Metagame Workshop

[DuDono]

Stab should stay, otherwise typing wouldn't matter at all.

 

[Codename Turtle]

Stab should stay, otherwise typing wouldn't matter at all.

I gave this a lot of thought and decided to remove the question because STAB should stay.

 

[Yak Attack]

All Pokemon get access to all of their abilities at once. This includes all of a single Pokemon's abilities AND the rest of the team's abilities.
Pokemon can use 5 moves, with their 5th move being available to all Pokemon on the team, bringing the number of moves for each Pokemon to 10.
I don't know what to call this besides a clustermuk of abilities and moves, so I can call it Clustermons for now.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

All Pokemon get access to all of their abilities at once. This includes all of a single Pokemon's abilities AND the rest of the team's abilities.
Pokemon can use 5 moves, with their 5th move being available to all Pokemon on the team, bringing the number of moves for each Pokemon to 10.
I don't know what to call this besides a clustermuk of abilities and moves, so I can call it Clustermons for now.

That sounds like a combination of Pokeabilities (use all of a Pokemon's abilities), the failed Shared Power (a team's abilities are pooled), and a little bit of Partners in Crime (doubles meta where active team mates share moves).

Shared Power alone failed partly because it was a nightmare to balance. I don't see this meta doing better.

 

[Gravity Monkey]

Bandit Cup
Shamelessly stolen from MegaLionne and from all the suggestions on this threat but it kinda fits with the theme of the metagame anyway soo

Premise: Before starting the match, you get to choose one pokemon from your opponent's team. This pokemon will be swapped with a pokemon your opponent will have chosen from your team.

Bans: Standard OU Banlist

Now, this might seem like a boring premise when compared to the likes of Mix and Mega or Crossed Evolution. But just think about how much this simple addition adds a whole new layer of complexity to mindgames and teambuilding. For instance, let's say you start your fight and you immediately notice a Medicham on the enemy team, a big threat to your team. So you decide to swap him, but your opponent already anticipated this and made his Medicham (who doesn't actually carry a mega stone) a screen setter! But you might have anticipated that and went for something less threatening, like a Mew that complements well your team and would wall said Medicham if it was actually mega. This could bring some interesting strategies to a metagame that is already known by most player, the OU metagame.

Question for the community:
What do you guys think about the name? I won't say i'm not proud of it tbh
Would you play this?
Sir urkerab, is this actually codable?
Is this considered plagiarism?

 

[Codename Turtle]

Bandit Cup
Shamelessly stolen from MegaLionne and from all the suggestions on this threat but it kinda fits with the theme of the
Is this considered plagiarism?

Sounds like a really fun metagame I'd personally love to play

 

[urkerab]

urkerab, is this actually codable?

At the very least it would need some client changes to allow the initial swap.

 

[Sereg]

There used to be a similar metagame where half the team was swapped. Donovan know how that was coded

 

[KHollow]

Blankmons
Mechanic: Blankmons is a ou-based metagame where is no more type effectivity, weaknesses, immunities, resistances and, neutralities, are all set to be neutral damage. STAB, and type bonus effects (Electric types can't be paralyzed, ghosts cannot be trapped, flying types are immune to all hazards except stealth rocks etc) are all still in effect. Stealth rocks do the same amount of damage to a volcarona, and to a rhydon.

