Static
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Discharge
- Heat Wave
- Roost
- Ice Beam
New Stats: 90/90/85/125/100/100

Here Dragonite and Zapdos both run natures that affect Special Defense, as a result, they get to swap those stats and swap a move from the other. Dragonite takes Drill Peck to be less relilant on it's z crystal, while Zapdos takes Ice Beam to have a stronger HP Ice.

case 3: Ability exchange

Celesteela @ Leftovers
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Leech Seed
- Protect
- Heavy Slam
- Earthquake
New Stats: 97/101/103/70/101/60

Crobat @ Life Orb
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Air Slash
- Sludge Bomb
- Heat Wave
New Stats: 85/90/80/107/80/130

Here Celesteela and Crobat both run natures that affect Special Attack, as a result, they get to swap those stats and swap an ability from the other. Celesteela takes Infiltrator to make Leech Seed more relilable, while Crobat takes Beast Boost to give it stronger sweeping capabilities with it's new 107 Special Attack.

case 4: Two moves at once

Serperior @ Life Orb
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Rash Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Leaf Storm
- Glare
- Fire Blast
- Ice Beam
New stats: 75/75/95/95/100/113

Tyranitar @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance
New Stats: 100/134/110/75/95/61

Here Serperior and Tyranitar both run natures that affect both Special Attack and Special Defense, as a result, they get to swap those two stats and swap two moves from the other. Serperior takes Fire Blast and Ice Beam to filnally have coverage moves with Leaf Storm, while Tyranitar takes Swords Dance and Knock Off to give it a sweep capability and a stronger Dark STAB respectively.

Bans: OU Clauses + Chansey, Kyurem-B, Huge Power, Pure Power, Wonder Guard

Q/A:

• How do megas work?

They pass the base form stats and abilities. Their ability gets replaced as usual, but they keep any inherited stats.

• Pokemon that change form inside battle?

They pass the base form stats and abilities, and keep any inherited stats.

• If I switch a stat, do I have to share a move or ability?

Yes you have to share.

Questions for you:

• Is this metagame too complex?
• Should the sharing work in a different way?

 

[AV Cosmoem]

Monobility
this is pretty much a UM but whatever​

All Pokemon on the team must have access to the same ability, and at least 5 of them must be using said ability. Mega-evolved Pokemon can only be used on the team that corresponds to their post-Mega ability. For example, Manectric holding Manectite can only be used on Intimidate teams.
Clauses: Ubers clauses. Species Clause has been altered and you can now have one duplicate on each team, but only one. Only one Pokemon on the team is allowed to hold a corresponding Mega Stone.
Bans: Pressure, Shadow Tag
Potential Ban: Levitate

Questions:
Is this metagame too restricted?
Are there any more broken threats I should look into?

 

[OPStellar]

Monobility
this is pretty much a UM but whatever​

Is this metagame too restricted?
Are there any more broken threats I should look into?

Note some of the identical Abilities. Namely:
Insomnia & Vital Spirit (somehow Delibird has both)
Iron Barbs & Rough Skin
Battle Armor & Shell Armor
Air Lock & Cloud Nine
Dazzling & Queenly Majesty
Turboblaze, Teravolt, Mold Breaker
Huge Power & Pure Power
Wimp Out & Emergency Exit
Plus & Minus
Receiver & Power of Alchemy
Gooey & Tangling Hair
And the handful of Abilities with no competitive use.

The following have minor tweaks, but the same basic principles:
Clear Body, White Smoke, Full Metal Body (cannot be ignored)

Hyper Cutter, Keen Eye (which additionally ignores evasiveness), Big Pecks, etc. do the same as the above, but to individual stats.​

Multiscale & Shadow Shield (cannot be ignored)
Filter, Solid Rock, Prism Armor (cannot be ignored)
Water Veil & Water Bubble (power boost)
Static or Poison Point: Effect Spore (+Sleep chance)
Rock Head & Magic Guard (overall indirect damage immunity)
Moxie, Soul-Heart (Special Attack instead), Beast Boost (highest stat instead)
Defiant, Competitive (Special Attack instead)

Then there are Blaze, Overgrow, Swarm, and Torrent (and maybe Steelworker?) that differ only by Type. And the -ate/-ize Abilities, too.
I'm sure I've missed some points, but you get the idea.

 

[S1nn0hC0nfirm3d]

Monobility
this is pretty much a UM but whatever​

All Pokemon on the team must have access to the same ability, and at least 5 of them must be using said ability. Mega-evolved Pokemon can only be used on the team that corresponds to their post-Mega ability. For example, Manectric holding Manectite can only be used on Intimidate teams.
Clauses: Ubers clauses. Species Clause has been altered and you can now have one duplicate on each team, but only one. Only one Pokemon on the team is allowed to hold a corresponding Mega Stone.
Bans: Pressure, Shadow Tag
Potential Ban: Levitate

Questions:
Is this metagame too restricted?
Are there any more broken threats I should look into?

