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Format Discussion Pokemon Sun/Moon Random Battle sets

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Might it be possible to put Stomping Tantrum on Ariados? I'm kind of tired of getting hard walled by Steels and I think the coverage might work, especially after a potential Sucker Punch fail.
Getting some pushback on this idea from The Immortal because ultimately, Ariados is a hazards-focused mon and has kind of a weak attack which is a problem for potential "coverage" moves to be useful.

I did some research and AFAIK its base 90 attack can't really threaten any Steel that wishes to set up on it to switch out, usually dealing less than 1/3 HP, unless that Pokemon has quad weakness. (It can also 2HKO Lucario and Alolan Dugtrio, but if those mons decide to attack instead of setting up they will outspeed and 2HKO Ariados instead.)

I'm on the fence on this so I'd like more of your reasoning on why Stomping Tantrum would be good for it. Because we really want Ariados to have hazards to set up, it might be necessary to give up Poison Jab or something in order to prevent it from getting 4 attacks and being even worse than if it at least had some sort of hazards. (Ariados' possible moves in Random Battles are: Megahorn, Poison Jab, Sucker Punch, Toxic Spikes, Sticky Web)
 
Hm. That honestly does make a lot of sense, and to be honest, now that I think about it, I don't think that Ariados has the room for Stomping Tantrum, at least not in randbats. Maybe it'd work in like Battle Factory or something where the pool is considerably smaller and Ariados has the opportunity to be more utile for the team, but in randbats Ariados's MO is more "throw out hazards and hopefully get off some damage as a side note." That, combined with the fact that I pretty severely underestimated how little damage Stomping Tantrum would actually do, makes it not the best choice for Ariados. Thanks for checking though!
 
Because Zarel wants it so. PS! isn't Smogon through and through either and it's a bit of an exaggeration to say that this one set in Random Battles goes against Smogon's core identity. It's there to stay or to be replaced by another joke set in the future.
Sorry if I don't understand--I'm not familiar with the people here really. Who is Zarel? Also what is the relationship between showdown and smogon, then?
 
Sorry if I don't understand--I'm not familiar with the people here really. Who is Zarel? Also what is the relationship between showdown and smogon, then?
Zarel owns and created PS!, which is the official battle simulator of Smogon. While that means that most of the formats played are Smogon formats, everything playable doesn't have to fully be in line with utmost competitive play.
 
Hello, I don't happen to have a screencap of this but I was playing some rb with a friend yesterday and got Taunt / Bulk Up / Superpower / Heat Wave Torn which I believe is an error cause it doesn't have a stab move, probs should be looked into :psyduck:
 
Hello, I don't happen to have a screencap of this but I was playing some rb with a friend yesterday and got Taunt / Bulk Up / Superpower / Heat Wave Torn which I believe is an error cause it doesn't have a stab move, probs should be looked into :psyduck:
at this point fixing this should be my new year's resolution because it'll actually take the entire year to fix this part of the algorithm without accidentally breaking something else
 
Any reason why blaziken gets blaze Kick instead of flare blitz. The only upside is no recoil damage but that is heavily outweighed by the fact that it only does around 70% the damage of flare blitz making you miss out on a lot of KO's that flare blitz would get. Also blaze kick only has 90% accuracy making it a overall bad move and really should be replaced with flare blitz.
 
Any reason why blaziken gets blaze Kick instead of flare blitz. The only upside is no recoil damage but that is heavily outweighed by the fact that it only does around 70% the damage of flare blitz making you miss out on a lot of KO's that flare blitz would get. Also blaze kick only has 90% accuracy making it a overall bad move and really should be replaced with flare blitz.
On non-Mega Blaziken, the recoil is quite bad if it's running Focus Sash, as the move will break it. I don't think Mega Blaziken is able to get Blaze Kick, though.
 
isnt this a little counterproductive
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Some suggestions: (it's kinda long)

Add Energy Ball, Shadow Ball, Nasty Plot, and Hidden Power Fighting to Decidueye:
It's special attack is only 7 lower; I think a special set is possible to make variety.

Add Swords Dance and Will-O-Wisp to Incineroar:
Intimidate helps it force switches. These moves could help it take advantage of that opportunity.

Add Ice Beam and Energy Ball to Primarina:
More coverage options never hurts, plus it means it's not running the same set every time. (well mostly)

Add Brave Bird and Return to Toucannon:
In the case of Brave Bird, it's because I'm sure people won't like relying on a negative priority move to kill slower mons. Return is just strong in general thanks to getting STAB.