Bans

Shedinja

Threats

Everything that was previously hindered by it's weakness, Volcarona is the best example of this because it can easily switch into rocks now and reek havoc on anything later in the game where walls were destroyed, Landot will be an absolute beast as it now has no quad weakness, Dragon types will be severely buffed as nothing is immune to dragon types, which will make dragonite, an already buff and fearsome mon, a pure powerhouse wielding dragon dance for some free stat buffs with it's major bulk in it's multiscale, and hazard immunity. (I say immunity because stealth rocks will be really bad in this meta.) To allow it to freely setup a couple times and absolutely destroy everything with an outrage with the metronome item. Toxapex is also perfect for this metagame and I assume it will be like balanced hackmon's need for a prankster-haze user. It packs insane bulk, and the broken move: haze, getting rid of everything's stat changes on the field, which is probably the only thing that dragonite has to fear. Normal types will also be crowned kings along their dragon type beasts just like gen-1, nothing is immune to it or resists it, which makes it a really REALLY good offensive types, the balance of normal type moves used to be: they're normal type, Now that doesn't matter, as normal type is the same as any other. This makes stuff like snorlax unbelivably fat and offensive if used right, and mummy slaking will be a threat you will have to look out for every game. Pokemon that get extreme-speed are now much more useful as-well (ahem dragonite), as it is now just a free, decent base power priority 2 move, and any normal types get STAB with it too. This metagame of no type-chart might sound like it will be completely stall based, but on the contrary, it will only be slightly stall favoured, as much as any meta, you see, you've gotta remember that dragon types can now hit fairy types with their amazing STAB moves (literraly just outrage + metronome item will be so busted). toxapex, clefairy, and quagsire all come to mind as viable stall mons or even just normal mons in any team to ward off against hyper offensive teams. The only ban-worthy mon mentioned here is dragonite though, but even that is one that's not going to be quickbanned (probably) as it's just a setup-sweeper who is going to be compleatly op AFTER it's boosts and stuff, To break metronome you've just gotta fake-out it (unless it runs it's no-flinch ability, but then if it does that, you've got the ability to whack it with other high powered pokemon), Dragonite and other dragon types will surely be overpowered threats though.

Strategy:

Dragonite:
Dragonite will be an absolute monster, with insane bulk, and great abilities, it can run multiscale-dragondance to setup almost freely then spam attacks that are buffed by the metronome item, it also has a great move in extremespeed, which will be used to severely damage threats that can outspeed it. It can also use inner focus, to guarantee it keeps its metronome buff and is not stopped by fakeout. It also packs roost for more setup windows. This thing will be a monster in even bad players hands. Let alone a good player, this can be used to completely destroy teams if used properly. The only reason it's not banned is because of stuff like quagsire and toxapex being beasts in this meta on the defensive side.

Hydreigon:
Hydreigon is a monster without it's fairy weakness, it packs levitate which gives it an immunity, which is just amazing, which makes it an automatic counter to most ground type offensive mons. It can just freely spam attacks with an amazing speed and spatk stat that are nothing to scoff at. It will be an absolute beast and something every good team will have to prepare for
Volcarona
This is a true beast, power in the hands of volca is not a thing that is new to it, It has had it's taste of power in many other oms, and will certainly be a true powerhouse here, QD (quiver dance) Is such an amazing move that buffs it's speed and spatk like a special version of dragondance and gives it some spdef too. Volca is already quite fat in ou and is formidable there, but it can only be very early game because of rocks, here, rocks don't do 50-49%, That makes volcarona already quite the feat. But now it has no quad weakness (or weakness at all actually) so it's back to being a tank. Not a tank in videogame terms as in fat and doesn't hit too hard. No, I mean like a real life tank, fat, chonky, can take hits, (it also has roost on top of that), and explodes it's opponents, It can pack bug buzz as it's main STAB, (or flamethrower if you aren't running swarm which can be reccomended) And fiery dance is used to kill anything a little weaker, because of the chance of a spatk buff. Volca will be a monster. It is hardwalled by some unaware stall, but it has two attacks and roost, meaning it can just pray be used to kill the wall if used properly. Most viable teams will either have to have a volcarona counter or just pray every game for no volcarona.


Mega Mawile
Mega-Wile was already a beast, a good set for it was max attack and defense but it was quite weak to super effective things, never allowing it to setup it's much needed swords dance to dish out really high-powered sucker punches. But now that problem is solved, Mawile won't be that good against many special attackers, but it can run some other stat spreads for that. The main thing is: It's a mon who was hindered by super effective attacks, Now it can just setup SD freely when it needs to and sucker punch the world away, and if theres a trick room team up against you, they gotta PRAY you don't know how to use your mawile. It's probably going to be the go-to mega.