Mono ability is a very old OM idea that never really took off (I'm talking like 8 years old lol), but in short:
>Levitate was very popular for all the mons and team roles you could fill with the popular ability.
>Regenerator teams become more viable and annoying each generation.
>Intimidate balance was a safe bet and funny to see, and Sheer Force was common on offense.
>As far as this gen goes, Beast Boost is similar but also more limited, doesn't mean it can't be pulled off.

I'm not going into too much more speculation because I've played it before (back in the days of challonge or whatever we used before there was a tour plug in), and I don't think it will ever be accepted any time soon. If you have any hope for this meta try finding others who are interested and post some replays / preliminary VR for the skeptical to see.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

This isn't a meta idea, but rather an observation. Pokemon Showdown now has a manual Hidden Power setter, so metas that rely on Hidden Power types are no longer cumbersome. This might open up a new door for what OMs are possible.

 

[OPStellar]

This isn't a meta idea, but rather an observation. Pokemon Showdown now has a manual Hidden Power setter, so metas that rely on Hidden Power types are no longer cumbersome.

When I first saw that it looked like this:

Note the Pokéball.

This might open up a new door for what OMs are possible.

^ Understatement. ^

 

[DrPumpkinz]

When I first saw that it looked like this:
View attachment 190616
Note the Pokéball.

^ Understatement. ^

When the Pokeball setter comes into fruition, it certainly will allow for many new OMs. Though it looks like they've removed the feature, as it's still a work in process.

 

[JTD783]

When I first saw that it looked like this:
View attachment 190616
Note the Pokéball.

^ Understatement. ^

Maybe this is more of a pet mod type of thing, but there could be a meta where different effects are given to pokemon based on whatever pokeball they use. They might have made one like that already, I have no idea.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

I need to work a bit more with this idea, so any help with technical issues is pretty much appreciated

Type Sum

Metagame premise: Your pokemon's hidden power type will be added to the effect of the moves, item and ability of that pokemon each time one or more types appear in the description. For conditions an 'OR' clause will be used, and for consecuences an 'AND' clause will apply.

This is quite confusing, so better explain it with a few examples

View attachment 179165
Heatran @ Grassium Z
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA (Hidden Power = Ground)
- Magma Storm
- Earth Power
- Solar Beam
- Stealth Rock

lets see Heatran ability:
Standard Falsh Fire: This Pokemon's Fire attacks do 1.5x damage if hit by one Fire move; Fire immunity.

now, since Heatran Hidden power is Ground, each time a 'Fire' appears in the description regarding the Fire type, then Ground will be added, so the new Flash Fire will be

New Flash Fire: This Pokemon's Fire AND Ground do 1.5x damage if hit by one Fire OR Ground move; Fire AND Ground immunity.

note the AND are added since they are effects while the OR is added because being hitted by a Fire move is a condition.

This means, Heatran is now immune by both Fire and Ground (and also, immune by Thousand Arrows!!) and by receiving an Fire or Ground move, Both Magma Storm and Earth Power will gain more power.

But the Heatran analysis doesnt end here.

Lets see Heatran's Item, Grassium Z:

Description: If holder has a Grass move, this item allows it to use a Grass Z-Move.

by adding Ground each time Grass appears, this will be modified this way:

New Grassium Z effect: If holder has a Grass OR Ground move, this item allows it to use a Grass or Ground Z-Move.

In order to understand how Z moves works, one should directly check at the coding i guess, but my bet is that now you can use both a Ground Z move with Earth Power or a Grass Z move with Solar Beam depending on what do you need during the battle. My other hypothesis (Acoording to Bulbapedia description), is that you can uppgrade your Grass or Ground moves into Z Bloom Doom (a Grass type move). Using this second alternative, you can use any Z- crystal with Heatran and activate it with Earth Power.

Now, looking at the moves, one might think that Stealth Rock is affected by this Metagame, however the real effect of Stealth Rock is to 'place rocks on the field'. So you are never calling the Rock type actually (Stealth Rock effect is to set up rocks on the field; the effect of the rocks placed are not modified by this metagame).

In general, moves, abilities and items that interact with field conditions, such as Sunny Day, Drizzle, Electric Surge, have a 'Set up' Effect, and they are not modified by this metagame because any type is called in the description of the effect.