Add Ice Punch and Thunder Punch to Gumshoos:
More coverage can always be counted on when the Pokemon you get are random.

Add Drain Punch, Thunder Punch, and Crabhammer (you can say no on this one if you want) to Crabominable:
More options is great for a Pokemon who's lacking in them. (It only has four moves right now) and Drain Punch could be interesting when it gets an Iron Fist Boost (still lower than Close Combat's 120, but an option)

Add Hidden Power Ground and Calm Mind to Oricorio (all forms):
All of the analysis's suggest Calm Mind on all of them, and HP Ground can put work into some targets for a Pokemon lacking options anyway.

Add Sticky Web to Ribombee:
It's the fastest thing to learn it, which is definitely useful.

Add Sucker Punch to Lycanroc (all forms):
This move is also shown on the normal and dusk analysis's, and midnight would benefit from another priority option.

Add U-Turn to Wishiwashi:
Needs more options.

Add Knock Off and Toxic to Toxapex:
Again, More options for something with only 5 moves.

Add Toxic, Rest, and Sleep Talk to Mudsdale:
Toxic is another option yet again, and RestTalk can synergize with Stamina depending on the situation.

Add Magic Coat to Araquanid:
A few analysis's mention this move, which could bring help to variety.

Add Giga Drain to Shiinotic:
Having the other STAB option never hurts, especially when it can heal HP back.

Add Toxic, Substitute, and Hidden Power Grass to Salazzle:
Making use of Corrosion could be an interesting idea to experement with, and HP Grass gives another coverage option for NP sets.

Add Drain Punch and Earthquake to Bewear:
Drain Punch has use over Hammer Arm for being able to recover HP.

Add Giga Drain and Hidden Power Ground (or Fire) to Comfey:
Having priority Giga Drain alongside Draining Kiss can be interesting for certain teams to handle.

Add Block and Spite to Pyukumuku:
It uses Block in a lot of formats, and Spite works well with it.

Add Swords Dance to Type: Null:
It too uses it in real formats.

Add Hyper Voice and Shadow Ball to Silvally (Normal) and Defog to most forms (pick the ones which don't get it):
Hyper Voice can mean Special sets are a possibility, and has good coverage combined with Shadow Ball. Defog is a usefull move in general.

Add Signal Beam to Silvally (Bug): (Hesitant on this one)
While Signal Beam can make an ok STAB, I'm not sure if clicking STAB is what you want to do with it.

Swap Multi-Attack for Thunderbolt on Silvally (Electric):
All of it's other moves are special; it gains the ability to use an atk lowering nature from it.

Swap Multi-Attack for Flamethrower on Silvally (Fire):
Read above.

Swap Multi-Attack for Shadow Ball on Silvally (Ghost):
Again, read above.

Swap Multi-Attack for Grass Pledge on Silvally (Grass):
And again.

Swap Multi-Attack for Ice Beam on Silvally (Ice):
And again..

Swap Multi-Attack for Surf on Silvally (Water):
And once more.

Add Shadow Claw to Dhelmise:
It literately has no Ghost STAB listed in it's current move set.

Add Ice Punch, Focus Blast, Flamethrower, Flash Cannon, Stealth Rock, Taunt, and Swords Dance to Kommo-o:
All of these have some kind of use, and it's lacking in options currently.

Add Roost, Toxic, Bulk Up to Buzzwole:
Recovery helps on something with a spread like that. Toxic and Bulk Up can increase options other than just attacking.

Add Drill Run and Throat Chop to Pheromosa:
Adds more coverage options.

Add Tail Glow and Hypnosis (Debatable) to Xurkitree:
More options other than just attacking.

Add Defog to Kartana:
Also another option.

Add Dark Pulse, Sludge Wave, and Outrage to Guzzlord:
It can run a full special, or a full physical set with these additions.

I might make more suggestions later, but these mons seemed lacking in their random battles move sets.
 
Hey, sorry about this, but there are a few things with these suggestions that are a bit off-base or unadvisable. I don't mean anything bad with this, just want to make sure we don't get mixed Decid and stuff.

Add Energy Ball, Shadow Ball, Nasty Plot, and Hidden Power Fighting to Decidueye:
It's special attack is only 7 lower; I think a special set is possible to make variety.
This would make mixed decidueye exist and isn't worth messing up how good Swords Dance is. There is no way to make mixed decidueye not exist if this happens. You would have 3 physical attacks HP fighting as a set. You don't want that.

