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NU Discussion Thread (Mark II)
- Thread starter twash
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I guess they can behind lolchu. To be honest, they seem extremely gimmicky and they're ONLY use would be to pass a Nasty plot boost to something like Manetric or Magmortar.
Eh.
Sub Magneton poses a huge threat to alot of teams (much like Sub Haunter), and by far the best electric type in the tier especially considering his typing. Magmortar is not at all the best in the tier, if that position could be given to anyone it would easily be Espeon who everyone is complaining about right now.
You rate Raichu faaaaar to low. He should not be below Luxray and Ampharos at all and shoudl be on par with Manetric and or Magneton. The Nasty plot power boosts Raichu's viablity by far.
Electabuzz is an (often) inferior Manetric.
Manectric has vastly superior speed, a much better movepool, and access to switcheroo.
Explosion isn't such a big deal, why would you just sacrifice yourself to get a kill? Explosion is good, but not amazing.
The typing isn't that amazing, as ground and fighting types are very common. It is better than manectric's, however.
Explosion isn't such a big deal, why would you just sacrifice yourself to get a kill? Explosion is good, but not amazing.
The typing isn't that amazing, as ground and fighting types are very common. It is better than manectric's, however.
PK is definately right, Raichu is a powerful attacker. The big 3 electric types would be Magneton, Raichu and then Manectric, the rest of them are pretty garbage except for that annoying Physical Wall Luxray set. I'm going to toss together a team with NP Raichu today and see how it works because I haven't tried that set yet.
EDIT: Explosion is outstanding, I don't see how it's not good. And Ground is nowhere, you have to have never played the tier to think this. Manectric isn't that great a pokemon and the only set it should play anyways is Switcheroo Specs =/.
EDIT: Explosion is outstanding, I don't see how it's not good. And Ground is nowhere, you have to have never played the tier to think this. Manectric isn't that great a pokemon and the only set it should play anyways is Switcheroo Specs =/.
Raichu is really weak to priority attacks, and needs to set up to be powerful, which is hard to do with paper thin defenses.
A mixed luxray set is really effective. don't knock it until you try it.
A mixed luxray set is really effective. don't knock it until you try it.
Zangoose used Quick Attack!
You reaaaaally don't like Raichu? Yes, Raichu can deal with NU's nonexistant priority save for Skuntank. Don't knock it till you try it!
I completely and utterly agree with this post. Everything.
I'm definetely taking Magneton for a spin. Choice Scarf Magneton is it not?
Speaking of Zangoose, that thing needs more love. It takes alot to pull off a Swords Dance but once it does it's basically Lucario, they will lose their team. I was going to try off the bat using Lead Venomoth to use Sub as the other lead SRs, then Sleep Powder, then Baton Pass to either BD Linoone or SD Zangoose.
EDIT: CS is okay but Substitute decimates alot more teams, but it's expected of all Magneton. CS could give you some unexpectedness especially considering Electric is amazing type coverage in NU.
EDIT: CS is okay but Substitute decimates alot more teams, but it's expected of all Magneton. CS could give you some unexpectedness especially considering Electric is amazing type coverage in NU.
I agree with this chain completely but what's better is opinionated since they all work differently with different teams (as well as some personal bias).
Most of it is personal bias, but a few of that list is just some things are better than others.
Ampharos is completely and utterly outclassed by Magneton, and Manectric is outclassed in quite a few ways by Raichu, and Luxray is a terrible electric other than the beforementoined Phy Wall set.
Ampharos is completely and utterly outclassed by Magneton, and Manectric is outclassed in quite a few ways by Raichu, and Luxray is a terrible electric other than the beforementoined Phy Wall set.
what can beat raichu:
Banette: CB shadow sneak: 61.1% - 72.1% Ohko after SR and a sub
Bastiodon: Only with no Focus Blast +2 Tbolt: 69.8% - 82.4%
Cacturne: Sucker Punch (sub isn't an end all answer)
Camerupt: can set up RP and sweep, grass knot deals 118.9% - 140.2% after a NP
Espeon: Outspeeds and Ohkos, takes 60.9% - 72% from unboosted Tbolt
Floatzel: Outspeeds and Ohkos
Gardevoir: +2 tbolt on support set: 70% - 82.9%
Grumpig: 65.9% - 77.7%
Hypno: 57.2% - 67.6%
Keckleon (lol): 65.1% - 76.9%
Lickilicki: 59.4% - 70%
Linoone: Extreemspeed hurts
Magneton: 78.4% - 92.5%
Manetric: Overheat: 90.5% - 106.5% Ohko after SR
Muk: 58% - 68.4%
Persian: outspeeds, FO does 52.7% - 62.2%, return does 89.3% - 105.3%
Probopass: 54.9% - 65.1%
Purugly: CB return: 113.4% - 133.2%
Rapidash: Fire blast: 93.1% - 109.9%
Regigigas: 58% - 68.2%
Regice: 42.3% - 50.3% without spdef ivs, 37.1% - 44% with :D
Shedinja: Can't touch this do do do do do do do do Can't touch this
With no Hp ice: Almost all grass types own this
With no grass knot, whishcash and specific others own you
I can say that I was very plesently suprised, just not amazed.