Ok, more examples

View attachment 179166
Araquanid @ Splash Plate
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 130 HP / 252 Atk / 126 Def
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 SpD / 30 Spe (Hidden Power = Bug)
- Liquidation
- Leech Life
- Sticky Web
- Magic Coat


Water Bubble boosts both Water and Bug Attacks, effectively doubling this pokemon attack. This pokemon now also resist Bug type moves, since it also does resist Fire. Splash Plate Boost Both Water and Bug type moves (also, it makes Judgement a combined Water+Bug type move similar to Flying Press). WIth this new resistance and stronger Bug Type moves, without needing to lose life with Life Orb. Now this pokemon became an effective check for Bug types like Scizor and Buzzwole, Grass types like Tangrowth, and Psychic tpyes like Reuniclus, Alakazam and Slowbro.

View attachment 179168
Glalie-Mega @ Glalitite
Ability: Refrigerate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
IVs: 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 Spe (Hidden Power = Fire)
- Freeze-Dry
- Earthquake
- Double-Edge
- Taunt / Hidden Power Fire

Refrigerate boosts and transforms both Normal and Fire moves into a combined Ice+Fire Move, which is only resisted by Water, Rock and Fire types. Freeze dry is supper Efective against Fire and Water Pokemon and Earthquake also Handles Fire while also being supper effective against Rock, You can use Hidden power fire on last slot so you dont loose 1 Iv on this 100 base Speed Pokemon. Since Hidden Power Effect Overwrites Refrigerate and it doesnt call any specific type on its description, it isnt affected by this metagame rules, so it is effectively a wasted slot.

View attachment 179169
Latios-Mega (M) @ Latiosite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Roost
- Dragon Dance

Perfect Iv for Hidden Power Dark. Levitate gives this guy Dark Immunnity as well as immunity to Ground, Spikes and Toxic Spikes. This Pokemon doesnt fear the Threats of Hoopa-U, Ash Greninja or Sucker Punch Mega Mawile. Standard Lati@s also works and it is immune to Knock Off. In general, Levitate Dragons can carry Hidden Power Dragon to get access to Dragon Z moves as an alternative to other Z moves; and Flygon can Transform a X4 weaknesses to ice into a Immunity.

View attachment 179170
Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 SpA / 30 SpD (Hidden Power = Ground)
- Earthquake
- Roost / Stealth Rock / Knock Off
- Protect
- Curse

With Hp ground Curse will work the same way it works with Ghost types. With Protect and Poison Heal you can Stall out or force out any Cursed pokemon. With Roost this pokemon becomes typeless until the end of the turn.

View attachment 179171
Magnezone @ Choice Specs
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 2 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA (Hidden Power = Water)
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Volt Switch
- Signal Beam

Maybe Rain teams are strong in this metagame...
Magnet Pull Traps Both Water and Steel Types, allowing you to break those mons with Thunderbolt, despite few exceptions like Swampert and Ferrothorn, but if you manage to trap Greninja or Peliper, you will have dealt a ton of damage alredy. Specs are needed to quickly kill Toxapex and Speed investment is needed to prevent Peliper from escaping with U-turn, but it can be adjusted.

A bulkier version with assault vest can be used to trap Psychic types. With Perfect Ivs and a scarf this pokemon can Finish off Tyranytar, hoopa_u and unboosted Mega gyarados.

View attachment 179172
Mamoswine @ Life Orb / Groundium Z
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe (Hidden Power = Steel)
Naive Nature
IVs: 30 SpD
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
- Superpower/ Iron Head / Stealth Rock
- Freeze-Dry

Thick Fat makes this pokemon take Neutral Damage from Fire and Steel. Freeze Dry hits water and Steel supper effectively, so this pokemon have 3 ways to break steel types depending on they other typing: Ferrothorn, Empoleon and Celesteela are destroyed by Freeze Dry, Heatran and Mawile by Earthquake, and scizor is weakened by Freeze Dry. You can remove Superpower for Iron Head so you have 2 different options for Z moves, but Mamo tends to prefeer consistant damage with Life Orb.

View attachment 179173
Volcarona @ Air Balloon
Ability: Swarm
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Bug Buzz
- Hidden Power [Rock]
- Substitute
- Quiver Dance

Air Balloon gives Volc a partial immunity to Ground and Rock (also... stealth rocks?). Hidden Power Rock sucks against everything except Mega Zard Y, so this set is more like a Lure set and it is assumed that you can handle Steel types with Magnezone. Hidden power rock is boosted by Swarm though.

View attachment 179174
Zeraora @ Life Orb
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
IV: 30 SPA, 30 SPD (Hidden Power = Ground)
Jolly Nature
- Plasma Fists
- Knock Off
- Close Combat
- Fire Punch/ Toxic

Offensive Electric immune to Ground and Electric. The downside is that you wont damage Defensive Ground tpyes, so carrying toxic is a good alternative.