Add Ice Beam and Energy Ball to Primarina:
More coverage options never hurts, plus it means it's not running the same set every time. (well mostly)
These coverage moves, even in Primarina's home tier of UU, are pretty useless. Moonblast, Psychic, and Water-type moves are all Primarina needs. Don't add this.

Add Ice Punch and Thunder Punch to Gumshoos:
More coverage can always be counted on when the Pokemon you get are random.
Thunder Punch doesn't really do anything at all that Adaptability Return or Earthquake wouldn't do. Ice Punch can theoretically be usable for Lando-T and the other quad ice weak mons, but the coverage of Earthquake and Crunch is preferred and having Ice Punch in the pool would cause sets without one of those to exist. There is no way to prevent this. Don't add these.

Add Drain Punch, Thunder Punch, and Crabhammer (you can say no on this one if you want) to Crabominable:
More options is great for a Pokemon who's lacking in them. (It only has four moves right now) and Drain Punch could be interesting when it gets an Iron Fist Boost (still lower than Close Combat's 120, but an option)
Crabhammer and Thunder Punch don't provide any useful coverage that Crab doesn't already have with its current pool. Drain Punch is an interesting option, though.

Add Toxic, Substitute, and Hidden Power Grass to Salazzle:
Making use of Corrosion could be an interesting idea to experement with, and HP Grass gives another coverage option for NP sets.
Salazzle already has HP grass.
Add Signal Beam to Silvally (Bug): (Hesitant on this one)
While Signal Beam can make an ok STAB, I'm not sure if clicking STAB is what you want to do with it.

Swap Multi-Attack for Thunderbolt on Silvally (Electric):
All of it's other moves are special; it gains the ability to use an atk lowering nature from it.

Swap Multi-Attack for Flamethrower on Silvally (Fire):
Read above.

Swap Multi-Attack for Shadow Ball on Silvally (Ghost):
Again, read above.

Swap Multi-Attack for Grass Pledge on Silvally (Grass):
And again.

Swap Multi-Attack for Ice Beam on Silvally (Ice):
And again..

Swap Multi-Attack for Surf on Silvally (Water):
And once more.
Natures do not exist in random battles, so this wouldn't really be useful. Having mixed offensive capabilities is only a bonus for them.

Add Shadow Claw to Dhelmise:
It literately has no Ghost STAB listed in it's current move set.
Knock Off provides the same coverage at about the same power. It used to have shadow claw, but it was removed and replaced with Knock Off.

Add Ice Punch, Focus Blast, Flamethrower, Flash Cannon, Stealth Rock, Taunt, and Swords Dance to Kommo-o:
All of these have some kind of use, and it's lacking in options currently.
All of this would mess with the current Clangorous Soulblaze + Dragon Dance set, which is by far its best option. I wouldn't add any of these.

Add Swords Dance to Type: Null:
It too uses it in real formats.
Type null does not exist in randbats.

Add Tail Glow and Hypnosis (Debatable) to Xurkitree:
More options other than just attacking.
i tried proposing this once but TI said no :[

that's all i've got to say on this, some of these suggestions are p good tbh, i'd like cm oricorio for instance if there's a way to prevent cm uturn (which i think there is)

Thanks for contributing!
 