Other Mons

Landorus-T
Oh boy it's the space doggo, it's super fat here, boasting no weaknesses (like everything else) but the thing that sets it aside is intimidate, that alone is a great ability, and it also has hazard immunity. It can usually get its rock polish and swords dance setup, which will make it unstoppable by anything not fat with its STAB earthquake, But mons with levitate will give it a really hard time. For those it would have to be weary. I don't know what else to say here, It's going to be quite formidable,

Questions for the community: Moves like freeze dry are the main thing to discuss.

I suggested this earlier under a different name.

2. NO ROCHAMBEAU (rock-paper-scissors)

Metagame Premise: An OU Meta without type weaknesses, resistances, and immunities. Immunities, Resistances, and Weaknesses granted by Abilities still work; like Flash Fire, Dry Skin, Levitate, Heatproof, Thick Fat, Fluffy, etc. All other bonuses granted by Type still work; like Grass-types being immune to Spore, Rock-types getting a SpDef increase in Sand, Electric-types being immune to Paralysis, etc.

Pokemon will be chosen based on Raw Stats, Abilities, and Movepools. Moves will be chosen based on Power, STAB, and utility.

Some interesting effects:
- Ghost-types can no longer spinblock
- Toxic, Toxic Spikes, and Poison-types will be everywhere
- Thick Fat is no longer redundant on Water-types
- Stealth Rocks will hit all Pokemon neutrally
- Setup is easier in general
- Weakness Policy, Weakness-Reducing Berries, Filter and Solid Rock, & Scrappy no longer work
- Defensive Pokemon with 4x Weaknesses will see increased usage

+ Offensive Types with no immunities/resistances: Bug, Dark, Dragon, Fairy, Flying, Fighting, Ghost, Normal, Poison, Psychic, Rock, Steel

Potential Threats
Defensive: Multiscale Dragonite, Blissey/Chansey, Poison Heal Gliscor, Toxapex, Avalugg, Palossand, Tyranitar, Regirock
Offensive: Contrary Serperior, STAB Outrage, Choice Scarfed/Banded/Specs Moxie/Beast Boost, Outrage Moxie Salamence, Water Bubble Araquanid
Other: Mono-Ice looks scary. Multiple Hail setters, Aurora Veil, Blizzard Spam, and lots of defensive Mons.
Grass types are also crazy. They’re still immune to Powder and Spore moves they have Leech Seed, Ingrain, Grassy Terrain, Giga Drain, Strength Sap, and Spore. Plus Sun based abilities without a Weakness to Fire.
Rock-types in Sand Speak for themselves.

Questions for the Commmunity:
How should Freeze Dry be handled. Should it still hit Water-types Super Effectively, have no effect, have it’s effect changed to something else(10% Freeze), or just be banned?

Bans: Psychic Terrain, Shedinja
Potential Bans: Freeze Dry, Shell Smash, Toxic Spikes, Grassy/Electric Terrain, Rainy/Sunny Weather, Water Bubble

 

[Codename Turtle]

I suggested this earlier under a different name.

oh, sorry for stealing your idea then lmao.

 

[Yak Attack]

You know those Metagames where you can use the Item or the Ability slot to give a Pokemon an extra move? How about the Move slot to give a Stat boost?

What if that was taken a step further, and you could have 6 moves, if you replace the ability and the item slot?
2 abilities, if you replace the item or a move slot?
2 items, if you replace the ability or a move slot?
Even a combination of 2 abilities and 2 items, with only 2 moves?

Meta idea: Custommons
You can have up to 6 moves, as long as you replace one or both of the ability or item slots with moves.
You can have up to 2 abilities, as long as you replace the item/move slot
You can have up to 2 items, as long as you replace the ability/move slot

Potential bans: Choice Scarf x Choice Band/Specs
Eviolite x Assault Vest (2.25x Sp Def)
Life Orb x Choice Band/Specs
Regigigas
Slaking
Archeops? (No ability)
Serperior? (Leaf Storm/Contrary/Choice Specs/Metronome/Overgrow)

Question to the community: Does this sound fun to play, or does it sound broken?