View attachment 179175
Floatzel @ Splash Plate
Ability: Life Orb
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
IV: 30 ATK, 30 SPE (Hidden Power = Psychic)
Jolly Nature
- Liquidation / Crunch
- Ice Punch/ Crunch
- Pursuit/ Crunch
- Soak

Soak transforms the target into a Water/Psychic type. Then you finish it off with Pursuit or Crunch. Ice punch helps extending pressure against many key threats.


Banlist and Clauses: OU banlist and Clauses

Bans: I havent find anything broken yet. I will watch out Magnezone and Magnet Pull in general. Dhelmise is dangerous, and Shedinja can remove one weakneses with Air baaloon (with HP rock it may be immune to all hazards).

Here there is a link with possible Hidden Power IV's, if you are interested on giving some feedback: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/hidden-power-iv-combinations.78083/

Questions:

1) Is the premise understandable. If not very much, how can i make it more clear?

2) Do you find this metagame Fun?

3) How should Z- Crystals and Z- Moves work?

4) Should Air Balloon give Stealth Rock immunity if hidden power is Rock?

5) Should i use the pokemon Name to Specify what type is summed to all effects, instead of Hidden power type? (for example, if Flygon is called 'Ice', it gets Ice immunity with Levitate). This would help with teambuilding since you wont have to find about IV's for hidden power and it will let your opponent know about the type that is being summed.

6) Should ate abilities and type modifiers for attacks being handled with double typing? or Overwriting should work better?

7) What do you consider broken?

8) How should i handle Field effects called by moves and abilities? Is it ok to let them work as usual?

Thank you for reading!

Thinking about Hidden Power made me remember this idea. I think it has potential, but it needs to be streamlined. I think it should only apply to abilities, and it should replace whatever type(s) are being referenced, instead of add to them. For example, HP Ground Heatran would become immune to Ground, and its Ground attacks would be powered up when hit with a Ground move, but it would lose its immunity to Fire.

The reason I think replacement is better than addition is because of abilities like Dry Skin and the -ates, where it isn't clear what should be done. With replacement, you get a weakness to the type of your chosing, which is then overwritten by an immunity to that same type. For the -ates, it wouldn't change the type (you're replacing a type with the same type), but it would power them up.

List of affected abilities and their new effects

An ability is affected if it mentions an explicit type in its effects. For example, Adaptability isn't affected, as it doesn't boost any particular type. Abilities that set weather and terrains are also not affected, as they only set the condition; the effects come from the condition, not the ability.

Abilities in bold are abilities that I'm not sure what effect it would have. It depends on how the ability is actually coded.

• Aerilate: Powers up moves of the given type
• Blaze: Powers up moves of the given type when at low health
• Corrosion: Allows Pokemon of the given type to be poisoned
• Dark Aura: Powers up moves of the given type
• Dry Skin: Grants immunity to the given type, doesn't introduce a new weakness
• Fairy Aura: Powers up moves of the given type
• Flash Fire: Grants immunity to the given type, and powers up moves of the given type when hit by moves of that type
• Flower Veil: Pokemon of the given type become immune to status and stat drops
• Fluffy: Grants a weakness to the given type
• Gale Wings: Grants priority to moves of the given type when at full health
• Galvanize: Powers up moves of the given type
• Heatproof: Grants resistance to the given type
• Justified: Increases Attack when hit with a move of the given type
• Levitate: Grants immunity to the given type
• Lightning Rod: Grants immunity to the given type, increases Special Attack when hit with moves of that type
• Liquid Voice: Changes sound moves into the given type
• Magnet Pull: Traps Pokemon of the given type
• Motor Drive: Grants immunity to the given type, increases Speed when hit with moves of that type
• Normalize: Changes all moves to the given type and powers them up
• Overgrow: Powers up moves of the given type when at low health
• Pixilate: Powers up moves of the given type
• Rattled: Increases Speed when hit with moves of the given type, uncertain if it would boost by one or three stages
• Sand Force: Powers up moves of the given type, uncertain if it would power up by 1.3x or 2.197x
• Sap Sipper: Grants immunity to the given type, increases Attack when hit with moves of the given type
• Scrappy: Either allows opponents of the given type to be hit with stuff they're usually immune to, or allows opponents of the given type to be hit with moves of the given type
• Steelworker: Powers up moves of the given type
• Storm Drain: Grants immunity to the given type, increases Special Attack when hit with moves of the given type
• Swarm: Powers up moves of the given type when at low health
• Thick Fat: Grants resistance to moves of the given type, uncertain if the resistance would be 0.5x or 0.25x
• Volt Absorb: Grants immunity to moves of the given type, heals when hit with moves of the given type
• Water Absorb: Grants immunity to moves of the given type, heals when hit with moves of the given type
• Water Bubble: Powers up moves of the given type, and halves damage from moves of the given type
• Water Compaction: Increases Defense when hit with moves of the given type

With that, some sets that you didn't mention.

