np: OU Suspect Testing Round 5 - Sandstorm (Excadrill/Thundurus Banned)

[Mario With Lasers]

Let say Mewtwo was given moody

Completely irrelevant. Mewtwo doesn't have Moody, and won't have in this generation. Besides, Moody is a special case (see: banned in Ubers), so using it doesn't help your case.

Uber pokemon are irrelevant in the standard metagame, and thus should not be given any consideration in such bans. Without Lugia you have only Dragonite, one pokemon, 2 abilities.

Lugia and Dragonite are OU. Lugia is found to be broken, Dragonite too. People ban Multiscale because it's the common factor. Lugia is still broken, Dragonite isn't anymore. Lugia is then banned, Dragonite now sucks. What has just happened here? A pokémon was nerfed because we didn't want to ban it, and we ended up with two bans anyway; one of them, however, was completely against principle (and common sense), because we wanted to work with this asinine logic of "well the pokémon, the main element in competitive pokémon and what's always banned at first, shouldn't be banned if we could nerf it instead so ban Multiscale yeahhhhhh".

BTW: I don't think Dragonite should be banned either way.

Neither do I but eh, I'd rather see Dragonite banned than "Multiscale". Multiscale doesn't even work like Drizzle to have a vessel argument in its defense...

 

[Guyguypants]

Umm, what?

You ban MultiScale if MultiScale is broken. The fact Lugia is broken without MultiScale... in what way does that prove MultiScale isn't broken?

The only relevant Pokemon is Dragonite. Full stop.

 

[Mario With Lasers]

Umm, what?

You ban MultiScale if MultiScale is broken. The fact Lugia is broken without MultiScale... in what way does that prove MultiScale isn't broken?

The only relevant Pokemon is Dragonite. Full stop.

How is it broken if it didn't break a pokémon?

 

[Guyguypants]

How is it broken if it didn't break a pokémon?

Note I never said once it was broken.

But the question of whether or not it is broken, depends completely on Dragonite. To which I really have no opinion.

 

[NoUserName]

"It's easy to counter, just use SR!" - But smart Dragonites often come with Rapid Spin support.

Also all already said, Dragonite user needs to switch into the spinner and Rapid Spin, not easy while the opponent can take that turns in which he/she can do what he/she wants or killing the Rapid Spinner. Or again, later, set up SR again.

 

[Deaga]

I do really think we should just go ahead and ban Drizzle already so that all these stupid arguments about ability-bans would stop. :/

Neither do I but eh, I'd rather see Dragonite banned than "Multiscale". Multiscale doesn't even work like Drizzle to have a vessel argument in its defense...

This guy speaks the truth.

 

[WarriorPrince]

Neither do I but eh, I'd rather see Dragonite banned than "Multiscale". Multiscale doesn't even work like Drizzle to have a vessel argument in its defense...

I agree with you here. I don't think Dragonite or its ability are broken, but if anything is to be banned, ban Dragonite.

 

[Adamant Zoroark]

I definitely agree that if either Dragonite or Multiscale were to get banned, Dragonite should be the one getting banned. I personally don't think it should get banned, as there's Stealth Rock and you can start putting Ghost-types on your team, it's not that hard. But if I had to pick one of them to get banned, banning Dragonite is just easier.

 

[Matthew]

I'm locking this. We have multiple threads which covers the entirety of this thread in separate essences. If you want to talk about weather go to my weather thread. You want to talk about metagame trends go to the stats thread. You want to talk about stall, go do it.

Feel free to PM me or NixHex with thread ideas and we're more than happy to work with you on your ideas.