 

[Codename Turtle]

Potential bans: Choice Scarf x Choice Band/Specs

Slaking, Regigigas, Archeops all probably need to be quickbanned

 

[Sereg]

You know those Metagames where you can use the Item or the Ability slot to give a Pokemon an extra move? How about the Move slot to give a Stat boost?

What if that was taken a step further, and you could have 6 moves, if you replace the ability and the item slot?
2 abilities, if you replace the item or a move slot?
2 items, if you replace the ability or a move slot?
Even a combination of 2 abilities and 2 items, with only 2 moves?

Meta idea: Custommons
You can have up to 6 moves, as long as you replace one or both of the ability or item slots with moves.
You can have up to 2 abilities, as long as you replace the item/move slot
You can have up to 2 items, as long as you replace the ability/move slot

Potential bans: Choice Scarf x Choice Band/Specs
Eviolite x Assault Vest (2.25x Sp Def)
Life Orb x Choice Band/Specs
Serperior? (Leaf Storm/Contrary/Choice Specs/Metronome/Overgrow)

Question to the community: Does this sound fun to play, or does it sound broken?

There used to be a meta like this already

 

[Arai]

You know those Metagames where you can use the Item or the Ability slot to give a Pokemon an extra move? How about the Move slot to give a Stat boost?

What if that was taken a step further, and you could have 6 moves, if you replace the ability and the item slot?
2 abilities, if you replace the item or a move slot?
2 items, if you replace the ability or a move slot?
Even a combination of 2 abilities and 2 items, with only 2 moves?

Meta idea: Custommons
You can have up to 6 moves, as long as you replace one or both of the ability or item slots with moves.
You can have up to 2 abilities, as long as you replace the item/move slot
You can have up to 2 items, as long as you replace the ability/move slot

Potential bans: Choice Scarf x Choice Band/Specs
Eviolite x Assault Vest (2.25x Sp Def)
Life Orb x Choice Band/Specs
Regigigas
Slaking
Archeops? (No ability)
Serperior? (Leaf Storm/Contrary/Choice Specs/Metronome/Overgrow)

Question to the community: Does this sound fun to play, or does it sound broken?

No need for regigigas or slaking ban, you could simply lock their ability to truant and slow start

 

[Arai]

Bandit Cup
Shamelessly stolen from MegaLionne and from all the suggestions on this threat but it kinda fits with the theme of the metagame anyway soo

Premise: Before starting the match, you get to choose one pokemon from your opponent's team. This pokemon will be swapped with a pokemon your opponent will have chosen from your team.

Bans: Standard OU Banlist

Now, this might seem like a boring premise when compared to the likes of Mix and Mega or Crossed Evolution. But just think about how much this simple addition adds a whole new layer of complexity to mindgames and teambuilding. For instance, let's say you start your fight and you immediately notice a Medicham on the enemy team, a big threat to your team. So you decide to swap him, but your opponent already anticipated this and made his Medicham (who doesn't actually carry a mega stone) a screen setter! But you might have anticipated that and went for something less threatening, like a Mew that complements well your team and would wall said Medicham if it was actually mega. This could bring some interesting strategies to a metagame that is already known by most player, the OU metagame.

Question for the community:
What do you guys think about the name? I won't say i'm not proud of it tbh
Would you play this?
Sir urkerab, is this actually codable?
Is this considered plagiarism?

Seems fun and I'd personally wanna play this, maybe have more swaps than just 1 though? Like maybe 2 or 3. And like you said, there would be a lot of bait mons and that'd be very interesting to see.

 

[Gravity Monkey]

Seems fun and I'd personally wanna play this, maybe have more swaps than just 1 though? Like maybe 2 or 3. And like you said, there would be a lot of bait mons and that'd be very interesting to see.

I thought about 2 and I figured out it would be too hard to have any real strategy with your own team since it would be almost impossible to really predict which mons would go.

 

[Arai]

I thought about 2 and I figured out it would be too hard to have any real strategy with your own team since it would be almost impossible to really predict which mons would go.

I feel like just 1 would have too little impact on the overall game though but I could be wrong. I like the idea though.