Primarina @ Choice Specs
Ability: Liquid Voice
Hidden Power: Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Hydro Pump
- Hyper Voice
- Psychic

Primarina essentially gets a stronger Hidden Power.

Dhelmise @ Choice Band / Miracle Seed / Spell Tag
Ability: Steelworker
Hidden Power: Grass / Ghost
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Power Whip
- Earthquake
- Shadow Claw
- Rapid Spin

Steelworker can be made to boost either of Dhelmise's STABs to even further levels. Power Whip brings raw power, while Shadow Claw has a better offensive typing and appreciates the boost more.

Goodra @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sap Sipper
Hidden Power: Ice / Dragon
- Pick 4 moves, Goodra's movepool is insane

HP Fairy would be pretty valuable here if it existed, but it doesn't. Nonetheless, a Dragon with an immunity to Ice or Dragon is useful.

Talonflame @ Leftovers
Ability: Gale Wings
Hidden Power: Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Flamethrower
- Will-O-Wisp
- Roost
- U-turn / Defog / Taunt

Talonflame gets priority on Will-O-Wisp and a STAB that doesn't damage it.

 

[OPStellar]

When the Pokeball setter comes into fruition, it certainly will allow for many new OMs. Though it looks like they've removed the feature, as it's still a work in process.

At the very least, the selectable HP type makes the current OMs that centralize on it a lot easier to play.

 

[CoolMan6001]

SHARING
​

In this metagame, two Pokemon get to share attributes such as abilities, moves, and stats with each other. Sharing is activated by having the pair of Pokemon (Slots 1+2, 3+4, and 5+6) have natures affecting a single stat. (Adamant and Jolly work for this. Both affect Special Attack) Once activated the two Pokemon get to use one of the other's moves or abilities. (Has to be the same thing they share, and both are required to share something) If the natures affect the same stats however, (Neutral natures, Timid and Quiet, and double natures work) they now need to share either two moves, or a move and an ability. Lost? Here's some help:

help

case 1: Nothing changes

Camerupt-Mega @ Cameruptite
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Nature Power
- Rock Slide

Chansey (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Seismic Toss
- Toxic
- Soft-Boiled
- Heal Bell

Due to the natures affecting completely different stats, nothing changes for the two. neither can use the other's ability, stats, nor moves.

case 2: Move exchange

Dragonite @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Extreme Speed
- Earthquake
- Drill Peck
New Stats: 91/134/95/100/90/80

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Static
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Discharge
- Heat Wave
- Roost
- Ice Beam
New Stats: 90/90/85/125/100/100

Here Dragonite and Zapdos both run natures that affect Special Defense, as a result, they get to swap those stats and swap a move from the other. Dragonite takes Drill Peck to be less relilant on it's z crystal, while Zapdos takes Ice Beam to have a stronger HP Ice.

case 3: Ability exchange

Celesteela @ Leftovers
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Leech Seed
- Protect
- Heavy Slam
- Earthquake
New Stats: 97/101/103/70/101/60

Crobat @ Life Orb
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Air Slash
- Sludge Bomb
- Heat Wave
New Stats: 85/90/80/107/80/130

Here Celesteela and Crobat both run natures that affect Special Attack, as a result, they get to swap those stats and swap an ability from the other. Celesteela takes Infiltrator to make Leech Seed more relilable, while Crobat takes Beast Boost to give it stronger sweeping capabilities with it's new 107 Special Attack.

case 4: Two moves at once

Serperior @ Life Orb
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Rash Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Leaf Storm
- Glare
- Fire Blast
- Ice Beam
New stats: 75/75/95/95/100/113

Tyranitar @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance
New Stats: 100/134/110/75/95/61

Here Serperior and Tyranitar both run natures that affect both Special Attack and Special Defense, as a result, they get to swap those two stats and swap two moves from the other. Serperior takes Fire Blast and Ice Beam to filnally have coverage moves with Leaf Storm, while Tyranitar takes Swords Dance and Knock Off to give it a sweep capability and a stronger Dark STAB respectively.

Bans: OU Clauses + Chansey, Kyurem-B, Huge Power, Pure Power, Wonder Guard

Q/A:

• How do megas work?

They pass the base form stats and abilities. Their ability gets replaced as usual, but they keep any inherited stats.