Add Energy Ball, Shadow Ball, Nasty Plot, and Hidden Power Fighting to Decidueye:
It's special attack is only 7 lower; I think a special set is possible to make variety.
To add to what A Cake Wearing A Hat said, keep in mind that some Pokémon already have mixed sets and can learn both nasty plot and swords dance, namely Lucario and Infernape. These two are a tier above Decidueye in terms of speed, have access to priority moves, and do not have a signature move as useful as Spirit Shackle (and potentially Sinister Arrow Raid), which is physical. I think it's better to keep Decidueye as is.
Add Swords Dance and Will-O-Wisp to Incineroar:
Intimidate helps it force switches. These moves could help it take advantage of that opportunity.
Dunno about that. IIRC it only has assault vest, choice band and choice scarf as possible items, and I like those. Particularly AV, because it allows it to tank both physical and special attackers (bare strong SE moves). Maybe WoW + leftovers could be an option, but I'd keep SD out.
Add Ice Beam and Energy Ball to Primarina:
More coverage options never hurts, plus it means it's not running the same set every time. (well mostly)
When looking for coverage moves, you generally want to achieve perfect neutral coverage, especially against threats. Energy Ball does nothing in that regard that its stab moves don't, except against Gastrodon and water absorb Seismitoad. In practically any other situation, its other moves will do at least what energy ball would do.
Add Brave Bird and Return to Toucannon:
In the case of Brave Bird, it's because I'm sure people won't like relying on a negative priority move to kill slower mons. Return is just strong in general thanks to getting STAB.
I think those are good ideas, but I'd want to keep Beak Blast because of how usefull it can be. If you can't afford a switch out against a physical attacker that will kill Toucannon, getting the burn opportunity is massive.
Add Ice Punch and Thunder Punch to Gumshoos:
More coverage can always be counted on when the Pokemon you get are random.
Nothing to add to what A Cake Wearing A Hat said.
Add Drain Punch, Thunder Punch, and Crabhammer (you can say no on this one if you want) to Crabominable:
More options is great for a Pokemon who's lacking in them. (It only has four moves right now) and Drain Punch could be interesting when it gets an Iron Fist Boost (still lower than Close Combat's 120, but an option)
Same.
Add Hidden Power Ground and Calm Mind to Oricorio (all forms):
All of the analysis's suggest Calm Mind on all of them, and HP Ground can put work into some targets for a Pokemon lacking options anyway.
I like this idea. Having access to roost also provide reliable recovery that allows Oricorio to set up multiple times.
Add Sticky Web to Ribombee:
It's the fastest thing to learn it, which is definitely useful.
I've already explained my position on that earlier in this thread. Not all convinced, but then, Masquerain does get sticky web and QD, so dunno.
Add Sucker Punch to Lycanroc (all forms):
This move is also shown on the normal and dusk analysis's, and midnight would benefit from another priority option.
Midnight already gets it. Midday is super fast and besides Deoxys (which gets kaboomed by a boosted accelrock anyways), I'm not sure it would have that much use because it just isn't that much stronger than accelrock on neutral hits. Dusk is a tad slower and tough claws boosts sucker punch, which would make it more viable against fast threats. So I'd be down to adding it to Dusk.
Add U-Turn to Wishiwashi:
Needs more options.
Suggested that the other day. YES PLEASE.
Add Knock Off and Toxic to Toxapex:
Again, More options for something with only 5 moves.
I think it does its job pretty well as is.
Add Toxic, Rest, and Sleep Talk to Mudsdale:
Toxic is another option yet again, and RestTalk can synergize with Stamina depending on the situation.
Now that's something I'd really want to see.
Add Magic Coat to Araquanid:
A few analysis's mention this move, which could bring help to variety.
Don't think that would be useful in randbats.
Add Giga Drain to Shiinotic:
Having the other STAB option never hurts, especially when it can heal HP back.
Yes please.
Add Toxic, Substitute, and Hidden Power Grass to Salazzle:
Making use of Corrosion could be an interesting idea to experement with, and HP Grass gives another coverage option for NP sets.
It's so weak it won't be able to stall much. Keep it as a glass cannon.
Add Drain Punch and Earthquake to Bewear:
Drain Punch has use over Hammer Arm for being able to recover HP.
Drain Punch would be nice. EQ doesn't really add much IMO, except the possibility of hitting fire types harder (but it would still miss the KO in a lot of cases).
Add Giga Drain and Hidden Power Ground (or Fire) to Comfey:
Having priority Giga Drain alongside Draining Kiss can be interesting for certain teams to handle.
Giga Drain and Draining Kiss face a lot of the same resists (fire, steel, poison), but Giga does allow to hit water, rock and/or ground types pretty hard. I think this could use some experiment, but overall, I'm not sure it'd be that useful. Comfey being mostly a utility 'mon, no need for HP.
Add Block and Spite to Pyukumuku:
It uses Block in a lot of formats, and Spite works well with it.
Block could be nice. I'd keep Spite out of randbats, however.
Add Swords Dance to Type: Null:
It too uses it in real formats.
Nothing to add to what A Cake Wearing A Hat said.
Add Hyper Voice and Shadow Ball to Silvally (Normal) and Defog to most forms (pick the ones which don't get it):
Hyper Voice can mean Special sets are a possibility, and has good coverage combined with Shadow Ball. Defog is a usefull move in general.
Nothing to add to what A Cake Wearing A Hat said. Defod being a possibility for most forms should be a must though.
Add Signal Beam to Silvally (Bug): (Hesitant on this one)
While Signal Beam can make an ok STAB, I'm not sure if clicking STAB is what you want to do with it.
Swap Multi-Attack for Thunderbolt on Silvally (Electric):
All of it's other moves are special; it gains the ability to use an atk lowering nature from it.
Swap Multi-Attack for Flamethrower on Silvally (Fire):
Read above.
Swap Multi-Attack for Shadow Ball on Silvally (Ghost):
Again, read above.
Swap Multi-Attack for Grass Pledge on Silvally (Grass):
And again.
Swap Multi-Attack for Ice Beam on Silvally (Ice):
And again..
Swap Multi-Attack for Surf on Silvally (Water):
And once more.
Nothing to add to what A Cake Wearing A Hat said.
Add Shadow Claw to Dhelmise:
It literately has no Ghost STAB listed in it's current move set.
Nothing to add to what A Cake Wearing A Hat said.
Add Ice Punch, Focus Blast, Flamethrower, Flash Cannon, Stealth Rock, Taunt, and Swords Dance to Kommo-o:
All of these have some kind of use, and it's lacking in options currently.
This adds a lot of options and would make sets all over the place. Better to keep it like it is. Maybe Flash Cannon could be useful for Diancie and Carbink, but that'd be about it.
Add Roost, Toxic, Bulk Up to Buzzwole:
Recovery helps on something with a spread like that. Toxic and Bulk Up can increase options other than just attacking.
Yes please. It's a physically bulky mon and I think this would work.
Add Drill Run and Throat Chop to Pheromosa:
Adds more coverage options.
I don't think it needs those. Drill Run would be mostly for poison types I guess, since a SE drill run doesn't do more than a neutral HJK.
Add Tail Glow and Hypnosis (Debatable) to Xurkitree:
More options other than just attacking.
I hate hypnosis, and while I know some people love the z-hypnosis set, I'd hate its reliability in randbats.
Add Defog to Kartana:
Also another option.
I'd rather keep it full glass cannon.
Add Dark Pulse, Sludge Wave, and Outrage to Guzzlord:
It can run a full special, or a full physical set with these additions.
I don't know if I was dreaming, but the other day I had a celesteela with a leech seed set that had its defense as its higher stat, and no special move. So that means EVs/IVs that are not speed could also be adjusted for certain Pokemon - if that wasn't a dream, obviously. If that is possible, I think it would be a good idea. If you have a full physical set (knock off, outrage, hammer, EQ...), keep it as is, but if it lands only special attacks (dark pulse, sludge wave, draco meteor/dragon pulse and fire blast), lower its attack EV to have special attack as its highest stats. But I feel like that becomes too many moves on its moveset.
 
