• Check out the relaunch of our general collection, with classic designs and new ones by our very own Pissog!

Pokemon VGC 2010 DATES / rules announced for the US!

Status
Not open for further replies.
hmmm the concept of using TR to cancel TR is kind of... well I mean I made an Alakazam + Gengar leads that pulled off the same idea but like... you'd generally need really good prediction, since you'd want to cancel TR as soon as it was used, meaning on the exact same turn they used it, which is rather difficult since you might end up accidentally setting it up for them, I mean you could just TR the next turn, but that's if you survive long enough to do that
What ever happened to Fake Out leads... I guess they became less necessary as Kyogre auto weathers? :/
 
thats the reason you use cress not gengar though, cress can take a hit and then cancel the set up while your partner protects. I used an anti-set up cress at worlds this year with sunny day and trick room.
 
Howie82 said:
hmmm the concept of using TR to cancel TR is kind of... well I mean I made an Alakazam + Gengar leads that pulled off the same idea but like... you'd generally need really good prediction, since you'd want to cancel TR as soon as it was used, meaning on the exact same turn they used it, which is rather difficult since you might end up accidentally setting it up for them, I mean you could just TR the next turn, but that's if you survive long enough to do that
What ever happened to Fake Out leads... I guess they became less necessary as Kyogre auto weathers? :/
Click to expand...

Fake out is still usable, especially against auto-weathers - it can reduce Water Spout's power and allow Kyogre to be hit with Grass Knot/Wood Hammer/whatever. However, that can also be taken care of with a Togekiss or other Follow Me user, which I've found to be VERY useful.

TR users are still fairly predictable: Dusknoir, Cresselia, Bronzong, and, to a lesser extent, Dialga (every Dialga I've seen has used it, lead or not; the problem is, you don't know what Dialga's going to do until it does something) are the common ones I've seen or personally used. Of those four, Bronzong (and maybe Dusknoir, I forget) can be OHKO'd by a full power Water Spout/Eruption. The problem is who they're partnered with - you can use a Taunter and something with Fake Out (ie Mewtwo/Infernape combo), but that assumes you don't have to deal with Follow Me, which will ensure that TR goes off.
 
I hadn't really looked over these until now. I really can't believe that Darkrai is banned considering how readily available it has been. Maybe it won't be in the US? People had every opportunity to get it here. Anyway, maybe the metagame will be better without mass Dark Void spam. Ima have to make a team pretty soon. >:)
 
Diesel said:
I hadn't really looked over these until now. I really can't believe that Darkrai is banned considering how readily available it has been. Maybe it won't be in the US? People had every opportunity to get it here. Anyway, maybe the metagame will be better without mass Dark Void spam. Ima have to make a team pretty soon. >:)
Click to expand...

Probably 'cause it's only been obtainable by Event (Alamos and Mystery Gift distribution), or because the Ubers allowed are all readily obtainable in HG/SS? If anything, I get the feeling it's the latter, with part of the first.

Smeargle won't see much, if any use this year, at least as a Dark Void spammer. It can still endeavor against someone unprepared, but you really won't be able to count on it, since it's such a common tactic.
 
Let's talk about some stuff xD

It seems that Dialga with Trick Room and Metal Burst will be useful.

You can use Metal Burst the first turn, in the second your opponent will think twice before attacking Dialga and you can set up Trick Room. Both moves take advance of a low speed stat so you can max hp and Sp Attack or add some bulk putting some ev's in the defenses...

Just guessing, but it looks interesting...
 
hmm... I doubt they'd think twice about it if Dialga reaches a point where it's about to faint... did Smeargle see much use like ever? there was a lot of theorymon on him but then when the tournament came by, most people just ran counters to it while like only two or three people actually used it... or at least from what I remember
 
flash0mc said:
Let's talk about some stuff xD

It seems that Dialga with Trick Room and Metal Burst will be useful.

You can use Metal Burst the first turn, in the second your opponent will think twice before attacking Dialga and you can set up Trick Room. Both moves take advance of a low speed stat so you can max hp and Sp Attack or add some bulk putting some ev's in the defenses...

Just guessing, but it looks interesting...
Click to expand...

XD! Dialga makes a pretty crappy TR poke! XD He can be flinched, he's pretty much too fast for TR, and he has some crappy weaknesses like fighting.
 
@Mattj & Howie82

Not for the Uber environnement xD Also if he is faster than other pokes when trick room is seted up, he can abuse metal burst

I dunno if you have played consistently ubers but i can tell you that dialga is one of the best trick roomers around xD

Dialga has impressive bulk, enough to survive a fighting attack and give back an OHKO with metal burst xD Also it can survive two turns, enough to defeat a poke and set up trick room, then it can fire of a STABed Draco Meteor in the third turn and it can be another easy OHKO xD

Plus you have another poke to pair with him, pherhaps kyogre. In this scenario it's difficult to decide what poke will you target so this makes the life easier to Dialga xD
 
flash0mc said:
@Mattj & Howie82

Not for the Uber environnement xD Also if he is faster than other pokes when trick room is seted up, he can abuse metal burst

I dunno if you have played consistently ubers but i can tell you that dialga is one of the best trick roomers around xD

Dialga has impressive bulk, enough to survive a fighting attack and give back an OHKO with metal burst xD Also it can survive two turns, enough to defeat a poke and set up trick room, then it can fire of a STABed Draco Meteor in the third turn and it can be another easy OHKO xD

Plus you have another poke to pair with him, pherhaps kyogre. In this scenario it's difficult to decide what poke will you target so this makes the life easier to Dialga xD
Click to expand...