• Pokemon that change form inside battle?

They pass the base form stats and abilities, and keep any inherited stats.

• If I switch a stat, do I have to share a move or ability?

Yes you have to share.

Questions for you:

• Is this metagame too complex?
• Should the sharing work in a different way?

I'd like to give some ideas for sets that could be used:

Pair 1: Shift Gear shenanigans

Magearna @ Leftovers
Ability: Soul-Heart
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fleur Cannon
- Focus Blast
- Volt Switch
- Synthesis
New stats: 80/95/131/130/115/65

Kartana @ Life Orb
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Smart Strike
- Sacred Sword
- Shift Gear
New stats: 59/181/115/59/31/09
Magearna is finally able to recover HP and even gets higher defense, while Kartana gets a sick boosting move to help it sweep.

Pair 2: A real attack stat

Hawlucha @ your terrain seed of choice depending on the team it's on
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Acrobatics
- Roost
- Knock Off
New stats: 78/127/75/74/63/118

Blacephalon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Shadow Ball
- Trick
- Focus Blast
New stats: 53/92/53/151/79/107
Hawlucha has a real attack stat now, letting it get away with not having Swords Dance. It also gets Knock Off allowing it to remove items on it's own. Blacephalon finally gets the Focus Blast it long desired, letting it Pokemon like Tyranitar.

Pair 3: No Guard on something who wants it

Doublade @ Eviolite
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Gyro Ball
- Shadow Sneak
- Shadow Claw
New stats: 59/110/150/45/80/35

Thundurus (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Rash Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Thunder
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Focus Blast
New stats: 79/115/70/125/49/111

Doublade gets Defiant, which is better than No Guard for it, and higher special defense. Thundurus gets No Guard, letting it run Thunder and Focus Blast without worrying about misses anymore.

Share thoughts on ideas to run!

 

[OPStellar]

Sounds like a better version of A Berry Useful Immunity.

• Corrosion: Allows Pokemon of the given type to be poisoned

I have to disagree here. Corrosion doesn't specify a Type. It's like Scrappy, but for poison status alone. Perhaps certain types should be assigned to specific statuses? Like Fire/Water to Burn, Poison to Poison/Tox. Poison, Electric to Paralysis, Ice to Freeze, Fairy/Psychic to Infatuation, Flying to Confusion (because Hurricane), Dark to Taunt/Torment, Grass/Normal to Sleep, etc. It might work, but it would be quite an undertaking to code. It would also need to be applied to any Abilities with a chance of causing certain statuses.

• Scrappy: Either allows opponents of the given type to be hit with stuff they're usually immune to, or allows opponents of the given type to be hit with moves of the given type

Pick one. Since you can only pick 1 HP type, it should affect 1 aspect. Personally, I think it should be "Moves of the given type can hit types immune to the given type, if applicable."

• Dry Skin: Grants immunity to the given type, doesn't introduce a new weakness
• Rattled: Increases Speed when hit with moves of the given type, uncertain if it would boost by one or three stages
• Sand Force: Powers up moves of the given type, uncertain if it would power up by 1.3x or 2.197x
• Thick Fat: Grants resistance to moves of the given type, uncertain if the resistance would be 0.5x or 0.25x
• Water Bubble: Powers up moves of the given type, and halves damage from moves of the given type

My favorite thing about Rattled: It has the coverage of all of a Psychic-type's weaknesses, but no Psychic types have it! It also only exists as a Hidden Ability. My suggestion: Increases Speed when hit by moves that are Super-Effective against the given type.

Sand Force: Nope. This Ability pertains to Sandstorm, and powers up move types that pertain to the Types that take no damage from Sandstorm. Suggestion: No changes to original description. This thing is complicated.

Thick Fat: Many Water and Ice types get this Ability, with some exceptions. Water is a type that has a resistance to Fire and Ice. Fire is another, as noticeable with Tepig and Pignite (but for some reason not Emboar). Grass is the only Type weak to both. What I see here is something that can apply in the Starter Type Triangle, since it involves Fire, Water, and Grass. Therefore, I have no clue what to do about this Ability. Suggestion: Leave it be.

Dry Skin rule should apply to Water Bubble, too. No halving damage from the given type; no introducing a new resistance.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

I have to disagree here. Corrosion doesn't specify a Type. It's like Scrappy, but for poison status alone. Perhaps certain types should be assigned to specific statuses? Like Fire/Water to Burn, Poison to Poison/Tox. Poison, Electric to Paralysis, Ice to Freeze, Fairy/Psychic to Infatuation, Flying to Confusion (because Hurricane), Dark to Taunt/Torment, Grass/Normal to Sleep, etc. It might work, but it would be quite an undertaking to code. It would also need to be applied to any Abilities with a chance of causing certain statuses.