 

[Codename Turtle]

(I don't know a name please recommend some)



Metagame premise: (OU Based) Every (living) pokemon on your team shares their abilities, so yeah, if your entire team is alive, a mon can get up to 6 abilities at once.

Potential bans and threats:

Bans: Diggersby, Mawileite, Azumaril, Electrify, Serperior, Jiratchi, Togekiss. Shedinja,

Unshareable Abilities: (These are abilities that can't be given to other pokemon but are not banned, if too complicated to add/code, just ban them all.) Wonder guard, Pure/Huge Power, Contrary, Simple, Moody, Imposter, Serene grace, -ate and -ize abilities, No Guard. Speed Boost, Triage.

Strategy

Wether teams will be amazing as you can have a pokemon with the chosen weather type, and then another with the speed doubling in weather ability to make some monsters, the only reason that is not banned, is because of cloud nine.

Kyurem-Black

Kyu-B provides an amazing ability in teravolt, which will probably be used in most HO teams to counteract stall's unaware or any type-immunity shenanigans. Having amazing stats and pretty solid STABs doesn't hurt either, it can be a monster in the right hands being used to protect its allies from those pesky walls or just rip through some teams that rely on their defensive abilities. Oh yeah and if you're running a hail team it's just really good too, having ice type.



Prankster:

Oh boy, this will be such a solid ability to have shared among allies, I was going to just plop the best prankster-using mon on here, but then I realized there is no chief among prankster users (whimsicott is adorable though so theres that) You can just slap it on any stall or HO team and have free boosts or boost removers, it will especially be good on mixed teams where they have, maybe a toxapex with BH's ruling defensive mechanic: Prankster-haze. Or maybe an HO team can just have it with one of their fatter mons who can setup a couple of times and wreak havoc. Also you can use a pokemon with a move like gastro acid to just get rid of abilities until that mon switches, which will be really fun to see and use.

Quagsire

Quagsire is just a wall, it can usually hold it's own with the AMAZING ability unaware, but giving it's whole team unaware means that they can just safely survive, this is literally the only reason I thought of kyub-b or moldy abilities in general as quickly as I did, because those are one of the few things that can stop this monster, you see it's going to be solid on balance and maybe have a niche on HO teams, but stall teams will really REALLY love this guy. Imagine a chansey with eviolite and unaware, it would just be an absolute WALL with unaware to any special attackers, it would completely halt any special attackers whomst lack psyshock, and force them to switch or die.



Cloud Nine

Another really good ability for stall/balance teams that need something to counter wether, this ability will probably be common among non-weather HO to because it's just too useful. It will be less useful for stall, than it is for balance teams, you see if a balance team doesn't have to worry about speed being doubled from weather, or attacks being nuclear, it's teams can usually just be a lot safer.



Magic Bounce

This is going to be REALLY good to have on any types of team, hazards will need to be used with moldy abilities because without that, they just get bounced back, which is amazing. Moves like toxic and willo-wisp can be bounced too, without the proper moldy abilities, whilst moldy abilities will be quite common among every team, this ability will still be useful to check those without it.

None atm

(Please send your own sample team ideas with a pokepaste link, the name of the team (if applicable) and your preferred username. I will be more than happy to see what you guys come up with.)



Questions for the community: Would you like to see this metagame being a thing?

 

[Arai]

(I don't know a name please recommend some)



Metagame premise: (OU Based) Every (living) pokemon on your team shares their abilities, so yeah, if your entire team is alive, a mon can get up to 6 abilities at once.

Potential bans and threats:

Bans: Diggersby, Mawileite, Azumaril, Electrify, Serperior, Jiratchi, Togekiss. Shedinja,

Unshareable Abilities: (These are abilities that can't be given to other pokemon but are not banned, if too complicated to add/code, just ban them all.) Wonder guard, Pure/Huge Power, Contrary, Simple, Moody, Imposter, Serene grace, -ate and -ize abilities, No Guard. Speed Boost, Triage.