Add Roost, Toxic, Bulk Up to Buzzwole:
Recovery helps on something with a spread like that. Toxic and Bulk Up can increase options other than just attacking.

This was brought up before and was rejected by The Immortal on the grounds that it interferes with the effectiveness of its banded set.

I don't know if I was dreaming, but the other day I had a celesteela with a leech seed set that had its defense as its higher stat, and no special move. So that means EVs/IVs that are not speed could also be adjusted for certain Pokemon - if that wasn't a dream, obviously. If that is possible, I think it would be a good idea. If you have a full physical set (knock off, outrage, hammer, EQ...), keep it as is, but if it lands only special attacks (dark pulse, sludge wave, draco meteor/dragon pulse and fire blast), lower its attack EV to have special attack as its highest stats. But I feel like that becomes too many moves on its moveset.

You were not dreaming. Pokemon with beast boost and no special moves get their special attack minimized, and any Pokemon with no physical moves (and no moves to potentially copy other attacks) has its attack minimized. (Also Pokemon with gyro ball or trick room have their speed minimized.)

Anyways, I also think it's too many moves on Guzzlord and having a mixed set will be a mess with regards to beast boost, and mixed sets will happen a lot under the current system and it's really hard to "unmix" them properly.
 
Hi all!

This suggestion is in line with the various sets of joke movesets, such as Levitate Rotom-Fan holding an Air Baloon, or more recently a Limber Stunfisk with a Cheri Berri. Another fun triple-immunity pokemon to add would be an Overcoat Leavanny with Safety Googles, which is essentially triple-immune to powder and spore moves and effects. This is also possible with Grass-Wormadam, but given Leavanny is a hazard-focused pokemon while Wormadam can get some nice Quiver Dance action, I think it's more worthwile to use this set on a Leavanny.