May be, but so far in testing both with a friend and online, Dialga's gone down pretty easy. I've been using an Infernape / Mewtwo Lead lately, and 2 fighting moves is more than enough to 1HKO him even with chopple or whatever. Maybe with Follow Me support, he's okay, but beyond that...
 
mattj said:
XD! Dialga makes a pretty crappy TR poke! XD He can be flinched, he's pretty much too fast for TR, and he has some crappy weaknesses like fighting.
Click to expand...

I disagree... bigtime. Fighting is hardly a "big" weakness in VGC, since you won't be seeing many fighting types running around at all. Its biggest fear on that front is Aura Spheres probably. Ground is definitely the bigger of its two weaknesses. I plan on trying to use it like I used Heatran at nationals and Skill Swap it Levitate. In the old metagame, 90 would definitely be to high of a speed stat to be TR-viable, but its one of the slowest Uber pokemon, and can set TR up itself, so I think TR variants could see some action. Let's not forget its ridiculous SpAtk and awesome move pool either. I think it'll be a force for sure.
 
I was just on PBR and I saw a Mewtwo, Groudon lead. What I didn't know was that mewtwo would selfdestruct. This was a huge suprise. The japanese guy also used Zapdos to Discharge with Groudon. He also had an infernape who used encore the turn after I used protect, giving him a clear victory over me. Ill check his friend pass later if anyone wants me to. But that battle was an epic fail.
 
Personally, I've found TR Dialga sort of underwhelming. He's not actually that bulky, and gets ripped to shreds by Machamp who still does pop up occasionally in ubers. I still prefer Cresselia.
 
Zog said:
Personally, I've found TR Dialga sort of underwhelming. He's not actually that bulky, and gets ripped to shreds by Machamp who still does pop up occasionally in ubers. I still prefer Cresselia.
Click to expand...

The problem with Cresselia is that it can't hurt anything. After TR is set up, the most you might see of it is some sort of Swagger combo. Although I suppose screens from it could be pretty useful.
 
naw, Helping hand is really underrated, its a great option for bulky but weak hitting pokemon
 
Alakapimp said:
naw, Helping hand is really underrated, its a great option for bulky but weak hitting pokemon
Click to expand...

bulky was the problem! XD I used a stinkin jolteon! x_x

So, is it true that the japs can use pokes of any level since there's apparently local "level" battles?
 
drcossack said:
Water's weakened in the Sun though - while it'll still hurt if you get hit by Water Spout from a full HP Kyogre, you can survive at least one if the Sun is up, even if you're weak to it.

Shedinja: Yeah - against Rain or teams that don't have a Ghost/Rock/Fire/Dark move, Shedinja can live forever. While it's not terribly threatening, it can still force a stalemate if it's held in reserve.


The TR Cress: idk, it did use it on me in a rematch, but that was when we knew each other's team. That said, it's more likely to be there to cancel it out if someone else uses it - I have TR on one version of my rain team on Dialga for that reason.
Click to expand...

Maybe, but if the sun ever goes out, or changes to rain, they're in for a world of hurt.

I was thinking a bit more about the team, and I guess the reason Ho-oh and Shedinja seemed so out of place was because I was only considering Cresselia using Swagger on Groudon. A +2 Sacred Fire in the Sun is going to hurt, and if Shedinja manages to not be threatened, he'll be able to bring the hurt, albeit at a slower pace than Groudon or Ho-oh would.
 
Helping Hand Dusknoir = Epic. I just tried the Ho-Oh / Shedinja (with a few tweaks of my own of course) and its actually pretty good. Not much on rain teams can really hit Shedinja so Protect on Ho-Oh and Sunny Day first turn is usually enough to mess them up then you always have Groudon to auto-Sun after they get the rain going again
 
ah to combat Rain teams... I was always just thinking one nice Rock Slide would just shut them both down, I've always wondered why Dusknoir can get Helping Hand as a special move in one of the games, but can't be tutored it...
 
RandomVGC said:
Hey, a Macho Brace Brave Serene Grace Togekiss seems like it could flinch hax the opponent quite a bit with rock slide, sleep on the idea.
Click to expand...

Check out the shiny, 0spd, Brave, Serene Grace Dunsparce w/ Rockslide/Headbutt/ZenHeadbutt/Protect in my thread.

Just for Lolz! XD
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top