Strategy

Wether teams will be amazing as you can have a pokemon with the chosen weather type, and then another with the speed doubling in weather ability to make some monsters, the only reason that is not banned, is because of cloud nine.

Kyurem-Black

Kyu-B provides an amazing ability in teravolt, which will probably be used in most HO teams to counteract stall's unaware or any type-immunity shenanigans. Having amazing stats and pretty solid STABs doesn't hurt either, it can be a monster in the right hands being used to protect its allies from those pesky walls or just rip through some teams that rely on their defensive abilities. Oh yeah and if you're running a hail team it's just really good too, having ice type.



Prankster:

Oh boy, this will be such a solid ability to have shared among allies, I was going to just plop the best prankster-using mon on here, but then I realized there is no chief among prankster users (whimsicott is adorable though so theres that) You can just slap it on any stall or HO team and have free boosts or boost removers, it will especially be good on mixed teams where they have, maybe a toxapex with BH's ruling defensive mechanic: Prankster-haze. Or maybe an HO team can just have it with one of their fatter mons who can setup a couple of times and wreak havoc. Also you can use a pokemon with a move like gastro acid to just get rid of abilities until that mon switches, which will be really fun to see and use.

Quagsire

Quagsire is just a wall, it can usually hold it's own with the AMAZING ability unaware, but giving it's whole team unaware means that they can just safely survive, this is literally the only reason I thought of kyub-b or moldy abilities in general as quickly as I did, because those are one of the few things that can stop this monster, you see it's going to be solid on balance and maybe have a niche on HO teams, but stall teams will really REALLY love this guy. Imagine a chansey with eviolite and unaware, it would just be an absolute WALL with unaware to any special attackers, it would completely halt any special attackers whomst lack psyshock, and force them to switch or die.



Cloud Nine

Another really good ability for stall/balance teams that need something to counter wether, this ability will probably be common among non-weather HO to because it's just too useful. It will be less useful for stall, than it is for balance teams, you see if a balance team doesn't have to worry about speed being doubled from weather, or attacks being nuclear, it's teams can usually just be a lot safer.



Magic Bounce

This is going to be REALLY good to have on any types of team, hazards will need to be used with moldy abilities because without that, they just get bounced back, which is amazing. Moves like toxic and willo-wisp can be bounced too, without the proper moldy abilities, whilst moldy abilities will be quite common among every team, this ability will still be useful to check those without it.

None atm

(Please send your own sample team ideas with a pokepaste link, the name of the team (if applicable) and your preferred username. I will be more than happy to see what you guys come up with.)



Questions for the community: Would you like to see this metagame being a thing?

This was a thing and was known as Shared Power. Pretty much same premise.

 

[Gravity Monkey]

And then it got canceled for being too hard to balance

 

[DrPumpkinz]

And then it got canceled for being too hard to balance

And because preventing certain abilities from being passed wouldn't really be possible if the actual games were modded to share abilities without updating the mod each time an ability is banned.

 

[Codename Turtle]

This was a thing and was known as Shared Power. Pretty much same premise.

I want to dead

 

[Arai]

Hidden Power

Premise: A Pokemon's first move's typing will be changed to its Hidden Power type. So if you have Hidden Power Fire and you have Return in your first slot, Return would be changed to a Fire-type move instead of Normal-type.

Clauses: OU Clauses
Bans: OU Banlist

Strategy:

Victini @ Choice Band
Ability: Victory Star
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 SpA
- Return [Grass]
- V-create
- Bolt Strike
- Zen Headbutt

Victini is a very hard hitting Pokemon, being able to even deal with Water-types fairly well due to having access to Bolt Strike, but it struggles quite a bit with Mega Swampert which Grass Return would easily defeat. Perhaps you could also use a Scarf Victini with Ice Return for Ground-types like Gliscor, Garchomp and Landorus-T.

Kartana @ Choice Band
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 Def / 30 SpD / 30 Spe
- Return [Rock] / [Ground]
- Leaf Blade
- Sacred Sword
- Smart Strike

Kartana is another hard hitting Pokemon, but it is extremely weak to Fire-types. With a Rock Return, Fire-types like Mega Charizard-X and Y will easily be dealt with and not be of any problem for Kartana. You could even use Ground instead of Rock if you are scared of Heatran while still being able to deal with Mega Charizard-X.