EDIT: Those calcs are +2 Tbolts
Banette: CB shadow sneak: 61.1% - 72.1% Ohko after SR and a sub
Bastiodon: Only with no Focus Blast +2 Tbolt: 69.8% - 82.4%
Cacturne: Sucker Punch (sub isn't an end all answer)
Camerupt: can set up RP and sweep, grass knot deals 118.9% - 140.2% after a NP
Espeon: Outspeeds and Ohkos, takes 60.9% - 72% from unboosted Tbolt
Floatzel: Outspeeds and Ohkos
Gardevoir: +2 tbolt on support set: 70% - 82.9%
Grumpig: 65.9% - 77.7%
Hypno: 57.2% - 67.6%
Keckleon (lol): 65.1% - 76.9%
Lickilicki: 59.4% - 70%
Linoone: Extreemspeed hurts
Magneton: 78.4% - 92.5%
Manetric: Overheat: 90.5% - 106.5% Ohko after SR
Muk: 58% - 68.4%
Persian: outspeeds, FO does 52.7% - 62.2%, return does 89.3% - 105.3%
Probopass: 54.9% - 65.1%
Purugly: CB return: 113.4% - 133.2%
Rapidash: Fire blast: 93.1% - 109.9%
Regigigas: 58% - 68.2%
Regice: 42.3% - 50.3% without spdef ivs, 37.1% - 44% with :D
Shedinja: Can't touch this do do do do do do do do Can't touch this
With no Hp ice: Almost all grass types own this
With no grass knot, whishcash and specific others own you
I can say that I was very plesently suprised, just not amazed.
EDIT: Those calcs are +2 Tbolts
So, you choose bulky pokemon that are never used? It honestly doesn't matter if it can't OHKO those pokemon since nobody uses them. Linoone won't make any attempt to priority you without it's Belly Drum unless it's a very rare CB version. Persian and Purugly, two pokemon you mentoined, are suicide leads of sorts and usually killed off at the start. The rest of the faster threats you mentoined, Raichu isn't supposed to single handedly sweep the entire tier, he needs a tiny bit of support just getting rid of insanely fast stuff before he's good to go.
Meh. I think it's similar to this:
Magneton>Raichu>Manetric>Ampharos>Luxray>Lolchu>Plusle/Minun
(I just used Magneton for a couple of matches, and I can already see that it's incredible)
Magneton: Powerful STAB Thunderbolt/Flash Cannon can utterly decimate UU. Decent speed (for NU) can be bolstered by Choice Scarf, making him a powerful sweeper. Explosion cleans up the scraps. It's typing is fantastic as well.
Raichu: Nasty plot set is brutal. Raichu can literally muscle his way through NU with 2+ Thunderbolts/HP Ground/Grass note. It's frail, but it's not THAT frail, and people often forget that. (32 Hp Raichu can survive a sucker punch at max.)
Raichu can also run a physical set with Sub/Focus Punch/Volt Tackle/Encore. I can see this set being better when people start using Raichu. He can also run a support Wish set for the extra lolz.
Raichu's Frailness stops him from utterly destroying NU.
Manetric: It's fast, strong and has excellent coverage. Manetric's best set is the Choice Specs set, which can cause an opponent a lot of dilemna. He can cripple switch in's with Switcheroo, and fire specs boosted Thunder Bolt for a potential sweep. He's unfortunately frail (even more frail than Raichu when it comes to special defense)
Ampharos: Haven't used it much (only twice ever). It can fun a similar set to Tyranitar (Tyranboah). It's okay, and can hurt a good amount of pokemon, but it's poor speed holds it back. It can run support sets like Raichu.