The same combo can apply to Forestress who would be triple-immune to sandstorm, or Cloyster for Hail. However, as both of these pokemons perform very well in their respective categories and considering how rare sandstorms and hailstorms are, I think those would be a waste imo.

---

Despite that, I have more serious suggestions.
I noticed that the terrain moves are not wildly used in random battles. Terrains just sort of happen if you have a Tapu in your team, otherwise you can never really hope to see them. I can see why, not all of them are that useful. However, there are a few cases that might prove useful for some pokemons, on top of adding variety of course.

== Psychic Terrain ==
Good candidates : Delphox, Mr. Mime , Musharna (to a lesser extent)
Psychic Terrain, as a terrain, boosts Psychic-type moves by 50% and protects from priority moves, including those boosted by Triage or Prankster abilities. I don't think Prankster moves are so problematic now, however Draining Kiss Comfey can prove very obnoxious to deal with. Oh, and uh, Sucker Punch, anyone? In Mr Mime's case, it also applies to the very common Bullet Punch. It's an easy setup to deal with those threats. Z-Psychic Terrain also boosts special attack. Which means one single move could confer a 225% damage for psychic moves (and 150% damage for other special moves) used by those pokemons and protect from priority moves. That's excellent if you ask me.

==Grassy Terrain ==
Good candidates : Grass Pelt Gogoat, Comfey (to a lesser extent)
Again, Z-Grassy Terrain or Grassy Terrain while holding the appropriate seed give defensive boosts to Gogoat that are accentuated by its ability. Gogoat already has a very nice recovery, with access to Horn Leech (that would be further boosted), Leech Seed and even Milk Drink. Imagine if its defense was up to par with its HP. A true physical wall. The only downside to this strategy is that Grassy Terrain halves the power of Earthquake (which Gogoat already resists but can be very useful to counter fire-type bullies). As such, having the two together can prove counterproductive. As for Comfey, it benifits Grassy Terrain not only for the regen, but also as a counter to Psychic Terrain, as mentioned earlier.



I can't really find a good use for Electric and Misty Terrain however. That is all!
Have fun and stay inventive!
 
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Despite that, I have more serious suggestions.
I noticed that the terrain moves are not wildly used in random battles. Terrains just sort of happen if you have a Tapu in your team, otherwise you can never really hope to see them. I can see why, not all of them are that useful. However, there are a few cases that might prove useful for some pokemons, on top of adding variety of course.

== Psychic Terrain ==
Good candidates : Delphox, Mr. Mime , Musharna (to a lesser extent)
Psychic Terrain, as a terrain, boosts Psychic-type moves by 50% and protects from priority moves, including those boosted by Triage or Prankster abilities. I don't think Prankster moves are so problematic now, however Draining Kiss Comfey can prove very obnoxious to deal with. Oh, and uh, Sucker Punch, anyone? In Mr Mime's case, it also applies to the very common Bullet Punch. It's an easy setup to deal with those threats. Z-Psychic Terrain also boosts special attack. Which means one single move could confer a 225% increase in damage for psychic moves used by those pokemons and protect from priority moves. That's excellent if you ask me.

==Grassy Terrain ==
Good candidates : Grass Pelt Gogoat, Comfey (to a lesser extent)
Again, Z-Grassy Terrain or Grassy Terrain while holding the appropriate seed give defensive boosts to Gogoat that are accentuated by its ability. Gogoat already has a very nice recovery, with access to Horn Leech (that would be further boosted), Leech Seed and even Milk Drink. Imagine if its defense was up to par with its HP. A true physical wall. The only downside to this strategy is that Grassy Terrain halves the power of Earthquake (which Gogoat already resists but can be very useful to counter fire-type bullies). As such, having the two together can prove counterproductive. As for Comfey, it benifits Grassy Terrain not only for the regen, but also as a counter to Psychic Terrain, as mentioned earlier.



I can't really find a good use for Electric and Misty Terrain however. That is all!
Have fun and stay inventive!

Seems very worrying in viability to me. Is Sucker Punch really so universal that Delphox has to fear it at every turn? I don't think so. Besides, Z-Psychic Terrain is 225% damage overall, NOT a 225% increase (it's more like a 125% increase which is slightly more than a +2), and only on its Psychic move, so a more reliable boost from Calm Mind is probably more appreciated, and Delphox cannot afford to run two boosting moves. At most, it would be a move to add to a Doubles set (Heliolisk runs Electric Terrain in Random Doubles) and is not worth it for Singles. Maybe on Musharna Doubles, but doubtful.