Obviously there are a lot more strategies that can be done and other potential threats, but this is just to give an example and a general idea of how the metagame would play out. If you have any sets or strategies you think would be good, feel free to post them.

Questions for the community:
- Are there any moves that should be banned from being in the first slot?
- Does the name 'Hidden Power' express the metagame's premise in a way and should I use it even though it's the same name as that of a move?
- Are there any huge threats in this metagame?
And most importantly:
- Would this be fun and enjoyable to play?

 

[gmfc]

​

Have you ever wondered how good a mon with a great moveset could be with better stats? Well you're in luck! PURE ATTACK allows you to use your move's base power as your attack/special atk stat for that turn. Simply put, your move's base power=your attack.

Example: Brave Bird Smogonbirb goes from 81 atk to 120 atk.

​

Potential Threats:

1) Victini - V-Create spam​

- Self Explanatory​

2) Pure Power/Huge Power Users​

- These mons have nothing to lose, since any low bp move will still hit pretty hard.​

3) Araquanid - Water spam​

- Same as Pure Power, except with water moves​

4) Smeargle - Literally any high bp move​

- With access to every move, the only thing smeargle fears is itself.​

5) Weather/Terrain/Unburden Spam​

- Of course in this type of meta, speed kills. So +2 speed abilities plus the extra damage added by weather/terrains will be a mainstay.​

​

Potential Bans/Clauses:

1) Clauses​

• OU Clause
• Z-move Clause- Z moves cannot determine a pokemon's attack/special attack stats
• Possibly a clause on all moves over a certain bp

2) Potential Bans​

• Pure Power/Huge Power- mons like Mega Medicham and Azumarill could be completely uncheckable
• Victini/V-create- could be unstoppable on a sun team: 252 Atk Choice Band Victini V-create vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro-Mega in Sun: 198-234 (50.2 - 59.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO. Pretty absurd.
• Explosion- Could possibly be a clause

Questions for the Community

• Are there any threats that I missed?
• Should weather/terrain/ability(e.i. tough claws) boosts affect the move's bp for attack stats?
• Should this meta be OU or Ubers based?
• If a move's base power is lower than the mon's original attack stat, should it still go into affect or should it ignore the move's bp and use the original attack stat? For example, if Kartana uses Leaf Blade, should his attack dip to 90atk or should it stay at 181atk because the move's bp is lower.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

If a move's base power is lower than the mon's original attack stat, should it still go into affect or should it ignore the move's bp and use the original attack stat? For example, if Kartana uses Leaf Blade, should his attack dip to 90atk or should it stay at 181atk because the move's bp is lower.

I think the stat should be the base power even if it's low, if only because not a whole lot would change if stats couldn't be lowered. Things like Kartana, Ash Greninja, and Tapu Lele would still just as strong as usual.

I don't actually see Mega Medicham and Mega Mawile doing very well in this meta. Medicham's High Jump Kick gets stronger, but everything else, especially its Fake Out, becomes weaker. Mawile just gets weaker all around.

Meanwhile, Azu and Diggersby become much stronger, though their priority is weakened a bit.

Priority in general is significantly worse in this meta, which benefits frail offensive teams.

However, offense in general also takes a pretty big hit, as most top Pokemon have attacking stats higher than the base power of their moves.

Deoxys-N and Deoxys-A can maybe be unbanned, as their towering offensive stats mean nothing. They aren't completely screwed though, because Psycho Boost is still super strong, and because they don't have to worry much about priority, and because they're fast as hell.

Flail and Reversal seem interesting.

Pikachu and Marowak sound scary. Not Clamperl, though.

RIP Skill Link and Technician users

Hawlucha gets a big buff thanks to Acrobatics and HJK being higher than its 92 base attack

Boomburst Swellow

Serperior sounds terrifying

Either Kyurem Black should be banned, or Kyurem White should be unbanned, as now their offensive stats are now identical.