Luxray: I've only seen it. This is a pokemon that's been trolled by Gamefreak. Fantastic stats that actually outclass Raichu almost completely (except speed) excellent ability and... a terrible movepool. Thunder Fang is it's strongest physical attack and that's just sad. It's often relegated to mixed sweeping which isn't THAT good. It's okay.
I've never used it, but I've battled it enough times.
Lolchu (Pikachu): OMG LIGHTBALLZ ANNILIATES!!!
Seriously, this thing is extremely weak defensively, and will fall pray to anything. It NEEDS to run substitute on like...every single set. It's basically forced to use standard special attacking set without Nasty plot. (Sub and Nasty plot on the same set? Your not pulling that off) It's predictable and work aroundable. Pikachu is bad.
Plusle/Minun: Apparantly they can pass Nasty plots... Even worse than Lolchu due to not posing a threat to anything.
Hope you like it.
On a side note, Regigigas is brutal. I think it's the best pokemon in the tier without being broken. This thing rocks. Sub/Return/Confuse Ray/Thunderwave are you tools of choice. I seriously run this on ALL of my NU teams. It's that good. Use it.
PS: Electric type need buffs... like now.
Even with Focus Blast, Bastiodon could still survive without NastyPlot and can KO back with a MetalBurst.
@Lord Liam: Jumpluff's Memento makes it safe for Linoone to use BellyDrum.
@PK Gaming: what's up with the huge Raichu bias? It's cool that you don't deny it and you're open about it though.
regice is on 13.9% on teams
persian: 15.2%
Floatzel: 7.2
Espeon, maggy and gardy are very used.
The rest are all used around 3%, so the chance of raichu sweeping is little to none.
persian: 15.2%
Floatzel: 7.2
Espeon, maggy and gardy are very used.
The rest are all used around 3%, so the chance of raichu sweeping is little to none.
There aren't many battles on the NU ladder, maybe a few 100 a month? 3% is mabe 10-20 of each a month, which is not impressive at ALL. Also, nobody in their right mind would not Substitute against Bastiodon =/. Also, Persian is ONLY used as a lead, and Floatzel is bad altogether so something else on your team can defeat it with impunity.
I hope you used Modest. Entry hazards can turn those 2HKO's into OHKO's.
A good amount of those NU pokemon just plain ole suck. Bastidion? Bannette? Terrible.
Raichu isn't OHKO by unboosted psychic with LO from Espeon. (32 Hp)
How does Camerupt set up a RP on Raichu at 2+?!?
You also mention a couple of pokemon that can't really do much to Raichu in return.
Finally, the fact that Raichu can cripple such a large amount of pokemon is astonishing. Besides, he isn't a won man army and I can easily run Skuntank to deal with well over half of them.
Raichu is an excellent pokemon in NU, I have no idea why you possess such animosity towards it.
Favorite pokemon.
Think about it for a second. Bastiodon is setup fodder. Raichu can easily setup while he uselessly MB. It's low attack won't allow it to OHKO with EQ. (especially since it's unstabbed)
Neither Persian nor Floatzel can reliably switch in on Raichu unless he nasty plots. They can also be dealt with quite easily.
Espeon is dealt by with Skuntank, How does Maggy even stop Raichu when he is OHKO by 2+ Tbolt with Entry hazards, and Gardevoir can't really hurt Raichu.
Dude, you've gone past denial and now it seems that your trolling.
(Also a good amount of that threat is applicable to Manetric)
"Neither Persian nor Floatzel can reliably switch in on Raichu unless he nasty plots. They can also be dealt with quite easily.
Espeon is dealt by with Skuntank, How does Maggy even stop Raichu when he is OHKO by 2+ Tbolt with Entry hazards, and Gardevoir can't really hurt Raichu.
Dude, you've gone past denial and now it seems that your trolling.
(Also a good amount of that threat is applicable to Manetric)"
Well if he dosen't NP, then he only deals about 30% to all of those others mentioned.
Psychic deals 61.8% - 73.3%.
I'm trolling? Really.
Yeah dude, that's definately coming on trolling or denying simple logic.
Raichu Skuntank seems like a really sturdy offensive duo, Skuntank can deal with alot of Raichu's threats and splode, providing an opening for Raichu to come in. Also, Modest is much better as unlike OU the metagame is much less speed oriented and the power is appreciated and as stated turns 2HKOes into OHKOes.
Also your an idiot if you think Miltank counters Skuntank, an easy boom gets rid of it.