As for Grassy Terrain, I think that Sap Sipper is important enough that it's not worth losing it on Gogoat for the sake of some Grassy Pelt funny time set. Furthermore, there's no reason for Comfey to throw up Grassy Terrain "as a counter to Psychic Terrain" when only the Tapus actually have space to set terrains up (by not needing to dedicate space to it at all)
 
Seems very worrying in viability to me. Is Sucker Punch really so universal that Delphox has to fear it at every turn?
Short answer would be, well, yes.
A more detailed answer would be that Sucker punch, alone, is very common in random battles. A lot of set rely on slower, tankier pokemons being able to boost themselves and then use priority moves. However, Sucker Punch was just an example. The same applies to Shadow Sneak, Aqua Jet (for Delphox), Bullet Punch (for Mr. Mime), or a Belly-drum-boosted Extremespeed. Or even regular Extremespeed boosted by the choice band of an Entei, if we're talking about Mr. Mime, who has very low hp and defense stats.

Besides, Z-Psychic Terrain is 225% damage overall, NOT a 225% increase (it's more like a 125% increase which is slightly more than a +2) ?
Yes, yes, you are right. I'm sorry, it was a little late when I wrote that. It's what I meant initially. Thanks for spotting it. I edited my message.

[...] and only on its Psychic move, so a more reliable boost from Calm Mind is probably more appreciated, and Delphox cannot afford to run two boosting moves.
I acknowledge and agree that two boosting moves, on almost any pokemon actually, not just Delphox, is very risky and not worth in my opinion. That is why I want to clarify I did not express that Calm Mind and Psychic Terrain should be ran together. I find the idea a little absurd. And I also acknowledge that given you have the time to setup, Calm Mind gives better stat boosts. I mentioned that, unlike Psychic Terrain, you can stack Calm Mind stat increases, which leaves no doubt that if you have 8 turns to setup, Calm mind is way better.

But you rarely ever do have more than one turn to setup on a pokémon as frail as Delphox or Mr. Mime.

Why I still think that Psychic Terrain is better than Calm Mind for those two Pokémons? Simply put, because that protection against priority moves is far more valuable than 1.5 Sp.Def stat boost. In terms of offense I think the calm mind set and psychic terrain set are pretty similar, assuming that in the calm mind set they would hold life orbs. Psychic terrain offers a more focused damage on psychic moves, which I acknowledge is a gamble. But on a defensive point of view Psychic Terrain is superior to Calm Mind for Delphox and Mr. Mime.

[...]Maybe on Musharna Doubles, but doubtful.
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Maybe, yes. But I'm not really familiar with the Doubles random meta so I will let you be the judge of that. I don't think priority moves would be as potent in double battles then they are in singles, and Musharna being slow, priority moves are likely not going to be used on it, but rather on its partner.

As for Grassy Terrain, I think that Sap Sipper is important enough that it's not worth losing it on Gogoat for the sake of some Grassy Pelt funny time set.
I agree that variety should come second to practical ability and viability, but I did not intend this set to be a humorous set like the overcoat one I suggested. I'm sorry if you misread my intentions. I simply thought that Gogoat could benefit from this new niche, given again that physical attackers are way more common than grass moves in general. I think that the possibility of a 1.5 atk boost and an immunity to grass type moves VS a steady and reliable recovery, tanking potential and a resistance to grass type (instead of the immunity granted by sap sipper) and an increase to grass-type move powers by 50%, including Horn Leech, whose damage also influence your recovery ... it's a no brainer for me. I get that Sap Sipper also has the side effect of making you immune to moves such as Spore and Stun Spore, but being grass type, Gogoat already benefits from that immunity. Sap Sipper Gogoat is a bit like Lightning Rod on Mega-Sceptile to me. It's cute in terms of flavor and context, but way too situational to be useful.
 
Gogoat also has Bulk Up, which IMO works better than Z-Grassy Terrain even if you don't get as much of a defense boost, since it gains more attack along with its defense. I'll think about Delphox but it still seems kinda sketchy to me. Maybe only have it on if the team has space for a Z-Move, I guess? On top of that I don't know if The Immortal would approve of these kinds of things especially considering that I'm still not fully on board
 
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