You are right that it's not clear how Corrosion works. I was assuming it was "allows Steel and Poison types to be poisoned", in which case both types would be replaced with the given type. Though it's possible that it's coded as "bypass type when checking to see if the target can be poisoned", in which case the ability wouldn't change. However, I don't think changing the status depending on the type is a good idea, as it's very subjective and would make this idea even more likely to become a Pet Mod.

My favorite thing about Rattled: It has the coverage of all of a Psychic-type's weaknesses, but no Psychic types have it! It also only exists as a Hidden Ability. My suggestion: Increases Speed when hit by moves that are Super-Effective against the given type.

Sand Force: Nope. This Ability pertains to Sandstorm, and powers up move types that pertain to the Types that take no damage from Sandstorm. Suggestion: No changes to original description. This thing is complicated.

Thick Fat: Many Water and Ice types get this Ability, with some exceptions. Water is a type that has a resistance to Fire and Ice. Fire is another, as noticeable with Tepig and Pignite (but for some reason not Emboar). Grass is the only Type weak to both. What I see here is something that can apply in the Starter Type Triangle, since it involves Fire, Water, and Grass. Therefore, I have no clue what to do about this Ability. Suggestion: Leave it be.

I'm fairly confident that the types affected by three abilities have nothing to do with type effectiveness or weather, at least not under the hood. They all apply to moves of certain types, all of which get replaced by the given type. The uncertainty comes from whether the moves check for each type individually, or all at once. For example, in the case of Thick Fat:

If the code looks like this

IF type = fire OR ice, power = power * 0.5;

then it would halve the damage from the given type. On the other hand, if the code looks like this

IF type = ice, power = power * 0.5;

IF type = fire, power = power * 0.5;

then it would halve the damage twice, effectively quartering the incoming damage.

ry Skin rule should apply to Water Bubble, too. No halving damage from the given type; no introducing a new resistance.

The only "rule" for Dry Skin is the rule of how multiplication works. Dry Skin normally gives a weakness to Fire and an immunity to Water, both of which are replaced with the given type. The immunity overwrites the weakness because anything multiplied by zero is still zero. Water Bubble powers up your own Water moves and weakens incoming Fire moves, both of which are replaced with the given type. These multipliers don't interact, so nothing unusual happens.

 

[OPStellar]

You are right that it's not clear how Corrosion works. I was assuming it was "allows Steel and Poison types to be poisoned", in which case both types would be replaced with the given type. Though it's possible that it's coded as "bypass type when checking to see if the target can be poisoned", in which case the ability wouldn't change. However, I don't think changing the status depending on the type is a good idea, as it's very subjective and would make this idea even more likely to become a Pet Mod.


I'm fairly confident that the types affected by three abilities have nothing to do with type effectiveness or weather, at least not under the hood. They all apply to moves of certain types, all of which get replaced by the given type. The uncertainty comes from whether the moves check for each type individually, or all at once. For example, in the case of Thick Fat:

If the code looks like this

IF type = fire OR ice, power = power * 0.5;

then it would halve the damage from the given type. On the other hand, if the code looks like this

IF type = ice, power = power * 0.5;

IF type = fire, power = power * 0.5;

then it would halve the damage twice, effectively quartering the incoming damage.


The only "rule" for Dry Skin is the rule of how multiplication works. Dry Skin normally gives a weakness to Fire and an immunity to Water, both of which are replaced with the given type. The immunity overwrites the weakness because anything multiplied by zero is still zero. Water Bubble powers up your own Water moves and weakens incoming Fire moves, both of which are replaced with the given type. These multipliers don't interact, so nothing unusual happens.

I get it now. You're saying it would amalgamate all the original types into the given type, thus conglomerating the effects into one effect. Makes sense.

 

[DuDono]

Reversing​

Rules: All pokemons base stats become (BST/3) - base stat. Then all stats are mutiplied by (1200 - bst)/bst so weaks pokemons become strong, and strongs become weak.
Clauses: uber clauses +
Evolution clause: you can't use pokemons from NFE and LC tiers. Pokemons from these tiers which are ranked in another tier (such as chansey or doublade) are still allowed.
Bans : smeargle, shedinja
Unbans: rayquasa-mega

Q: how do mega stones work?
A: they make your mon lose stats.

Q: what if a base stat is negative?
A: it becomes 0.

Questions for community:
Other bans?