Raichu Skuntank seems like a really sturdy offensive duo, Skuntank can deal with alot of Raichu's threats and splode, providing an opening for Raichu to come in. Also, Modest is much better as unlike OU the metagame is much less speed oriented and the power is appreciated and as stated turns 2HKOes into OHKOes.
Also your an idiot if you think Miltank counters Skuntank, an easy boom gets rid of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fat PK Gaming
I hope you used Modest. Entry hazards can turn those 2HKO's into OHKO's. No, not really. I don't think modest adds another 30%. Modest also opens it up to get killed by base 90-100 speed pokes, which are very common in NU.
A good amount of those NU pokemon just plain ole suck. Bastidion? Bannette? Terrible. Banette is actually a great support pokemon. I do agree that Bastiodon is terrible, however.
Raichu isn't OHKO by unboosted psychic with LO from Espeon. (32 Hp)
How does Camerupt set up a RP on Raichu at 2+?!? Then you lose attacking power (albit a little).
Hp ice at +2 does 69.8% - 81.9%, so it can set up RP, then Ohko with EQ.
You also mention a couple of pokemon that can't really do much to Raichu in return. Like who?
Finally, the fact that Raichu can cripple such a large amount of pokemon is astonishing. Besides, he isn't a won man army and I can easily run Skuntank to deal with well over half of them. Then I can easily run a pokemon who counters skunktank, such as miltank.
Raichu is an excellent pokemon in NU, I have no idea why you possess such animosity towards it.
Favorite pokemon.
Think about it for a second. Bastiodon is setup fodder. He can EQ, so how is he setup fodder?
Raichu can easily setup while he uselessly MB. Who in their right mind would MB?
It's low attack won't allow it to OHKO with EQ. Yes, but it can cripple it, and allow it to be picked off by essentially any priority attack
"Neither Persian nor Floatzel can reliably switch in on Raichu unless he nasty plots. They can also be dealt with quite easily.
Espeon is dealt by with Skuntank, How does Maggy even stop Raichu when he is OHKO by 2+ Tbolt with Entry hazards, and Gardevoir can't really hurt Raichu.
Dude, you've gone past denial and now it seems that your trolling.
(Also a good amount of that threat is applicable to Manetric)"
Well if he dosen't NP, then he only deals about 30% to all of those others mentioned.
Psychic deals 61.8% - 73.3%.
I'm trolling? Really.
Lost on the last page.
Originally Posted by Fat PK Gaming
I hope you used Modest. Entry hazards can turn those 2HKO's into OHKO's. No, not really. I don't think modest adds another 30%. Modest also opens it up to get killed by base 90-100 speed pokes, which are very common in NU.
A good amount of those NU pokemon just plain ole suck. Bastidion? Bannette? Terrible. Banette is actually a great support pokemon. I do agree that Bastiodon is terrible, however.
Raichu isn't OHKO by unboosted psychic with LO from Espeon. (32 Hp)
How does Camerupt set up a RP on Raichu at 2+?!? Then you lose attacking power (albit a little).
Hp ice at +2 does 69.8% - 81.9%, so it can set up RP, then Ohko with EQ.
You also mention a couple of pokemon that can't really do much to Raichu in return. Like who?
Finally, the fact that Raichu can cripple such a large amount of pokemon is astonishing. Besides, he isn't a won man army and I can easily run Skuntank to deal with well over half of them. Then I can easily run a pokemon who counters skunktank, such as miltank.
Raichu is an excellent pokemon in NU, I have no idea why you possess such animosity towards it.
Favorite pokemon.
Think about it for a second. Bastiodon is setup fodder. He can EQ, so how is he setup fodder?
Raichu can easily setup while he uselessly MB. Who in their right mind would MB?
It's low attack won't allow it to OHKO with EQ. Yes, but it can cripple it, and allow it to be picked off by essentially any priority attack
"Neither Persian nor Floatzel can reliably switch in on Raichu unless he nasty plots. They can also be dealt with quite easily.
Espeon is dealt by with Skuntank, How does Maggy even stop Raichu when he is OHKO by 2+ Tbolt with Entry hazards, and Gardevoir can't really hurt Raichu.
Dude, you've gone past denial and now it seems that your trolling.
(Also a good amount of that threat is applicable to Manetric)"
Well if he dosen't NP, then he only deals about 30% to all of those others mentioned.
Psychic deals 61.8% - 73.3%.
I'm trolling? Really.
Lost on the last page.
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