 

[OPStellar]

Reversing​

Rules: All pokemons base stats become (BST/3) - base stat. Then all stats are mutiplied by (1200 - bst)/bst so weaks pokemons become strong, and strongs become weak.
Clauses: uber clauses +
Evolution clause: you can't use pokemons from NFE and LC tiers. Pokemons from these tiers which are ranked in another tier (such as chansey or doublade) are still allowed.
Bans : smeargle, shedinja
Unbans: rayquasa-mega

Q: how do mega stones work?
A: they make your mon lose stats.

Q: what if a base stat is negative?
A: it becomes 0.

Questions for community:
Other bans?

You've probably thought this through, but there's already a working unofficial metagame like it called "The Negative Metagame," wherein each stat is subtracted from 160, with a 5 minimum value. Also, "Reversing" sounds to similar to "Reversed," which is the name of an existing other metagame.
Also, nobody would use Mega Stones if it were to function this way.

 

[Ivy]

Spoiler alert; the Negative Metagame may see some light before gen 7 ends. It has a much simpler and easier to understand formula than that, though (160 - base stat for each base stat).

 

[DuDono]

Didn't know

 

[Xanderpitz]

JUGGERNAUT
​

Metagame premise:
TL;DR When a Pokemon faints, the next pokemon that is brought in inherits 1/10th of the fainted mon's BST (no less than 1 per stat), rounded up.

Long version:
Let's say I have a team of all 100/100/100/100/100/100 base stat pokemon (Victini, Celebi, Mew, and Jirachi). My Victini is knocked out first. The next pokemon I bring in is Mew, who will gain 1/10th of Victini's base stats (so 10 each), leaving it with 110 in each stat. I switch out Mew into Celebi, who is knocked out. I bring in Mew again, so it will inherit another 10 to each stat thanks to Celebi, putting it at 120 in each stat.

The returns are much less, though, if my Mew is knocked out. Since it has 120 in each stat, it will only pass on 12 to Jirachi, putting it at 112 in each stat. If I had kept Mew safe and Jirachi had fainted first, Mew could receive another 10 BST to put it at 130 total in each stat.

Ideally, the goal then would be to balance KOing and crippling opposing pokmon (i.e. not dying) with inheriting the right mix of stats onto juggernauts you want to shine in the end-game (i.e. dying intelligently). It's better to keep on KOing than to rely entirely on 1 Juggernaut, though.

A few main rules:
- Any mon can inherit the stats of any other mon and can inherit stats as many times as they'd like per match
- Any mon that receives inherited stats keeps them for the remainder of the match, even if they switch out or mega evolve.
- Fainted mons will pass 1/10th of each base stat of the form they were in when they fainted (i.e. Mega mons will pass the stats of their mega evolution form, but only if they actually mega evolved)
- Mega Evolving will keep your already acquired boosts (i.e. if you had +20 in each stat, you will have +20 added onto your mega evolution's default stats after it mega evolves).

Potential bans and threats:
Bans:
- Quickban self-KO moves like Self-Destruct, Explosion, Memento, Final Gambit, Lunar Dance, and Healing Wish. These can make it way too easy to pass boosts to a Juggernaut that can then set up on something they resist.
- Standard OU clauses. Singles. No ubers (though some things like Genesect and Zygarde could be unbanned)
- Eviolite might be a problem on stall teams. If they become too hard to break, we can ban Eviolite and/or HP can not be passed down like in Tier Shift.
- Huge/Pure Power, Water Bubble, StakeOut, Thick Club, etc. can be problematic since they effectively multiply attack boosts by 2. These abilities might need to be quickbanned, if not suspect tested.

Threats:
- Entry hazards will most likely play a pivotal role since a juggernaut needs to switch in to receive the boosts. Regenerator juggernauts will have a much easier time popping in and out repeatedly, as well as those with access to a healing move or Wish.
- Likewise, pursuit and binding moves might be more prevalent to trap juggernauts and try to force a KO and thus diminishing returns.
- Chansey/Blissey can act as a Def/Sp Def receiver (the latter also able to receive Sp. Atk as well) and gift a substantial 25 HP stat to any pokemon receiving their boosts. Some other basic setups could be:
- Stacking Atk/Sp Atk and Speed onto wallbreakers like Kyurem-B, Char-X/Y, Mega-Gyarados, Mega-Medicham, and Tapu Lele.
- Stacking bulk + atk/sp atk onto setup sweepers like Keldeo, Kommo-o, Magearna, Serperior, Tapu Bulu, Z-Celebrate Victini, and Volcarona.
- Stacking bulk onto pure stall teams to better wall and chip away at opposing threats.

Questions for the community:
My main concern is whether or not stall will become too powerful, especially with mons like Chansey/Blissey adding insane bulk to Toxapex, Tangrowth, and Scizor-Mega and vice-versa.

 

[Shucklegigas]

Make Frantic Fusions official tbh